Civil War Generals 2 - like this game, but..
skip
But I think something needs to be fixed. I am playing the second
scenario of the complete civil war campaign- first battle of Bull Run
(advanced level). I have the latest patch so far as I am aware.
I am on turn 38 out of 108(!) playing the North. At this time, there is
not a single southern unit which is not routing, or surrendered. The
score so far is -2192 for the South, and +9921 for the North.
I suspect that either I am a lot better general than I had imagined, or
something needs to be fixed here, big time. All I did, is concentrate
and dig-in, completely ignoring the victory hexes (part of the problem I
should think, these need to be given more weight). The South came up and
attacked more or less piecemeal. I waited till they were blown, and
counter-attacked. They crumbled.
Knowing how the real first battle of Bull Run came out, the ease of this
victory does not inspire much confidence in the game as it now stands.
There is much I like about this game, and should think some minor
tweeking on the designer's part could put things in order.
PS: I wonder if I have to play ALL 108 moves of this scenario. I should
imagine there will not be a southern formation on the map in 10 or 20
more moves.
--
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Paul Aceto
I'm in a similar situation in the first battle of the Tennessee
campaign. It's turn 40 or so of 88, and I have killed or routed every
Reb unit on the map. I did it aggressively, and it was a lot of fun,
but like you I wonder 1) if the AI sucks or I was lucky; and 2) do I
really have to finish out those 40 or so turns left?
As I've said before, though, I really like the feel of the game. Have
others run up against a tougher AI than we have so far?
Jim Potts
Pau and Skip:
Don't despair. The AI is better than you think. I have just finished
the battle at Winchester, which is about the sixth in the Civil War
complete campaign. That turned out to be a minor defeat for my Union
side, and I'm actually surprised it wasn't worse---I was outmanned,
outgunned, and outgeneralled. Front Royal wasn't all that great for me
either. Eventually the rebel AI will give you a run for your money !
I think the reason Bull Run seems relatively easy (I, too, attained a
major victory there, as well as at Blackburn and Kernstown) is because
if not for McLellans' extreme cautiousness (some have used a harsher
word to describe the way in which McLellan consistently frittered away
tactical and material advantages in the early months of the war), those
battles should have been Union victories. Presumably neither of you,
nor I, repeated the mistakes and mis-steps taken by the Union
historically.
I would actually like to hear if anyone has WON at Winchester playing
the Union side---frankly, I don't see how it can be done. You probably
need to hang on to all the victory hexes to win, and I ultimately only
saved one.
You mentioned "routed units all over the map". You may not be aware
that there is an error in the game code (including the latest patch)
which doesn't permit the icon to change back to a "non-routed" status,
even though the unit may well have recuperated. Check the values of
some of those routed units---you may find that some of them are actually
quite healthy.
The only way to avoid sitting around waiting for the last turn, when
you have already beaten the AI for all intents and purposes, is to
capture or destroy EVERY UNIT, or force them to leave the map.
Capturing pays big dividends in weapon and supply cost captured, so I
recommend capturing as many broken units as possible. As I am sure you
are aware, simply ZOC'ing the unit to be captured isn't enough. You
must totally surround it, then attack it--sometimes more than one attack
will be needed before a surrender occurs, but, it WILL occur.
I am overall, fairly impressed with the AI. But, if you really want
to have fun, try a hotseat game with a friend who knows what he or she
is doing---excellent ! This is the most fun I've had with a computer
game since Gary Grigsby's "Pacific War".
Happy generalling !
Jim Potts
skip
Jim Potts wrote:
>
> Pau and Skip:
Thanks for the reply. Was there another reply? If so, it did not show up
on my news server. I often wonder how reliable that is. I sometimes
leave posts that I never see later.
[snip]
>
> You mentioned "routed units all over the map". You may not be aware
> that there is an error in the game code (including the latest patch)
> which doesn't permit the icon to change back to a "non-routed" status,
> even though the unit may well have recuperated. Check the values of
> some of those routed units---you may find that some of them are actually
> quite healthy.
