Wheelmouse & Win3.1x report
Artur Yelchishchev
I'd like to share my fresh experience in spinning the wheels under our
beloved environment! :-)
Recently, I've checked several different brands & models, and finally
decided to switch from Logitech (my preferred mousemaker during last
five years) to A4Tech products. Current models from that manufacturer
have full range of drivers for any flavours of Windows - from 3.1x to
2000, and scrolling wheel actually works in all of them
(yabba-dabba-doo!!! :-).
My new rodent - A4Tech Wheel3DMouse model SWW-25 (chip WWW-1007D),
PS/2-COM device (adaptor included), and I've tried it on several
machines. At work, I've installed it as PS/2 device, and it works like
a charm - or more precisely, I didn't noted single problem or
incompatibility with anyhting I've running on office's PC, including
"mouse-oriented" utils like QuickClick etc). Believe me - if you'll
ever try to use Forte Agent with wheelmouse, you'll never go back to
the 'classic' one!
On my home i386 (where I've installed it as COM device) it works not
so perfectly, though - sometimes it generates unattended button clicks
(I mean application software buttons), and pointing arrow periodically
jumps to the random places. I think, it's timing-related problems,
produced by insufficient CPU power; as far as I've figured out, this
mouse driver operates mostly via "keyboard emulation" - at least, it
loads its own AWVKD.386 device driver, but keeps Windows's internal
*VMD driver (Logitech, Microsoft and Genius are all using their own
virtual mouse drivers, BTW), so it seems to me as 'overload' for weak
machine IMHO. In addition, it conflicts with one particular
application - semi-serious "Mouse Odometer" utility by Dean Thomas
(according to which, my Logitech Pilot just crossed 36th. kilometer -
it's time to change oil, I think!<g>).
About compatibility with other brands: unfortunately, neither
Microsoft nor Logitech mices can't be used fith A4 software - system
just stops responding to any input. I've tried next models:
Microsoft IntelliMouse Serial or PS/2 Compatible
part # 68874, FCC ID C3KKZB1
chip PIC16C622-06/041
Logitech WheelMouse model M-S48a
part # 851208-0000 FCC ID JNZ201213
chip LSC507804P
So, previously mentioned here success in using A4 driver in
conjunction with Microsoft mouse seems to be lucky exception.
I've also tried cordless IRW-25 (infrared) dual-wheel model, too - but
only on one particular machine (not mine); unfortunately, wheels were
unavailable (the driver was installed flawlessly, and mouse worked
fine, except for totally ignored wheels). I haven't enough time to
investigate htis or replace driver, and I can't say if it was hardware
or software problem - under Win2000 it worked w/o problems, and was
sold out).
Happy scrolling!
Artur
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
> Gentlemen,
> I'd like to share my fresh experience in spinning the wheels under
> our beloved environment! :-)
Aaaaaarrrghh... ;-)) Please do me a favor, Artur, and choose *one*
of your favorite crosspost newsgroups concerning this subject for a
*FollowUp-To*. This means that all replies on your crossposting will
automatically be directed to that one and most appropriate newsgroup
(for an example, take a look at the header of my reply). Otherwise all
answers will be duplicated in every group you chose for crossposting.
I'm sure your FortO Free Agent has an option for this somewhere...
;-)
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
--
F'up2 comsw
Artur Yelchishchev
(Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen) wrote:
>Aaaaaarrrghh... ;-)) Please do me a favor, Artur, and choose *one*
>of your favorite crosspost newsgroups concerning this subject for a
>*FollowUp-To*.
Reasonable idea! ;-)
>I'm sure your FortO Free Agent has an option for this somewhere...
Of course, but problem is, that I'm not always remember to do it...
And in addition, most good newsreaders can simply ignore duplicated
articles, like Forte Agent does! :-P
Artur
ZCM Services
I've basically concluded that I'm never gonna get my MS Intellimouse to
work with wheels - it works fine elsewise tho, and is a lot better on
the wrist - so I'm happy !
Calvin.
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
>> Aaaaaarrrghh... ;-)) Please do me a favor, Artur, and choose *one*
>> of your favorite crosspost newsgroups concerning this subject for a
>> *FollowUp-To*.
> Reasonable idea! ;-)
Thank you.
>> I'm sure your Forte Free Agent has an option for this somewhere...
> Of course, but problem is, that I'm not always remember to do it...
