New Mystery Boards
Jeff Lemke
weekend, (with no documentation of course), that I'd like to find out
the specifics of, or just what they're for in some cases.
Board 1: Dated 1982
"GSP" is silkscreened in large letters in the upper left. "Artwork
PC19845, Rev. B, Model GTP-245" is written on the other side. There is
a Z8530PC chip on the board, and two 25-pin cables coming from "Port A"
and "Port B".
Board 2:
There is a 34-pin connector, 8 LED lights in two pairs of 4, numbered
1-4 and 5-8, and 4 DIP switches. Board is labled only with "FAB 830125
Rev. B". A modem card?
Board 3: Very unusual looking.
Labled as "MMI DAC Board, Temporal Acuity Products Inc." There are RCA
"Spkr. Out" and "Aux. Out" jacks, and a long sliding lever on one end of
the board which I presume is supposed to stick out of the back of the
Apple through a slot. Obviously this is some type of sound board, but
if anyone has any more specific information, please fill me in.
Board 4:
Labled as "Voice Input Module" by "Voice Machine Communications". There
is another daughterboard (but not piggybacked) connected to this board
by two 16-pin cables.
Board 5:
This is the only board that's fairly straightforward in purpose - it's a
Titan Technologies "Accelerator IIe". Does anybody know how it compares
to the Applied Engineering accelerator for the IIe?
Jeff Lemke
TWS
Mystery Cards, and reguarding the Hardware you are interested in buying from
me.
Sandy
David Empson
> I have come across some Apple II boards in an archeaological dig this
> weekend, (with no documentation of course), that I'd like to find out
> the specifics of, or just what they're for in some cases.
>
> Board 1: Dated 1982
> "GSP" is silkscreened in large letters in the upper left. "Artwork
> PC19845, Rev. B, Model GTP-245" is written on the other side. There is
> a Z8530PC chip on the board, and two 25-pin cables coming from "Port A"
> and "Port B".
Doesn't ring any bells, but the Z8530 is the SCC, which is the serial
chip used on the IIgs motherboard (and in the Mac). It is obviously a
serial interface card of some kind.
It doesn't sound like an Apple II Workstation Card, because that clearly
says Apple on it, has lots of other major chips including a 65C02
processor and an ASIC, and it uses 10 pin connectors.
I'm not aware of any other SCC-based serial cards. It won't be
hardware-compatible with the Super Serial Card, but it might support the
firmware interface (rather limited).
Since the Z8530 supports data formats other than asynchronous, it might
be a network interface card, but the cables (and presumably DB-25
connectors?) point more towards a standard interface card.
> Board 2:
> There is a 34-pin connector, 8 LED lights in two pairs of 4, numbered
> 1-4 and 5-8, and 4 DIP switches. Board is labled only with "FAB 830125
> Rev. B". A modem card?
34 pins implies it might be an interface for an IBM PC floppy disk
drive, though the LEDs are puzzling. Any identifiable chips on it? An
EPROM programmer perhaps (with external box missing)?
> Board 3: Very unusual looking.
> Labled as "MMI DAC Board, Temporal Acuity Products Inc." There are RCA
> "Spkr. Out" and "Aux. Out" jacks, and a long sliding lever on one end of
> the board which I presume is supposed to stick out of the back of the
> Apple through a slot. Obviously this is some type of sound board, but
> if anyone has any more specific information, please fill me in.
DAC = Digital to Analog Converter, i.e. sound output. I guess the lever
is a volume setting. Haven't heard of this one either.
> Board 4:
> Labled as "Voice Input Module" by "Voice Machine Communications". There
> is another daughterboard (but not piggybacked) connected to this board
> by two 16-pin cables.
Pass. Possibly a phrase recognition system for some kind of control
system, or a simple analog input card which is optimized for digitizing
the speech range of the spectrum (telephone quality)?
> Board 5:
> This is the only board that's fairly straightforward in purpose - it's a
> Titan Technologies "Accelerator IIe". Does anybody know how it compares
> to the Applied Engineering accelerator for the IIe?
An older product, I believe. I've only ever used ZIP chips in a IIe, so
I don't know enough about the card-based accelerators to comment.
