STonX newbie success
Mickey Boyd
first try. I used WinX to burn a TOS image from my MegaSTE, and encountered
no problems whatsoever (I'm using the Linux binary distribution). Here are
my GEMBench numbers:
============================================
ST TOS 2.06, MiNT not present
Blitter Enabled, NVDI not present
Video Mode = 640 * 400 * 2 Colours
FPU not present
Run and Malloc from STRAM
Ref = ST + Blitter + FPU, ST High
STonX 0.4, 133mHz Pentium
============================================
GEM Dialog Box: 0.725 758%
VDI Text: 2.055 269%
VDI Text Effects: 5.850 252%
VDI Small Text: 2.360 257%
VDI Graphics: 6.640 354%
GEM Window: 0.545 296%
Integer Division: 0.625 2880%
Float Math: 3.360 22%
RAM Access: 0.910 692%
ROM Access: 0.930 677%
Blitting: 0.460 397%
VDI Scroll: 1.315 325%
Justified Text: 1.835 296%
VDI Enquire: 0.745 356%
New Dialogs: 2.060 351%
============================================
Graphics: 355%
CPU: 1067%
Average: 545%
The author mentioned something about having to divide these numbers by two
in some cases, but even then they are impressive. I'm sure they'll get
better when I get NVDI installed. This is on a 133mHz Pentium, ASUS PB-SRAM
cache motherboard, Diamond Stealth 64 VRAM video, BTW.
Those that have access to a UNIX system should definitely check this out.
For more info, see http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/nino/.
--
*****************************************************************************
* Mickey Boyd * Office Phone: (904)644-7167 *
* Systems Administrator * Digital Pager: (904)657-6425 *
* Florida State University * FAX: (904)644-4053 *
* Mathematics Department * http://www.math.fsu.edu/~boyd *
*****************************************************************************
Ian Taylor
>STonX is cool! I just installed it on my Linux box, and it worked on
>the first try. I used WinX to burn a TOS image from my MegaSTE, and
>encountered no problems whatsoever (I'm using the Linux binary
>distribution). Here are my GEMBench numbers:
...
>Float Math: 3.360 22%
Curious. The ST stikes back :)
What applications you got running on it?
Ian_T...@a2w.maus.de The hidden secret of life is
Marinos Yannikos
Ian_T...@a2w.maus.sub.org (Ian Taylor) writes:
>>Float Math: 3.360 22%
>Curious. The ST stikes back :)
That's due to a bug in the bus error stackframe in STonX 0.4 ;-)
(AFAIR, when the FPU detection routine causes a bus error, the return address
is incorrect, which leads to all kinds of weird problems).
Regards,
-nino
--
http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/nino
Adrian Bridgett
:-)
============================================================
Adrian Bridgett (ap...@cam.ac.uk)
------------------------------------------------------------
Windows - the world's first NON-operating system.
============================================================
Darek Mihocka
>
>>STonX is cool! I just installed it on my Linux box, and it worked on
>>the first try. I used WinX to burn a TOS image from my MegaSTE, and
>>encountered no problems whatsoever (I'm using the Linux binary
I'm sure you get a warm fuzzy feeling inside knowing that you've just
pirated your TOS ROMs and have the balls to brag about it on the
Internet. Don't be surprised if some people come knocking on your door
soon.
Unfortunately the makers of legitimate Atari ST emulators (Gemulator,
Magic Mac, Janus, etc) don't have the luxury of selling products that
use pirated TOS ROMs. I'm sure we'd all like to, but because we don't
care to have lawsuits on hands, we use either legitimate TOS ROMs or as
in the case of Magic Mac, write a new OS.
So all I have to say is it's rather foolish of you to go on the Internet
and admit to being a pirate. Unfortunately the makers of STonX don't
appear to have any regard for copyright laws either.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Atari users are all a bunch
of damn pirates.