I've heard of that problem, too. ;-)
> And in addition, most good newsreaders can simply ignore duplicated
> articles, like Forte Agent does! :-P
So you want to tell me I'm using a bad newsreader? >;) Mine can ignore
duplicated articles, but only down to a minimum of 3. This means if
you would kindly crosspost to 4 or more newsgroups next time, it will
getcha... ;-)
Furthermore one of those RFC's you like to mention is saying that
crosspostings are fine (for starting a new thread for example) as
long as you choose an appropriate newsgroup for the answers with the
FollowUp-To headerline. "And now for something completely different",
please... ;-)
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
--
Artur Yelchishchev
wrote:
>> And in addition, most good newsreaders can simply ignore duplicated
>> articles, like Forte Agent does! :-P
>
>So you want to tell me I'm using a bad newsreader? >;)
No, just to inform you about other software's features! :-)
>Mine can ignore
>duplicated articles, but only down to a minimum of 3. This means if
>you would kindly crosspost to 4 or more newsgroups next time, it will
>getcha... ;-)
In Agent, all identical articles can be omitted after DLing in the
first subscribed NG, regardless from how many other groups also
'offer' it. You can tune up this mechanism to detect X-post either by
message ID or by 'author-subj-date' criteria. Unfortunately, there are
no protection against so-called "multi-posting", but it's less common
problem than Xpost.
>Furthermore one of those RFC's you like to mention is saying that
>crosspostings are fine (for starting a new thread for example) as
>long as you choose an appropriate newsgroup for the answers with the
>FollowUp-To headerline.
When answering someone's X-posted message, current edition of Agent
does ask you if you want to post your reply in all of NGs or not - but
when you're composed such a message yourself, it doesn't ask whether
you'd like to set "F'up To:" field... How sad! :-)
Best wishes,
Artur
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
>>> And in addition, most good newsreaders can simply ignore duplicated
>>> articles, like Forte Agent does! :-P
>> So you want to tell me I'm using a bad newsreader? >;)
> No, just to inform you about other software's features! :-)
OK, what feature is it that lets you answer to yourself rather than
to the person you meant? The "Avoiding replies" option? ;-)))
>> Mine can ignore
>> duplicated articles, but only down to a minimum of 3. This means if
>> you would kindly crosspost to 4 or more newsgroups next time, it
>> will getcha... ;-)
> In Agent, all identical articles can be omitted after DLing in the
> first subscribed NG, regardless from how many other groups also
> 'offer' it. You can tune up this mechanism to detect X-post either by
> message ID or by 'author-subj-date' criteria. Unfortunately, there
> are no protection against so-called "multi-posting", but it's less
> common problem than Xpost.
Yes, the DOS mail/newsclient UKA_PPP I'm using for CrossPoint can do
this, too, but so far I was too lazy to change its standard settings
that omit crosspostings with more than 5 recipients, as far as I know.
Perhaps I should take a closer look to its config files now.
>> Furthermore one of those RFC's you like to mention is saying that
>> crosspostings are fine (for starting a new thread for example) as
>> long as you choose an appropriate newsgroup for the answers with the
>> FollowUp-To headerline.
> When answering someone's X-posted message, current edition of Agent
> does ask you if you want to post your reply in all of NGs or not -
> but when you're composed such a message yourself, it doesn't ask
> whether you'd like to set "F'up To:" field... How sad! :-)
Yeah, really sad... ;-)
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
--
Artur Yelchishchev
(Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen) wrote:
>>> So you want to tell me I'm using a bad newsreader? >;)
>> No, just to inform you about other software's features! :-)
>
>OK, what feature is it that lets you answer to yourself rather than
>to the person you meant? The "Avoiding replies" option? ;-)))
No, of course not. This problem have no relation to the particular
software at all - it's my terrible ISP, whose newsserver constantly
misses articles... :-(
So, I use DejaNews as a "backup" system for periodical browsing of
articles related to me - when I see something "new" (i.e., someone's
reply to my message) which isn't carried by this damned NNTP host, I
react by one of two methods:
1) - send reply directly from my DejaNews account (as I did recently
with Mr. Blocksom's article), or
2)- copy this article into Notepad, compose my answer and send it
from Agent in respective tread as usually, with only differense that
"References" field gets confused a little bit (as in your case).
I prefer this second method, as it doesn't require me to log on into
my DejeNews page and is faster and more convenient.
