Amiga Quake - Arrives!
tim
@BEGIN_FILE_ID.DIZ .________________
____Ś____ ( _____/__ - -------------
_/ ___/ _/\_ T Ź\_ ˇ diGiTAL ˇ
.-\ Ś/ 7--7 l / ˇ cORRUPTiON ˇ
| \____.-----Ś Ś----.____/------- - - -
| ŻŻŻŻŻ ŻŻŻŻŻ
| AMIGA QUAKE Alpha 0.2
| Requires CyberGFX & 8 megs
| Ported & Coded on Amiga by MAX
`----------------------------- Design: sTORM
@END_FILE_ID.DIZ
******************************************************************************
* Description *
******************************************************************************
Direct port of the original Quake v1.01 from ID Software.
******************************************************************************
* Requirements *
******************************************************************************
Amiga Computer.
68020/30/40/60 processor.
CyberGraphX graphic board with 320x200x256 screemode.
8-10 Megz of free memory.
ShareWare or Registered Quake.
******************************************************************************
* How to Use *
******************************************************************************
Smash this executable over the Quake installed directory. (You have to install
Quake shareware or Quake registered on a PC, then copy the entire Quake
directory to your Amiga).
Type in the cli or shell
stack 300000
AmigaQuake
******************************************************************************
* History *
******************************************************************************
v0.1 - First Released version.
v0.2 - Removed lottsa bugs. (too much).
- Lottsa stable version (NO MORE GURUS). (I HOPE)
- Full multitask.
- Little faster engine.
- Reduced stack requirements.
- Added CleanUp code (You can quit now!).
******************************************************************************
* To Do *
******************************************************************************
- Add Sound
- Add multiple Graphics resolutions 640x480, 800x600, etc.
- Add AGA and ECS graphics modes.
- Add v1.06 bullshit.
- ReCode whole draw, light, sprites and models routines in 100 % assembler.
- AmigaStylize.
- Add 16 and 24 Bit support.
Yepz the options are in order.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Just thought i'd post this here to make a few of you wet yourselves ;)
(before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
Tim Stubbs
A4000/060
Nick
tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
[snipp]
: ******************************************************************************
: * To Do *
: ******************************************************************************
: - Add Sound
: - Add multiple Graphics resolutions 640x480, 800x600, etc.
: - Add AGA and ECS graphics modes.
: - Add v1.06 bullshit.
: - ReCode whole draw, light, sprites and models routines in 100 % assembler.
: - AmigaStylize.
: - Add 16 and 24 Bit support.
Hope they are gonna do this stuff soon :)
Especially AGA part, since have no gfx card... and hope it will be playable
on 030@50...
Btw, how fast is it currently?
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Daniel Schmitt
Way to go, Tim! Several questions: How close is it to FEELING like the
original? What kinda frame-rate do you get on a 030/50? 060/50? When
can we expect a public-beta? Are you considering talking to Id? Will a
future version support PPC and CV64 3D?
Can you imagine what will be possible with 68k+PPC+S3 working in tandem?!
If you can get the thing running SMOOOTH in 800x600 (or even just 640x480)
on a CGFX+PPC machine, Phase5 will have trouble keeping up with the
demands! Hell, even full-screen 320x240 will make me *very* *happy* if it
runs single-frame! <dreamy look>
laytz,
-Danny
--
+--------------------------+ \ | / +-------------------------+
| Daniel A. Schmitt |-------| '030@50 is too slow! |
| <dsch...@mentasm.com> | A12oo | 16Megs is too little! |
`--------------------------+-------+-------------------------'
/ | \
There is none other!
Philip Kaulfuss
tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
[stuff snipped]
: Just thought i'd post this here to make a few of you wet yourselves ;)
: (before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
I'll believe it when I see it. =) I guess it is quite feasible on the Amiga
though. And if this is for real, add AGA support. Please. Sir. ;)
--
,-----------------------------------------------------------.
:-: Philip Kaulfuss :---------------------------------------:
:-: ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk :-------------------------------:
:-: PhilK in UnderNet #AmigaCafe :--------------------------:
:-: http://www.boehme.demon.co.uk :-------------------------:
:-: Gfx artist for the freeware gorefest 'Urban Massacre' :-:
`-----------------------------------------------------------'
Troels Walsted Hansen
In article <2840.6985...@angeldos.demon.co.uk>,
dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk (tim) wrote:
>Direct port of the original Quake v1.01 from ID Software.
>Just thought i'd post this here to make a few of you wet yourselves ;)
>(before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
Yeah, it exists, and it runs. Terribly buggy though, but then I only tried
v0.1, will have have to get v 0.2 I guess. :)
T r o e l s W a l s t e d H a n s e n
tro...@stud.cs.uit.no - http://www.cs.uit.no/~troels
Even Sandvik Underlid
>Direct port of the original Quake v1.01 from ID Software.
WHAAAAAT?
>Amiga Computer.
>68020/30/40/60 processor.
>CyberGraphX graphic board with 320x200x256 screemode.
>8-10 Megz of free memory.
>ShareWare or Registered Quake.
COOOOOOL!
>Just thought i'd post this here to make a few of you wet yourselves ;)
WOOOOOOW!
>(before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
Where can I get this? I WANT IT!!! NOW!!!
-- rUSTYBRAIn --
Even Sandvik Underlid
>Way to go, Tim! Several questions: How close is it to FEELING like the
>original? What kinda frame-rate do you get on a 030/50? 060/50? When
>can we expect a public-beta? Are you considering talking to Id? Will a
>future version support PPC and CV64 3D?
They'll have to, or I'll get my BIG weaponloving friend to
kick their asses. Or something.
Sorry for writing bullshit, this just sounds too good to be
true!
>Can you imagine what will be possible with 68k+PPC+S3 working in tandem?!
>If you can get the thing running SMOOOTH in 800x600 (or even just 640x480)
>on a CGFX+PPC machine, Phase5 will have trouble keeping up with the
>demands! Hell, even full-screen 320x240 will make me *very* *happy* if it
>runs single-frame! <dreamy look>
I agree! I have ordered a Picasso2, but maybe I should go
for a CyberVision3D instead? ANYTHING to run Quake (not
that I want to play that boring game, just drool over it!)
-- rUSTYBRAIn --
tim
>tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>[snipp]
>: **************************************************************************
>: ****
>: * To Do
>: *
>: **************************************************************************
>: ****
>: - Add Sound
>: - Add multiple Graphics resolutions 640x480, 800x600, etc.
>: - Add AGA and ECS graphics modes.
>: - Add v1.06 bullshit.
>: - ReCode whole draw, light, sprites and models routines in 100 % assembler.
>: - AmigaStylize.
>: - Add 16 and 24 Bit support.
>Hope they are gonna do this stuff soon :)
>Especially AGA part, since have no gfx card... and hope it will be playable
>on 030@50...
>Btw, how fast is it currently?
Right now it's not that quick with a gfx card, that will change though. I'm
afraid anything less than 040/40mhz isn't going to be vaguely usable and a gfx
card is a MUST for this kind of thing. AGA is too slow in 8bit. Think about
getting a gfx card, they are getting cheaper and more and more games support
both cybergfx/Picasso96 and/or AHI sound retargetting. If you want the games of
2morrow you cant do it with a 1992 spec machine. Sorry :(
Much talk of a PPC + 68k version is being made right now, if this happens the
game will run very very quickly. (I'm off to order a PPC ;)
Tim
tim
>Way to go, Tim! Several questions: How close is it to FEELING like the
>original? What kinda frame-rate do you get on a 030/50? 060/50? When
>can we expect a public-beta? Are you considering talking to Id? Will a
>future version support PPC and CV64 3D?
The game engine is EXACTLY the one from ID. This is a port plain and simple!
I'm told that the game isn't too nippy on 060/CV64 in it's 0.1 config - i'll
talk to people tonight and find out about 0.2. Remember that this will
change as routines are 'amigarized' i.e. crap ID code removed ;)
The version out now is Public, if the author wants to put it on the Aminet he
can - but i'd suggest ID's lawyers will scream 'profit loss' if this happens.
This, of course, is bullshit and the game will continue to be ported and
spread no matter what. Personally I think this is great stuff, since it
trounces PC users claims that it 'isnt possible' on the Amiga.
>Can you imagine what will be possible with 68k+PPC+S3 working in tandem?!
No - i can't *IMAGINE* this since it would damage my brain too much!!! A
multiprocessor Quake 060+PPC+Picasso96/Cybergfx would literally run rings
around the PC version. Oh yes indeedy!
>If you can get the thing running SMOOOTH in 800x600 (or even just 640x480)
>on a CGFX+PPC machine, Phase5 will have trouble keeping up with the
>demands! Hell, even full-screen 320x240 will make me *very* *happy* if it
>runs single-frame! <dreamy look>
I hear you brother! :^) hehehe... Yeah but please dont forget the PicassoIV
and Picasso96 - it's faster ;) I guess you meant sales of PPC boards?
PPC will be mine soon as they release it for the CyberStorm II.
Happy gaming,
Tim
tim
>tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>[stuff snipped]
>: Just thought i'd post this here to make a few of you wet yourselves ;)
>: (before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
>I'll believe it when I see it. =) I guess it is quite feasible on the Amiga
>though. And if this is for real, add AGA support. Please. Sir. ;)
Aha! Pessimist ? It is REAL... people are running it right now.. and yes it is
possible since the Quake source has been around for a while. If you want a PC-
beater may I suggest AGA wont do the job? Ok, it will probably be 'playable'
but all the PC lot play quake in high res high depth screens - and boy does it
look nice!
Tim
(NOT the author of AmigaQuake!!! PLEASE STOP ASKING ME SPECIFICS!)
tim
>>Way to go, Tim! Several questions: How close is it to FEELING like the
>>original? What kinda frame-rate do you get on a 030/50? 060/50? When
>>can we expect a public-beta? Are you considering talking to Id? Will a
>>future version support PPC and CV64 3D?
>They'll have to, or I'll get my BIG weaponloving friend to
>kick their asses. Or something.
>Sorry for writing bullshit, this just sounds too good to be
>true!
Yeah I know what you mean... It took me about 7 mins to accept it - and i had
the file in front of me!
>>Can you imagine what will be possible with 68k+PPC+S3 working in tandem?!
>>If you can get the thing running SMOOOTH in 800x600 (or even just 640x480)
>>on a CGFX+PPC machine, Phase5 will have trouble keeping up with the
>>demands! Hell, even full-screen 320x240 will make me *very* *happy* if it
>>runs single-frame! <dreamy look>
>I agree! I have ordered a Picasso2, but maybe I should go
>for a CyberVision3D instead? ANYTHING to run Quake (not
>that I want to play that boring game, just drool over it!)
>-- rUSTYBRAIn --
Personally i'm going for the PicassoIV as it's faster and they'll do a 3D
module for it anyway... coupled with sound card, PCI slots, EDO 64bit mem
access, mpeg module, tv tuner... etc.. ;)
CV3D is slower than CV64 on 2D stuff...
Tim
James William Barton
>>Way to go, Tim! Several questions: How close is it to FEELING like the
>>original? What kinda frame-rate do you get on a 030/50? 060/50? When
>>can we expect a public-beta? Are you considering talking to Id? Will a
>>future version support PPC and CV64 3D?
>The game engine is EXACTLY the one from ID. This is a port plain and simple!
>I'm told that the game isn't too nippy on 060/CV64 in it's 0.1 config - i'll
>talk to people tonight and find out about 0.2. Remember that this will
>change as routines are 'amigarized' i.e. crap ID code removed ;) The version
>out now is Public, if the author wants to put it on the Aminet he can - but
>i'd suggest ID's lawyers will scream 'profit loss' if this happens. This, of
>course, is bullshit and the game will continue to be ported and spread no
>matter what. Personally I think this is great stuff, since it trounces PC
>users claims that it 'isnt possible' on the Amiga.
ID can't do a thing unless it becomes commercial or they charge for it :)
Apparently they left the sources (the fools!) on a *public access ftp server*
I've heard that two finnish guys are also working on a port, I don't know
where they got there sources, but probably the same place.