- Darek
--
==========================================================================
Darek Mihocka, god of PC Xformer and Gemulator, email:bra...@halcyon.com
c/o Branch Always Software, 14150 N.E. 20th St. #302, Bellevue, WA 98007
phone:206-236-0540 fax:206-236-0257 WWW:http://www.halcyon.com/brasoft/
Mark Wilkinson
> Magic Mac, Janus, etc) don't have the luxury of selling products that
> use pirated TOS ROMs. I'm sure we'd all like to, but because we don't
> care to have lawsuits on hands, we use either legitimate TOS ROMs
> or as in the case of Magic Mac, write a new OS.
of TOS. Whereas...
> Internet and admit to being a pirate. Unfortunately the makers of
> STonX don't appear to have any regard for copyright laws either.
STonX does _NOT_ come with a TOS image, it is up to you to use your OWN
copy. It is after all, for private use - I'm sure, for instance, that most
commercial software would not preclude you from installing there latest
program on your laptop _and_ home unit - would _you_ buy two copies?
> I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Atari users are all a bunch
> of damn pirates.
smiley?
Mark
azog
: >Mickey Boyd (bo...@gauss.math.fsu.edu) (bo...@math.fsu.edu) wrote on 14.10.95:
: >
: >>STonX is cool! I just installed it on my Linux box, and it worked on
: >>the first try. I used WinX to burn a TOS image from my MegaSTE, and
: >>encountered no problems whatsoever (I'm using the Linux binary
: I'm sure you get a warm fuzzy feeling inside knowing that you've just
: pirated your TOS ROMs and have the balls to brag about it on the
: Internet. Don't be surprised if some people come knocking on your door
: soon.
I am not sure what is illegal about this. It is his machine, he owns
the machine that the TOS ROMs are in. He didn't go out and get someone
elses machine and make a copy of the ROMs. Most software vendors allow
you to make copies of the software, under some of the following common
stipulations:
The copy is for archival purposes. ie: backup. This doesn't work here.
The copy is to be used on one system AT A TIME. In other words, you
can run multible systems, so long as only one is in use at a time.
Like a laptop versus a desktop. Win95 license allows you to install
Win95 on your desktop at work, and your laptop at home, because there
is a small chance that you are going to use both at the same time.
I would like to know the outcome of this. I currently have two
machines: an STe, that is dead; a Falcon that works. Since STonX
can't use TOS 4.04 (Falcon), I can use the STe. As a matter of fact,
the TOS 2.06 ROMs for the STe are not even in the machine. Since the
machine is dead, if and when I toss it, I still want to keep the
TOS 2.06 since I paid $60 for them.
--
Billy D'Augustine
az...@gti.gti.net
http://www.gti.net/azog/
bre...@hg.uleth.ca
>>
>> I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Atari users are all a bunch
>> of damn pirates.
>>
>
>Being a prospective customer awaiting your NT release, I'm surprised you'ld come on
>the Internet and paste your name on that line. I don't defend pirating, I'm just
>surprised.
>
>If I buy a Gemulator, does that make me a damn pirate because I, too,
>use an Atari?
>
I've said it before, and I'll say it again,, Darek Mihoka is a bitter
little goofball, who doesn't even understand the most basic marketing ideas so
he reacts by blaming the market for his own failings.
I bought Quick ST 2, and it was a *great* product. Then he promised the
world for Version 3, and I bought that too, but it sucked, it was worse than
QST2 . aHis sales flopped because people like me told everyone what a
waste of time it was, unless serious upgrading happened. Is that the market's
fault? Then he passes the product on to the codeheads who claim that Warp 9 is
the most pirated piece of softwre on the face of the planet -- WHAT A LOAD OF
CRAP! Warp 9 wouldn't work with anything! It wouldn't work with Speedo GDOS,
it wouldn't work on the Falcon, it wouldn't work with That's Write (the
Codehead's solution? Buy their word processor too!) and it wouldn't, and for
all I know still doesn't, work with MultiTOS! Besides which, NVDI was far
superior in version 2.5, let alone what they've added to version 3! Imagine,
no bugs, no incompatibilities, an excellent GDOS, hey, this is almost looking
like a quality product... But somehow, people like Darek Mihoka can't get a
basic simple notion though their fat heads -- You can't sell crap unless
someone wants to buy crap, which is good because he's working for Microsoft
now.