Any more questions? :-)
Artur
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
>> OK, what feature is it that lets you answer to yourself rather than
>> to the person you meant? The "Avoiding replies" option? ;-)))
> No, of course not. This problem have no relation to the particular
> software at all - it's my terrible ISP, whose newsserver constantly
> misses articles... :-(
Yes, I had this problem, too, when I had to rely on the newsserver
that my BBS uses. But with UKA_PPP I am independent from this now
and can choose the newsserver I like the most. It should be a free
one, of course, so that I'm not stuck to the server my ISP is
offering. The newsserver of the Freie Universität Berlin is open to
everyone who wants an account, at least for german users. But probably
they offer this service to foreigners, too. Take a look at their website:
You'll have to write an email to them, wait for your password and
user number and stick to their rules (only real names, no spam, no
binaries, no HTML postings), but this is all they want - no money
included... ;-)
The important thing is that this newsserver is probably one of the
best maintained servers in usenet (at least in Europe), and they are
proud of that and try to keep this standard.
> So, I use DejaNews as a "backup" system for periodical browsing of
> articles related to me - when I see something "new" (i.e., someone's
> reply to my message) which isn't carried by this damned NNTP host, I
> react by one of two methods:
> 1) - send reply directly from my DejaNews account (as I did recently
> with Mr. Blocksom's article), or
If it's only a shorter reply, this would not take too much time, that's
right.
> 2)- copy this article into Notepad, compose my answer and send it
> from Agent in respective tread as usually, with only differense that
> "References" field gets confused a little bit (as in your case).
So you had to answer to your last posting, because my article wasn't
there, now I understand. When you saved my article in Dejanews, did
you choose the ASCII text format? That's the only method to see all
headerlines in Deja, as far as I now, and only then you could take
my message-id and put it into your "References" field.
> I prefer this second method, as it doesn't require me to log on into
> my DejeNews page and is faster and more convenient.
But it destroys the correct threading of your article, that's why I
only saw it by chance.
> Any more questions? :-)
Well, I think you should give news.cis.dfn.de a try... ;-)
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
Artur Yelchishchev
(Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen) wrote:
[lost articles]
>Yes, I had this problem, too, when I had to rely on the newsserver
>that my BBS uses. But with UKA_PPP I am independent from this now
>and can choose the newsserver I like the most. It should be a free
>one, of course, so that I'm not stuck to the server my ISP is
>offering.
Currently I use at home local university's host, but it is incredibly
slow and doesn't carry out many of NGs I'm interested in, so at work I
had to use ISP's one...
>The newsserver of the Freie Universität Berlin is open to
>everyone who wants an account, at least for german users. But probably
>they offer this service to foreigners, too. Take a look at their website:
>
>http://news.cis.dfn.de
Seems promising. Danke schoene! :-)
>You'll have to write an email to them, wait for your password and
>user number and stick to their rules (only real names, no spam, no
>binaries, no HTML postings), but this is all they want - no money
>included... ;-)
Let's see - I've sent registration request.
>The important thing is that this newsserver is probably one of the
>best maintained servers in usenet (at least in Europe), and they are
>proud of that and try to keep this standard.
The letters "CIS" within its name confused me initially, BTW! :-)
>So you had to answer to your last posting, because my article wasn't
>there, now I understand.
Exactly.
>When you saved my article in Dejanews, did
>you choose the ASCII text format?
No - just copied the text via clipboard.
>That's the only method to see all
>headerlines in Deja, as far as I now, and only then you could take
>my message-id and put it into your "References" field.
Thanks for the tip; it's indeed good idea. I'll try this at first
occasion.
>But it destroys the correct threading of your article, that's why I
>only saw it by chance.
Sorry. BTW, Agent (including freeware version) have very useful
feature: you can mark any thread you're interested in, and all future
articles posted into this tread will be automatically downloaded next
time you'll get new headers - really good thing.
>Well, I think you should give news.cis.dfn.de a try... ;-)
I will!
Sincerely yours,
Artur
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
> Currently I use at home local university's host, but it is incredibly
> slow and doesn't carry out many of NGs I'm interested in, so at work
> I had to use ISP's one...
Perhaps the newsmaster of your university would add the newsgroups
you miss on his server, if you write an email to him. That's what
you would have to do if you're missing any newsgroups on "news.cis.
dfn.de". After a week or so they will be there.
>> The newsserver of the Freie Universität Berlin is open to
>> everyone who wants an account, at least for german users. But
>> probably they offer this service to foreigners, too. Take a look at
>> their website:
>> http://news.cis.dfn.de
> Seems promising. Danke schoene! :-)
One crucial fact concerning the speed of downloading articles is the
connection quality of your ISP to the DFN (Deutsches Forschungs-Netz),
the backbone of all german universities. So I can't promise that you
will encounter a better performance in terms of speed than you have
now, because the distance is an important factor here. By the way,
where is ".ee"?
