DECterm special escape sequences ?
JF Mezei
cause that window to minimise itself into an icon. Is there such a beast ?
There really should be some central "official" document that lists all the
escape sequences supported by DECterm above and beyond what a VT200 dupports.
I tried google, and there are so many sites that list one or two espape
sequence that it is nearly impossible to find out whether what I am looking
for exists or not.
Roger Ivie
> There really should be some central "official" document that lists all the
> escape sequences supported by DECterm above and beyond what a VT200 dupports.
I hear ya. I've fought a few futile battles with DECterm myself. I see
occasional references to a document called "DECterm Programming Release
Notes", part number EK-DTERM-RN-001, but have not encountered a copy of
the document.
I see a couple of folks who say they've been looking through the PuTTY
source code for escape sequences because PuTTY tends to support the DEC
sequences. I don't know if this particular sequence is among them (in my
case, I was interesting in particulars of its ReGIS implementation, so
things like PuTTY and xterm wouldn't help).
Looks like xterm using ^[[2t for to minimize and ^[[1t to unminimize.
I don't know if they'll work for DECterm; I don't have one handy at the
moment. I got the xterm sequence from:
http://rtfm.etla.org/xterm/ctlseq.html
--
roger ivie
ri...@ridgenet.net
Roger Ivie
>
> I hear ya. I've fought a few futile battles with DECterm myself. I see
> occasional references to a document called "DECterm Programming Release
> Notes", part number EK-DTERM-RN-001, but have not encountered a copy of
> the document.
Looks like EK-DTERM-DK is the document to which EK-DTERM-RN-001 are
release notes. It's allegedly titled "DECterm Programming".
--
roger ivie
ri...@ridgenet.net
JF Mezei
> Looks like xterm using ^[[2t for to minimize and ^[[1t to unminimize.
> I don't know if they'll work for DECterm; I don't have one handy at the
the <csi>xt resizes the DECterm windows to contain "x" lines.
So the 2t one makes the window 2 lines long. The 1th makes it 1 line long.
Michael Unger
> [...]
>
> I tried google, and there are so many sites that list one or two espape
> sequence that it is nearly impossible to find out whether what I am looking
> for exists or not.
There are quite a lot of escape sequences documented in
<http://bjh21.me.uk/all-escapes/all-escapes.txt> ...
Michael
--
Real names enhance the probability of getting real answers.
My e-mail account at DECUS Munich is no longer valid.
Robert Deininger
2006Q4.usenet...@spamgourmet.org wrote:
>On 2006-12-28 06:20, "JF Mezei" wrote:
>
>> [...]
>>
>> I tried google, and there are so many sites that list one or two espape
>> sequence that it is nearly impossible to find out whether what I am looking
>> for exists or not.
>
>There are quite a lot of escape sequences documented in
><http://bjh21.me.uk/all-escapes/all-escapes.txt> ...
VMS users can look in SMGTERMS.TXT (in SYS$SYSTEM IIRC). But I don't
think the DECterm special stuff is in there.
chris...@postmaster.co.uk
JF Mezei wrote:
> I am looking fro an escape sequence, which, when sent to a DECterm, would
> cause that window to minimise itself into an icon. Is there such a beast ?
>
> There really should be some central "official" document that lists all the
> escape sequences supported by DECterm above and beyond what a VT200 dupports.
I have a copy of the elusive EK-DTERM-DK, which is divided into
EK-DTERM-GM-001 (graphics) and EK-DTERM-PM-001 (text). But
disappointingly they differ little from the VT340 manuals and do not
even give the text colour, title, and icon name sequences I gave in a
post a few weeks ago. I can't find a minimize-me sequence in the
manuals. I scoured the DECterm code in the microfiche many years ago
but AFAIR the above were the only undocumented commands I found.
Chris
Bob Harris
JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
I've found this dtterm man page from Tru64 UNIX to be most useful
in providing VT terminal escape sequences:
<http://h30097.www3.hp.com/docs/base_doc/DOCUMENTATION/V51B_HTML/MA
N/MAN5/0201____.HTM>
Is this the escape sequence you were looking for?
