Which Hand Held? Help Please
Jamie Smith
one with a key board as I will be typing a lot. From what I have seen
so far there does not appear to be to many that have key boards. I had
thought of a Psion but have heard that they are pulling out of this
market, so will not consider one of their products. So what ideals do
you guys have? Any information is welcome and links to reviews would
be most helpful. Not sure if this is relevant but I am bases in the
UK.
TIA
Jamie
Krammer Martin
handhelds with a keyboard- there are just psion's and hp's devices which
have one. but the disadvantage of these devices is their price tag... if
you're looking after something cheap, have a look at palm's handhelds. i
know they have no keyboard, but if you're typing much, it's possible to buy
a snap-on-keyboard. a palm plus keyboard is *much* less expensive than a hp
or psion. i own a palm m500, and i personally love the really huge pool of
software i can choose from.
Martin ;-)
"Jamie Smith" <jamie...@blueyonder.co.uk> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
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Barry F Margolius
to mean a machine with a keyboard? I've always used the term
"palmtop" to refer to things like PalmPilots which have no keyboard.
-barry
Peter da Silva
If you're going to be typing a lot, you need a full-sized keyboard. There are
at least three available for both Palm and Pocket PC handhelds. The best is
the Stowaway: it's full sized, with good key action, and folds up nearly as
small as the typical handheld. The others, the gotype and ibiz keyboards, are
more like the keyboards on the "clamshell" like handhelds though still
larger than even a big handheld.
--
`-_-' In hoc signo hack, Peter da Silva.
'U` "A well-rounded geek should be able to geek about anything."
-- nic...@esperi.org
Disclaimer: WWFD?
Jack
"Barry F Margolius" <b...@pobox.com> wrote in message
news:4n4but802hunqpopn...@4ax.com...
| I can no longer restrain myself. Isn't the term "handheld" intended
| to mean a machine with a keyboard? I've always used the term
| "palmtop" to refer to things like PalmPilots which have no keyboard.
No, it is not. An handheld is a computing device that can be operated while
holding in your hand. So it includes the Palmtop. A machine with a keyboard is
also too broad, because a desktop has also a keyboard and so does a laptop and
they don't belong to the catagory of handhelds.
David Ness
If you will truly `be typing a lot' I'd advise against a handheld.
Buy a refurb laptop (it shouldn't cost much more than a handheld)
and you'll be way ahead if you really have much typing to do.
Handhelds are ok, but IME they are no replacement for laptop/desktops
for serious work.
Eric Lindsay's spam trap
<b...@pobox.com> wrote:
>I can no longer restrain myself. Isn't the term "handheld" intended
>to mean a machine with a keyboard? I've always used the term
>"palmtop" to refer to things like PalmPilots which have no keyboard.
I believe the terminology has been changing over the years,
especially since all the early small computers from say about
1990 had keyboards. I think the Newton was the first popular one
that didn't have a keyboard. I got the impression back in those
days that the distinction between them was mainly on whether they
could fit in a pocket (like the HP95LX) or couldn't (like the
Newton, Sharp PC3000 and the many similar video cassette sized
small computers with MS-DOS and Lotus 123 in ROM).
For what it is worth, my Psion 3a box (about 1993) says "pocket
size computer", my Psion 5 (1997) says "handheld computer", my
(brand new) 5mx says "palmtop computer", and my Series 7 says
"mobile computer". I'd say Psion were pretty firm about it being
a computer, even if they couldn't decide what went in front of
"computer". I guess we could also have an argument about whether
these little gadgets are computers, organisers, or PC companions.
However to return to the original topic, it surely depends a lot
on how you intend to use the device. In particular, whether the
PC companion (and thus syncing) is very important to you, or
relatively unimportant as long as you can transfer data.
The Jornada has been getting good reviews, and I believe has a
built in modem which the Psion lacks. The Psion is around 375
grams whereas the J is over 500. You can (just) shove a Psion in
a trouser pocket (and only get a few comments about being glad to
see people), but I don't believe you would manage that with a J.
I bought myself a new Psion 5mx last week. Major reason was that
in Australia the price was down to 1/3rd what it used to be
(around E#125) whereas the Jornada next to it was around E#600+
Psion claim they will support them until 2004 with repairs and so
on, but the gadgets only have a one year warranty anyway. Psion
said they were no longer developing new consumer models (claiming
slow takeup of Bluetooth and similar factors), however I notice
that in September they released the NetPad industrial model with
a colour 640 x 240 display and no keyboard.
I'm not concerned at all about synchronising with a PC, and
PsiWin always works flawlessly for me in doing backups and
conversions (there have been many complaints by people who can't
get PsiWin to work). If you have concerns about that (or a fully
loaded Windows PC, since that is the major factor in PsiWin
connection problems) then you might prefer to stick with
Microsoft.
