RISC OS LTD Licenses RO4 to Virtual Acorn
Annraoi
http://www.riscos.com/news/news_items/PR020903.htm
Seems like VA will soon have RO4 available generally (and therefore
not just limited to the Microdigital Alpha).
I have mixed feelings about emulation and the potential for damage it
will cause the platform, but having RO4 available for people who
already have laptop computers (rather than insisting they buy yet
another PC laptop to run it) is probably the lesser of two evils.
Thoughts anyone ?
Regards
Annraoi
Martin Dann
a...@globalcafe.ie (Annraoi) wrote:
I know speculation is normally a bad thing, but this does imply that
a) RISC OS Ltd and Castle Ltd are actively talking to each other,
because AIUI this means the RO4 licensing conditions have changed.
b) If the above is true, then Castle, probably the leading RO hardware
manufacturer, is confident that the market will not be harmed.
Martin.
--
According to the human genome project, humans are 50-60% bananas.
Andy McMullon
Martin Dann <Mar...@f451.freeserve.co.uk> expounded:
> In message <dab3e751.03090...@posting.google.com>
> a...@globalcafe.ie (Annraoi) wrote:
>
> > Yep there you have it folks on
> > http://www.riscos.com/news/news_items/PR020903.htm
> >
> > Seems like VA will soon have RO4 available generally (and therefore
> > not just limited to the Microdigital Alpha).
> >
> > I have mixed feelings about emulation and the potential for damage it
> > will cause the platform, but having RO4 available for people who
> > already have laptop computers (rather than insisting they buy yet
> > another PC laptop to run it) is probably the lesser of two evils.
The only hardware solution we were being offered (and that not yet
ready) was 7500 based and very slow and very expensive compared with
the virtual alternative.
The only advantage of the RS portable was size and battery life.
On the down side I'm much more worried about people buying VirtualRPC
for desktop use. After all a 3.0 Pentium 4 (or alternative) must run
quite a bit faster than a RISC PC. How does it compare with an Iyonix
though?
> > Thoughts anyone ?
>
> I know speculation is normally a bad thing, but this does imply that
This is a RISC OS newsgroup - we love speculation.
> a) RISC OS Ltd and Castle Ltd are actively talking to each other,
> because AIUI this means the RO4 licensing conditions have changed.
>
> b) If the above is true, then Castle, probably the leading RO hardware
> manufacturer, is confident that the market will not be harmed.
Does this mean:
a. That they have a portable Iyonix ready to go and know that it will
be more attractive than the virtual route in both speed and economy?
Probably not!
b. That no hardware portable is planned at all and this is all we are
ever going to get. Much more likely!
So the end result might be more people using RISC OS as an alternative
- but less chance of really new hardware.
What chance of an X-scale or ARM 10 card with RISC OS on it to stick
in a PC?
Guy Inchbald
First, it's really great that the RISCOS community are at last singing the
same tune. This strength beats any protectionist issues hands down.
Second, hey, it can sell into the US of A at last, without worrying about
stupid power conversion.
Third, will it run on PocketPC or whatever it's been rebranded these days?
My Psion 5 is getting old.
Cheers,
Guy
Geoff Lavallin
> In message <dab3e751.03090...@posting.google.com>
> a...@globalcafe.ie (Annraoi) wrote:
>
> > Yep there you have it folks on
> > http://www.riscos.com/news/news_items/PR020903.htm
> >
> > Seems like VA will soon have RO4 available generally (and therefore
> > not just limited to the Microdigital Alpha).
I've noticed on the VA site that the min spec of PC required is 500
Mhz
Would Risc os4 with VAriscpc on such a PC equate to the performance
of an A7000+ ( ie.about 50 Mhz).
druck
> Third, will it run on PocketPC or whatever it's been rebranded these days?
> My Psion 5 is getting old.
No, Pocket PC / WinCE is not compatible in any way with Windows, and it runs
on a different processor, usually ARM rather than x86.
---druck
--
The ARM Club Free Software - http://www.armclub.org.uk/free/
The 32bit Conversions Page - http://www.quantumsoft.co.uk/druck/
simo
[snip]
> a) RISC OS Ltd and Castle Ltd are actively talking to each other,
> because AIUI this means the RO4 licensing conditions have changed.
The "must be sold with hardware" clause was with Pace. I guess ROL can
ignore that now that they don't own RISC OS anymore, not neccessarily
re-negotiated with Castle.
> b) If the above is true, then Castle, probably the leading RO hardware
> manufacturer, is confident that the market will not be harmed.
I think Castle believe THEIR market won't be harmed, i.e. VARPC
standalone will probably kill the Alpha/Omega/RiscStation, but not the
Iyonix.
ROL should get more Select subs from this, or at least money from RO4
to continue development.
Hopefully VirtualAcorn are getting their fair share too for all the
excellent work that Graeme and Aaron have put in.
Jess
I think it will be mostly beneficial to the market.
I think most purchasers would otherwise have been lost to RO or just
carry on using an old machine. I don't think it will stop sales of many
new machines (certainly not in proportion to the total sales it is
likely to have)
It would give options to (some of) those who have windows at work and
RISC OS at home.
It would be of interest to those who gave up waiting for an RO laptop
and bought a PC laptop.
It would be ideal for those who have needs that require a Windows
system, but can't justify an Iyonix (etc) too. It might mean some cheap
RPCs on the secondhand market.
I don't think it would be a substitue for a real Iyonix (or omega)
There must be lots of users who when they get home want to get away
from windows (I know I do)
I only think that real machines would only be threatened if a stand
alone version ever happened (ie no windows needed) and even then it
would be the cheapie alternative. I guess a high end PC would be likely
to match an Iyonix before too long, but that would help ensure that the
hardware manufacturers keep on their toes.
--
Jess icq: 91353267 msn: phant...@hotmail.com http://www.kentwebnet.com
Hotmail is my spam trap - don't use for email
mailto:nos...@itworkshop.uklinux.net
RISC OS 4.36 kinetic 64+128+2M Castle Storm DMA + 17GB 586-133 I-3 ADSL
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Jess
simonin...@yahoo.co.uk (simo) wrote:
> Martin Dann <Mar...@f451.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>
> [snip]
> > a) RISC OS Ltd and Castle Ltd are actively talking to each other,
> > because AIUI this means the RO4 licensing conditions have changed.
>
> The "must be sold with hardware" clause was with Pace. I guess ROL can
Surely acorn/e14?
> ignore that now that they don't own RISC OS anymore, not neccessarily
> re-negotiated with Castle.
I don't see that, but Castle would be far easier to re-negotiate with.
