Cleve's true racist self shines through [long]

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Damocles

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Sep 24, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/24/99
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Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed
himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
(single ">" parts are Cleve):

[begin quote]


On Thu, 23 Sep 1999 17:55:23 GMT, CMB <cl...@ans.com.au> wrote:

>In article <7scihr$k3u$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> bras...@my-deja.com wrote:
>> In article <7sahuc$4t7$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>> CMB <cl...@ans.com.au> wrote:
>>
>> <snip> (stuff)
>> > I guess you don't love your country so much as your cot and your >
>paycheck.
>> You're right, I only love it enough to continue living here and try to
>> improve this country for future generations regardless of their ethnic
>> origin. What a selfish bastard I am.
>
>"Ethnic origin." I guess 30 million people in eight years entering the
>country without passports then, is in fact, "immigration." You're a
>crap soldier, you're so fugging ignorant of human history you don't
>even recognize a full scale invasion when you see one. Or else so
>scared of the cannibal cocaine colonizers you think if you placate them
>ala Lord Chamberlain they won't drive you into the sea, gringo. I think
>not.
>
>> Their is a workaround. The order is given to the US officer in
>charge, he
>> delegates to the next lower chain of command and so forth. The
>officer in
>> question has to verify the order with his US HQ, therefore no order is
>> carried out without US authentification.
>
>Marxist traitor. You are forbidden to take orders by proxy through a
>foreign national. You are forbidden to alter your uniform. You are
>forbidden to place any insignia of a foreign government on your
>uniform. You are sworn to defend the United States in your oath of
>allegiance when you are recruited. Only an opportunist would
>rationalize such obvious treason against the national sovereignty of
>our country. You are not fit to wipe Michael New's shoes, you aren't a
>good enough soldier to brass his cufflinks.
>
>> > You'd put on a pink dress and
>> > fight with a limp strip of macaroni for the Soviet Union if you got
>> > orders to do so.
>>
>> Why are you so filled with hate and hostile? Is your fear that great?
>
>My intelligence is that great, junior. A fool wants to believe he isn't
>afraid of anything, a wise and courageous warrior knows what to be
>afraid of. I don't fight battles I can't win. If you think I'm going to
>run out of a burning building and suck down an ATF bullet so you can
>watch me on CNN with a caption "Hate & Thought Crime Perpetrator Is
>Executed By Glorious Imperial Forces" and click your tongue and go
>"What the heck is wrong with these people, can't we all just get
>along?" and flick back over to the Jerry Springer show you're out of
>your frigging mind.
>
>I can't wait to see your face when you finally get it. Naked, raw
>terror, I guarantee it. You'll never know what hit you. When your
>internal paradigm flips rightside up and you feel this sickening lurch
>as reality shifts around you into a completely different form, it is
>going to be rich, I wish I could take a polaroid snap at that moment. I
>love that moment Keanu Reeves wakes up in THE MATRIX, that is the only
>analogy I can think of you'd understand.
>
>> I agree, however if that also means I can help the people of other
>countries
>> when possible why shouldn't we cooperate with our close allies like
>the UK?
>
>Fugging traitor bastard. You don't even know your general orders.
>
>> Well then don't wear their uniform then. however since you are cut
>off from
>> your own unit and you are with allies, I see no problem with hitting
>the
>> enemy positions with artillery fire as long as you wear your own
>uniform.
>
>Court martial when it is over.
>
>> <snip> (repetitious stuff)
>>
>> > Actually, I don't believe it was the huge explosions, firestorms,
>> > automatic weapons fire and marauding gangs of rapist thugs in the
>Los
>> > Angeles Riots that induced me to leave ... it was the creeping
>> > certainty that my fellow countrymen absolutely were not going to put
>> > up anything remotely like a fight.
>>
>> LA is a hole, and I don't live there specifically for that reason.
>
>I guess it just has some abstract "bad karmic" aura around it that
>makes it that way. Probably the 60% non-white population has nothing to
>do with it. The world of the socialist is just filled with coincidences.
>
>Third world people = third world country. Any nation is the sum total
>of the millions of decisions all the people in it make every waking
>second of the day.
>
>Name one prosperous stable democratic republic non-white country being
>invaded by white illegal immigrants, I'll drop this argument forever.
>Remember, white people are only 8% of the world's population. Name one
>non-white country they smuggle themselves into inside cargo containers
>and I am more than bright enough to immediately see the validity of
>your whacky Marxist worldview. There is no such country. It doesn't
>exist.
>
>> > They'll have you hog-tied over a barrel
>> > in a New Aztlan Comfort Camp getting bunged up the ass by Mexican
>> > Marxists during their off-duty time and you'll be saying (while your
>> > arse is getting pounded) "Sure, there are some cultural differences
>to
>> > be weathered, but frankly I think this country is all about
>tolerance
>> > and learning to appreciate our common bonds rather than our
>> > differences." Maybe you'll be able to hear the screams of your wife
>> > and daughter coming from a nearby shack.
>>
>> One must come to the conclusion that you have psycho-sexual issues to
>deal
>> with if you can come up with such graphic depictions of sexual
>violence
>> without partaking in them or experiencing them previously.
>
>Now you're an Oprah style post freudian psychologist, too! What a
>surprise, it must be catching! Practically everybody is nowadays,
>especially people with the poorest literacy and weakest minds. I guess
>the field is now open to all expertise sort of like UFO research.
>
>> > If you think I'm going to stay and fight to protect the likes of
>you,
>> > you're dreaming.
>>
>> Well, I don't need your protection. I'm quite able to protect myself
>and my
>> family thank you.
>
>I love the Howard Mitty couch rambos who think that although they lack
>the courage to make a stand today, they will definitely make one "if
>things get out of hand" tomorrow. In these fantasies, they are fighting
>the National Guard with a revolver and a bullwhip.
>
>Here's what is will happen, Kevin. A guy from the Aztlan interim
>government will show up at your door with a truckful of soldiers
>outside and tell you that you are a capitalist pig and that your family
>is inhabiting a house that could easily hold 20 or 30 more people. This
>has happened many times over the past 3 decades in Mexico and
>throughout South America. Your neighbor will protest and about ten
>minutes later he will be shot point blank in the head out in the
>street, at which time your wife will begin screaming pitifully, over
>and over again, shaking her head in horror. You will look down after
>feeling a dampness inside your pantleg and you will realize you have
>pissed yourself. The next day the new marxist government will move a
>half dozen families inside your home and you will have Mexicans
>crapping in your sink and sleeping with their dogs on your bed while
>your wife and daughter lie with you on the couch. You won't do a damned
>thing. You'll do exactly what the hell you are told and you will have
>trouble even complaining when your new boarders start to tell you that
>part of true Marxism means universal love amongst all comrades in the
>struggle and not getting hung up on relationships. Then they'll take
>your wife and daughter to sleep in with them from then on. The Marxist
>insurgency does this all the time down in Mexico when they confiscate a
>safe house and move their troops inside for barracks.
>
>You will just stare out the window all day long at the bleak gray sky
>helplessly, maybe watching the crappy State propaganda TV and tears
>will form in your eyes occasionally for no reason. Maybe you'll turn to
>drugs or alcohol to help you remain quiet and not show any sign of
>outrage or discontentment. Finally, one day they'll show up at your
>door and tell you that they have discovered you were a fascist tool
>previously in the Marines of the former United States and that you have
>been scheduled for incarceration and reprogramming. (Thousands inhabit
>jails in South America now awaiting this process)
>
>Someday, years later, you'll be taken into an open courtyard and
>summarily shot. You'll be grateful for death by that point and consider
>it the greatest blessing you could possibly hope for at that juncture.
>At no time will you so much as raise your voice or even lift a hand to
>help yourself.
>
>> You know why the American people never listened to racist, xenophobic,
>> ethnocentric, fear and hate mongers like you before? Because you
>never have
>> anything better planned except to a return to fundamental christian
>values
>> from the 1930s. I much prefer our present society, it's got problems,
>but at
>> least it's a lot less fake and dopy.
>
>The truth at last. You hate white people. Yourself most of all. What a
>shock.
>
>If you mean that safe, law abiding gentle drug-free society with sock
>hops and white sales and milk bars and church dances and unlocked doors
>and abstinence before marriage and two cars in every garage and no
>couples on beds together in movies and an intact family with a mother
>at home to care for the children and enough disposable income that
>Americans owned their own homes in their early 20's and a tax rate of
>20% ... I know what you mean. What a boring place compared to Rwanda or
>Bosnia. Really dull, it was. How trite and mundane compared to Sierra
>Leone or Haiti or Mexico.
>
>> > If Mexicans are such fine and decent people ... why is Mexico a
>third
>> > world socialist hellhole and why are they trying to escape it so
>> > desperately? Why has Mexico been a barbaric nightmarish country for
>> > the past 1000 years of recorded history?
>>
>> Because their leaders aren't nice people? Have you ever thought of
>that?
>
>Do you think I might have thought of that? Many times? Thousands of
>times? Millions of times? And decided that is the sorriest apologist
>irrational bullsh*t humanly imaginable? You think the problem with
>Mexico is 2 or 3 crooked politicians?
>
>Mexico is what mexicans have made it into. Mexico is not a place on a
>map ... mexico is wherever there are enough Mexicans. Mexicans can move
>to Antarctica or Mars, within a couple of weeks if they are a majority
>there then Antarctica or Mars will start to closely resemble Mexico.
>
>I don't think you really know anything about Mexico. Maybe like most
>Americans you figure the images you are shown on TV are what Mexico is.
>
>MEXICO IS A FUGGIN 3rd WORLD MARXIST HELLHOLE. The cops run the
>prostitution and slavery rings and the drugs business. Forget about
>what you have heard - the reality of Mexican life is a million times
>worse than you could possibly conceive. This is why Mexican illegals
>see sidewalks and intact water mains, no wild rabid dogs and no
>explosions in Los Angeles and think they have arrived in heaven ... in
>a city that 100 million white people have voted on with their feet in
>the past twenty years by vacating. Still, it's a step up for Mexicans,
>even if it is a violent, vicious collapsing city of death and
>destruction. At least until enough Mexicans arrive there.
>
>> > Did you know that when Europeans were experimenting with electricity
>> > and looking through microscopes and printing books off a press and
>> > exploring the globe in sailing ships, Mexicans subsisted primarily
>by
>> > eating human flesh as a source of protein because they never learned
>> > how to domesticate animals?
>>
>> Well at least you aren't a revisionist, racist xenophobe. (sarcasm
>intended)
>
>Good comeback - always answer all reasonable arguments with ad hominem
>witchhunt labels like "racist." What the hell is this supposed to mean?
>I believe that races are biologically different from one another? IS
>this like "misogynist" - I believe the sexes are different from one
>another? Well ... what would you offer to lead me to believe otherwise?
>"The Color Purple?" Some Marxist blueprint for world socialism?
>
>What is your point, exactly? I'm sane - you aren't? What are you
>getting at? I am stuck on reality, you're a better man because you are
>sick, repressed and lying to yourself about the nature of human
>existence? How does this make you a better person than me, exactly?
>
>> > Is the third world a geographic location? Or is the third world >
>carried inside the genes of third world people?
>>
>> It's a geographic location because Europe was once a third world
>country when
>> Rome, Greece, Egypt, and China were all civilized countries.
>
>No, it wasn't. A popular liberal cliche. They had order, agriculture,
>communication, writing, art, science, religion, law and innovation even
>in the darkest period of the dark ages. On their worst day there was
>never a white majority country on Earth so debased that it could hold a
>candle to the average noon bongo party in south Africa.
>
>Rome, Greece, Egypt and China were all white civilizations. Any doubts,
>open a book and look at their artistic portrayals of lily white
>caucasian nordics with blue eyes and blond hair. A lot of the artwork
>still has paint on it. China just opened the tomb of their ancient
>ruling class and dragged into the sun bodies of men with red hair and
>blue eyes, blond females and fish white skin. It was such an
>embarrassment to the Chinese government they closed the site down and
>forbid journalists to take any more photographs.
>
>As it happens there is a little bit of truth to the African American
>fantasies of black Egyptians with laser beams and helicopters ... it is
>a historical fact that the last dynasty WAS black. It was also the LAST
>dynasty, period. Egypt collapsed into the stone age immediately
>afterwards.
>
>>
>> Again, LA isn't the only Hispanic American reality.
>
>So you admit, racism is not an irrational hatred of people because of
>the color of their skin. Racism is a natural and realistic reaction
>based on direct one-to-one experience. Good. Because 60 years of
>research into the subject has reluctantly confirmed this same
>conclusion again and again, even as the media has claimed otherwise.
>
>> > You're a pathetic weakling, Kevin, when I was in Los Angeles I saw
>> > guys like you suck up a big submissive grin and a cold sweat every
>> > time they got into a conflict with some hispanics - you're all
>> > rhetoric, and they know it too.
>>
>> That's peculiar, I've never had a fight with one before. They've been
>> friendly to me, and I've been friendly to them. Never said an
>antogonistic
>> word to a Hispanic. Some of my best friends are Hispanic.
>
>I knew many in the military who really weren't such bad guys, either.
>Unfortunately, the overwhelming majority were subhuman lowlifes of
>staggeringly depraved character and conduct. The whole point is not
>that there aren't good people of all colors and origins - the problem
>is that some races are incapable of maintaining civilizations, period.
>Some races are extraordinarily violent no matter how much the
>government tries to conceal the facts about their rates of crime and
>disease. This is not the fault of white Europeans. Attempting to go on
>living and existing is not a crime by any standard. Mexicans are trying
>to survive by escaping their fellow mexicans. At some point, we'd
>better make a decision about our lifeboat, because too many people of
>the wrong origins and we WILL be Bosnia, period. Period. But you keep
>up the nice chit-chat and keep telling yourself that if you had
>anything to worry about you're sure Ted Koppel would have mentioned it
>on Nightline.
>
>Ted Koppel's ass will be on a plane to a resort hotel in Ontario when
>the gunfire starts, trust me. Don't look to him for any advice. Ted
>Koppel will be sipping champagne and watching your ass on CNN in front
>of a Mexican Marxists People's Court, believe it. "Poor Kevin - if only
>he'd been more tolerant and less prejudiced, he wouldn't be in that
>situation today. It wasn't multiculturalism that failed, it was the
>average american unwilling to give up their racist bias. Well, on to
>Australia! What's next on the agenda? When are we going to start
>blessing the Ozzies with the real benefits of 'diversity?'"
>
>Name a single country (not an empire) that remained stable for more
>than ten years after a majority resident ethnic group was displaced by
>colonizers. You can't - it's a trick question, there never was any such
>country. Outside of Star Trek and the "It's a Small World Exhibit" at
>Disneyland, liberals and socialists have no historical examples to draw
>upon from the last 5000 years for their multicultural fantasy world.
>
>> > You'd pass'em your girlfriend for a group hug before you'd
>> > so much as raise your voice to those animals. Don't try to paint the
>> > fact you're a complete coward as some kind of sensitivity, now.
>You're
>> > just scared, period. You couldn't fight your way out of a paper bag
>> > even if you could summon up the aggression.
>>
>> Well considering who ran away and who stayed, I think we both know
>who is
>> really scared here.
>
>You're right - I was scared. Because I'm smart. Zero doubt about that.
>If we were going to fight this invasion, I'd have stayed and fought.
>But looked to me like nobody was going to fight and anybody who did was
>going to be imprisoned for hate/thought/speech crime. So fugg you,
>junior, you're on your own. People tend to get the kind of government
>they deserve. If Americans want to laugh feebly as their nation goes
>bongo-bongo, that is the bed they have made for themselves. Good luck,
>you're gonna need it, trust me.
>
>It occurs to me the reason you aren't scared is that you have no idea
>what is going on other than what you hear on TV.
>
>> Again, the Barrios aren't the whole existence of Hispanics in the US.
>
>Yes, I know about the two or three guys they roll out for the news
>stories who are upstanding citizens. You could find such exemplary
>people amongst any race. Standing right behind them is the horde I saw
>pouring down Sunset Blvd. in the fading orange light of a horizon
>illuminated by thousands of raging fires. You bring up the tokens, you
>got your exceptions, the floodgates open and the primates pour in
>unabated like locusts. They will all be democrats, guaranteed.
>
>The Mexican is a Marxist by nature. With an average IQ of 90* they
>could not be otherwise even if they wanted to with all their hearts.
>They are destroyers - they destroyed their own nest and now they are
>ready to befoul another. It's not their fault. They are not so much
>immoral as amoral - incapable of being held responsible for what they
>are. It is tragic but if you think I'm going to let Dr. Octavius and
>General Ursa inherit the earth so I don't hurt anybody's feelings
>you're out of your gourd.
>
>*Considered evidence of severely impaired mental function in most
>states as recently as the 1960's
>
>> I have heard very few 'mainstream' Hispanics speak that way. I have
>heard
>> quite a few extremists speak that way however.
>
>What the hell does the National Council of La Raza stand for, fool? The
>national council of friendly assimilation? La Raza means THE RACE in
>Spanish. Do you think they mean the European race? The white race? If
>white people formed a political group called The National Council of
>The Race ... well?
>
>> > Give it a couple of years, then tell me which one of us was sick,
>> > repressed and in denial.
>>
>> I can diagnose which of us is in this state right now and I'm not very
>> qualified to do so.
>
>So if you're not qualified, maybe you should go see a shrink who is?
>
>> > I say 2008-2012. Some people think I'm too premature, most say
>around
>> > 2020 or later. I think they don't understand just how quickly these
>> > things happen. I've seen it and frankly I would not be surprised if
>it
>> > started tomorrow.
>>
>> Look, evidently we disagree on a great many things. Espcially human
>nature
>> and civil rights as they apply across all ethinicities. I don't think
>I will
>> change your mind, nor have I tried to. You will definitely not change
>my mind
>> on this matter either, so let's just leave it at that and save each
>other a
>> lot of energy.
>
>I'm not the one who is going to be in a work-study reeducation camp, so
>I consider that a reasonable offer. It's no sweat off my nose whether
>you understand or not.
>
>
>
>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>Share what you know. Learn what you don't.


