Christianity and Gaming
Alvin
a Christian gaming review site:
http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
Everyone is poking fun at this website for their outrageous reviews.
I would like to hear from some people on these forums especially
Christian gamers as to your feelings about this website. I am a
Christian gamer myself, but I do not necessarily agree with most
reviews on the site. The crazy thing is that they bash like 90% or
more games with failing scores. Even top quality games like the
Serious Sam receive a F. The only game that I see that received an A
is Civ 3.
Frankly, I find gaming to be the least dangerous form of entertainment
as far as corrupting a Christian mind. The same parents and media
that outcry against gaming have no problems watching a PG-13 movie.
Movies and TV inject more realistic images into our minds that can
cement. Yet, everytime some kid shoots up a school or something,
video games are to blame. I am more likely to remember a movie scene
than a level in a game.
On the other hand, I think it is good to warn of material that may be
offensive to a believer in a game. Certainly a game like Diablo and
Undying would be games that I would avoid. However, you might as well
throw up your hands if you are looking for a game that is completely
non-violent, and even then you can claim that these games are immoral
as they could bring up feelings of frustration or anger by the
difficulty of the game. I did not even bother reading the review for
GTA. I am certain this game gets a F as well.
For the most part, it is just a matter of personal opinion. You could
claim that the majority of all forms of entertainment are of the
devil.
JDMac
"Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
Taken in part from their Black and White review:
"LANGUAGE
Once a character in the game says "Oh hell." Otherwise there is no
profanity."
LOL
JDMac
Vorlin
"Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
> There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> a Christian gaming review site:
>
> Frankly, I find gaming to be the least dangerous form of entertainment
> as far as corrupting a Christian mind. The same parents and media
> that outcry against gaming have no problems watching a PG-13 movie.
> Movies and TV inject more realistic images into our minds that can
> cement. Yet, everytime some kid shoots up a school or something,
> video games are to blame. I am more likely to remember a movie scene
> than a level in a game.
This really doesn't have to do with religion, it is just people trying to
control people. I find this particularly repulsive when done under the
guise of 'working for God'. So repulsive that I'm having a hard time making
a coherent post here because it makes me too upset to think clearly.
Christian Fundamentalists (most any fundamental religious group, really)
have a big problem with human nature. Since they don't subscribe to
evolutionary theory, they can only view human nature as flawed by sin.
Which means that most anything that deals with fufilling human nature
becomes sinful to them. They have to view most any media as sinful because
they view most any human activity as sinful. They should have given Civ3 an
'F' too, it promotes the wholesale slaughter of entire civilizations. In
fact, at their core these groups view happiness as sinful (this shows more
clearly in the early history of the United States, when people actually took
their religion seriously). What would -really- make them happy would be you
wearing sackcloth and ashes, rolling on the ground tearing at your skin as
you scream for forgiveness. And they'll be right there ready to judge
whether you should be forgiven.
Now, if you do subscribe to the theory of evolution (which, IMO, is in no
way anti-God at all, it just disagrees with the Bible which is a -human-
work) all this gets a lot clearer: our movies, games, books, and societies
are violent because we are violent animals. We are hunter/gatherers, and we
are omnivores, and this combination is truly rapacious. If we were
non-violent then violent amusements wouldn't appeal to us (where in fact the
more violent the amusement, in general, the more appealing it is to the
majority of people). IMO, if you can't achieve enlightenment, then violent
games are the next best thing. At least that way your most destructive
impulses are relieved in a way that doesn't hurt anyone. Pretending you
don't have these impulses isn't going to help, you might end up starting a
new fundamentalist group and telling everyone what to do...
I'm not a big fan of finding God through other people as intermediaries, and
that's what organized religion is: a group of people who have set
themselves up as being closer to God than you are. I have yet to meet
anyone from any organized religion, in any position in that religion, who
was in any way enlightened. And if you aren't enlightened, then you have no
business at all pretending that you are (which is what these fundamentalist
groups all do). That's like pretending to be a trail guide in a forest
where you've never been, you aren't just risking yourself but everyone who
follows you as well.
Don't let other people tell you what God demands of you, find out for
yourself. Because when other people tell you, they are probably only
relaying -their- demands and not God's.
<incoherent semi-rant mode off>
Tom Meyer
> a Christian gaming review site:
Noooo!! Why, WHY did you have to start a religion thread in our quiet little
newsgroups??
Ithaqua
> offensive to a believer in a game. Certainly a game like Diablo and
> Undying would be games that I would avoid.
I have to ask, why are Diablo and Undying ones to avoid but Serious Sam isn't?
I get that diablo=devil and Undying references the occult, but isn't SS
populated by gibbering nether monsters too?
> For the most part, it is just a matter of personal opinion. You could
> claim that the majority of all forms of entertainment are of the
> devil.
Or you could just wise up. There's an equal likelihood of there being a devil
as there is a family of invisible pink leprechauns living in your ass. Not
that we aren't all given to flights of fancy but c'mon, the devil is just so
ten centuries ago.
--
"I get good advice...from (Arthur Andersen)...over and above just sort of the
normal by-the-books auditing arrangement." -Dick Cheney, then chairman of
Halliburton, 1996
Pyrephox
>I have to ask, why are Diablo and Undying ones to avoid but Serious Sam
>isn't?
>I get that diablo=devil and Undying references the occult, but isn't SS
>populated by gibbering nether monsters too?
Hell, Black and White got an F *just* for the premise. The reviewer apparently
liked the graphics, didn't mention the gameplay (which I thought was the low
point---darn gestures), and really seemed to enjoy the animals.
Although, I wonder why he even bothered to review it...I mean, really, you
could tell just from the back of the box that it'd freak out the loonies.
Pyrephox
--
US East Honest Traders' Club: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/USEast_HTC/
"Oh, good. My dog's found the chainsaw."--Lilo
Cr@nkster
> a Christian gaming review site:
>
>
> http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
They're idiots.
John Beaderstadt
>
> You could
> claim that the majority of all forms of entertainment are of the
> devil.
To the innocent, all things are innocent; to the damned, all things are
damned.
--
Beady's Seventh Law of Social Harmonics: "Before you begin, pee."
The Astute Andrew
> a Christian gaming review site:
>
>
> http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
*looks at website*
*proceeds to gag*
Ugh. As a Catholic (a Christian by most standards*), I perfectly understand
committing an evil act is wrong. For that matter, I sincerely believe that
nearly everyone understands committing an atrocious act is morally wrong.
That said, this website takes the concept of "sin" to the extreme. It
implies killing a virtual monster, or even thinking about it, is wrong. I
don't particularly know if the person is "misguided but well intentioned" or
not; however, I believe this website is attempting to influence and control
the way people think. That is something I cannot stand.
I suppose the same people dislike books that are "evil." Like the LoTR
series, or anything in the fantasy genre.
--
The Astute Andrew
Just a kid seeking enlightenment
The Astute Andrew
"Vorlin" <vor...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:jH%%8.16683$Og3.4...@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com...
> Now, if you do subscribe to the theory of evolution (which, IMO, is in no
> way anti-God at all, it just disagrees with the Bible which is a -human-
> work)
Evolution disagrees with the Bible? If you interpret the book of Genesis
literally, sure. Of course, most of Genesis wasn't meant to be taken
literally.
<snip>
The Astute Andrew
"Pyrephox" <pyrep...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020725204805...@mb-cj.aol.com...
> Although, I wonder why he even bothered to review it...I mean, really, you
> could tell just from the back of the box that it'd freak out the loonies.
Their argument would be "as a warning." I would argue they review it for
the foul and vile purpose of religious indoctrination.
NightSky 421
news:jH%%8.16683$Og3.4...@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com...
>
> yourself. Because when other people tell you, they are probably only
> relaying -their- demands and not God's.
>
Very true, and gaming is not the only area of life where some people use
religion to tout their own personal agendas.
Boogie with Stu
| a Christian gaming review site:
|
|
| http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
|
|
<snip>
Not my cup of tea...I think I'll just find my reviews elsewhere.
--
Boogie with Stu, PhD.
Zavia Tiplady
> a Christian gaming review site:
>
>
> http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
>
>
This has to be my favourite quote, from the Medal of Honour Review.
"As in all violent games, killing people is seen as an acceptable action.
Even though, in this game, you are fighting Germans, nothing can
ever justify taking the life of another person."
I love the "even though" part. I think the reviewer has something against
Germans.
He makes it sound as if it is almost good to kill Germans but not quite.
LOL. What an Idiot.
Zavia.
Gladimir
Sam was definitely an 'F' rated game. The action was repetitive and
mundane, the graphics were just 'ok', there was not attempt at a storyline
hook of anykind, and they tried to pass off those little red squares as
gore... give me a break.
