MOO : 1 ship killing guardian
Adam Wolfe Littman
On the simple difficulty level after maxing out my tech I was able to kill
the guardian with a single medium ship. Has anyone out there killed him
with a single small ship?
Adam Littman
Karen Lofstrom
Adam Wolfe Littman (alit...@Hawaii.Edu) wrote:
: On the simple difficulty level after maxing out my tech I was able to kill
: the guardian with a single medium ship. Has anyone out there killed him
: with a single small ship?
I think I've killed the Guardian with one blast from a BIG ship with
lots of disruptors. Hard to remember .... I've killed the Guardian so
many times now :)
--
Karen Lofstrom lofs...@lava.net
----------------------------------------------------------------------
A product of Happy People's Recycled Food Cooperative Division Three
-kludge-
Peter Stewart
Karen Lofstrom (lofs...@lava.net) wrote:
: Adam Wolfe Littman (alit...@Hawaii.Edu) wrote:
:
: : On the simple difficulty level after maxing out my tech I was able to kill
: : the guardian with a single medium ship. Has anyone out there killed him
: : with a single small ship?
:
: I think I've killed the Guardian with one blast from a BIG ship with
: lots of disruptors. Hard to remember .... I've killed the Guardian so
: many times now :)
In a game I just completed yesterday at the average level I defeated the
Guardian with a stack of large ships armed with pulse phasors and that
thingie-whose-name-escapes-me that adds three to your beam weapons' range.
Pete
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pete Stewart | "Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent"
ste...@bae.bellcore.com | - Salvor Hardin
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fotis Kokkoras
Adam Wolfe Littman wrote:
>
> On the simple difficulty level after maxing out my tech I was able to kill
> the guardian with a single medium ship. Has anyone out there killed him
> with a single small ship?
>
I did it in impossible difficulty level with just one hit. If memory
serves, that was a huge ship but I can't rebember the weapons.
Fotis / MOOW
Keith R. Kearnan
That thingie-whose-name-escaped-you is:
High Energy Focus.
-Keith
Mathias Schrandt
Hi Orioner,
I think you can kill him with a single ship, equipped with an black hole
generator and teleporter.
Bye,
Mathias
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~ Mathias Schrandt Informatik Uni-Oldenburg ~~
~~ Im Ofenerfeld 6a 26127 Oldenburg Tel: 0441 / 602544 ~~
~~ Email: Mathias....@informatik.uni-oldenburg.de ~~
~~ Logins: beren@diamant, schrandt@mango ~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott A. Colcord
Mathias Schrandt (Mathias....@Informatik.Uni-Oldenburg.DE) wrote:
:
: I think you can kill him with a single ship, equipped with an black hole
: generator and teleporter.
No, you can't....the Guardian is immune to most special weapons, including
the BHG.
----Scott
--
Scott A. Colcord http://www.cs.mtu.edu/grads/Colcord/Home.html
M.S. Cand. Artificial adaptive systems Dept. of Computer Science
Michigan Technological University E-mail: saco...@mtu.edu
--
Urn...a Psilon
alit...@Hawaii.Edu (Adam Wolfe Littman) wrote:
>On the simple difficulty level after maxing out my tech I was able to kill
>the guardian with a single medium ship. Has anyone out there killed him
>with a single small ship?
>Adam Littman
I have also destroyed the guardian, but at Impossible difficulty
level. It was with either a medium or large ship. I can't remember.
Mike Means
Urn...a Psilon (ju...@voyager.net) wrote:
: I have also destroyed the guardian, but at Impossible difficulty
: level. It was with either a medium or large ship. I can't remember.
I usually do it with a stack of medium size ships armed with one
antimatter or plasma torpedo and a subspace teleporter. If you're fast and
know what you're doing you never get hit so I theoretically could kill
him with one medium size ship if I really wanted to spend the time.
