Hard drive on CPC 6128+
Etienne
I'm new on this forum so sorry if the question was already asked 1000
times...
I'd like to know if it is possible to plug an IDE 40Mb hard disk on a
CPC6128+
If yes, what hardware and software do I need.
Thank you for your answers (if possible to mailto:emau...@iname.com)
Etienne (and happy new year !)
Julian Cassin
technical background willing to make a 'tiny' few $$$ to make one for
everyone...
I sure would like to buy a few for my CPCs...
Julian
James Hoskisson
news:3a4b4...@d2o313.teliauk.com...
> "Etienne" <emau...@iname.com> wrote in message
> news:92f8q9$460$1...@s1.read.news.oleane.net...
> >
> > I'd like to know if it is possible to plug an IDE 40Mb hard disk on a
> > CPC6128+
> > If yes, what hardware and software do I need.
>
> but am not sure if the HDD was IDE or not.
I've just looked up an article on it an old ACU. It was 20Mb and made by a
German company (Fritz Obermeier). It didn't go in to any technical detail on
the actual interfacing, suffice to say that it was all in a big metal box!
> Anyway, a much more pratical solution IMHO would be to connect a CPC to a
PC
> and use it's hard disk for storage. I'm sure this has been attempted
> before, check the FAQ at http://genesis8.free.fr .
Why would it be more practical to connect a PC to a CPC? As far as I can see
it would be less practical because you'd have to have your CPC and PC in
close proximity to one another, you'd have to find twice as many plug
sockets for the lot, and you'd actually have to own a PC. Then there is the
problem of interfacing with the PC, and writing software for both the PC and
CPC end.
I can't really see any benefits if you are just going to use the PC for data
storage!
James
Julian Cassin
http://www.spectrumplus3e.redhotant.com/
> Well, I was assuming that you already have a PC or some high end computer
if
> you are posting to a newsgroup, unless of course you use someone else's
How can you be sure, I had been using my CPC on the net now for over 6
years.
> The software to do this has largely already been written, and infact I'm
> sure someone has written some software to allow access to a PC and it's
HDD,
> but I'm once again not sure of the exact details.
See the Spectrum +3e project, I am sure some of the code could be adapted to
work on the CPC.
> would be limited by size of the HDD (no LBA or anything like that) and
also
> the file system you'd have to use would be pretty restrictive.
The Spectrum +3e method is quite interesting, it maps partitions into the
drives
A and B...
Julian
Andreas Micklei
In article <3a4be...@d2o313.teliauk.com> you wrote:
> "James Hoskisson" <james.ho...@virgin.net> wrote in message
> news:TmQ26.19503$ca6.3...@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com...
>> Why would it be more practical to connect a PC to a CPC? As far as I can
>> for both the PC and CPC end.
> sure someone has written some software to allow access to a PC and it's HDD,
> but I'm once again not sure of the exact details.
Homepage
http://home.worldonline.dk/~zigzac/
Click on Hardware, and look for AMSSIO. I have built AMSSIO V3.0. It
comes with a DOS server application and some CPC code (AMSDOS patches,
and some new RSX commands) to use a portion of your PC HD as a virtual
disk on the CPC. I have successfully ported the PC portion to Linux
where it happily runs in the background.
This solution is not very fast at the moment, but I have seen a C64
accessing my Amiga HD at 57600 BAUD without even an UART (pushing out
the single bits by hand), so I think we should be able to achieve the
same on the CPC. Especially when actually using an UART.
What I like about RS232 is its robustness. The cables and even the
interface for the CPC are easy to build and the chances to blow your PC
is quite low.
Btw.: The software package I used to connect my C64 to my Amiga is
called Over5. Has someone else seen it? Now I would like to have THAT
functionality. Should be doable...
--
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Antonio Martins
Hi Julian
When connecting your cpc to your Amiga with a nullmodem cable is it a specilay
made one, and where would I be able to get the software from, would I be able
to use it with my cpc6128Plus and my Amiga A1200.
Regards
Antonio
> Currently I am not and haven't been for 3 years now, but I still have my
> CPC/modem etc and
> it is still able to connect to the net.