Max Payne on the other hand, was an 'A+' all the way! Great graphics,
excellent gameplay, it broke new ground with "Bullet Time", the perfect
reflective round droplets of blood and beatifully rendered sprays and splats
were masterful, and the story was hokey and disturbing at the same time. A
wonderful piece of work.
Although I didn't read enough of the site to determine if the following term
applies to the author(s), but the only thing that I find slightly more
annoying than religious zealots are secular zealots.
- gladimir
"Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
XxSATANxX
Play every game they rate and F and you'll be very pleased.
Like you I find little that concerns me and god while I'm
blowing away bad guys on my PC.
As for review sites like this that's why God gave you a brain
Regards,
Monkey Ghoti
This site is not a game review site at all. More like a content
censorship one. Telling you which games are playable and which arn't by
christians. It's all bullshit if you ask me. I'd like to see someone
hack the site so porn pop-ups go all off when you visit it.
M.
Brian H.
> a Christian gaming review site:
>
>
> http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
>
>
This shows a good example of the way how Christians would enjoy computer
games. Play it through (or possibly multiple times). Then bash it and pray
to God to forgive their sin.
I believe they would do the same when they abused girls & kids.
Go-ta Maga-nus
s hard to withdraw yourself from it. Half-life gets a score of 55% (F+)
Every other site: A problem with this type of brutal and self-serving world
is it's hard to withdraw yourself from it. Half-life gets a score of 95%
(A+)
"Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
Jason C.
"Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
Clogar
>
[snip]
>
> "LANGUAGE
> Once a character in the game says "Oh hell." Otherwise there is no
> profanity."
>
> LOL
Stop the crack and MJ - it has destroyed your sense of humor.
Remember, kids: Only take what you can handle.
Clogar
>
[snip]
> are damned.
The problem with threads dealing with religion is that it
brings out every dumb-ass that has taken a quarter of PHIL 101 and
failed it. If you're going to post these stupid little responses,
at least give us something decent and not this lame-ass, easily
disproven BS.
Bob Perez
"Vorlin" <vor...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:jH%%8.16683$Og3.4...@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com...
> I'm not a big fan of finding God through other people as intermediaries,
and
> that's what organized religion is: a group of people who have set
> themselves up as being closer to God than you are. I have yet to meet
> anyone from any organized religion, in any position in that religion, who
> was in any way enlightened. And if you aren't enlightened, then you have
no
> business at all pretending that you are (which is what these
fundamentalist
> groups all do). That's like pretending to be a trail guide in a forest
> where you've never been, you aren't just risking yourself but everyone who
> follows you as well.
>
> Don't let other people tell you what God demands of you, find out for
> yourself. Because when other people tell you, they are probably only
> relaying -their- demands and not God's.
Excellent post, very well put.
--
Bob Perez
"Men do not quit playing because they grow old; they grow old because they
quit playing."
- Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes
Gandalf Parker
news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com:
> There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> a Christian gaming review site:
I dont think I will bother to check out the site. But I wonder what they
might say of Europa Universalis. I considered EU to be too christian
history for my taste. Great training tool for catechism.
Gandalf Parker
aelyria
Natural in that most people are familiar with it. There are Crusaders,
churches, etc. I don't find fault with this but I wonder if it puts a
strain on Christian players.
smr
alvinst...@hotmail.com says...
> Certainly a game like Diablo and [...] would be games that I would avoid.
Um, the object of that game was to fucking KILL THE DEVIL. I would think
Christians would applaud that, nu?
smr
Alex Pavloff
solemnly uttered:
>Everyone is poking fun at this website for their outrageous reviews.
I love it!
"Clive Barker's Undying is, by far, the worst game I have ever played.
I can easily say that there are no redeeming qualities in this entire
game. It is a game that I am certain Satan would approve of."
Now THAT should go on the box!
--
Alex Pavloff - www.pavloff.net
Clogar
>
[snip]
> think Christians would applaud that, nu?
You need to play through to the end (either of Diablo I or
the expansion pack for Diablo II) - those games are really dark.
chy...@ludens.elte.hu
No offence, but I get the feeling you're not terribly
familiar with the Christian mindset.
Let me give you an example. If there was a game called
"Kill the Nazis", and it involved scenes (and FMV, too)
where Nazi soldiers tortured, raped, and killed Jews,
blacks, and other minorities, would your being able to
kill the Nazis in the game make it okay?
Or (assuming you're an American here), a game called
"Terrorist Hunt". Bin Laden is on the loose, and only
_you_ can stop him! The game would consist of 5 episodes.
At the end of each episode, a couple of America's national
treasures would get blasted to ashes. Beautiful FMV
sequences would be shown about corpses in the rubble,
family members crying, etc. The president would probably
get assassinated a couple of times, just for the dramatic
tension. But at the end, you'd finally get to kill Bin
Laden in an epic showdown, so this would make a great
patriotic American game, right?
Are you offended yet? If yes, good. You're probably
starting to understand what Diablo might mean to a
Christian.
[Disclaimer: I'm not a Christian. I was, once.]
Chyron
--
It is good to have an end to journey towards,
but it is the journey that matters in the end.
We are all travelers, whatever our position,
and as one traveler to another, I salute you.
Courageous
>Evolution disagrees with the Bible? If you interpret the book of Genesis
>literally, sure. Of course, most of Genesis wasn't meant to be taken
>literally.
--Signed, Andrew
Who professes first hand information of what the Creator _MEANT_.
LOL.
C//
spauldingae
"Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
> There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> a Christian gaming review site:
>
>
> http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
>
>
Reminds me of this, for movies:
spauldingae
"Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
> There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> a Christian gaming review site:
Soldier of Fortune Review:
Even so, prolonged playing of this game is not a good idea. These shooter
games primarily appeal to adolescent boys, looking for ways to take out
their frustrations from everyday life. And study after study has shown that
prolonged exposure to this level of violence and gore tends to spill out of
the game and into more aggressive behaviors in real life.
So what about the other 50 million people who play violent games and NEVER
break the law or go on killing sprees?
I think the problem is people who can't separate Fantasy from Reality, or
can't tell the difference between "Sprites" and "Real, Living breathing
people". These people also have much bigger problems then video games or
violent films.
Forlane
at all violence, language or nudity (on the contrary, he would like to
have men in thongs in Diablo 2!). The scariest thing to him is BLACK
MAGIC!
Just compare the score for Warcraft 3 (F, 54%) and Starcraft (C, 74%).
He actually praises Starcraft for "being mentally challenging"
although I perfectly remember that terran soldiers were splitting in
two when killed.
But whenever game has fantasy elements, it's dangerous for the
monk-reviewers. I didn't feel that War3 was much more violent than
Starcraft but of course, you have all the undead magic in War3 and
that is why it's harmful for true Christian fundamentalists.
"Human priests can heal people with some divine magic."
It's supposed to be a complaint. WTF is wrong about divine magic and
healing?
"And the night elves worship Mother Earth and the goddess. Mother
Earth is presented as a spirit that actually exists."
Blizzard developers must be actually praying for Mother Earth and have
little treants at work to worship.
I see such reviews much more dangerous to any sensible person than the
games. The reviews convince the reader that Christianity is the only
true religion and that you must hate and avoid "pagans". I found the
articles offensive toward non-Christians.
### To purists: English is my 2nd language, please don't be picky. ###
Go-ta Maga-nus
"Brian H." <bh1234...@nospam.please.ismart.net> wrote in message
news:ahqdrp$gle$1...@hfc.pacific.net.hk...
snip
Mike Noren
>Alvin wrote:
>>
>> You could
>> claim that the majority of all forms of entertainment are of the
>> devil.
>
>To the innocent, all things are innocent; to the damned, all things are
>damned.
What a beautiful sentence. Do you have a source for it? I'd like to
put it in my cookie-file.
Mike Noren
>> Now, if you do subscribe to the theory of evolution (which, IMO, is in no
>> way anti-God at all, it just disagrees with the Bible which is a -human-
>> work)
>
>Evolution disagrees with the Bible? If you interpret the book of Genesis
>literally, sure. Of course, most of Genesis wasn't meant to be taken
>literally.
That's the reasonable stance, yes. I'm sure you're aware that many
christian sects do not take that stance.
><snip>
Mike Noren
>There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
>a Christian gaming review site:
>
>
>http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
I have no real problem with this; presumably other fundamentalist
xians have use of a site like this to help them find games they, or
their children, can enjoy.
I personally think the ratings are wrong, but then again I do not
share the world-view of fundamentalist xians, and judge the games
based on other criteria, so that's OK.
If I have a problem with this site at all, it is the assumption that
everything in the world can, or should, be filtered through any
particular political or religious belief. Do we also need communist
gaming review sites, complaining about how workers are treated in
Warcraft? Hippie review sites affording smilies to the game with the
grooviest colors?
Perhaps we do.