--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz
Snail mail: P.O. Box 27-103, Wellington, New Zealand
Labelas Enoreth
Listed chips on the board which caught my attention...
*'Little Blue Limited' "PC Transporter" Applied Engineering
Has passthrough cables onto the speaker, keyboard, and modulator (?) pins
on the motherboard of the IIe.
It's got, let's see, a NEC v30 8710WK, I9591 V6T7737-6009 745V, and a
VLSI 8835AZ X1001I VC2849 as chips which catch my attention, along
with other miscellanous PROMs and stuff. 19-pin female connector on rear.
(This is...a PC Compatibility card for the Apple IIe <?!?!>...any idea on
where one can find an external 5.25 which attaches to it? or the software
for it?)
*Apple Computer 1990 'Sandwich II'
Some PROMs with serial numbers and APPLE89 on them
NCR CP02764 8924A
AMI 9002MAH C17656
25-pin female connector on back of computer.
*ALS Z-card
Z80B cpu, 10 socketed PRAMs, 4 DIP siwtches
*ALS Z-engine
Z80B cpu, 3 socketed PROMs, 5 soldered
(looks like perhaps a lower-end version of the first I guess)
Any idea on these? I'm assuming the Z80 cards are for CP/M, since that's
like the only good use for a Z80 in a IIe that I can think of...? But no
software, so dunno what they do. (can I use a CP/M boot disk from, say,
another CP/M card and have it work with them?) And that Little Blue card
makes me really curious.
Oh, hey, got a mem board as well, 32 ILM41256AP-12 chips
I saw 256, but there's no way that it is 8192kB for a IIe, right? What am
I misreading...
Randy Shackelford
: *Apple Computer 1990 'Sandwich II'
: Some PROMs with serial numbers and APPLE89 on them
: NCR CP02764 8924A
: AMI 9002MAH C17656
: 25-pin female connector on back of computer.
That's a high speed SCSI card.
: Oh, hey, got a mem board as well, 32 ILM41256AP-12 chips
: I saw 256, but there's no way that it is 8192kB for a IIe, right? What am
: I misreading...
That's a 1 mb memory card. 41256 chips are 256Kx1 bit memory, so it takes
eight chips to make 256K. Four sets of eight add up to a megabyte. You
didn't say what type of memory card, e.g. slinky, RAMworks, IIgs.
--
Offsite mail to this host gets nuked.
Neil Parker
Labelas Enoreth <lab...@hotmail.com> wrote:
}Hey, don't mean to cut in, but I have some mystery card of my own...
}Listed chips on the board which caught my attention...
}*'Little Blue Limited' "PC Transporter" Applied Engineering
}Has passthrough cables onto the speaker, keyboard, and modulator (?) pins
}on the motherboard of the IIe.
}It's got, let's see, a NEC v30 8710WK, I9591 V6T7737-6009 745V, and a
}VLSI 8835AZ X1001I VC2849 as chips which catch my attention, along
}with other miscellanous PROMs and stuff. 19-pin female connector on rear.
}(This is...a PC Compatibility card for the Apple IIe <?!?!>...any idea on
}where one can find an external 5.25 which attaches to it? or the software
}for it?)
It is indeed a PC compatibility card. It's basically an XT on a board.
}*ALS Z-card
}Z80B cpu, 10 socketed PRAMs, 4 DIP siwtches
}*ALS Z-engine
}Z80B cpu, 3 socketed PROMs, 5 soldered
}(looks like perhaps a lower-end version of the first I guess)
}
}Any idea on these? I'm assuming the Z80 cards are for CP/M, since that's
}like the only good use for a Z80 in a IIe that I can think of...? But no
}software, so dunno what they do. (can I use a CP/M boot disk from, say,
}another CP/M card and have it work with them?)
Usually, with Z80 cards, you can't use any other card's boot disks. But
one or both of the ALS cards might be a clone of the Microsoft Softcard, in
which case the Microsoft boot disks would work with it.
}Oh, hey, got a mem board as well, 32 ILM41256AP-12 chips
}I saw 256, but there's no way that it is 8192kB for a IIe, right? What am
}I misreading...