I believe the main thing is to carefully list the tasks you need
to acomplish, and buy on the basis of which ones can handle those
tasks right now most efficiently.
--
Eric Lindsay http://www.ericlindsay.com/guff
Airlie Beach Qld Australia - Great Barrier Reef entry
Psion & Epoc site http://www.ericlindsay.com/epoc
David Ness
>
> I can no longer restrain myself. Isn't the term "handheld" intended
> to mean a machine with a keyboard? I've always used the term
> "palmtop" to refer to things like PalmPilots which have no keyboard.
>
> -barry
>
I'd restrain myself if I were you. People use words as they wish, and
there are no `God-given' hard and fast rules. Many people use `handheld'
to mean `computer that you can easily hold in your hand' (not surprisingly)
others use the term only for keyboard small machines. Still others
distinguish QWERTY keyboards from ABC keyboards (like the ancient first
generation Psions).
And then if you are being `sticky' you can get into trouble when someone
puts a keyboard on their iPAQ or Palm. Does that convert it into a
`handheld'? It probably doesn't matter much what you call it, so long
as you describe it clearly.
Clearly there's nothing wrong with your usage, but don't be surprised if
others don't choose to draw such rigorous distinctions...
In any case I'd never argue with someone asking for a `keyboard based
handheld'. At worst they are perhaps being redundant, and at best they
avoid any possibility of misunderstanding.
Jack
"Jamie Smith" <jamie...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:p4k8utcu2hc1fg48q...@4ax.com...
If you want to do some serious typing I would have a serious look at the Netbook
from Psion. The netbook is classified as business product and Psion is only
pulling out of the consumer market with the smaller handheld products.
Otherwise most palmtops have keyboards available as add on.
Jamie Smith
However a few folk have mentioned foldable key boards for palms, I had
not realised these where available so I am now back at stage one.
My requirements are as fellows.
keyboard
compatible with microsoft word and excel
good quality screen with high resolution
Good back up for future upgrade/ addons
Internet/ e-mail capabilities
I have had the compaq ipaq h3630 + keyboard recommended to be by a
friend what are the groups views?
TIA
Jamie
Jack
| Thanks for all the replys.
|
| However a few folk have mentioned foldable key boards for palms, I had
| not realised these where available so I am now back at stage one.
|
| My requirements are as fellows.
|
| keyboard
| compatible with microsoft word and excel
| good quality screen with high resolution
| Good back up for future upgrade/ addons
| Internet/ e-mail capabilities
|
|
| I have had the compaq ipaq h3630 + keyboard recommended to be by a
| friend what are the groups views?
I'll be blunt: expensive. All topline handhelds (over 350 pounds) are way
overpriced for their _real_ functionality. Only midrange and lower priced models
are giving the functionality in accordance with their price. With functionality
I mean what you really will use it for. (For some people even a $99 PDA is
already wasted money).
In regards to future upgrades and add-ons you are reaching a touchy area.
Microsoft has shown that you cannot depend on them for future upgrades: their
newest OS does not fit in the ROM of the handhelds released last year. The only
manufacturer commited to add-ons is in my opinion Handspring who has encouraged
thrid parties to develop add-ons, but it is also the manufacturer who does not
provide flash-ROMs in their PDA so the OS cannot be upgraded. AFAIK it is
currently the only one whose handhelds can operate a modem and keyboard at the
same time.
In details:
Keyboards are available for all palmtops
PocketPC and PalmOS 4.0 has native compatibility and PalmOS pre-OS 4.0has
third party compatibility (i.e. buy additional software)
The screens are very dependent on the user. I heard people praising the iPaq
screen as God and I think it is a piece of crap.Just go to a store and see for
yourself what you prefer.
For future upgrades you can trust the manufacturers even less than Osama Bin
Laden (at least you know what his agenda is).
For add-ons only Handspring seems to be really commited however more devices
are showing up for other handhelds too (do compare the prices though and take in
account that the Ipaq need a jacket to use CF cards which is another 40 pounds)
Internet/e-mail capabilities are overvalued. Major surfing is not what you
want to do on a palmtop size (except when you want to show off). Receiving
e-mail, sms-messages are interesting options and maybe even a remote sync with a
databaseserver. So that means you need a modem or GSM with built-in modem.
Sven Utcke
> My requirements are as fellows.
>
> keyboard
Most PDAs. Personally I like the idea of the Palm's folding keyboard
(are these available for wince too?).
> compatible with microsoft word and excel
None. All wince machines come with apps which will allow you to view
and edit very simple WinWord or Excel files. Palms do not come with
these apps, but add-ons are readily (and cheaply or for free)
available.
> good quality screen
This is something you might need to see for yourself, and is very
dependent on whether you are going to use this machine indoors or
outdoors.