As an atheist gamer I, personally, have little use of the site, but
I'm sure it fills a function.
F r e e
Congrats, Vorlin.
Religiousity is dead. Or at least it should be :-)
Enjoy: http://objectiveministries.tripod.com/creation.html
--
F r e e
"Mike Noren" <mike_no...@yahoo.co.uk> escribió en el mensaje
news:lov1kuk0jram9fna7...@4ax.com...
F r e e
--
F r e e
"Mike Noren" <mike_no...@yahoo.co.uk> escribió en el mensaje
news:ui02ku0744712va6o...@4ax.com...
Soomo
<REMOV...@pavloffTOEMAIL.net> wrotf:
Totally agree, they can always release the game with a Satan GOTY
edition.
Soomo
And the problem with religious threat is assholes like you coming out
to slam what appear to be a harmless little post.
snoob
right out of my mouth, fixed the spelling mistakes and then made them
coherent =)
Yes puns intended.....
"Vorlin" <vor...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:jH%%8.16683$Og3.4...@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com...
> <some snipping>
>
> "Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
> > There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> > a Christian gaming review site:
> >
> > Frankly, I find gaming to be the least dangerous form of entertainment
> > as far as corrupting a Christian mind. The same parents and media
> > that outcry against gaming have no problems watching a PG-13 movie.
> > Movies and TV inject more realistic images into our minds that can
> > cement. Yet, everytime some kid shoots up a school or something,
> > video games are to blame. I am more likely to remember a movie scene
> > than a level in a game.
>
> This really doesn't have to do with religion, it is just people trying to
> control people. I find this particularly repulsive when done under the
> guise of 'working for God'. So repulsive that I'm having a hard time
making
> a coherent post here because it makes me too upset to think clearly.
>
> Christian Fundamentalists (most any fundamental religious group, really)
> have a big problem with human nature. Since they don't subscribe to
> evolutionary theory, they can only view human nature as flawed by sin.
> Which means that most anything that deals with fufilling human nature
> becomes sinful to them. They have to view most any media as sinful
because
> they view most any human activity as sinful. They should have given Civ3
an
> 'F' too, it promotes the wholesale slaughter of entire civilizations. In
> fact, at their core these groups view happiness as sinful (this shows more
> clearly in the early history of the United States, when people actually
took
> their religion seriously). What would -really- make them happy would be
you
> wearing sackcloth and ashes, rolling on the ground tearing at your skin as
> you scream for forgiveness. And they'll be right there ready to judge
> whether you should be forgiven.
>
> Now, if you do subscribe to the theory of evolution (which, IMO, is in no
> way anti-God at all, it just disagrees with the Bible which is a -human-
> work) all this gets a lot clearer: our movies, games, books, and
societies
> are violent because we are violent animals. We are hunter/gatherers, and
we
> are omnivores, and this combination is truly rapacious. If we were
> non-violent then violent amusements wouldn't appeal to us (where in fact
the
> more violent the amusement, in general, the more appealing it is to the
> majority of people). IMO, if you can't achieve enlightenment, then
violent
> games are the next best thing. At least that way your most destructive
> impulses are relieved in a way that doesn't hurt anyone. Pretending you
> don't have these impulses isn't going to help, you might end up starting a
> new fundamentalist group and telling everyone what to do...
>
> I'm not a big fan of finding God through other people as intermediaries,
and
> that's what organized religion is: a group of people who have set
> themselves up as being closer to God than you are. I have yet to meet
> anyone from any organized religion, in any position in that religion, who
> was in any way enlightened. And if you aren't enlightened, then you have
no
> business at all pretending that you are (which is what these
fundamentalist
> groups all do). That's like pretending to be a trail guide in a forest
> where you've never been, you aren't just risking yourself but everyone who
> follows you as well.
>
> Don't let other people tell you what God demands of you, find out for
> yourself. Because when other people tell you, they are probably only
> relaying -their- demands and not God's.
>
> <incoherent semi-rant mode off>
>
>
>
Soomo
>
>This shows a good example of the way how Christians would enjoy computer
>games. Play it through (or possibly multiple times). Then bash it and pray
>to God to forgive their sin.
>
>I believe they would do the same when they abused girls & kids.
>
The more you think about it, the more the fundamentalist Christians
are looking more like the Talibans, especially those in the US. These
are the same people that wants everyone to pledge allegiance to God.
Frankly, I don't think god gives a hoot what games you play or if you
pledge Allegiance to him. Some people are just so insecure about
their religions.
One Punch Mickey
"Requiem:Avenging Angel". He's an angel who shoots (bad) people and
swears like a trooper. I sort of liked him as a result.
--
-
- Almost, sweet talk, caffeine ...
-
"JDMac" <nom...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:QH%%8.2159$Ib....@nwrddc03.gnilink.net...
>
> "Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
> > There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing
with
> > a Christian gaming review site:
> >
> >
> > http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
> >
> >
> > Everyone is poking fun at this website for their outrageous
reviews.
> > I would like to hear from some people on these forums especially
> > Christian gamers as to your feelings about this website. I am a
> > Christian gamer myself, but I do not necessarily agree with most
> > reviews on the site. The crazy thing is that they bash like 90%
or
> > more games with failing scores. Even top quality games like the
> > Serious Sam receive a F. The only game that I see that received an
A
> > is Civ 3.
> >
> >
> > Frankly, I find gaming to be the least dangerous form of
entertainment
> > as far as corrupting a Christian mind. The same parents and media
> > that outcry against gaming have no problems watching a PG-13
movie.
> > Movies and TV inject more realistic images into our minds that can
> > cement. Yet, everytime some kid shoots up a school or something,
> > video games are to blame. I am more likely to remember a movie
scene
> > than a level in a game.
> >
> >
> > On the other hand, I think it is good to warn of material that may
be
> > offensive to a believer in a game. Certainly a game like Diablo
and
> > Undying would be games that I would avoid. However, you might as
well
> > throw up your hands if you are looking for a game that is
completely
> > non-violent, and even then you can claim that these games are
immoral
> > as they could bring up feelings of frustration or anger by the
> > difficulty of the game. I did not even bother reading the review
for
> > GTA. I am certain this game gets a F as well.
> >
> >
> > For the most part, it is just a matter of personal opinion. You
could
> > claim that the majority of all forms of entertainment are of the
> > devil.
>
> Taken in part from their Black and White review:
>
> "LANGUAGE
> Once a character in the game says "Oh hell." Otherwise there is no
> profanity."
>
> LOL
>
>
> JDMac
>
>
>
Gouge
"Forlane" <forl...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:5aafc2f.02072...@posting.google.com...
> One point I noticed was that the scariest thing to the reviewer is not
> at all violence, language or nudity (on the contrary, he would like to
> have men in thongs in Diablo 2!). The scariest thing to him is BLACK
> MAGIC!
I know! Diablo 2 has the lowest rating I could find on the site. And it's
pretty much based on the copious amounts of black magic in the game. And
the fact that the player characters use this magic to do good. I was
surprised that it received a lower lower rating than GTA3. But no black
magic in GTA3. I would like too see how he would rate the fallout games.
Lotsa violence, lotsa profanity, and lotsa evil acts one can commit.
> Just compare the score for Warcraft 3 (F, 54%) and Starcraft (C, 74%).
> He actually praises Starcraft for "being mentally challenging"
> although I perfectly remember that terran soldiers were splitting in
> two when killed.
>
> But whenever game has fantasy elements, it's dangerous for the
> monk-reviewers. I didn't feel that War3 was much more violent than
> Starcraft but of course, you have all the undead magic in War3 and
> that is why it's harmful for true Christian fundamentalists.
>
> "Human priests can heal people with some divine magic."
>
> It's supposed to be a complaint. WTF is wrong about divine magic and
> healing?
>
> "And the night elves worship Mother Earth and the goddess. Mother
> Earth is presented as a spirit that actually exists."
>
> Blizzard developers must be actually praying for Mother Earth and have
> little treants at work to worship.
>
> I see such reviews much more dangerous to any sensible person than the
> games. The reviews convince the reader that Christianity is the only
> true religion and that you must hate and avoid "pagans". I found the
> articles offensive toward non-Christians.
I gotta completely disagree. The reviews arn't dangerous to anybody. They
are written words and someone's opinion. I'm not into cenorship, but by
reading the posts this has spawned, I'm guessing a lot of people in here
are. We are not the target audience for these reviews. These are for
christians who have similiar values to the reviewer. He makes it very clear
how he is judging the games. I don't really think any non christians are
gonna buy games base on these reviews, or very many christians for that
matter. As for being offensive to non christians, well, just about
everything is offensive to somebody. Generally, people don't sit around and
read large amounts of material they find offensive. So I really don't see a
reason for non christians to be read the website, if they find it offensive.