>> You'll have to write an email to them, wait for your password and
>> user number and stick to their rules (only real names, no spam, no
>> binaries, no HTML postings), but this is all they want - no money
>> included... ;-)
> Let's see - I've sent registration request.
The answer will take a few days, normally, because they have lots of
requests, and I'm not sure if and how they check your "existence" in
real life.
>> The important thing is that this newsserver is probably one of the
>> best maintained servers in usenet (at least in Europe), and they are
>> proud of that and try to keep this standard.
> The letters "CIS" within its name confused me initially, BTW! :-)
They have nothing to do with Compuserve, but I can't recall the
meaning of this abbreviation right now.
Compuserve is just one of my ISPs that I use, by the way, because
they offer an interesting by-call account during the daytime that is
cheaper than in the evening. So there is no connection between the
FU Berlin and Compuserve, as you might have thought.
>> When you saved my article in Dejanews, did
>> you choose the ASCII text format?
> No - just copied the text via clipboard.
It is an option somewhere on the page, called "read article in
usenet format" or something like that.
> Sorry. BTW, Agent (including freeware version) have very useful
> feature: you can mark any thread you're interested in, and all future
> articles posted into this tread will be automatically downloaded next
> time you'll get new headers - really good thing.
If they exist on the newsserver... ;-) But you're right, this is a
useful feature, if you did not choose to download all articles in a
newsgroup.
By the way, have you ever heard of Hamster? This is a freeware
program that establishes a local newsserver on your computer and is
able to download articles from several real newsservers at the same
time. So you can multiply the general download speed, pull the same
newsgroups from different servers (no more holes in the threads) or
gather all newsgroups you want but don't exist on one server in a
single session. Of course, this only works in Win9x... ;-)
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
--
Artur Yelchishchev
(Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen) wrote:
>Perhaps the newsmaster of your university would add the newsgroups
>you miss on his server, if you write an email to him.
I'm not sure if he'll be happy to know his system is used not only by
students... ;-)
> That's what
>you would have to do if you're missing any newsgroups on "news.cis.
>dfn.de". After a week or so they will be there.
Even non-English/non-German ones?
>One crucial fact concerning the speed of downloading articles is the
>connection quality of your ISP to the DFN (Deutsches Forschungs-Netz),
>the backbone of all german universities. So I can't promise that you
>will encounter a better performance in terms of speed than you have
>now, because the distance is an important factor here.
Let's see.
> By the way, where is ".ee"?
Estonia - small Baltic/Eastern European country, formerly a part of
Soviet Union. Geographically we're relatively close to the
Deutscheland, so I hope connection channels are good enough.
>The answer will take a few days, normally, because they have lots of
>requests,
It's already arrived BTW.
> and I'm not sure if and how they check your "existence" in
>real life.
By comparing names in the body of letter and in header, perhaps?
>> The letters "CIS" within its name confused me initially, BTW! :-)
>
>They have nothing to do with Compuserve, but I can't recall the
>meaning of this abbreviation right now.
Center for Information Services
>By the way, have you ever heard of Hamster?
No. Most similar word I've heard is "Napster"! :-)
>This is a freeware
>program that establishes a local newsserver on your computer and is
>able to download articles from several real newsservers at the same
>time.
Direct connection to the net is required, I think?
>So you can multiply the general download speed,
Good for *.jpg collectors! <g>
>pull the same
>newsgroups from different servers (no more holes in the threads)
Nice feature.
>or
>gather all newsgroups you want but don't exist on one server in a
>single session.
Really desirable. My beloved Agent does have only one disadvantage -
multiple newsservers aren't supported (even Netscape's newsreader have
this feature BTW!). This may be compensated by using several copies of
the program (they can have different settings for each host), but of
course it isn't very convenient...
>Of course, this only works in Win9x... ;-)
Well, I've suspected that... :-(
Thanks,
Artur
Jay T. Blocksom
hjbard...@COMPUSERVE.de (Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen) wrote:
>
[snip]
>
> Yes, the DOS mail/newsclient UKA_PPP I'm using for CrossPoint can do
> this, too, but so far I was too lazy to change its standard settings
> that omit crosspostings with more than 5 recipients, as far as I know.
> Perhaps I should take a closer look to its config files now.
>
I think you and Artur are talking about two different things.
If I understand you correctly, you are referring to filtering out _all_
copies of any article which is crossposted to more than 'N' newsgroups (with
the default value for N=5) -- apparently as a means of spam reduction.