[end quote]


Sam Schlansky

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Sep 24, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/24/99
to
phae...@yahoo.com (Damocles) wrote in
<37ec72af....@news.slnt1.on.wave.home.com>:

>Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed
>himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
>Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
>(single ">" parts are Cleve):

Who cares? I just want to play a good game.

Hell, I'd even buy Derek Smart's game IF it was any good... I don't give a shit
that he's quite possibly the biggest fucking prick in the entire universe-- I
just want to play a good game.

And Cleve isn't even CLOSE to Derek's level... not even in the same ballpark.

Sam

(snip a whole bunch of crap from cleve's post, basically saying that Mexico is a
shithole because the Mexicans made it that way)

--

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John Macvie

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Sep 24, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/24/99
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In article <8E4B5AC40vi...@208.11.224.91>, Sam Schlansky
<s...@deletethis.operation3d.com> writes
>phae...@yahoo.com (Damocles) wrote in

>
>Who cares? I just want to play a good game.
>
>Hell, I'd even buy Derek Smart's game IF it was any good... I don't give a shit
>that he's quite possibly the biggest fucking prick in the entire universe-- I
>just want to play a good game.
>
>Sam
>
>
I sense a "fuck you" post from DS heading your way :)

John

--
John Macvie
Dumfries, Scotland.
To reply by email remove "nospam"

PJL

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Sep 24, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/24/99
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Damocles wrote:
>
> Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed
> himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
> Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
> (single ">" parts are Cleve):
>

Was there ever any doubt? We all knew he was a nut, just never the
specific type.

--
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Remove $ to email
////////////////////

Marcus J. Maunula

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Sep 24, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/24/99
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Anyone seen the Simpsons episode where some nerd threatens to nuke
the city unless they stop showing TV? This Cleave guy reminds me of him. LOL

Btw Jagged Alliance 2 features Cleve too. (Cleve Barkmore). He offers a job
to invade Canada.

Wasn't this Grimoire game supposed to be out by now?

Marcus


Damocles <phae...@yahoo.com> skrev i
diskussionsgruppsmeddelandet:37ec72af....@news.slnt1.on.wave.home.com.
..
>
(snip)
>
>
> [end quote]
>

Werebat

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Sep 24, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/24/99
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Damocles wrote:
>
> Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed
> himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
> Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
> (single ">" parts are Cleve):
>
> [begin quote]

(Snip)

Please, oh please, tell me that this was an ACTUAL post that was not
edited in any way! Hee hee hee oh, boy this is gonna be FUN!!!

(Off to forge me headers)

- Ron ^*^


--

"Get your priorities straight, Debbie. Your spiritual growth through the
game is more important than some lousy loser's life."

- Ms. Frost, "Dark Dungeons"

Patrick Mcginley

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Sep 24, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/24/99
to
I seem to recall Damocles babbling somthing about:

: Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed


: himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
: Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
: (single ">" parts are Cleve):

Yeah - he should be forbidden from speaking his mind because his thoughts
aren't sanctioned by popular ideology. Remember kids: anyone who has an
opinion that mentions race that doesn't agree with liberal media is
automatically a racist, nazi, conservative, religious fanatic, or whatever
other group you are told to hate. But remember hate is bad - but not if
directed at people who think different than us.

For crying out loud, he is against large scale immigration - does that
make him evil or something? He took a courageous stance; any cowardly
nitwit can come on here and uphold the status quo. Get some nerve already.

Christ, at least make reference to where you stand - or tell me why he is
wrong. Use your brain and interpret what he said, and comment, or close
your eyes when he says something you don't like and brandish him as less
than human, based on your fear of looking at things from someone elses
perspective...

--
transport. motorways & tramlines. starting then stopping. taking off &
landing. the emptiest of feelings. disappointed people. clinging onto
bottles. when it comes it's so, so disappointing. let down and hanging
around. crushed like a bug in the ground. i7yci7cyi** Radiohead

Scott Shupe

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Sep 24, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/24/99
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Patrick Mcginley wrote:
>
> I seem to recall Damocles babbling somthing about:
>
> : Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed

> : himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
> : Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
> : (single ">" parts are Cleve):
>
> Yeah - he should be forbidden from speaking his mind because his thoughts
> aren't sanctioned by popular ideology. Remember kids: anyone who has an
> opinion that mentions race that doesn't agree with liberal media is
> automatically a racist, nazi, conservative, religious fanatic, or whatever
> other group you are told to hate. But remember hate is bad - but not if
> directed at people who think different than us.
>
> For crying out loud, he is against large scale immigration - does that
> make him evil or something? He took a courageous stance; any cowardly
> nitwit can come on here and uphold the status quo.

Uh, Cleve's been saying that third-world nations are
composed of ethnicities genetically inferior to whites. Being
a racist is hardly courageous.

Scott
sh...@ca.metsci.com


The T stands for Smooth

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Sep 24, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/24/99
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> : Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed

> : himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
> : Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
> : (single ">" parts are Cleve):
>
> Yeah - he should be forbidden from speaking his mind because his thoughts
> aren't sanctioned by popular ideology. Remember kids: anyone who has an
> opinion that mentions race that doesn't agree with liberal media is
> automatically a racist, nazi, conservative, religious fanatic, or whatever
> other group you are told to hate. But remember hate is bad - but not if
> directed at people who think different than us.

LOL - ain't that the truth. Simply because I'm a Christian conservative
upper middle class heterosexual white American male, I am automatically
racist, bigoted, close-minded, deluded, unintelligent, hateful, etc, etc,
etc. Gotta love it.

--
Smooth T's badder than the wicked witch
Got more rhymes than you can beat with a switch.

MJ DiBella

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Sep 24, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/24/99
to
Do you really think Grimoire will ever see the light of day? It seems to
me like Cleve's history shows an utter inability to get along with pretty
much anybody else. He's also posted some pretty offensive stuff about
women, but heck, I'll give him this...he's an equal opportunity asshole. He
doesn't like ANYONE very much, including (I suspect) himself.

I'd be astonished to see Grimoire ever get finished. He keeps firing the
artists, for one thing...or else they keep walking off the job because they
can't deal with him, which amounts to the same thing.

Sad, really, seeing anyone that consumed with hatred.

I dunno anything about Derek Smart, which means that even if he's a jerk he
at least stays off the newsgroups. Cleve, on the other hand, makes enough
postings here that his 'jerkness' shines like a lighthouse beacon,
broadcasting 'Stay AWAY! Stay AWAY!'.

MJ

Sam Schlansky wrote in message <8E4B5AC40vi...@208.11.224.91>...

>>Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed
>>himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
>>Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
>>(single ">" parts are Cleve):
>

>Who cares? I just want to play a good game.
>
>Hell, I'd even buy Derek Smart's game IF it was any good... I don't give a
shit
>that he's quite possibly the biggest fucking prick in the entire universe--
I
>just want to play a good game.
>

Marcus J. Maunula

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
Then you should know that national socialism is considered a socialist
ideology by
most of your conservative pals :)

Maybe there are socialist conservatives. I know there are conservative
socialists though.

Ah Fuck politics.

Marcus

The T stands for Smooth <smo...@NOSPAMFORMETHANKShome.com> skrev i
diskussionsgruppsmeddelandet:eXTG3.2127$3e2....@news.rdc1.tn.home.com...
>
> > : Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed


> > : himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
> > : Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
> > : (single ">" parts are Cleve):
> >

Damocles

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
On 24 Sep 1999 16:37:14 -0500, pat...@earth.execpc.com (Patrick
Mcginley) wrote:

>I seem to recall Damocles babbling somthing about:
>

>: Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed


>: himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
>: Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
>: (single ">" parts are Cleve):
>

>Yeah - he should be forbidden from speaking his mind because his thoughts
>aren't sanctioned by popular ideology. Remember kids: anyone who has an
>opinion that mentions race that doesn't agree with liberal media is
>automatically a racist, nazi, conservative, religious fanatic, or whatever
>other group you are told to hate. But remember hate is bad - but not if
>directed at people who think different than us.
>

Let's see: he said that Mexicans all have sub-normal IQs, that all the
great achievements of history were made by whites...in another post in
that same thread he talked about how black natives of Africa are
incapable of inventing anything beyond a stone age level. No racism
there.

Damocles

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
On 24 Sep 1999 16:37:14 -0500, pat...@earth.execpc.com (Patrick
Mcginley) wrote:

>I seem to recall Damocles babbling somthing about:
>

>: Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed


>: himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
>: Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
>: (single ">" parts are Cleve):
>

>Yeah - he should be forbidden from speaking his mind because his thoughts
>aren't sanctioned by popular ideology. Remember kids: anyone who has an
>opinion that mentions race that doesn't agree with liberal media is
>automatically a racist, nazi, conservative, religious fanatic, or whatever
>other group you are told to hate. But remember hate is bad - but not if
>directed at people who think different than us.
>

BTW, I would never forbid anyone from saying anything. I believe that
racists of all stripes should be free to say what they want. Of
course, what you really mean by that is that I should ignore it, which
I will not do.