On a side note, I don't find it offensive at all, in fact, I find it quite
interesting.
Gouge
Gouge
<chy...@ludens.elte.hu> wrote in message news:smPReJXu$Kz+@ludens...
I think both of these games sound great! And I am American, but they do
sounds like fun concepts, of course these games would never be made. I can
see lotsa cries of moral outrage. And an obscene amount of political
correctness. But if they looked to be decent games, I'd play em.
> Are you offended yet? If yes, good. You're probably
> starting to understand what Diablo might mean to a
> Christian.
Maybe so. But did you actually reads the said reviews? This really isn't
the point the reviewer brings up. Most objections spring from satanic
imagery( ok this might be close to what you were talking about at least I
assume), and the big problem, players using and gaining occult powers. Oh
and the fact that zombies and skeletons don't wear any clothes(I'm serious
about this, read the reviews). Also, the fact that the game can be played
on line and people sometimes use profanity.
> [Disclaimer: I'm not a Christian. I was, once.]
>
> Chyron
Gouge
Gouge
"Alex Pavloff" <REMOV...@pavloffTOEMAIL.net> wrote in message
news:9sp1kucosh7p6tdkt...@4ax.com...
Hahahaha. Kinda makes me wanna try it out. My favorite line from the
review:
"there are some dead corpses in the game"
Dead corpses?
Gouge
Gouge
"Mike Noren" <mike_no...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:ui02ku0744712va6o...@4ax.com...
> Replying to alvinst...@hotmail.com (Alvin) :
>
> >There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> >a Christian gaming review site:
> >
> >
> >http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
>
>
> I have no real problem with this; presumably other fundamentalist
> xians have use of a site like this to help them find games they, or
> their children, can enjoy.
Exactly the way I felt. But it is oh so cool to bash Christains.
> I personally think the ratings are wrong, but then again I do not
> share the world-view of fundamentalist xians, and judge the games
> based on other criteria, so that's OK.
Right. He does clearly state how he rates the games, so based on his
criteria, I guess he's doing a good job. I do object to the fact that he
seems to mark Diablo down, cause the zombies and skeletons arn't wearing any
clothes. Not only that, in his review of undying, he notes the that there
are skeletons and "dead corpses"(his phrase), but doesn't seem to count that
as nudity. At least I assume, I haven't played undying, but corpses without
flesh, can only mean skeletons? So his reviews lose a few points for
inconsistancy.
> If I have a problem with this site at all, it is the assumption that
> everything in the world can, or should, be filtered through any
> particular political or religious belief. Do we also need communist
> gaming review sites, complaining about how workers are treated in
> Warcraft? Hippie review sites affording smilies to the game with the
> grooviest colors?
I have no problems with this idea. If there are hippies or communists who
want this kinda info, I'm sure someone will cater too their needs. Doesn't
bother me in the slightest. I don't have much use for this information, but
if others do, so be it.
> Perhaps we do.
>
> As an atheist gamer I, personally, have little use of the site, but
> I'm sure it fills a function.
Wow, an atheist who doesn't bash christian people! Amazing, most people I
know, who claim to be atheist love to bash other religions, especially
christianity.
Gouge
Lucian Wischik
>>damned.
>What a beautiful sentence. Do you have a source for it? I'd like to
>put it in my cookie-file.
The "Thousand Nights and One Night" (1001 arabian nights) had its biggest
English translation done by Richard Burton in the late 1800s. It was
critized for its explicitness, and he had to publish it privately. In
response to these critisms, the inside front page has something like
"To the pure, all things are pure"
but I bet it came from somewhere else. Burton was an amazingly colourful
person. He did espionnage in the "Great Game" in Afghanistan between the
British and Russian empires. He conducted extensive studies into the
"young boy brothels" of northwest india. He got in trouble and escaped,
eloping on the way with the mother superior of a convent. He became the
first westerner to make his way inside Mecca. He translated the Arabian
Nights and the Kama Sutra.
The Order of the Garter was founded when King Edward helped a lady whose
garter had fallen off. To rebuff the shocked onlookers, he said
"Honi soit qui mal y pense"
(Evil to him who thinks evil of it). Again, I bet this came from somewhere
before that.
--
Lucian Wischik, Queens' College, Cambridge CB3 9ET. www.wischik.com/lu
Lucian Wischik
>There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
>a Christian gaming review site:
>http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
I'm a catholic, but not a practising or believing one. I get fed up a lot
with all the death around me, and depictions of it, and violence. I think
there is too much, and due to our constant exposure to it we have become
desensitized, and I think that most of the responses in this thread
are examples of desensitization. There's another movie review site on
similar lines, www.capalert.com, which I like for the same reason.
(I still play violent games, and often enjoy the storytelling and gameplay
while disliking the violence and death, but sometimes it gets just too
much -- e.g. most FPS games with animated gore, and the "finishing moves"
of mortal combat).
I think there's something to be said in favour of the uncompromising
stance of the website: that not even great gameplay or poetic scenes can
justify a game's violence. I don't agree with this stance myself, but
someone needs to take it, and keep reminding us.
Forlane
"NUDITY/SEXUAL CONTENT
As could be expected, the skeletons, zombies and demons do not wear
any clothes, but I doubt that the best designer clothes would do
anything for their looks anyhow."
ROTFLMAO!!! haha lol
RogerM
>
> <some snipping>
> > a Christian gaming review site:
> >
> > as far as corrupting a Christian mind. The same parents and media
> > that outcry against gaming have no problems watching a PG-13 movie.
> > Movies and TV inject more realistic images into our minds that can
> > cement. Yet, everytime some kid shoots up a school or something,
> > video games are to blame. I am more likely to remember a movie scene
> > than a level in a game.
>
> control people. I find this particularly repulsive when done under the
> guise of 'working for God'. So repulsive that I'm having a hard time making
> a coherent post here because it makes me too upset to think clearly.
>
All organized religions are inherently fascist. One reason why I despise them on principle.
> Christian Fundamentalists (most any fundamental religious group, really)
> have a big problem with human nature. Since they don't subscribe to
> evolutionary theory, they can only view human nature as flawed by sin.
> Which means that most anything that deals with fufilling human nature
> becomes sinful to them. They have to view most any media as sinful because
> they view most any human activity as sinful. They should have given Civ3 an
> 'F' too, it promotes the wholesale slaughter of entire civilizations. In
> fact, at their core these groups view happiness as sinful (this shows more
> clearly in the early history of the United States, when people actually took
> their religion seriously).
The various religious groups fled Europe to escape persecution, only to end up persecuting each
other in the New World.
Very well put.
--
WARNING: The above message likely contains one or more generalizations.
Please do not attempt to disprove them with isolated exceptions.
My other .sig file is a Mercedes.
"See if you can get it to run. It sure is worth 99 cents!" - X-Com Apocalypse ad blurb
"Computers don't make errors. What they do, they do on purpose." - Dale Gribble
"From now on, whenever people get wood, they'll think of Trojans" - Ned Flanders
"Stupid everything!" - Rocko, 'Undergrads'
Mike Noren
>"there are some dead corpses in the game"
>
>Dead corpses?
They're in the hollow tubes, right next to the round spheres...
>Gouge
RogerM
>
> There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> a Christian gaming review site:
>
>
> Everyone is poking fun at this website for their outrageous reviews.
> Christian gamers as to your feelings about this website. I am a
> Christian gamer myself, but I do not necessarily agree with most
> reviews on the site. The crazy thing is that they bash like 90% or
> more games with failing scores. Even top quality games like the
> Serious Sam receive a F. The only game that I see that received an A
> is Civ 3.
>
> as far as corrupting a Christian mind. The same parents and media
> that outcry against gaming have no problems watching a PG-13 movie.
> Movies and TV inject more realistic images into our minds that can
> cement. Yet, everytime some kid shoots up a school or something,
> video games are to blame. I am more likely to remember a movie scene
> than a level in a game.
>
> Undying would be games that I would avoid.
Diablo? Why? You FIGHT evil in Diablo (the original, anyway. I haven't played D2).
> However, you might as well
> throw up your hands if you are looking for a game that is completely
> non-violent, and even then you can claim that these games are immoral
> as they could bring up feelings of frustration or anger by the
> difficulty of the game. I did not even bother reading the review for
> GTA. I am certain this game gets a F as well.
Well, I am not a fan of the GTA series, since they glamourize criminal behaviour. (I don't
watch 'The Sopranos' either). I wouldn't play a game that casts you in the role of a drug
pusher, either. I want to play a hero in a game, not scum.
RogerM
>
> "Vorlin" <vor...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> news:jH%%8.16683$Og3.4...@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com...
>
> > way anti-God at all, it just disagrees with the Bible which is a -human-
> > work)
>
> literally, sure. Of course, most of Genesis wasn't meant to be taken
> literally.