Mike
Scott A. Colcord
Jonathan Aitken (ait...@ocean.com.au) wrote:
: I dont see how this would be possible - given that the regeneration is 30%
: per turn or somesuch - how will a single small ship do more than what a
: constant 700+ points per turn (on easy let alone the 3000+ needed for
: impossible)? I'm actually pretty suspicious of a medium or large being
: able to do it, given the HEF etc as well of the Guardian - maybe on easy.
It is possible...a stream projector does damage as a percentage of hit
points, and cannot be repaired.
Jonathan Aitken
As far as I know, Stream projectors do not affect the guardian, as with most
other specials.
Cheers,
J Aitken.
Urn...a Psilon
ait...@ocean.com.au (Jonathan Aitken) wrote:
>I dont see how this would be possible - given that the regeneration is 30% per
>turn or somesuch - how will a single small ship do more than what a constant
>700+ points per turn (on easy let alone the 3000+ needed for impossible)? I'm
>actually pretty suspicious of a medium or large being able to do it, given the
>HEF etc as well of the Guardian - maybe on easy.
>Cheers,
>Jonathan Aitken
>ju...@voyager.net (Urn...a Psilon) wrote:
>>alit...@Hawaii.Edu (Adam Wolfe Littman) wrote:
>>>On the simple difficulty level after maxing out my tech I was able to kill
>>>the guardian with a single medium ship. Has anyone out there killed him
>>>with a single small ship?
>>>Adam Littman
>>I have also destroyed the guardian, but at Impossible difficulty
>>level. It was with either a medium or large ship. I can't remember.
Sorry I can't remember the weopons I used. But I do know that I did
it. It was a memorable event at the time!
As Scott A. Colcord said, it is very possible. There are a handle
full of weopons, like the stream projector, that can do plenty of
damage. A small ship doing the above is improbable, but a
medium or large is quite possible.
Urn...a Psilon
Jonathan Aitken
Chris Byler
Mike Means (me...@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu) wrote:
> Urn...a Psilon (ju...@voyager.net) wrote:
> : I have also destroyed the guardian, but at Impossible difficulty
> : level. It was with either a medium or large ship. I can't remember.
> I usually do it with a stack of medium size ships armed with one
> antimatter or plasma torpedo and a subspace teleporter. If you're fast and
> know what you're doing you never get hit so I theoretically could kill
> him with one medium size ship if I really wanted to spend the time.
How do you never get hit? Unless you know some way to teleport twice per turn,
and anyway he will eventually nail you with his HEF'd Stellar Converters.
It doesn't take much speed when you have range 6.
Besides, he has Auto Repair at hard level and ADC at Impossible, so no one
ship is going to be able to take him, period. Even a mauler device small
(which you can do at TL99) won't be able to overcome the ADC, not to mention
the Stellar Converters.
> Mike
Chris Byler
> : per turn or somesuch - how will a single small ship do more than what a
> : constant 700+ points per turn (on easy let alone the 3000+ needed for
> : impossible)? I'm actually pretty suspicious of a medium or large being
> : able to do it, given the HEF etc as well of the Guardian - maybe on easy.
> It is possible...a stream projector does damage as a percentage of hit
> points, and cannot be repaired.
.. And the Guardian is immune to it.
You cannot BHG, Warp Dissipate, Tech Nullify, Stasis Field, Ion Stream
Projector, Neutron Stream Projector, Energy Pulsar, or Ionic Pulsar the
Guardian, Amoeba, or Crystal. 'Nuff said. Oh, and you can't Repulse them
either.
Also stream projector damage *can* be repaired.
> ----Scott
Chris
Jonathan Aitken
OK - on easy, it can be done with a large - I checked. I dont think its
possible with a medium from what I can see, but if someone wants to post their
configuration Ill have a look. Small is dreaming.
And for Easy it would be at least 1400 per turn - I thought it was 2000 not 4000
for the guardian.
As has been said, specials basically dont work against the guardian.