Damocles

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
On Fri, 24 Sep 1999 23:37:46 GMT, "The T stands for Smooth"
<smo...@NOSPAMFORMETHANKShome.com> wrote:

>
>> : Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed


>> : himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
>> : Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
>> : (single ">" parts are Cleve):
>>

>> Yeah - he should be forbidden from speaking his mind because his thoughts
>> aren't sanctioned by popular ideology. Remember kids: anyone who has an
>> opinion that mentions race that doesn't agree with liberal media is
>> automatically a racist, nazi, conservative, religious fanatic, or whatever
>> other group you are told to hate. But remember hate is bad - but not if
>> directed at people who think different than us.
>

>LOL - ain't that the truth. Simply because I'm a Christian conservative
>upper middle class heterosexual white American male, I am automatically
>racist, bigoted, close-minded, deluded, unintelligent, hateful, etc, etc,
>etc. Gotta love it.

I'm a basically conservative upper middle class heterosexual white
Canadian male, and I think Blakemore is a punk. I don't want to
silence him or anyone else, but I will try and expose his views for
what they are. If he ever gets his game out, maybe some people will
remember what kind of person the developer is.


Patrick Mcginley

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
I seem to recall Damocles babbling somthing about:
: On 24 Sep 1999 16:37:14 -0500, pat...@earth.execpc.com (Patrick
: Mcginley) wrote:

: Let's see: he said that Mexicans all have sub-normal IQs, that all the


: great achievements of history were made by whites...in another post in
: that same thread he talked about how black natives of Africa are
: incapable of inventing anything beyond a stone age level. No racism
: there.

Stop for a second and think. Is what he says true, or is what is saying
hateful rhetoric? If he is lying, prove him wrong. If he is saying - that:

a: Mexicans have sub-normal IQ's - it can or cannot be quantified.
The book The Bell Curve approached this subject and was declared racist
based on the fact that if found a pattern that did not jive with PC
ideology. Is dismissing truth out of hand more or less ignorant than
claiming to be superior based on statistical findings? I don't know...

b: All great achievements in history - this is oppinion and cannot be
counted. But you could counter that the victors wrote the history
books, and I would counter that you can't argue with the internal
combustion engine or the Theory of Gravity. So many cultures didn't have a
writen language when it was all the rage in Iraq(?) 10,000 years ago.
What's up with that? Is it non PC to point this out?

c: Black natives in Africa are incapable of inventing - suggests a
predisposition to ignorance (actually does sound ignorant) On the
other hand, past history indicative of current state, they really didn't do
too much in their own countries to write home about. I really can't name
anything off the top of my head that was invented over there that
ammounted to much. However, I never took a class in African Studies, so
God only knows what was shaking over there.

When I think about it, even in the independant countries of Africa, what
the hell have they invented in the last 200 years? Yeah, I know, this
sounds bad. There was the first heart transplant in S. Africa, but that
doesn't exactly prove him wrong.

Notice he doesn't slam blacks in general, just the kind of crummy
warlike mentality that ruled Africa for it's entire recorded history, and
continues to this day.

I don't know, put me up against the wall, but when reading your post it
just appeared to me that your problem was not with the factuality of his
post, but that he had the audacity to approach forbidden subjects in an
agressive manner. He didn't stop to kow-tow to modern intellectual
sensibilities or subtility, and IMHO today that seems to be the ultimate
crime...

Patrick Mcginley

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
I seem to recall Damocles babbling somthing about:

: BTW, I would never forbid anyone from saying anything. I believe that


: racists of all stripes should be free to say what they want. Of
: course, what you really mean by that is that I should ignore it, which
: I will not do.

By branding him a racist, what exactly are you trying to accomplish then?
If this isn't a thinly veiled attempt to silence him by slandering his
name, what is your agenda?

Patrick Mcginley

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
I seem to recall Scott Shupe babbling somthing about:

: Uh, Cleve's been saying that third-world nations are


: composed of ethnicities genetically inferior to whites. Being
: a racist is hardly courageous.

No mention of genetics in his post. And posting BS doesn't take a lot of
courage either.

Gerry Quinn

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
In article <37EBFEC9...@ca.metsci.com>, Scott Shupe <sh...@ca.metsci.com> wrote:

>
> Uh, Cleve's been saying that third-world nations are
>composed of ethnicities genetically inferior to whites. Being
>a racist is hardly courageous.
>

In an rpg group, this is a truly ironic thread.

Perhaps he shouldn't have concentrated so much on the perceived INT
bonus for some races...

- Gerry Quinn

Damocles

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
On 25 Sep 1999 01:55:17 -0500, pat...@earth.execpc.com (Patrick
Mcginley) wrote:

>I seem to recall Damocles babbling somthing about:
>
>: BTW, I would never forbid anyone from saying anything. I believe that
>: racists of all stripes should be free to say what they want. Of
>: course, what you really mean by that is that I should ignore it, which
>: I will not do.
>
>By branding him a racist, what exactly are you trying to accomplish then?
>If this isn't a thinly veiled attempt to silence him by slandering his
>name, what is your agenda?

I don't know if you're being facetious or not, but how can a statement
that Mexicans have sub-normal IQs be anything other than racist? Yes,
as you said in another post it can't be quantified. I can say that
Anglo Saxons have subnormal IQs and you couldn't PROVE to me that I'm
wrong, but you could certainly say that I'm racist towards Anglo
Saxons.

He's not challenging some great intellectual truth. There are plenty
of real dissidents on all sides of the political spectrum who do that.
He's parroting the half-baked theories of 19th century social
Darwinists, propagating ideas that were discredited even before Hitler
was sitting in prison dictating Mein Kampf.


LOTcyclops

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
>For crying out loud, he is against large >scale immigration - does that
>make him evil or something? He took a >courageous stance; any cowardly
>nitwit can come on here and uphold the >status quo. Get some nerve already.

Is it his courage that made him run to another country? Remember, this is the
guy who in another thread told us his muscles are bigger than Arnold's - or was
that the incredible hulk? And that if seen in a shadow on a rooftop he'd be
mistaken for a, dragon was it?

+Five-Clawed Dragon UDIC Dr. Dungeon, In The Castle of The Mach Gryphon+
-----== The last word in shareware rpg's will soon be here! ==----
--== Ultizurk IV: Lord of the Cyclops ==--

CMB

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
In article <37ebef0e$0$77...@news.execpc.com>,

pat...@earth.execpc.com (Patrick Mcginley) wrote:
> I seem to recall Damocles babbling somthing about:
>
> : Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed

> : himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
> : Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
> : (single ">" parts are Cleve):
>
> Yeah - he should be forbidden from speaking his mind because his
thoughts
> aren't sanctioned by popular ideology. Remember kids: anyone who has
an
> opinion that mentions race that doesn't agree with liberal media is
> automatically a racist, nazi, conservative, religious fanatic, or
whatever
> other group you are told to hate. But remember hate is bad - but not
if
> directed at people who think different than us.
>
> For crying out loud, he is against large scale immigration - does that
> make him evil or something? He took a courageous stance; any cowardly
> nitwit can come on here and uphold the status quo. Get some nerve
already.
>
> Christ, at least make reference to where you stand - or tell me why
he is
> wrong. Use your brain and interpret what he said, and comment, or
close
> your eyes when he says something you don't like and brandish him as
less
> than human, based on your fear of looking at things from someone elses
> perspective...
>
> --

Here is what happened:

Clinton (gestures to Mexico):"People, our neighbours are in trouble.
Their nation is a hideously corrupt, barbaric wasteland of corruption,
drugs and violence."

American People: "That's terrible. How did that country get in such bad
shape?"

Clinton : "That's not important now. I think you'll agree we need to
allow them to take refuge in our country until Mexico settles down.
We're talking women and children here, these people need our help."

American People (including me): "We agree. We are more than willing to
allow some of them to come here as a safe haven from the hell-on-earth
they are stuck in. How many do you plan on letting in each year? 5000
people, 10,000? What the heck, let's not be cold hearted, why don't you
let in 20,000 mexicans a year?"

A clean shaven dignified man in a suit named Raoul walks across the
border. He looks like a hard working, conservative and law abiding man.
Nobody faults him merely because his skin is a shade darker than that
of a white. Clinton puts his arm around Raoul's shoulders.

Clinton : "As you can see, Mexicans are people just like us. They can
assimilate and take their place in the great melting pot alongside all
of us."

American People : "We've seen enough. By all means, let's start
allowing more Mexicans to enter our country, provided they are willing
to support themselves and not burden our welfare system. They are
welcome here, their race of no concern to us."

Clinton gives a weird evil smile. This is the moment he has been
working towards for fifty years ... since he lived underneath the roof
of the founding member of the communist party in Russia when he was a
Rhodes Scholar. He steps to one side and throws open wide the gates of
the southern border, which explodes immediately with thirty million
filthy, diseased, scabrous criminal monstrous horrors who enter the
United States wild-eyed with racial hatred and unrepentant resentment
of whites. They are armed to the teeth with weapons, carrying unreal
amounts of drugs and each one of them has the Marxist Manifesto tucked
into his shirt pocket. There is no orderly procession, no actual
control and no monitoring of these hordes. They simple enter en masse
like a living wave of molten death in a physical invasion that defies
the most impressive population shift of invaders since WWII.

It is the last thing the American people ever see. Ten years after
Clinton has left office, the entire nation is embroiled in coast-to-
coast Civil War fought along race lines with blacks against mexicans,
mexicans against whites and whites against blacks. Twenty years after
the fighting ends, the United States has ceased to exist, having been
divided into more than 60+ different independent nations of assorted
ethnic makeup. Europeans occupy a thin stretch of land along the
Canadian border and inside Canada, but lately even this piece of land
is under attack by neighboring states claiming that the higher standard
of living and economic strength of this majority white state is a form
of discrimination against the surrounding countries, which are by and
large socialist hellholes of varying degrees occupied by blacks and
mexicans who endure regular famine and epidemics.

In 2070 the overwhelming forces of sheer population superiority are
victorious and the last white man in North America is dragged in front
of a people's court and executed for "anti-revolutionary" sentiments.
By 2150 the place where the United States used to exist is simply an
overgrown wasteland of crawling ivy and weeds, where savages wrestle
over trinkets from the ruins and try to figure out what a rusting
computer terminal was once used for inside a collapsed building. There
is no civilization left, even the descendants of the Mexicans are
unable to maintain anything like a stable government without the vast
economic engines of the U.S. and their manufactured goods. At this
point along with Africa, most of the Earth's living space is inhabited
by people who expend themselves in endless tribal warfare generation
after generation without surcease.

E Pluribus Unum. Clinton claims the translation is "out of one, many."
Actually, the correct translation is "from many, one." But there is
nobody on Earth left who can speak Latin and this secret dies with the
rest of the Earth's hopes.


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

Before you buy.

Mark Asher

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
On Sat, 25 Sep 1999 16:31:44 GMT, CMB <cl...@ans.com.au> wrote:

>Here is what happened:
>
>Clinton (gestures to Mexico):"People, our neighbours are in trouble.
>Their nation is a hideously corrupt, barbaric wasteland of corruption,
>drugs and violence."

snip

>Clinton gives a weird evil smile. This is the moment he has been
>working towards for fifty years ... since he lived underneath the roof
>of the founding member of the communist party in Russia when he was a
>Rhodes Scholar. He steps to one side and throws open wide the gates of
>the southern border, which explodes immediately with thirty million
>filthy, diseased, scabrous criminal monstrous horrors who enter the
>United States wild-eyed with racial hatred and unrepentant resentment
>of whites. They are armed to the teeth with weapons, carrying unreal
>amounts of drugs and each one of them has the Marxist Manifesto tucked
>into his shirt pocket. There is no orderly procession, no actual
>control and no monitoring of these hordes. They simple enter en masse
>like a living wave of molten death in a physical invasion that defies
>the most impressive population shift of invaders since WWII.

Are these 30 million Mexicans armed with muskets firing baseball-sized
shot that is 10 times as powerful as any gun in the US? I'd better run
to Australia before I'm vaporized!

Actually, here are some real statistics that show that the number of
illegal aliens entering the US has been pretty constant over the last
decade under both Republican and Democratic presidents. This is from
the INS:

"The undocumented population grows at varying levels from year to
year, but the data available to make these estimates do not permit the
derivation of annual figures to measure year-to-year changes. However,
the similar levels of growth for the 1988-92 and 1992-96 periods,
281,000 and 275,000, respectively, suggest that the overall level of
growth has been fairly constant over the past decade. This also
indicates that the rate of growth of the undocumented resident
population has declined since 1988."

Gee, the growth has actually declined since the Reagan years? What a
commie that Reagan was, eh Cleve? He was the one throwing open the
doors I guess.

Yep, at 275,000 illegal aliens a year in a country of 250 million,
they'll be running the country any day now.

Interestingly, out of the estimated 5 million illegal aliens in the US
in 1996, about 120,000 came from Canada, a mostly white country.


