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2.4MB floppy used on WHAT IBM equipment?
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Louis Ohland
Mar 17, 2018, 11:23:52 AM3/17/18
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I forgot, what bit of comm gear used the 2.4MB 5.25" floppy?
Maybe.. the setup disks might have an adf (if it is MCA based, that is...)
Maybe.. the setup disks might have an adf (if it is MCA based, that is...)
Louis Ohland
Mar 17, 2018, 11:31:38 AM3/17/18
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http://publibfp.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr/BOOKS/GG663260/1.0?DT=19940907172102
WHY IS IT CALLED THE "EXCEPTIONAL MACHINE"
SALES PITCH: "If you plan to buy a 3174, .. at least one 2.4 MEG
diskette drive.
WHY IS IT CALLED THE "EXCEPTIONAL MACHINE"
SALES PITCH: "If you plan to buy a 3174, .. at least one 2.4 MEG
diskette drive.
gfre...@aol.com
Mar 17, 2018, 12:54:27 PM3/17/18
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On Sat, 17 Mar 2018 10:23:52 -0500, Louis Ohland <ohl...@charter.net>
wrote:
>I forgot, what bit of comm gear used the 2.4MB 5.25" floppy?
>
>Maybe.. the setup disks might have an adf (if it is MCA based, that is...)
The only one I can think of is 3174.
I know that if you put that drive in an AT or on the MCA card, it only
ran at 1.2m
wrote:
>I forgot, what bit of comm gear used the 2.4MB 5.25" floppy?
>
>Maybe.. the setup disks might have an adf (if it is MCA based, that is...)
I know that if you put that drive in an AT or on the MCA card, it only
ran at 1.2m
Lorenzo Mollicone
Mar 17, 2018, 2:58:02 PM3/17/18
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Limited by the controller or the BIOS?
Could parameters be used to define the drive otherwise ?
Could parameters be used to define the drive otherwise ?
gfre...@aol.com
Mar 17, 2018, 4:05:50 PM3/17/18
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WBSTClarke
Mar 17, 2018, 5:17:00 PM3/17/18
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On Saturday, 17 March 2018 18:58:02 UTC, Lorenzo Mollicone wrote:
> Limited by the controller or the BIOS?
>
> Could parameters be used to define the drive otherwise ?
Basically, pretty much everything. We have no knowledge of the media requirements, sector size, sectors per track, etc. and the BIOS, DOS and OS/2 have no support for that 5.25" diskette format. It was never intended (nor provided) for PCs.
> Limited by the controller or the BIOS?
>
> Could parameters be used to define the drive otherwise ?
Theoretically, if 3.5" 2.88MB drives are supported the FDC is capable, but the rest is NOT.
There is *no* supported drive type 5 indicating the 5.25" 2.4MB capable drive, it's misleading Louis.
Louis Ohland
Mar 17, 2018, 6:04:36 PM3/17/18
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Tim, with my eyes of blue, would I lie to you?
Dunno, there is the Type 5 gap. Maybe IBM reserved it. Maybe they
wandted to leave room... Most likely they are all dead, Jim.
OK, nothing in the BIOS, what of parameters? Let me snuffle about...
Dunno, there is the Type 5 gap. Maybe IBM reserved it. Maybe they
wandted to leave room... Most likely they are all dead, Jim.
OK, nothing in the BIOS, what of parameters? Let me snuffle about...
Louis Ohland
Mar 17, 2018, 10:07:19 PM3/17/18
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http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/drive.html#244
IBM 2.44Mb 5.25" drive
This was called to my attention in Aug 2016. IBM model 3174, used a 2.4
MB 5.25-inch floppy drive. One brand was Hitachi, model HFD532EIU - I
saw one date as early 1989. another brand was Y-E DATA model YD-803 date
code mid-1983. OI have two sources for those brands and models. They
appear to have a 34-pin edge connector and the ordinary 4-pin Molex DC
connector for +12 and +5 volts. IBM put a drive in an IBM plastic
carrier with their own single connector. That carrier and contained
drive may have a part number IBM 25F8398 or 25F8399 or 25F8400.
The IBM 3174 was a "network processor or controller". Bitsavers.org has
documentation on this device. The floppy drive apparently read microcode
on the IBM 3174; and could be a 1.2Mb or a 2.44MB drive; but the drives
were not otherwise for customer use.
Discussions in the now VCFED.ORG forum dating Nov-Jan 2008-9, suggest
they use ordinary disk media (although DD or HD was not clear) and was
able to read an IBM-PC format 1.2MB (HD) diskette successfully. My guess
would be, the data clock rate was doubled from DD 5.25 format, and the
drive is 80-track and of course double sided. Use at 2.4MB would likely
require non-DD IBM-branded media and a floppy controller capable of
higher data rates. Other Web searches suggest IBM issued various
versions of microcode to support various product features or
enhancements; and the drives were only used to read, not write or
format. - Herb Johnson
IBM 2.44Mb 5.25" drive
This was called to my attention in Aug 2016. IBM model 3174, used a 2.4
MB 5.25-inch floppy drive. One brand was Hitachi, model HFD532EIU - I
saw one date as early 1989. another brand was Y-E DATA model YD-803 date
code mid-1983. OI have two sources for those brands and models. They
appear to have a 34-pin edge connector and the ordinary 4-pin Molex DC
connector for +12 and +5 volts. IBM put a drive in an IBM plastic
carrier with their own single connector. That carrier and contained
drive may have a part number IBM 25F8398 or 25F8399 or 25F8400.
The IBM 3174 was a "network processor or controller". Bitsavers.org has
documentation on this device. The floppy drive apparently read microcode
on the IBM 3174; and could be a 1.2Mb or a 2.44MB drive; but the drives
were not otherwise for customer use.