For now, ID can't do a single thing! (If they even know what an amiga is)
>I hear you brother! :^) hehehe... Yeah but please dont forget the PicassoIV
>and Picasso96 - it's faster ;) I guess you meant sales of PPC boards?
>PPC will be mine soon as they release it for the CyberStorm II.
>Happy gaming,
>Tim
James Barton - Ja...@bartonjw.demon.co.uk (Home)
What's brown and sticky? A Stick
Michael Merkel
dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk (tim) wrote the 16.02.1997 at 00:43:04 Uhr about
"Re: Amiga Quake - Arrives!":
[...]
> The game engine is EXACTLY the one from ID. This is a port plain and simple!
> I'm told that the game isn't too nippy on 060/CV64 in it's 0.1 config - i'll
> talk to people tonight and find out about 0.2. Remember that this will
> change as routines are 'amigarized' i.e. crap ID code removed ;)
> The version out now is Public, if the author wants to put it on the Aminet he
> can - but i'd suggest ID's lawyers will scream 'profit loss' if this happens.
> This, of course, is bullshit and the game will continue to be ported and
> spread no matter what. Personally I think this is great stuff, since it
> trounces PC users claims that it 'isnt possible' on the Amiga.
hi!
where can we find this public version to have a look at it??
please tell me!
byebye...
--
/\ /\ ' _ |_ _ _ | /\ /\ Mis...@Asylum.prometheus.de
| \/ | | | ` | ) _) (_ | | \/ | mme...@rumms.uni-mannheim.de
| | | |_, | | (_|_ (_ (_ | | MiMe @IRC
HomePage at: "http://webrum.uni-mannheim.de/fht/mmerkel/www/index.html"
MicroDot V1.12
Philip Kaulfuss
tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: Aha! Pessimist ? It is REAL... people are running it right now.. and yes it is
: possible since the Quake source has been around for a while. If you want a PC-
: beater may I suggest AGA wont do the job? Ok, it will probably be 'playable'
: but all the PC lot play quake in high res high depth screens - and boy does it
: look nice!
Yeah, I believe you now, but after reading about things like Noah Rosenberg's
mythical TKG Patch, I'm more cautious these days. =)
I have a 40 MHz 040, and I want to get a GFX card, but that would also mean
buying a tower case for my A1200, and getting a multisync monitor (I have a PAL
one at the mo). I just can't afford all that. Yeah, I know, AGA sucks, but
it's what most people have right now, so could you tell the author to
reconsider? =)
Even Sandvik Underlid
>>Direct port of the original Quake v1.01 from ID Software.
>>(before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
>v0.1, will have have to get v 0.2 I guess. :)
WHERE can I get it?
How is the speed, and will AGA-modes be a priority for the
developers or something far in the future?
How about a DOOM/DOOM2-port for 030-owners? ;-)
-- rUSTYBRAIn --
Johan Forsberg
The only way to get it is to pirate it...
Pester someone who has it already...
(ID software, the greedy bastards, want $1000000000+ (OK, so I'm exaggerating)
to allow anyone to port their games. Even though they make all their money
on *registrations*, and thus have nothing to loose, and money to gain.)
--
<--/---\------78-cols-----------------^-----Your-Name-Here------Something---->
/ Small*<-Perth Make Your Very 4 rows em...@address.here witty some dead
/ Ascii \ Own Signature File! | Profession Here guy once said
\ Picture / Follow The Instructions v Other Personal Info here
tim
>>>Way to go, Tim! Several questions: How close is it to FEELING like the
>>>original? What kinda frame-rate do you get on a 030/50? 060/50? When
>>>can we expect a public-beta? Are you considering talking to Id? Will a
>>>future version support PPC and CV64 3D?
>>The game engine is EXACTLY the one from ID. This is a port plain and
>>simple! I'm told that the game isn't too nippy on 060/CV64 in it's 0.1
>>config - i'll talk to people tonight and find out about 0.2. Remember that
>>this will change as routines are 'amigarized' i.e. crap ID code removed ;)
>>The version out now is Public, if the author wants to put it on the Aminet
>>he can - but i'd suggest ID's lawyers will scream 'profit loss' if this
>>happens. This, of course, is bullshit and the game will continue to be
>>ported and spread no matter what. Personally I think this is great stuff,
>>since it trounces PC users claims that it 'isnt possible' on the Amiga.
>ID can't do a thing unless it becomes commercial or they charge for it :)
>Apparently they left the sources (the fools!) on a *public access ftp server*
>I've heard that two finnish guys are also working on a port, I don't know
>where they got there sources, but probably the same place.
Yeah i heard the same thing, I have been offered the source code myself ;)
Another port underway? Can only be a good thing..
The 'scene' spans both PC and Amiga so doubtless the source changed hands like
that.
>For now, ID can't do a single thing! (If they even know what an amiga is)
If thats true, then I'm glad.. If ID could axe it right now that'd really piss
me off.. I'd have to attack them physically :)
>>I hear you brother! :^) hehehe... Yeah but please dont forget the PicassoIV
>>and Picasso96 - it's faster ;) I guess you meant sales of PPC boards?
>>PPC will be mine soon as they release it for the CyberStorm II.
L8r
Tim
tim
>dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk (tim) wrote the 16.02.1997 at 00:43:04 Uhr about
>"Re: Amiga Quake - Arrives!":
>[...]
>> simple! I'm told that the game isn't too nippy on 060/CV64 in it's 0.1
>> config - i'll talk to people tonight and find out about 0.2. Remember that
>> this will change as routines are 'amigarized' i.e. crap ID code removed ;)
>> The version out now is Public, if the author wants to put it on the Aminet
>> he can - but i'd suggest ID's lawyers will scream 'profit loss' if this
>> happens. This, of course, is bullshit and the game will continue to be
>> ported and spread no matter what. Personally I think this is great stuff,
>> since it trounces PC users claims that it 'isnt possible' on the Amiga.
>hi!
>where can we find this public version to have a look at it??
>please tell me!
>byebye...
>--
> /\ /\ ' _ |_ _ _ | /\ /\ Mis...@Asylum.prometheus.de
>| \/ | | | ` | ) _) (_ | | \/ | mme...@rumms.uni-mannheim.de
>| | | |_, | | (_|_ (_ (_ | | MiMe @IRC
>HomePage at: "http://webrum.uni-mannheim.de/fht/mmerkel/www/index.html"
>MicroDot V1.12
As soon as i've talked to the author i'll see if we can't arrange a posting to
the newsgroup - would you all allow me to post a binary here ?
Tim
tim
>>>Direct port of the original Quake v1.01 from ID Software.
>>>Just thought i'd post this here to make a few of you wet yourselves ;)
>>>(before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
>>Yeah, it exists, and it runs. Terribly buggy though, but then I only tried
>>v0.1, will have have to get v 0.2 I guess. :)
>WHERE can I get it?
>How is the speed, and will AGA-modes be a priority for the
>developers or something far in the future?
>How about a DOOM/DOOM2-port for 030-owners? ;-)
>-- rUSTYBRAIn --
Moan moan moan ;)
V0.3 supports AGA theoretically... Probably not *too* fast tho ;)
Tim
tim
>tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>: Aha! Pessimist ? It is REAL... people are running it right now.. and yes
>: it is possible since the Quake source has been around for a while. If you
>: want a PC- beater may I suggest AGA wont do the job? Ok, it will probably
>: be 'playable' but all the PC lot play quake in high res high depth screens
>: - and boy does it look nice!
>Yeah, I believe you now, but after reading about things like Noah Rosenberg's
>mythical TKG Patch, I'm more cautious these days. =)
>I have a 40 MHz 040, and I want to get a GFX card, but that would also mean
>buying a tower case for my A1200, and getting a multisync monitor (I have a
>PAL one at the mo). I just can't afford all that. Yeah, I know, AGA sucks,
>but it's what most people have right now, so could you tell the author to
>reconsider? =)
V0.3 supports AGA...
Tim
(and buy a gfx card wuss!)
Stefan Boberg
tim <dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>The game engine is EXACTLY the one from ID. This is a port plain and simple!
>I'm told that the game isn't too nippy on 060/CV64 in it's 0.1 config - i'll
>talk to people tonight and find out about 0.2. Remember that this will
>change as routines are 'amigarized' i.e. crap ID code removed ;)
'Crap id code removed?'. You've got to be joking.
>The version out now is Public, if the author wants to put it on the Aminet he
>can - but i'd suggest ID's lawyers will scream 'profit loss' if this happens.
>This, of course, is bullshit and the game will continue to be ported and
>spread no matter what.
I'd just like to point out that this is highly illegal. It is
illegal to redistribute any software that has compiled using source
code obtained through illegal means. Not that anyone cares, but it
pisses me off to see someone claim credit for work produced by someone
like John Carmack.
[Cue ObButYouWereACrackerToo remark...]
>Personally I think this is great stuff, since it
>trounces PC users claims that it 'isnt possible' on the Amiga.
Bah. Anything's possible on the Amiga. It's just going to be so
pointlessly slow. Like entering Le Mans with a mini.
>Happy gaming,
>Tim
--
=====================================================================
Stefan Boberg Vrooooom With a View... bob...@team17.com
Philip Kaulfuss
tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: V0.3 supports AGA...
I've got it now. =)
: (and buy a gfx card wuss!)
Oooh, leave me alone you nasty man! ;)
Terry Fry
>>dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk (tim) wrote the 16.02.1997 at 00:43:04 Uhr about
>>"Re: Amiga Quake - Arrives!":
>>[...]
>>> simple! I'm told that the game isn't too nippy on 060/CV64 in it's 0.1
>>> config - i'll talk to people tonight and find out about 0.2. Remember
>>> that this will change as routines are 'amigarized' i.e. crap ID code
>>> the Aminet he can - but i'd suggest ID's lawyers will scream 'profit loss'
>>> if this happens. This, of course, is bullshit and the game will continue
>>> stuff, since it trounces PC users claims that it 'isnt possible' on the
>>> Amiga.
>>hi!
>>where can we find this public version to have a look at it??
>>please tell me!
>>byebye...
>>--
>> /\ /\ ' _ |_ _ _ | /\ /\ Mis...@Asylum.prometheus.de
>>| \/ | | | ` | ) _) (_ | | \/ | mme...@rumms.uni-mannheim.de
>>| | | |_, | | (_|_ (_ (_ | | MiMe @IRC
>>HomePage at: "http://webrum.uni-mannheim.de/fht/mmerkel/www/index.html"
>>MicroDot V1.12
>As soon as i've talked to the author i'll see if we can't arrange a posting
>to the newsgroup - would you all allow me to post a binary here ?
>Tim
Put it in the alt.binaries.games.quake newsgroup. Perfect place for it.
Angus Manwaring
tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: >where can we find this public version to have a look at it??
: >please tell me!
:
: As soon as i've talked to the author i'll see if we can't arrange a posting to
: the newsgroup - would you all allow me to post a binary here ?
:
No this group is definitely not the place, how about a web-page?
--
Regards,
Angus. D
Dv
misc...@csc.canterbury.ac.nz
> Direct port of the original Quake v1.01 from ID Software.
[snip]
> Just thought i'd post this here to make a few of you wet yourselves ;)
> (before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
Why didn't you port a -real- game, like Duke Nukem, or Doom 2?
Nobody likes Quake... nice engine, but nobody likes the game...
(except maybe in a network/telnet session...)
Duke I would've been interested in, till then I reserve the right
-not- to wet myself, just yet.
Nathan.
(n.w...@student.canterbury.ac.nz)
PS: At the risk of sounding contradictory, damn good job though.
If this works as good as it sounds, it'll still be interesting,
just not wettingly so.
misc...@csc.canterbury.ac.nz
In article <970215185...@boehme.demon.co.uk>, Philip Kaulfuss <ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk> writes:
> tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
> [stuff snipped]
> : Just thought i'd post this here to make a few of you wet yourselves ;)
> : (before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
> I'll believe it when I see it. =) I guess it is quite feasible on the Amiga
> though. And if this is for real, add AGA support. Please. Sir. ;)
I suspect AGA would quite have the bandwidth to handle it very well. :-(
Though, alternatively - albeit more-expensively - I did hear mention once
of a GFX-card that plugs into the RGB-port, and thus works on A1200's?
(It's name -may- have been the graffiti-board....)
