idNews: DOOM II release party invitations

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David Taylor

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Sep 23, 1994, 12:28:43 PM9/23/94
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We now have specifics on time and place of the DOOM II release
party in New York on Oct. 10. We'd like to extend invitations to
all of you, but there isn't much room. Amongst other things, the
party is actually a chance to smack id's finest down in Deathmatch
2.0. If you're interested in a shot at this or just want to meet
id and spit in our eye for lowering your GPA/productivity, here's
your opportunity.

If interested, you've got 5 days (September 28 midnight is the
deadline) to reply to doo...@tsipr.com. You'll want to get that
e-mail address right. Any mail sent to @idsoftware.com addresses
will go down the bit bucket. Include your name, address, phone
number, and age. You must be over 17. If accepted, time and place
details will be sent to you. Keep in mind you've got to get there
by your own means, so if you don't live near NYC, you've got a long
drive ahead of you.

Good luck, and we look forward to meeting y'all!

=-ddt->

PS. Those post forgeries on a.g.d. were amazingly lame.


David J. Warner

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Sep 23, 1994, 3:31:26 PM9/23/94
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David Taylor <d...@idcube.idsoftware.com> wrote:
>We now have specifics on time and place of the DOOM II release
>party in New York on Oct. 10.
[rest deleted]

This really doesn't have too much to do with DOOM, but does anyone else
(specifically Letterman fans) find it vaguely interesting that DOOM II's
release coincides with the appearance of Dave's ex, Merrill Markoe, on
The Late Show?

Just curious.


--
L8A...

David J. (dwa...@cybernetics.net)
Director of Network Distribution, HardC.O.R.E.

Bob Tausworthe

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Sep 23, 1994, 7:53:29 PM9/23/94
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David J. Warner (dwa...@cybernetics.net) wrote:

: David Taylor <d...@idcube.idsoftware.com> wrote:
: >We now have specifics on time and place of the DOOM II release
: >party in New York on Oct. 10.
: [rest deleted]

: This really doesn't have too much to do with DOOM, but does anyone else
: (specifically Letterman fans) find it vaguely interesting that DOOM II's
: release coincides with the appearance of Dave's ex, Merrill Markoe, on
: The Late Show?

NO

tozz

Jon Thomas Lemke

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Sep 24, 1994, 11:33:08 PM9/24/94
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A little word about Marathon (doom like game for the Mac)

I got to play it at a Mac expo in Boston. It is very similiar to doom in
a lot of way. 3-d texture mapping, stereo-panning sound effects, network
play option. Good alternative to Doom for those who are stuck with Mac's.
Pretty much needs a Power Mac to run decently. Looked great on 7100's with
NEC 6FG monitors.

As compared to Doom, it is pretty competitive. A little slower maybe.
Graphics are higher resolution. Play action is similiar, a little
less intense in my opinion. Major technical difference is the
ability to look up and down. I talk to the designer; he claimed he
never had seen Doom prior to programming this - seemed pretty unlikely
but that's what he said.

Not sure about customization. Doesn't appear as easy to customize as Doom.
So new levels, sounds effects, and graphics might not be possible. That's
one of the reasons I like Doom so much.

-------------------------------
Jon Lemke -- JT...@Columbia.EDU

Brian Stone

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Sep 25, 1994, 12:55:54 PM9/25/94
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: I got to play it at a Mac expo in Boston. It is very similiar to doom in

: a lot of way. 3-d texture mapping, stereo-panning sound effects, network
: play option. Good alternative to Doom for those who are stuck with Mac's.
: Pretty much needs a Power Mac to run decently. Looked great on 7100's with
: NEC 6FG monitors.

I belive that the monitor in the middle was a Q840AV 040 40Mhz... and
it was pushing 8 FPS in 640480 res... but I dont know if it was
displaying 256 or 16-bit color. Please correct me if Im wrong about any
of this... its hard to remember two months back.

: As compared to Doom, it is pretty competitive. A little slower maybe.

