Compact Flash "drive" on RiscPC via Unipod

[Jim Nagel]

I'm puzzled about why a Compact-Flash-to-IDE adapter isn't working on
my RiscPC quite as expected.

The CF card and adapter work with no problem on the Iyonix, but when I
plug the same card and adapter into the IDE slot on the Unipod on the
RiscPC (4.39), nothing appears on the iconbar. I didn't have to do
anything to make it appear on the Iyonix (5.18) iconbar.

The RiscPC's boot drive is plugged into the motherboard port, and it's
ADFS. I haven't used the Unipod IDE slots before.

*rommodules shows that IDEFS is active but IDEFSfiler is dormant.

If I do *idefs, then it provides commands such as *listmounts or
*showdevices (from memory -- these might not be exact names), which
show that the cards are registering, even if not on the iconbar.

Then I can do *share <cardname> and thus make the card appear on
the iconbar as a share. This kludge works, except that SparkFS
doesn't like to handle zipfiles that are stored on the card.

I have tried reflashing the Unipod, but that has made no difference.

Any suggestions gratefully received.


--
Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk

[Alan Adams]

I'm using *real" discs plugged into both IDE slots on the Unipod. I
don't recall doing anything special to make them appear.

Is the adapter set as a master? If it's a slave that might cause it
not to be seen properly.

Alan

In message <3456364...@nails.abbeypress.net>

Alan Adams, from Northamptonshire
al...@adamshome.org.uk
http://www.nckc.org.uk/

[druck]

On 05/05/2013 20:18, Jim Nagel wrote:
> I'm puzzled about why a Compact-Flash-to-IDE adapter isn't working on
> my RiscPC quite as expected.
>
> The CF card and adapter work with no problem on the Iyonix, but when I
> plug the same card and adapter into the IDE slot on the Unipod on the
> RiscPC (4.39), nothing appears on the iconbar. I didn't have to do
> anything to make it appear on the Iyonix (5.18) iconbar.

The Iyonix has a relative recent IDE/ATA controller, the Risc PC's IDE
chip is much older and may have compatibility issues with current devices.

---druck

[Someone Somewhere]

And the Unipod is newer than the Iyonix is it not? Whether the chip is
uses is newer than the one in the Iyonix may still be in question though.

Why is the Risc PC IDE interface relevant?

PS Your signature separator is broken...

[David Holden]

On 5-May-2013, Jim Nagel <jimne...@abbeypress.co.uk> wrote:

> The CF card and adapter work with no problem on the Iyonix, but when
> I plug the same card and adapter into the IDE slot on the Unipod on
> the RiscPC (4.39), nothing appears on the iconbar. I didn't have to
> do anything to make it appear on the Iyonix (5.18) iconbar.
>
> The RiscPC's boot drive is plugged into the motherboard port, and
> it's ADFS. I haven't used the Unipod IDE slots before.
>
> *rommodules shows that IDEFS is active but IDEFSfiler is dormant.

What make and size CF card is it? Some types don't work on the
motherboard and some won't work on 3rd party interfaces like the
Unipod.

--
David Holden - APDL - www.apdl.co.uk

[druck]

On 06/05/2013 10:19, Someone Somewhere wrote:
> Why is the Risc PC IDE interface relevant?

It's not, I didn't pick up the mention of Unipod.

> PS Your signature separator is broken...

It's not a sig separator!

---druck

[Jim Nagel]

By the way, are these CF cards hot-pluggable?
In other words, is it safe to unplug one card and plug in another
while the machine is running, just as you can a USB stick?
Or is it necessary to switch off the machine first?

(So far I have never risked it. ie. not relevant to my question in
main thread.)

[Jim Nagel]

David Holden wrote on 6 May:

> What make and size CF card is it? Some types don't work on the
> motherboard and some won't work on 3rd party interfaces like the
> Unipod.

Two types of card, both 8G, both marked "3.3V/5V":
- Kingston Compact Flash 990426--018.A00LF (if numbers mean owt)
- Kingston 133x Compact Flash Elite Pro--S2--015.A00LF
Both work in the Iyonix and appear on the iconbar automatically.

What puzzles me is why they don't appear on the RiscPC iconbar.

They DO work to some extent on the RiscPC Unipod too. I can read and
write to them via ShareFS (see previous post).
What puzzles me is why they refuse to appear on the RiscPC iconbar
(ie, normally, rather than via ShareFS).


--
Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk
>> "from" address is genuine but will change. website has current one.
See you at Wakefield? www.wakefieldshow.org.uk April 20

[David Holden]

On 6-May-2013, Jim Nagel <jimne...@abbeypress.co.uk> wrote:

> David Holden wrote on 6 May:
> > What make and size CF card is it? Some types don't work on the
> > motherboard and some won't work on 3rd party interfaces like the
> > Unipod.
>
> Two types of card, both 8G, both marked "3.3V/5V":
> - Kingston Compact Flash 990426--018.A00LF (if numbers mean owt)
> - Kingston 133x Compact Flash Elite Pro--S2--015.A00LF
> Both work in the Iyonix and appear on the iconbar automatically.