He is referring to a feature in Agent known as "Crosspost Management". In
essence, this maintains a database of X-posted Message-IDs, so that it can
automatically discard any/all _duplicate_ copies of any article you've
already "seen" in another newsgroup rather than download/store them two or
three (or four or six dozen) times. But the _first_ copy is still
maintained (subject to the same conditions as a non-crossposted article, of
course) in the first newsgroup in which it was encountered.
-- Jay T. Blocksom
----------------------------
Appropriate Technology, Inc.
approtek[at]rcn.com
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Jay T. Blocksom
Artur Yelchishchev <ris...@hot.ee> wrote:
>
[snip]
>
> In Agent, all identical articles can be omitted after DLing in the
> first subscribed NG, regardless from how many other groups also
> 'offer' it. You can tune up this mechanism to detect X-post either by
> message ID or by 'author-subj-date' criteria. Unfortunately, there are
> no protection against so-called "multi-posting", but it's less common
> problem than Xpost.
>
Actually, if you set CPM to use the Subject/Author/Date/Lines criteria
instead of Message-ID, it will catch at least most "multi-posts".
> When answering someone's X-posted message, current edition of Agent
> does ask you if you want to post your reply in all of NGs or not - but
> when you're composed such a message yourself, it doesn't ask whether
> you'd like to set "F'up To:" field...
[snip]
True. But the "All Fields >>" buttonm is rught there, and it's simple
enough to C&P from the "Newsgroups:" field to the "Followup-To" field.
Remember, Agent usually assumes that the user has some clue as to what they
are doing; so if it were to constantly "nag" about this, it would get old
in a hurry. ;-)
Artur Yelchishchev
<approtek+...@rcn.com> wrote:
>Actually, if you set CPM to use the Subject/Author/Date/Lines criteria
>instead of Message-ID, it will catch at least most "multi-posts".
Maybe - I've played with both variants once, and decided to stay with
Mesage ID - can't recall why...
> > When answering someone's X-posted message, current edition of Agent
> > does ask you if you want to post your reply in all of NGs or not - but
> > when you're composed such a message yourself, it doesn't ask whether
> > you'd like to set "F'up To:" field...
> [snip]
>
>True. But the "All Fields >>" buttonm is rught there, and it's simple
>enough to C&P from the "Newsgroups:" field to the "Followup-To" field.
Editing of the "Subject:" field to reflect real theme of conversation
is even more simple (no extra buttons required, and it's right before
your eyes! ;-), but the problem is that we often forget to do it
without reminder.
>Remember, Agent usually assumes that the user has some clue as to what they
>are doing; so if it were to constantly "nag" about this, it would get old
>in a hurry. ;-)
And remember, most (all?) of those "nags" can be disabled if we don't
need them! ;-)
WBR,
Artur
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
>> Perhaps the newsmaster of your university would add the newsgroups
>> you miss on his server, if you write an email to him.
> I'm not sure if he'll be happy to know his system is used not only by
> students... ;-)
But perhaps the universities in Estonia are like the ones in Berlin... ;-)
>> That's what
>> you would have to do if you're missing any newsgroups on "news.cis.
>> dfn.de". After a week or so they will be there.
> Even non-English/non-German ones?
Yes, definitely, this is even a speciality of news.cis.dfn.de
because of its academical background. There are tons of Finnish,
Russian, Polish and other foreign language newsgroups available on
the server, and every day they add some more. Did you already get
the FAQ they hand out? I have one in German, it's about 40 KB long.
>> By the way, where is ".ee"?
> Estonia - small Baltic/Eastern European country, formerly a part of
I thought so, but wasn't sure...
> Soviet Union. Geographically we're relatively close to the
> Deutscheland, so I hope connection channels are good enough.
I think the central backbone server of the DFN is located in
Frankfurt/Main, and the speed within this net is very fast, because
it's based on glass fibre, as far as I remember.
>> The answer will take a few days, normally, because they have lots of
>> requests,
> It's already arrived BTW.
So you are already an official user of this newsserver? Good...
>> and I'm not sure if and how they check your "existence" in
>> real life.
> By comparing names in the body of letter and in header, perhaps?
Maybe, or by calling the KGB in Moscow... ;-)
>>> The letters "CIS" within its name confused me initially, BTW! :-)
>> They have nothing to do with Compuserve, but I can't recall the
>> meaning of this abbreviation right now.
> Center for Information Services
And how true this is...
>> By the way, have you ever heard of Hamster?