Does anyone know about this beastie? Is this related in any way to the
device proposed by Fabio? Or does anyone know if this exists or is any
good?
Just wondering...
Nathan.
(n.w...@student.canterbury.ac.nz)
Mathew Hendry
Philip Kaulfuss (ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
:
: [stuff snipped]
:
: : Just thought i'd post this here to make a few of you wet yourselves ;)
: : (before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
:
: I'll believe it when I see it. =) I guess it is quite feasible on the Amiga
: though. And if this is for real, add AGA support. Please. Sir. ;)
AGA support is there, AFAIK. Don't expect it to fly, though.
-- Mat.
Jyrki O Saarinen
Stefan Boberg <bob...@team17.com> wrote:
: Bah. Anything's possible on the Amiga. It's just going to be so
: pointlessly slow. Like entering Le Mans with a mini.
I dont see any reason why Quake Amiga port wouldnt run ~10fps
on 040/40 and faster on 060 when correctly optimized in low-res.
Because of advanced algorithms Quake should run nicely
and MUCH faster on 040 than on 486 because of its slow FPU.
(non-pipelined, it cant execute fdiv in the backround)
--
http://www.helsinki.fi/~jxsaarin/ - University of Helsinki, Computer Science
Jyrki O Saarinen
In comp.sys.amiga.hardware Philip Kaulfuss <ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk> wrote:
: : (and buy a gfx card wuss!)
: Oooh, leave me alone you nasty man! ;)
In Quakes case using a ZIII graphics card wont speed up much
since it is playable from 040 and up because of the use of
floating point math and the fact that c2p is free from c2p
and most of the time goes to rendering the screen
anyway.
Hearing 5fps 060+CV64 is sad, but that is probably without
any assembly and bad compiler and trapping math routines.
The solution is 060 math lib and SAS/C 6.57.
And I have already done a very optimized routine in assembly
which takes the most time in Quake. (Span renderer)
On 030/FPU combination Quake will be so slow that it
cant be played at all because of slow FPU. Recoding
to fixed point would be quite a job but not impossible
though.
Anyway, 040/40 should be about 10fps, and I am not surprised
at all if a proper Quake port would be faster on 040/40
than AB3D TKG because of very advanced algorithms.
tim
Ain't THAT the truth buddy!
BUY A PICASSOIV YOU LOVELY PEOPLE :)
Tim
Joris D inhuurkracht
> >I have a 40 MHz 040, and I want to get a GFX card, but that would also mean
> >buying a tower case for my A1200, and getting a multisync monitor (I have a
> >PAL one at the mo). I just can't afford all that. Yeah, I know, AGA sucks,
> >but it's what most people have right now, so could you tell the author to
> >reconsider? =)
>
> V0.3 supports AGA...
>
> Tim
>
>
I have a Merlin-II, will it be supported?? I guess not eh?
Maybe I should start bugging H. Raaf for CyberGFx support?
Bye,
Dennis.
--
Ing. D.M. Joris, Software Specialist,
Philips Sound & Vision / ASA Lab Eindhoven, Building SFJ-769
Tel: +31 40 2732453 Fax: +31 4027 37353
------------------------------------------------------------------
E-mail @ work : jor...@iclab.ce.philips.nl
E-mail @ home : g...@iaehv.nl
Homepage : http://www.iaehv.nl/users/gto
Nick
Jyrki O Saarinen (jxsa...@cc.Helsinki.FI) wrote:
: On 030/FPU combination Quake will be so slow that it
: cant be played at all because of slow FPU. Recoding
: to fixed point would be quite a job but not impossible
: though.
I hope you (or someone) will change it to fixed point math. It is faster,
and will allow to more ppl at least to try it.
: Anyway, 040/40 should be about 10fps, and I am not surprised
: at all if a proper Quake port would be faster on 040/40
: than AB3D TKG because of very advanced algorithms.
well, ab3dii runs on 030 at approx 10fps (or mebbe a bit slower), so
amigaquake (after it has been optimized, changed to fixed point math),
should run 10fps on 030.
--
E-Mail: nfra...@public.srce.hr nfra...@zems.fer.hr | Powered by:
ni...@fly.cc.fer.hr |-| A1200
WWW: http://diana.zems.fer.hr/~nfrances |------| Blizzard 1230-IV
CroAminet: ftp://thphys.irb.hr/pub/aminet |---| 2+16 MB RAM : 125+200MB HD
Nick
: : Bah. Anything's possible on the Amiga. It's just going to be so
: : pointlessly slow. Like entering Le Mans with a mini.
: I dont see any reason why Quake Amiga port wouldnt run ~10fps
: on 040/40 and faster on 060 when correctly optimized in low-res.
Well, I *would* expect game like quake to run as fast as ab3dII, since it is
approx of same complexity, and also considering that ab3dII wasn't too much
optimized (I dont't say it is bad, but it should have been faster).
GROUT LEN EDWARD
: BUY A PICASSOIV YOU LOVELY PEOPLE :)
: Tim
All I can say is WOW!! Maybe this is exactly what we need to make software
companies stand up and take notice. Maybe T17 won't leave us just yet?
To tell the truth, I would only get Quake to show PentUp users that once
again anything is possible on an Amiga!!!
Anyway, I couldn't sleep at all last night after reading about
The Quake breakthrough. <huge Dreamy Look>
Now I have a ?. What is the difference between CV64 and the
PicassoIV? I haven't read anything about PIV yet.
--
\ /
\ ~ ~ /
\ * * /
\ /
\ <> /
\ /
\ [] /
Len \ / Jerri
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^\/^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
John Girvin
In article <970216130...@boehme.demon.co.uk> Philip Kaulfuss <ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk> writes:
[AmigaQuake on AGA]
>I have a 40 MHz 040, and I want to get a GFX card, but that would also mean
>buying a tower case for my A1200, and getting a multisync monitor (I have a PAL
>one at the mo). I just can't afford all that. Yeah, I know, AGA sucks, but
>it's what most people have right now, so could you tell the author to
>reconsider? =)
Well Id like to upgrade my A1200 like that as well, but until I win
the lottery it aint gonna happen :-/
So please, please, pleeeeease make AmigaQuake AGA!
/John.
--
____________________________________________________________________________
|00 John Girvin : developing software for Unibol Inc., speaking for myself |
|\/ jgi...@bfs.unibol.com | Amiga,68k,net,SciFi,MTB,TaiJutsu,house,techno |
| gi...@girvnet.demon.co.uk | Youll never take me alive, Macro$loth fiends! |
\ http://www.girvnet.demon.co.uk --- A1200/030+882-40/2+8Mb --- Team AMIGA /
John Girvin
In article <1440.6986...@concentric.net> Terry Fry <maf...@concentric.net> writes:
>
>Put it in the alt.binaries.games.quake newsgroup. Perfect place for it.
>
Oh yes! Good one :)
John Girvin
In article <503.6986...@sn.no> Even Sandvik Underlid <evu...@sn.no> writes:
>How about a DOOM/DOOM2-port for 030-owners? ;-)
YES! Id second that :)
John Girvin
In article <970216194...@boehme.demon.co.uk> Philip Kaulfuss <ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk> writes:
>tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>
>: V0.3 supports AGA...
>
>I've got it now. =)
Where! Where!
I wanna see it!
Nick
John Girvin (gi...@girvnet.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: In article <970216130...@boehme.demon.co.uk> Philip Kaulfuss <ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk> writes:
: [AmigaQuake on AGA]
: >I have a 40 MHz 040, and I want to get a GFX card, but that would also mean
: >buying a tower case for my A1200, and getting a multisync monitor (I have a PAL
: >one at the mo). I just can't afford all that. Yeah, I know, AGA sucks, but
: >it's what most people have right now, so could you tell the author to
: >reconsider? =)
: Well Id like to upgrade my A1200 like that as well, but until I win
: the lottery it aint gonna happen :-/
: So please, please, pleeeeease make AmigaQuake AGA!
They already made it, and your current config will suffice.
tim
>> >I have a 40 MHz 040, and I want to get a GFX card, but that would also
>> >mean buying a tower case for my A1200, and getting a multisync monitor (I
>> >have a PAL one at the mo). I just can't afford all that. Yeah, I know,
>> >AGA sucks, but it's what most people have right now, so could you tell the
>> >author to reconsider? =)
>>
>>
>> Tim
>>
>> (and buy a gfx card wuss!)
>>
>I have a Merlin-II, will it be supported?? I guess not eh?
>Maybe I should start bugging H. Raaf for CyberGFx support?
>Bye,
>Dennis.
Bug the Piccasso96 folk :) and then bug everyone else to support it!
Tim
tim
>In comp.sys.amiga.hardware Philip Kaulfuss <ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>: : (and buy a gfx card wuss!)
>: Oooh, leave me alone you nasty man! ;)
>In Quakes case using a ZIII graphics card wont speed up much
>since it is playable from 040 and up because of the use of
>floating point math and the fact that c2p is free from c2p
>and most of the time goes to rendering the screen
>anyway.
Any increase in graphic output speed will only speed things up..
>Hearing 5fps 060+CV64 is sad, but that is probably without
>any assembly and bad compiler and trapping math routines.
>The solution is 060 math lib and SAS/C 6.57.
>And I have already done a very optimized routine in assembly
>which takes the most time in Quake. (Span renderer)
Thats right, ID's original code is designed to suck lots of CPU time from high
end pentiums. Speed will improve with time and recoding :)
>On 030/FPU combination Quake will be so slow that it
>cant be played at all because of slow FPU. Recoding
>to fixed point would be quite a job but not impossible
>though.
Running Quake on anything less than 040/40 is a meaningless excercise.
>Anyway, 040/40 should be about 10fps, and I am not surprised
>at all if a proper Quake port would be faster on 040/40
>than AB3D TKG because of very advanced algorithms.
AB3D TKG is full of slow code, lets hope the TKGPATCH folk do a good job with
updating it all :)
Tim
tim
>: : Bah. Anything's possible on the Amiga. It's just going to be so
>: : pointlessly slow. Like entering Le Mans with a mini.
>: I dont see any reason why Quake Amiga port wouldnt run ~10fps
>: on 040/40 and faster on 060 when correctly optimized in low-res.
>Well, I *would* expect game like quake to run as fast as ab3dII, since it is
>approx of same complexity, and also considering that ab3dII wasn't too much
>optimized (I dont't say it is bad, but it should have been faster).
Quake is more complex, it contains a hell of lot of texture mapped polygons
for a start! Couple that with higher resolution/more colours things get
slight more complex. However it should run fluidly eventually but you will
need a fast gfx card (e.g. PicassoIV) to do it :)
Tim
John Shiali
GROUT LEN EDWARD wrote...
> : BUY A PICASSOIV YOU LOVELY PEOPLE :)
>
> : Tim All I can say is WOW!! Maybe this is exactly what we need to make
> software companies stand up and take notice. Maybe T17 won't leave us
> just yet? To tell the truth, I would only get Quake to show PentUp users
> that once again anything is possible on an Amiga!!! Anyway, I couldn't
> sleep at all last night after reading about The Quake breakthrough.
> <huge Dreamy Look> Now I have a ?. What is the difference between CV64
> and the PicassoIV? I haven't read anything about PIV yet. -- \
Sorry to burst your bubble, but we are about to fall further behind
than ever - the PC world has just got into hardware accelleration in a
big way - look at GLQuake, Tomb Raider, Descent2 (or anything else for
that matter) running on a 3DFX Voodoo card. This thing can push
1,000,000 polygons per second, does alpha blending, Z-buffering,
bi/tri-linear filtering, texture-mapping, etc, all for approx $200
street price. It's a seriously impressive bit of hardware with an
aggressive developer policy behind it.
Quake on the Amiga may be a big advance for us, but it's already
yesterday's news on the PC. Without the huge PC market enabling such
3D accelerator hardware to even exist at all, I doubt we will be able
to keep up (or even have the option to) when this kind of hardware
becomes standard on PC's, and all the ground breaking games expect to
use one.. :(
I won't give up my Amiga, but the commercial games market is all but
dead. We just can't provide the brute force hardware that the PC
market can. The developers will only see more money on the PC and
console side of the fence, and that's where they'll go. If you want to
play the best games, that's where you'll have to follow.
