SuperCPU emulation.
Ramlink666
is fine with the idea, so hopefully it will happen. This will be very
beneficial to everyone as far as I can see, although 20mhz speed might not be
possible just yet!
Shaun.
Todd Elliott
Thank you for your recent replies regarding your surprising stance on
SuperCPU emulation under the VICE suite. I would have easily deduced that
if complete SuperCPU emulation is perfected under VICE, existing hardware
sales of the SuperCPU will drop down to almost nothing.
That said, I hope the volunteer VICE team will implement some form of
SuperCPU emulation for at least the x64 emulator. (It would be nice if the
x128 emulator will have the same capability.) It would be the ideal
development platform for me as I can code for the SuperCPU and debug/test
it easily under an emulated environment. Even the cc65 programming suite
has some form of 65816 support!
However, there seems to be some problems; For starters, the VICE team has
not put in an asynchronous CPU feature for x64/x128 emulators. Even the
x128 emulator does not have the 2MHz 'FAST' mode. The asnycronous aspect
of the VICE suite needs to be resolved first before a 65816 emulation core
can be added to the mix. It may be the case where the code is ill-designed
for asyncronous use and is 100% optimized for syncronous (1MHz) use, and
would entail a substantial code rewrite.
Secondly, the ROM question needs to be addressed; The VICE team could
supposedly modify a CBM Kernal ROM to allow IRQ's to function normally in
any mode (6502/65816), any speed (1MHz, 2MHz or 20MHz) and any memory
bank configuration. Some ROM code other than interrupts may need a tweak
here and there. This way, the SuperCPU ROM need not be included in the
emulation mix. To date, I have not heard of any application that
specifically uses the SuperCPU ROM. Another drawback w/ the customized
Kernal ROM is the lack of JiffyDOS as well.
Next, the VICE team would have to somehow duplicate the SuperCPU's
mirroring features. The VICE suite is already halfway there towards this
goal as the 17xx REU emulation is there. That way, the DMA capability is
already implemented in the emulation code and can be reused for this
purpose.
Then there's the CPU/memory issue; The SuperCPU can address up to 16MB of
RAM and this has to be emulated to some extent. The addition of the 65816
emulation code core introduces added complexity and more possiblity of
code rewrites. I'm sure some existing 'free' 65816 emulation code can be
used from SNES emulators and/or Apple IIGS emulators.
I'm well aware that this has been a largely volunteer endeavor and I am
thankful for the VICE team's programming efforts! I hope members of the
programming team will have the time, expertise and continued labor of love
to add on a 'SuperCPU' emulation of sorts to the stable and highly
compatible x64/x128 emulation suite. However, I am realistic and patient,
I will continue to enjoy the current state of x64/x128 emulators!
Enjoy!
--
Todd Elliott
Michael Hunter
It's been a long time since I've spoken with you. I hope all is going
well :-)
> Thank you for your recent replies regarding your surprising stance
Yes, it was quite a surprising response!!! I never would have thought
I'd hear that one.
> on SuperCPU emulation under the VICE suite. I would have easily
> deduced that if complete SuperCPU emulation is perfected under
> VICE, existing hardware sales of the SuperCPU will drop down to
> almost nothing.
You make a good point there.
Of course, there is the other side to. If more people have access to
the "environment" provided by the SuperCPU, there will almost
certainly be more development. More software for the SuperCPU may
actually result in more people interested in purchasing SuperCPU
units.
As one who has always had a Commodore computer available (since the
VIC-20 was first released), I would personally have a hard time moving
to the use of an emulator for my Commodore computing. Even if the
emulator was the only way I could access the features of the SuperCPU,
I would still use my Commodore computer.
As one who has been patiently waiting for my SuperCPU to be produced
and shipped, I would like to see more great software written to take
advantage of it.
There is a lot of great software out there already, but by making the
device "electronically available" to the masses, it may greatly
increase the number of great programs that take advantage of the
SuperCPU.
Even if the programmers don't have a SuperCPU of their own, they may
tinker with writing programs for it just to experiment with the code.
I know that many times in the past, I studied programming techniques
and languages for machines that I didn't own. It was simply out of
curiousity and interest.
If the Vice Team does take on this challenge, there could be many
great results for the Commodore community.
Michael Hunter
mhu...@videocam.net.au
Rick Balkins
.d64 on CDs and I will make part of the proceeds to support Click Here!
Software. If it means a SHIT load of .d64 files or .d2k (.d64 for FD-2000),
.d4k (.d64 for FD-4000) and .dhd (.d64 for CMD HD partition image or whole
disk image). Who knows, we may wait some of this for a new generation
Commodore PC/C= (or C-One) hybrid to introduce that feature right in the OS.
For cross transfer from real disk to .d64 file format in a painless and
inredibly simple form.
I want that in a new C= from Tulip.
"Michael Hunter" <mhu...@videocam.net.au> wrote in message
news:2x0fc.18877$K_.5...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> Hello Todd,
>
> It's been a long time since I've spoken with you. I hope all is going
> well :-)
>
> Yes, it was quite a surprising response!!! I never would have thought
> I'd hear that one.
>
Ramlink666
"If people are interested in SCPU emulation they should write it
by themselves.
MfG Andreas"
So, it'll be down to someone else then...
Shaun.
Jason
news:20040416121251...@mb-m21.aol.com...
> So, it'll be down to someone else then...
Don't lose hope, that's how you were hoping to get Doom on the SuperCPU
remember? =-)
-- ______________________________ _________________________________
/ /\/ ___/ / ___/ / / ___/\
/ Website: www.cosine.org.uk / / /\_/ / /__ / / / / __/\\/
/ ICQ: 44373717 IRC: TMR{C0S} / / /__/ / / / / / / / / /\
/_____________________________/ /_____/_____/_____/__/__/__/_____/ /
\_____________________________\/\_____\_____\_____\__\__\__\_____\/TMR
Anders Carlsson
>> So, it'll be down to someone else then...
> Don't lose hope, that's how you were hoping to get Doom on the
> SuperCPU remember? =-)
That is a thought, that the team who make a CS-Doom will create
a SuperCPU emulator as well as one would be needed to play the
game. It would probably both be "easier" to do and more versatile
to have than the game itself.
I don't know how Maurice would feel if Commodore Scene instead of
putting money in a Doom pot would reshuffle it into a pot for a
SCPU emulator. Maybe he would not have a problem with someone else
sponsoring the development of something that either might raise or
decrease his sales of the actual product.
--
Anders Carlsson