More likely you have 1 MB. The number "41256" looks like a 256K x 1 chip--
i.e. it has 256K *bits*, not bytes. So effectively you have 32K bytes per
chip, for a total of 1024KB, or 1 MB.
- Neil Parker
--
Neil Parker, npa...@ssil.uoregon.edu, npa...@axis.llx.com,
http://axis.llx.com/~nparker/ (Note new addresses and home page!)
Unsolicited commercial e-mail is not welcome, and will be discarded unread.
Louis Schulman
>Labelas Enoreth <lab...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>That's a 1 mb memory card. 41256 chips are 256Kx1 bit memory, so it takes
>eight chips to make 256K. Four sets of eight add up to a megabyte.
Or for the really simple minded, the "256" means 256 BITS. There are 8 bits
to a BYTE, so you have to divide the number of bits by 8 to get the number
of bytes.
Louis
Labelas Enoreth
In article <712tqt$sr4$1...@opal.southwind.net>, Randy Shackelford
<sh...@onyx.southwind.net> wrote:
> Labelas Enoreth <lab...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> : *Apple Computer 1990 'Sandwich II'
> : Some PROMs with serial numbers and APPLE89 on them
> : NCR CP02764 8924A
> : AMI 9002MAH C17656
> : 25-pin female connector on back of computer.
>
> That's a high speed SCSI card.
>
> : Oh, hey, got a mem board as well, 32 ILM41256AP-12 chips
> : I saw 256, but there's no way that it is 8192kB for a IIe, right? What am
> : I misreading...
>
> That's a 1 mb memory card. 41256 chips are 256Kx1 bit memory, so it takes
Labelas Enoreth
I originally thought it was in bits, but when I explained the card to
someone, they kept insisting it was 256 kilobytes per chip, which I
thought sounded funny to me, since 8mb in a IIe would most likely be
decadent and wasteful, and thusly, I took it here to see.
David Empson
> Hey, don't mean to cut in, but I have some mystery card of my own...
> Listed chips on the board which caught my attention...
> *'Little Blue Limited' "PC Transporter" Applied Engineering
Well that isn't exactly a mystery - it tells you right on the card what
it is. :-)
In effect it is a PC/XT clone, using an NEC V30 processor (80186
instruction set, faster than an 8088) running at 7.3 MHz (ish).
It can be used in an Apple II+, IIe or IIgs, with the appropriate
adaptor kit.
For the II+, you need:
- External IBM keyboard adaptor and keyboard
- Speaker passthrough cable
- Video override cable
For the IIe, you need:
- IIe keyboard intercept cable/circuit board
- Speaker passthrough cable
- Video override cable
For the IIgs, you need:
- ColorSwitch video card and cables
The IIe and IIgs also have the option of using a real IBM keyboard if
you have the adaptor cable.
All machines have the option of using a genuine CGA monitor with the
right adaptor cable, and you can connect an adapator cable which goes to
a D-19 connector for hooking up floppy drives (TransDrive 5.25",
TransDrive 3.5", or Apple 3.5 Drive).
The card also supports an optional 8087 maths coprocessor chip, and up
to 768K of RAM (preinstalled on the later version, can be added in 256K
multiples on the original version using ZIL RAM, if I remember right).
128K of the RAM is used up for system functions (including BIOS and
video memory), leaving you with 640K of usable RAM when in PC mode.
The main function of the card is to run PC software on the Apple II. It
takes over the machine while running, borrowing Apple peripherals
(serial ports, mouse, keyboard, hard drive) for many activities.
It can also be used as a RAM disk and disk controller while the machine
is being used normally as an Apple II.
To do anything with it, you'll need the software (it has no ROM), which
comes on a single 3.5" disk or at least three 5.25" disks. The main
component is a program called AEPC.SYSTEM, but there are a lot of
associated files including drivers for various Apple peripherals.
In theory, it is possible to connect any PC 360K 5.25" drive or 720K
3.5" drive to the card, but you need to wire the cable up correctly and
I don't have any information on this. PC drives have to be powered
externally.