> > b) If the above is true, then Castle, probably the leading RO hardware
> > manufacturer, is confident that the market will not be harmed.
>
> I think Castle believe THEIR market won't be harmed, i.e. VARPC
> standalone will probably kill the Alpha/Omega/RiscStation, but not the
> Iyonix.
Doubt it will have much affect on the Omega. The Alpha will probably
survive because some people like complete solutions.
> ROL should get more Select subs from this, or at least money from RO4
> to continue development.
>
> Hopefully VirtualAcorn are getting their fair share too for all the
> excellent work that Graeme and Aaron have put in.
--
Peter Naulls
> Yep there you have it folks on
> http://www.riscos.com/news/news_items/PR020903.htm
http://www.drobe.co.uk/riscos/artifact799.html
--
Peter Naulls - pe...@chocky.org | http://www.chocky.org/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
GCC for RISC OS | http://hard-mofo.dsvr.net/gcc/
Tim Rowledge
> Thoughts anyone ?
Yes - I'd like to see it available for Mac OSX so I can run my favourite
OS on nice hardware with a bearable OS underneath it.
tim
--
Tim Rowledge, t...@sumeru.stanford.edu, http://sumeru.stanford.edu/tim
Oxymorons: Same difference
Ian K (N)
In article <1c17c52...@mcfamily.demon.co.uk>,
Andy McMullon <an...@mcfamily.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> In missive <9ffec02b4c%Mar...@f451.freeserve.co.uk>
> Martin Dann <Mar...@f451.freeserve.co.uk> expounded:
> > In message <dab3e751.03090...@posting.google.com>
> > a...@globalcafe.ie (Annraoi) wrote:
> >
> > > Yep there you have it folks on
> > > http://www.riscos.com/news/news_items/PR020903.htm
> > >
> > > Seems like VA will soon have RO4 available generally (and therefore
> > > not just limited to the Microdigital Alpha).
> > >
> > > I have mixed feelings about emulation and the potential for damage it
> > > will cause the platform, but having RO4 available for people who
> > > already have laptop computers (rather than insisting they buy yet
> > > another PC laptop to run it) is probably the lesser of two evils.
> The only hardware solution we were being offered (and that not yet
> ready) was 7500 based and very slow and very expensive compared with
> the virtual alternative.
> The only advantage of the RS portable was size and battery life.
Has the RS portable been formally declared dead or is there still a
possibility it will be reborn in some shape or form?
If it wasn't for the case issues I think there would of been a steady
stream of laptops after the A4. I've been looking into making a small
batch of RISC OS palmtop PC's even with it's small and very simple case
design it's prohibitively expensive to make with the volume I'm likely to
shift.
RISC OS hardware is ideally suited for turning into laptops with only
board remodleing and addition of LCD driving and battery control hardware,
a much more straightforward job than the Omega or Iyonix have been. But
unless a suitable case can be found that can be guaranteed to be available
for at least 5 years it's really not going to be practical to produce one.
For the moment at least emulation is the best way round this.
> On the down side I'm much more worried about people buying VirtualRPC
> for desktop use. After all a 3.0 Pentium 4 (or alternative) must run
> quite a bit faster than a RISC PC. How does it compare with an Iyonix
> though?
The trick is to make the current hardware desirable, which at the moment
it is, so people still want to buy the genuine article. Both Castle and
Microdigital need to be clever in the way they develop and promote their
products so this continues to be so.
Regards
Ian K
* Inventor of radio controlled knicker elastic!
simo
[snip]
> I've noticed on the VA site that the min spec of PC required is 500Mhz
> Would Risc os4 with VAriscpc on such a PC equate to the performance
> of an A7000+ ( ie.about 50 Mhz).
My PIII/500 laptop gets 22-28MIPS, a real RPC700 gets about 23, so yes
500MHz should get you about the same as an A7000+
Mr J McCulloch
So basically you don't want anyone to buy a new PC, but if they have already
gone down this route, you don't really mind if they rin VARiscPC/RISC OS 4 on
it.
As opposed to supporting a company with a native RISC OS 4 machine, in
production, who might benefit other RISC OS users in the longer run by the
increased sales of their PC Laptop equipped with VARiscPC/RISC OS 4, and thus
more money in the coffers to develop their native RISC OS machine.
Strikes me that you have used the same false logic as others out there.
While I do not mind people deciding to purchase any computer suitable for
their needs, I would suggest if they have already gone the PC route, they are
unlikely to want to be able to run RISC OS.
I must state here that although my sig file shows computer: Acorn RiscPC....
I am also the proud owner of a MD Alpha, which I am extremely impressed with,
so I speak from both camps as it is.
I have to say that native software for PC is different from RISC OS, not
necessarily better or worse, just different. It certainly is generally
enormous compared to similar RISC OS software. But I have to say it generally
does what it says on the tin, even if I find RISC OS applications easier to
use and much more productive.
I had a specific need for a laptop and a lesser need for PC compatibility,
and I feel that the Alpha gives me the best of both worlds.
73 de john
--
Email : jo...@jcmcc1srp.freeserve.co.uk
Callsign : GM1SRP (Class B)
Computer : Acorn RiscPC SA 202MHz RISC OS Select 3i1
Modem : Elsa MicroLink 56k Fun
VinceH (use reply-to)
Peter Naulls <pe...@chocky.org> wrote:
> In message <dab3e751.03090...@posting.google.com>
> a...@globalcafe.ie (Annraoi) wrote:
> > Yep there you have it folks on
> > http://www.riscos.com/news/news_items/PR020903.htm
> http://www.drobe.co.uk/riscos/artifact799.html
http://www.softrock.co.uk/usenet/csa/misc/post382.html
;-)
VinceH
--
VinceH can be found in the vicinity of http://www.vinceh.com
Soft Rock Software can be found around http://www.softrock.co.uk
WebChange2 for RISC OS & Windows is at http://www.webchange.co.uk
VinceH (use reply-to)
> [snip]
> > a) RISC OS Ltd and Castle Ltd are actively talking to each
> > other, because AIUI this means the RO4 licensing conditions
> > have changed.
> The "must be sold with hardware" clause was with Pace. I guess
> ROL can ignore that now that they don't own RISC OS anymore,
> not neccessarily re-negotiated with Castle.
Unless the RISC OS market has a specific exemption
from The Real World[tm], then the terms of their
licence would remain the same when the ownership
changed, with only [one of] the named parties
changing, until and unless it was re-negotiated.
[...]
Ollie Clark
[snip]
> While I do not mind people deciding to purchase any computer suitable for
> their needs, I would suggest if they have already gone the PC route, they are
> unlikely to want to be able to run RISC OS.