>
Just the fact that people were tortured and murdered for saying that sort of thing, is
chilling.
RogerM
>
> Well this is the ultimate troll post but hey I'll stick my 2 cents in.
>
>
>
> Play every game they rate and F and you'll be very pleased.
> Like you I find little that concerns me and god while I'm
> blowing away bad guys on my PC.
>
> As for review sites like this that's why God gave you a brain
>
> Regards,
God didn't give us brains, evolution did.
F r e e
at Burton :-)
Iphigenie
comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic when one foggy november evening
"Gouge" <deep...@yahoo.com> came into my office and told me:
> Hahahaha. Kinda makes me wanna try it out. My favorite line
> from the review:
>
> "there are some dead corpses in the game"
>
> Dead corpses?
Hey games seem to have a lot of non-dead corpses too, of the kind
that tries to kill you...
it could just make sense...
--
Iphigenie
RogerM
>
> Around 25 Jul 2002 15:59:25 -0700, alvinst...@hotmail.com (Alvin)
> solemnly uttered:
>
>
>
> "Clive Barker's Undying is, by far, the worst game I have ever played.
> I can easily say that there are no redeeming qualities in this entire
> game. It is a game that I am certain Satan would approve of."
>
> Now THAT should go on the box!
>
> Alex Pavloff - www.pavloff.net
Except that the Devil runs XP (of course) and it won't run that game properly.
RogerM
>
> One point I noticed was that the scariest thing to the reviewer is not
> at all violence, language or nudity (on the contrary, he would like to
> have men in thongs in Diablo 2!). The scariest thing to him is BLACK
> MAGIC!
>
> He actually praises Starcraft for "being mentally challenging"
> although I perfectly remember that terran soldiers were splitting in
> two when killed.
>
> But whenever game has fantasy elements, it's dangerous for the
> monk-reviewers. I didn't feel that War3 was much more violent than
> Starcraft but of course, you have all the undead magic in War3 and
> that is why it's harmful for true Christian fundamentalists.
>
> "Human priests can heal people with some divine magic."
>
I guess Jesus was evil, then.
> It's supposed to be a complaint. WTF is wrong about divine magic and
> healing?
>
> "And the night elves worship Mother Earth and the goddess. Mother
> Earth is presented as a spirit that actually exists."
>
What Christians really hate is competition.
> Blizzard developers must be actually praying for Mother Earth and have
> little treants at work to worship.
>
> I see such reviews much more dangerous to any sensible person than the
> games. The reviews convince the reader that Christianity is the only
> true religion and that you must hate and avoid "pagans". I found the
> articles offensive toward non-Christians.
>
--
RogerM
>
> Replying to alvinst...@hotmail.com (Alvin) :
>
> >There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> >a Christian gaming review site:
> >
> >
> >http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
>
> I have no real problem with this; presumably other fundamentalist
> xians have use of a site like this to help them find games they, or
> their children, can enjoy.
>
> I personally think the ratings are wrong, but then again I do not
> share the world-view of fundamentalist xians, and judge the games
> based on other criteria, so that's OK.
>
> If I have a problem with this site at all, it is the assumption that
> everything in the world can, or should, be filtered through any
> particular political or religious belief. Do we also need communist
> gaming review sites, complaining about how workers are treated in
> Warcraft? Hippie review sites affording smilies to the game with the
> grooviest colors?
>
Speaking as an environmentalist, it always bothered me to watch those Peons cut down all those
trees and leave the world so barren. Seriously.
RogerM
LOL. There're a few square cubes in there too.
Werner Arend
RogerM wrote:
> Mike Noren wrote:
>
>>Replying to alvinst...@hotmail.com (Alvin) :
>>
>>
>>>There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
>>>a Christian gaming review site:
>>>
>>>
>>>http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
>>>
>>I have no real problem with this; presumably other fundamentalist
>>xians have use of a site like this to help them find games they, or
>>their children, can enjoy.
>>
>>I personally think the ratings are wrong, but then again I do not
>>share the world-view of fundamentalist xians, and judge the games
>>based on other criteria, so that's OK.
>>
>>If I have a problem with this site at all, it is the assumption that
>>everything in the world can, or should, be filtered through any
>>particular political or religious belief. Do we also need communist
>>gaming review sites, complaining about how workers are treated in
>>Warcraft? Hippie review sites affording smilies to the game with the
>>grooviest colors?
>>
>>
>
> Speaking as an environmentalist, it always bothered me to watch those Peons cut down all those
> trees and leave the world so barren. Seriously.
The same for me. But even so, I won't go and put "Avoid This Game" in
capital letters on my website. I have read hundreds of good books and
played dozens of good games where I didn't agree with some premise or
other - and enjoyed the books and games anyway.
Werner
Iphigenie
>> On the other hand, I think it is good to warn of material that
>> may be offensive to a believer in a game. Certainly a game like
>> Diablo and Undying would be games that I would avoid.
>
> Diablo? Why? You FIGHT evil in Diablo (the original, anyway. I
> haven't played D2).
AH, you fail to understand something.
You fight evil but it's a world of magic and sorcery. White magic is
not any more accepted than black magic, as a matter of fact it's
probably considered worse as it could lure well meaning people...
something like that.
There's a whole set of people that think that seing something in a
work of fiction will somehow influence their children to believe in
the thing in real life. Which is why christians were so opposed to
Harry Potter.
I don't know why, my christian friends have the most grounded and
stable children. Children who can read a book, enjoy the story, and
not be "corrupted" by it to start playing wizard... Children who
could probably by mistake watch or read something truly horrendous
and not be scarred by it for more than 2 minutes...
Obviously the more fundamentalist christians must not give their kids
that kind of grounding. or something.
--
Iphigenie
RogerM
They long for the Garden. So do I, but not at the price of ignorance.
Gouge
"Lucian Wischik" <ljw...@cus.cam.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:ahr6bm$iji$1...@pegasus.csx.cam.ac.uk...
> Alvin <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> >a Christian gaming review site:
> >http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
>
> I'm a catholic, but not a practising or believing one.
Maybe a silly question, and kind of off topic, but can I ask why you
consider yourself a catholic, if you you don't practice or believe as such?
> I get fed up a lot
> with all the death around me, and depictions of it, and violence.
I have similiar feelings, kinda. I get a bit squemish with very graphic
depictions of violence in movies. Not all violence, usually just very
graphic things, that feature copious amounts of blood. Or really anything
with a lot of gore. Gaping wounds, decapitations, etc. Especially long and
or close up shots of such things. This is true for whether or not the
victim is human or some other animal. On the other hand, I have no problem
with melting vampires, monsters that bleed green ichor, etc. I also don't
have a problem with people getting shot in movies, at least the way most
movies handle it. If it's extremely bloody, and we have to see a close up
of the wound, I have a problem. Not that I morally object too such
depictions of violence, I just can't stomach it.
On the other hand, I haven't played a video game that gives me the same type
of reaction. Not sure why, there are some pretty graphic games out there.
Just can't put my finger on it.
> I think
> there is too much, and due to our constant exposure to it we have become
> desensitized, and I think that most of the responses in this thread
> are examples of desensitization. There's another movie review site on
> similar lines, www.capalert.com, which I like for the same reason.
I'm not so worried about desensitization. It's possible that this indeed
does happen, but again, not especially concerned with it. And I don't
choose my movies on the amount of blood involved, though the kind of
violence I'm talking about isn't normally gonna be in the kinda of movie I
go out to watch, or rent. So it's usually not a problem.
> (I still play violent games, and often enjoy the storytelling and gameplay
> while disliking the violence and death, but sometimes it gets just too
> much -- e.g. most FPS games with animated gore, and the "finishing moves"
> of mortal combat).
I play violent games too. And usually not for the violence, though it
doesn't detract from my enjoyment of the game, at least not usually. And
sometimes it may even add to my enjoyment of the game, but violence can't
make or break a game for me. More important is it fun? Do I want to play?
Does it keep me coming back?
> I think there's something to be said in favour of the uncompromising
> stance of the website: that not even great gameplay or poetic scenes can
> justify a game's violence. I don't agree with this stance myself, but
> someone needs to take it, and keep reminding us.
Agreed. I have no problem with the website. He makes it clear how he
judges games, and seems to do a pretty good job of judging the games on
those criteria. My one beef with his reviews. He marks down Diablo because
the skeletons and zombies don't wear clothes. Come on! That is kinda
ridiculous. What about the skeleton their children's biology teacher
probably has in the class room? I bet that one doesn't have any clothes
either! Is that considered nudity? Anyway, that gripe aside, he does what
he says he does. I don't have a lot of use for the reviews, though I find
them kinda interesting.