> No. Most similar word I've heard is "Napster"! :-)
It's the same word in English and means this little pet that hoards
everything he can in his cheeks.
>> This is a freeware
>> program that establishes a local newsserver on your computer and is
>> able to download articles from several real newsservers at the same
>> time.
> Direct connection to the net is required, I think?
What do you mean by that? If you're asking about the chance to use
Hamster within a LAN, I think it is possible. But I don't use it myself,
because I don't have a 32-bit Windows system. There a lots of hamster.*
newsgroups on news.cis.dfn.de, by the way... ;-)
Hamster uses the Windows DUN (and its WINSOCK.DLL) to open several
connections to either one newsserver (this is called "multithreading")
or different servers. So during the process of gathering articles
Hamster has to stay online, of course, but afterwards it stores all
news on the HDD, and you can use any newsreader to "call" Hamster as
the local newsserver and insert the articles like you would have
called a real newsserver with Forte Agent, for example. This way you
can even use an online newsreader like the one in Opera for offline
reading.
>> So you can multiply the general download speed,
> Good for *.jpg collectors! <g>
Or other binaries...
>> pull the same
>> newsgroups from different servers (no more holes in the threads)
> Nice feature.
And the dupes are sorted out, of course...
>> or
>> gather all newsgroups you want but don't exist on one server in a
>> single session.
> Really desirable. My beloved Agent does have only one disadvantage -
> multiple newsservers aren't supported (even Netscape's newsreader
> have this feature BTW!). This may be compensated by using several
> copies of the program (they can have different settings for each
> host), but of course it isn't very convenient...
So Hamster would be a solution, if you would use Win9x. ;-) And
Netscape's newsreader can only manage multiple accounts, not
multiple connections to several newsservers in one session, or did
I miss something? UKA_PPP (the DOS mail/newsclient I use for my
newsreader CrossPoint) can store multiple "setups" (= ISP profiles),
so I can choose which newsserver I want to use with what ISP, and I
can even switch the newsserver after I pulled all articles from the
first one without interrupting the connection to my ISP.
>> Of course, this only works in Win9x... ;-)
> Well, I've suspected that... :-(
I think the main reason for this is the 32-bit WINSOCK.DLL that
Win9x uses and its ability to establish several connections at a
time. But perhaps this would be possible with newer 16-bit winsocks,
too - as far as I remember, the 16-bit Opera browser can do this with
a newer winsock. So there might be a possibility if there would
exist a 16-bit version of Hamster, hmmm.... ;-)
And another attempt to get this thread back on topic <g>: the new
Arachne v1.68 is out and can use a... wheelmouse... taaa-taaa! ;-)
But still no sign of JavaScript capabilities, Michael Polak seems to
have concentrated on speeding up the process of image downloading
for this new version.
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
>> Yes, the DOS mail/newsclient UKA_PPP I'm using for CrossPoint can do
>> this, too, but so far I was too lazy to change its standard settings
>> that omit crosspostings with more than 5 recipients, as far as I
>> know. Perhaps I should take a closer look to its config files now.
> I think you and Artur are talking about two different things.
Probably because I did not express myself clearly enough. Furthermore
I seemed to have mixed up the default settings of my newsreader and my
newsclient.
> If I understand you correctly, you are referring to filtering out
> _all_ copies of any article which is crossposted to more than 'N'
> newsgroups (with the default value for N=5) -- apparently as a means
> of spam reduction.
This would be what my offline newsreader CrossPoint can do when he
inserts all downloaded articles from UKA_PPP, the mail/newsclient I
have to use together with CrossPoint. The minimum of "allowed"
crosspostings in XP (= abbreviation for CrossPoint) is 3, so I can't
filter out crossposted articles that appear in only 3 newsgroups
with that method. There are special filter plugins for CrossPoint
like XPFilter that could do this job (and others), but I don't use
them yet.
> He is referring to a feature in Agent known as "Crosspost
> Management". In essence, this maintains a database of X-posted
> Message-IDs, so that it can automatically discard any/all _duplicate_
> copies of any article you've already "seen" in another newsgroup
> rather than download/store them two or three (or four or six dozen)
> times. But the _first_ copy is still maintained (subject to the same
> conditions as a non-crossposted article, of course) in the first
> newsgroup in which it was encountered.
Yes, and this is something UKA_PPP should be able to do, if I take
the time to search for the right config file and correct line... ;-)
At least it gathers all headers first before downloading the new
articles in a group, so it already has all informations it needs to
recognize crosspostings and keep only the first article and skip the
other ones.
