VxWorks vs. Linux
DuckE
features to compete directly with VxWorks.
SteveD
ChaeHo You <ch...@softec.co.kr> wrote in message
news:87t4tl$55u$1...@news2.kornet.net...
> Hello, VxWorks users...
>
> I'm concerned about Linux development. And I'm interested about the price
of
> VxWorks.
> Our company sales the Dy4 systems' products. That company makes the VME
> board for military/commercial version. And the main RTOS of the boards is
> VxWorks.
> That company determined a joining a Linux company,AMIRIX. If RTLinux would
> be ported to Dy4 boards, there will be many interesting changes in RTOS
> market.
> I think the price of the VxWorks is too high. The price of Tornado II per
1
> user
> is about 50000 us dollars, isn't it?
> The problem is the capability of Linux. The developing speed of Linux is
> amazing. Maybe in a near future, RTLinux will compete VxWorks.
>
>
> Best Regards...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
ChaeHo You
Ed & Lisa Brown
DuckE wrote in message <38a22...@news.pacifier.com>...
>A closer competitor would be RTEMS, which is rapidly developing a set of
>features to compete directly with VxWorks.
>
.
thot...@my-deja.com
> Where would one find information on RTEMS or Linux RT?
All regarding RTEMS is present in www.oarcorp.com or www.rtems.com.
RTEMS is a full-free REALTIME OS with support various microprocessors
and BSP. It is available in source code, and it uses GNU tool chain like
VxWorks.
In next days should be available the new versione, I think 4.5, in
that will be present more BPSs, CPU families, RPM for Linux e Windows
(with CygWin), ITRON layer, and even more.....
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Gerhard Juen
Embedded Linux
try this link-list
http://www-et.bocholt.fh-ge.de/~juen/ak_tele/ak_tele4.html
there exists a headline "embedded linux" with some releated links
gerhard
Ed & Lisa Brown schrieb:
> Where would one find information on RTEMS or Linux RT?
>
> DuckE wrote in message <38a22...@news.pacifier.com>...
> >A closer competitor would be RTEMS, which is rapidly developing a set of
> >features to compete directly with VxWorks.
> >
> .
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Prof. Dr. Gerhard Juen
FH Gelsenkirchen, Abt. Bocholt
Münsterstr. 265
D-46397 Bocholt
email: ju...@bocholt.fh-gelsenkirchen.de
web: http://www-et.bocholt.fh-gelsenkirchen.de/~juen
Fon: 02871-2155 830
Fax: 02871-2155 800
Peter Fenzke
Embedded Linux compete mainly with QNX, LynxOS, and WinCE.
The same market - the same features ...
Today you can download/order about 20 different embedded
linux distributions. Which embLinux and which linux support
is the best choise for your customer ?
That is the question ?
regards peter
john hagen
> Where would one find information on RTEMS or Linux RT?
>
> DuckE wrote in message <38a22...@news.pacifier.com>...
> >A closer competitor would be RTEMS, which is rapidly developing a set of
> >features to compete directly with VxWorks.
> >
> .
http://www.rtlinux.org/~rtlinux/
Rosimildo daSilva
Ed & Lisa Brown wrote in message <87vt22$oac$1...@nntp2.atl.mindspring.net>...
>Where would one find information on RTEMS or Linux RT?
>
RT Linux:
http://luz.cs.nmt.edu/~rtlinux/
RTEMS:
http://www.oarcorp.com
Rosimildo.
Mario Semo
http://www.thinkingnerds.com/fsmlabs/index.html
and there is an email newsletter:
http://linuxplc.org/mailman/listinfo/linuxplc
--
regards, Mario Semo. http://www.kirchnersoft.com
lcb
Professional. Good luck on every getting out a product with a free OS unless
you have a group of engineers working 80 to 100 hours a week for months.
John McClenny
says...
> $2995 gets you a seat of VxWorks. $50K buys you 10 seats of Tornado Power
> Professional. Good luck on every getting out a product with a free OS unless
> you have a group of engineers working 80 to 100 hours a week for months.
>
And that would be different from VxWorks how?
hu...@mrao.cam.ac.uk
:> $2995 gets you a seat of VxWorks. $50K buys you 10 seats of Tornado Power
:> Professional. Good luck on every getting out a product with a free OS unless
:> you have a group of engineers working 80 to 100 hours a week for months.
I'm surprised you say this...
My experience is far from that... in certain areas (especially complex
device drivers) so-called 'profession' software is often hastily
thrown together, and often full of bugs. As the source-code is
secret, your only solution is to pester the driver makers in the hope
that they will fix the problem.
Having played with both, I would say that that Linux software is
usually of exceptional quality, having been crafted by people who take time
to get the bugs removed and optimised for speed, rather than being driven
by the hasty need to stamp the glossy brochures with 'driver
available'
Hugh Gibson.
Keith Buchanan
Power
:> Professional. Good luck on every getting out a product with a free OS
unless
:> you have a group of engineers working 80 to 100 hours a week for months.
...and to switch architectures or targets, you only pay the $2995 again.
The
investment in Tornado tools carries forward. The price is a drop in the
bucket
compared to the labor costs of development.
>I'm surprised you say this...