I was wondering about this. I have noticed routed units that appeared to
be in fair condition. I thought there must be some sort of "army morale"
factor at work, causing the to have the routed icon showing.
> The only way to avoid sitting around waiting for the last turn, when
> you have already beaten the AI for all intents and purposes, is to
> capture or destroy EVERY UNIT, or force them to leave the map.
Erk.. I guess I better spread out and start beating the bushes. There
are no more enemy units in line of sight anyway. I still have (groan) 40
turns left. That should give me time to look in about every hex. :)
If I recall, Sid Meyers Gettysburg allowed one to call a game off early.
Wish this one did too.
Jim Potts
skip wrote:
> Thanks for the reply. Was there another reply? If so, it did not show up on my news server. I often wonder how reliable that is. I sometimesleave posts that I never see later.
There was another reply, which echoed your comments.
> >
The only way to avoid sitting around waiting for the last turn, when
> > you have already beaten the AI for all intents and purposes, is to
> > capture or destroy EVERY UNIT, or force them to leave the map.
>
> Erk.. I guess I better spread out and start beating the bushes. There
> are no more enemy units in line of sight anyway. I still have (groan) 40
> turns left. That should give me time to look in about every hex. :)
> If I recall, Sid Meyers Gettysburg allowed one to call a game off early.
> Wish this one did too.
GOOD NEWS ! The 1.03 patch will apparently fix this problem. Don't
know the specifics yet.
Jim P.
Henri H. Arsenault
> As I've said before, though, I really like the feel of the game. Have
> others run up against a tougher AI than we have so far?
Considering that in the early part of the war the Union generals were so
atrocious, it is perhaps better to play the Rebels, in which case you are
playing a stronger but more stupid opponent, which the AI simulates fairly
well. Asking the AI to play with the Genius of Lee, Jackson and Longstreet
may be asking for a bit much...
Henri
Ken Parker
> > Pau and Skip:
> > You mentioned "routed units all over the map". You may not be aware
> > that there is an error in the game code (including the latest patch)
> > which doesn't permit the icon to change back to a "non-routed" status,
> > even though the unit may well have recuperated. Check the values of
> > some of those routed units---you may find that some of them are
actually
> > quite healthy.
Version 1.03, presently in development, will fix the routed unit bug AND
provide a "declare victory" option that lets you end a battle early if your
advantage is large enough.
The date for releasing 1.03 has not yet been announced.
Ken Parker
Impressions/Sierra
Andy S.
In article <arseno-2601...@staa013.ulaval.ca>,
The AI is strong enough for me. Maybe I'm unique, but I don't want to
face an AI that will kick my butt every game. I like to win once in a
while.
Andy S.
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Andy S.
In article <01bd2a6f$97f51640$700aa8c0@kparker>,
Great news.
skip
Henri H. Arsenault wrote:
>
> In article <34C945...@idt.net>, pac...@idt.net wrote:
>
> > As I've said before, though, I really like the feel of the game. Have
> > others run up against a tougher AI than we have so far?
>
> Considering that in the early part of the war the Union generals were so
> atrocious, it is perhaps better to play the Rebels, in which case you are
> playing a stronger but more stupid opponent, which the AI simulates fairly
> well. Asking the AI to play with the Genius of Lee, Jackson and Longstreet
> may be asking for a bit much...
>
> Henri
I have seen the AI make some reasonable looking moves. Like trying to
slide around my flanks, or trying to isolate a brigade and gang up on
it. It sure knows the advantage of finding a broken unit and piling-on.
:)
slidge
In article <34C966...@bc.sympatico.ca>, jim_...@bc.sympatico.ca wrote:
>Pau and Skip:
> I think the reason Bull Run seems relatively easy (I, too, attained a
>major victory there, as well as at Blackburn and Kernstown) is because
>if not for McLellans' extreme cautiousness (some have used a harsher
>word to describe the way in which McLellan consistently frittered away
>tactical and material advantages in the early months of the war), those
>battles should have been Union victories. Presumably neither of you,
>nor I, repeated the mistakes and mis-steps taken by the Union
>historically.