Yeah, you're right Darek, we're all a bunch of pirates. That's great for
your public relations, isn't it? Why don't you just admit that you don't know
what you're talking about and stop blaming everybody else because you can't
sell crap. You are nothing but a crybaby.
Jon
P.S. -- If you think this is inflamatory, you should see what I deleted.
Tommi Hietavuo TKKK
: >Mickey Boyd (bo...@gauss.math.fsu.edu) (bo...@math.fsu.edu) wrote on 14.10.95:
: >
: >>STonX is cool! I just installed it on my Linux box, and it worked on
: >>the first try. I used WinX to burn a TOS image from my MegaSTE, and
: >>encountered no problems whatsoever (I'm using the Linux binary
:
:
: I'm sure you get a warm fuzzy feeling inside knowing that you've just
: pirated your TOS ROMs and have the balls to brag about it on the
: Internet. Don't be surprised if some people come knocking on your door
: soon.
: Unfortunately the makers of legitimate Atari ST emulators (Gemulator,
: Magic Mac, Janus, etc) don't have the luxury of selling products that
: use pirated TOS ROMs. I'm sure we'd all like to, but because we don't
: care to have lawsuits on hands, we use either legitimate TOS ROMs or as
: in the case of Magic Mac, write a new OS.
: So all I have to say is it's rather foolish of you to go on the Internet
: and admit to being a pirate. Unfortunately the makers of STonX don't
: appear to have any regard for copyright laws either.
: I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Atari users are all a bunch
: of damn pirates.
What are laws made for? For serving people? Or for something else?
How silly should we really be? Who does this kind of "piracy" _really_
hurt? I'm getting tired of people who read those lawbooks like they
read bible.
It's the spirit, I believe (of the law) - not the exact words.
No, I don't think this person was a pirate - no matter, how many lawyers
might sue him just because they can.
Mostly honesty is honorable and good, but sometimes it is stupid, I
think. Things are never black and white - and copying TOS for some
purpose doesn't make someone a pirate. Writing stuff like this doesn't
make me a pirate, either.
It's funny, you know - the REAL pirates I know all come from the PC-
family. Those heros who boast they NEVER have purchased any single one
piece of software... It's SO easy on the PC-side.........
We Atari-users sometimes have to work hard to find soft- or hardware.
Sometimes it's impossible to find something necessary legally. What do
people do then? Change platform? On PC-side they could copy their
MS Words, Windows programs, games, everything, easily - and nobody
would care. Why is it US who are the "damn pirates"?
Should Atarians give up their machines if they don't find a legal
TOS - and join the paradise of pirates: DOS-world?
Really: what would you want people to do? You have to have software
for your computer, don't you? The machine itself _is_ useless!
I think we're even too honest sometimes - and that might hurt us
sometimes...
I don't like these kinds of "damn pirates" -messages, because they
simply are NOT true!
Greetings,
Tommi (not a pirate - but sometimes life on PC-side would be easier..)
Thorsten Guenther
>>Mickey Boyd (bo...@gauss.math.fsu.edu) (bo...@math.fsu.edu) wrote on 14.10.95:
>>
>>>STonX is cool! I just installed it on my Linux box, and it worked on
>>>the first try. I used WinX to burn a TOS image from my MegaSTE, and
>>>encountered no problems whatsoever (I'm using the Linux binary
>
>
>I'm sure you get a warm fuzzy feeling inside knowing that you've just
>pirated your TOS ROMs and have the balls to brag about it on the
>Internet. Don't be surprised if some people come knocking on your door
>soon.
Mr. Mihocka,
- he is using one (1) copy of TOS at the same time only, for he's only
able to use one computer at the same time
- he has legally purchased TOS with his MegaSTE
Thus he is not a pirate, or gemulator runs a priated (copy from board to
RAM) TOS 2.06, too.
IMHO this article will have a bad impact on Gemulator sales. People will
think twice before they decide to buy something from a guy who calls
"piracy" what isn't considered as such by them.
>I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Atari users are all a bunch
>of damn pirates.
And you have outed yourself.
