CiderPress v4.1.0 released

[fadden]

This was a relative minor release. I bumped the minor version because of the compatibility break. Changes since v4.0.5:

* Added save and restore of main window placement (issue #41).
* Added workaround for ProDOS sparse file issue (issues #15 and #49).
* Updated to modern build tools (breaks WinXP support).

This version runs on Windows 7 and later. See http://a2ciderpress.com/ for downloads for the latest version as well as older versions that run on WinXP/Vista and Win98/ME/2K.

-----

The ProDOS sparseness issue happens (I think) because some programs expect the first block in a tree file's master block list to be nonzero, and become sad if it isn't. Adding zeroed-out blocks wastes a little space if the first 128KB of the file is full of zeroes, so CiderPress didn't create them that way. Now it does. cf. https://github.com/fadden/ciderpress/issues/49

[Bob Piltz]

On Monday, August 16, 2021 at 3:47:24 PM UTC-7, fadden wrote:

> * Updated to modern build tools (breaks WinXP support).
>
> This version runs on Windows 7 and later. See http://a2ciderpress.com/ for downloads for the latest version as well as older versions that run on WinXP/Vista and Win98/ME/2K.

I simply don't understand the need to "update to modern build tools" and the needless regression of not supporting Windows XP systems. Leaving Windows XP support in will hurt no one, and probably help many. I do not understand why authors feel the need and compulsion to break their 20-year-old applications by castrating them. First, MS-DOS compatibilty was eliminated, now it's a rush to "modernize" with eliminating Windows XP compatibility. I'm sure next we'll see 32-bit support dropped, in a rush to upgrade an application written to work with system images and code from 40-year-old vintage Apple IIs to 64-bit "build tools."

I'm a very happy user of CiderPress for many, years (decades!), and please, please do not think me ungrateful for all your stupendous and hard work, but why the need to break something which wasn't broken in the first place.

Don't fall for the planned obsolescence game. Please keep Ciderpress real by making it as compatible as possible with extant systems. Sure, there might not by many XP users left, but there are really more than you think. I'm even still an MS-DOS user and find that operating system so refreshingly fast, simple, and productive in 2021.

[fadden]

On Monday, August 16, 2021 at 7:09:10 PM UTC-7, Bob Piltz wrote:
> I simply don't understand the need to "update to modern build tools" and the needless regression of not supporting Windows XP systems.

There are two practical reasons:
(1) I don't have a WinXP system to test on. The last few releases have been a guessing game as to whether they would actually work, and I'm not comfortable with that.
(2) There have been some modern updates to things like standard file dialogs that I wasn't able to use in the last major "refresh" because they didn't exist until Vista or later.

Building for WinXP requires a separate set of tools (v120_xp), and I'd rather not have to deal with those going forward since I doubt they're still maintained.

commit be8d3a49110bce562fd1d92abda1725447db082d
Author: Andy McFadden <thef...@gmail.com>
Date: Wed Dec 10 11:57:41 2014 -0800

WinXP compatibility update

This changes the Platform Toolset configuration from "Visual Studio
2013 (v120)" to "Visual Studio 2013 - Windows XP (v120_xp)". Without
this change, executables built by VS2013 will not run on WinXP.

To actually run on WinXP, we also need to install the redistributable
msvcr120.dll and mfc120u.dll, both of which are fairly large. The
installation package has more than doubled in size.

At some point we may want to drop WinXP support -- Microsoft declared
end-of-life on April 8 2014 -- but if the only penalty is a 2MB increase
in installer size, we might as well keep supporting WinXP users.

[Antoine Vignau]

Hi Bob,
I am as well a satisfied user of an old version of Ciderpress running on XP running under Parallels on my Mac, and I will not blame Andy for not supporting that old OS (EOS 4/2014). I am glad Andy keeps on updating Ciderpress (and I could use Cadius) and I know, by experience, that it is not planned obsolescence.

With +1% of XP systems still running in 2020, and with difficulties in compiling on modern machines, we either have to stay up to date by upgrading ourselves or let them fly.

On the Mac world, we have had the same problem with the 32 vs 64-bit support. We were warned. Some people have waited (and for good reasons: work or personal, the Apple II is a hobby) and now, Sweet16 does not run on modern machines and OSes. And if we are not satisfied, we can use old versions.

Myself, I cannot use the latest updates of Ciderpress, but I do not care, my current version runs fine under XP.

Keep up the good work,
Antoine

[Oliver Schmidt]

Hi Andy,

> (1) I don't have a WinXP system to test on. The last few releases have
> been a guessing game as to whether they would actually work, and I'm not
> comfortable with that.

Full ACK!

> (2) There have been some modern updates to things like standard file
> dialogs that I wasn't able to use in the last major "refresh" because
> they didn't exist until Vista or later.

Full ACK!

Please don't get distracted by useless posts like the one you reacted upon
above.

Thanks for your efforts, Oliver

[D Finnigan]

Bob Piltz wrote:
>
> Don't fall for the planned obsolescence game. Please keep Ciderpress real
> by making it as compatible as possible with extant systems. Sure, there
> might not by many XP users left, but there are really more than you think.

I agree: considering the audience of the Apple II, there is some logic in
maintaining support for older operating systems.

[Bob Piltz]

On Monday, August 16, 2021 at 10:40:02 PM UTC-7, fadden wrote:
> On Monday, August 16, 2021 at 7:09:10 PM UTC-7, Bob Piltz wrote:
> > I simply don't understand the need to "update to modern build tools" and the needless regression of not supporting Windows XP systems.
> There are two practical reasons:
> (1) I don't have a WinXP system to test on. The last few releases have been a guessing game as to whether they would actually work, and I'm not comfortable with that.
> (2) There have been some modern updates to things like standard file dialogs that I wasn't able to use in the last major "refresh" because they didn't exist until Vista or later.
>
> Building for WinXP requires a separate set of tools (v120_xp), and I'd rather not have to deal with those going forward since I doubt they're still maintained.

I appreciate the response, which of course is very decent of you. I know you're between a rock and a hard place. My complaint, if you want to call it that, is more directed toward those who put out build tools and always make new versions imcompatible with older releases (by purpose, by design, who knows?) and not at the application programmers such as yourself. Older versions of Ciderpress will continue to work on XP, it is true, and nothing can change that. I had heard there was also a kind of patch to the .exe header which will make the version VS studio 13 binaries XP compatible (backwards compatible with ver 12).

Again, I am glad that some understand that as much compatibility as possible is always a good thing, especially for working with 35-year old stuff. For, compatibility will only decrease in the future as both the hardware and the toolchains become rare and unobtainable.

[fireb...@charter.net]

Windows XP? Your device is not recognized! Please upgrade to the
latest surveillance OS. All your data are belong to us.