--
John -
Burt Reynolds and Jennifer Saunders seen leaving restaurant together.
Jeremy Beadle declines to comment.
============================== CUT =========================
--
John -
Zenophobia - a morbid fear of Buddhists.
tim
>Jyrki O Saarinen (jxsa...@cc.Helsinki.FI) wrote:
>: On 030/FPU combination Quake will be so slow that it
>: cant be played at all because of slow FPU. Recoding
>: to fixed point would be quite a job but not impossible
>: though.
>I hope you (or someone) will change it to fixed point math. It is faster,
>and will allow to more ppl at least to try it.
This isn't gonna happen..
>: Anyway, 040/40 should be about 10fps, and I am not surprised
>: at all if a proper Quake port would be faster on 040/40
>: than AB3D TKG because of very advanced algorithms.
>well, ab3dii runs on 030 at approx 10fps (or mebbe a bit slower), so
>amigaquake (after it has been optimized, changed to fixed point math),
>should run 10fps on 030.
Umm.. no :( AB3D does far less per frame than Quake - Quake has lots of extra
things to do - e.g. all the enemies are vector based rather than plain bitmaps.
Don't forget Quake requires a beefy Pentium on the PC and not without reason.
Oh and dont forget Quake runs in higher 1:1 resolutions than AB3D (which is only
in PAL:HIRES 1:2).
Tim
tim
>: BUY A PICASSOIV YOU LOVELY PEOPLE :)
>: Tim
>All I can say is WOW!! Maybe this is exactly what we need to make software
>companies stand up and take notice. Maybe T17 won't leave us just yet?
>To tell the truth, I would only get Quake to show PentUp users that once
>again anything is possible on an Amiga!!!
I think we all want it for this reason!
> Anyway, I couldn't sleep at all last night after reading about
>The Quake breakthrough. <huge Dreamy Look>
You should probably a: get out more or b: drink a whole lot more shandy :)
> Now I have a ?. What is the difference between CV64 and the
>PicassoIV? I haven't read anything about PIV yet.
Speed, resolution and expansion - if you want details point your WWW browser
at:
http://www.home.pages.de/~picassoIV/
..hold onto your jaw first tho! :)
Tim
Jonas Thorell
Stefan Boberg (bob...@team17.com) wrote:
> I'd just like to point out that this is highly illegal. It is
>illegal to redistribute any software that has compiled using source
>code obtained through illegal means. Not that anyone cares, but it
>pisses me off to see someone claim credit for work produced by someone
>like John Carmack.
Who claimed credit? Have you seen something I haven't?? I haven't seen
a single remark that the porters/hacker/crackers whatever you want to
call them that says "This is all our work". Sure, they stole ID's code
but atleast they didn't say it was theirs.
> Bah. Anything's possible on the Amiga. It's just going to be so
>pointlessly slow. Like entering Le Mans with a mini.
Probably, since it's slow on anything below P90 atleast (if you don't
turn off all details and shrink the playing-window). I haven't seen
this port and quite frankly, I'd be more interested in seeing someone
port DukeNukem. Quake is just nice looking graphics with no gameplay.
---
Jonas Thorell |Internet: jon...@bahnhof.se |"Animals are our
Skyttbacksvägen 11 |Fidonet: 2:206/124.7 |to wear, eat and
740 34 Skyttorp |Voice: +46-18-352444 | experiment on"
Sweden | |- Cat rapes dog
---
Colorless green odors gravitate furiously.
Jason Quigley
On 17 Feb 97 14:19:17 +1200, misc...@csc.canterbury.ac.nz wrote:
>In article <970215185...@boehme.demon.co.uk>, Philip Kaulfuss <ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk> writes:
>> I'll believe it when I see it. =) I guess it is quite feasible on the Amiga
>> though. And if this is for real, add AGA support. Please. Sir. ;)
>
>I suspect AGA would quite have the bandwidth to handle it very well. :-(
Someone should see if the guy who did the "Savage" 8 bit AGA graphics
driver for Shapeshifter is willing to cook up something for these
illegal Quakes.
--
Jason Quigley
qu...@rogers.wave.ca
Devout Amiga, 3DO, Star Wars, Star Control,
Twin Peaks and Toronto Maple Leafs fan.
Hans Guijt
>As soon as i've talked to the author i'll see if we can't arrange a posting
>to the newsgroup - would you all allow me to post a binary here ?
*NO*. We have *AMINET* for that sort of thing!
Or put it on alt.binaries.quake or whatever, the PC crowd will enjoy that ;-)
Hans
tim
>In article <970216130...@boehme.demon.co.uk> Philip Kaulfuss
><ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk> writes:
>[AmigaQuake on AGA]
>>buying a tower case for my A1200, and getting a multisync monitor (I have a
>>PAL one at the mo). I just can't afford all that. Yeah, I know, AGA sucks,
>>but it's what most people have right now, so could you tell the author to
>>reconsider? =)
>Well Id like to upgrade my A1200 like that as well, but until I win
>the lottery it aint gonna happen :-/
>So please, please, pleeeeease make AmigaQuake AGA!
It's already happened, AmigaQuake supports AGA!
Tim
tim
>>How about a DOOM/DOOM2-port for 030-owners? ;-)
>YES! Id second that :)
>/John.
>--
>____________________________________________________________________________
>|00 John Girvin : developing software for Unibol Inc., speaking for myself |
>|\/ jgi...@bfs.unibol.com | Amiga,68k,net,SciFi,MTB,TaiJutsu,house,techno |
>| gi...@girvnet.demon.co.uk | Youll never take me alive, Macro$loth fiends! |
>\ http://www.girvnet.demon.co.uk --- A1200/030+882-40/2+8Mb --- Team AMIGA /
Get shapeshifter :)
Tim
tim
>GROUT LEN EDWARD wrote...
>> : BUY A PICASSOIV YOU LOVELY PEOPLE :)
>>
>> : Tim All I can say is WOW!! Maybe this is exactly what we need to make
>> software companies stand up and take notice. Maybe T17 won't leave us
>> just yet? To tell the truth, I would only get Quake to show PentUp users
>> that once again anything is possible on an Amiga!!! Anyway, I couldn't
>> sleep at all last night after reading about The Quake breakthrough.
>> <huge Dreamy Look> Now I have a ?. What is the difference between CV64
>> and the PicassoIV? I haven't read anything about PIV yet. -- \
>Sorry to burst your bubble, but we are about to fall further behind
>than ever - the PC world has just got into hardware accelleration in a
>big way - look at GLQuake, Tomb Raider, Descent2 (or anything else for
>that matter) running on a 3DFX Voodoo card. This thing can push
>1,000,000 polygons per second, does alpha blending, Z-buffering,
>bi/tri-linear filtering, texture-mapping, etc, all for approx $200
>street price. It's a seriously impressive bit of hardware with an
>aggressive developer policy behind it.
New gfx cards such as the PicassoIV and CV3D both tackle this already :)
The PicassoIV has PCI and a 3D option coming out... CV3D has 3D functions right
now, when in truth we dont need them yet.
Yes this stuff certainly exists on the PC, but it's yet to really take off.
Sure, it will do but it'll take a little time to do so. The fact is, 3D cards
have been around for a long time, but PC owners choose fast 2D cards right now
since not many games support them.
Powerup PPC is designed to help us hold our own this year, with ABOX being the
progressive step after that. IF you REALLY want state of the art gaming at good
pricing the Playstation has been around for ages and the Playstation 2 will
replace that in the near future!
Perhaps the most enduring and endearing thing about Amigas are the users, who
constantly proove we can 'keep up'. If it doesn't exist for the Amiga now, it
will do 2morrow ;)
>Quake on the Amiga may be a big advance for us, but it's already
>yesterday's news on the PC. Without the huge PC market enabling such
>3D accelerator hardware to even exist at all, I doubt we will be able
>to keep up (or even have the option to) when this kind of hardware
>becomes standard on PC's, and all the ground breaking games expect to
>use one.. :(
Anything you can add to PC you can add to an Amiga. Right down at the roots the
Amiga is more open to expanision, as recent developments have shown. Sure, we
may be behind, but ask this - when is Quake out for Powermac? Soon, but not
now. Quake is far from yesterdays news for the Mac community.
Tim
tim
>tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>: >where can we find this public version to have a look at it??
>: >please tell me!
>:
>: As soon as i've talked to the author i'll see if we can't arrange a posting
>: to the newsgroup - would you all allow me to post a binary here ?
>:
>No this group is definitely not the place, how about a web-page?
>--
> Regards,
> Angus. D
> Dv
I'll try and arrange an FTP server, but i feel that i must post it as so many
have now asked for it and i can't cope! It's not very large as it's only the
engine, not the whole thing! Appr. 200k archived!
Tim
Espen Berntsen
>>>Direct port of the original Quake v1.01 from ID Software.
>>>Just thought i'd post this here to make a few of you wet yourselves ;)
>>>(before you ask.. this exists.. on my HD right now..)
>>v0.1, will have have to get v 0.2 I guess. :)
>WHERE can I get it?
Pirate circles. It is not a supported port from ID.
>How is the speed, and will AGA-modes be a priority for the
>developers or something far in the future?
A bit under half the framerate of Ab3d-II on a 060. But remember that this
is only a rekolpile of the C sources.
--
Name...@ask.himolde.no <> Nameless @ IRC <> http://www.himolde.no/~espen
==========================================================================
DIPLOMACY: The art of letting somebody have your way.
John Shiali
tim wrote...
> >Sorry to burst your bubble, but we are about to fall further behind
> >than ever - the PC world has just got into hardware accelleration in a
> >big way - look at GLQuake, Tomb Raider, Descent2 (or anything else for
> >that matter) running on a 3DFX Voodoo card. This thing can push
> >1,000,000 polygons per second, does alpha blending, Z-buffering,
> >bi/tri-linear filtering, texture-mapping, etc, all for approx $200
> >street price. It's a seriously impressive bit of hardware with an
> >aggressive developer policy behind it.
>
> New gfx cards such as the PicassoIV and CV3D both tackle this already :)
> The PicassoIV has PCI and a 3D option coming out... CV3D has 3D
> functions right now, when in truth we dont need them yet. Yes this stuff
No they don't - just look at the speed and feature set available on
the PC Voodoo cards - there is nothing even vaguely close on the
Amiga. We're talking of cards designed to be better than the
Playstation dedicated hardware, aimed specifically at games
production. Take a look at the specs at www.3dfx.com - we are now so
far behind that it is scary. I can't see what the current Amigas can
offer, either in terms of hardware (platform) or market (money) to
tempt games developers back.
> certainly exists on the PC, but it's yet to really take off. Sure, it
> will do but it'll take a little time to do so. The fact is, 3D cards
> have been around for a long time, but PC owners choose fast 2D cards
> right now since not many games support them. Powerup PPC is designed to
As I wrote above, the PC world is just getting into hardware
acceleration, but the list of developers who see this as a way of
turning out PC games that look better than consoles is very long
indeed. Even though there is development lead time, games are already
appearing that take advantage of the hardware (or are all but
unplayable without it). People like Psygnosis are talking about all
their titles having 3D card support by end of 97, with many titles not
running without 3D hardware. Remember Psygnosis? They used to be quite
big on the Amiga...
> help us hold our own this year, with ABOX being the progressive step
> after that. IF you REALLY want state of the art gaming at good pricing
> the Playstation has been around for ages and the Playstation 2 will
But you can't play flight/space sims, don't have access to large
amounts of RAM and hard drive space, can't use a keyboard, play in
high resolution. These are things that consoles are bad at.
If you want state of the art gaming you go for a Playstation (cheap
option) or maxed out PC (expensive option), but I don't see how that
argument gets the games appearing on the Amiga. You seem to be telling
me if I want "state of the art gaming" I shouldn't be looking at the
Amiga - and I'd agree with you.
> replace that in the near future! Perhaps the most enduring and endearing
> thing about Amigas are the users, who constantly proove we can 'keep
> up'. If it doesn't exist for the Amiga now, it will do 2morrow ;)
Yes, but not in the world of comercial gaming - the *reality* is that
no one turning out quality games for a living is doing it for the
Amiga.