That's probably your problem. I've found Kinston CF usually won't work
on Acorn machines and frequently not using 3rd party interfaces
either.

[Jim Nagel]

David Holden wrote on 6 May:


> On 6-May-2013, Jim Nagel <jimne...@abbeypress.co.uk> wrote:

>> David Holden wrote on 6 May:
>>> What make and size CF card is it? Some types don't work on the
>>> motherboard and some won't work on 3rd party interfaces like the
>>> Unipod.
>>
>> Two types of card, both 8G, both marked "3.3V/5V":
>> - Kingston Compact Flash 990426--018.A00LF (if numbers mean owt)
>> - Kingston 133x Compact Flash Elite Pro--S2--015.A00LF
>> Both work in the Iyonix and appear on the iconbar automatically.

> That's probably your problem. I've found Kinston CF usually won't work
> on Acorn machines and frequently not using 3rd party interfaces
> either.

Beats me, though, why these cards do "work" on the RiscPC, on Unipod,
but via ShareFS -- yet they don't appear on the iconbar.

[Theo Markettos]

Jim Nagel <jimne...@abbeypress.co.uk> wrote:
> By the way, are these CF cards hot-pluggable?
> In other words, is it safe to unplug one card and plug in another
> while the machine is running, just as you can a USB stick?
> Or is it necessary to switch off the machine first?

The CF-IDE interface is just a passive connector, so the question is, are
your IDE ports hot pluggable? The motherboard ports aren't designed to be,
in that ADFS has no support for adding drives while the machine is up. You
might get away with *RMReinit ADFS but I wouldn't bank on it. I don't know
about Simtec.

The CF-IDE adaptor should take care of connecting the pins in the right
order to not cause damage hotplugging, but things get messier if you have
another drive on the same bus.

On the original question, have you tried *RMreinit IDEFSFiler? Or
*Filer_OpenDir IDEFS::4.$

Theo

[Jim Nagel]

Jim Nagel wrote on 6 May:
> Beats me, though, why these cards do "work" on the RiscPC on Unipod,

> but via ShareFS -- yet they don't appear on the iconbar.

I've now got as far as an IDEFS icon appearing on the iconbar. Then I
have to choose menu "Mount > cardname", and the CF card appears on the
iconbar.

The behaviour is different on the Iyonix, where the card appears
immediately without these extra steps.

Is there some command that I could put into an obeyfile to do the
steps automagically on the RiscPC? (4.39)

Or maybe I need an update of IDEFS or something on the RiscPC. I
reflashed the Unipod in the midst of all this, so presumably I have
the latest version of all its modules. (IDEFS 1.30, dated 2004)

(Titlebars of the card's directory displays start with IDEFS on the
RiscPC but start with ADFS on the Iyonix. The Iyonix doesn't have
IDEFS at all, according to *help IDEFS.)

--
Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk
>> "from" address is genuine but will change. website has current one.

[Theo Markettos]

Jim Nagel <jimne...@abbeypress.co.uk> wrote:
> Jim Nagel wrote on 6 May:
> > Beats me, though, why these cards do "work" on the RiscPC on Unipod,
> > but via ShareFS -- yet they don't appear on the iconbar.
>
> I've now got as far as an IDEFS icon appearing on the iconbar. Then I
> have to choose menu "Mount > cardname", and the CF card appears on the
> iconbar.
>
> The behaviour is different on the Iyonix, where the card appears
> immediately without these extra steps.

Ah, that makes some kind of sense. Presumably the IDEFS (whichever flavour
it is, Simtec, APDL?) is cleverer than ADFS and understands about removable
IDE drives (think IDE Zip discs of old). So you put a disc into the drive
but you have to 'mount' it to access it - a bit like floppies, that don't
open automatically when you insert them.

The CompactFlash may be reporting that it's a removable drive - because it
is (in, say, a camera) - which requires the extra mounting stage on IDEFS.
ADFS (that controls the motherboard port(s) on Risc PC, Iyonix) is ignorant
about removable devices and so assumes that the CF is just a hard drive and
will be mounted on startup.

['Removable' in this case means 'removable media', which is something the
drive understands. Normal hard drives aren't removable - you don't 'eject'
them. Neither is 'removable' in the sense of putting a hard drive in a
caddy, or a CD (which is completely different entirely)]

> Is there some command that I could put into an obeyfile to do the
> steps automagically on the RiscPC? (4.39)

Try
*idefs:mount 4

or alternatively there may be a configuration setting for IDEFS.

Theo