Thorsten
--
- guen...@cabal.shnet.org (Thorsten Günther) - _O
----ä=ae--ö=oe--ü=ue--Ä=Ae--Ö=Oe--Ü=Ue--ß=sz---- /
\
)
Thorsten Guenther
[To Darek "Pirates!" Mihocka]
>PS. Good luck with GEMulator - you'll need it when the competition from
>Germany is released (an Emulator for DOS, and no, I can't say more about it).
He already has probs. While Janus is more expensive, it needs much less
processing power (coming with it's own 68k or 020) and IT SUPPORTS TRUE
COLOUR, while the gemulator is apparently limited to the outdated 16
colours of the original ST series.
Eric Hall
> I'm sure you get a warm fuzzy feeling inside knowing that you've just
> pirated your TOS ROMs and have the balls to brag about it on the
> Internet.
Talk about "balls"! DM accusing someone _else_ of piracy! Hehehehe....
How soon they forget.... "Memories.... of the way we were..." Hehehe....
> Don't be surprised if some people come knocking on your door soon.
Ahhhh... Now you've gone and frightened him Derek. Are you sending out
the Micro$loth goons to harass a guy for legally copying his _own_ ATARI
OS for use in his _own_ equipment, at precisely the same time that his
Atari is turned off???
Or did you think ATARI (chuckle) was going to check up on the 'legal' use
a single copy of an operating system they abandoned years ago!
>I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Atari users are all a bunch
>of damn pirates.
This makes such good copy ;-). Talk about POT..KETTLE..BLACK syndrome or
'people in glass houses.. throwing stones' or well we all get the picture
I'm sure. Just pissed that MS doesn't make anything worth pirating and
you get it all _free_ now anyway.... takes all the fun out of it, eh?
**disclaimer** No slight of DM's character is intended or implied by any-
thing in this posting. As opposed to DM who feels free to call _all_
Atari users (and DM must include himself in that group!), _pirates_.... I
would _never_ insinuate anything similar with respect to DM (uh_huh ;-)
BTW, Derek.... still got the parrot and the eye-patch?
Raymond Collins
I all actually Atari is no longer producing computers; however, they have
licensed TOS to 3rd party developers. Thus TOS has not been abandoned.
A great deal of Atari's technology is still under legal action, ie. the Sega
and Atari suite was settled out of court. Sega gained additional licenses to
Atari's technology and Sega is buying 4.7 million shares of Atari stock over a
set period of time.
Enough said.
| Raymond Collins | Atari TT030 4/4MB ST/TT RAM 245 HD |
| | Travel via ZyXEL, 28.8 V.34 |
| rcol...@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu|2MB CyREL, Sunrise M16-1280 video card|
| rcol...@freenet.columbus.oh.us | Die Hard Atarian since 1983 |
azog
: Or did you think ATARI (chuckle) was going to check up on the 'legal' use
: a single copy of an operating system they abandoned years ago!
I don't agree with the original statement that using a TOS image for
STonX is illegal (frankly, its a foolish statement), but this above
statement needs some reflection. A copyright lawyer can give you more
details, but from what I understand, even tho a company has abandonded a
system, they still retain the rights to that system. Just because Atari no
longer supports TOS does not automatically void that copyright.
Tderrick
TH> Mostly honesty is honorable and good, but sometimes it is
TH> stupid, I think.
TH> Really: what would you want people to do? You have to have
TH> software for your computer, don't you? The machine itself
TH> _is_ useless! I think we're even too honest sometimes - and
TH> that might hurt us sometimes...
Tommi, I have enjoyed your posts in the past, and respect your
thoughts, mostly. But I have to take issue with you on this point.
I believe in honesty wholeheartedly. Your "what are people to do"
attitude is wrong, IMHO. If you can't find the software you need and
want, learn to write it, damn it. If it is a game, too bad. Nobody,
nobody, nobody _needs_ a game!
There is no excuse for piracy.
"The Poor Deluded Soul" - tder...@acpu.com
... Don't take life so seriously... It isn't permanent
___ Mountain Reader II - #00000077
Tommi Hietavuo TKKK
: thie...@news.abo.fi (Tommi Hietavuo TKKK) spake thusly:
:
: Tommi, I have enjoyed your posts in the past, and respect your
: thoughts, mostly. But I have to take issue with you on this point.
