High Speed '816s from Sanyo
Jawaid Bazyar
available from WDC. It's a fairly standard 65c816, except for two
things:
o It runs at 14MHz
o It was reengineered almost from scratch by Sanyo to run at 14MHz
This is no joke; I called WDC and asked them (talk to 'Deb'). They
have them, they cost $95 just like the old 'high speed' (not) chips
they had. And, they have what's probably an unlimited supply of
them.
You can pump your Zips up to 12.4MHz (their gate array is now the bottleneck,
although there are about 100 Zips out there with faster gate arrays).
Transwarps can probably go the full 14MHz, though I don't know for a fact.
There is no power supply boosting necessary; these chips run straight off
the regular 5V (they were reengineered, remember?). Just plug 'em in,
put in a new crystal, hope you particular accelerator card doesn't
have some odd fault, and GO! Ultra fast IIgs's.
WDC will require you to look at some outdated (and because of the new
chip, obsolete) information on modifying TWGS's and Zips before they'll
let you order the chip; but that's free, and well worth a IIgs at 12 or
14 MHz.
Again, *THIS IS NOT A JOKE*. WDC's phone number is 602-962-4545.
--
Jawaid Bazyar | Ask me about the GNO Multitasking Environment
Procyon, Inc. | for the Apple IIgs!
baz...@cs.uiuc.edu | 11738 W Aqueduct Drive
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Joe Kohn
RE: Faster Zips and TransWarps
Jawaid mentions that there are new 14 Mhz 65c816's available. I'd love to
pump up my TWGS from 7 mhz to 12 or 14 Mhz. Only one problem...I hate to be
the first guy to try something like that. If others get those new chips and
new crystals, and find that the GS remains dependable, I'd go for it in an
instant. So, please keep us informed.
BTW, I have also spoken to Burger Bill about his souped up GS. I was a
little concerned, a while back, when I sent Bill some software and he
couldn't even get it to boot. As soon as he disabled his speedy ZipGS, it
ran just fine.
So, I'm especially interested in learning about doubling the speed of the
TWGS. That's what I have. With a 32K cache, I just can't go faster than
7Mhz. Before I got the cache update, I was running it at 8Mhz; as soon as I
installed the 32K cache, I had to go back to running at 7Mhz. But, I never
tried a new CPU; I only swapped crystals.
Joe Kohn
(no quotes, no sig, no jive)
System Operator
>
>RE: Faster Zips and TransWarps
>
>Jawaid mentions that there are new 14 Mhz 65c816's available. I'd love to
>pump up my TWGS from 7 mhz to 12 or 14 Mhz. Only one problem...I hate to be
>the first guy to try something like that. If others get those new chips and
>new crystals, and find that the GS remains dependable, I'd go for it in an
>instant. So, please keep us informed.
>
>
>So, I'm especially interested in learning about doubling the speed of the
>TWGS. That's what I have. With a 32K cache, I just can't go faster than
>7Mhz. Before I got the cache update, I was running it at 8Mhz; as soon as I
>installed the 32K cache, I had to go back to running at 7Mhz. But, I never
>tried a new CPU; I only swapped crystals.
>
>Joe Kohn
>(no quotes, no sig, no jive)
I was thinking it might be interesting, but I have a lot of other $100
projects I'll prolly tackle first.
But you raise an interesting question. What speed is the TWGS cache RAM?
Can it deal with 14Mhz?
Mike
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Tc Wilson
>
> There is no power supply boosting necessary; these chips run straight off
> the regular 5V (they were reengineered, remember?). Just plug 'em in,
> put in a new crystal, hope you particular accelerator card doesn't
> have some odd fault, and GO! Ultra fast IIgs's.
>
Um, don't you need to diddle with the variable cap along with the crystal?
The way I understood it, the card/chip/crystal needs to be "dialed in" in
order to work.
However, $95 sound reasonable... do it, write down what you did, and let
us know!