What if they are given a PC at work but want to use some Risc OS software
(like me). Using ROS at work has renewed my interest in it at home and I'm
considering saving up for an Iyonix now. So that's one possible sale of
new hardware the emulator has *created*. If I can persuade my bosses, I'll
be paying out for a copy of VRPC with a copy of ROS4 so that's some more
money that'll go towards ROS development.
[...]
--
Ollie Clark - oli...@comp.leeds.ac.uk - o...@ollieclark.com
http://www.ollieclark.com/acronyms.html
Martin Wuerthner
> Martin Dann <Mar...@f451.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>
> [snip]
> > a) RISC OS Ltd and Castle Ltd are actively talking to each other,
> > because AIUI this means the RO4 licensing conditions have changed.
>
> The "must be sold with hardware" clause was with Pace. I guess ROL can
> ignore that now that they don't own RISC OS anymore, not neccessarily
> re-negotiated with Castle.
That is a funny idea. So you reasoning is along the lines of:
I have a contract with company <A> owning product <B>. That contract,
under condition <C>, allows me to do <D>. Now that <B> has been sold from
<A> to <E> I will continue doing <D> but I will conventiently forget about
condition <C>?
It has been clearly stated that existing licences are unaffected by the
sale of RISC OS from Pace to Castle so nothing has changed for RISCOS Ltd.
If their original contract with E14 or whatever they have later signed
with Pace disallows the sale of RO4 as a pure software product and they
are now able to do that, then that clearly means that they must have
re-renegotiated with Castle.
The fact that RISC OS was sold by Pace does not per se have any impact on
existing contracts anyway. RISCOS Ltd. have a contract with E14, later
"inherited" by Pace that grants them certain rights under certain
conditions. Obviously, when Pace sold RISC OS it had to make sure that it
could still honour its contract with RISCOS Ltd so it had to put in a
clause in the contract that placed an obligation on Castle to honour the
existing contract with RISCOS Ltd.
Just imagine I gave my neighbour a contract that allowed him to use my car
each Monday for a whole year. If I then decided to sell my car tomorrow I
would have to make sure that the buyer continues to grant that right to my
neighbour, otherwise I would be in trouble because I would be in breach of
contract with my neighbour. If I just sold the car without any specific
extra clauses in the contract, there is no way my neighbour could force
the buyer to grant him access to the car on the grounds of his contract
with me. But, of course, my neighbour could sue me. So, I have to put a
clause in the sales contract that obligates the buyer to honour the
contract I had made with my neighbour and grant him the promised rights.
The same must have happened when RISC OS was first sold from E14 to Pace
and then from Pace to Castle. Of course, both parties involved in the
contract can always decide to re-negotiate.
Martin
--
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Martin Wuerthner MW Software mar...@invalidMW-software.com
remove "invalid" to reply
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Martin Wuerthner
Jess <phant...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> In message <30260531.03090...@posting.google.com>
> simonin...@yahoo.co.uk (simo) wrote:
> > I think Castle believe THEIR market won't be harmed, i.e. VARPC
> > standalone will probably kill the Alpha/Omega/RiscStation, but not the
> > Iyonix.
>
> Doubt it will have much affect on the Omega. The Alpha will probably
> survive because some people like complete solutions.
Well, so far, most people were not exactly thrilled by the hardware side
of the Alpha. Every corner shop can now sell a better specced laptop
complete with VARPC as a complete solution.
druck
> Has the RS portable been formally declared dead
Dead? It slipped out it had never even been born.
> or is there still a possibility it will be reborn in some shape or form?
Absolutely zero. Who would want a machine so slow in comparison with the
Iyonix, with a hopelessly inadequte display, now anyway?
> If it wasn't for the case issues I think there would of been a steady
> stream of laptops after the A4. I've been looking into making a small
> batch of RISC OS palmtop PC's even with it's small and very simple case
> design it's prohibitively expensive to make with the volume I'm likely to
> shift.
Thats the problem, and after seeing such difficulties, I highly doubt whether
the single viable hardware manufacturer in this market, would risk their
company on such a venture, no matter howmuch I'd like to be proved wrong.
> RISC OS hardware is ideally suited for turning into laptops with only
> board remodleing and addition of LCD driving and battery control hardware,
All on chip these days, although perhapse not the spec (15" 1600x1200) I'd
be after.
> a much more straightforward job than the Omega or Iyonix have been. But
> unless a suitable case can be found that can be guaranteed to be available
> for at least 5 years it's really not going to be practical to produce one.
> For the moment at least emulation is the best way round this.
Its ridiculous such piece of plastic costs so much. You can understand if it
has to house desktop replacement x86's which generate up to 86W and need
ridiculously complex heat pumps to stop them melting, but we dont need
anything like that.
> The trick is to make the current hardware desirable, which at the moment
> it is, so people still want to buy the genuine article. Both Castle and
> Microdigital need to be clever in the way they develop and promote their
> products so this continues to be so.
Well I'd only half agree with that, for obvious reasons.
Dave Cooper
<g...@less.spam.please.to.steelpillow.com> wrote:
>
> First, it's really great that the RISCOS community are at last singing the
> same tune. This strength beats any protectionist issues hands down.
>
> Guy
>
Fully agree with this statement!
I will continue to use my very upgraded StrongArm PC as my main machine.
I will continue to save up for an Iyonix.
And I will enjoy upgrading my Virtual5000 to VRiscPc with RO4 and Select.
Regards, Dave C.
--
__ __ __ __ __ ___ _____________________________________________
|__||__)/ __/ \|\ ||_ | /StrongArm RiscPc (RISCOS4) saving for Iyonix
| || \\__/\__/| \||__ |/RINGS:- RISC OS, SF Review & Classical Music
free wallpaper backdrops & photos http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/dac/
Annraoi
<snip>
> So basically you don't want anyone to buy a new PC, but if they have already
> gone down this route, you don't really mind if they rin VARiscPC/RISC OS 4 on
> it.
>
Yes, if someone has a PC or can acquire one cheaply second hand it
means with an unbundled VARPC-SE they can use RISC OS on a PC without
purchasing a Windows XP license (in short without providing further
support to Microsoft in the process). It also is a cheaper means for
RISC OS users to use RISC OS on a PC than insisting that they *must*
purchase an overpriced laptop from one specific non-PC specialist
vendor.
> As opposed to supporting a company with a native RISC OS 4 machine, in
> production, who might benefit other RISC OS users in the longer run by the
> increased sales of their PC Laptop equipped with VARiscPC/RISC OS 4, and thus
> more money in the coffers to develop their native RISC OS machine.