:
: I believe in honesty wholeheartedly. Your "what are people to do"
: attitude is wrong, IMHO. If you can't find the software you need and
: want, learn to write it, damn it. If it is a game, too bad. Nobody,
: nobody, nobody _needs_ a game!
I respect your view, too. These are very difficult questions, and it's
awfully easy to misunderstand people's opinions. This question of
honesty touches our deepest attitudes. Some people would literally die
before breaking the laws. Not many, but some... And some would break
any laws, no matter how sensible or crazy those were. Most of us, I guess
, try to be honest - but at the same time listen to our heart and brain.
And because of that, sometimes one disagrees with some laws. Should
people have obeyed, e.g. Nazi-German laws? I guess, not. Not always,
at least. Not, if one is human. But yes, if one is 100% lawful =-( ...
I myself can't accept the idea of being honest just for honesty's sake.
It has to mean something to someone. Words are only words. In this case
of TOS/STonX I just can't see the loser - either economically, or in any
other way. I only see winners: people who might have to change their
computer platform (expensive, and often unpleasant..) have a chance to
use their familiar Atari software on a UNIX computer. Atari wouldn't
benefit much, I think, if those people couldn't find the legal TOS
-versions anywhere, and decided that "Well, too much trouble - I'll
buy a Mac, or a PC..".
: : There is no excuse for piracy.
You may be right, but world is complex. Sometimes something that looks
black appears to be white in the end - and vice versa.. But it's good
to talk and share different opinions.
: "The Poor Deluded Soul" - tder...@acpu.com
Greetings,
TH
Eric Noss
> >I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Atari users are all a bunch
> >of d**n pirates.
>
> I say you're just p***ed of because you might loose sales to a competitor.
Competition from a freeware author? Wow, that's a new one. I always
fantised about writing a better DOS compatible OS for the PC and giving
it out as shareware just to tick Gates off :)
Eric Noss
a.k.a
Mr. Maddog
Eric Noss
> Eric Hall (eric...@io.org) wrote:
>
> : Or did you think ATARI (chuckle) was going to check up on the 'legal' use
> : a single copy of an operating system they abandoned years ago!
>
> I don't agree with the original statement that using a TOS image for
> STonX is illegal (frankly, its a foolish statement), but this above
> statement needs some reflection. A copyright lawyer can give you more
> details, but from what I understand, even tho a company has abandonded a
> system, they still retain the rights to that system. Just because Atari no
> longer supports TOS does not automatically void that copyright.
I will have to agree, Atari has even gone after big companies like Sega
for using techiniques for games on the 2600. Again, when is something
piracy(when you copy and give something to other people), and when do you
need to use a certain program on an emulated system? BTW, I disagree
with pirating programs for profit or to give to others for nothing. So
what do we call running TOS 2.06 on Linux and 8-bit cartridges on
Xformer?
Phil Hough
bra...@coho.halcyon.com (Darek Mihocka) said:-
>>Mickey Boyd (bo...@gauss.math.fsu.edu) (bo...@math.fsu.edu) wrote on 14.10.95:
>>
>>>STonX is cool! I just installed it on my Linux box, and it worked on
>>>the first try. I used WinX to burn a TOS image from my MegaSTE, and
>>>encountered no problems whatsoever (I'm using the Linux binary
>
>
>I'm sure you get a warm fuzzy feeling inside knowing that you've just
>pirated your TOS ROMs and have the balls to brag about it on the
>Internet. Don't be surprised if some people come knocking on your door
>soon.
You call that priacy ??? I really think not, they are his TOS ROMS, in
his computer, and he isn't using the copy and the original at the
same time, so he isn't pirating them. If he started to modify the
copy, or sold/distributed it THEN it would be piracy.
>
>Unfortunately the makers of legitimate Atari ST emulators (Gemulator,
>Magic Mac, Janus, etc) don't have the luxury of selling products that
>use pirated TOS ROMs. I'm sure we'd all like to, but because we don't
>care to have lawsuits on hands, we use either legitimate TOS ROMs or as
>in the case of Magic Mac, write a new OS.