Cheers,
J. Aitken
Ralph Betza
Oh, I forgot to mention the other way you could beat the Guardian, at any
difficulty level, with one small ship:
You could cheat! :-)
Any of the popular saved-game editors will let you create a small ship
packed to the gills with death rays or crystal rays or amoeba streams.
Jonathan Aitken
My mistake - I missed that autorepair isnt on the guardian at lower difficulty
levels than hard. I still dont believe that it can be done with a medium or
smaller tho - willing to be educated tho (with a configuration).
Im pretty sure Ive done it with a 1 huge at impossible but I'll check...
Ralph Betza
*sigh* Fourteen responses, and nobody has properly addressed the original
question.
At the easy difficulty level, with tech level 99, can you kill the
Guardian with one small ship?
At easy, the Guardian has no hitpoint regeneration, but it still has
plenty of punch to kill a small ship with one shot. Using a teleporter,
you can wait and wait, and then get two shots in before the Guardian has
a chance to defend itself. Against shield level 5, the Gauss Autocannon
is the best choice in terms of average amount of damage per hull space.
Unable to try it, I can only estimate that this fails by a factor of 4
(you only do 1/4 as much damage as you need, and then you are toast).
Another alternative would be to use a weapon whose damage is highly
variable, and to get lucky. I don't think this would work, either.
The only remaining strategy is to try to get more than two shots.
For this, you need luck. Good shields will let you ignore the Guardian's
missiles, but the only thing that can save you from the Death Ray is
the Displacement Device (and a bit of luck).
As for the Guardian's Stellar Converters, the combination of good
shields, high mobility, and the displacement device (and luck) should do
the trick.
So, could you beat the Guardian with one small?
I say yes, but not with any degree of certainty. If you win one time out
of 200 tries, you have been fabulously fortunate.
Chris Byler
Ralph Betza (sa...@newshost.li.net) wrote:
I agree.. you basically have to go alkari, max maneuver, disp.dev., inert.null.,
and pray. This should reduce his to-hit to (5% for max defense) * (2/3 for
D.D.) = 3 1/3 %, in other words only 1 in 33 shots will hit. Then you just
have to hope you last enough rounds without him getting lucky.
Of course you wouldn't have a prayer on the levels where he has Auto Repair.
Chris
Marcus Lindberg
A fun game in a style reminding of Panzer General.
Does anyone know how to use sea transports? It seems
to be impossible to walk my groundunits onto the transports.
Seems like I must take care of my airtransports and use them
instead.
Also, is there any keyboard comands. Using the mouse for
everythings is a pain. Yes, I read the manual, but found
nothing.
/Marcus
Gerry Flint
e90...@efd.lth.se (Marcus Lindberg) wrote:
>A fun game in a style reminding of Panzer General.
>Does anyone know how to use sea transports? It seems
>to be impossible to walk my groundunits onto the transports.
>Seems like I must take care of my airtransports and use them
>instead.
Sea transports can take ground units. Try walking your ground units
onto a transport at a port.
>
>Also, is there any keyboard comands. Using the mouse for
>everythings is a pain. Yes, I read the manual, but found
>nothing.
I lost my manual so I can't help you with this one. I use the mouse
for everything myself. In the earlier versions of BI, you had to hold
down the space bar and press the arrow keys to command the game.
PS. This is a good www site to check out;
http://www.studionet.it/andrea/bi3.html
Gerry
Tim Chown
Gerry Flint wrote:
>
> e90...@efd.lth.se (Marcus Lindberg) wrote:
>
> >A fun game in a style reminding of Panzer General.
> >Does anyone know how to use sea transports? It seems
> >to be impossible to walk my groundunits onto the transports.
> >Seems like I must take care of my airtransports and use them
> >instead.
> Sea transports can take ground units. Try walking your ground units
> onto a transport at a port.
Some ground units - usually only robots (up to HBR).