> Anything you can add to PC you can add to an Amiga. Right down at the
> roots the Amiga is more open to expanision, as recent developments have
> shown. Sure, we may be behind, but ask this - when is Quake out for
> Powermac? Soon, but not now. Quake is far from yesterdays news for the
> Mac community.
>
We don't have the market to tempt hardware or game developers -
without that there will be no 3D accelerator addon cards, and even if
there were, games companies can't see themselves selling games to us
in this non-existent market.
You say we can do anything that PC users can, but if the hardware is
not being built and the games companies won't program for us, then the
games market *is* dead. It's not about how good/bad the Amiga is,
it's about how market forces have killed off the gaming market for us.
Realistically, until the next generation of Amiga arrives and sells a
load of units, I can't see big games developers looking at the Amiga
as a viable gaming platform either in terms of hardware specs or size
of market any more than the Atari ST, C64, Sinclair Spectrum, etc...
One or two people porting ID's code from another platform/market does
not make a renaissance of Amiga gaming.
--
John -
What makes you think *I* did it?
Klaus Gillarek
Jyrki O Saarinen schrieb in comp.sys.amiga.hardware ueber "Re: Amiga Quake
- Arrives!":
> In comp.sys.amiga.hardware Philip Kaulfuss <ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
> : : (and buy a gfx card wuss!)
>
> : Oooh, leave me alone you nasty man! ;)
>
> In Quakes case using a ZIII graphics card wont speed up much
> since it is playable from 040 and up because of the use of
> floating point math and the fact that c2p is free from c2p
> and most of the time goes to rendering the screen
> anyway.
What's with the CV64? This card doesn't need a c2p.
---
with best regards
Klaus Gillarek tol...@turtle.insider.org
sz0...@rzmail.uni-erlangen.de
2:2490/1090.17@fidonet
Hans Guijt
>I'll try and arrange an FTP server, but i feel that i must post it as so many
>have now asked for it and i can't cope! It's not very large as it's only the
>engine, not the whole thing! Appr. 200k archived!
``Arrange?'' Put it on AMINET! That's what we have it for!
DON'T POST IT HERE!
Hans
Roger Strandberg
John Shiali (jo...@heights.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: Sorry to burst your bubble, but we are about to fall further behind
: than ever - the PC world has just got into hardware accelleration in a
: big way - look at GLQuake, Tomb Raider, Descent2 (or anything else for
: that matter) running on a 3DFX Voodoo card. This thing can push
: 1,000,000 polygons per second, does alpha blending, Z-buffering,
: bi/tri-linear filtering, texture-mapping, etc, all for approx $200
: street price. It's a seriously impressive bit of hardware with an
: aggressive developer policy behind it.
Uhm, 1,000,000?!?!?! Are you sure? Well, who cares as long as PCI only can
'bout 40 MB/sec... I'd say when you take THAT into consideration it's not so
mindboggingly fast anymore..
rattler^iLF^FKS
GROUT LEN EDWARD
: > New gfx cards such as the PicassoIV and CV3D both tackle this already :)
: > The PicassoIV has PCI and a 3D option coming out... CV3D has 3D
: > functions right now, when in truth we dont need them yet. Yes this stuff
: No they don't - just look at the speed and feature set available on
: the PC Voodoo cards - there is nothing even vaguely close on the
: Amiga. We're talking of cards designed to be better than the
: Playstation dedicated hardware, aimed specifically at games
: production. Take a look at the specs at www.3dfx.com - we are now so
: far behind that it is scary. I can't see what the current Amigas can
: offer, either in terms of hardware (platform) or market (money) to
: tempt games developers back.
I don't know where you've been, but the PIV and CV3D are recent hardware
developments for the amiga. And hold onto your briches, they were developed
in what some people would say is a dead Amiga market. Everywhere I look
on the web I read optimistic Amiga users and companies like Quickpak,
Phase V, Vulcan, etc.. I think we know that Quake isn't thaT COOL, and
we don't expect things to all of a sudden change, that would be stupid.
If by the end of this month new owners are not found, then maybe we'll
have our bubbles burst, but until then you haven't changed anything
for me. Pentups are not the answer and I would never consider them.
: As I wrote above, the PC world is just getting into hardware
: acceleration, but the list of developers who see this as a way of
: turning out PC games that look better than consoles is very long
: indeed. Even though there is development lead time, games are already
: appearing that take advantage of the hardware (or are all but
: unplayable without it). People like Psygnosis are talking about all
: their titles having 3D card support by end of 97, with many titles not
: running without 3D hardware. Remember Psygnosis? They used to be quite
: big on the Amiga...
Are you sure you should even be in this newsgroup? Were you just passing
by? What system do you have anyway?
Besides software companies are still keeping an eye on who takes control
of the Amiga's helm. Sure they're not developing anything for us, but
if Quikpak takes control then things'll start changing.
In fact I wouldn't be surprised if you were from one of our old Software
companies. Team17 perhaps?
: We don't have the market to tempt hardware or game developers -
: without that there will be no 3D accelerator addon cards, and even if
: there were, games companies can't see themselves selling games to us
: in this non-existent market.
Non-existent market? What kind of rubbish is this? If it's a non-existent
market then why can we still get hardware and software, and why do
companies still put them out?
: You say we can do anything that PC users can, but if the hardware is
: not being built and the games companies won't program for us, then the
: games market *is* dead. It's not about how good/bad the Amiga is,
: it's about how market forces have killed off the gaming market for us.
We have a game company thank you very much, Vulcan. They may not be
putting out the latest Mechwarrior, but atleast they are there for us.
: Realistically, until the next generation of Amiga arrives and sells a
: load of units, I can't see big games developers looking at the Amiga
I think that that is a given, but until that happens we can get off on
a port of a game called Quake, even if it might be the only port for
now.
: One or two people porting ID's code from another platform/market does
: not make a renaissance of Amiga gaming.
No one really said it would. I mean I may have said something similar, but
I was in the heat of the moment and all fired up, sure it was only Quake,
but hey one can dream big when something like this happens. I mean if
you live in a society with just horses as transportation and along comes
a port of a Model T, you can't help but start to dream big, right?
Jakob Eriksson
On 18 Feb 1997, tim wrote:
> The PicassoIV has PCI and a 3D option coming out... CV3D has 3D functions right
Has it PCI? What do u mean?
Regards,
Jakob
Jay King
"John Shiali" <jo...@heights.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>No they don't - just look at the speed and feature set available on
>the PC Voodoo cards - there is nothing even vaguely close on the
>Amiga. We're talking of cards designed to be better than the
>Playstation dedicated hardware, aimed specifically at games
>production.
Pee See is NOWHERE NEAR Playstation or indeed any of the Next
Generation consoles !!!!
Take a look at the Pee See version of Sega Rally compared to it`s
Saturn counterpart and you`ll see what a joke the Pee See is compared
to the consoles. I`m not saying Amiga holds a candle (fast 3d stuff
only...2d we will always lord it over PC :) but please spare us the
naff comparisons..
----======= Jas...@Corel.ie =========------------
A1200, 1230 IV, 6mb
The Beard
>Smash this executable over the Quake installed directory. (You have to install
>Quake shareware or Quake registered on a PC, then copy the entire Quake
>directory to your Amiga).
Ummm, where do I get this executable to "Smash" ???
Beard
Even Sandvik Underlid
>>WHERE can I get it?
>>developers or something far in the future?
>Pester someone who has it already...
>(ID software, the greedy bastards, want $1000000000+ (OK, so I'm
>exaggerating)
>to allow anyone to port their games. Even though they make all their money
>on *registrations*, and thus have nothing to loose, and money to gain.)
Then **** 'em and pirate it. Oh, the police... I forgot :-)
Anyway - the sharewareversion could be released onto CU/AF-CDs
at least!
-- rUSTYBRAIn --
Aki M Laukkanen
In comp.sys.amiga.games Philip Kaulfuss <ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk> wrote:
: I have a 40 MHz 040, and I want to get a GFX card, but that would also mean
: buying a tower case for my A1200, and getting a multisync monitor (I have a PAL
: one at the mo). I just can't afford all that. Yeah, I know, AGA sucks, but
: it's what most people have right now, so could you tell the author to
: reconsider? =)
Fact, the current "version" is some 1-2 fps full screen on 040/40/AGA.
C2P takes about 4 % of that time. With a ZIII Gfx card the frame rate would
be 1 % faster.
--
D.
Even Sandvik Underlid
>>>Way to go, Tim! Several questions: How close is it to FEELING like the
>>>original? What kinda frame-rate do you get on a 030/50? 060/50? When
>>>can we expect a public-beta? Are you considering talking to Id? Will a
>>>future version support PPC and CV64 3D?
>>They'll have to, or I'll get my BIG weaponloving friend to
>>kick their asses. Or something.
>>Sorry for writing bullshit, this just sounds too good to be
>>true!
>Yeah I know what you mean... It took me about 7 mins to accept it - and i had
>the file in front of me!
I still cannot belive it - maybe because that Picasso2 didn't
arrive when it should and I haven't been able to try it myself :-/
I've got v.0.3 now, and will get the QUAKE-files very soon as well.
>>I agree! I have ordered a Picasso2, but maybe I should go
>>for a CyberVision3D instead? ANYTHING to run Quake (not
>>that I want to play that boring game, just drool over it!)
>Personally i'm going for the PicassoIV as it's faster and they'll do a 3D
>module for it anyway... coupled with sound card, PCI slots, EDO 64bit mem
>access, mpeg module, tv tuner... etc.. ;)
>CV3D is slower than CV64 on 2D stuff...
Then again, the CV3D is out, the Picasso4 3D-module is not.
CV3D is cheaper and I support the A\Box and PowerUp-projects
when buying P5-products.
(did I forget to mention the scandoubler and ECS/AGA-passthrough
of Picasso? damn!)
-- rUSTYBRAIn --
John Shiali
Jay King wrote...
> "John Shiali" <jo...@heights.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >No they don't - just look at the speed and feature set available on the
> >PC Voodoo cards - there is nothing even vaguely close on the Amiga.
> >We're talking of cards designed to be better than the Playstation
> >dedicated hardware, aimed specifically at games production.
> Pee See is NOWHERE NEAR Playstation or indeed any of the Next Generation
> consoles !!!!
You have obviously never seen a 3DFX Voodoo card in action. It
outperforms the Sony Playstation, in terms of resolution, speed,
effects, and polygon count. That's a fact.
>
> Take a look at the Pee See version of Sega Rally compared to it`s Saturn
> counterpart and you`ll see what a joke the Pee See is compared to the
> consoles. I`m not saying Amiga holds a candle (fast 3d stuff only...2d
> we will always lord it over PC :) but please spare us the naff
> comparisons..
Try comparing console games with a game written for the hardware
acellerators I'm talking about, rather than comparing console games
with a non-accelerated PC (as you have done above).
Example: Take a look at the 3DFX version of Tomb Raider compared to
the Playstation.
Come back when you have some knowledge to back up your opinions.
--
John -
As Amiga International continues to flounder, rumours are emerging of
a potential takeover by Fisty's Fabulous Fishcake Factory. The CEO of
IBM, Dominic Ramsey, declined to comment on the possible effects of
such a merger.
Paul Copsey
On 17 Feb 1997 21:12:45, tim <dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Running Quake on anything less than 040/40 is a meaningless excercise.
Only if you consider running AB3D2 without the patch a meaningless
exercise, I found Quake to be playable, I've definitely seen slower,
with less GFX detail in a 3d game, it was worht it just to see it ;-)
Given that it's apparently not fully optimised, I'd say it could
eventually run at an acceptable speed on an 030/50.
Paul
tim
>Hans
"ILLEGAL" <<<--- this word means AmigaQuake.
Don't people realise this is the case right now? sure, it's a technicality
but do you want ID persuing the Aminet? Besides, Urban probably wouldn't
allow it!
Tim
tim
>tim wrote...
>
>> >Sorry to burst your bubble, but we are about to fall further behind
>> >than ever - the PC world has just got into hardware accelleration in a
>> >big way - look at GLQuake, Tomb Raider, Descent2 (or anything else for
>> >that matter) running on a 3DFX Voodoo card. This thing can push
>> >1,000,000 polygons per second, does alpha blending, Z-buffering,
>> >bi/tri-linear filtering, texture-mapping, etc, all for approx $200
>> >street price. It's a seriously impressive bit of hardware with an
>> >aggressive developer policy behind it.