>
>So all I have to say is it's rather foolish of you to go on the Internet
>and admit to being a pirate. Unfortunately the makers of STonX don't
>appear to have any regard for copyright laws either.
The people who wrote STonX didn't actually pirate any ROMs did they
??? Or are you accusing them of piracy also ???
>
>I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Atari users are all a bunch
>of damn pirates.
>
>- Darek
So what you are actually doing is coming onto an Atari usenet group
and accusing every single atari own er reading it of piracy ??? are
you stupid or something. Sounds to me like you are bitter about
something ??
If we are having a legal argument over pircay of ROMS, does anyone
know how us atari users stand on being able to sue for the above
statement ???
If you think atari users pirate software, you really aught to see some
PC users at work, from what I've seen, there are a hell of a lot of PC
users who pirate software also.
I hope you aren't going to try and sell anything to atari users in the
future !!! can you really imagine an (ex?)atari owner buying gemulator
from someone that calls him/her a pirate ??? Dream on !!!
Seems to me that if you EVER write anyhthing even ST related then you
are going to lose a lot of sales to atari owners, especially as many
of my non-interneting friends will recieve a warning about your
soft/hardware, and how you have great respect for your potential
customers, NOT !!!
If you are pissed off about how you can;t sell stuff then just shut up
and go crawl into a hole, theres no point blaming the makers of STonX
just 'cause they are honest enough to make their stuff freeware.
Its people making statements like this that REALLY piss me off, if you
don't like Atari users then just piss off and find someone else to
buy your stuff. And just home they don't pirate it !!!
Phil H
__
----------------
Email Phil Hough:
<ph...@phil4.demon.co.uk>
Phil Hough
Heck, a lot of napalm being chucked around in this subject. Hows
about someone trying to prise a verdict/suggestion/comment out of
Atari, how do they feel about their OS being used, and more
importantly do they think its illegal ?
I know that atari have dumped their computers, but I'm sure someone
out there could get someone from atari to speak.
Please, someone lets get at least part of this argument settled.
Tderrick
TH> Should people have obeyed, e.g. Nazi-German laws?
It depends, as so many things do, on whether your government is
legitimate or not. Mine (USA) seems to be pretty borderline.
My grandfather had a reputation for 1: bitching about silly laws and
2: Obeying them. But there is big difference between silly laws and
catastrophic laws.
I consider the laws that have grown up around the computer to be
pretty legitimate - and I wish that we had had them in place years
ago, back when certain parties were dealing fast and loose with the
intent of copyright laws.
This example of the horror that was Nazi Germany is over-used,
Tommi. (And my apologies to our German friends in csas.) Their laws
allowed or required atrocities. Our current copyright laws do
neither, IMHO.
I reiterate that it is this attitude, that of "I bought this
computer, now I deserve software, no matter what I have to do to get
it" coupled with "I don't have the money, so somebody ought to give
it to me", that rankles me. And it is this attitude which drives the
free-lance socialists on all computer platforms to steal the
products of another man's time, brains, and sweat.
That certain people "pirate" their bought and paid for TOS Roms for
their own private use in something like STonX, I consider trivial.
Probably Atari Corp does, too. The legal questions spawned here may
keep the courts busy, and lawyers buying summer homes, for quite a
while. Since, as others have pointed out, the question is in our
"fair use" and "product liability" laws, don't look for a resolution
any time soon.
I don't think it is very hard to comply with the law for the "STonX
Newbie" - one computer, one user is hard _not_ to comply with
(unless he starts giving away or selling the TOS disk images). I
think you and I would both agree that _that_ would be both a legal
violation and morally wrong.
... For people who like peace & quiet: a phoneless cord.
Marinos Yannikos
Such a DOS-clone is already available - a bunch of hackers wrote it somewhere
in an East-European country. I can't recall its name though. :-/
Marinos Yannikos
cla...@hpbbn.bbn.hp.com (Claus Brod) writes:
>Phil Hough (ph...@phil4.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>: So what you are actually doing is coming onto an Atari usenet group
>
>something in a private e-mail message and was quoted here. Please
>correct me if I'm wrong.