> Lucian Wischik, Queens' College, Cambridge CB3 9ET. www.wischik.com/lu
Gouge
Gerry Quinn
>
>"Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
>> a Christian gaming review site:
>>
>>
>> http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
>
I've seen review sites that were a lot worse! While their rating system
is unkind to games that involve much gore or occultism, the reviewers
clearly have played the games and those I looked at gave a good feel for
the contents and were by no means devoid of humour (cf. skeleton nudity
in Diablo).
I would recommend this review site to anyone considering buying a game.
Aren't they allowed have opinions? They clearly distinguish between
objective comment and their own religious criteria - I only wish most
other sites did so well!
Forget the points and check the reviews - they are actually quite solid
compared to some...
- Gerry Quinn
Iphigenie
comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic when one foggy november evening
"Gouge" <deep...@yahoo.com> came into my office and told me:
>
> I know! Diablo 2 has the lowest rating I could find on the
> site. And it's pretty much based on the copious amounts of
> black magic in the game. And the fact that the player
> characters use this magic to do good. I was surprised that it
> received a lower lower rating than GTA3. But no black magic in
> GTA3. I would like too see how he would rate the fallout games.
> Lotsa violence, lotsa profanity, and lotsa evil acts one can
> commit.
I assume he didnt rate "Sacrifice" - I wonder how he'd react to that.
I also wonder - who plays all those games the site reviews???
--
Iphigenie
Lucian Wischik
>[I'm a catholic, but not a practising or believing one.]
>Maybe a silly question, and kind of off topic, but can I ask why you
>consider yourself a catholic, if you you don't practice or believe as such?
Because I was baptised and so am a member of the catholic church.
>He marks down Diablo because the skeletons and zombies don't wear
>clothes.
I thought that was a joke on his part!
--
Gouge
"RogerM" <rog...@sprint.ca> wrote in message
news:3D4120CF...@sprint.ca...
> Alvin wrote:
> >
> > There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> > a Christian gaming review site:
> >
> > http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
> >
> > Everyone is poking fun at this website for their outrageous reviews.
> > I would like to hear from some people on these forums especially
> > Christian gamers as to your feelings about this website. I am a
> > Christian gamer myself, but I do not necessarily agree with most
> > reviews on the site. The crazy thing is that they bash like 90% or
> > more games with failing scores. Even top quality games like the
> > Serious Sam receive a F. The only game that I see that received an A
> > is Civ 3.
> >
> > Frankly, I find gaming to be the least dangerous form of entertainment
> > as far as corrupting a Christian mind. The same parents and media
> > that outcry against gaming have no problems watching a PG-13 movie.
> > Movies and TV inject more realistic images into our minds that can
> > cement. Yet, everytime some kid shoots up a school or something,
> > video games are to blame. I am more likely to remember a movie scene
> > than a level in a game.
> >
> > On the other hand, I think it is good to warn of material that may be
> > offensive to a believer in a game. Certainly a game like Diablo and
> > Undying would be games that I would avoid.
>
> Diablo? Why? You FIGHT evil in Diablo (the original, anyway. I haven't
played D2).
Well, you fight evil in both versions. But there is a lot of satanic
imagery. The reviewer also doesn't like the fact that one gets into hell
through the church. He takes this as a back handed slap at christians.
Also the fact that players use and gain occult powers and objects. Oh, and
skeletons and zombies are naked in the game.
> > However, you might as well
> > throw up your hands if you are looking for a game that is completely
> > non-violent, and even then you can claim that these games are immoral
> > as they could bring up feelings of frustration or anger by the
> > difficulty of the game. I did not even bother reading the review for
> > GTA. I am certain this game gets a F as well.
>
> Well, I am not a fan of the GTA series, since they glamourize criminal
behaviour. (I don't
> watch 'The Sopranos' either). I wouldn't play a game that casts you in the
role of a drug
> pusher, either. I want to play a hero in a game, not scum.
>
I think GTA3 gets a higher rating than the Diablo games. At least I'm sure
it gets a higher rating than Diablo2. The reviews seem heavily weighted
against games that have satanic imagery and especially the use of occult
powers. And especially if said occult powers are used by the player
characters. Cause ya can't use occult powers and be good, at least in the
reviewers eyes.
Gouge
Iphigenie
ger...@indigo.ie (Gerry Quinn) came into my office and told me:
> I've seen review sites that were a lot worse! While their
> rating system is unkind to games that involve much gore or
> occultism, the reviewers clearly have played the games and those
> I looked at gave a good feel for the contents and were by no
> means devoid of humour (cf. skeleton nudity in Diablo).
>
> I would recommend this review site to anyone considering buying
> a game. Aren't they allowed have opinions? They clearly
> distinguish between objective comment and their own religious
> criteria - I only wish most other sites did so well!
>
> Forget the points and check the reviews - they are actually
> quite solid compared to some...
true - at least the reason they rate as they do is clearly explained
and the score is "suitability to christian children and teenagers"
--
Iphigenie
Iphigenie
comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action when one foggy november evening
told me:
> Gouge <deep...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>[I'm a catholic, but not a practising or believing one.]
>>Maybe a silly question, and kind of off topic, but can I ask why
>>you consider yourself a catholic, if you you don't practice or
>>believe as such?
>
> Because I was baptised and so am a member of the catholic
> church.
>
>>He marks down Diablo because the skeletons and zombies don't
>>wear clothes.
>
> I thought that was a joke on his part!
I think it is a joke
--
Iphigenie
Ronny Nielsen
>
> "As in all violent games, killing people is seen as an acceptable action.
> Even though, in this game, you are fighting Germans, nothing can
> ever justify taking the life of another person."
>
> I love the "even though" part. I think the reviewer has something against
> Germans.
> He makes it sound as if it is almost good to kill Germans but not quite.
Yeah, he should have said Nazis :)
Edward Crisler
putting out material based on Christian priniciples. Now then do I agree
with all their reviews, no but then again I dont agree with half the reviews
I have seen. However this just offers another opinion.
As such this site should be taken like any other review site. Look at the
review sites, find one that judhes along a criteria that you agree with and
use that site. If you do not agree with the reviewing methods move on.
This is not a matter of Chrisitan or not, this is a matter of do you use the
site or not. Shucks I find more humor and many of the other review sites.
Anything PC Gamer reviews to me is a huge joke :-)
Lets not get wrppaed up in a faith issue, but rather does it fill your need,
if it does not then move along to some toher site. Personally I have booked
mark the site and will give it a look with my other review choices.
Edward Crisler
"Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
> There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> a Christian gaming review site:
>
>
> http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
>
>
> Everyone is poking fun at this website for their outrageous reviews.
> I would like to hear from some people on these forums especially
> Christian gamers as to your feelings about this website. I am a
> Christian gamer myself, but I do not necessarily agree with most
> reviews on the site. The crazy thing is that they bash like 90% or
> more games with failing scores. Even top quality games like the
> Serious Sam receive a F. The only game that I see that received an A
> is Civ 3.
>
>
> Frankly, I find gaming to be the least dangerous form of entertainment
> as far as corrupting a Christian mind. The same parents and media
> that outcry against gaming have no problems watching a PG-13 movie.
> Movies and TV inject more realistic images into our minds that can
> cement. Yet, everytime some kid shoots up a school or something,
> video games are to blame. I am more likely to remember a movie scene
> than a level in a game.
>
>
> On the other hand, I think it is good to warn of material that may be
> offensive to a believer in a game. Certainly a game like Diablo and
> Undying would be games that I would avoid. However, you might as well
> throw up your hands if you are looking for a game that is completely
> non-violent, and even then you can claim that these games are immoral
> as they could bring up feelings of frustration or anger by the
> difficulty of the game. I did not even bother reading the review for
> GTA. I am certain this game gets a F as well.
>
>
> For the most part, it is just a matter of personal opinion. You could
> claim that the majority of all forms of entertainment are of the
> devil.
>
Ronny Nielsen
"Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> skrev i en meddelelse
news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
> There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> a Christian gaming review site:
>
>
> http://www.almenconi.com/topics/games/amm_game_ratings.html
Well, hardly a site I´m ever gonna visit again :)
Did anybody notice he declared Civ3 to be a RPG? :D
Khalistro
>
> Who professes first hand information of what the Creator _MEANT_.
<SNIP>
I don't thank ANYONE now understands what I ment in those days ;-)
Khalistro
Gouge
> Gouge <deep...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >[I'm a catholic, but not a practising or believing one.]
> >Maybe a silly question, and kind of off topic, but can I ask why you
> >consider yourself a catholic, if you you don't practice or believe as
such?
>
> Because I was baptised and so am a member of the catholic church.