--
Tim Chown | GD Review http://www.gamesdomain.com/gdreview
t...@ecs.soton.ac.uk | - the games site written by gamers for gamers
Peter Huebner
In <4tagfk$f...@news.lth.se> e90...@efd.lth.se (Marcus Lindberg) writes:
>A fun game in a style reminding of Panzer General.
>Does anyone know how to use sea transports? It seems
>to be impossible to walk my groundunits onto the transports.
>Seems like I must take care of my airtransports and use them
>instead.
>Also, is there any keyboard comands. Using the mouse for
>everythings is a pain. Yes, I read the manual, but found
>nothing.
> /Marcus
I have boarded units on to a Repair Ship by parking it next to a quay, in a
port, then moved the units on to it. Destroyers, I think, can only take
Infantry. I found I could not board them from shore or from a shoreside city.
What I want to try but haven't got around to is to build a road out into the
ocean and see if I can board from that . . . you can build a road in the
shallow water next to the shore, y'know <g>.
Did you know that a 'Flying Fortress' can take substantial amounts of payload?
The bloody manual is so miserly with information! I only found out by accident.
cheers, -Peter
--
The Animal
How can you defeat Guardian on Impossible with one huge?
Can someone describe in painful detail the technique for dodging missiles
with a very high-manuervability ship?
-----
Daniel DuBois http://www.pobox.com/~ddubois/
Jonathan Aitken
Nup thats basically it - I only did it to check out other peoples posts with a
saved game I had. You need maximum tech levels to get the miniaturisation - I
got about 350 maulers at max into a huge with max engines, no shields, max comp,
battle scanner and SST (smallest size at high tech levels).
Anyone writing about mediums doing it is full of it as far as I can see - you
can do it with a large on easy. As I've said, post the design and Ill have a go
to check it out.
Think I'll get a life now.
Cheers,
J. Aitken
Doug Jacobs <dja...@rahul.net> wrote:
>The Animal (ddu...@enteract.com) wrote:
>: How can you defeat Guardian on Impossible with one huge?
>: Can someone describe in painful detail the technique for dodging missiles
>: with a very high-manuervability ship?
>With a huge? That should be possible...
>Sub-space teleporters, highest battle computers, no shields and cram the
>rest of the ship full of maulers & gauss autocannons (my personal fav.)
>Get the first move...1 shot, 1 kill. (or does the Guardian at impossible
>do something I don't know about? I've never gone for Orion at impossible
>since by the time I find it, I've already won the game.)
Doug Jacobs
Mike Means
The Animal (ddu...@enteract.com) wrote:
: How can you defeat Guardian on Impossible with one huge?
: Can someone describe in painful detail the technique for dodging missiles
: with a very high-manuervability ship?
: -----
: Daniel DuBois http://www.pobox.com/~ddubois/
I can do it with a medium and thoeretically with a small (If i had the
techs to put a torpedo and a sub-space teleporter on the ship with a
decent computer)
Basically you can warp around the screen dodgeing all of the missles and
firing every other round. Very monotonous. I usually do it with a
rather large squadron of medium class ships and it takes awhile but
I presume the if I had the patience I could do it with one. If I had the
tech I could then do it with a small.
Mike
Doug Jacobs
Mike Means (me...@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu) wrote:
: The Animal (ddu...@enteract.com) wrote:
: : How can you defeat Guardian on Impossible with one huge?
: I can do it with a medium and thoeretically with a small (If i had the
: techs to put a torpedo and a sub-space teleporter on the ship with a
: decent computer)
: Basically you can warp around the screen dodgeing all of the missles and
: firing every other round. Very monotonous. I usually do it with a
: rather large squadron of medium class ships and it takes awhile but
: I presume the if I had the patience I could do it with one. If I had the
: tech I could then do it with a small.
Er... I think the question implied _1_ _single_ ship, no stacks.