>>
>> New gfx cards such as the PicassoIV and CV3D both tackle this already :)
>> The PicassoIV has PCI and a 3D option coming out... CV3D has 3D
>> functions right now, when in truth we dont need them yet. Yes this stuff
>No they don't - just look at the speed and feature set available on
>the PC Voodoo cards - there is nothing even vaguely close on the
>Amiga. We're talking of cards designed to be better than the
>Playstation dedicated hardware, aimed specifically at games
>production. Take a look at the specs at www.3dfx.com - we are now so
>far behind that it is scary. I can't see what the current Amigas can
>offer, either in terms of hardware (platform) or market (money) to
>tempt games developers back.
Sony have had the PS2 lined up for AGES... They aren't worried about PC game
development, especially given the prohibitive cost of the hardware :(
I agree tho, the card is impressive but even so we'll still be seeing some great
game on the Amiga. Perhaps only because it's a joy to develop on :)
High spec amiga games will appear, and are doing so :) I am currently involved
in 2 :)
>> certainly exists on the PC, but it's yet to really take off. Sure, it
>> will do but it'll take a little time to do so. The fact is, 3D cards
>> have been around for a long time, but PC owners choose fast 2D cards
>> right now since not many games support them. Powerup PPC is designed to
>As I wrote above, the PC world is just getting into hardware
>acceleration, but the list of developers who see this as a way of
>turning out PC games that look better than consoles is very long
>indeed. Even though there is development lead time, games are already
>appearing that take advantage of the hardware (or are all but
>unplayable without it). People like Psygnosis are talking about all
>their titles having 3D card support by end of 97, with many titles not
>running without 3D hardware. Remember Psygnosis? They used to be quite
>big on the Amiga...
And bigger on the Playstation. Yes I know them well :) My m8 works for them ;)
End of 1997? ABOX anyone ? The PC market is insane - personally i'd prefer to
actually be able to eat rather than spend everything I've got just to keep up
with the upgrading. The reason the PC needs all this hardware anyway is due to
the architecture and the crap s/w it has to run, e.g. now they want all games to
run under Windows 95 style environments. Doubtless all this new hardware is
impressive, but then so is a SGI workstation ;*)
>> help us hold our own this year, with ABOX being the progressive step
>> after that. IF you REALLY want state of the art gaming at good pricing
>> the Playstation has been around for ages and the Playstation 2 will
>But you can't play flight/space sims, don't have access to large
>amounts of RAM and hard drive space, can't use a keyboard, play in
>high resolution. These are things that consoles are bad at.
But you have to ask yourself do the public care? Probably not.. since the
playstation sells in droves to the public. Resolution isn't as important when
you've only got a TV to play it through, if it's of a decent res and in lots of
colours people won't care. Unlike the 16bit consoles I think the PS actually
has a few decent titles, Tomb Raider isn't exactly all that bad :)
>If you want state of the art gaming you go for a Playstation (cheap
>option) or maxed out PC (expensive option), but I don't see how that
>argument gets the games appearing on the Amiga. You seem to be telling
>me if I want "state of the art gaming" I shouldn't be looking at the
>Amiga - and I'd agree with you.
Yes, thats probably exactly what i'm saying.. But then if all you bought an
Amiga for was games, then you're missing out on the whole 'computer' thing vs. a
console! The point is, the PS offers a cheap alternative whilst the PC doesn't.
In any case, as i've said, there will be some great Amiga games this year - why
not have the best of both worlds ? #^)
>> replace that in the near future! Perhaps the most enduring and endearing
>> thing about Amigas are the users, who constantly proove we can 'keep
>> up'. If it doesn't exist for the Amiga now, it will do 2morrow ;)
>Yes, but not in the world of comercial gaming - the *reality* is that
>no one turning out quality games for a living is doing it for the
>Amiga.
Ouch... I'd be very quiet if I were you... With that last one you just insulted
every damn amiga game dev. out there! Play nice :)
>> Anything you can add to PC you can add to an Amiga. Right down at the
>> roots the Amiga is more open to expanision, as recent developments have
>> shown. Sure, we may be behind, but ask this - when is Quake out for
>> Powermac? Soon, but not now. Quake is far from yesterdays news for the
>> Mac community.
>>
>We don't have the market to tempt hardware or game developers -
>without that there will be no 3D accelerator addon cards, and even if
>there were, games companies can't see themselves selling games to us
>in this non-existent market.
Even if the CV3D didn't exist, the PicassoIV offers a PCI bus to do this. There
is no reason why a standard PCI card can't be plugged into this given the right
driver.
>You say we can do anything that PC users can, but if the hardware is
>not being built and the games companies won't program for us, then the
>games market *is* dead. It's not about how good/bad the Amiga is,
>it's about how market forces have killed off the gaming market for us.
I don't think it's a case of games companies any more.. Amiga users have been
banding together for some time on their own projects. The users make it a
reality for the Amiga, I cannot credit them enough for doing it either.
Once a game is complete, you only need publish it - and there are companies more
than willing to help you out there :)
>Realistically, until the next generation of Amiga arrives and sells a
>load of units, I can't see big games developers looking at the Amiga
>as a viable gaming platform either in terms of hardware specs or size
>of market any more than the Atari ST, C64, Sinclair Spectrum, etc...
Oh thanx for the generous comparison ;) You're right tho, they wont look to the
Amiga market *unless* we all upgrade or do it for ourselves. AmigaQuake has
already made more than a few of us consider gfx cards, faster processors etc.
This is a step in the right direction no matter what. If you can show it can be
done on an Amiga, then it's only going to be better than sitting back and saying
"Well <nick>, we're all dead in the water now so we might as well just give up"
Fatalism isn't my style, nor is investment in a dead platform based on
puritanical belief. I've yet to see something to tempt me away from the Amiga.
The ABOX might, but the PC certainly won't, no matter what you bolt onto the
back of it.
>One or two people porting ID's code from another platform/market does
>not make a renaissance of Amiga gaming.
I wouldn't be so bold as to claim so, the truth is - the 'renaissance' is
already happening. People got bored with waiting for games, so we're doing it
all ourselves now. Please don't underestimate the talent of programming that is
out there, the PC isn't reponsible for today's great programmers.
Everyone has their own opinion :)
Tim
Philip Kaulfuss
John Girvin (gi...@girvnet.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: >How about a DOOM/DOOM2-port for 030-owners? ;-)
: YES! Id second that :)
Bah. =) I use Shapeshifter for that. Doom is pretty old hat anyway, I'd rather
play TKG. =)
BTW, Skittle, what happened to your port of Wolf3D?
--
,-----------------------------------------------------------.
:-: Philip Kaulfuss :---------------------------------------:
:-: ph...@boehme.demon.co.uk :-------------------------------:
:-: PhilK in UnderNet #AmigaCafe :--------------------------:
:-: http://www.boehme.demon.co.uk :-------------------------:
:-: Gfx artist for the freeware gorefest 'Urban Massacre' :-:
`-----------------------------------------------------------'
John Shiali
Roger Strandberg wrote...
>
> Uhm, 1,000,000?!?!?! Are you sure? Well, who cares as long as PCI only
'Fraid so.
> can 'bout 40 MB/sec... I'd say when you take THAT into consideration
> it's not so mindboggingly fast anymore..
That's probably why it's got 4mb on board, and Intel has a high speed
dedicated bus for graphics (AGP) out this year.
--
John -
You don't have to be crazy to work here, but boodly friddly frabb...
John Shiali
GROUT LEN EDWARD wrote...
>
> I don't know where you've been, but the PIV and CV3D are recent hardware
> developments for the amiga. And hold onto your briches, they were
> developed in what some people would say is a dead Amiga market.
Yes, they are recent developments but who is going to write games for
them? Activision, LucasArts, Psygnosis, Origin, Core? These are all
names from the past of the Amiga, but they won't be programming for
the PIV or CV3D.
Even so, those boards are way behind (in terms of game playing
technology) what those companies are writing for on the PC's now. We
used to get an advantage out of the Amiga's onboard sound and custom
chips, but now every PC has better sound and graphics, and they are
now heading off towards specific hardware for pushing games in the
form of 3D accelerators.
> Everywhere I look on the web I read optimistic Amiga users and companies
> like Quickpak, Phase V, Vulcan, etc.. I think we know that Quake isn't
> thaT COOL, and we don't expect things to all of a sudden change, that
> would be stupid. If by the end of this month new owners are not found,
> then maybe we'll have our bubbles burst, but until then you haven't
> changed anything for me. Pentups are not the answer and I would never
> consider them.
I'm talking about *games* on the Amiga. I never said that there
anything wrong with the rest of the Amiga market. It may be in
decline compared to the PC, but there are a hard core of application
programmers and supporters.
> Are you sure you should even be in this newsgroup?
> Were you just passing by? What system do you have anyway? Besides
Yeah, I passed by c.s.a.g about five years ago after I moved on from
FidoNet, and decided to stay. It was a lot busier then than it is
now. I'm writing this on a B2000 with a 1.5 gigs of scsi drive, a
40mhz 030 Gforce card, 14megs of fast ram and a Picasso II with
CGraphX. I talk to the 'net through Miami and a MultiFace III. I'm
typing into Cygnus Ed and keeping your messages in UMS and Intuinews.
Before the B2000 I had an A500. I've been using Amigas for about 7 years,
and my first computer was a ZX81 at the beginning of the 80's
I've also got a P100 at home, and used Sun workstations, HPs,
Motorolas, PCs and Sequents at work. What's your point?
Are you implying that I wouldn't hold my particular opinion if I was a
"true" Amigan? If anything, my view of both sides of the fence are
more valid than the rabid advocacy types who have never used the other
platform they are so strenuously rubbishing. The fact that I have a
powerful PC at home, but still use my Amiga for so much "serious
stuff" speaks far more eloquently than anything I could write here
about my support for the Amiga.
> software companies are still keeping an eye on who takes control of the
> Amiga's helm. Sure they're not developing anything for us, but if
> Quikpak takes control then things'll start changing. In fact I wouldn't
I *really* hope so, but I've heard this from Commodore, Escom, Amiga
over the last few years, and it's yet to happen. In the meantime, the
games developers have moved on.
> be surprised if you were from one of our old Software companies. Team17
> perhaps?
Nope sorry. The closest I have got to games software companies was
when I worked at HMV head office and pushed for them to get back into
computer games retail in the early nineties. That was before PC games
were more numerous than Amiga games.
> Non-existent market? What kind of rubbish
> is this? If it's a non-existent market then why can we still get
> hardware and software, and why do companies still put them out?
Excuse me? Have you looked around a big store like HMV, Virgin or
Electronics Boutique recently? How many Amiga titles have you seen
compared to the PC? The games aren't there. Please tell me what
hardware companies are developing addon cards to enable high speed
game processing up to console standard. Tell me how I can get
TombRaider or Descent 2 on my Amiga. These are the kind of amazing,
fun, cutting edge games that used to be made for the Amiga, but I have
to buy them for the PC or console
> We have a game company thank you very much, Vulcan. They may not be
> putting out the latest Mechwarrior, but at least they are there for us.
"We have a game company". Well that's alright then, as long as we have
one. How long do you think it will be before they find they can't
survive on the Amiga alone and move to the PC? You have to sell a lot
of games to make a living...
> : Realistically, until the next generation of Amiga arrives and sells a
> : load of units, I can't see big games developers looking at the Amiga
> I think that that is a given, but until that happens we can get off on a
> port of a game called Quake, even if it might be the only port for now.
Enjoy it while you can, because the next engine ID is working on will
rely heavily on hardware accelleration. I won't be playing AmigaQuake
because I've played the OpenGL version on a Voodoo card, and it's very
difficult to go backwards when you've experienced such horsepower. If
the next Amiga could have that chipset on board, that's some *serious*
game playing power in there...
> : One or two people porting ID's code from another platform/market does
> : not make a renaissance of Amiga gaming.