>
> I was dialing into the Unix shell account provided by my ISP using ZMP in
> CP/M+.
>
> Of course any comms program would suit, and I think there is even a very
> good AMSDOS
> one that handles faster connections than the 4800bps I was using with ZMP -
> although I
> haven't tried anything else.
>
> I will eventually setup an indirect net connection with my CPC via ZMP & a
> nullmodem cable
> to my Amiga (which is connected via a cable modem) - so I should get a very
> snappy response.
> This will use the 'amiga' as the shell rather than a unix shell as my
> current ISP doesn't provide
> a unix shell.
>
> Julian
>
> Benjamin Fall <be...@altavista.net> wrote in message
> news:3a4c8...@d2o313.teliauk.com...
> >
> > "Julian Cassin" <ninjaturtle..REMOVETHIS..@optushome.com.au> wrote in
> > message news:yFX26.20194$Xx3....@news1.eburwd1.vic.optushome.com.au...
> > >
> > > How can you be sure, I had been using my CPC on the net now for over 6
> > > years.
> >
> > Well this debate could hark back to the 'are you using a real CPC or
> > emulator' debate, but instead I will just say that I'm impressed that
> you're
> > connecting to the net on a CPC. What software/hardware do you use?
> >
> > Ben
> >
> > --
> > Ben Fall | be...@altavista.net
> >
> >
> >
James Hoskisson
>
> That's the one I was thinking of, and I also remember that it was encased
in
> a rather large box ;-) I remember that it actually connected to the CPC's
> expansion port, so it must have utilised it's own I/O device, but what or
> how is anyone's guess - unless somebody actually bought one, or was it
just
> a bluesky project?
No, the guy who was doing the review actually bought one. He seemed rather
impressed with it, even if it was bigger than the CPC! I've heard rumour
that Alan Sugar actually blocked the import of them in to the country,
because he was working on his own CPC hard drive. Unfortunately, this never
materialized, so Fritz Obermier went out of business and the CPC never got a
hard drive. Such is life!
> > Why would it be more practical to connect a PC to a CPC? As far as I can
> see
> > it would be less practical because you'd have to have your CPC and PC in
> > close proximity to one another, you'd have to find twice as many plug
> > sockets for the lot, and you'd actually have to own a PC.
>
> Well, I was assuming that you already have a PC or some high end computer
if
> you are posting to a newsgroup, unless of course you use someone else's
> connect etc. etc. And as for the plug sockets - that's easily sorted out,
> surely...
Okay, but I think it's rather a bit of overkill having a zonking great PC
just so that you can store stuff on its hard drive. It is rather
restrictive. What about if you were unable to have access to a PC, when you
want to use your CPC (like with me when I'm at university). There is also
the problem of other people wanting to use the PC, which may not be so easy
if you've got your CPC attached to it.
In my family nobody except me uses the CPC, so I have it in my room (when
I'm at home) but everyone uses the PC, so it would be woefully impractical
for that to be in my room as well (never mind trying to find space for it!)
Even if the PC and CPC were close enough to allow the kind this kind of
system, I'm not sure I could be bothered having to set up the PC every time
I wanted to do something with the CPC. Okay, theoretically you could get
everything to load up automatically on the PC, but I doubt the configuration
would be permanent, since the hardware would have to be initialised every
time the PC was turned on, and if you're not using the CPC, it would cause
problems.
> > Then there is the
> > problem of interfacing with the PC, and writing software for both the PC
> and
> > CPC end.
>
> The software to do this has largely already been written, and infact I'm
> sure someone has written some software to allow access to a PC and it's
HDD,
> but I'm once again not sure of the exact details.
Yes, but does anyone actually use it on a regular basis? I'm sure in the
long run it would just be easier to put eveything on a floppy and stick it
in the CPC disc drive when you want to get the data off it!
> > I can't really see any benefits if you are just going to use the PC for
> data
> > storage!