Interesting. I guess that means, technically, I'm a catholic too. I was
baptised and even did communion. But I never, at least for quite a number
of years, considered myself catholic. Not really even considered myself
catholic ever. My immediate family wasn't religious at all. I can remember
going too church twice, and once was for the communion I mentioned. We
didn't say grace, didn't read the bible, etc. Nothing. Which makes me
wonder why I did communion in the first place. It's been quite a number of
years, and my memory is foggy. So, if not if you don't practice and don't
believe, and you're still catholic, how does one go about getting out of the
church. Not that I'm interested in such, just curious.
> >He marks down Diablo because the skeletons and zombies don't wear
> >clothes.
>
> I thought that was a joke on his part!
>
Well, it would be hard too tell if it was a joke, since he doesn't give
numerical values too each part of the review, just a total. But by general
tone of the review and the website, I would guess that he's not. Though it
is a little hard too tell what might and might not be a joke on the
website....;)
Gouge
Gouge
"Iphigenie" <ip...@imagis.ch> wrote in message
news:Xns92577EF...@130.133.1.4...
> I started thinking something odd was going on in
> comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic when one foggy november evening
> "Gouge" <deep...@yahoo.com> came into my office and told me:
>
> >
> > I know! Diablo 2 has the lowest rating I could find on the
> > site. And it's pretty much based on the copious amounts of
> > black magic in the game. And the fact that the player
> > characters use this magic to do good. I was surprised that it
> > received a lower lower rating than GTA3. But no black magic in
> > GTA3. I would like too see how he would rate the fallout games.
> > Lotsa violence, lotsa profanity, and lotsa evil acts one can
> > commit.
> I also wonder - who plays all those games the site reviews???
>
Games are reviewed by JC Long and John Gocke. Both are game experts. They
have some neat profiles on the website.
> I assume he didnt rate "Sacrifice" - I wonder how he'd react to that.
Not sure I'm familiar with sacrifice, but Undying has the lowest score on
the site, followed closely by Diablo2. But here is what I can't figure out.
Everquest get's 79%, C+!?!?!?! What? I just don't get it. There are is
loads of magic and occult items in the game. This is one of the big
problems they had with Diablo, good players could use magic. But he glosses
over the magic system, and says it isn't that bad. It has necromancers for
christsakes! I can't see how magic is represented all that different in
Diablo. Anyway, Everquest also has a bunch of different gods. Gods
characters can choose as deities. He glosses over this too. Now, this
would seem to be a big deal, at least the way a lot of other stuff on the
site reads. But apparently worshipping a bunch of different gods isn't so
bad, evil gods as well. Diablo has nothing on this. Also, plenty of
scantily clad women, this is something other games have been marked down
for. But not Everquest! Everquest is of course played on line, this gets
other games marked down, but again, not a big deal for Everquest. And of
course, the game is completely centered on killing for personal gain. All
these things are mentioned in the review, but it still gets high marks. I
just can't figure it out. Either Sony has this guy in their pocket, or the
reviewer became addicted while playing and doesn't want to speak badly of
his new habbit. Hmmm. Something else I just noticed. This one is not
reviewed by the normal reviewers. It's a special guest reviewer Bruce
Gifford. So they might explain the high score. Cause black magic,
escpecially if players get to use it, is usually automatic F. Wonder why
they needed a guest reviewer.
Gouge
factory
> Or (assuming you're an American here), a game called
> "Terrorist Hunt". Bin Laden is on the loose, and only
> _you_ can stop him! The game would consist of 5 episodes.
> At the end of each episode, a couple of America's national
> treasures would get blasted to ashes. Beautiful FMV
> sequences would be shown about corpses in the rubble,
> family members crying, etc. The president would probably
> get assassinated a couple of times, just for the dramatic
> tension. But at the end, you'd finally get to kill Bin
> Laden in an epic showdown, so this would make a great
> patriotic American game, right?
Erm, that description is quite apt for quite a few movies at least
("True Lies" for one of the more apt).
But that said, there is a vast diversity of opinion in christianity,
so trying to say anything about 'the christians' is a bit of a silly thing.
- Factory
Gouge
"Gouge" <deep...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ahrfut$mcq$1...@news.efn.org...
Gouge
Gouge
>
> >> On the other hand, I think it is good to warn of material that
> >> may be offensive to a believer in a game. Certainly a game like
> >> Diablo and Undying would be games that I would avoid.
> >
> > Diablo? Why? You FIGHT evil in Diablo (the original, anyway. I
> > haven't played D2).
>
> AH, you fail to understand something.
>
> You fight evil but it's a world of magic and sorcery. White magic is
> not any more accepted than black magic, as a matter of fact it's
> probably considered worse as it could lure well meaning people...
> something like that.
>
term white magic. This is explained in another post.
Gouge
RogerM
Because it a 'God' game, no doubt.
Gouge
"Edward Crisler" <compu...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:C0b09.4380$XG5...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> You know as I read these posts I see so many people again bashing a site
for
> putting out material based on Christian priniciples. Now then do I agree
> with all their reviews, no but then again I dont agree with half the
reviews
> I have seen. However this just offers another opinion.
Completely agree. Though Christian bashing is very fashionable.
> As such this site should be taken like any other review site. Look at the
> review sites, find one that judhes along a criteria that you agree with
and
> use that site. If you do not agree with the reviewing methods move on.
That's how I've been reading it. I have no problem with the site, though I
am starting to question the quality of some of the reviews, as compared to
how they say they are judging the games. As well factual problems. First
of all, Civ3 is an RPG according to the reviewers. And compare the reviews
for Diablo2 and Everquest. Doesn't seem to be in line.
> This is not a matter of Chrisitan or not, this is a matter of do you use
the
> site or not. Shucks I find more humor and many of the other review sites.
> Anything PC Gamer reviews to me is a huge joke :-)
Hahaha. I agree, though I am enjoying this website for some reason.
> Lets not get wrppaed up in a faith issue, but rather does it fill your
need,
> if it does not then move along to some toher site. Personally I have
booked
> mark the site and will give it a look with my other review choices.
Agreed. It doesn't fill my need. And it doesn't really have to do with
faith. I wonder if it even fills the needs of the target audience though.
As there are factual errors, and inconsistancies with some of the reviews.
Well, especially the Everquest review. Seems hinky.
Anyway, again, I agree, with your comments. Though I don't see anything
wrong with discussing the actual content of the site.
Gouge
Mark Sidarous
> In article <d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com>,
> alvinst...@hotmail.com says...
>
> > Certainly a game like Diablo and [...] would be games that I would avoid.
>
> Um, the object of that game was to fucking KILL THE DEVIL. I would think
> Christians would applaud that, nu?
then you became him, haha
--
Mark
Maddog
> <some snipping>
> > There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> > a Christian gaming review site:
> >
> > as far as corrupting a Christian mind. The same parents and media
> > that outcry against gaming have no problems watching a PG-13 movie.
> > Movies and TV inject more realistic images into our minds that can
> > cement. Yet, everytime some kid shoots up a school or something,
> > video games are to blame. I am more likely to remember a movie scene
> > than a level in a game.
>
> control people. I find this particularly repulsive when done under the
> guise of 'working for God'. So repulsive that I'm having a hard time making
> a coherent post here because it makes me too upset to think clearly.
>
LOL - Man don't you know that is what religion is all about?
Controlling people!
Think about it. Simple Example: 3 or 4 thousand years ago it became
obvious to some (hey there were smart observant folkes even back then)
that eating pork wasn't a terribly healthy thing to do (parasites and
all but they didn't know that). Imagine now that you are living back
then and finding ways to eat every day is a major part of your
existence (which it was). Some fool tells you don't eat that pig -
you'll get sick and die. Your response - fuck off maggot, I'll
whatever the hell I want to eat. Next the local chieftain or king says
don't eat that pig or you'll get sick and die - your response - no
problem, right, I won't eat pig anymore (but you go off and eat the
pig anyway when no one is looking - because jails at that time weren't
terribly pleasant places to be). Now some guy comes along and says GOD
says don't eat that pig or HE'll smite thee and you will rot in hell
for disobeying his holy commands - your response (being a primitive
and all) - fall to your knees, beg forgiveness for even thinking about
eating that pig, and offer up to GOD's spokesman what ever you have to
get forgiveness (because as bad as prison may be HELL for eternity has
got to be a lot worse).
It isn't much different today (pigs are not the parsite ridden beasts
they used to be but the same principles apply to other areas -
adultery for example).
RELIGION IS ALL ABOUT CONTROLLING PEOPLE - plain and simple.
Maddog
Maddog
> "Alvin" <alvinst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com...
> > There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> > a Christian gaming review site:
>
> newsgroups??
Look at it this way...
It's a refreshing and exhilirating break from the incessant NWN and MW posts.
Maddog
Damocles
"Gandalf Parker" <postmaster@[127.0.0.1]> wrote in message
news:Xns9256DEDF1818...@216.168.3.30...