To get around these problems, Applied Engineering sold the "TransDrive",
which is an external enclosure holding one or two 5.25" or 3.5" drives
(also supplied by AE).
> *Apple Computer 1990 'Sandwich II'
> Some PROMs with serial numbers and APPLE89 on them
> NCR CP02764 8924A
> AMI 9002MAH C17656
> 25-pin female connector on back of computer.
This is an Apple High-Speed SCSI card, which can be used to connect SCSI
hard drives and a very limited range of SCSI CD-ROM drives to a IIgs or
enhanced IIe. (It also supports Apple's 40MB tape drive and original
scanner, but software support for these is almost nonexistant.)
It uses DMA (direct memory access) to get much higher transfer rates
than older SCSI cards. On the IIe, its maximum transfer rate is 500
kilobytes per second (it can go twice as fast as this if used in a
IIgs).
It isn't the fastest card around: the RamFast SCSI card is significantly
faster on a IIe or when running ProDOS-8 on a IIgs, due to its on-card
caching. (It is also easier to set up, and supports a wider variety of
devices, though the Apple card is more compatible with recent SCSI hard
drives.)
> *ALS Z-card
> Z80B cpu, 10 socketed PRAMs, 4 DIP siwtches
Presumably a Z80 card for running CP/M. Never really used these, so I
can't comment much.
> Any idea on these? I'm assuming the Z80 cards are for CP/M, since that's
> like the only good use for a Z80 in a IIe that I can think of...? But no
> software, so dunno what they do. (can I use a CP/M boot disk from, say,
> another CP/M card and have it work with them?)
In general, no. Each CP/M card has its own unique way of interacting
with the Apple II, though I expect some of the later ones emulate
corresponding earlier ones.
> Oh, hey, got a mem board as well, 32 ILM41256AP-12 chips
> I saw 256, but there's no way that it is 8192kB for a IIe, right? What am
> I misreading...
256 kiloBITS not kiloBYTES per chip. 32 chips gives you 1 megabyte of
RAM. Can you see a manufacturer's name anywhere on it, and which type
of slot does it fit into?
If it goes in a standard slot (50 pin connector), then it is probably an
Apple II Memory Expansion Card (from Apple) or a RamFactor (from Applied
Engineering). There are some other clones of these.
If it goes in the IIe auxiliary slot (60 pin connector), then it is
probably an Applied Engineering RamWorks, of which there were at least
three major revisions (RamWorks, RamWorks II and RamWorks III), or a
similar card.
For a standard slot RAM card, you can just plug it in and ProDOS will
automatically recognise it as a RAM disk. You can even boot off it if
the card is set up properly. Some applications (e.g. AppleWorks 1.3 and
later) can use these cards for data storage. The RamFactor also
supports DOS 3.3 through a patch mechanism.
For an auxiliary slot RAM card, you need to patch ProDOS to use it as a
RAM disk, and use special versions of applications (or patches) to
support the card.
Supertimer
>Hey, don't mean to cut in, but I have some mystery card of my own...
>Listed chips on the board which caught my attention...
>*'Little Blue Limited' "PC Transporter" Applied Engineering
>Has passthrough cables onto the speaker, keyboard, and modulator (?) pins
>on the motherboard of the IIe.
>It's got, let's see, a NEC v30 8710WK, I9591 V6T7737-6009 745V, and a
>VLSI 8835AZ X1001I VC2849 as chips which catch my attention, along
>with other miscellanous PROMs and stuff. 19-pin female connector on rear.
>(This is...a PC Compatibility card for the Apple IIe <?!?!>...any idea on
>where one can find an external 5.25 which attaches to it? or the software
>for it?)
You don't need an external 5.25" drive. The PC Transporter
supports the concept of "disk images," specifically "hard drive
volumes" or files that represent the C and D drives. You can
trade disk images with other PCT users OR you can set up
your own hard drive volume (a hard drive disk image set up
as the C drive), then null modem things from your real PC
to your IIe and copy them to your hard drive volume/disk
image file with the PCT utilities.