At any rate, I don't see how a single medium ship would be able to
take out the Guardian, much less a small. Sure, teleport around to dodge
the missiles, but, what about the Guardian's beam weapons? Once the
Guardian reaches the middle of the screen, it can basically reach all
edges of the screen with its beams with minimal fuss. Let's say you
manage to miraculously dodge the beams too. The Guardian's got auto-repair
which means you'll have to inflict some heavy damage, otherwise, it'll
just heal up after each turn. 1 torpedo every other turn isn't even
going to make the Guardian blink.
1 huge should be fairly easy. 1 large? Trickier, but may be possible.
1 medium? I'd like to see a video of that ;) 1 small? Is your name
Skywalker, by chance? I have a rebellion you maybe interested in.... ;)
Jonathan Aitken
Mike - I think you're wrong. A single large ship can't put out the 3300+ damage
per turn for this to be true, let alone medium or small (on impossible, the
Guardian has advanced damage control). Please feel free to post the design you
think it can be done with. Huge is OK and is fairly easy.
I'm talking 1.3 here.
J. Aitken
me...@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu (Mike Means) wrote:
>The Animal (ddu...@enteract.com) wrote:
>: How can you defeat Guardian on Impossible with one huge?
>: Can someone describe in painful detail the technique for dodging missiles
>: with a very high-manuervability ship?
>: -----
>: Daniel DuBois http://www.pobox.com/~ddubois/
>I can do it with a medium and thoeretically with a small (If i had the
>techs to put a torpedo and a sub-space teleporter on the ship with a
>decent computer)
>Basically you can warp around the screen dodgeing all of the missles and
>firing every other round. Very monotonous. I usually do it with a
>rather large squadron of medium class ships and it takes awhile but
>I presume the if I had the patience I could do it with one. If I had the
>tech I could then do it with a small.
>Mike
Jonathan Aitken
I've checked - I dont think it can be done with a large on impossible. I'd be
happy to be proved wrong. Huge actually isnt that easy - it does need very high
levels of tech to do it on this 'easily'.
J. Aitken
x95...@wmich.edu
neutroniu 2 armor.
Must have the Alkaris to do it.
++ on defence against rays and missles. Have better beam defence and miss.
defence.
you'll see defence equal to + - 19!
Fill up all your weapons pylons with:
99 pulse phasor (finish up the job)
99 mauler (break the hull)
99 Zeon missles (get it shot first)
99 Particle Beam (slice'em half)
fill you device bays with : Inertial nullifier for first initiative attack
Displacement Device +33% chance of surviving
High energy focus for range & first strike
Doug Jacobs
Jonathan Aitken (ait...@ocean.com.au) wrote:
: I've checked - I dont think it can be done with a large on impossible. I'd be
: happy to be proved wrong. Huge actually isnt that easy - it does need very high
: levels of tech to do it on this 'easily'.
Sorry...I naturally was assuming that tech levels were maxxed out, and that
you had access to every tech-goody researchable.
Jonathan Aitken
Well I'll be - just got a post from someone pointing out that there is no ADC on
impossible Guardians, only on hard (he's right, I checked - how ridiculous). So
medium is possible by dodging etc.
Live and learn.
J. Aitken
For easy huge - 1 shot - max tech, max weapons (350 maulers), no shields, no
armour, no maneuverability, no ecm, SST, max comp. Apparently one missile of
high tech will increase hits chnces (bug I'd say) - but you lose an entire
weapon bay so it'll be interesting to see the trade off. Warp in and shoot.
Mrrshan would help.
Clas Fabricius
In article <4uv8d0$f...@lynx.aba.net.au>, ait...@ocean.com.au says...
>
>I've checked - I dont think it can be done with a large on impossible. I'd be
>happy to be proved wrong. Huge actually isnt that easy - it does need very
high
>levels of tech to do it on this 'easily'.
>
>
<snip>
In my version 1.3, the Guardian only has ADC on the hard setting. On all the
others (I checked) it only has HEF and Lightn.Shield. (But more hits etc.)