Mark Asher

Damocles

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to
On Sat, 25 Sep 1999 18:39:21 GMT, ma...@cdmnet.com (Mark Asher) wrote:

>On Sat, 25 Sep 1999 16:31:44 GMT, CMB <cl...@ans.com.au> wrote:

>
>Actually, here are some real statistics that show that the number of
>illegal aliens entering the US has been pretty constant over the last
>decade under both Republican and Democratic presidents. This is from
>the INS:
>

<snip>

No no Mark, we can't have any REAL statistics here. This is all a
playground for Cleve's fantasy world of goblins and monsters, the
hordes of non-white men all running to sleep with his woman and buy
SirTech games.

It's interesting how his rants have progressed, though. Two years ago
it was mostly libertarianism and anti-communism. I even agreed with
some of it, and it was cleverly argued regardless. Now that Grimoire
continues to be delayed and is undoubtedly falling farther and farther
behind the curve technology - wise, he's sunk into the trap of
bitterness and resentment and become an all - out racist. Too bad...
he'll never be a recognized developer now, even if Grimoire is
successful. He'll always be that crazy guy posting the White Power
crap in the newsgroup.


The T stands for Smooth

unread,
Sep 25, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/25/99
to

Damocles <phae...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:37ed4509....@news.slnt1.on.wave.home.com...


> On Fri, 24 Sep 1999 23:37:46 GMT, "The T stands for Smooth"
> <smo...@NOSPAMFORMETHANKShome.com> wrote:
>
> >

> >> : Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed


> >> : himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
> >> : Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
> >> : (single ">" parts are Cleve):
> >>

> >> Yeah - he should be forbidden from speaking his mind because his
thoughts
> >> aren't sanctioned by popular ideology. Remember kids: anyone who has an
> >> opinion that mentions race that doesn't agree with liberal media is
> >> automatically a racist, nazi, conservative, religious fanatic, or
whatever
> >> other group you are told to hate. But remember hate is bad - but not if
> >> directed at people who think different than us.
> >

> >LOL - ain't that the truth. Simply because I'm a Christian conservative
> >upper middle class heterosexual white American male, I am automatically
> >racist, bigoted, close-minded, deluded, unintelligent, hateful, etc, etc,
> >etc. Gotta love it.
>
> I'm a basically conservative upper middle class heterosexual white
> Canadian male, and I think Blakemore is a punk. I don't want to
> silence him or anyone else, but I will try and expose his views for
> what they are. If he ever gets his game out, maybe some people will
> remember what kind of person the developer is.

That may very well be true - I have heard very little about this guy... just
wanted to vent :)

Lizard

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
phae...@yahoo.com (Damocles) wrote in
<37ed4509....@news.slnt1.on.wave.home.com>:

>I'm a basically conservative upper middle class heterosexual white
>Canadian male, and I think Blakemore is a punk. I don't want to
>silence him or anyone else, but I will try and expose his views for
>what they are. If he ever gets his game out, maybe some people will
>remember what kind of person the developer is.
>

You are saying, basically:"It doesn't matter if Cleve makes a good game or
a bad game. He has a personal ideology I disagree with, therefore, people
should not buy his game."

How does this differ from McCarthy era blacklisting of writers for their
Communist views? Remember, no one was ever arrested or jailed for being a
Communist...but they had their lives and careers destroyed, even if their
ideology didn't show through in their work.

(People *were* jailed for contempt of Congress or refusing to
testify[1]...not for being Communists per se. A subtle but legally
important difference.)

When you advocate boycotts based on political views, you are acting in a
McCarthyist fashion. If this doesn't bother you...fine. It bothers me.

[1]Even today, you can be jailed for not testifying. The Fifth Amendment
applies only to the accused, not to witnesses. I personally don't agree
with this, but it is the law, at least in the USA.

CMB

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
In article <37ed1480...@news.primary.net>,

ma...@cdmnet.com (Mark Asher) wrote:
> On Sat, 25 Sep 1999 16:31:44 GMT, CMB <cl...@ans.com.au> wrote:
>
> >Here is what happened:
> >
> >Clinton (gestures to Mexico):"People, our neighbours are in trouble.
> >Their nation is a hideously corrupt, barbaric wasteland of
corruption,
> >drugs and violence."
>
> snip

>
> >Clinton gives a weird evil smile. This is the moment he has been
> >working towards for fifty years ... since he lived underneath the
roof
> >of the founding member of the communist party in Russia when he was a
> >Rhodes Scholar. He steps to one side and throws open wide the gates
of
> >the southern border, which explodes immediately with thirty million
> >filthy, diseased, scabrous criminal monstrous horrors who enter the
> >United States wild-eyed with racial hatred and unrepentant resentment
> >of whites. They are armed to the teeth with weapons, carrying unreal
> >amounts of drugs and each one of them has the Marxist Manifesto
tucked
> >into his shirt pocket. There is no orderly procession, no actual
> >control and no monitoring of these hordes. They simple enter en masse
> >like a living wave of molten death in a physical invasion that defies
> >the most impressive population shift of invaders since WWII.
>
> Are these 30 million Mexicans armed with muskets firing baseball-sized
> shot that is 10 times as powerful as any gun in the US? I'd better run
> to Australia before I'm vaporized!
>
> Actually, here are some real statistics that show that the number of
> illegal aliens entering the US has been pretty constant over the last
> decade under both Republican and Democratic presidents. This is from
> the INS:
>
> "The undocumented population grows at varying levels from year to
> year, but the data available to make these estimates do not permit the
> derivation of annual figures to measure year-to-year changes. However,
> the similar levels of growth for the 1988-92 and 1992-96 periods,
> 281,000 and 275,000, respectively, suggest that the overall level of
> growth has been fairly constant over the past decade. This also
> indicates that the rate of growth of the undocumented resident
> population has declined since 1988."

HAHAHAHA!

The Bureau Chief of the INS last week in Congress recommended that his
own organization, the INS, be dissolved for colossal incompetency! He
basically admitted that the INS has NO IDEA WHATSOEVER how many illegal
aliens have entered the U.S. since 1992! NOBODY DOES for sure!

I use the thirty million figure so nobody can accuse me of
exaggerating! The real figure is probably around 60 million people,
perhaps half of those transient migrant workers who cross back and
forth at will unhampered by anybody!! This includes our recent
ambassador of Mexican good will, the trainline serial killer!

Remember, Asher, Mexican birth rates are EXPONENTIAL! They double every
generation! This is like the 29th day of that algae growth on the pond,
with a 30 day cycle to cover the pond! One generation and you'll be in
leg irons writing out essays on why capitalism doesn't work in an
Aztlan prison! Good luck.

Be SURE to drop me a line via email when the Marxist Front has your
house surrounded amidst huge rioting! I'll be sipping iced tea on my
porch in Australia.

> Gee, the growth has actually declined since the Reagan years? What a
> commie that Reagan was, eh Cleve? He was the one throwing open the
> doors I guess.

You will likely die with apologetics in your throat, a liberal to the
last. Be sure to tell the rioting mob, "I voted for Clinton! Arrega,
arrega! I love salsa, it's my favorite condiment!" when they come for
you. When they are hitting you in the head with porcelain comodes out
in the middle of the street, see if you can blurt out, "Of course there
is an adjustment period because of the cultural differences!" before
you succumb.

> Yep, at 275,000 illegal aliens a year in a country of 250 million,
> they'll be running the country any day now.

They'll never be running the country, but they will shortly be running
it down. The southwest U.S. is looking more like Mexico every day.
Crime, drugs, gang warfare, corruption, fraud, kickbacks and
catastrophic embezzlement from public office. El Cenizo recently
decided all public business will be conducted in Spanish from now on
and that assisting the INS is forbidden. Apparently the secession of
Aztlan has already begun.

> Interestingly, out of the estimated 5 million illegal aliens in the US
> in 1996, about 120,000 came from Canada, a mostly white country.
>
> Mark Asher

Boop Boop De Doop! Fling that liberal solipsism and doublethink, I love
it! Too bad you can't put that crap in a rifle cartridge and use it as
a bullet, cuz you're going to need 'em!

Werebat

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
CMB wrote:

(Snip bedtime story for paranoid folk)

> Clinton gives a weird evil smile. This is the moment he has been
> working towards for fifty years ... since he lived underneath the roof
> of the founding member of the communist party in Russia when he was a
> Rhodes Scholar. He steps to one side and throws open wide the gates of
> the southern border, which explodes immediately with thirty million
> filthy, diseased, scabrous criminal monstrous horrors who enter the
> United States wild-eyed with racial hatred and unrepentant resentment
> of whites. They are armed to the teeth with weapons, carrying unreal
> amounts of drugs and each one of them has the Marxist Manifesto tucked
> into his shirt pocket.

(Snip)

Heh. OK, Cleve. I teach ESL in Pawtucket, Rhode Island. Every year, I
see about 200 kids (with Block Scheduling) from about 50 different
nations. About 40% of these kids are from Colombia, and another 40% are
from Cape Verde. The rest are from all over -- Russia, Portugal, France,
Poland, Senegal, Liberia, Guinea, and Mexico, to name a few. And none of
them have EVER mentioned Marxism, not even the Russians. Not one of them
has ever been caught with a weapon, drugs, or anything else. Actually,
they're FAR more polite and willing to learn than 90% of the native-born
kids. I speak from experience, as I've taught both types of classes --
not from some fantasy dominant culture brainwashing.

Oh, OK, Pedro did throw an eraser out the window once. And Diana got
caught sending e-mail to her cousins back home when she wasn't supposed
to be in the computer lab. And I guess to be honest I have to admit
that Guillermo can be a real pain in the ass sometimes, mouthing off
in class left and right ever since his mother died.

RUN FOR YOUR LIVES, FELLOW WHITES!!! ;^)

Kindly show us where these gun-toting, Marxist Mexicans are hiding out,
Cleve, so that I can go see them for myself. When I walk into school,
what I tend to see are smiling, friendly kids, not knife-throwing
Whitey-haters.

Or is your rambling all just a delusional fantasy?

As someone who can work in a room filled with non-whites day after day
and not only be unafraid but actually look forward to going in to work
every morning, I honestly pity you. Your fear has overpowered you and
made you an easy tool of something sinister, indeed. Ah, but of course
you see things the other way 'round. Or, as I have asserted before, you
are just another Usenet troll. Well, so am I, so am I...

Heh.

> By 2150 the place where the United States used to exist is simply an
> overgrown wasteland of crawling ivy and weeds, where savages wrestle
> over trinkets from the ruins and try to figure out what a rusting
> computer terminal was once used for inside a collapsed building.

Cool! I haven't played Gamma World in quite a while!

> There
> is no civilization left, even the descendants of the Mexicans are
> unable to maintain anything like a stable government without the vast
> economic engines of the U.S. and their manufactured goods. At this
> point along with Africa, most of the Earth's living space is inhabited
> by people who expend themselves in endless tribal warfare generation
> after generation without surcease.

You really ought to write a book about this. It would sell -- really!
Though not for the same reasons you would hope...

Mark Asher

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
On Sun, 26 Sep 1999 05:10:34 GMT, CMB <cl...@ans.com.au> wrote:

>> Actually, here are some real statistics that show that the number of
>> illegal aliens entering the US has been pretty constant over the last
>> decade under both Republican and Democratic presidents. This is from
>> the INS:
>>
>> "The undocumented population grows at varying levels from year to
>> year, but the data available to make these estimates do not permit the
>> derivation of annual figures to measure year-to-year changes. However,
>> the similar levels of growth for the 1988-92 and 1992-96 periods,
>> 281,000 and 275,000, respectively, suggest that the overall level of
>> growth has been fairly constant over the past decade. This also
>> indicates that the rate of growth of the undocumented resident
>> population has declined since 1988."
>
>HAHAHAHA!
>
>The Bureau Chief of the INS last week in Congress recommended that his
>own organization, the INS, be dissolved for colossal incompetency! He
>basically admitted that the INS has NO IDEA WHATSOEVER how many illegal
>aliens have entered the U.S. since 1992! NOBODY DOES for sure!

Including you, I suppose? That doesn't seem to stop you from slinging
around outlandish figures, such as:

>I use the thirty million figure so nobody can accuse me of
>exaggerating! The real figure is probably around 60 million people,
>perhaps half of those transient migrant workers who cross back and
>forth at will unhampered by anybody!! This includes our recent
>ambassador of Mexican good will, the trainline serial killer!

60 million? About one quarter of the population of the US is comprised
of illegal aliens? Did the aliens tell you this? I don't mean the
illegal aliens -- I'm talking the space aliens that you obviously talk
to.

>Remember, Asher, Mexican birth rates are EXPONENTIAL! They double every
>generation! This is like the 29th day of that algae growth on the pond,
>with a 30 day cycle to cover the pond! One generation and you'll be in
>leg irons writing out essays on why capitalism doesn't work in an
>Aztlan prison! Good luck.

Wow, at the rate the population is growing, they'll be on boats
heading for Australia in no time! Forget the US -- the Mexicans will
conquer the world in the next 20 years!

Thank you so much for this advance warning. I'll round up the family
and head for one of those militia compounds tomorrow! It will be a
bonding experience anyway. My son and I will practice target shooting
at dummies made up to look like migrant farm workers armed with those
200 year old muskets that are so deadly!

>Be SURE to drop me a line via email when the Marxist Front has your
>house surrounded amidst huge rioting! I'll be sipping iced tea on my
>porch in Australia.

And Grimoire still won't be finished....

