any PIO MODE 4 VLB controllers?
TED WOO
NOT support PIO MODE 4 (even though the packaging says it does). I
bought a Seagate Decathlon ST5850A yesterday and hooked it up as the
slave along with my Western Digital 730. Now, when I run Norton
Sysinfo, the most I can get for the transfer rate (after playing around
with the DMA and PIO speeds) was under 2800kb/s. Compared with my
slower mode 3 WD (under 2500kb/s) this is hardly what I would call an
improvement. However, when I took this hard drive over to my brother's
computer (he has a PCI motherboard with on-board EIDE controller),
Sysinfo reports over 3200kb/s. I know for a fact that his integrated
controller is capable of PIO MODE 4 (cause I read the docs), but I also
know that my Promise card isn't. This really pisses me off, because I
had bought this card thinking that it could take advantage of mode 4
drives. I guess not.
So, my question is, after I trash my Promise card, are there any VLB
eide controller cards out there that will couple nicely with my new
Seagate? I don't really need 16550's, just the hard drive and floppy
(capable of 2.88meg floppies) controllers.
Any recommendations?
Thanks.
John Wehman
>
>I've currently got a Promise EIDE2300+ VLB controller card which does
>NOT support PIO MODE 4 (even though the packaging says it does).
Here's the tricky part about Promise...they clock the I/O cycles off the
Motherboard Bus clock, and blindly say "Fastest transfer shall be: three clock
cycles for assertion of IO (R/W) and three clock cycles for de-assertion of same."
On a 33MHz Bus-clock (486-33DX, 486-66DX-2), this computes to 90ns ON, 90ns Off, or
180 ns Cycle time (1/33MHz = 30ns). That's fine, except where 1)the drive can support
PIO Mode 3, but at a reduced t0 cycle time (as reported in ID Data), or 2) the drive
can achieve faster transfer rates (as your drive below).
However, on a 50MHz bus, this timing becomes (20ns*3)=60ns ON and 60ns off, or 120ns,
Mode 4 (sort of). With a faster drive (as below), this would be okay, but put just
about any other drive on, and your talking C.O.R.R.U.P.T.I.O.N.
Actually, this type of timing is unfortunately common, and really only those IO Cards
with their own crystal can run independant of the bus, and properly set up the x-fers.
>I bought a Seagate Decathlon ST5850A yesterday and hooked it up as the
>slave along with my Western Digital 730. Now, when I run Norton
>Sysinfo, the most I can get for the transfer rate (after playing around
>with the DMA and PIO speeds) was under 2800kb/s. Compared with my
>slower mode 3 WD (under 2500kb/s) this is hardly what I would call an
>improvement. However, when I took this hard drive over to my brother's
>computer (he has a PCI motherboard with on-board EIDE controller),
>Sysinfo reports over 3200kb/s.
12% improvement isn't much??? Trust me, it is. But, what you're seeing is the
increase of RPM to 5400. RPM (and sector density, to a lesser degree) is the most
important factor in achieving faster throughout. Especially when the comparator is a
program like SI, which does rate acurate transer numbers.
I know for a fact that his integrated
>controller is capable of PIO MODE 4 (cause I read the docs), but I also
>know that my Promise card isn't. This really pisses me off, because I
>had bought this card thinking that it could take advantage of mode 4
>drives. I guess not.
Yeah, it pisses me off, too.
>
>So, my question is, after I trash my Promise card, are there any VLB
>eide controller cards out there that will couple nicely with my new
>Seagate?
Haven't put my finger on any yet...just a couple of beta boards, that, coupled
with a proprietary driver, really kick butt, especially on the 5850A.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Wehman -The opinions I express are solely
jwe...@picosof.com my own and in no way reflect those
john_...@notes.seagate.com of my employer's.
408-439-2123
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roger Hand
>Date: Sun, 26 Mar 95 10:09:43 PST
>In article <8A6126E.0C7B...@onlinesys.com>, ted...@onlinesys.com proclaims...
>>
[snip!]
>> . . . I took this hard drive over to my brother's
>>computer (he has a PCI motherboard with on-board EIDE controller),
>>Sysinfo reports over 3200kb/s.
[snip!]
>>I know for a fact that his integrated
>>controller is capable of PIO MODE 4 (cause I read the docs),
Cool! Which motherboard is it? I'm in the market for one.
Is it the ASUS? Brand and model number wouldbe a big help if you know it,
thanks.
-Roger
-Roger
Roger Hand rh...@slip.net CIS: 73520,3506
"Life is the only thing worth living for!"