So I (and everybody else?) can kill the Guardian on impossible with one _1_
medium ship.
It's almost cheating but if you have to do it...
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
W
A
R
N
I
N
G
It's only because of the SST (way to powerful IMO) it works, and you have to
dodge a lot.
My ship design: (tech lvl 99)
medium, best computer, no shield, no ecm, smallest armor, best engine, best
manuver., 1 missile (Stinger 2c), 10 Stellar Converters, Subspace Teleporter.
That's it!
You have to dodge his missiles. After the're gone (5c) you _wait_ for the plasma
torps to close, dodge in, shoot (missiles turned off), end turn, shoot, dodge
away, repeatedly...(you'll need about 18 shots).
The Guardian only has speed 2 and after he has fired his missiles/torps he'll
back off if you're still on the other side of the screen.
BTW it seems that if you put a missile or torp in bay one the beam weapons will
do much more damage. Has anybody else noticed this?
/Clas
P.S. If the Guardian has ADC I need _many_ small, _some_ medium or at least
_one_ large ship with this method.
Jonathan Aitken
Mike -
I blew it too (thanks for the honesty by the way about not actually having done
it) - on impossible it doesnt have ADC (I checked - what a have!) - it only does
on hard so my comments apply there, but apparently it can be done on impossible
- the only other issue would be the 50 turn limit - I doubt a small could do it
in time. Medium apparently can in 18 turns. Large can do it on a Guardian with
ADC on hard - (thanks to Clas Fabricius who posted this and the ship design to
back it up).
Cheers,
J. Aitken
me...@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu (Mike Means) wrote:
>I didn't realize that it had repair systems so you are right, one of that
>ship wouldn't work. I've killed it with stacks of that ship many times
>without losing a ship (I used to have a patern that the computer would
>never get into beam range and the missles would always miss...It was a
>long time ago though...maybe the missles did hit once and a while...I
>don't remember) Since I didn't realize that it repaired I figured that
>it could be done with one...sorry...
>Mike
Mike Means
Tey Chee Meng
ews.enteract.com> <4usj6g$i...@news.ccit.arizona.edu> <4utn1r$h...@lynx.aba.net.au>
Organization: NUS
Distribution:
On Wed, 14 Aug 1996 22:22:50 GMT, Jonathan Aitken (ait...@ocean.com.au)
wrote:
:Mike - I think you're wrong. A single large ship can't put out the 3300+ damage
:per turn for this to be true, let alone medium or small (on impossible, the
:Guardian has advanced damage control). Please feel free to post the design you
:think it can be done with. Huge is OK and is fairly easy.
:I'm talking 1.3 here.
:J. Aitken
1 medium can kill the guardian. Just tried it last night with
psilons on impossible.
This is possible due to the fact that the guardian does not
have adc on impossible and the following bug in the AI :
If the guardian has a torpedo or missile chasing after you, it
will will back off to the right edge of the screen, rather than move 1
square left and fire its stellar converters.
The ship design is 10 mauler, 1 missile, hyper engine, high E focus,
inert nullifier, battle scanner, no shield/ecm, battle comp M11.
The combat took about 30 turns(boring). Hence, I think a small
can never kill the guardian since any combat disengages after 40-50 turns.
--
Tey Chee Meng
" Not to take extremes, the middle way is the best "
Michelle Servais
Well, I haven't managed to kill it yet, but I did stalemate it with one
medium ship. I'm playing huge/hard, my tech levels are maxed. I designed
the ship with a teleporter as many plasma torpedoes as I could pack on
and precious little else. I just can't inflict enough damage to overcome
it's auto repair. I'll keep trying
Clas Fabricius
In article <4va74b$j...@falcon.ccs.uwo.ca>, mser...@genesis.edu.uwo.ca says...
can pack. Then you can hit twice as often :)
/Clas