: Graphics are higher resolution. Play action is similiar, a little
: less intense in my opinion. Major technical difference is the
: ability to look up and down. I talk to the designer; he claimed he
: never had seen Doom prior to programming this - seemed pretty unlikely
: but that's what he said.

Marathon utilizes the theory that you can get a good game by using fewer
SMART enemies... while Doom utilizes the theory that you can get a good game
by using many STUPID enemies. Im sure its purly opinion in the end.

: Not sure about customization. Doesn't appear as easy to customize as Doom.

: So new levels, sounds effects, and graphics might not be possible. That's
: one of the reasons I like Doom so much.

Apparently the editor that Bungie used to make the levels for Marathon
could be released as a comerical product. But apparently Bungie hasnt
made any plans to do so... yet.

BAS

Leo

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Sep 27, 1994, 1:28:38 PM9/27/94
to

So:

- is there a demo/shareware available on the Net?
- where is it?
- is it already on sale? or
- which is the relase date?

Just curious, as we have a PowerMac 7100 here, and I'd like to see how this
game goes...


TIA.


Luca.

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Marc Nimchuk

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Sep 27, 1994, 5:45:09 PM9/27/94
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lleo...@acorn.co.uk writes:

>- is there a demo/shareware available on the Net?
>- where is it?
>- is it already on sale? or
>- which is the relase date?

>Just curious, as we have a PowerMac 7100 here, and I'd like to see how this
>game goes...

The game isnt out yet. Its expected at ~the end of October. Screenshots are
available at Sumex-aim.stanford.edu in info-mac/rec. A demo will be out
in the next week or two.

It'll be stunning on a Powermac....

White Flame

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Sep 28, 1994, 10:55:31 AM9/28/94
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In article b...@krypton.hpc.sdsmt.edu, bas...@silver.sdsmt.edu (Brian Stone) writes:
> Marathon utilizes the theory that you can get a good game by using fewer
>SMART enemies... while Doom utilizes the theory that you can get a good game
>by using many STUPID enemies. Im sure its purly opinion in the end.

DOOM enemies STUPID? They can "hear" you walking or shooting, depending on
the level design, they have evasion tactics (like those pink munchers who
always zig-zag towards you), and haven't you ever seen a sarge who's plugging
at you get hit in the back with an imp fireball, turn around, and splatter
the imp's brain? I'm impressed by the intelligence programming of DOOM, and
it's not to complex, so you can have many enemies and not slow down the
system too badly.

White Flame
(holz...@nova.gmi.edu after Oct. 1)

Harlan Hilman

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Sep 28, 1994, 6:10:30 PM9/28/94
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ho...@cpchq.cpc.gmeds.com (White Flame) writes:

You haven't heard about Triad's AI yet? Rise of the Triad will have
enemies that roll aside when shot, bosses that don't just walk at you and
fire, but actually maneuver around and dodge your shots. With Doom, it's
just:

a) monsters can hear you if there are no soundproof walls in the way.

b) They never walk straight at you

c) They attack other monsters that are not their own kind

I agree that this is simple, but you can get much more interesting with
complex.


>Nezitic

Daniel Lemberg

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Sep 28, 1994, 10:57:54 PM9/28/94
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In article <hilman.7...@ichips.intel.com> hil...@ichips.intel.com (Harlan Hilman) writes:

> a) monsters can hear you if there are no soundproof walls in the way.
>
> b) They never walk straight at you
>
> c) They attack other monsters that are not their own kind

I swear I've seen monsters going after their own variety before, enough
so that I have to question that last one. The human sarge's in particular
like to blast away at each other. Has anyone else noticed this?

Edward A. Brunner

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Sep 29, 1994, 1:07:00 AM9/29/94
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: > a) monsters can hear you if there are no soundproof walls in the way.

: >
: > b) They never walk straight at you
: >
: > c) They attack other monsters that are not their own kind

: I swear I've seen monsters going after their own variety before, enough
: so that I have to question that last one. The human sarge's in particular
: like to blast away at each other. Has anyone else noticed this?