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
--
Stephan Grossklass
>
> I think the main reason for this is the 32-bit WINSOCK.DLL that
> Win9x uses and its ability to establish several connections at a
> time. But perhaps this would be possible with newer 16-bit winsocks,
> too - as far as I remember, the 16-bit Opera browser can do this with
> a newer winsock. So there might be a possibility if there would
> exist a 16-bit version of Hamster, hmmm.... ;-)
What language is Hamster written in? With C and such, a Win16 port
shouldn't be all too difficult.
> And another attempt to get this thread back on topic <g>: the new
> Arachne v1.68 is out and can use a... wheelmouse... taaa-taaa! ;-)
> But still no sign of JavaScript capabilities, Michael Polak seems to
> have concentrated on speeding up the process of image downloading
> for this new version.
Hey, thanks for mentioning that :). I'll get it ASAP...
Stephan
--
Stephan Großklaß (7bit: Grossklass)
eMail: mailto:jgros...@t-online.de | Webmaster: http://www.i24.com/
Home: http://home.t-online.de/home/jgrossklass/
P3-500, 128MB, 8+8+19GB HDD; MS-DOS 6.22, WfW 3.11, Calmira II 3.1b3
Artur Yelchishchev
(Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen) wrote:
-snip-
>> Even non-English/non-German ones?
>
>Yes, definitely, this is even a speciality of news.cis.dfn.de
>because of its academical background. There are tons of Finnish,
>Russian, Polish and other foreign language newsgroups available on
>the server, and every day they add some more.
Really good then!
>Did you already get
>the FAQ they hand out? I have one in German, it's about 40 KB long.
Not yet, but currently I have little time to read it anyway. So far,
everything works fine...
>I think the central backbone server of the DFN is located in
>Frankfurt/Main, and the speed within this net is very fast, because
>it's based on glass fibre, as far as I remember.
During my first day of use, I can't say the speed is great - but most
likely, limiting factor is my own ISP (free one, so go figure! ;-)
>So you are already an official user of this newsserver?
Yes.
>>> By the way, have you ever heard of Hamster?
>> No. Most similar word I've heard is "Napster"! :-)
>
>It's the same word in English and means this little pet that hoards
>everything he can in his cheeks.
Interesting - I've just looked in Webster's and Encarta-96; none of
them knows word "Napster". What's language it belongs to? ;-)
>>> This is a freeware
>>> program that establishes a local newsserver on your computer and is
>>> able to download articles from several real newsservers at the same
>>> time.
>> Direct connection to the net is required, I think?
>
>What do you mean by that?
-snip-
>during the process of gathering articles
>Hamster has to stay online, of course, but afterwards it stores all
>news on the HDD, and you can use any newsreader to "call" Hamster as
>the local newsserver and insert the articles like you would have
>called a real newsserver with Forte Agent, for example. This way you
>can even use an online newsreader like the one in Opera for offline
>reading.
Ok, now I understand. After your phrase about Hamster "establishes a
local newsserver on your computer" I've mistakenly concluded it's
"available from outside" kind of host. Your description of how it
works resembles me local proxy operations. Thanks for clarification.
>> . My beloved Agent does have only one disadvantage -
>> multiple newsservers aren't supported
-snip-
>So Hamster would be a solution, if you would use Win9x. ;-)
First of all, it's _very_ unlikely I'll ever use Win9x by free will
<g>, and second - seems that 'news.cis.dfn.de' resolved this problem
aswell - here I see all the groups I've subscribed to, including
Russian 'fido7.ru.win3x'.
I hope, sometime I'll also be able to give you equally valuable
information as you gave me. :-) Thanks again!
[a need for Win32]
>I think the main reason for this is the 32-bit WINSOCK.DLL that
>Win9x uses and its ability to establish several connections at a
>time. But perhaps this would be possible with newer 16-bit winsocks,
>too - as far as I remember, the 16-bit Opera browser can do this with
>a newer winsock.
I'm not sure what you're referring to under "several connections" -
AFAIK it's standard feature in any WINSOCK, isn't it? At least,
Trumpet Winsock allows you to have several (definitely more than 10)
simultaneous connections/sockets - I'm regularily DLing messages from
two different NNTP hosts, with simultaneous web surfing-telnet/FTP
session-mail sending etc. Or, you mean multiple connections between
client's PC and given host/IP-address? Then I don't understand
something...