Kris Montoya
You might try and get a CMD VLB IDE controller, I believe it can support PIO mode 4. I've tried
it with the Conner CFA-850A (Mode 4) with very good results.
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kris Montoya kmn...@primenet.com
Sales Manager http://www.primenet.com/~kmntoya/
Professional Technologies pro...@aol.com -~-
(800) 949-5018 ext. 3110 (@ @)
------------------------------------------------------------------ooO~(_)~Ooo-
Heather Dubuisson
: In article <8A6126E.0C7B...@onlinesys.com>, ted...@onlinesys.com wrote...
: >
: >I've currently got a Promise EIDE2300+ VLB controller card which does
: You might try and get a CMD VLB IDE controller, I believe it can support PIO mode 4. I've tried
: it with the Conner CFA-850A (Mode 4) with very good results.
I just bought an Acculogic 4VL controller card that supports PIO MODE 4.
Paul Lukman
>
> Kris Montoya (kmn...@primenet.com) wrote:
> : In article <8A6126E.0C7B...@onlinesys.com>, ted...@onlinesys.com wrote...
> : >
> : it with the Conner CFA-850A (Mode 4) with very good results.
>
> I just bought an Acculogic 4VL controller card that supports PIO MODE 4.
My Promise 2300+ and Seagate Decathlon ST5850A also gets between
2735-2750Kb/sec w/ NU SI 8.0 HDD Benchmark (set to DMA Speed 8, which
is the DMA Mode 1 spec. I believe -- I haven't tried PIO Speed A /
IORCHDY yet, though, and it might be faster?)... So it's true that
using PIO Mode 4/DMA Mode 2 gets you 3200-3300+Kb/sec rate? Damn I
may just trash my Promise then...<g>
Anyway, to the original poster, how did the Promise driver rate the
HDD after it tested it (since this new HDD is not in the driver's
built-in table of popular HDD's)? My driver keeps returning a result
of DMA Speed 7 AND PIO Speed *0*!! When I manually set the driver's
parameters to use DMA Speed 8 for the Seagate, the drive works fine,
BUT when I set it to PIO Speed 8, the drive freezes and hangs!!
Thus I haven't tried PIO Speed A (IORCHDY) yet...but anyway, what IS
IORCHDY? Is that faster than DMA Speed 8? Damn, though, is this a
bad drive design or a bad controller/driver design?? Probably the
Promise's fault, eh?
--Paul
John Wehman
>
>hjdu...@ouray.cudenver.edu (Heather Dubuisson) wrote:
>>
>> Kris Montoya (kmn...@primenet.com) wrote:
>> : In article <8A6126E.0C7B...@onlinesys.com>, ted...@onlinesys.com wrote...
[original problem snipped]
>BUT when I set it to PIO Speed 8, the drive freezes and hangs!!
Pieter, didn't you already address this in another post???
DO NOT!!! REPEAT DO NOT!!! in fact, don't even think of:
using Speed 8. Never...ever...
This is something that should never have been implemented.
Do you design a fast car without brakes? Just think if you did...wouldn't
get very far, eh? That's what IOCHRDY does (to answer the Q below). It
brakes the BIOS from taking data (or giving it, on rarer occasions) from the
drive if the drive isn't ready (which it often isn't, in PIO Mode 3/4).
IOCHRDY stands for IO (as in interface input/output) Channel Ready. This signal
throttles the host much as a brake slows a car down. Data is not to qualified
by the host until IOCHRDY is true. Thus, during a sector transfer, IOCHRDY can
go false (ground reference) during the middle of an IOR/W, and the R/W strobe would
have to be extended longer to give the drive time to actually get the data on the bus.
>Thus I haven't tried PIO Speed A (IORCHDY) yet...but anyway, what IS
>IORCHDY? Is that faster than DMA Speed 8? Damn, though, is this a
>bad drive design or a bad controller/driver design?? Probably the
>Promise's fault, eh?
You make the call...(I'll give you a hint: PROMISE'S FAULT)
>
>--Paul
>
--
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John F. Wehman
jwe...@picosof.com
john_...@notes.seagate.com
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dgibbons
>
>In article <8A6126E.0C7B...@onlinesys.com>, ted...@onlinesys.com wrote...
>>
>>So, my question is, after I trash my Promise card, are there any VLB
>>eide controller cards out there that will couple nicely with my new
>>Seagate? I don't really need 16550's, just the hard drive and floppy
>>(capable of 2.88meg floppies) controllers.
>>
>>Any recommendations?
>
Adaptec has a new 2825 card out that combines EIDE & SCSI-2 on the same
VLB Card, it is a very good price, and I think it does Mode 4.