Tc Wilson/The Captain "Programming is an art form
t.ca...@bluemoon.rn.com that fights back."
.... or try: TCQ, The Captain's Quarters (614) 294-0556, 300-38400 hst
Steven T Chiang
>In article <1992Jul4.1...@well.sf.ca.us> jo...@well.sf.ca.us (Joe Kohn) writes:
>
>>So, I'm especially interested in learning about doubling the speed of the
>>TWGS. That's what I have. With a 32K cache, I just can't go faster than
>>7Mhz. Before I got the cache update, I was running it at 8Mhz; as soon as I
>>installed the 32K cache, I had to go back to running at 7Mhz. But, I never
>>tried a new CPU; I only swapped crystals.
I don't think this is a true indicator. I know there was a
scam with the PC, where the guy just switched crystals, and it made
the computer think it was going faster, when it wasn't.
>>Joe Kohn
>>(no quotes, no sig, no jive)
>
>I was thinking it might be interesting, but I have a lot of other $100
>projects I'll prolly tackle first.
>
>But you raise an interesting question. What speed is the TWGS cache RAM?
>Can it deal with 14Mhz?
My cache ram is 35 ns.... I have the TWGS 32k cache upgrade.
Zip has switched to the smaller packaged static rams that the TWGS
uses, so I imagine it should be easier to find faster components.
When I spoke with the guy at AE, he said it the ram would be
plenty fast enough for at least 10 mhz... and he didn't have any
faster chips or something at the time, so beyond that is ... ??k
>Mike
Steven Chiang Order - DreamGrafix: The ONLY 16/256/3200
st...@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu color paint program for the Apple IIGS.
America On_Line: DWS Steve
Genie: S.Chiang4 Apple IIGS Forever!
Eric D. Shepherd
luck others have had first! :)
Anybody who tries it, please post and tell us how it went!
- Eric S.
--
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----------------------------------+-----------------------------------
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Brian Clark
>I was talking to Bill Heineman and he mentioned a new chip that's
>available from WDC. It's a fairly standard 65c816, except for two
>things:
>
>o It runs at 14MHz
>o It was reengineered almost from scratch by Sanyo to run at 14MHz
>
>This is no joke; I called WDC and asked them (talk to 'Deb'). They
>have them, they cost $95 just like the old 'high speed' (not) chips
>they had. And, they have what's probably an unlimited supply of
>them.
>Again, *THIS IS NOT A JOKE*. WDC's phone number is 602-962-4545.
So everyone is going to call them now... :) I'm sure they're wondering why the
huge rush of phone calls all of a sudden. I called, its for real!
--
Brian Clark bcl...@jupiter.chi.il.us
gac...@bonnet.enet.dec.com
If I get such a chip, did I have to replace my Apple IIGS chip by this one ??? in order to have my GS running at 14Mhz ?
Shane M Zatezalo
> Could it be possible to have the addresse of WDC.
>
> If I get such a chip, did I have to replace my Apple IIGS chip by this one ??? in order to have my GS running at 14Mhz ?
Anyone know if /this/ is the chip that the new Zip GS will be using?
(something like $150 to upgrade to.... yuk)
:GS::::::::::Genesis game system? ::::::::: Interceptor Cycle ?::::::::::GS:
: Shane M. Zatezalo : i-net> szat...@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu :
: Comp/Elec Eng, Ohio State : Who'd ya expect, Elmer Fudd? - M. Jordan :
:GS:::: Apple II forever!! ::::::GO BUCKS!::::::: Play Lacrosse! ::::::::GS:
Soenke Behrens
> Anyone know if /this/ is the chip that the new Zip GS will be using?
>(something like $150 to upgrade to.... yuk)
New ZIP? Just yesterday I called them and they said they "were lokking into
14 MHz and preparing a mailing to our customers". Nothing about a new ZIP
card. What is this? Could you please enlighten me?