Kind of turns the whole emulator/disk image thing on its head,
doesn't it? ;-) Where do you think Randy Spurlock, the
programmer who started the A2 emulator craze, got his idea
for disk images FROM?
Right click on the following file to download the PCT
software.
ftp://ground.ecn.uiowa.edu/apple2/apple8/Pgms/pctbootvol.shk
>*Apple Computer 1990 'Sandwich II'
>Some PROMs with serial numbers and APPLE89 on them
>NCR CP02764 8924A
>AMI 9002MAH C17656
>25-pin female connector on back of computer.
This is the Apple High Speed SCSI card. It lets the Apple II
run SCSI devices of all types (I, II, ultra, wide, whatever).
I have a 1GB drive running off it. It supports DMA.
>*ALS Z-card
>Z80B cpu, 10 socketed PRAMs, 4 DIP siwtches
>*ALS Z-engine
>Z80B cpu, 3 socketed PROMs, 5 soldered
>(looks like perhaps a lower-end version of the first I guess)
>
>Any idea on these? I'm assuming the Z80 cards are for CP/M, since that's
>like the only good use for a Z80 in a IIe that I can think of...? But no
>software, so dunno what they do. (can I use a CP/M boot disk from, say,
>another CP/M card and have it work with them?)
That's most likely a CP/M card. Redundant because the
V30 on the PCT can also run in Z80 emulation with the
right software and run CP/M programs if you find the right
MS-DOS program to switch it into CP/M mode.
>Oh, hey, got a mem board as well, 32 ILM41256AP-12 chips
>I saw 256, but there's no way that it is 8192kB for a IIe, right? What am
>I misreading...
256 bits per chip, 256k per 8 chips, 1MB in 32 chips. Note
that Applied Engineering's IIe RamFactor actually supported
5MB of total memory with the correct expander (the one that
actually shipped).
David Empson
> lab...@hotmail.com (Labelas Enoreth) wrote:
>
> >*ALS Z-card
>
> That's most likely a CP/M card. Redundant because the
> V30 on the PCT can also run in Z80 emulation with the
> right software and run CP/M programs if you find the right
> MS-DOS program to switch it into CP/M mode.
Not exactly. The V30 has an 8080 emulation mode, not a Z80 emulation
mode. Big difference - lots of instructions are missing.
It would not be compatible with most Apple II CP/M software, since they
expect a Z80, and may depend on hardware details of the Apple II CP/M
cards. (It may be difficult to access the floppies as well.)
Labelas Enoreth
than one model) for the card as well...Does anyone out there have specs,
schematics, documentation...for the card and such?
I'd like to know about adding to it, like memory or the external monitor.
As for the adaptors, it came with the passthrough cable for the keyboard
and cables for the speaker and modulator from the card.
Hoping the SW on that link is the required software to boot it...haven't
checked it out yet.
As for the Memory card, it's an Apple IIe Memory Expansion card.
And out of curiousity, is either the Sandwich II or especially the PCT
card especially rare or valuable or something? I've gotten quite a few
emails about people wanting one or the other or both.
And does anyone think I should go out of my way to get a DuoDisk
controller card or Apple Parallel interface card, or a Laser 128? This
place I found a lot of stuff at has tons of Apple II stuff cheaply (IIe
beige and Dot-matrix printers out the wazoo), but only one or two of
those...
Oh, and Thanks everyone for your response
Supertimer
>Hm. I found the external TransDrive (with dual 5.25s if there was more
>than one model) for the card as well...Does anyone out there have specs,
>schematics, documentation...for the card and such?
Well, the TransDrives are not absolutely necessary as you can
use disk images of MS-DOS software. It will make transfers
easier, though, because you don't then need to resort to modem
or null-modem transfer to get your MS-DOS stuff to the IIe from
your real DOS PC.
>I'd like to know about adding to it, like memory or the external monitor.
>As for the adaptors, it came with the passthrough cable for the keyboard
>and cables for the speaker and modulator from the card.
That should be all you need. The video gets piped through the
IIe's monitor through the IIe motherboard.
>Hoping the SW on that link is the required software to boot it...haven't
>checked it out yet.