>
So what you're saying is (let's name names here shall we ?) you're
supporting MD's Omega by buying Alpha ? Surely a more direct route
would be to purchase Omega ? After all MD don't have to pay VA or
Microsoft to use RISC OS on an Omega and more of the money stays with
them.
> Strikes me that you have used the same false logic as others out there.
>
What, that I don't believe that buying a PC and a (yet another) copy
of WindowsXP is a way to effectively support RISC OS ? That's what
happens when you buy an Alpha ! Most of the money goes to some
(unnamed) PC Laptop manufacturer, then a swodge to Microsoft and then
VA/ROL and MD battle over the scraps.....
> While I do not mind people deciding to purchase any computer suitable for
> their needs, I would suggest if they have already gone the PC route, they are
> unlikely to want to be able to run RISC OS.
>
Why so ?
People may have a PC and an Acorn, they may be contemplating an Iyonix
(the cheapest and most powerful new RISC OS native platform), they're
hardly going to be able to afford that *and* buy MD's Alpha - but use
the £150 VARPC on their existing PC and the maths becomes better
doesn't it ?
<snip>
> I had a specific need for a laptop and a lesser need for PC compatibility,
> and I feel that the Alpha gives me the best of both worlds.
It's an expensive means of acchieving that end though, and if you'd
been able to choose a cheaper PC (or get one second hand) and put
VARPC-SE up on it then you might have saved enough money to make
Iyonix (or Omega) a viable upgrade for your existing RPC.
Feel free to disagree though, each person has to make their own mind
up on this one......
Kind Regards
Annraoi
Ian Jeffray
> Doubt it will have much affect on the Omega. The Alpha will probably
> survive because some people like complete solutions.
It won't be long before some bright spark (CJE/STD?) come along and
bundle VRPC with a *decent* spec laptop, then.
I.
charles
Annraoi <a...@globalcafe.ie> wrote:
> People may have a PC and an Acorn, they may be contemplating an Iyonix
> (the cheapest and most powerful new RISC OS native platform), they're
> hardly going to be able to afford that *and* buy MD's Alpha -
well, perhaps I'm not people but I have an Iyonix and an Alpha.
Stephen Parkin
<URL:mailto:ne...@druck.freeuk.com> wrote:
> On 2 Sep 2003 Guy Inchbald <g...@less.spam.please.to.steelpillow.com> wrote:
> > Third, will it run on PocketPC or whatever it's been rebranded these days?
> > My Psion 5 is getting old.
>
> No, Pocket PC / WinCE is not compatible in any way with Windows, and it runs
> on a different processor, usually ARM rather than x86.
>
> ---druck
>
For exmple, my Dell Axim PPC has a 400MHz XScale processor.
Stephen
Richard Porter
> Guy Inchbald <g...@less.spam.please.to.steelpillow.com> wrote:
> >
> > First, it's really great that the RISCOS community are at last singing the
> > same tune. This strength beats any protectionist issues hands down.
> >
> Fully agree with this statement!
>
> I will continue to use my very upgraded StrongArm PC as my main machine.
>
> I will continue to save up for an Iyonix.
>
> And I will enjoy upgrading my Virtual5000 to VRiscPc with RO4 and Select.
Alleluya!
Peter Bell
charles <cha...@charleshope.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> well, perhaps I'm not people but I have an Iyonix and an Alpha.
I'll raise you - those plus an Omega and 4 RPCs!
--
Peter Bell - pe...@bellfamily.org.uk
Harriet Bazley
druck wrote:
[snip laptop cases]
> Its ridiculous such piece of plastic costs so much. You can understand if it
> has to house desktop replacement x86's which generate up to 86W and need
> ridiculously complex heat pumps to stop them melting, but we dont need
> anything like that.
>
Well, the most practicable solution I've seen yet was from the
individual who proposed, given a relatively small production run,
employing a cabinet-maker to make the necessary components out of
*wood*....
--
Harriet Bazley == Loyaulte me lie ==
Questions are a burden to others, but answers are a prison for oneself.
Jess
Martin Wuerthner <mar...@invalidMW-software.com.invalid> wrote:
> In message <b8dddd2...@itworkshop.invalid>
> Jess <phant...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > In message <30260531.03090...@posting.google.com>
> > simonin...@yahoo.co.uk (simo) wrote:
>
> > > I think Castle believe THEIR market won't be harmed, i.e. VARPC
> > > standalone will probably kill the Alpha/Omega/RiscStation, but not the
> > > Iyonix.
> >
> > Doubt it will have much affect on the Omega. The Alpha will probably
> > survive because some people like complete solutions.
>
> Well, so far, most people were not exactly thrilled by the hardware side
> of the Alpha. Every corner shop can now sell a better specced laptop
> complete with VARPC as a complete solution.
But I don't think many of them would have bought it anyway.
Bob Hartley
> On 3 Sep 2003 as I do recall,
> druck wrote:
>
> [snip laptop cases]
>
> > Its ridiculous such piece of plastic costs so much. You can understand if it
> > has to house desktop replacement x86's which generate up to 86W and need
> > ridiculously complex heat pumps to stop them melting, but we dont need
> > anything like that.
> >
> Well, the most practicable solution I've seen yet was from the
> individual who proposed, given a relatively small production run,
> employing a cabinet-maker to make the necessary components out of
> *wood*....
There is no need.
In Alexandria, Scotland, there is a custom plastics manufacturer that
does everything from design to production. They made Chris Boardman's
wheels, and the williams water bottles. Trustme it can be complex
designing a watter bottle for Nigel Mansell so that no matter what G
force or corner he was going through he still had +ve pressure for a
drink. :-)
I know my mate Phil Murphy did them. :-)
A coputer case would be a easy.
cheers
bob
John Cartmell
Cost my dear boy. Cost.
I could design a case tomorrow (OK it'll take a few months!) but share the
design, tooling, &c cost between (how many?) and you won't get many takers.
rs. ;
--
John Cartmell jo...@cartmell.demon.co.uk FAX +44 (0)8700-519-527
Acorn Publisher magazine & FD Games www.acornpublisher.com
Steffen Huber
> In message <4c2c42dd...@charleshope.demon.co.uk>
> charles <cha...@charleshope.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > well, perhaps I'm not people but I have an Iyonix and an Alpha.
>
> I'll raise you - those plus an Omega and 4 RPCs!