Yes, you're right. The equation works this way:

1. If it shoots fireballs (Imp, Caco, Baron), it is immune to its own shots.

2. If it shoots bullets (Former Human, Sargeant, CybDem, SpidDem), then
it can shoot others of the same type.

Scratchers are the really interesting ones, scratchers can hit others of
the same type, but they only start to scratch when they are next to you.
If you hit IDSPISPOPD when you are surrounded by demons, you will see
that this is so.


One more thing, after seeing Blake Stone and every other Apogee game for
the last 2 years or so, I have an *extremely* hard time believing that
they will come up with monsters that are 'more intelligent'. Apogee just
doesn't do that kind of stuff. The 'rolling on the floor once they get
hit' is probably nothing more than a reaction -- monster gets hit, it
rolls away, stands up and keeps attacking. You just have to see that
kind of thing 3 or 4 times before it gets extremely predictable.

Anyway, I am holding back judgement on ROTT until I see it with my own
eyes. Apogee has done nothing lately to give me any faith in them, so in
order to avoid disappointment I am expecting the game to suck. (That way
anything better will be a pleasant suprise.) (But I'm not counting on it ;)

Later,
Ted B.

Harlan Hilman

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Sep 29, 1994, 10:30:55 AM9/29/94
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lem...@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Daniel Lemberg) writes:

Yes, anything that fires bullets will gleefully attack eachother. And when
a pinkie chomp is misdirected at another pinkie, they will chomp it out.
BUT, Cyber rockets don't hurt other Cybers, Baron plasma won't hurt other
barons, Caco balls won't hurt other Cacos, and Imp Fireballs won't hurt
other Imps.

Topi Ylinen

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Sep 30, 1994, 5:35:01 AM9/30/94
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In article <36di1k$j...@apollo.it.luc.edu>,

Edward A. Brunner <ebr...@orion.it.luc.edu> wrote:
>
>: > a) monsters can hear you if there are no soundproof walls in the way.

More specifically, you need at least TWO soundproof lines between yourself
and the monsters, or it won't work. The Design FAQ says so.

>Yes, you're right. The equation works this way:
>
>1. If it shoots fireballs (Imp, Caco, Baron), it is immune to its own shots.
>
>2. If it shoots bullets (Former Human, Sargeant, CybDem, SpidDem), then

>it can shoot others of the same type. ~~~~~~

Wrong! Cyberdemons are immune to Cyberdemon missiles! (Your rockets, on the
other hands, do hurt Cyberdemons). Check the FAQ for details.

===========================================================================
|| Topi Ylinen || "Hwaet, we gardena in geardagum, ||
|| f1t...@kielo.uta.fi || theodcyninga thrym gefrunon, ||
|| t...@modeemi.cs.tut.fi || hu tha aethelingas ellen fremedon!" ||
===========================================================================

mis...@csc.canterbury.ac.nz

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Sep 29, 1994, 8:53:14 PM9/29/94
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> You haven't heard about Triad's AI yet? Rise of the Triad will have
> enemies that roll aside when shot, bosses that don't just walk at you and
> fire, but actually maneuver around and dodge your shots. With Doom, it's
> just:
>
> a) monsters can hear you if there are no soundproof walls in the way.

It's more complex than that, even with sound proof walls in the way, monsters
can hear as the sound can travel down a corridor, into an adjacent room,
through a ventilation duct etc .

>
> b) They never walk straight at you
>

Sometimes they do, but nevermind :)

> c) They attack other monsters that are not their own kind

No, they attack _anything_ that hurts them, including monsters of their
own kind, and they don't attack until they have been hurt by them. if more
than one thing hurts them, they will pick one, kill it, remember the others,
pick another, kill it etc. The exception to not attacking until hurt is when
they see the player, but it would be a bit silly if they didn't...
But sometimes they will ignore you completely as they hunt down another
monster, sometimes they will give up on a hunt before the monster is dead
and choose another target as above. (This happens when the offending monster
gets away. usually the player :-)

> > I agree that this is simple, but you can get much more interesting with
> complex.
>

It's not quite as simple, but yeah, better AI's makes a better game IMHO.