>
>My experience is far from that... in certain areas (especially complex
>device drivers) so-called 'profession' software is often hastily
>thrown together, and often full of bugs. As the source-code is
>secret, your only solution is to pester the driver makers in the hope
>that they will fix the problem.
Speaking for a group that writes complex device drivers... I must conclude
that your observations are skewed by one or more poor experiences. My peers
typically write very throughly tested professional drivers. It has been
my experience that (for VxWorks anyway) this is the rule rather than the
exception. The source code is 'secret' because we often have serious monies
tied up in developing the code. Rarely does a single customer pay the
entire
costs of development.
> Having played with both, I would say that that Linux software is
>usually of exceptional quality, having been crafted by people who take
time
>to get the bugs removed and optimised for speed, rather than being driven
>by the hasty need to stamp the glossy brochures with 'driver
>available'
Having developed complex drivers and applications for both, I say that the
quality depends on the dedication and practices of the person or
organization
that wrote the software. Software is no different than any other
engineering
discipline in this regard and Linux enjoys no advantage over VxWorks. In
fact,
the Linux driver model is more complex.
Linux and VxWorks are great tools but are still intended for very different
applications. Using a free-OS (currently serving my mail!) for any purpose
has unique risks. Choosing VxWorks for deadline driven applications is a
no-risk decision.
Call me for a glossy brochure,
------------------------------------
/\ Thomas Keith Buchanan
/**\ Principal Engineer
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\/ Pride In Performance
Jeff Creem
> Linux and VxWorks are great tools but are still intended for very
different
> applications. Using a free-OS (currently serving my mail!) for any
purpose
> has unique risks. Choosing VxWorks for deadline driven applications is a
> no-risk decision.
>
No risk??? Low risk perhaps... but please... I have had to beg for vxWorks
source
components several times to fix bugs that Wind River was too slow to fix (or
to
admit they even existed)..
On the up side the local sales rep has always been good about giving us one
or
two source files if we were confident we knew where the problem was.
Ephraim Gadsby
wrote:
>The bottom line for me in choosing vxWorks was cost! 150 000 target licenses
>was a few hundred thousand bucks. Doubling RAM and ROM to accomodate the free
Then by Moore's law RTLinux is only 18 months from being feasible on
you type of application.
>o/s would be a few million.
Initially the most sensible applications of RTLinux are probably going
to be in small volume/ high value products, and for applications that
require a sophisticated user interface.
The basic idea of RTLInux, of running a sophisticated, nearly
unmodified, general purpose OS inside a minimalist RTOS, is an
eminently sensible one - the fact that Linux is free is not the key
point.
The philosophy of RTLinux is to do as much as possible in ordinary
Linux software leaving the real-time part as simple as possible -
decoupling the two potentially makes the system more reliable.
Linking ever more complex and untested libraries to a traditional
RTOS is not a sensible approach.
Douglas Fraser
Ephraim Gadsby wrote:
>
> On Sat, 19 Feb 2000 19:16:21 GMT, pwhi...@home.net (Paul Whicker)
> wrote:
>
> >The bottom line for me in choosing vxWorks was cost! 150 000 target licenses
> >was a few hundred thousand bucks. Doubling RAM and ROM to accomodate the free
>
> Then by Moore's law RTLinux is only 18 months from being feasible on
> you type of application.
For most of us in the 'volume' embedded business, 18 months out puts
us out of business. We will be on the third generation of our product
by then. Consumer electronics is a tough place to play....
Even though I 'snipped' the rest of your note, (to save bandwidth ;-)
I do agree with your stated philosophy for RTLinux, however, that is
nowhere near what my needs or my market are, and may have been true
for the original poster as well. What is your view on the maturity
curve for eCos?
Doug
<snip>
Ephraim Gadsby
I don't know much about eCos - I work in telecomms, which is pretty
much the other other end of the spectrum from consumer electronics. I
am sure that that market is very well matched to traditional RTOSs,
but I am worried that making them ever more complex is going to
compromise their reliability.
Reading the questions on the pSOS mailing list it is quite striking
how many of them are from people having problems with IP stacks, SNMP
software etc, rather than with interrupts, deadlocks, and so on. They
would be better off if they could ask their questions in a general
Linux newsgroup.
John McClenny
>
>
> Ephraim Gadsby wrote:
> >
> > On Sat, 19 Feb 2000 19:16:21 GMT, pwhi...@home.net (Paul Whicker)
> > wrote:
> >
> > >The bottom line for me in choosing vxWorks was cost! 150 000 target licenses
> > >was a few hundred thousand bucks. Doubling RAM and ROM to accomodate the free
> >
> > Then by Moore's law RTLinux is only 18 months from being feasible on
> > you type of application.
>
> For most of us in the 'volume' embedded business, 18 months out puts
> us out of business. We will be on the third generation of our product
> by then. Consumer electronics is a tough place to play....
>
If one is building Internet Appliances, the equation changes. The
available VxWorks browsers have big footprints that more than make up for
the smaller kernel size of VxWorks. By the time you get to near PC
functionality with a 'consumer electronics' interface, the OS and
applications end up with a comparable footprint to Linux.
This all depends on what you are building, how soon you are building it,
and how long it will take to debug VxWorks on your platform :(.