Thanks
Soenke
--
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(RACTER) ! FIDO: 2:246/13 Soenke Behrens
Shane M Zatezalo
>szat...@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Shane M Zatezalo) writes:
>
>> Anyone know if /this/ is the chip that the new Zip GS will be using?
>>(something like $150 to upgrade to.... yuk)
>
>New ZIP? Just yesterday I called them and they said they "were lokking into
>14 MHz and preparing a mailing to our customers". Nothing about a new ZIP
>card. What is this? Could you please enlighten me?
That's what I was referring to... I heard about it a while ago though.
READ: not a whole new card (to my knowledge) just a new upgrade....
Jawaid Bazyar
> Could it be possible to have the addresse of WDC.
> If I get such a chip, did I have to replace my Apple IIGS chip by this one ??? in order to have my GS running at 14Mhz ?
You'll need an accelerator of some sort, either a ZipGS or a TransWarp GS.
Unfortunately, you can't simply replace the chip on your motherboard.
--
Jawaid Bazyar | Ask me about the GNO Multitasking Environment
Procyon, Inc. | for the Apple IIgs!
baz...@cs.uiuc.edu | P.O Box 620334
--Apple II Forever!-- | Littleton, CO 80162-0334 (303) 933-4649
Scott Anderson
>In article <bazyar.710273927@teal>, baz...@teal.csn.org (Jawaid Bazyar) writes:
>>
>>o It runs at 14MHz
>>o It was reengineered almost from scratch by Sanyo to run at 14MHz
>>
>>This is no joke; I called WDC and asked them (talk to 'Deb'). They
>--
>Brian Clark bcl...@jupiter.chi.il.us
Will I be able to just swap this chip into my Zip GSX and get a 56 Mhz
crystal?
(I suspect others with accelerators want to know too.)
Scott Anderson
acc...@carroll1.cc.edu
Andrew Nicholas
>>Again, *THIS IS NOT A JOKE*. WDC's phone number is 602-962-4545.
>
>So everyone is going to call them now... :) I'm sure they're wondering why the
>huge rush of phone calls all of a sudden. I called, its for real!
So how fast can you crank an existing ZipGS card if you get fast cache ram
and this new part? Are there weird reliability problems with cranking the
speed up like there were with the old WDC 65816's?
andy
--
Andy Nicholas GEnie & America-Online: shrinkit
Apple Computer, Inc. InterNET: shri...@apple.com
Soenke Behrens
>Will I be able to just swap this chip into my Zip GSX and get a 56 Mhz
>crystal?
>(I suspect others with accelerators want to know too.)
You need fast SRAM. At least 35 ns, 25 or 20 would be better (20 would be
enough even for 20 MHz). See if your ZIP is equipped with the (smaller)
fast SRAMs or if it still has the old (wide) slow SRAMs (slow meaning 70ns
or 60ns). If the latter, you have to swap the SRAM. It might be tricky to
get fast SRAM that uses the wide package.
Second thing: The ZIP can only go to 12 MHz at the moment. ZIP told me, when
I called them, that they were looking into the possibility of an upgrade
so you could use 14 MHz. Exactly how that would work (a board swap, probably,
faster ASIC) they didn't say. Well, let's await their mailing ;)
Jawaid Bazyar
>>In article <bazyar.710273927@teal>, baz...@teal.csn.org (Jawaid Bazyar) writes:
>>>
>>>o It runs at 14MHz
>>>o It was reengineered almost from scratch by Sanyo to run at 14MHz
>>>
>>>This is no joke; I called WDC and asked them (talk to 'Deb'). They
>Will I be able to just swap this chip into my Zip GSX and get a 56 Mhz
>crystal?
>(I suspect others with accelerators want to know too.)
No. All but a handful of Zips are limited by the custom gate array
to 12.4MHz or so. And, again, you need to make sure your cache RAM is
fast enough (35ns will do).