> alvinst...@hotmail.com (Alvin) wrote in
> news:d2ec46.020725...@posting.google.com:
>
> > There is a hot thread on the Gamespot PC forum right now dealing with
> > a Christian gaming review site:
>
> might say of Europa Universalis. I considered EU to be too christian
> history for my taste. Great training tool for catechism.
Why, because it allowed for the importance of religious beliefs in medieval
and early modern history?
Damocles
> Gouge <deep...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >[I'm a catholic, but not a practising or believing one.]
> >Maybe a silly question, and kind of off topic, but can I ask why you
> >consider yourself a catholic, if you you don't practice or believe as
such?
>
> Because I was baptised and so am a member of the catholic church.
>
My two ex-girlfriends who were born Catholics and now loathe the church and
all it stands for would disagree.
Damocles
> They long for the Garden. So do I, but not at the price of ignorance.
>
The Garden looks boring as hell to me, running around and eating nuts and
berries. No blow jobs, pizza or computer games...are you sure it isn't hell?
Gandalf Parker
news:5U609.650231$352.137237@sccrnsc02:
> Even so, prolonged playing of this game is not a good idea. These
> shooter games primarily appeal to adolescent boys, looking for ways to
> take out their frustrations from everyday life. And study after study
> has shown that prolonged exposure to this level of violence and gore
> tends to spill out of the game and into more aggressive behaviors in
> real life.
>
Yeah thats why so many of the DnD players end up chopping their school
mates to bits with swords.
Gandalf Parker
Maddog
> The more you think about it, the more the fundamentalist Christians
> are looking more like the Talibans, especially those in the US. These
> are the same people that wants everyone to pledge allegiance to God.
> Frankly, I don't think god gives a hoot what games you play or if you
> pledge Allegiance to him. Some people are just so insecure about
> their religions.
The only difference between the Taliban and Fundamentalist Christians
is that the Taliban took control of their government and
fundamentalist christians haven't taken over the US' (yet - they're
trying really, really hard to though). IMO if fundamentalist
christians took over the US the same thing that the Taliban did in
Afghanistan would be done in the US (hell just look at what the PC
crowd (read thought police) has already accomplished). A religious
fanatic is a religious fanatic. What religion they follow is
immaterial.
As for GOD giving a hoot - you're right - he doesn't!
How arrogant of the human species to assume that we above all else in
the universe which GOD created are his/her/its favorites. Think about
it - if we are God's main entertainment why bother with creating the
rest of the universe - a single flat chunk of ground with a sun and
moon circling around it and a few pretty lights in the sky to amuse
the inhabitants would have worked just fine and GOD could have played
with his toys just the same and gone to a whole lot less trouble.
But that's not what GOD created. He/she/it created the whole damned
universe with billions of galaxies and trillions of stars around which
orbit trillions of planets (and they all follow a really, really
sophisticated set of rules). That's a lot of real estate to play with
- even for a supreme being. To imagine GOD pays any more attention to
us than all the other of his toys in the universe is simply ludricrous
and extremely arrogant(well there was that one time he dropped in and
left the water running when he left and of course the next time he
showed up he kinda dipped his wick where he shouldn't have and forgot
to wear a condom - and look at all the trouble that's caused).
Maddog
Gandalf Parker
news:ahrkjt$cv...@mercury.cc.uottawa.ca:
Exactly. I think they would find the extensive research and use of true
events to be a great way to teach about the emergence of christianity in
europe. Plus its low on actual blod/violence. I would think it might be one
of their favorite games.
Gandalf Parker
Clogar
>
[snip]
> > The problem with threads dealing with religion is that it
> >brings out every dumb-ass that has taken a quarter of PHIL 101 and
> >failed it. If you're going to post these stupid little responses,
> >at least give us something decent and not this lame-ass, easily
> >disproven BS.
>
> And the problem with religious threat is assholes like you coming out
> to slam what appear to be a harmless little post.
Ignoring the religious "threat" here ;), that "harmless little
post" was slamming a harmless little gaming review website. Pot. Kettle.
Black. Be-atch.
Maddog
> Around 25 Jul 2002 15:59:25 -0700, alvinst...@hotmail.com (Alvin)
> solemnly uttered:
>
> >Everyone is poking fun at this website for their outrageous reviews.
>
>
> "Clive Barker's Undying is, by far, the worst game I have ever played.
> I can easily say that there are no redeeming qualities in this entire
> game. It is a game that I am certain Satan would approve of."
>
> Now THAT should go on the box!
I've never even heard of Undying - but now I want it!
Maddog
Clogar
>
[snip]
> mates to bits with swords.
Yeppers. I remember the first time I was attacked by one of
my D&D buddies - it was nasty. Had to knock him out. Then I stabbed
another guy in the foot because he pissed me off. Then I got stabbed
in the foot with a sword and had to go to the hospital...
Long story short: Dungeons and Dragons + RenFests = PAIN.
Some of those swords are sharp, man!
Maddog
[snip]
>
> I have no problems with this idea. If there are hippies or communists who
> want this kinda info, I'm sure someone will cater too their needs. Doesn't
> bother me in the slightest. I don't have much use for this information, but
> if others do, so be it.
>
And there in lies the power of the Internet - to provide many
different points of view to the many different people who espouse and
belive in all those different points of view. That my friends is
FREEDOM!
Maddog
Mark Morrison
<REMOV...@pavloffTOEMAIL.net> wrote:
>Around 25 Jul 2002 15:59:25 -0700, alvinst...@hotmail.com (Alvin)
>solemnly uttered:
>
>>Everyone is poking fun at this website for their outrageous reviews.
>
>I love it!
>
>"Clive Barker's Undying is, by far, the worst game I have ever played.
>I can easily say that there are no redeeming qualities in this entire
>game. It is a game that I am certain Satan would approve of."
>
>Now THAT should go on the box!
I quite liked Undying - very, very spooky in places.
In fact, I think I'll dig out the CD - I never got around to finishing
it...
--
Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes !
They got them hoppy legs and twitchy little noses !
And what's with all the carrots ?
What do they need such good eyesight for anyway ?
Bunnies ! Bunnies ! It must be BUNNIES !
Iphigenie
shows his criteria didnt match all that well.
When I look at the reviews from the point of view that this is a site
trying to help parent let their children play games but in a balanced
way and chose games that are suitable, then even whether you agree or
not with some of the concepts, a lot of the conclusions are right.
For example I agree that massively multiplayer RPGs are not suitable
for children or even teenagers. Not because of all the "unsafe"
people they might meet but simply because of the highly addictive
nature of the games. These are games which are aimed at keeping
people paying month in, month out. They have made normal, fairly
healthy adults lose all sense and call in sick to play more, pay
money to buy game items etc. Children are even more likely to fall in
the addiction.
Of a lot of the games listed I think many are just not all that good
for children, even if you don't mind the magic...
They do forgive some magic if the setting of it is light, and if it's
use by the main player is not being encouraged. Just like they do
forgive killing if its not encouraged as the easiest solution...
Besides, they like freedom force and I agree there!!!
--
Iphigenie
Damocles
"Maddog" <mjan...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:56dd8040.02072...@posting.google.com...
> Think about it. Simple Example: 3 or 4 thousand years ago it became
> obvious to some (hey there were smart observant folkes even back then)
> that eating pork wasn't a terribly healthy thing to do (parasites and
> all but they didn't know that). Imagine now that you are living back
> then and finding ways to eat every day is a major part of your
> existence (which it was). Some fool tells you don't eat that pig -
> you'll get sick and die. Your response - fuck off maggot, I'll
> whatever the hell I want to eat. Next the local chieftain or king says
> don't eat that pig or you'll get sick and die - your response - no
> problem, right, I won't eat pig anymore (but you go off and eat the
> pig anyway when no one is looking - because jails at that time weren't
> terribly pleasant places to be). Now some guy comes along and says GOD
> says don't eat that pig or HE'll smite thee and you will rot in hell
> for disobeying his holy commands - your response (being a primitive
> and all) - fall to your knees, beg forgiveness for even thinking about
> eating that pig, and offer up to GOD's spokesman what ever you have to
> get forgiveness (because as bad as prison may be HELL for eternity has
> got to be a lot worse).
>
> It isn't much different today (pigs are not the parsite ridden beasts
> they used to be but the same principles apply to other areas -
> adultery for example).
> RELIGION IS ALL ABOUT CONTROLLING PEOPLE - plain and simple.
>
Quite true...the ancient Israelites believed that men had a finite supply of
sperm, and so any sexual act not for the purpose of procreation endangered
the survival of the tribe. Thus the biblical commandments and all of our
sexual taboos today.
Damocles
"Gandalf Parker" <postmaster@[127.0.0.1]> wrote in message
Be that as it may, you can't understand the history of Europe in those times
without understanding the religion that dominated them. European history is
Christian history, right up til the Enlightenment.