Right click on that link. The software CAN boot the PCT. It
has the software plus a disk image of a bootable MS-DOS disk
containing utilities (such as for making more disk images and
transferring files).
>And out of curiousity, is either the Sandwich II or especially the PCT
>card especially rare or valuable or something? I've gotten quite a few
>emails about people wanting one or the other or both.
Not really. However, the Sandwich II is one of the better
(IMO, the best) SCSI card for the IIGS.
>And does anyone think I should go out of my way to get a DuoDisk
>controller card or Apple Parallel interface card, or a Laser 128? This
>place I found a lot of stuff at has tons of Apple II stuff cheaply (IIe
>beige and Dot-matrix printers out the wazoo), but only one or two of
>those...
Look carefully at the Laser 128. Is it the Laser 128EX/2 model
that has the 3.5" drive? If it is, grab it. It has features no other
8-bit Apple II (IIGS does not count because it is 16-bit) has and
is worth having. If it is any other Laser, forget it.
Labelas Enoreth
Microtek 'SLOTWARE'
4 SN74xxxxx chips and a socketed chip with a label over it
has a 26-pin connector directly on the card, like the old disk ][
contollers were. I'm thinking it may be a parallel interface, since I
think I may have gotten some huge daisy-wheel printer with it at the time
and I think that this would have been the only way it could have been
attached, but, unfortunately, since there is no adapter to go between the
card and the back of the computer, I guess I am SOL.
Galen Tatsuo Komatsu
Any other identifying codes on the card? I have a cardless
manual for a Microtek Dumpling-GX Parallel Interface. ("Slotware"
is apparently the name for their line of cards.)
The Manual is dated September 1, 1983 and lists these cards
that Microtek makes. Any of the codes printed on your card?
RV-611C 7/8 BIT Parallel Interface Slotware(TM)
DUMPLING-GX Hi-Res Graphics printer Interface Slotware(TM)
DUMPLING-64 64K Spooler Buffer Slotware(TM) for all major printers
DUMPLING-S Programmable Serial I/O Slotware(TM) with 4 Personalities
BAM-16MM 16K Memory Expansion Slotware(TM) with Memory Management
BAM-128 64K or 128K Memory Expansion Slotware(TM)
Q-DISC 128K Disc Emulation Slotware(TM) for DOS 3.3
MAGNUM-80 80 Column Video Slotware(TM)
MAGNUM-80Me 80 Column Video Slotware(TM) with 64K Memory For Apple IIe
RAINBO-256 RGB Analog Slotware(TM) providing 256 colors
SV-622 Serial Interface Slotware(TM)
--- These people owe me stuff ---
Josh Smith (aka "itsme") : $17.00 + various specified videogame items
(http://www2.hawaii.edu/~gkomatsu/JSmith/js.html)
Ben Cureton ("tragic") : $85.00
Labelas Enoreth
So it is a Parallel interface...Thanks.
Now, if only I could find one of the (most likely) proprietary connectors
to convert it into a standard parallel port.
David Empson
> Well, this one may not be a mystery if I am right, but I may not be.
> Microtek 'SLOTWARE'
> 4 SN74xxxxx chips and a socketed chip with a label over it
> has a 26-pin connector directly on the card, like the old disk ][
> contollers were.
The Disk ][ connectors are 20 pins. 26 pins is a strong hint that it is
a parallel interface, but not totally conclusive - it might just be a
general purpose I/O card that happens to use a DB-25 connector (and you
are missing the cable that goes from the card to the back panel).
Labelas Enoreth
card, like the old disk ][' was because I was trying to make the imagery
of the pins jutting directly off of the card at a 90 degree angle from it,
but couldn't think of a technical term. I should have broken it up more
between '26-pin' and 'like old disk ][' But yeah, I am missing the
cable...but I know for a fact now that it is parallel. Now, to find the
cable...somehow.
Of course, now that I think about it, every Apple II card I can think of
had a plug on the board, and then a cable with the plug on the other end
to attach to the back. I was just thinking in my mind at the time to
differentiate from cards which had the correct port directly on the rear
of the card (you know, like NuBus, PDS, ISA, etc.)