Esc [ p1 ; p2 ; p3 t
Window manipulation. Valid values for p1 (and any additional
parameters) are:
1 Restore (de-iconify) window.
2 Minimize (iconify) window.
3 ; x ; y
Move window to [x, y].
4 ; height ; width
Resize the dtterm(1) window to height and width in pixels.
5 Raise the dtterm(1) window to the front of the stacking
order.
6 Lower the dtterm(1) window to the bottom of the stacking
order.
7 Refresh the dtterm(1) window.
8 ; height ; width
Resize the text area to height and width in characters.
11 Report dtterm(1) window state. If the dtterm(1) window is
open (non-
iconified), it returns ``Esc [ 1 t''. If the dtterm(1)
window is
iconified, it returns ``Esc [ 2 t''.
13 Report the dtterm(1) window position. The terminal emulator
returns
``Esc[ 3 ; x ;y t''.
14 Report the dtterm(1) window in pixels. The terminal emulator
returns
``Esc[ 4 ; height ;width t''.
18 Report the size of the area in characters. The terminal
emulator
returns ``Esc[ 8 ; height ;width t''.
20 Report the dtterm(1) window's icon label. The terminal
emulator returns
``Esc ] L label Esc Backslash''.
21 Report the dtterm(1) window's title. The terminal emulator
returns
``Esc] l title Esc Backslash''.
Bob Harris
JF Mezei
> <http://h30097.www3.hp.com/docs/base_doc/DOCUMENTATION/V51B_HTML/MAN/MAN5/0201____.HTM>
>
> Is this the escape sequence you were looking for?
>
> Esc [ p1 ; p2 ; p3 t
> 2 Minimize (iconify) window.
Many thanks. Unfortunatly, this escape sequence does not work in my
parralel universe. Esc [ 2 t makes the window 2 lines long. Esc [ 1 t
makes it 1 line long. Esc [ 51 t makes it 51 lines long.
Esc[3;100;100t makes it 3 lines long. (instead of moving window to pixels
100, 100).
I guess there is nobody left in VMS engineering who knows even where the
code for DECTERM is stored (maybe it is on some disk in India already ?)
Considering that Digital is *THE* standard for VT100, I would have though
that they would have made public ALL the escape sequences to ensure that
the VT100 protocol lives on.
But when you consider that even within Digital the secrets resulted in
OSF/DEC-UNIX/Tru64 using different escape sequences than for VMS, it says a
lot about the company.
Thomas Dickey
> In article <6cd74$4593545a$cef8887a$12...@TEKSAVVY.COM>,
> JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>> I am looking fro an escape sequence, which, when sent to a DECterm, would
>> cause that window to minimise itself into an icon. Is there such a beast ?
>>
>> There really should be some central "official" document that lists all the
>> escape sequences supported by DECterm above and beyond what a VT200 dupports.
>>
>> I tried google, and there are so many sites that list one or two espape
>> sequence that it is nearly impossible to find out whether what I am looking
>> for exists or not.
> I've found this dtterm man page from Tru64 UNIX to be most useful
dtterm is unrelated to DECterm (aka dxterm).
--
Thomas E. Dickey
http://invisible-island.net
ftp://invisible-island.net
Thomas Dickey
> On 2006-12-28 06:20, "JF Mezei" wrote:
>> [...]
>>
>> I tried google, and there are so many sites that list one or two espape
>> sequence that it is nearly impossible to find out whether what I am looking
>> for exists or not.
> There are quite a lot of escape sequences documented in
> <http://bjh21.me.uk/all-escapes/all-escapes.txt> ...
...unfortunately, they're just heaped together in one place, without
a cross-reference (which would show that they're from several types
of terminals).