Mark Asher

CMB

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
In article <37ed4509....@news.slnt1.on.wave.home.com>,

phae...@yahoo.com (Damocles) wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Sep 1999 23:37:46 GMT, "The T stands for Smooth"
> <smo...@NOSPAMFORMETHANKShome.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >> : Cleve Blakemore has finally come out of the closet and revealed
> >> : himself as the Aryan Nation poster boy I always suspected he was.
> >> : Potential purchasers of Grimoire take note and read this post
> >> : (single ">" parts are Cleve):
> >>
> >> Yeah - he should be forbidden from speaking his mind because his
thoughts
> >> aren't sanctioned by popular ideology. Remember kids: anyone who
has an
> >> opinion that mentions race that doesn't agree with liberal media is
> >> automatically a racist, nazi, conservative, religious fanatic, or
whatever
> >> other group you are told to hate. But remember hate is bad - but
not if
> >> directed at people who think different than us.
> >
> >LOL - ain't that the truth. Simply because I'm a Christian
conservative

> >upper middle class heterosexual white American male, I am
automatically
> >racist, bigoted, close-minded, deluded, unintelligent, hateful, etc,
etc,
> >etc. Gotta love it.
>
> I'm a basically conservative upper middle class heterosexual white
> Canadian male, and I think Blakemore is a punk. I don't want to
> silence him or anyone else, but I will try and expose his views for
> what they are. If he ever gets his game out, maybe some people will
> remember what kind of person the developer is.
>
>

Oh, Blakemore is a "punk."

I think you've got all kinds of issues there, Damocles. In fact, you
seem to be in the throes of a homosexual panic or something similar
thereof.

Two years ago, I wrote a couple posts stating that the sexes were
biologically different and that this was why men dominated information
technology - and not "gender prejudice."

For two months, all sorts of carnival freaks were flaming this thread,
telling anybody who would listen I was the devil incarnate, the son of
the Anti-Christ, that I had led 2/3 of the angels in a revolt against
god, that I was a Nazi, that I was involved in the Kennedy
Assassination, that I may have been at Waco, that I was almost
certainly a woman-hating bigot out to enslave all women within the
chains of the wicked male patriarchy.

Now, I write a couple of posts about what everybody knows but nobody
talks about - that the races are biologically different. Here we go
again with the sideshow - old men with white beards are picketing me as
a demon in human form, the essence of all that is evil on Earth, a
witch in cohorts with his familiar, a Nazi (the old standby, never
fails) and of course an ignorant redneck out to destroy the fabric of
society.

You're rushing about in a shrill, almost frantic vein to tell all and
sundry that these ideas are evidence of demonic possession, are
undeserving of any serious consideration, I must be silenced, exposed,
crucified, burned at the stake. There's a goldmine here for a clinical
psychologist, but the object of fascination would be you and your
reaction, not my ideas ... which happen to be consistent, well
organized, derived from direct observation and independent of any
ulterior drive to reach a conclusion. I wish all the races were
biologically equal. Unfortunately, they aren't. As Benjamin Disraeli
pointed out "Those who fail to understand the effects of race on
civilization can never comprehend history," or Will Durant, the
greatest historian who ever lived, "To deny the central influence of
race on the development of cultures and history means to deny history
itself."

I can't help but think that you protest too much, and that like any
religious zealot it is the ones who harbor the greatest unvoiced doubts
about their theology that prove to be the most fervent and violent when
it comes to suppressing heresy.

I wasn't raised in a racist home. My parents were not racists and told
me racism was bad. Nobody ever used the "N" word in my home, I didn't
grow up around anybody who taught me the races were different. Mind
you, I never really understood if this meant that concluding races were
different was forbidden thought or that such ideas were without merit,
period, and therefore not subject to consideration. I didn't decide
that the races were different from reading something on the Internet, I
don't belong to a militia or organization of white supremacists and
nobody with a strong dominant charismatic personality programmed me to
think such things or infused me with such beliefs passively.

My ideas about race are derived from general reading in anthropology,
history and genetics. Chances are I'm about a million times better read
than many people with PhDs in the field, but given the state of public
universities that doesn't mean a hell of a lot. Most importantly of
all, my ideas about races are derived from one-to-one contact, eight
hours a day, face-to-face with hispanics and blacks for YEARS at a time
in the most intimate and personal conditions. I'm like the Jane Goodall
of this field, I've been behind the blind for ages watching with my own
eyes. I'm not like you - a neurotic whiteboy in a suburban fortress
raised a million miles from any black man or mexican other than those
I've seen on TV. (And even if you're not this kind of person, about 70%
of European Americans ARE. It's called white flight and it means to run
like hell whilst denying the reason you are running for.)

How dangerous is direct exposure to real racial differences? Well ...
WHY do you think they took COPS off the air? WHY do you think the
Supreme Court basically decided it would be illegal to film them in
their native habitat for broadcast?

I can't help but think these sorts of ideas. In terms of Occam's Razor
they are the ONLY ideas that fit all the facts. They also don't require
a lot of high pitched, whiney pseudo-apologetic tongue-in-cheek coyness
like Jared Diamond's. They just are there and frankly they are the only
ideas a sane, rational man can deduce given access to the information.

If you were as bright as I am, had read as much as I have, were as
unflinchingly honest as I am (with others but most of all myself) and
had been in life where I've been, you'd be ME, Damocles, as much as
that might pain you to admit. You'd simply be me.

Mexican immigration is going to destroy the United States, junior. I'd
put hard money on it even if I got colossal odds against it from the
bookie. We were just barely treading water with the black population
and managing to keep our nose above the surface with African Americans
as it was. They were posing an incredible drain on tax revenues,
resources, law enforcement, government and our basic freedoms by the
1970's without any worse news. Then Clinton threw a one ton anvil into
our arms while we were gasping in the pool when he decided NAFTA meant
no more border sovereignty ... and good night, Irene, that's all she
wrote.

I'm sorry. That's called real life. It can be hard and difficult.
Things happen that maybe we don't want to happen but reality doesn't
consult with us. All these differences were created many tens and even
hundreds of thousands of years ago and can't be outvoted by committees.
Man is not a pliant animal who can be engineered into anything we want
him to be with a headstart program. It's cruel and if you want to know
the truth I have never felt anything more consistently than an
overwhelming sense of pity towards Mexicans. They look with envy in
their eyes to the north, see a million things they desire and want them
for themselves ... things like flush toilets, clean drinking water,
electric power and decent homes. But they never comprehend that these
things they see in white civilizations are present not because of some
innate magical quality the soil of the U.S. contains that Mexico
doesn't - but rather that it is those evil gringos themselves that
contain this innate magic. You can't have all those things without the
gringos, the gringos are these things, they are expressions of their
internal qualities magnified by a million choices in the marketplace
every waking second of the day.

Maybe if we admitted 5000 a year we could absorb them and any damage
they might do would be minimized, especially if we were very selective
about who we let in. But 30 million people is almost the equivalent of
just taking Mexico and moving it whole to the United States.

The third world is not a geographic location. The third world is
carried inside the genes of third world people and there is nowhere
they can escape to that they will not bring the third world with them.
They are not separate from the third world - the third world is in
their bones, their muscles, their brain tissue and their blood. You
can't remove the gringos from the United States and leave the gringo
miracle of Western civilization behind any more than you can surgically
remove the "wetness" from water and leave the moisture behind.

Mexicans are certain that if only they are allowed to occupy the mystic
lands of the U.S. that the earth below has some sorcerous quality that
conjures up ATMs, clean streets, reasonably trustworthy public
officials and supermarkets with shelves fifteen feet high the size of a
football stadium. But they are like alcoholics who see a surburban
neighborhood of sober, prosperous people and convince themselves that
if only they could live in that house and work at that job and dress in
those clothes that they would cease to be an alcoholic.

In the last analysis, they'll still ...

1. Make impulsive, irrational choices with their money and resources

2. Have children in and out of wedlock from random sexual encounters
until they bankrupt themselves with the demands placed on them to
support these children

3. Respond with vicious, unprovoked violence at the most inopportune
times and often completely out of proportion to the events

4. Break public trust and siphon off any money given to them in public
offices for their own enrichment at the expense of the entire community.

5. Score consistently below the levels needed on tests of aptitude and
intelligence needed to operate competently in high-tech jobs or even
the service sector

6. Give themselves over to their most basic animal instincts even in
situations where it will result in them being arrested or injured to
satisfy passing impulses

7. Work towards short term gratification and fail to do long range
planning to maximize their returns from their exertions in the market

8. Always tend to believe the answer to social problems lies in giving
more authority to government and redistributing resources from those
who produce wealth to those who do not

9. Fail to show the attention to detail needed to maintain the complex
web of modern life like hydroelectric plants, water purification
systems, fire and earthquake safety standards, mass transport and the
entire delicate framework of technology that creates the miraculous
lifestyle we enjoy from ATM machines (they never work in Mexico) to
fast food (too much criminal unrest, market corruption and graft for
such businesses to operate for long South of the Border)

10. Always tend to solve problems by reasoning along group-based and
communal efforts and centralized solutions implemented by authority
figures (DOAs, Democrats on Arrival) rather than individual rights and
initiative which are the fundamental reasons that the U.S. is the 1st
world and they are the 3rd world. Without the Bill of Rights and a
population margin of people who understand why such rights are
important, America would be just another socialist dump.

11. Eventually overload the frail thin support struts of any society
and collapse back into their natural condition, barbarism and total
anarchy ... that's what their genes program them to do. As far as
Mexican DNA is concerned, it doesn't care if the cargo container is
starving, dodging bullets, on drugs or eating human flesh. As long as
the container vessel is pumping out babies at a high enough rate to
surpass the attrition rate from violence, hunger and disease, Mexican
DNA could care less what sort of hellhole is created by the overall
nature of the vessel. Mexican DNA doesn't see the need for any changes
because at the end of the day it IS surviving and it IS being
reproduced. Even if it turns its surroundings into hell on earth. If a
Mexican woman pops out ten children and nine die from deprivation or
war, Mexican DNA lights up a cigar and announces it is sitting pretty,
business as usual because it still has one child left to reproduce it
into another generation. Plus it thinks, "Hey, that's 9 weaklings I
didn't need anyway. The surviving kid will be even more violent, more
rapacious, will wear even bigger pantalones and drive an even bigger
Pontiac jacked up on shocks. Arrega, arrega!"

In short, wherever you move the Mexican people to ... you are moving
Mexico as well. It's painful, embarrassing, unsettling, disturbing ...
and true. The mexican people have a country - it's called Mexico. Why
don't they stay where they are and make that country into the 1st
world? Because it's hard? Hey, fugg, life is hard, how do you think
America got to be the 1st world? Government dictates and memorandums?
Big signs with regulations? Guys on committees adjusting interest rates?

I just can't understand how the Mexican people can be such
"hardworking, home proud, conservative and intelligent" people and
Mexico look the way it does and be what Mexico is. There is something
wrong here and you don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out
what it is. It sure as hell isn't two or three guys taking a few
kickbacks and maybe not following through on that city council plan to
add more filtering to the water supply. No way.

CMB

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
In article <37ecb821....@news.slnt1.on.wave.home.com>,
phae...@yahoo.com (Damocles) wrote:
> On 25 Sep 1999 01:55:17 -0500, pat...@earth.execpc.com (Patrick

> Mcginley) wrote:
>
> >I seem to recall Damocles babbling somthing about:
> >
> >: BTW, I would never forbid anyone from saying anything. I believe
that
> >: racists of all stripes should be free to say what they want. Of
> >: course, what you really mean by that is that I should ignore it,
which
> >: I will not do.
> >
> >By branding him a racist, what exactly are you trying to accomplish
then?
> >If this isn't a thinly veiled attempt to silence him by slandering
his
> >name, what is your agenda?
>
> I don't know if you're being facetious or not, but how can a statement
> that Mexicans have sub-normal IQs be anything other than racist? Yes,
> as you said in another post it can't be quantified. I can say that
> Anglo Saxons have subnormal IQs and you couldn't PROVE to me that I'm
> wrong, but you could certainly say that I'm racist towards Anglo
> Saxons.

Damocles, what PLANET are you inhabiting?

Hispanics don't just underscore whites on average by a substantial
margin on IQ tests like Stanford Binet or Wechsler Brenner, they
underscore whites on the Armed Forces Aptitude Test, SATs, their OWN in-
country College Admissions test and about a million other tests,
irregardless of their class, surroundings, upbringing or even
nutritional support. Even hispanics adopted into white families and
raised in white suburbia.

This is not to say that there are not hispanics who score the same as
whites, that there are not hispanics that score ABOVE AVERAGE or that
on occasion there are not hispanics that even score WAY ABOVE AVERAGE
in intelligence. (Although like blacks, very few hispanics ever score
in genius range as do sizable percentages of whites and asians, it
seems their curve distribution is similar but the curve itself peaks
earlier)

Wait - let me guess! These tests (including their own College
Admissions Test) are somehow SUBCONSCIOUSLY CULTURALLY "biased" against
them, right? All you'd need to do to prove this is design a test that
they can score higher on than whites. Nobody has ever produced such a
test - the fact nobody has ever tried makes you wonder if maybe it is
because most liberal apologists know instinctively no such test could
ever be created.

Okay, here is your coffin nail. How do you explain the fact that ASIANS
on average score higher by a SUBSTANTIAL margin over whites on all of
these tests above?!? Even ASIANS with poor english only recently
immigrated to AMERICA?!?