>

Guenter Wunner

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Sep 30, 1994, 7:18:05 AM9/30/94
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hil...@ichips.intel.com (Harlan Hilman) writes:
> Yes, anything that fires bullets will gleefully attack eachother. And when
> a pinkie chomp is misdirected at another pinkie, they will chomp it out.
> BUT, Cyber rockets don't hurt other Cybers, Baron plasma won't hurt other
> barons, Caco balls won't hurt other Cacos, and Imp Fireballs won't hurt
> other Imps.

Wrong. Just what do you think is the solution for E2M9? Maybe to let the
barons hit other barons etc.? Gee...
Lukas.

** Lukas Wunner, Hustadtring 143, ** Nicht alles, was Gold ist, funkelt, **
** 44801 Bochum, United Germany ** Nicht jeder, der wandert, verlorn, **
** Nickname@IRC: lukas ** Das Alte wird nicht verdunkelt **
** lu...@tp1.ruhr-uni-bochum.de ** Noch Wurzeln der Tiefe erfrorn. **
** Teflon@home: +49-234-707367 ** Aus Asche wird Feuer geschlagen, **
** Teflon@office: +49-234-7003767 ** Aus Schatten geht Licht hervor, **
** Fax@office: +49-234-7094251 ** Heil wird geborstnes Schwert **
** [ sorry for my lengthy .sig! ] ** Und Koenig, der die Krone verlor! **

br...@fdant.nctr.fda.gov

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Sep 30, 1994, 10:00:58 AM9/30/94
to
>David Taylor <d...@idcube.idsoftware.com> wrote:
>>We now have specifics on time and place of the DOOM II release
>>party in New York on Oct. 10.
>[rest deleted]

>This really doesn't have too much to do with DOOM, but does anyone else
>(specifically Letterman fans) find it vaguely interesting that DOOM II's
>release coincides with the appearance of Dave's ex, Merrill Markoe, on
>The Late Show?
>Just curious.

Not a bit, but it DOES make me wonder about universal irony, October 10 is my
wife's birthday!

(Just kidding, Dear.)

Adam Williamson

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Sep 30, 1994, 12:54:26 PM9/30/94
to
Stop criticising Apogee...Blake Stone has intelligent enemies...I know
Doom kicks it's butt but it's still good. I've never seen an enemy trooper
pick up a pack of bullets in Doom...
--
---
_____________________________________
_ _
_DOOM is a load of rubbish. _
_ARRRGGGHHHL! _
_Put the chainsaw down...I was only _
_joking. _
_____________________________________
_ _
_ad...@scss.demon.co.uk _
_____________________________________

David Wareing

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Oct 5, 1994, 2:24:36 AM10/5/94
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lleo...@acorn.co.uk (Leo) writes:


>>A little word about Marathon (doom like game for the Mac)
>>

>>As compared to Doom, it is pretty competitive. A little slower maybe.
>>Graphics are higher resolution. Play action is similiar, a little
>>less intense in my opinion. Major technical difference is the
>>ability to look up and down. I talk to the designer; he claimed he
>>never had seen Doom prior to programming this - seemed pretty unlikely
>>but that's what he said.

Not all that unlikely really. Mac programmers (just like DOS box programmers)
can be fairly insular at times. Although it's a pretty safe bet that
Pathways into Darkeness was based on Wolf 3D.

>>Not sure about customization. Doesn't appear as easy to customize as Doom.
>>So new levels, sounds effects, and graphics might not be possible. That's
>>one of the reasons I like Doom so much.

New levels, sfx and gfx *will* be available. Even if Bungie don't release
an editor, or even the formats, Mac programmers will take on the task
themselves. This is of course, assuming that Marathon really is the DOOM
killer people say it is.

>- is there a demo/shareware available on the Net?

Nup. Cos the game hasn't been released yet.

>- where is it?

Bungie's office.

>- is it already on sale? or
>- which is the relase date?

Bungie are saying less than a month, but they've been saying that since
MacWorld. It's been a while.


--
David Wareing
Adelaide, South Australia dwar...@apanix.apana.org.au
--------------------------------------------------------------
Macintosh Games & Multimedia Programming

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