One small point of contention. McClellan did not command either battle of
Manassas. Irwin McDowell was in command of the First battle, and Pope was in
command of the second (although McClellan assumed command after the First
Battle and resumed command after the Second Battle).
However, everything else said about McClellan stands. How he could not win
the battle of Sharpsburgh when he A) outnumbered the CSA 5 to 1; and B) had
detailed plans outlying EVERY move the CSA was making is beyond me.
Jim Potts
I think I actually meant to say McDowell but mixed him up with
McClellan. McDowell is the guy who ran for the presidency against
Lincoln in 1864? That's the guy I was thinking of. My civil war
history is limited to having read a couple of books, and watching the
very excellent Ken Burns television documentary on PBS.
Jim P.
Jim Potts
Andy S. wrote:
>
> The AI is strong enough for me. Maybe I'm unique, but I don't want to
> face an AI that will kick my butt every game. I like to win once in a
> while.
>
> Andy S.
As I've said previously, I too am fairly happy with the AI. My record
so far (as the Union, full war campaign) is:
Blackburn: major victory
Bull Run: " "
Kernstown: " "
McDowell: " "
Front Royal: minor victory
Winchester: minor defeat
Cross Keys: minor victory
Port Republic: draw (after several minor losses !)
The battles I've won, are battles the Union probably should have won. If
the Winchester and Port Republic scenarios are accurate reflections of
the historical orders of battle, then I can understand the Union losing
them---at Winchester especially I was really badly outnumbered.
Has anyone actually won as the Union Winchester or Port Republic. If
so, I'd love to hear how.
TIA,
Jim P.
CMalosh
>I think I actually meant to say McDowell but mixed him up with<BR>
>McClellan. McDowell is the guy who ran for the presidency against<BR>
>Lincoln in 1864?
Actually you are right. McClellan did run against Lincoln in 1864.
McDowell ended up with the Army of the Pacific for his actions in the East.
Casey Malosh
skip
...Oh.. I was hoping I could pull out some sort of draw or minor victory
at Winchester. I am playing it for the third time (I think). I had half
convinced myself if I could wreck as many Reb units as possible before
too many enemy reinforcements arrived, I could fall back on the breast
works and hunker down for the rest of the scenario.
I am currently on turn 9 of 24 and ahead 1125 to 46 victory points.
But I am now attempting the delicate operation of extracting my units
and withdrawing to the breastworks, hopefully without getting too
beat up in the process.
PS: I discovered the "Charge" command! It works wonders. Especially
against those blasted artillery units which the Rebs seem to have so
many of.
PSS: I usually get sick of the game music by this time, but find
with this game, I only have to have the music off for short periods,
and can then enjoy it again. I was impressed when my wife heard it
and asked why I was playing music from the Civil War (She is
apparently more knowledgeable on the subject than I).
Skip.
skip
Yep. I just finished Winchester after the 3rd try. I am surprised I
escaped with a Draw! I see what you mean.
Just when I would start thinking I had weathered the storm, I would
see yet another hord of enemy entering the map. It was like there was an
unending flood of them, and you were the boy at the dike. But there were
more holes in the dike than you had fingers.
So far, the scenarios dont seem very balanced. I suppose we are being
somewhat historical here. But I hope there are some coming up that are
nail-biters. I won't complain about the ones that are too easy anymore
though, after the last couple. :)
By the way, is it just me or do units in column formation look like a
bunch of weenies roller skating down the road?
Jim Potts
skip wrote:
>
> Yep. I just finished Winchester after the 3rd try. I am surprised I
> escaped with a Draw! I see what you mean.
> Just when I would start thinking I had weathered the storm, I would
> see yet another hord of enemy entering the map. It was like there was an
> unending flood of them, and you were the boy at the dike. But there were
> more holes in the dike than you had fingers.
> So far, the scenarios dont seem very balanced. I suppose we are being
> somewhat historical here. But I hope there are some coming up that are
> nail-biters. I won't complain about the ones that are too easy anymore
> though, after the last couple. :)
>
you're looking for.
> By the way, is it just me or do units in column formation look like a
> bunch of weenies roller skating down the road?
> --
roller skates ;)
Jim P.
>