(By the way, even though on average whites score as much as 10-20
points lower on IQ tests than Asians, for some reason that nobody has
ever figured out people of Anglo-Saxon descent produce more genius than
any other race. Asians are in the average much brighter than whites but
produce fewer IQ scores in genius range ... this does keep with the
idea of them being of more uniform and reliable quality due to the
harsh arctic conditions they endured for much longer than whites.)

> He's not challenging some great intellectual truth. There are plenty
> of real dissidents on all sides of the political spectrum who do that.
> He's parroting the half-baked theories of 19th century social
> Darwinists, propagating ideas that were discredited even before Hitler
> was sitting in prison dictating Mein Kampf.
>

You sound like Stephen Gould, first making up a caricature of me to
which you attribute a lot of ideas that have nothing to do with me,
then demolishing this straw man to show that I am wrong. If you get a
chance, you should try to actually refute my ideas instead of ones you
dreamed up and assigned to me.

CMB

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
In article <37edb925...@news.primary.net>,

ma...@cdmnet.com (Mark Asher) wrote:
>
> Thank you so much for this advance warning. I'll round up the family
> and head for one of those militia compounds tomorrow! It will be a
> bonding experience anyway. My son and I will practice target shooting
> at dummies made up to look like migrant farm workers armed with those
> 200 year old muskets that are so deadly!

Before you leave, make sure you install Mad Max style grills over your
windshield and side windows. Check out this latest article about the
Mexican Highway system, it had me rolling with laughter :

<http://detnews.com/1999/nation/9909/25/09250081.htm>

Mexico 1999, Colorado 2006

Have fun, Mark. Remember to roll down the window and scream out "I love
salsa! It's my favorite condiment! Hey, what is that gigantic speargun
thing you're pointing at me?"

Lurking Grue

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
In article <7slb5d$m4c$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
CMB <cl...@ans.com.au> wrote:
<chop>

>
> Two years ago, I wrote a couple posts stating that the sexes were
> biologically different and that this was why men dominated information
> technology - and not "gender prejudice."
>
> For two months, all sorts of carnival freaks were flaming this thread,
> telling anybody who would listen I was the devil incarnate, the son of
> the Anti-Christ, that I had led 2/3 of the angels in a revolt against
> god, that I was a Nazi, that I was involved in the Kennedy
> Assassination, that I may have been at Waco, that I was almost
> certainly a woman-hating bigot out to enslave all women within the
> chains of the wicked male patriarchy.
<chop Cleve's long declaration of his own ignorance, including an
especially bizarre digression on COPS>

What a buffoon.

Are you reading this, Werebat? Remembered how I said that Cleve
inevitably tries to weasel out of his statements by claiming he said
something totally innocuous that others blew out of proportion? Here's
a prime example.

Here's what Blakemore actually said, on September 13, 1997. (September
does seem to be his month to shine!):

[begin quoted rant]

Sorry, but there is now overwhelming and reproducible physiological
evidence
that testosterone is directly responsible for almost every noble,
ambitious,
self-sacrificing, creative, honest, sexy, truthful, kind and tolerant
impulse
that human beings have. If a woman displays these traits to a degree
some
men do, you can bet she must have a deep voice and hair on her lip like
Ayn
Rand, because estrogen compels people to conform, reside in strict
hierarchies without complaining, submit to authority figures and
believe group
standards are superior to one's own as well as to be content with
whatever
situation one is in.

Testosterone compels a person to cut new trails, assert oneself and to
create
beautiful and singular things and if necessary to be a destroyer of old
value
systems. Estrogen compels one to make like a fly in a beam of sunlight
and
think happy and uninspired thoughts. This is the reason men tend to be
achievers and excel in science, philosophy and business ... not "the
evil male
patriarchy" as the misguided feminist asserts. If you set a group of
boys and
girls loose in a room with computers, the boys don't attack the
machines like
they are invading Poland because of "social conditioning."

You have to figure people like Ayn Rand and Nietszche must have
practically had pure testosterone in their bloodstream congealed as
thick as
butter.

Read the FBI reports on the early fighters for woman's suffrage. Notice
how
almost all of them had the same traits - deep voices and hair on their
lips? To
such a noticeable degree that FBI agents felt compelled to put it into
their
reports consistently? Think this is coincidental? Ever meet a highly
sexed
woman that did not tend to disparage all thinking in favor of
conformity?

This is also why androgenous women tend to be more interesting, kind,
thoughtful and better lovers. There is also a lot of evidence that
androgenous
people in general tend to be physically more robust and hardier, likely
because they have a good even blend of hormones in their system among
other things.

[end quoted rant]

Let the weaseling begin.

Llorkh Dragon

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
after reading this whole.... i dunno what the fuck to call it... thread...
i'm just left thinking....
OH MY FUCKING GOD THIS IS HILARIOUS!!!

and i can't believe you people are actually still arguing about this.

i'm not insulted by this cleve character's post in any way. i'm not white.
i just don't take offence to these things.
i think the word 'nigger' is funny. calling a white person nigger is
actually REALLY funny, and people look at you oddly. i think the word 'spic'
is funny. i think the word paki is funny. i'm of egyptian/pakistani
heritage. i don't live in either egypt nor pakistan. i just moved to canada
a year ago, and i was born in denmark, actually.
i don't give a flying fuck what people call me. people call me satanic,
evil, a nazi, a freak and whatever because of the music i listen to, my
beliefs and the way i dress... but you know what? I COULDN'T CARE LESS. same
with when people call me a 'paki' and call me 'coloured'. I just don't care.
if people would actually start to ignore things like these
racist/chauvenistic/anti-homosexual/anti-heterosexual/anti-religion/anti-rac
ist/anti-whatever posts and just let them go unanswered and die, the very
fuel that fires these people will ALSO die. they'll get bored of posting
their opinions and going so far as to actually doing research in an attempt
to prove their opinions are right.

i don't know who the hell cleve is, nor do i care. i've gathered that he's
making some sort of game called grimoire. whatever. for all i know (and
care) he's just an ignorant fuck that's too obsessed with his opinions to
actually do anything productive. And being productive means doing anything
from finishing the game he's making to starting a political activist party.
so to you cleve, i say:
finish your game and get a fucking master's degree in microbiology,
specialising in genetics. then write several books on your claims and win a
fucking nobel prize. start a few wars, eradicate the 'bad genes'. genocide,
yay! whatever. in the end, we all die.
oh, and TRY not to act like the US is the only fucking country that's
represented in this newsgroup. just because YOU happen to be american, it
doesn't mean that everyone else is too (with a minority of canadians).

so, to sum up this post of mine:
play some computer games. listen to music. go to school. go to work. eat
dinner. make love to your significant other. let your significant other make
love to you. if you don't HAVE a significant other, find one. live.
whatever. who gives a fuck. point made.

if you get my point and agree, you won't reply to this post; you'll just
ignore it, and hopefully ignore other posts that are completely off-topic
and/or obvious trolls to this and any other NG.

(if you don't get my point or agree, then go ahead and call me a hypocrite,
an idiot, ignorant, whatever... i don't care and i'm not going to reply).

-Nyarlathotep Llorkh Dragon

"Nougat!"
-Happy Noodle Boy

hey did anyone count how many times i said 'whatever' in this post? haha.

Werebat

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
CMB wrote:

= Mexicans are certain that if only they are allowed to occupy the mystic
= lands of the U.S. that the earth below has some sorcerous quality that
= conjures up ATMs, clean streets, reasonably trustworthy public
= officials and supermarkets with shelves fifteen feet high the size of a
= football stadium. But they are like alcoholics who see a surburban
= neighborhood of sober, prosperous people and convince themselves that
= if only they could live in that house and work at that job and dress in
= those clothes that they would cease to be an alcoholic.
=
= In the last analysis, they'll still ...
=
= 1. Make impulsive, irrational choices with their money and resources

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= 2. Have children in and out of wedlock from random sexual encounters
= until they bankrupt themselves with the demands placed on them to
= support these children

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= 3. Respond with vicious, unprovoked violence at the most inopportune
= times and often completely out of proportion to the events

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= 4. Break public trust and siphon off any money given to them in public
= offices for their own enrichment at the expense of the entire
=community.

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= 5. Score consistently below the levels needed on tests of aptitude and
= intelligence needed to operate competently in high-tech jobs or even
= the service sector

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= 6. Give themselves over to their most basic animal instincts even in
= situations where it will result in them being arrested or injured to
= satisfy passing impulses

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= 7. Work towards short term gratification and fail to do long range
= planning to maximize their returns from their exertions in the market

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= 8. Always tend to believe the answer to social problems lies in giving
= more authority to government and redistributing resources from those
= who produce wealth to those who do not

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= 9. Fail to show the attention to detail needed to maintain the complex
= web of modern life like hydroelectric plants, water purification
= systems, fire and earthquake safety standards, mass transport and the
= entire delicate framework of technology that creates the miraculous
= lifestyle we enjoy from ATM machines (they never work in Mexico) to
= fast food (too much criminal unrest, market corruption and graft for
= such businesses to operate for long South of the Border)

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= 10. Always tend to solve problems by reasoning along group-based and
= communal efforts and centralized solutions implemented by authority
= figures (DOAs, Democrats on Arrival) rather than individual rights and
= initiative which are the fundamental reasons that the U.S. is the 1st
= world and they are the 3rd world. Without the Bill of Rights and a
= population margin of people who understand why such rights are
= important, America would be just another socialist dump.

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= 11. Eventually overload the frail thin support struts of any society
= and collapse back into their natural condition, barbarism and total
= anarchy ... that's what their genes program them to do. As far as
= Mexican DNA is concerned, it doesn't care if the cargo container is
= starving, dodging bullets, on drugs or eating human flesh. As long as
= the container vessel is pumping out babies at a high enough rate to
= surpass the attrition rate from violence, hunger and disease, Mexican
= DNA could care less what sort of hellhole is created by the overall
= nature of the vessel. Mexican DNA doesn't see the need for any changes
= because at the end of the day it IS surviving and it IS being
= reproduced. Even if it turns its surroundings into hell on earth. If a
= Mexican woman pops out ten children and nine die from deprivation or
= war, Mexican DNA lights up a cigar and announces it is sitting pretty,
= business as usual because it still has one child left to reproduce it
= into another generation. Plus it thinks, "Hey, that's 9 weaklings I
= didn't need anyway. The surviving kid will be even more violent, more
= rapacious, will wear even bigger pantalones and drive an even bigger
= Pontiac jacked up on shocks. Arrega, arrega!"

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= In short, wherever you move the Mexican people to ... you are moving
= Mexico as well. It's painful, embarrassing, unsettling, disturbing ...
= and true.

Just like the Irish, eh, Cleve?

= The mexican people have a country - it's called Mexico. Why
= don't they stay where they are and make that country into the 1st
= world? Because it's hard? Hey, fugg, life is hard, how do you think
= America got to be the 1st world? Government dictates and memorandums?
= Big signs with regulations? Guys on committees adjusting interest
= rates?

I don't even have to begin wondering what you'd have been saying during
that old potato famine, Cleve...

= I just can't understand how the Mexican people can be such
= "hardworking, home proud, conservative and intelligent" people and
= Mexico look the way it does and be what Mexico is. There is something
= wrong here and you don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out
= what it is. It sure as hell isn't two or three guys taking a few
= kickbacks and maybe not following through on that city council plan to
= add more filtering to the water supply. No way.

Troll.

Werebat

unread,
Sep 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/26/99
to
Alan Brooks wrote:
>
> In article <7slb5d$m4c$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, cl...@ans.com.au shared with
> the group...

> > The mexican people have a country - it's called Mexico. Why
> > don't they stay where they are and make that country into the 1st
> > world? Because it's hard? Hey, fugg, life is hard, how do you think
> > America got to be the 1st world? Government dictates and memorandums?
> > Big signs with regulations? Guys on committees adjusting interest
> > rates?
>

> Which is probably exactly what the Native Americans might have said.
> "Those Europeans have a continent..."

Oh, goody, yes! Tell us about the Native Americans, Cleve! And then the
Jews!

I can hardly wait!

;^)

CMB

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to
In article <19990925080209...@ng-fn1.aol.com>,

lotcy...@aol.com (LOTcyclops) wrote:
> >For crying out loud, he is against large >scale immigration - does
that
> >make him evil or something? He took a >courageous stance; any
cowardly
> >nitwit can come on here and uphold the >status quo. Get some nerve
already.
>
> Is it his courage that made him run to another country? Remember,
this is the
> guy who in another thread told us his muscles are bigger than
Arnold's - or was
> that the incredible hulk? And that if seen in a shadow on a rooftop
he'd be
> mistaken for a, dragon was it?
>

What's your point? You think I should have stayed and fought for your
right to live in a peaceful homogenous intact nation-state? Listen to
the reaction an ex-patriot gets even MENTIONING or ADMITTING to this
problem. You're all SICK, SICK people. Your forefathers would be
stunned to watch you down on your knees blowing a bunch of hispanic
invaders intent on displacing you, it's disgusting. Americans have lost
touch with reality, they can't tell the difference between Mr. Roger's
Neighborhood and their own!!

I'm a libertarian. I believe people tend to get the kind of government
they deserve. I'm not going to try to force my fellow Americans who are
complete jackasses to try to do what I think is right. They don't have
the nerve to just assert themselves, shut the border down and declare a
moratorium on immigration. They're too weak, they can't do it. God
forbid some poor illegal should get an infected hangnail in the
process, they'd be in the streets flagellating themselves. Honestly,
fugg 'em ... I'd have dug a trench a mile deep from coast to coast in
Texas by now and filled it with pitch oil, but hey that's me, the
survivor. Americans can't do anything anymore, they are helpless.
They're just oozing with candy-colored liberal gibberish and bleeding
heart nauseous sentimentality. They'll probably help their invaders
cock the triggers of the guns to their heads when the time comes.