You mean you don't have 5 RPCs, an Iyonix, an Omega, an A5000,
two A3000s, an A310, VirtualA5000 and soon VirtualRPC? Shame
on you ;-)
Steffen
--
steffe...@gmx.de ste...@huber-net.de
GCC for RISC OS - http://www.arcsite.de/hp/gcc/
Private homepage - http://www.huber-net.de/
Peter Bell
Steffen Huber <sp...@huber-net.de> wrote:
> Peter Bell wrote:
> > In message <4c2c42dd...@charleshope.demon.co.uk>
> > charles <cha...@charleshope.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> >
> > > well, perhaps I'm not people but I have an Iyonix and an Alpha.
> >
> > I'll raise you - those plus an Omega and 4 RPCs!
>
> You mean you don't have 5 RPCs, an Iyonix, an Omega, an A5000,
> two A3000s, an A310, VirtualA5000 and soon VirtualRPC? Shame
> on you ;-)
Not quite, but I do have VirtualA5000 and, obviously, VRPC on the
Alpha. I would have to include the company-owned machines (currently
at my colleague's office) to add a fifth RPC, an A5000 and an A410.
So, I guess I'm short by a couple of A3000s. Used to have an A3010,
but sold it to Gavan Fantom who, last I heard, still runs BSD on it.
skok
> Peter Bell wrote:
>> In message <4c2c42dd...@charleshope.demon.co.uk>
>> charles <cha...@charleshope.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> well, perhaps I'm not people but I have an Iyonix and an Alpha.
>>
>> I'll raise you - those plus an Omega and 4 RPCs!
>
> You mean you don't have 5 RPCs, an Iyonix, an Omega, an A5000,
> two A3000s, an A310, VirtualA5000 and soon VirtualRPC? Shame
> on you ;-)
OK, you win there! We just have 3 RPCs, 1 A310, 1 PC, but we will raise you
one BBC model B Issue 7.... :)
Samuel
--
Samuel Kock
Pretoria, South Africa
Bio: http://go.to/skock/bio.htm
"Kernal" is not a word. The correct spelling is "kernel".
Russ Tarbox
> Used to have an A3010,
> but sold it to Gavan Fantom who, last I heard, still runs BSD on it.
There's a blast from the past. Haven't seen him for a few years. Kind of
surprised he doesn't post here to be honest. What's he up to these days?
--
Russ Tarbox
Biog: http://www.userve.co.uk/russbiog.htm
Shop: http://www.stores.ebay.co.uk/riscitfromruss
Remove THELID to reply by e-mail
Kell Gatherer
Steffen Huber <sp...@huber-net.de> wrote:
> > I'll raise you - those plus an Omega and 4 RPCs!
> You mean you don't have 5 RPCs, an Iyonix, an Omega, an A5000,
> two A3000s, an A310, VirtualA5000 and soon VirtualRPC? Shame
> on you ;-)
We have 10 x SA RPC's (5 with RO4), 1 x Iyonix, 1 x A7000 and 2 x PC's
running XP Pro. I think we still have a couple of A310's upstairs, but I
gave away the BBC's years ago. The email server is a Linux box, and
there's regularly a couple of Mac laptops plugged in as well. Once VRPC
has networking sorted out I'll get an Alpha or whatever anyone else
recommends (I do however prefer the idea of VRPC being pre-loaded).
Oh, and my brother James has an RPC (in Galloway), my brother Nigel and my
Dad each have SA RPC's (Crieff and Edinburgh).
But I've asked for my deposit back on the RiscStation portable....
--
Kell Gatherer
ke...@locsource.com
The Location Source
Russ Tarbox
> pre-loaded).
Do you mind if I enquire why?
Peter Bell
"Russ Tarbox" <russ...@THELIDuserve.co.uk> wrote:
> Peter Bell wrote:
>
> > Used to have an A3010,
> > but sold it to Gavan Fantom who, last I heard, still runs BSD on it.
>
> There's a blast from the past. Haven't seen him for a few years. Kind of
> surprised he doesn't post here to be honest. What's he up to these days?
He seems to be a regular at all the Acorn shows - on the BSD stand. He
was proudly demonstrating his motorised RPC flap at the last Wakefield
show.
Ian Molton
"skok" <sam...@global.xhosa> wrote:
>
> OK, you win there! We just have 3 RPCs, 1 A310, 1 PC, but we will
> raise you one BBC model B Issue 7.... :)
I've got an A540 fully loaded with 16MB and an FPU...
I know someone with an A680 though. <fx: envy rays>
--
Spyros lair: http://www.mnementh.co.uk/ |||| Maintainer: arm26 linux
Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are tasty and good with
ketchup.
Ian Molton
Peter Bell <pe...@bellfamily.org.uk> wrote:
>
> He seems to be a regular at all the Acorn shows - on the BSD stand.
> He was proudly demonstrating his motorised RPC flap at the last
> Wakefield show.
Yeah, that was very cool ;-)
John Campbell Rees
in message <4c2c930...@cartmell.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> In article <7b144ff3.03090...@posting.google.com>,
> Bob Hartley <r.ha...@bio.gla.ac.uk> wrote:
> > A coputer case would be a easy.
>
> Cost my dear boy. Cost.
And just think how impressive a walnut veneer laptop would look
compared to the grey/beige/black plastic machines everyone else is
using.
--
"Like shooting flies with a laser cannon, the aims a bit tricky, but
it certainly deals with the flies." - Lord Miles Vorkosigan.
From "Komarr" by Lois McMaster Bujold
skok
> On Thu, 04 Sep 2003 14:14:15 +0100
> Peter Bell <pe...@bellfamily.org.uk> wrote:
>
>>
>> He seems to be a regular at all the Acorn shows - on the BSD stand.
>> He was proudly demonstrating his motorised RPC flap at the last
>> Wakefield show.
>
> Yeah, that was very cool ;-)
Hmm, can someone (maybe him?) put this on a website somewhere? I would love
to be able to do that! A DIY version maybe?
Samuel
--
Samuel Kock
Pretoria, South Africa
Bio: http://go.to/skock/bio.htm
I'd like to, but I'm going to count the bristles in my toothbrush.
Peter Bell
"skok" <sam...@global.xhosa> wrote:
> Ian Molton wrote:
> > On Thu, 04 Sep 2003 14:14:15 +0100
> > Peter Bell <pe...@bellfamily.org.uk> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> He seems to be a regular at all the Acorn shows - on the BSD stand.
> >> He was proudly demonstrating his motorised RPC flap at the last
> >> Wakefield show.
> >
> > Yeah, that was very cool ;-)
>
> Hmm, can someone (maybe him?) put this on a website somewhere? I would love
> to be able to do that! A DIY version maybe?