> No one really said it would. I
> mean I may have said something similar, but I was in the heat of the
> moment and all fired up, sure it was only Quake, but hey one can dream
Well, that's pretty much what I replied to. AmigaQuake is not going to
suddenly start an avalanche of new games development on the Amiga
(more's the pity).
> big when something like this happens. I mean if you live in a society
> with just horses as transportation and along comes a port of a Model T,
> you can't help but start to dream big, right?
I guess I'm lucky because I have both, but I still think of myself as
an Amiga owner who also has a PC. What I'd really love to have is an
Amiga with the brute force power of my PC and the kind of games and
hardware market that the PC has. We can't get that with the current
hardware, so rather than people thinking that AmigaQuake is some kind
of resurrection, I want them to realise that we are still only playing
catch-up. The only way to come back into the games market is for
PIOS, Phase 5 or whoever to leapfrog over current PCs and produce an
Amiga that can hold it's own in games with the consoles.
In fact that would be going back to where the Amiga had its glory days
- with the performance and price of a console to suck the customers in,
but underneath, being a rather wonderful computer with a storming OS,
and the kind of groundswell user support that doesn't exist anywhere
else...
--
John -
Spiff makes a note that the Bizzarotron has been reading a little low lately.
jai...@aros.net
Jay King wrote:
>
> "John Shiali" <jo...@heights.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >No they don't - just look at the speed and feature set available on
> >the PC Voodoo cards - there is nothing even vaguely close on the
> >Amiga. We're talking of cards designed to be better than the
> >Playstation dedicated hardware, aimed specifically at games
> >production.
> Generation consoles !!!!
>
> Saturn counterpart and you`ll see what a joke the Pee See is compared
> to the consoles. I`m not saying Amiga holds a candle (fast 3d stuff
> only...2d we will always lord it over PC :) but please spare us the
> naff comparisons..
>
> A1200, 1230 IV, 6mb
Obviously you haven't seen Quake running the Rendition video card.
"timedemo demo1.dem" reports around 24 fps in 640*480 with mipscaling
very almost off, bilinear interpolation, anti-aliasing, and dithering
turned on, *and* in 65k colors. It looks amazing. You should see it
fly in 320*200!! Sure, the consoles are more bang for the buck, though.
I always wondered why the playstation can pack a 24-bit graphics card,
3d acceleration, 2x cd-rom, 3.5mb ram, serial and parelell ports, 16-bit
24-channel audio all for under $200, when a pc graphics card alone costs
just that much!
Paul Copsey
On 18 Feb 1997 08:10:03, Hans Guijt <hgu...@inter.nl.net> wrote:
> >I'll try and arrange an FTP server, but i feel that i must post it as so many
> >have now asked for it and i can't cope! It's not very large as it's only the
> >engine, not the whole thing! Appr. 200k archived!
>
> ``Arrange?'' Put it on AMINET! That's what we have it for!
I doubt it would get onto Aminet, given it's none too official origin
;-)
> DON'T POST IT HERE!
That I agree with.
Paul
Gi
>>well, ab3dii runs on 030 at approx 10fps (or mebbe a bit slower), so
>>amigaquake (after it has been optimized, changed to fixed point math),
>>should run 10fps on 030.
on the Pentium it does 1 Fixed point math instruction and one FPU instruction
at the same time, that means that a CPU like the 060 is best suited to Quake
as it has Pipelining.
tim
>>As soon as i've talked to the author i'll see if we can't arrange a posting
>>to the newsgroup - would you all allow me to post a binary here ?
>*NO*. We have *AMINET* for that sort of thing!
>Or put it on alt.binaries.quake or whatever, the PC crowd will enjoy that ;-)
>Hans
I think a server is best, FTP if i can manage it, WWW otherwise!
The Aminet is not an option, the reason should be VERY obvious :)
Tim
Even Sandvik Underlid
>>sleep at all last night after reading about The Quake breakthrough.
>><huge Dreamy Look> Now I have a ?. What is the difference between CV64
>>and the PicassoIV? I haven't read anything about PIV yet. -- \
>than ever - the PC world has just got into hardware accelleration in a
>big way - look at GLQuake, Tomb Raider, Descent2 (or anything else for
>that matter) running on a 3DFX Voodoo card. This thing can push
>1,000,000 polygons per second, does alpha blending, Z-buffering,
>bi/tri-linear filtering, texture-mapping, etc, all for approx $200
>street price. It's a seriously impressive bit of hardware with an
>aggressive developer policy behind it.
The hardware that does this may be technically wonderful,
but games such as Tomb rider are certainly not. Better play
Oldtimer instead!
>I won't give up my Amiga, but the commercial games market is all but
>dead. We just can't provide the brute force hardware that the PC
>market can. The developers will only see more money on the PC and
>console side of the fence, and that's where they'll go. If you want to
>play the best games, that's where you'll have to follow.
Have it even occured to you that if people didn't think like
this, the Amiga gamesmarket would still be (almost) as big as
the PC-gamesmarket? It was also the reason for the Commodore
buyout to take so long - if there was more interest in the machine
and people didn't sell their machines and tell us PCs were soo
much better, more companies would be willing to offer a lot
more money for a quick deal.
Of course, the people who have stayed as long as you prove
that they have a real interest in the Amiga, but slagging
of the gamesscene won't make it any better. It will encourage
the new owners of the Amiga to ditch the machine, OR market
it as a workstation or something like that - which it is
certainly not!
The Amiga NEEDS the gamemarket to come back in a big way when
the PowerAmiga/A\Box is out. Almost every big coder/gfx or sfx-
dude begins with games - and I'm sure most of us got into the
Amiga, or the C64 before it in that way.
-- rUSTYBRAIn -- A4000/040 [40Mhz]/10MB/4xCDrom/2.7GB
Even Sandvik Underlid
>Realistically, until the next generation of Amiga arrives and sells a
>load of units, I can't see big games developers looking at the Amiga
>of market any more than the Atari ST, C64, Sinclair Spectrum, etc...
Of course not - does anyone here really belive that the CISC
Amigas can get BIG again?
Maybe in a bit better situation than now, but not BIG.
>One or two people porting ID's code from another platform/market does
>not make a renaissance of Amiga gaming.
Of course not - but where are the PowerUp/A\box-developers going
to come from if the Amiga dies? How about the users? Do you
belive that P5 or Quikpak have the money to advertise like
Sony did for their Playstation? And a new computer that costs
above £1000 isn't as easy to sell as a Playstation to £250 -
"what if it flops?".
The AmigaQuake is a really positive thing IMHO - because IF
someone is interested in porting their games or heavy
applications to the Amiga - it will show them what is possible.
And belive me when I say that *I* would be impressed
to hear there was an Amigaversion of QUAKE if I had used a
PC the last four years (I would ask myself "how can that computer
survive for so long").
Even Sandvik Underlid
>>As soon as i've talked to the author i'll see if we can't arrange a posting
>>to the newsgroup - would you all allow me to post a binary here ?
>*NO*. We have *AMINET* for that sort of thing!
>Or put it on alt.binaries.quake or whatever, the PC crowd will enjoy that ;-)
Yeah, that would be COOL! :-)
tim
>Beard
Good news!!
My WWW server will be available from tomorrow with AmigaQuake for you to dl!
I will post the site tomorrow, it takes 24hrs for it to come online ;)
Tim
John Girvin
In article <588.6988...@angeldos.demon.co.uk> tim <dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>In article <503.6986...@sn.no> Even Sandvik Underlid <evu...@sn.no>
>>writes:
>
>>>How about a DOOM/DOOM2-port for 030-owners? ;-)
>>YES! Id second that :)
>
>>/John.
>
>Get shapeshifter :)
>
>Tim
>
Well OK, but Id have preferred native Amiga ;)
/John.
--
____________________________________________________________________________
|00 John Girvin : developing software for Unibol Inc., speaking for myself |
|\/ jgi...@bfs.unibol.com | Amiga,68k,net,SciFi,MTB,TaiJutsu,house,techno |
| gi...@girvnet.demon.co.uk | Youll never take me alive, Macro$loth fiends! |
\ http://www.girvnet.demon.co.uk --- A1200/030+882-40/2+8Mb --- Team AMIGA /
tim
>On 18 Feb 1997, tim wrote:
>> The PicassoIV has PCI and a 3D option coming out... CV3D has 3D functions
>> right
>Has it PCI? What do u mean?
Jakob,
find out for yourself - point one of the many Amiga browsers at:
http://ftp.tu-dresden.de/~deck/pic96/piciv.html
This gives full details about the card!
It's a local PCI slot.
And yes that does mean what you think - try to stay calm :) I know it's GREAT!
Tim
tim
>be 1 % faster.
I think you should wait till it's recoded away from the portable C++ meant for
the Alpha ;)
Tim
William W Toner
>Running Quake on anything less than 040/40 is a meaningless excercise.
>
>>at all if a proper Quake port would be faster on 040/40
>>than AB3D TKG because of very advanced algorithms.
How much of a difference is an 040/33? This is what I currently have in my
2000, and is the fastest my accelerator will support. I am planning to get
a PicassoIV in a couple months, so I will have the gfx horsepower. I find it
hard to believe that 44MHz is good but 33MHz is totally unusable. Am I too
optimistic about my new accelerator?
Bill
tim
>>>>Way to go, Tim! Several questions: How close is it to FEELING like the
>>>>original? What kinda frame-rate do you get on a 030/50? 060/50? When
>>>>can we expect a public-beta? Are you considering talking to Id? Will a
>>>>future version support PPC and CV64 3D?
>>>They'll have to, or I'll get my BIG weaponloving friend to
>>>kick their asses. Or something.
>>>Sorry for writing bullshit, this just sounds too good to be
>>>true!
>>Yeah I know what you mean... It took me about 7 mins to accept it - and i
>>had the file in front of me!
>I still cannot belive it - maybe because that Picasso2 didn't
>arrive when it should and I haven't been able to try it myself :-/
>I've got v.0.3 now, and will get the QUAKE-files very soon as well.
V0.31 is the latest.. My WWW page will be operating soon for latest info and
updates :)
>>>I agree! I have ordered a Picasso2, but maybe I should go
>>>for a CyberVision3D instead? ANYTHING to run Quake (not
>>>that I want to play that boring game, just drool over it!)
>>Personally i'm going for the PicassoIV as it's faster and they'll do a 3D
>>module for it anyway... coupled with sound card, PCI slots, EDO 64bit mem
>>access, mpeg module, tv tuner... etc.. ;)
>>CV3D is slower than CV64 on 2D stuff...
>Then again, the CV3D is out, the Picasso4 3D-module is not.
>CV3D is cheaper and I support the A\Box and PowerUp-projects
>when buying P5-products.
Theres nothing cheap about a board that needs an extra scandoubler. And the
scandoubler isn't out for the CV3D yet ;( I'll wait for a 3D module since
it's no good to me now - what software supports 3D ? Exactly.
>(did I forget to mention the scandoubler and ECS/AGA-passthrough
>of Picasso? damn!)
Almost.... this is a mail i got from phase5 today re: PicassoIV
the Picasso IV will be supported
with best regards / mit freundlichen Gr=FC=DFen
Gerd Kautzmann
(re: Cybergfx!)
>-- rUSTYBRAIn --
John Girvin
In article <5eak4d$j...@bagan.srce.hr> nfra...@jagor.srce.hr (Nick) writes:
>John Girvin (gi...@girvnet.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>: So please, please, pleeeeease make AmigaQuake AGA!
>
>They already made it, and your current config will suffice.
Yeah, its up to 0.31 isnt it? Where do I get it?!?!
Steffen P. Haeuser
Hi!
Nick (nfra...@jagor.srce.hr) wrote:
: tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: [snipp]
:
: : ******************************************************************************
: : * To Do *
: : ******************************************************************************
:
:
: : - Add Sound
: : - Add multiple Graphics resolutions 640x480, 800x600, etc.
: : - Add AGA and ECS graphics modes.
: : - Add v1.06 bullshit.
: : - ReCode whole draw, light, sprites and models routines in 100 % assembler.
: : - AmigaStylize.
: : - Add 16 and 24 Bit support.
:
: Hope they are gonna do this stuff soon :)
: Especially AGA part, since have no gfx card... and hope it will be playable
: on 030@50...
: Btw, how fast is it currently?