For a clue regarding the depth of this file, note the first line
# $Id: all-escapes.txt,v 1.32 2005/09/14 12:00:06 ben Exp $
and the 1999's pervading the text. It's basically a cut/paste job
from 1999 with a handful of changes past that point. Compare with
ftp://invisible-island.net/ncurses/terminfo.src.gz
or any of the references cited.
Robert Deininger
<jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>Bob Harris wrote:
>>
<http://h30097.www3.hp.com/docs/base_doc/DOCUMENTATION/V51B_HTML/MAN/MAN5/0201____.HTM>
>>
>> Is this the escape sequence you were looking for?
>>
>> Esc [ p1 ; p2 ; p3 t
>> 1 Restore (de-iconify) window.
>> 2 Minimize (iconify) window.
>
>
>Many thanks. Unfortunatly, this escape sequence does not work in my
>parralel universe. Esc [ 2 t makes the window 2 lines long. Esc [ 1 t
>makes it 1 line long. Esc [ 51 t makes it 51 lines long.
>
>Esc[3;100;100t makes it 3 lines long. (instead of moving window to pixels
>100, 100).
>
>I guess there is nobody left in VMS engineering who knows even where the
>code for DECTERM is stored (maybe it is on some disk in India already ?)
1. Please stop whining. You've already done enough whining to last
several lifetimes.
You haven't received, free of charge, immediate answers to your
questions. So naturally it becomes an opportunity to bash the very group
of people most likely to be able to help you. Clever, very clever.
2. The folks working on DECwindows are part of VMS Engineering. Most of
them happen to be in India. They know exactly where the code is.
Do you expect them to drop their real work to provide an immediate answer
about an undocumented non-feature to a bigoted, ill-mannered, non-paying,
non-customer? Perhaps you really do live in an alternate universe.
3. The DECwindows code and build environment are mostly separate from VMS
proper. That's always been the case. That means most of those you
consider "real" VMS engineers couldn't easily seek answers to your
questions. If they felt like helping you. Perhpas some of them do.
>Considering that Digital is *THE* standard for VT100, I would have though
>that they would have made public ALL the escape sequences to ensure that
>the VT100 protocol lives on.
VT100 and the associated ANSI standard are very well documented and easy
to find in public locations.
What you seek isn't VT100 stuff. DECterm is based on the VT300 series,
IIRC. But DECterm has its own extensions, which may not be part of any
general standard.
I don't even know if DECterm has escape sequences for this stuff.
>But when you consider that even within Digital the secrets resulted in
>OSF/DEC-UNIX/Tru64 using different escape sequences than for VMS, it says a
>lot about the company.
Blah, blah, blah.
JF Mezei
> 1. Please stop whining. You've already done enough whining to last
> several lifetimes.
I asked a question about a escape sequence. I was given a few things to
try, none of which worked on a DECTERM. I commented on why these would not
be properly documented fo DECTERM but are documented for other systems,
including Tru64 but are incompatible with DECTERM.
> 2. The folks working on DECwindows are part of VMS Engineering. Most of
> them happen to be in India. They know exactly where the code is.
Is this admission that DECTERM is officially in maintenance mode without
any hope of seeing improvements to it ?
Or let me ask this even more pointed question:
Is there any VMS *DEVELOPMENT* work being done in India ? Or is it just
maintenance ?
> Do you expect them to drop their real work to provide an immediate answer
> about an undocumented non-feature to a bigoted, ill-mannered, non-paying,
> non-customer? Perhaps you really do live in an alternate universe.
If you use Google over the years, you will find that there have been MANY
people asking for escape sequences, and that there doesn't seem to be a
documente containing all of them that was made available.
You can whine about me all you want. And you can decide to withhold answers
because *I* asked the question. But in doing so, you are also widtholding
answers that would benefit others. I am not asking for responses to be
sent to be privately so they benefit only myself.
> VT100 and the associated ANSI standard are very well documented and easy
> to find in public locations.
>
> What you seek isn't VT100 stuff. DECterm is based on the VT300 series,
> IIRC. But DECterm has its own extensions, which may not be part of any
> general standard.