It is a NetBSD program, and relies on the particular hardware which
Gavan happened to be able to lay his hands on. If you are running
NetBSD, and are interested in adding this feature then I suggest a
posting in the port-acorn32 mailing list might attract his attention.
Dave Symes
Barry Allen (news) <evan...@onetel.net.uk> wrote:
> In article <19b5512c4...@freeuk.com>, Harriet Bazley
> <har...@bazley.freeuk.com> wrote:
[Snip]
> > >
> > Well, the most practicable solution I've seen yet was from the
> > individual who proposed, given a relatively small production run,
> > employing a cabinet-maker to make the necessary components out of
> > *wood*....
> Mnn! I'd thought of this. A few bits of plywood and decent glue. Give me
> a working drawing and I'd have a go. It could be made to look quite nice
> as well.
I'm not denigrating your suggestion, just adding some thoughts, but as a
former Pro-Woodworker, can I assume from the above you are not a pro
woodworker?
Most diy persons with some amateur woodworking skills *could* take a month
to knock up a nice plywood case, trim/sand and polish/paint it to death.
The pro bit is making it good quality in a short time, so that it'd be
cost effective.
A self employed, pro woodworker today, would I suppose want somewhere
around 12-15 quid an hour.
Plus the cost of materials, including some good quality fittings like
hinges, stays and catches.
Even on a run, I couldn't see this being cost effective.
Cheers
Dave S
--
Pete Bready
John Cartmell <jo...@cartmell.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> In article <7b144ff3.03090...@posting.google.com>,
> Bob Hartley <r.ha...@bio.gla.ac.uk> wrote:
> > A coputer case would be a easy.
>
> Cost my dear boy. Cost.
You probably have a point there - have a look at http://www.woodcontour.com
(someone's been watching Will & Grace) or
http://www.exoticwoodcrafts.com/NewWoodCaseKits.html.
It's amazing what Google turns up!
--
PBready
Rob Hemmings
Ian Molton <sp...@f2s.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 4 Sep 2003 12:39:22 +0200
> "skok" <sam...@global.xhosa> wrote:
> >
> > OK, you win there! We just have 3 RPCs, 1 A310, 1 PC, but we will
> > raise you one BBC model B Issue 7.... :)
> I've got an A540 fully loaded with 16MB and an FPU...
> I know someone with an A680 though. <fx: envy rays>
What's an A680?
--
-------------------------------------------------------------
Rob Hemmings Southport
Tel: +44 (0)1704 573210 rhem...@argonet.co.uk
Ian Molton
Rob Hemmings <rhem...@argonet.co.uk> wrote:
> > I know someone with an A680 though. <fx: envy rays>
>
> What's an A680?
Arc with onboard SCSI...
Andy Pickering
<jo...@jcmcc1srp.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
> While I do not mind people deciding to purchase any computer suitable
> for their needs, I would suggest if they have already gone the PC route,
> they are unlikely to want to be able to run RISC OS.
> I must state here that although my sig file shows computer: Acorn
> RiscPC.... I am also the proud owner of a MD Alpha, which I am extremely
> impressed with, so I speak from both camps as it is.
> I had a specific need for a laptop and a lesser need for PC
> compatibility, and I feel that the Alpha gives me the best of both
> worlds.
Indeed. In my case, I needed a PC to be able to connect to my workplace
over broadband/VPN. (I had been using my RiscPC but only over a dialup
connection due to lack of an approved VPN client, which made it a bit slow
for graphical operations and tied up the phone line.) However, I also
definitely wanted to keep using RISC OS applications for my work, and
preferably have the ability to transport this around with me. A portable
PC running RO4 is therefore an ideal solution, and certainly does not
represent a wholehearted switch to MS.
I've been very happy with my Alpha (especially the VARPC side), and the
helpful support and advice that David Atkins has given me over the phone.
My only difficulty has been getting used to the touchpad/buttons, which
are not ergonomically ideal for using RO's flexibility with Sel/Menu/Adj
and Ctrl/Shift/Alt combinations.
Andy Pickering
--
********************************************************************
* StrongArm RiscPC / RISC OS 4 *
********************************************************************
Peter Bell
Andy Pickering <an...@surtsey.demon.co.uk> wrote:
[Snip]
> Indeed. In my case, I needed a PC to be able to connect to my workplace
> over broadband/VPN. (I had been using my RiscPC but only over a dialup
> connection due to lack of an approved VPN client, which made it a bit slow
> for graphical operations and tied up the phone line.)
A VPN client is built in to my adsl router, thereby all machines
(including RPCs, Iyonix and Alpha) on my network have transparent access
to the remote sites.
Andy Pickering
Annraoi <a...@globalcafe.ie> wrote:
> I don't believe that buying a PC and a (yet another) copy of WindowsXP
> is a way to effectively support RISC OS ? That's what happens when you
> buy an Alpha ! Most of the money goes to some (unnamed) PC Laptop
> manufacturer, then a swodge to Microsoft and then VA/ROL and MD battle
> over the scraps.....
I was persuaded by the comment in Dave Holden's article in the August 2003
edition of Risc World which stated that "RISCOS Ltd makes more money on
each Alpha than Microsoft does".
I think of it as a 2-1 victory, rather than the 5-0 whitewash that the
Riscstation portable would have been. :-}
> Kind Regards
> Annraoi
Cheers,
News poster
Dave Symes <d...@ukgateway.net> wrote:
<snip>
> A self employed, pro woodworker today, would I suppose want somewhere
> around 12-15 quid an hour.
>
> Plus the cost of materials, including some good quality fittings like
> hinges, stays and catches.
>
> Even on a run, I couldn't see this being cost effective.
How about CNC-ing major case components out of aluminum billets? I know
that CNC can be more cost effective for small runs. Added advantage is
that you have control over the design and can relatively easily make
more from the same pattern or modify the design as necessary.
Should make a strong corrosion resistant case that would meet electrical
emmision requirements, also you could anodise the surface of the case
and get some bright colours for your laptop?
Make it fit an A7000/+ board or a Simtec board or even a Neuron board
from Castle.
Any CNC experts out there who would like to comment?
Cheers
Stan
David Holden
On 5-Sep-2003, Andy Pickering <an...@surtsey.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Indeed. In my case, I needed a PC to be able to connect to my
> workplace over broadband/VPN. (I had been using my RiscPC but
> only over a dialup connection due to lack of an approved VPN client,
> which made it a bit slow for graphical operations and tied up the
> phone line.) However, I also definitely wanted to keep using RISC OS
> applications for my work, and preferably have the ability to
> transport
> this around with me. A portable PC running RO4 is therefore an ideal
> solution, and certainly does not represent a wholehearted switch to
> MS.