You are wrong...
Try <46ggrc$r...@news1.halcyon.com>:
--- 8< ---
>From: bra...@coho.halcyon.com (Darek Mihocka)
>Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
>Subject: Re: STonX newbie success
>Date: 23 Oct 1995 16:45:32 GMT
>Organization: Branch Always Software
>[...]
>So all I have to say is it's rather foolish of you to go on the Internet
>and admit to being a pirate. Unfortunately the makers of STonX don't
>appear to have any regard for copyright laws either.
>[...]
>I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Atari users are all a bunch
>of damn pirates.
>- Darek
--- >8 ---
-nino
--
http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/nino
Eric Noss
Kewl, I would love to see that! I can imagine Bill Gate$ getting on the
newsgroup(from MSN of course) and saying PC users are all pirates :)
(He actually did that when he realease GW Basic for the Altair and
everybody had a free copy already. That really soured his rep, even to
this day.)
Thorsten Guenther
>Phil Hough (ph...@phil4.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>: So what you are actually doing is coming onto an Atari usenet group
>: and accusing every single atari own er reading it of piracy ???
>
>AFAIK, Darek didn't post anything about this to this group. He wrote
>something in a private e-mail message and was quoted here. Please
>correct me if I'm wrong.
You are.
Check out <46ggrc$r...@news1.halcyon.com>.
Marinos Yannikos
cla...@hpbbn.bbn.hp.com (Claus Brod) writes:
>[...]
>In any case, there is definitely nothing illegal in Marinos writing
>an ST emulator even if there might be a small legal risk (note I'm
>not saying that there really is one) for anyone actually using it
>with a copy of their TOS. Therefore, I want to encourage you to
>carry on this cool project instead of wasting time on hypothetical
>legal issues.
Thanks for clarifying this and for the encouragement. :-) In fact, I just
wasted a whole night STonX's serial line support.
>On the other hand, us users might want to contact Atari for an
>agreement on using TOS with STonX - if you don't mind, Marinos,
>that is.
Not at all. The more influential the people who ask are, the better. ;-)
Michael Grove
I purchased Atari DOS II from B&C along with ST-Xformer
and cable. The first thing I noticed was that included
on the ST-Xformer disk was two other types of 8-bit
dos's ( I forget the names). So was I suppose to
purchase two dos II copies, one for the ST and one for
the 8-bit's to utilize this software on my 1040ST,
as we usually run them at the same time? Am I a
pirate? Was it legal to include the other dos's
on the ST-Xformer disk?
I haven't read this thread before, but I am actually
shocked by DM's statement. I was thinking of purchasing
Gemulator 4, but tomorrow i'm pulling the
2.06 roms out of my 486, trashing the Gemulator, and
upgrading my new MegaST. Shit, I may even trash the 486.
Michael Grove
Many Atari's
Chris Gray
In article <DHrt7...@ridgecrest.ca.us>, Michael Grove <mgr...@owens.ridgecrest.ca.us> writes:
> [...] I haven't read this thread before, but I am actually
> Gemulator 4, but tomorrow i'm pulling the
> 2.06 roms out of my 486, trashing the Gemulator, and
> upgrading my new MegaST. Shit, I may even trash the 486.
No need to be that extreme ... just install Linux/X on it, and use it
to run STonX. ;>
Now if STonX would work with Magic we could forget most of this
silliness ...
--
__________________________________________________________________________
Chris Gray Chris...@bcs.org.uk Compuserve: 100065,2102
http://plato.digiweb.com/kiffer/
Opinions expressed are purely personal unless otherwise stated.
__________________________________________________________________________
Eric Noss
> In any case, there is definitely nothing illegal in Marinos writing
> an ST emulator even if there might be a small legal risk (note I'm
> not saying that there really is one) for anyone actually using it
> with a copy of their TOS. Therefore, I want to encourage you to
> carry on this cool project instead of wasting time on hypothetical
> legal issues.