>
> Well, the fact that most PCs have 4Gb+ of storage should be incentive
> enough. If attaching a IDE HDD to a CPC *was* possible, then I'm sure you
> would be limited by size of the HDD (no LBA or anything like that) and
also
> the file system you'd have to use would be pretty restrictive.
Okay, <Rolls up sleeves> let's disect this argument...
For a start even the smallest hard drives are too big for the CPC to ship
the data about in real time (i.e. MFM hard rives), like floppy drives. This
necessarily requires some kind of external logic, in the form of a hard
drive controller, which waits for all the data to get to it, before it
whacks it on to the disc, this is why transfer protocols like IDE and SCSI
were invented. Since this is going to happen anyway, there is no theoretical
limit as to how big the hard drive can be, thus allowing 100 Gb, if you've
got the money to pay for the hard drive...
Following on from the previous statement, the hard drive interface (or the
serial interface, if you were going to use your method) would have to be
connected to the expansion port of the CPC. This necessarily requires new
software to direct the data through the expansion port. Even a patch for
AMSDOS would require some doing, so if you're going to go to the effort you
may as well write yourself a new DOS. This will then remove the need for a
restrictive file system.
So, in conclusion, the only real extra expense, would be getting another
hard drive. Seeing as the CPC doesn't gobble up the hard drive space I'm
sure you'd be able to make do with an 80Mb hard drive, or even something
smaller, which you could pick up for next to nothing second hand. People
would probably give them away, since they are pretty much worthless on a
modern PC running Windows software, which unfortunately most do.
I think that just about sums up my views on the subject. I suppose since
there is actually a way to use a PC hard drive from a CPC, that method does
have the upper hand, but if someone does come up with an IDE interface, then
I'm sure it would be much more convenient to get the CPC its own hard drive.
James
James Hoskisson
> > This solution is not very fast at the moment, but I have seen a C64
> > accessing my Amiga HD at 57600 BAUD without even an UART (pushing out
> > the single bits by hand), so I think we should be able to achieve the
> > same on the CPC. Especially when actually using an UART.
>
The 3" drives in the CPC operate at 250 000 baud, which incidentally is the
same for the 3.5" drives! (except for 1.44Mb format discs!)
James
Axel Berger
up a traditional BBS which gates to the internet and delivers UseNet
groups to me. The frontend I use could be copied on a CP/M system with
some alterations. As is it needs at least 2MB RAM and keeps whole
groups in rather big single files. If I had to do it I would far prefer
a file system with folders though.
--
Tschö wa
Axel
ja...@my-deja.com
but this assumes that the remainder of the machines devices are memory
mapped rather than port mapped and that only IDE hard disk reads/writes
will toggle the /IOR and /IOW lines. It has been a long time since I
have seen a real CPC - are printer ports and such like memory or port
mapped?
If the CPC is port mapped then you will want to use an interface
similar to the one I developed for the TRS-80 Model 4
(http://www.qsl.net/zl1wjq/trside1.htm). This interface includes some
port address mapping which was necessary because the TRS-80 used I/O
Ports for all devices.
The interface maps the IDE hard disk registers to Z80 Ports 0x4n which
are free on the TRS-80. The mapping is performed by the 74LS85 chip
and can easily be altered when the circuit is assembled. The interface
only uses 1/2 the disk capacity because the TRS-80 operating systems
used only 256 bytes/sector, not 512 that an IDE drive can support.
Anyone want to build one and have a go writing a driver? The Spectrum
3+ software would provide a good starting point for this.
Regards..... Andrew
In article <yFX26.20194$Xx3....@news1.eburwd1.vic.optushome.com.au>,
Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
Andreas Micklei
> I was thinking more along the line of using an (otherwise redundant) 486DX/2
> or something like that as the PC. You can get one with 16Mb and 250Mb HDD
> for about £20 or less (I just got one for a rather nice linux
> router/firewall). If you use a small linux distribution you would have more
> than enough room to store CPC software.
Hmmmmmmm, I have just gotten an old 486DX/33 which I want to configure as my
personal Linux DSL router/firewall. I always wondered what I should do with
the giantic 170MB harddrive. Now I know.... ;-)