Discussions in the now VCFED.ORG forum dating Nov-Jan 2008-9, suggest
they use ordinary disk media (although DD or HD was not clear) and was
able to read an IBM-PC format 1.2MB (HD) diskette successfully. My guess
would be, the data clock rate was doubled from DD 5.25 format, and the
drive is 80-track and of course double sided. Use at 2.4MB would likely
require non-DD IBM-branded media and a floppy controller capable of
higher data rates. Other Web searches suggest IBM issued various
versions of microcode to support various product features or
enhancements; and the drives were only used to read, not write or
format. - Herb Johnson
Louis Ohland
Mar 17, 2018, 10:10:06 PM3/17/18
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http://www.quesearch.com/msgsdisp.php?parm=ibmmain-2-4mb-5-25-fdd-for-3174-s
Even after you get the hardware sorted out and running, you will find
that coyping 3174 diskettes this way is very unreliable at best. The
only reliable way that I ever found to copy those diskettes is in a 3174
with 2 diskette drives. You may think the copy was successful only to
find out much later that there is a block or sector somewhere that is
defective.
I spent 10 years as chief tech for a reseller and knew many people who
tried the PC route to copy them and they always went back to 3174s for
copying.
HTH
Mike Maylone
Even after you get the hardware sorted out and running, you will find
that coyping 3174 diskettes this way is very unreliable at best. The
only reliable way that I ever found to copy those diskettes is in a 3174
with 2 diskette drives. You may think the copy was successful only to
find out much later that there is a block or sector somewhere that is
defective.
I spent 10 years as chief tech for a reseller and knew many people who
tried the PC route to copy them and they always went back to 3174s for
copying.
HTH
Mike Maylone
Louis Ohland
Mar 17, 2018, 10:14:23 PM3/17/18
to
Louis Ohland
Mar 18, 2018, 5:27:49 PM3/18/18
to
https://www.joc.com/maritime-news/import-briefs_19870330.html
High-Density Disk
MOONACHIE, N.J. - Maxell Corp. of America is marketing a 5 1/4 -inch
high- density floppy disk with storage capacity of up to 3.2 megabytes
unformatted and 2.4 MB after formatting.
The new disk, MD2-ED, will operate with the newly developed YD-801
drive, to be introduced by Tokyo-based Y-E Data Inc. The drive is
expected to make its U.S. debut later this year.
The disk uses conventional gamma cobalt ferric dioxide magnetic particles
applied to the disk surface at about one macron of thickness. Maxell's
lead may be short lived. Analysts say several high-density disk makers
are coming up with higher storage capacities. Among them isEastman Kodak
Co.'s Xerox division, which is planning to introduce a 10-MB disk over
the short term.
High-Density Disk
MOONACHIE, N.J. - Maxell Corp. of America is marketing a 5 1/4 -inch
high- density floppy disk with storage capacity of up to 3.2 megabytes
unformatted and 2.4 MB after formatting.
The new disk, MD2-ED, will operate with the newly developed YD-801
drive, to be introduced by Tokyo-based Y-E Data Inc. The drive is
expected to make its U.S. debut later this year.
The disk uses conventional gamma cobalt ferric dioxide magnetic particles
applied to the disk surface at about one macron of thickness. Maxell's
lead may be short lived. Analysts say several high-density disk makers
are coming up with higher storage capacities. Among them isEastman Kodak
Co.'s Xerox division, which is planning to introduce a 10-MB disk over
the short term.
WBSTClarke
Mar 18, 2018, 7:32:08 PM3/18/18
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gfre...@aol.com
Mar 19, 2018, 12:32:53 AM3/19/18
to
We used to get new disks for those machines all the time and we
chucked the old ones.
The 2.88s were a little less common tho. By the time the 2.88 drives
were showing up, people wanted bigger media and they started backing
up to tape or optical drives.
Louis Ohland
Mar 19, 2018, 8:00:23 AM3/19/18
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http://publibfp.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr/BOOKS/CN7V4001/1.6.6?DT=19940516124124
Blank diskettes must be P/N 6109660 (1.2MB) or P/N72X6086 (2.4MB) or
equivalent. The part numbers are for a box of ten.
Blank diskettes must be P/N 6109660 (1.2MB) or P/N72X6086 (2.4MB) or
equivalent. The part numbers are for a box of ten.
Louis Ohland
Mar 19, 2018, 8:10:38 AM3/19/18
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5.25 2ED DISKETTE no stock :(
Louis Ohland
Mar 19, 2018, 8:55:26 AM3/19/18
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ekb...@vnet.ibm.com
Mar 20, 2018, 8:34:30 AM3/20/18
to
Yes, the 2.4M ED 5.25-inch floppies are near unobtainium, and the 3.5-inch 2.88M floppies aren't much better. HOWEVER, I do actually have a modest number of the 2.88M floppies in hand, so if someone on the group wants a few for use with an old Thinkpad or RS/6000, I can supply reasonably small quantities (Amazon, I am not).
Lorenzo Mollicone
Mar 20, 2018, 9:21:05 AM3/20/18
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I wouldn’t mind a reasonably small quantity ! =D
Louis Ohland
Mar 20, 2018, 9:23:31 AM3/20/18
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I have a small number of 2.88MB, but never use them. Use the internet
for file transfer out of my Model 90.
for file transfer out of my Model 90.
Louis Ohland
Mar 23, 2018, 1:11:05 PM3/23/18
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http://publibfp.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr/BOOKS/GG243061/A.1.6?DT=19930913225354
9120 adapter provides read/write control for the two diskette or fixed
disk drives that can be installed in the 3174.
9120 adapter provides read/write control for the two diskette or fixed
disk drives that can be installed in the 3174.
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