--
Jawaid Bazyar | Ask me about the GNO Multitasking Environment
Procyon, Inc. | for the Apple IIgs!
baz...@cs.uiuc.edu | P.O Box 620334
--Apple II Forever!-- | Littleton, CO 80162-0334 (303) 933-4649
Jason Jones
I have a forked archive of modZap .77 that I can't unpack with 3
versions of GS shrinkit. It says "This is not a known archive, shrinkit
cannot unpack it." Buy I goto 8-bit shrinkit, and it treats it as normal,
I just can't unpack it <because it is forked..> I used the last 3
versions of GS shrinkit, and the last two on Shrinkit 8-bit. Both 8-bit
regognized it, but not one of the three Gshk's would.
__________________________________________________________________________
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Scott Alfter
> I have a forked archive of modZap .77 that I can't unpack with 3
>versions of GS shrinkit. It says "This is not a known archive, shrinkit
>cannot unpack it." Buy I goto 8-bit shrinkit, and it treats it as normal,
>I just can't unpack it <because it is forked..> I used the last 3
>versions of GS shrinkit, and the last two on Shrinkit 8-bit. Both 8-bit
>regognized it, but not one of the three Gshk's would.
Speaking of forked files and ShrinkIt...why not provide an option in
ShrinkIt to allow unpacking forked files into two files--one with the
data fork, one with the resource fork? It's done on other
systems...programs that unpack Mac archives on UNIX and DOS boxes
allow you to save the data fork, resource fork, and Finder info in
separate files.
_/_ Scott Alfter Internet: sknk...@cs.unlv.edu
/ v \ Call the Skunk Works BBS today! Fidonet: 1:209/765
(IIe ( (702) 896-2676 v.32bis Apple II/IBM GEnie: S.ALFTER
\_^_/ Ask me about SoftDAC--digital audio for your IIe/IIc! Apple II Forever!
Andy McFadden
>Speaking of forked files and ShrinkIt...why not provide an option in
>ShrinkIt to allow unpacking forked files into two files--one with the
>data fork, one with the resource fork?
(1) it requires a nonzero amount of time (don't forget you have to deal with
two different files, suggesting two different dialogs, etc, etc),
(2) it isn't all that useful,
(3) it would be just as easy to do it in a separate program (though it'd take
a bit more disk space)
> _/_ Scott Alfter Internet: sknk...@cs.unlv.edu
--
fad...@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
[ Above opinions are mine, Amdahl has nothing to do with them, etc, etc. ]
Scott Alfter
>(2) it isn't all that useful,
Say again? I can think of a couple of instances where it would've
been a nice capability to have...such as when a GS user puts out a
program for 8-bit machines--and puts the dox in a forked file (I've
seen it happen). How about all those TrueType fonts that're out in
ShrinkIt files for Pointless? They're forked...can't use those to
experiment with TrueType on my IIe, so I'll end up getting the fonts
that are packaged for the Mac or Windoze, unpacking 'em on the UNIX
box, and sending 'em to my IIe from there...lots of needless steps
that'd be saved if only ShrinkIt could unpack forked files. It can't
be that hard to add the capability.
_/_ Scott Alfter Internet: sknk...@cs.unlv.edu
/ v \ Call the Skunk Works BBS today! Fidonet: 1:209/765
(IIe ( (702) 894-9619 v.32bis Apple II/IBM GEnie: S.ALFTER
Jason Perez
>
>>>Again, *THIS IS NOT A JOKE*. WDC's phone number is 602-962-4545.
>>
>>So everyone is going to call them now... :) I'm sure they're wondering why the
>>huge rush of phone calls all of a sudden. I called, its for real!
i called up Zip to see if they had these availiable for upgrade. they do,
but they want $330 (to upgrade from my 9/64). seems a bit steep if the new chip
is only $95. the 14Mhz version also requires 64K cache if you don't have it already.
--
Jason Perez |
jas...@fantasia.sps.mot.com | "Gig 'em!" "Frodo lives!"
j0p...@sigma.tamu.edu | "Don't have a cow man!"
________________________________________|______________________________________