>
> I've been very happy with my Alpha (especially the VARPC side), and
> the helpful support and advice that David Atkins has given me over
> the
> phone.
>
> My only difficulty has been getting used to the touchpad/buttons,
> which are not ergonomically ideal for using RO's flexibility with
> Sel/Menu/Adj and Ctrl/Shift/Alt combinations.
Unless you are acyually using in on the move why not use a mouse? I
use the same optical scroll mouse that I use with my RiscPC.
--
David Holden - APDL - <http://www.apdl.co.uk>
Russ Tarbox
<snip>
>
> I was persuaded by the comment in Dave Holden's article in the August
> 2003 edition of Risc World which stated that "RISCOS Ltd makes more
> money on each Alpha than Microsoft does".
>
That's because RISC OS 4 costs £85 and Windows XP home (OEM) is £60.
I'd hardly boast about our chosen OS costing more than Windows!
Phil
David Holden <ne...@apdl.co.uk> wrote:
Phil: I like using a graphics tablet myself: I have one attached to the
Alpha, but it doesn't pass through to the Acorn side the pressure (I
havn't loaded a pressure tool on the acorn side yet) nor the ABSOLUTE
coordinate position mode normal for the pen - (it goes into relative mode
with a different sensitivity for the cordless mouse, but this change is
passed through either... at the momemt I am compromising on the
sensitivity of the tablet which in turn affects the built in pad.
--
Phil Spiegelhalter: Ph...@fillin.co.uk
==== Technical Training for Broadcasters =====
*RE CUE Mobile DV Multi-Camera Production and Non-Linear Editing*
Andy Pickering
Peter Bell <pe...@bellfamily.org.uk> wrote:
> A VPN client is built in to my adsl router, thereby all machines
> (including RPCs, Iyonix and Alpha) on my network have transparent access
> to the remote sites.
VPN is also built into mine (Draytek Vigor2600), but I had to sign an
agreement to only connect via the approved Cisco (MS-only) VPN client :-(
Andy Pickering
> use the same optical scroll mouse that I use with my RiscPC.
Absolutely - it's the next thing on my shopping list already! ;-)
Although I might go for a trackball...
Andy Pickering
Russ Tarbox <russ...@THELIDuserve.co.uk> wrote:
> That's because RISC OS 4 costs £85 and Windows XP home (OEM) is £60.
> I'd hardly boast about our chosen OS costing more than Windows!
Well if you actually compare
"Cost of RO4"/"Number of RO4 licenses sold"
vs.
"Cost of Windows"/"Number of Windows licenses sold"
I'm sure the ratio is immense, though I'm not sure what it proves... ;-)
Andy McMullon
Andy Pickering <an...@surtsey.demon.co.uk> expounded:
> In article <dab3e751.03090...@posting.google.com>,
> Annraoi <a...@globalcafe.ie> wrote:
> > I don't believe that buying a PC and a (yet another) copy of WindowsXP
> > is a way to effectively support RISC OS ? That's what happens when you
> > buy an Alpha ! Most of the money goes to some (unnamed) PC Laptop
> > manufacturer, then a swodge to Microsoft and then VA/ROL and MD battle
> > over the scraps.....
>
> I was persuaded by the comment in Dave Holden's article in the August 2003
> edition of Risc World which stated that "RISCOS Ltd makes more money on
> each Alpha than Microsoft does".
>
> I think of it as a 2-1 victory, rather than the 5-0 whitewash that the
> Riscstation portable would have been. :-}
VA gives us the potential to recruit more users of RISC OS. If we get
enough of those then new hardware projects might look more profitable.
After are any of the big players making a profit soley out of RISC OS
at the moment? ROL, Castle, Microdigital, RiscStation - any of them?
I still think that a 'trojan horse' hardware solution might be good.
All the double edged benefits of PC hardware with the speed of proper
ARM architecture. A bit like a RiscPC PC card in reverse....
Any chance of something like that?
Andy McMullon
Andy Pickering <an...@surtsey.demon.co.uk> expounded:
> My only difficulty has been getting used to the touchpad/buttons, which
> are not ergonomically ideal for using RO's flexibility with Sel/Menu/Adj
> and Ctrl/Shift/Alt combinations.
I've not much of a problem with that - but I struggled for a while
with no 3 button mouse wondering why somone didn't program a menu kep
on the keyboard. Then I found it had one......
Harriet Bazley
News poster wrote:
[snip wooden portable cases]
> How about CNC-ing major case components out of aluminum billets?
[snip]
>
>
> Any CNC experts out there who would like to comment?
If it were that easy I suspect someone would already have done it. :-(
--
Harriet Bazley == Loyaulte me lie ==
Death is nature's way of telling you to slow down.
David Holden
On 5-Sep-2003, Andy McMullon <an...@mcfamily.demon.co.uk> wrote:
[snip]
> VA gives us the potential to recruit more users of RISC OS. If we
> get enough of those then new hardware projects might look more
> profitable.
>
> After are any of the big players making a profit soley out of RISC
> OS
> at the moment? ROL, Castle, Microdigital, RiscStation - any of them?
>
> I still think that a 'trojan horse' hardware solution might be good.
> All the double edged benefits of PC hardware with the speed of
> proper ARM architecture. A bit like a RiscPC PC card in reverse....
>
> Any chance of something like that?
No.
John Sandford
Harriet Bazley <har...@bazley.freeuk.com> wrote:
> On 5 Sep 2003 as I do recall,
> News poster wrote:
>
> [snip wooden portable cases]
>
> > How about CNC-ing major case components out of aluminum billets?
> [snip]
> >
> >
> > Any CNC experts out there who would like to comment?
>
> If it were that easy I suspect someone would already have done it. :-(
>
Like anything else this method needs Prototypes and an initial setup
devised and proven so has a Development cost needing numbers to justify.
--
John Sandford West Herts UK
Hemel Hempstead Risc OS User Group www.hhrug.org.uk
Jess
Andy McMullon <an...@mcfamily.demon.co.uk> wrote:
[snip]
> I still think that a 'trojan horse' hardware solution might be good.
> All the double edged benefits of PC hardware with the speed of proper
> ARM architecture. A bit like a RiscPC PC card in reverse....
>
> Any chance of something like that?
What processor chip would you use?
7500 - far slower than an emulated solutions, and you can get ATX
boards anyway.
Strongarm - now obsolete and a top end PC could match it anyway.
XScale - would need to run RO 5, so perhaps an iyonix motherboard would
be better.