> with high resolution
Definitely not Palm. Well, maybe the Handera might be an option...
> Good back up for future upgrade/ addons
More likely with Palms (based on wince's track record), but not very
good either way. However, the user-supported software base is _much_
bigger for Palm's for several reasons.
> Internet/ e-mail capabilities
Hmm. Not something I would want to do regularly on a PDA, I would
guess. winces are probably better for that...
> I have had the compaq ipaq h3630 + keyboard recommended to be by a
> friend what are the groups views?
If you can afford it --- I certainly do not see a machine which would
meet your requirements more (even though the ipaq would not be a
perfect fit either). What about battery life?
Sven
--
_ __ The Cognitive Systems Group
| |/ /___ __ _ ___ University of Hamburg
| ' </ _ \/ _` (_-< phone: +49 (0)40 42883-2576 Vogt-Koelln-Strasse 30
|_|\_\___/\__, /__/ fax : +49 (0)40 42883-2572 D-22527 Hamburg
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Eric Lindsay's spam trap
<jamie...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
>keyboard
Remember that the foldable keyboards need a solid surface for
typing, so if you don't have a desk available, then one of the
solid keyboards may be a better option.
>compatible with microsoft word and excel
How compatible is compatible? Someone can _always_ write a MS
Word or Excel file that the converters can't handle. If you
mostly originate your documents on the PDA, and then clean them
up for final use on the PC, no problems. If they are written on
the PC, use equations and extensive macros, and you want to
change them on the PDA, then lots of luck!
>good quality screen with high resolution
The standard Palm is 160x160. Open a browser or spreadsheet
window that size on your PC and see if you can tolerate it. I
believe the Handera is 240x320 and the Sony 320x320. The
PocketPC are all 240x320, while the keyboard Windows PC varies
but I don't think any are smaller thn 640x240 these days.
>Good back up for future upgrade/ addons
I wouldn't count on that from any of them, although some have
flash rom and upgrades have been made available.
>Internet/ e-mail capabilities
All of them have some capability, but browsing on a small display
is an exercise in frustration. That is why there are so many
attempts at massaging commonly encountered files (like html and
acrobat) into some more PDA friendly format on a PC before
downloading them.
You still need to zero in more on what you will specifically
spend most of your time doing with your PDA. Try to visualise a
typical day. Try to imagine the parts where it will be easier to
wait until you can do the task on a PC, etc.
I've been very happy with my Psion Series 7 (the lower spec
version of the NetBook) as my travel computer (I frequently
travel for months at a time, without access to a PC, and often
out of contact with the phone system, and takes lots of notes).
However what suits people depends on what they need to do.
Jamie Smith
>
>If you can afford it --- I certainly do not see a machine which would
>meet your requirements more (even though the ipaq would not be a
>perfect fit either). What about battery life?
I would have a back up battery and a mains adapter.
Jamie
>Sven
Steve Grotheer
don't know about outer WinCE devices?
Here are some reviews of folding keyboards:
http://www.pocketpcmag.com/Jul01/keyboards.stm
http://www.pocketpcmag.com/Nov00/portakeybds.stm
"Sven Utcke" <ut...@tu-harburg.de> wrote in message
news:vd0elnc...@kogs12.informatik.uni-hamburg.de...
Geoff Parsons Snr.
--
"Jack" <uwland.ho...@excite.com> wrote in message
news:9s6jce$11csih$1...@ID-86123.news.dfncis.de...
>
> "Jamie Smith" <jamie...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
> >
> The screens are very dependent on the user. I heard people praising
the iPaq
> screen as God and I think it is a piece of crap.Just go to a store and see
for
> yourself what you prefer.
++++++++++
I don't agree with you about the Ipaq screen. It is really very bright and
clear. You must have been looking at a faulty one. The only other colour
screen that is as good is the Sony Clie. (also expensive) I believe these
are the only ones that can be read in sunlight and dim light. The Palm 505
is also very good outdoors but awful in doors even with the backlight on. I
definatly agree with you on the price. Way too expensive. But then again you
don't HAVE to buy one :-)
Geoff
Stig Eide
Stig
Russell Cederberg
traveling email. 640 X 240 screen and full-sized, wonderful keyboard. I
tried the Psion 5MX, the Jornada 720 and both were far too small for any
serious input. I don't use the MP for a PIM really, I use a Sony Clie for
that. I tried the foldable keyboard for the Clie, but the screen is so small
that any serious documents (especially spreadsheets) are a cumbersome study
in continuous scrolling. Each to his own though. I have read of many people
who use a Palm and a keyboard with great success. The NEC is rather
expensive new, but are available on Ebay used all the time. Not a huge
difference between the 770 (older color model) and the newest 790. I have
owned both of them.
Russell Cederberg
"Jamie Smith" <jamie...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
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