Well, about the speed... does anybody know how they did it ?
a) WritePixelArray8 OS calls
b) LockBitMapTagList of CyberGraphics.library for direct access to
Video Memory (that one would get a major speedup, if they used a) !!! )
Does anybody have the email of the authors, hehe ? :)
--
Steffen Haeuser - Mag...@birdland.es.bawue.de
WWW: http://www.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/fachschaft/adressen/haeuser.html
Keeper of the Amiga Texturemapping FAQ
Irc:MagicSN Main coder of the rtgmaster.library and of the
"Darkchild" RPG (formerly alled "Der Ring")
Steffen P. Haeuser
tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: Right now it's not that quick with a gfx card, that will change though.
Because up to now it uses the OS calls and later version will run through
LockBitMapTagList (direct Video-RAM access) ? Or simply some optimizations
to be done?
Evert de Vos
tim wrote:
: >> The PicassoIV has PCI and a 3D option coming out... CV3D has 3D
functions
: find out for yourself - point one of the many Amiga browsers at:
:
: http://ftp.tu-dresden.de/~deck/pic96/piciv.html
_IS_ this the right address? My DNS can't find this address :-(
Evert
Mer'rark
tim (dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: >On 18 Feb 1997, tim wrote:
: >> The PicassoIV has PCI and a 3D option coming out... CV3D has 3D
: >> functions right
: It's a local PCI slot.
: And yes that does mean what you think - try to stay calm :) I know
: it's GREAT!
So does this mean you can connect it to a PCI equipped Amiga? How
about an Amiga 2000 with a DKB Wildfire installed? PCI is definately
faster than Zorro 2. I assume though it would still occupy Z-2
autoconfig memory space.
Please tell me when you are are sick of all the questions I'm asking.
:P :)
--
-- Mer'rark Walk like a dog, talk like a man.
Walk like a dog, like anybody can.
Hans-J”rg Frieden
tim <dan...@angeldos.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> The game engine is EXACTLY the one from ID. This is a port plain and simple!
> I'm told that the game isn't too nippy on 060/CV64 in it's 0.1 config - i'll
> talk to people tonight and find out about 0.2. Remember that this will
> change as routines are 'amigarized' i.e. crap ID code removed ;)
What exactly do you mean by "crap ID code"? IMHO iD are some of the best
programmers around. Never has any doom engine on the PC gotten anywhere
near the original Doom. They might not be top notch in games design
(I found Doom was getting boring after some time), but they are really
excellent programmers...
After all, it's iD who invented the genre... And they virtually had
thousands of follow-ups.
Regards, Hans-Joerg.
--
Hans-Joerg Frieden | "All those moments will be lost in time, like
Schloss-Str. 176 | tears in the rain" - Roy Batty, Blade Runner
54293 Trier | "I merely chewed in self-defence. I didn't
hfri...@fix.uni-trier.de | swallow." - Draco, Dragonheart
William W Toner
>Even if the CV3D didn't exist, the PicassoIV offers a PCI bus to do this. There
>is no reason why a standard PCI card can't be plugged into this given the right
>driver.
Well, it might be tough. PCI on the PicassoIV doesn't mean you can pluc a PC
card into it. It has it's own connector. While it should theoretically be
possible to make an adaptor, it would be quite a hack. Might be fun, but not
for the average user... I think the coolest thing they could do would be to
make some connection from the DKB 060 accelerator's PCI to the PicassoIV's
PCI and releive Zorro of some strain. :) That would really fly, especially since
I only have a 2000.
Bill
Espen Berntsen
>Who claimed credit? Have you seen something I haven't?? I haven't seen
>a single remark that the porters/hacker/crackers whatever you want to
>call them that says "This is all our work". Sure, they stole ID's code
>but atleast they didn't say it was theirs.
Only thing they say is "AmigaQuake port by Max / DC" or something to that
effect.
--
Name...@ask.himolde.no <> Nameless @ IRC <> http://www.himolde.no/~espen
==========================================================================
life: a sexualy transmitted disease with 100% fatality rate
Robert Karlsen
Jay King wrote:
>
> "John Shiali" <jo...@heights.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >No they don't - just look at the speed and feature set available on
> >the PC Voodoo cards - there is nothing even vaguely close on the
> >Amiga. We're talking of cards designed to be better than the
> >Playstation dedicated hardware, aimed specifically at games
> >production.
> Pee See is NOWHERE NEAR Playstation or indeed any of the Next
> Generation consoles !!!!
>
> Take a look at the Pee See version of Sega Rally compared to it`s
> Saturn counterpart and you`ll see what a joke the Pee See is compared
> to the consoles. I`m not saying Amiga holds a candle (fast 3d stuff
> only...2d we will always lord it over PC :) but please spare us the
> naff comparisons..
>
> ----======= Jas...@Corel.ie =========------------
> A1200, 1230 IV, 6mb
I have Orchid Righteous 3D with the Voodoo Chipset.
Righteous 3D is far better than Sega Saturn and Sony PSX.
Compare Tomb Raider, Whiplash, Descent II etc... with the Sony PSX
versions and you will see the big difference.
Only Nintendo 64 will compare to the Righteous 3D...
Regards,
--
- Robert Karlsen Amiga - PlugAndPlay -
- rob...@applause.no and MultiTasking -
- Gamer at Applause Data AS since 1985! -
-> HomePage at http://www.applause.no/~robertk/index.html <-
-> FTP at ftp.applause.no usr/robertk - Amiga/PC/Linux/CBM64 <-
-> BBS (Heimdall MBBS) ISDN + 47 Up again TBA, Both Amiga & PC<-
- Machines: Amiga CD32/Promodule, A500+(A3500) + PC Int.P133 -
Marc Forrester
tim wrote:
> @BEGIN_FILE_ID.DIZ .________________
> ____Ś____ ( _____/__ - -------------
> _/ ___/ _/\_ T Ź\_ ˇ diGiTAL ˇ
> .-\ Ś/ 7--7 l / ˇ cORRUPTiON ˇ
> | \____.-----Ś Ś----.____/------- - - -
> | ŻŻŻŻŻ ŻŻŻŻŻ
> | AMIGA QUAKE Alpha 0.2
> | Requires CyberGFX & 8 megs
> | Ported & Coded on Amiga by MAX
> `----------------------------- Design: sTORM
> @END_FILE_ID.DIZ
You're a loony. :) Of precisely the caliber the Amiga needs.
(Always assuming this isn't bullshit, but my recent web wanders
would tend to suggest that it isn't)
Framerates?
--
Marc Forrester, via his mum's ISP.
William W Toner
>Excuse me? Have you looked around a big store like HMV, Virgin or
>Electronics Boutique recently? How many Amiga titles have you seen
>compared to the PC? The games aren't there. Please tell me what
If I was a serious gamer, I'd go with Playstation AND/OR N64. I'd still buy any
GOOD amiga games that came out, but probably not as much as the cconsoles. I am
very happy with the software available for my uses. So it's not at El.Bo. Big
deal, I am willing to mail order it.
>because I've played the OpenGL version on a Voodoo card, and it's very
>difficult to go backwards when you've experienced such horsepower. If
>the next Amiga could have that chipset on board, that's some *serious*
Anyone have any ideas/rumors as to what chipset the PicassoIV 3d module will
use? I'm sure others out there would be happy if they use Voodoo. I can only
hope...
Bill
Nick
Gi (g...@gj-cent.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: >>well, ab3dii runs on 030 at approx 10fps (or mebbe a bit slower), so
Well, Amiga's DON'T have Pentium CPU's, besides, very few ppl have 060.
Game that requires 060 to run at decent speed is not a game!
Sorry, I am for amiga expansio, and wan't ppl to upgrade, but not everyone
has 1000 DM for 060!
--
E-Mail: nfra...@public.srce.hr nfra...@zems.fer.hr | Powered by:
ni...@fly.cc.fer.hr |-| A1200
WWW: http://diana.zems.fer.hr/~nfrances |------| Blizzard 1230-IV
CroAminet: ftp://thphys.irb.hr/pub/aminet |---| 2+16 MB RAM : 125+200MB HD
tim
>Jay King wrote...
>> "John Shiali" <jo...@heights.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> >No they don't - just look at the speed and feature set available on the
>> >PC Voodoo cards - there is nothing even vaguely close on the Amiga.
>> >We're talking of cards designed to be better than the Playstation
>> >dedicated hardware, aimed specifically at games production.
>> Pee See is NOWHERE NEAR Playstation or indeed any of the Next Generation
>> consoles !!!!
>You have obviously never seen a 3DFX Voodoo card in action. It
>outperforms the Sony Playstation, in terms of resolution, speed,
>effects, and polygon count. That's a fact.
>>
>> Take a look at the Pee See version of Sega Rally compared to it`s Saturn
>> counterpart and you`ll see what a joke the Pee See is compared to the
>> consoles. I`m not saying Amiga holds a candle (fast 3d stuff only...2d
>> we will always lord it over PC :) but please spare us the naff
>> comparisons..
>Try comparing console games with a game written for the hardware
>acellerators I'm talking about, rather than comparing console games
>with a non-accelerated PC (as you have done above).
>Example: Take a look at the 3DFX version of Tomb Raider compared to
>the Playstation.
>Come back when you have some knowledge to back up your opinions.
Mind you, some of us want to drive a nice car *and* own a game machine...
Tim
tim
>>>well, ab3dii runs on 030 at approx 10fps (or mebbe a bit slower), so
>>>amigaquake (after it has been optimized, changed to fixed point math),
>>>should run 10fps on 030.
>on the Pentium it does 1 Fixed point math instruction and one FPU instruction
>at the same time, that means that a CPU like the 060 is best suited to Quake
>as it has Pipelining.
Yes.. 040 isn't too bad either.. But 060 is best :)
Tim
tim
This actually isn't the case, having done endless research into Amiga history
the recurrent problem is actually the lawyers. Blood sucking bastards they
are too. When a large company folds things get very messy - aka Commodore,
Escom etc. Plus there is things like politics - anyone remember the wonderful
Phillipines Government ? to worry about. Granted all this has taken a damn
long time, but it's not for lack of interest - many many companies have bid on
Amiga in the past.
>Of course, the people who have stayed as long as you prove
>that they have a real interest in the Amiga, but slagging
>of the gamesscene won't make it any better. It will encourage
>the new owners of the Amiga to ditch the machine, OR market
>it as a workstation or something like that - which it is
>certainly not!
You're very unlikely to 'ditch' technology you just spend x million USD on.
I guess my Amiga is a workstation, since i spend most of my time doing work on
it. I dunno - what is the definition here ? :)
>The Amiga NEEDS the gamemarket to come back in a big way when
>the PowerAmiga/A\Box is out. Almost every big coder/gfx or sfx-
>dude begins with games - and I'm sure most of us got into the
>Amiga, or the C64 before it in that way.
The Amiga needs PPC *NOW* - powerup for the interim and then a smooth
changeover to ABOX. ABOX will need a well established PPC powerup user base
to ensure native software upon release. Users want the kind of brain dead
kick me up the ass kinda power that pentiums offer the PC - the PPC can
deliver this (and better..).
>-- rUSTYBRAIn -- A4000/040 [40Mhz]/10MB/4xCDrom/2.7GB
gosh, thats a big HD :^)
Tim
Tobias Abt
Mer'rark (mer...@netcom.com) wrote:
: So does this mean you can connect it to a PCI equipped Amiga? How
: faster than Zorro 2. I assume though it would still occupy Z-2
: autoconfig memory space.
Well, the PicassoIV is not designed to be directly connected to the
Wildfire. The PCI slot of the PicassoIV is for additional modules.
DKB is planning to build a PCI graphics board for the Wildfire
which will be called WildPicasso. That one will be supported by
Picasso96, too.
: -- Mer'rark Walk like a dog, talk like a man.
Bye, \|/
Tobias @ @
+-------------------oOO-(_)-OOo------------------------+
| Tobias Abt |
| email: ta...@studbox.uni-stuttgart.de |
| irc: tabt@#AmigaGer |
| www: http://wwwcip.rus.uni-stuttgart.de/~etk10317/ |
+------------------------------------------------------+
If I don't remember your last mail, don't be angry, there is
way too much mail in my mailbox... :-))