Here's another idea will could try, what if you can install MagiC to run
on STonX? To be honest, if you're going to get a multitasking ST system
with a seperate desktop then getting TOS 2.06 would be a bit of an over kill.
Maybe someone can write a small program that loads MagiC in memory or the
programmers could even write a version that works on STonX. Ethier way,
the makers of STonX can get their money and people can still have ST
emulation on their Unix box :)
> On the other hand, us users might want to contact Atari for an
> agreement on using TOS with STonX - if you don't mind, Marinos,
> that is.
Or maybe someone can ask them to put TOS on disk like MS-DOS. The TOS on
ROM's work well on the ST's and even the emulators that use PC cards, but
for an emulator that's free and runs on different platforms this would
make it an easier idea than just having to install the chip only to use
it once to get a image file. See, I keep coming up with good ideas :)
d69stu
everything, then dump it up here! That would put the world out of sinc ...
Eric Noss
> My son just purchased two 800XL's and a 130XE.
> I purchased Atari DOS II from B&C along with ST-Xformer
> and cable. The first thing I noticed was that included
> on the ST-Xformer disk was two other types of 8-bit
> dos's ( I forget the names). So was I suppose to
> purchase two dos II copies, one for the ST and one for
> the 8-bit's to utilize this software on my 1040ST,
> as we usually run them at the same time? Am I a
> pirate? Was it legal to include the other dos's
> on the ST-Xformer disk?
You may have to get some sort of Atari DOS on ST-Xfomrer, though the only
use I see for it is conversion between 8-bit and ST files. Of course,
PC-Xformer comes with some DOS's on the virtual disk files. But you can
copy even cracked files of cart games on his emulator and it's "legal".
Go figure...
> I haven't read this thread before, but I am actually
> shocked by DM's statement. I was thinking of purchasing
> Gemulator 4, but tomorrow i'm pulling the
> 2.06 roms out of my 486, trashing the Gemulator, and
> upgrading my new MegaST. S**t, I may even trash the 486.
Keep the PC only if you can't do a task on the ST. Geez, if you only get
products from people who are nice & friendly to their customers(and not
try to be macho compared to the competition), you wouldn't have anything
PC at all.
Oliver Steinmeier
Eric Noss <en...@planetx.bloomu.edu> wrote:
>programmers could even write a version that works on STonX. Ethier way,
>the makers of STonX can get their money and people can still have ST
>emulation on their Unix box :)
What money?
Oliver
Gaven Miller
> On 3 Nov 1995, Marinos Yannikos wrote:
> > In article <Pine.SUN.3.91.951029...@planetx.bloomu.edu>,
> > Eric Noss <en...@planetx.bloomu.edu> writes:
> > >On Thu, 26 Oct 1995, Patrik Sanfridsson wrote:
> > >> I say you're just p***ed of because you might loose sales to a
> > >> competitor.
> > >
> > >Competition from a freeware author? Wow, that's a new one. I always
> > >fantised about writing a better DOS compatible OS for the PC and giving
> > >it out as shareware just to tick Gates off :)
> >
> > Such a DOS-clone is already available - a bunch of hackers wrote it
> > somewhere in an East-European country. I can't recall its name though.
> > :-/
Wasn't that a product called "4DOS" as a DOS 4 replacement? (Or, as others
tell me, it may have been a replacement command interpreter ("command.com"
was somewhat lame in DOS 4)).
> Kewl, I would love to see that! I can imagine Bill Gate$ getting on the
> newsgroup(from MSN of course) and saying PC users are all pirates :)
> (He actually did that when he realease GW Basic for the Altair and
> everybody had a free copy already. That really soured his rep, even to
> this day.)
> Eric Noss
> a.k.a
> Mr. Maddog
--
If I am wrong, flame AOL.
If I am right, flame AOL.
What the hell, just flame AOL.
Oliver Steinmeier
Gaven Miller <gmi...@inca.co.nz> wrote:
>Wasn't that a product called "4DOS" as a DOS 4 replacement? (Or, as others
>tell me, it may have been a replacement command interpreter ("command.com"
>was somewhat lame in DOS 4)).
It's a command shell, and as such replaces COMMAND.COM.
Oliver