VA works much like the PC card in reverse anyway.
--
Jess icq: 91353267 msn: phant...@hotmail.com http://www.kentwebnet.com
Hotmail is my spam trap - don't use for email
mailto:nos...@itworkshop.uklinux.net
RISC OS 4.36 kinetic 64+128+2M Castle Storm DMA + 17GB 586-133 I-3 ADSL
-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
-----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----
Annraoi
> Andy Pickering wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> >
> > I was persuaded by the comment in Dave Holden's article in the August
> > 2003 edition of Risc World which stated that "RISCOS Ltd makes more
> > money on each Alpha than Microsoft does".
> >
>
> That's because RISC OS 4 costs £85 and Windows XP home (OEM) is £60.
Surely the £85 for RISC OS is the price charged to single end users
(not to an OEM like MD), I suspect MD would pay somewhat less than £85
for the right to use it. MD also offer Windows XP Pro as an upgrade
option (and that certainly *does* cost more than £85).
Also ROL would have to pay royalties to Castle, whereas Microsoft get
all their £60....
>
> I'd hardly boast about our chosen OS costing more than Windows!
Indeed, besides (IMHO) it's not true. Most end users (unless they have
trade connections and can get OEM WindowsXP) will pay more for Windows
than for RISC OS.
Regards
Annraoi
Ian Molton
Andy McMullon <an...@mcfamily.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> All the double edged benefits of PC hardware with the speed of proper
> ARM architecture. A bit like a RiscPC PC card in reverse....
>
> Any chance of something like that?
Its called a linux box ;-)
Dave Higton
> On 5 Sep 2003 as I do recall,
> News poster wrote:
>
> [snip wooden portable cases]
>
> > How about CNC-ing major case components out of aluminum billets?
> [snip]
> >
> >
> > Any CNC experts out there who would like to comment?
>
> If it were that easy I suspect someone would already have done it. :-(
Yes. I remember from my apprentice days that when you take a billet
and remove a large amount of metal from it, you find that what's left
is very substantially bent. This is because the billet cooled with
enormous stresses in it, which now have their chance to be relieved.
One consideration, therefore, is that any such thing has to be machined
twice - one rough-out, then a final one. Preferably you stress relieve
it in an oven between the two operations. It all gets rather expensive.
I've also had some experience in plastic mouldings. You'd be amazed at
the stresses that exist in them. Careful design of the flow patterns
pays off handsomely, otherwise each piece has to be stress relieved
after the moulding process. Temperature control of the mould tool is
another area of study - oil flowing through the tools seems to be the
best way, but this too requires careful design.
I'm most impressed by the quality of mouldings for mobile phones and
laptops. The tolerances and surface finishes are excellent. But I
do have some idea of the costs involved; these numbers require great
confidence in the number of purchasers when translated to our market.
Dave
Andy McMullon
Jess <phant...@hotmail.com> expounded:
> In message <08b23d2...@mcfamily.demon.co.uk>
> Andy McMullon <an...@mcfamily.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> [snip]
>
> > I still think that a 'trojan horse' hardware solution might be good.
> > All the double edged benefits of PC hardware with the speed of proper
> > ARM architecture. A bit like a RiscPC PC card in reverse....
> >
> > Any chance of something like that?
>
>
> What processor chip would you use?
It would have to be:
> XScale - would need to run RO 5, so perhaps an iyonix motherboard would
> be better.
If it can be fitted into a PC slot, why not?
> VA works much like the PC card in reverse anyway.
I'm talking about something that gives full ARM hardware (not
emulated) with proper ARM speeds.
What speed would a PC processor have to be to be able to manage a true
speed Virtual Iyonix?
Jess
Andy McMullon <an...@mcfamily.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> In missive <e368a72...@itworkshop.invalid>
> Jess <phant...@hotmail.com> expounded:
[snip RiscPC PC card in reverse]
> > What processor chip would you use?
>
> It would have to be:
>
> > XScale - would need to run RO 5, so perhaps an iyonix motherboard would
> > be better.
>
> If it can be fitted into a PC slot, why not?
It depends how much you put in the card, but I would expect the PCI
slot to me a major bottleneck.
Also I don't think the cost would be much lower than an Iyonix board
itself.
> > VA works much like the PC card in reverse anyway.
>
> I'm talking about something that gives full ARM hardware (not
> emulated) with proper ARM speeds.
>
> What speed would a PC processor have to be to be able to manage a true
> speed Virtual Iyonix?
4 - 5 GHz ??? (Maybe less if "Virtual XScale" had it's own HAL rather
than pretending to be an Iyonix.)
--
Jess icq: 91353267 msn: phant...@hotmail.com http://www.kentwebnet.com
Hotmail is my spam trap - don't use for email
mailto:nos...@itworkshop.uklinux.net
RISC OS 4.37 kinetic 64+128+2M Castle Storm DMA + 17GB 586-133 I-3 ADSL
Andy McMullon
Jess <phant...@hotmail.com> expounded:
> In message <7ed8602...@mcfamily.demon.co.uk>
> Andy McMullon <an...@mcfamily.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> > What speed would a PC processor have to be to be able to manage a true
> > speed Virtual Iyonix?
>
> 4 - 5 GHz ??? (Maybe less if "Virtual XScale" had it's own HAL rather
> than pretending to be an Iyonix.)
So running RISC OS on ARM hardware is probably doomed anyway!
Annraoi
The 4-5GHz you'll find is an "estimate".
Even if accurate you're assuming that (a). There will be no further
improvement in ARM Hardware {remember Samsung's ARM10 will be along
shortly at 1.2GHz and so would push that estimate of PC equivilence up
to 8-10GHz} (B). That later windows won't *slow things down*. As long
as I've been in this business each successive windows edition has
required even faster hardware to compensate for it "slowing machines
down".
The advantage of using Native ARM Hardware is that you're running on
the real hardware rather than an emulation running on windows running
on alien hardware, even if the speed of both were the same the native
ARM setup would still be preferable as it is the only one you can
*guarantee* is RISC OS Compatible in all circumstances - you can't do
that for an emulation running on x86 gear.
Regards
Annraoi
Glenn Richards
>> Used to have an A3010, but sold it to Gavan Fantom who, last I
>> heard, still runs BSD on it.
> There's a blast from the past. Haven't seen him for a few years. Kind
> of surprised he doesn't post here to be honest. What's he up to these
> days?
He's working for Sun.
--
Glenn Richards Tel: (01453) 845735
Squirrel Solutions http://www.squirrel-net.co.uk/
"Growing old is compulsory. Growing UP is optional." -- Anon