Exactly my point. Digital should have made those extensions more formal
and published them so that anyone using the so called "VT100" standard
would not conflict with DEC's own extensions, which render the VT100 less
"standard". The fact that even within Digital, there were conflicts with
the <ESC>[xx t is such an indication.
You know very well that the VT100 "standard" is really much more than VT100
and includes far more modern features such as advanced video, and even
colours.
Michael Moroney
>> VT100 and the associated ANSI standard are very well documented and easy
>> to find in public locations.
>>
>> What you seek isn't VT100 stuff. DECterm is based on the VT300 series,
>> IIRC. But DECterm has its own extensions, which may not be part of any
>> general standard.
>Exactly my point. Digital should have made those extensions more formal
>and published them so that anyone using the so called "VT100" standard
>would not conflict with DEC's own extensions, which render the VT100 less
>"standard". The fact that even within Digital, there were conflicts with
>the <ESC>[xx t is such an indication.
>You know very well that the VT100 "standard" is really much more than VT100
>and includes far more modern features such as advanced video, and even
>colours.
What you call the 'VT100 "standard"' already _is_ a published, non Digital
standard. It's ANSI standard X3.64.
Richard B. Gilbert
The ANSI X3.64 standard is a subset of VT100. DEC added a lot of "DEC
private" escape sequences.
Larry Kilgallen
> Michael Moroney wrote:
>> What you call the 'VT100 "standard"' already _is_ a published, non Digital
>> standard. It's ANSI standard X3.64.
>
> The ANSI X3.64 standard is a subset of VT100. DEC added a lot of "DEC
> private" escape sequences.
It seems to me the VT100 would have preceeded ANSI X-whatever.
Likely DEC had to add a lot of "DEC private" because ANSI was not
willing to accept the whole thing (in the tradition of standards
committees not wanting to give one vendor too much of a head start).
Richard B. Gilbert
ANSI X3.64-1979 was first released in 1979 which, I believe, was a year
or two before the VT100 came along.
Thomas Dickey
> ANSI X3.64-1979 was first released in 1979 which, I believe, was a year
> or two before the VT100 came along.
after: 1976
(google can show you several references)
(google can also show you that x3.64 was withdrawn some time ago).
Richard B. Gilbert
> Richard B. Gilbert <rgilb...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>>ANSI X3.64-1979 was first released in 1979 which, I believe, was a year
>>or two before the VT100 came along.
>
>
> after: 1976
> (google can show you several references)
>
> (google can also show you that x3.64 was withdrawn some time ago).
>
Withdrawn? What does that mean? Was it replaced with something?
Has the VT100/200/300/400/500 series of terminals been relegated to
terminal hell along with the ADM-3, ADM-11, and zillions of other
terminals, each with it's own, incompatible with anything else, standard?
Paul Sture
http://www.vt100.net/vt_history
"VT100
Digital零 first ANSI-compliant terminal, introduced in August 1978."
which tallies extremely well with my memories of a PDP upgrade and
moving that system out of what could best be described as a broom
cupboard into a proper computer room, our first VT100 included.
--
Paul Sture
dav...@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk
>or two before the VT100 came along.
According to
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VT100
the VT100 was first released in August 1978.
According to
http://www.cs.utk.edu/~shuford/terminal/dec.html
it was based on ANSI X3.64 which was published in 1977 and although the most
popular terminal based on that standard was not the first.
David Webb
Security team leader
CCSS
Middlesex University
Bob Koehler
>
> "VT100
> Digital零 first ANSI-compliant terminal, introduced in August 1978."
>
> which tallies extremely well with my memories of a PDP upgrade and
> moving that system out of what could best be described as a broom
> cupboard into a proper computer room, our first VT100 included.
When we got our first VAX, in 1980, we were able to buy VT100 clones
already.
Paul Sture
koe...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote:
I remember using an extremely nice Tandberg model in 1980. If you didn't
get to the terminal room before everyone else in a morning you'd lost
you change of getting at it.
--
Paul Sture