I love America, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. But you poor
fools blew it. You gave it away riding on a fuzzy vague cloud of
politically correct doublespeak. There is no greater sorrow than the
loss of one's native land. The canary died a long time ago, I
understand the demographic and political forces at work and there is no
point in my standing in front of a sheep stampede at the edge of a
precipice and giving my life to try to turn you gits away from the
abyss. I have family to look out for, I've got to think of them first.

I also have no desire to be a dictator or seize control of the country
and try to keep it from swallowing broken glass. You did it to
yourselves, you have to suck it down now. Anything that happens after
this is what you wanted, simple as that. Jefferson said that people end
up with the government they deserve and frankly it is the truth. This
is why Mexico is what it is ... it is what the lazy, shortsighted,
easily persuaded opportunist Mexicans made it into. Now the Mexicans
are going to bongo-bongo on your soil and you're just too chalk-and-
cheese to stop them. Your life force is too weak, you lack the
essentials needed like a backbone to survive.

Often I have thought that the average affluent white european is full
of self-hatred and guilt and secretly lusts after death and extinction.
Far be it from me to try to convince them otherwise. As many of them
have said, "I got sick of all that whitebread boring white European
culture, I think we should spice it up. I hate whites, I hate their
success, their cultural stability, their innocuous social fabric, their
sexual prudence, their trustworthiness, their discipline, their
levelheadedness, their brains and their bright, cheery optimism and
enthusiasm ... their 'whiteness.'"

You're going to get some spice now, you can bet on that. Never a dull
moment from here on in. Sierra Leone, look out, here we come. Bust out
the machetes and the sombreros, this party is just getting started.

DemonKing

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to
Well, I'm not going to wade into this one but if you look at the mere length
of CMBs essay in his first post above then it's no wonder Grimiore is
nowhere near completion if he has time to burn writing this crap.

Cheers,

DK

Christoph Nahr

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to
On Sun, 26 Sep 1999 15:46:03 GMT, CMB <cl...@ans.com.au> wrote:

>Before you leave, make sure you install Mad Max style grills over your
>windshield and side windows. Check out this latest article about the
>Mexican Highway system, it had me rolling with laughter :
>
><http://detnews.com/1999/nation/9909/25/09250081.htm>

Wow, I wouldn't have thought it was *that* bad already...

This is a Los Angeles Times article, reprinted in Detroit News, and it
says that regular trucks with any sort of goods -- consumer goods,
machine tools, raw materials, whatever -- have to be escorted by
private rent-a-cops on Mexican highways. Undefended trucks are
regularly hijacked and robbed by organised gangs who sell the goods on
the thriving black market economy.

The black market used to be protected by the police when it consisted
of small businesses selling food and other consumer goods, but
recently it has grown into a state of its own, encompassing whole
industries who have their goods stolen rather than buying them.
--
Chris Nahr (christo...@uumail.xxde, remove xx to reply by e-mail)
Please reply either on Usenet or by e-mail but not both!
Visit http://uuhome.de/christoph.nahr/ for Might & Magic information
and Star Chess, a strategy game with source code and AI documentation

Mars

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to
[snip some thoughts]

>
> c: Black natives in Africa are incapable of inventing - suggests a
> predisposition to ignorance (actually does sound ignorant) On the
> other hand, past history indicative of current state, they really didn't
do
> too much in their own countries to write home about. I really can't name
> anything off the top of my head that was invented over there that
> ammounted to much. However, I never took a class in African Studies, so
> God only knows what was shaking over there.
>
> When I think about it, even in the independant countries of Africa, what
> the hell have they invented in the last 200 years? Yeah, I know, this
> sounds bad. There was the first heart transplant in S. Africa, but that
> doesn't exactly prove him wrong.
>
> Notice he doesn't slam blacks in general, just the kind of crummy
> warlike mentality that ruled Africa for it's entire recorded history, and
> continues to this day.

Maybe it has something to do with european whitemen colonizing and
depopulating Africa for slavery ?
It may occur to you that today independant african countries are still
suffering from the consequences of this colonization. Today wars in Africa
might be related to how european colonists divided Africa into countries to
serve their interest and not taking in account the different ethnics in
place, don't you think ?
Anyway, how do you measure cultural advancement ? In terms of economics ? of
technological knowledge ? I'm also tempted to include moral consciousness
and respect and social solidarity, which you may admit is not what our white
all-powerful countries have and are demonstrating.

>
> I don't know, put me up against the wall, but when reading your post it
> just appeared to me that your problem was not with the factuality of his
> post, but that he had the audacity to approach forbidden subjects in an
> agressive manner. He didn't stop to kow-tow to modern intellectual
> sensibilities or subtility, and IMHO today that seems to be the ultimate
> crime...

Are you just defending freedom of speech (to your honor) or trying to
justify Cleve's non-sense ?

Yannis


Christoph Nahr

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to
On Fri, 24 Sep 1999 10:32:29 -0400, "MJ DiBella"
<md...@roch875.mc.xerox.com> wrote:

>Do you really think Grimoire will ever see the light of day? It seems to
>me like Cleve's history shows an utter inability to get along with pretty
>much anybody else. He's also posted some pretty offensive stuff about
>women, but heck, I'll give him this...he's an equal opportunity asshole. He
>doesn't like ANYONE very much, including (I suspect) himself.

He's recently started a designer diary on the Grimoire web site at
http://www.geocities.com/~frpg-grimoire/. Apparently he's now in the
progress of beating the game into shape so that beta testing can
finally start.

>I dunno anything about Derek Smart, which means that even if he's a jerk he
>at least stays off the newsgroups.

HA HA HA HO HO HO HU HU HU!

Try subscribing to csipg.space-sim or .strategy and look at the
subject of 95% of the posts you get...

LOTcyclops

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to
>They'll probably help their invaders
>cock the triggers of the guns to their >heads when the time comes.
Wouldn't it be more of a maybe, maybe not situation? For example, if you and
I were the ones coming into this country from another, and we came here seeking
an improvement in our lives and found it here, would we not then attempt to
keep it that way? Perhaps I am somewhat idealistic, but why would we wish to
destroy the very "promised land" we wanted to come to, once here?
Additionally, wouldn't cultural influence play a role? For example, I've seen
many kids of numerous ethnic backgrounds here in America nonetheless behave
like Americans. There is a peer-pressure factor involved wherein hopefully the
younger set might be influenced in a more positive fashion.
On a lighter note, don't take me too seriously about the little pun. I like
to joke around a lot. :) And frankly, the world could use a little more humor I
think.
I'm also keeping my fingers crossed that you can incorporate some of your
ideas and especially imagination into your game - I know we can both agree that
depth is crucial in an epic rpg. Sure, it takes tons of time, but experience
shows that the quality of such a project is often determined by the time put
into it.
Here's a quick toast, then, to Grimoire, hoping you can gain the manpower
needed to pull it off - I look forward to it.

Sam Schlansky

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to
cl...@ans.com.au (CMB) wrote in <7sng3b$2a7$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>:

>Your forefathers would be stunned to watch you down on your knees
>blowing a bunch of hispanic invaders intent on displacing you, it's
>disgusting.

OK. Now THAT was offensive.

Originally, I thought that you were just exaggerating a bit, building
up a personality for yourself, that kind of thing. I didn't think you'd
ever get to be worse than Derek Smart... but you know what? Derek is
just unsecure and scared of the truth of his failure, and he flames and
lies to cover that up.

I have some sympathy for Derek, especially when I watch him desperately
try to get back on the topic of his game and his false ego won't let
him. At least he's trying to be professional. His attempts have so far
been unsuccessful, but at least he's trying.

On the other hand, you're a genuine grade-A asshole. No excuses... I
can see why sir-tech fired you.

I thought you were just blowing smoke up our collective asses in this
thread, but you're really going too far. Effective arguments aren't
made of statements like the above.

And neither are computer games.

I want you to read the following sentence very carefully and THINK
about what it says. THINK about what could happen if you follow my
suggestion instead of suggesting that the USA is intent on fellating
hispanic invaders and defiling the vision of our nation. Not that
you're wrong-- this isn't about right or wrong-- but that the argument
isn't worth making due to the damage it'll do to you. Don't argue for
the sake of arguing, be an adult and think it over. Here it comes:

Get back to work.

Sam

--

/| Sam Schlansky <sam[at]operation3d[dot]com>
/| I speak for myself only unless noted otherwise.
/| PGP Key ID: 0x63A9D707
/| 3DNews.net: News With Perspective!
/| 3DHardware.net: Taking Your Machine To The Third Dimension!
/| Remove "deletethis" to email.

Werebat

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to
LOTcyclops wrote:
>
> For example, if you and
> I were the ones coming into this country from another, and we came here seeking
> an improvement in our lives and found it here, would we not then attempt to
> keep it that way? Perhaps I am somewhat idealistic, but why would we wish to
> destroy the very "promised land" we wanted to come to, once here?

Case in point -- Irish, Italian, etc. immigrants whose descendents rail
against immigration as loudly as the old Brits railed against them.

> Additionally, wouldn't cultural influence play a role? For example, I've seen
> many kids of numerous ethnic backgrounds here in America nonetheless behave
> like Americans. There is a peer-pressure factor involved wherein hopefully the
> younger set might be influenced in a more positive fashion.

I see this every day at work. It is frankly amazing how much newcomer
students change from their first semester to their second.

And the "Americanization" is not always a POSITIVE thing.

Knight37

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to

MJ DiBella <md...@roch875.mc.xerox.com> wrote

> I dunno anything about Derek Smart, which means that even if he's a jerk he
> at least stays off the newsgroups.

Now THAT is freakin' hilarious.

Knight37

Knight37

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to

Eric Liebl <eli...@ix.netcom.com> wrote

> Screw all this BS. Where is Grimoire?

Amen to that, brother. :)

Shut the fuck up and work on your game, Cleve. :)

Knight37


Gouge

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to

Eric Liebl <eli...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:7slgnp$1...@dfw-ixnews21.ix.netcom.com...

> Screw all this BS. Where is Grimoire?
>
> --
> ^ +~+~~
> "Fair winds and following seas." ^ )`.).
> )``)``) .~~
> -Eric ).-'.-')|)

It came out about 7 years ago......But back then it was called Wizardry
7.......

Gouge

Grimfarrow

unread,
Sep 27, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/27/99
to

CMB wrote:

> Historically, the world's worst slaver nation, never reformed, has
> always been South Africa itself. White countries forbid the practice of
> slavery more than a hundred and fifty years ago and liberated slaves
> all over the world. Do you recall the conclusion of Amstrad?

<snip>
Amstrad?
Didn't that come out at around the same time as the Commodore 64
and the Spectrum or something like that? Well, in that case, we all
know that the machine died out like a Dodo.

Grimfarrow


CMB

unread,
Sep 28, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/28/99
to
In article <7snc6v$l0t$1...@oceanite.cybercable.fr>,

"Mars" <ma...@REMOVETHATclub-internet.fr> wrote:
> > Notice he doesn't slam blacks in general, just the kind of crummy
> > warlike mentality that ruled Africa for it's entire recorded
history, and
> > continues to this day.
>
> Maybe it has something to do with european whitemen colonizing and
> depopulating Africa for slavery ?

How much more mileage do you think you can squeeze out of this stuff?

Historically, the world's worst slaver nation, never reformed, has
always been South Africa itself. White countries forbid the practice of
slavery more than a hundred and fifty years ago and liberated slaves

all over the world. Do you recall the conclusion of Amstrad? White guys
rescuing the world, as usual. It was white guys who act like Dudley
DoRight or comic book superheroes, while the rest of the world was
still buying slaves from the ever present market in Africa, it was the
Europeans who decided to crush slavery wherever they found it.

Haiti, Liberia and lots of black countries have been completely free of
white influence often for as long as 200 years and it would seem the
longer they are separated from European influence, the more barbaric
these countries have become.

> It may occur to you that today independant african countries are still
> suffering from the consequences of this colonization. Today wars in
Africa

Oh, yeah, you'll be getting this for the next 5000 years or so. 4000
years from now, liberal apologists will claim that Africa is still
"recovering" from the "trauma" of European influence (flush toilets and
clean drinking water)

> might be related to how european colonists divided Africa into
countries to
> serve their interest and not taking in account the different ethnics
in
> place, don't you think ?

No. But it goes over well in the right crowd. Sip cappuccino, click
lips together in shame and contrition at our evil oppressive culture
(ample food supply and medical care) and it's terrible effects on these
poor rascals (who had the highest standard of living for any black
nation on Earth right up until two years ago when evil apartheid was
dissolved. They now rank the lowest on all scales.)

> Anyway, how do you measure cultural advancement ? In terms of
economics ? of
> technological knowledge ? I'm also tempted to include moral
consciousness
> and respect and social solidarity, which you may admit is not what
our white
> all-powerful countries have and are demonstrating.

Oh, you found some injustice somewhere! I guess our entire culture must
be a complete failure, then! Somebody got a hangnail somewhere! Mea
culpa! Ai yai yai!

Whitey is superman! HE can do anything! If anybody in his domain is
suffering it is because he is not flying fast enough or using his heat
vision or superpowers effectively enough! Faster whitey, fly faster! We
need more malt liquor and Thunderbird down here, let's see some hustle
superman, you exploitative evil European patriarchial colonizer! Pick
me up a pack of cigarettes while you're on your way over here! Faster,
whitey! We need more of your tax revenues garnished by the non-
productive freeloading sector! You can handle the load, whitey, you can
do anything, everybody knows that! Whitey has no limits, he can create
wealth out of thin air! Despite being an evil colonizer imperialist
abusive exploiter!

> >
> > I don't know, put me up against the wall, but when reading your
post it
> > just appeared to me that your problem was not with the factuality
of his
> > post, but that he had the audacity to approach forbidden subjects
in an
> > agressive manner. He didn't stop to kow-tow to modern intellectual
> > sensibilities or subtility, and IMHO today that seems to be the
ultimate
> > crime...

Don't look now, the inquisitors are watching and you may incriminate
yourself into thought crime. This sort of chain criminalization was
common during the Inquisition. Sympathizers frequently found themselves
on the rack for "crimes" of their own soon after.

> Are you just defending freedom of speech (to your honor) or trying to
> justify Cleve's non-sense ?
>
> Yannis

Yeah, it's nonsense alright. Instead of incredibly contorted and
contrived irrational apologetics, I'm just applying Occam's Razor. But
we all know that black shortcomings are always the fault of Europeans.
If we vacate the planet and go to live in another solar system, we'd
better beware of radio contact with Earth or the remaining black
population will claim whitey is "oppressing us" via subtle audio cues
across lightyears of space by small racist messages implied in his
communications.

Bzzt ... Bzzztt ... whirrr ... "Earth? Are you there? This is whitey in
Andromeda!"

Black man screams out and falls to his knees, "He's implying we might
not be here because he's not here any longer! Oppressive patronizing
bastard! He's given me an inferiority complex! I've got to get some
kind of government grant!"

CMB

unread,
Sep 28, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/28/99
to
In article <PS3vN7BTHujouh...@4ax.com>,

christo...@uumail.xxde wrote:
> Wow, I wouldn't have thought it was *that* bad already...

That?!? That's nothing, that's just leisure time fun in Mexico. Most
Americans really have no idea what country they live next to, or what
sort of human beings live there. None.

<http://www.americanpatrol.com/TRAVEL/warninglabelmexico990927.htm>

Maybe if I find it I'll give you a link to a story about the child-
prostitution rings run by the Mexican police that also sell the
children on occasion to body-parts clinics for wealthy patrons to get a
new kidney or liver. California 2004.

> This is a Los Angeles Times article, reprinted in Detroit News, and it
> says that regular trucks with any sort of goods -- consumer goods,
> machine tools, raw materials, whatever -- have to be escorted by
> private rent-a-cops on Mexican highways. Undefended trucks are
> regularly hijacked and robbed by organised gangs who sell the goods on
> the thriving black market economy.

Arrega! Arrega! Pass the taco sauce, amigo!

> The black market used to be protected by the police when it consisted
> of small businesses selling food and other consumer goods, but
> recently it has grown into a state of its own, encompassing whole
> industries who have their goods stolen rather than buying them.

The roads of Arizona, Oklahoma and Texas will be like this within 5
years. You have my personal guarantee on it, be sure to check in for a
recap in a couple years when I make half the people on this thread eat
s**t from a spoon with sugar and cinnamon sprinkled on top. I don't
take any real pleasure in being an I-told-you-so, but they need their
noses rubbed in it when the time comes.

Of course, all this seems to insinuate that the 90% of the Mexican
population who are criminals of some sort are also the illegals who are
invading America ... and obviously that is not the case. These
criminals would much rather remain in Mexico and make $200 a day off of
crime rather than come to the United States and make $100,000 a day off
the same criminal lifestyle with all those plump fat rich affluent
suburban gringos to prey on (who will never know what hit them.)

William Blake

unread,
Sep 28, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/28/99
to

> I'm a basically conservative upper middle class heterosexual white
> Canadian male, and I think Blakemore is a punk. I don't want to
> silence him or anyone else, but I will try and expose his views for
> what they are. If he ever gets his game out, maybe some people will
> remember what kind of person the developer is.

First, I'd like to thank you for taking such a courageous stand. I can
sleep better knowing a self-appointed thought policeman is taking steps
to protect me from all the hobgoblins running around out there. It's
such a relief knowing I no longer have to read or interpret anything
for myself. Now I can spend more time shopping.

Second, I'm a little fuzzy on what being a "punk" has to do with
software development. Does this mean if I drove a safety pin through my
nose my coding skills would improve? Will my higher brain functions
deteriorate if I listen to a Rancid CD more than once? Does Jello
Biafra lead a secret double life as a Perl wizard? Care to explain?

--
What will do you when the label comes off
And the plastic's all melted
And the chrome is too soft?
-Frank Zappa, "Who Are the Brain Police?"

William Blake

unread,
Sep 28, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/28/99
to
In article <7sp76f$9ai$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,

CMB <cl...@ans.com.au> wrote:
>
> No. But it goes over well in the right crowd. Sip cappuccino, click
> lips together in shame and contrition at our evil oppressive culture
> (ample food supply and medical care) and it's terrible effects on
> these poor rascals (who had the highest standard of living for any
> black nation on Earth right up until two years ago when evil
> apartheid was dissolved. They now rank the lowest on all scales.)

Interesting...

From Africa News and the Daily Mail and Guardian:

http://www.mg.co.za/mg/za/news.html#zuma
http://www.africanews.org/women/stories/19990906_feat1.html
http://www.mg.co.za/mg/news/99sep1/8sep-rape.html
http://www.mg.co.za/mg/news/99aug1/9aug-rape1.html
http://www.mg.co.za/mg/news/99jul1/5jul-rape.html
http://www.mg.co.za/mg/news/99may1/10may-rape2.html

Older article, but informative:

http://www.mg.co.za/mg/news/97feb2/26feb-rape.html

Finally, an article from the Telegraph Online at www.telegraph.co.uk
which reports a doubling in crime, loss of wages, loss of jobs, etc.
I'm posting it because the site requires registration for access.

[BEGIN]

Whites fear race backlash after South African poll
By Christina Lamb in Johannesburg
Sunday 30 May 1999

WHEN Sydney Mufamadi, South Africa's safety and security minister,
moved into 13 Andrew Murray Street in one of Johannesburg's leafier
suburbs, the white residents were pleased with their first black
neighbour.

"We thought, 'That's nice,' " said Denise Martin at number 16,
believing that the minister's presence - plus a 24-hour police guard -
would protect them from the city's crime wave.

Two years later, 10 of the 30 houses in the street have been the target
of armed robbers. Residents have protested publicly that the government
is not doing enough to protect them in a land where a serious crime
takes place every 17 seconds. Mr Mufamadi has responded by denouncing
his complaining neighbours as "racist".

The exchange underlines the fact that race still clouds every issue as
South Africans head for the polls on Wednesday for their second fully
democratic general election.

Last week Mrs Martin and her husband, Don, became the street's latest
victims. Guests arriving for dinner were robbed at gunpoint by three
men as the electronic gate to the house opened. Mrs Martin, 53,
realised what was happening when she heard the barking of her two boxer
dogs, a breed chosen because some African men apparently believe that
their bite causes impotence.

"They don't bark like that at whites," she said. As she called a
private security firm, the thieves fled with her guests' watches,
wallets and mobile telephones. She said: "It's unbelievable that this
can happen three doors away from the police minister. Does the new
South Africa mean living behind barricades?"

While crime has soared in the post-apartheid era, other changes are
also apparent. At Johannesburg airport, where once the only black faces
were porters and cleaners, smiling black customs officials have
replaced stern-faced Afrikaners. The car park, which offers a window-
repair service for those vehicles broken into, contains the expensive
cars of numerous black executives.

However, sitting on Mrs Martin's patio - drinking tea served by a black
maid as black gardeners clip bushes and sprinkle the perfectly
manicured lawn - is like stepping back into the old world of apartheid.
Mrs Martin points out that there are now black pupils at her daughters'
private school, and insists that things have changed for the country's
4.5 million whites. She said: "One realises how suppressed blacks were.
The fact that they can do things they couldn't before gives one a sense
of contentment. But white people haven't exactly been given their
wealth on a platter - we've worked for it."

Since the landmark 1994 election, average white income has fallen in
real terms, while a small group of blacks has taken the opportunity of
government incentives and become rich. However, the vast majority of
South Africa's 31.5 million blacks remain poor. The only whites they
come into contact with are those whose homes they clean.

Even the sporting world remains segregated, with whites favouring
cricket and rugby and blacks sticking to soccer. Last week the
government set up a commission on netball, with the aim of making the
sport more representative.

Tim du Plessis, the associate editor of City Press, a black Sunday
newspaper in Johannesburg, is an Afrikaner who for the first time in
his life has a black boss. He insisted that he liked working in a
mainly black office, but admitted that he has never invited any of them
home or been to their houses. He said: "We have learnt to live with
each other but not to like each other."

With opinion polls predicting that the African National Congress will
surpass the 62.5 per cent support it received in 1994 and win a two-
thirds majority - enabling it to change the constitution - many whites
now fear a new kind of racism, with them as the victims.

The African National Congress leader Thabo Mbeki, 56, who is set to
become Nelson Mandela's successor as president, remains something of an
enigma. He is reputed to be autocratic. The dapper pipe-smoker has
effectively run the country for the past two years and has been
ruthless in dispatching rivals.

While a streak of authoritarianism may well be necessary to tackle a
crime rate that has doubled in four years, Mr Mbeki's talk of
an "African renaissance" worries the white community. Posters all over
Johannesburg give warning that "Mugabe has two-thirds". This suggests
that Mr Mbeki might become as dictatorial and anti-white as President
Robert Mugabe of neighbouring Zimbabwe.

South Africa's parliament has already passed an employment law ordering
companies with more than 50 workers to mirror the racial composition of
the country - 77 per cent black, 11 per cent white, nine per cent
coloured (mixed race) and three per cent Indian.

John Kane-Berman, chief executive of the privately funded Institute of
Race Relations, complained: "In 70 years of existence, as a liberal
institution during the worst years of apartheid, we were never
compelled to send anyone an ethnic breakdown of our staff." He
added: "The ANC assumes there is widespread racism in the private
sector, but that's not true. The problem is shortage of supply of
skilled black labour because of the skewed education system of the
past. It's not fair to make young white graduates pay for this legacy."

However, while whites can, and do, leave the country - last year was
the fifth in a row with net emigration - poor blacks have no such
option. Instead of the 2.5 million jobs promised by Mr Mandela in 1994,
about 100,000 have been lost, and 42 per cent of adult black males are
jobless.

The ANC has brought clean water supplies to 3 million people and
electricity to 2 million. But about 20 and 37 per cent of the
population, respectively, are still without these facilities. Free
medical care is now provided to pregnant women and children under six.
But of the million homes promised by the government, only about 250,000
have been built. As a result, a number of black voters are turning away
from the ANC and planning to vote for the largely white Democratic
Party which could well oust the National Party as the official
opposition.

One of the Democrats' most unlikely recruits lives in a squatter camp
at Orlando East, part of Soweto, near Johannesburg. Mongameli Maroqa,
34, is the grandson of Walter Sisulu, Mr Mandela's great friend and
mentor, who spent 25 years in jail with him. Mr Maroqa said he was
ashamed to let visitors into his shack, made of corrugated iron and
hoarding. He covered his face with his hands and showed me the one room
he shares with his pregnant wife and five children.

The only light is a candle, the only book a Bible and the only
decoration a yellow and white crocheted toilet-roll holder. On the
shelves, the only items, apart from a few pans, are a handful of
potatoes and onions, a packet of washing powder and a tube of
toothpaste. A curtain sections off a sleeping area.

"Look at how we live," said Mr Maroqa, who makes about £50 a month from
carpentry. "Where are the houses, water and electricity the ANC
promised? If you think I'm going to believe that Thabo Mbeki will
change my life - forget it."

Outside his home, Mr Mandela's face and the ANC logo have been painted
out on a banner boasting a "better life for all". Mr Mandela's moral
stature puts him beyond criticism for most South Africans, grateful
that the transition to black rule went so smoothly. This time around,
the elections have none of the tension of 1994 and no one is
stockpiling food and ammunition.

However, as one Western diplomat pointed out: "Mbeki will have to
deliver to blacks without realising the fears of whites if South Africa
is to continue on a peaceful path."

[END]

--
What will you do when the label comes off

Mark Asher

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Sep 28, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/28/99
to
On Tue, 28 Sep 1999 01:55:31 GMT, CMB <cl...@ans.com.au> wrote:

> But
>we all know that black shortcomings are always the fault of Europeans.

What are the shortcomings of individual blacks and what laws and
regulations should we apply to them?

Do we forbid interracial marriage?

Do we not allow blacks to attend MIT?

Do we not allow blacks to emigrate to the US?

Do we segregate our schools?

Do we sterilize welfare receipients who continue to have babies?

What do we do? How do we combat this race problem? We can't all run
like cowards to Australia. Most of us didn't have your cowardly
foresight. What do we do?

[I fully expect Cleve to either ignore this post or reply with
personal invective and igrnore the questions asked. That's his
classless style.]

Mark Asher

CMB

unread,
Sep 28, 1999, 3:00:00 AM9/28/99