>And another attempt to get this thread back on topic <g>:
No, no - please! I've just corrected Subj. line!.. :-))
>the new
>Arachne v1.68 is out and can use a... wheelmouse... taaa-taaa! ;-)
Great - how it's done? It uses its own mouse driver, I suppose? And
how about compatibility with various brands? My experience shows that
wheels are highly proprietary things, and MS/Log./A4/Genius all
implement different protocols for sending extra packets...
Regards,
Artur
Stephan Grossklass
>
> >the new
> >Arachne v1.68 is out and can use a... wheelmouse... taaa-taaa! ;-)
>
> Great - how it's done? It uses its own mouse driver, I suppose?
A patched version of CuteMouse, as far as I've read.
> And
> how about compatibility with various brands?
Maybe you can find more about this on <http://arachne.cz>...
Artur Yelchishchev
<sgrossklas...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>Maybe you can find more about this on <http://arachne.cz>...
Ok.
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
>> time. But perhaps this would be possible with newer 16-bit winsocks,
>> too - as far as I remember, the 16-bit Opera browser can do this
>> with a newer winsock. So there might be a possibility if there would
>> exist a 16-bit version of Hamster, hmmm.... ;-)
> What language is Hamster written in? With C and such, a Win16 port
> shouldn't be all too difficult.
Sorry, I don't know, but there are lots of possibilities to find out:
is the URL which is mentioned most of the time when someone asks for
Hamster in de.comm.software.newsserver or *.newsreader. And like I
wrote before, there are many newsgroups in the hamster.* hierarchy
on the newsserver of the FU Berlin. Probably T-Online has them,
too... ;-)
>> And another attempt to get this thread back on topic <g>: the new
>> Arachne v1.68 is out and can use a... wheelmouse... taaa-taaa! ;-)
>> But still no sign of JavaScript capabilities, Michael Polak seems to
>> have concentrated on speeding up the process of image downloading
>> for this new version.
> Hey, thanks for mentioning that :). I'll get it ASAP...
And even more good news from the browser front line: the new Opera
5.0 (probably only in 32-bit first) is freeware now, because it
inserts a little window for sponsoring advertisements while surfing.
This windows should not slow down the session - says Opera.
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
--
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
>> I think the central backbone server of the DFN is located in
>> Frankfurt/Main, and the speed within this net is very fast, because
>> it's based on glass fibre, as far as I remember.
> During my first day of use, I can't say the speed is great - but most
> likely, limiting factor is my own ISP (free one, so go figure! ;-)
Well, you can't have it all... ;-)
> Interesting - I've just looked in Webster's and Encarta-96; none of
> them knows word "Napster". What's language it belongs to? ;-)
Probably it's a mixture of "nap" and "gangster"... ;-)
>>> . My beloved Agent does have only one disadvantage -
>>> multiple newsservers aren't supported
>> So Hamster would be a solution, if you would use Win9x. ;-)
> First of all, it's _very_ unlikely I'll ever use Win9x by free will
<g>> , and second - seems that 'news.cis.dfn.de' resolved this problem
This is one of their best features: the threads are complete,
because they are peering over 100 other newsservers in the internet.
This means they gather all articles from them and by this huge
redundancy it is very unlikely that an article disappears.
> aswell - here I see all the groups I've subscribed to, including
> Russian 'fido7.ru.win3x'.
Right, the Russians seem to love the Fidonet, even if it is gated to
the usenet. ;-) By the way, Forte Agent probably can sort a long
group list alphabetically, right? Then it's easier to take a look at
the neighbour hierarchies and newsgroups.
> I hope, sometime I'll also be able to give you equally valuable
> information as you gave me. :-) Thanks again!
You're welcome.
> [a need for Win32]
>> I think the main reason for this is the 32-bit WINSOCK.DLL that
>> Win9x uses and its ability to establish several connections at a
>> time. But perhaps this would be possible with newer 16-bit winsocks,
>> too - as far as I remember, the 16-bit Opera browser can do this
>> with a newer winsock.
> I'm not sure what you're referring to under "several connections" -
> AFAIK it's standard feature in any WINSOCK, isn't it? At least,
Well, as far as I know it wasn't possible with the older ones from
MS and Trumpet, but I might be wrong.
> Trumpet Winsock allows you to have several (definitely more than 10)
> simultaneous connections/sockets - I'm regularily DLing messages from
> two different NNTP hosts, with simultaneous web surfing-telnet/FTP
> session-mail sending etc. Or, you mean multiple connections between
> client's PC and given host/IP-address? Then I don't understand
> something...
Both, but more the ladder... ;-) Like I wrote, Hamster can use
"multithreading" which means that you can build up more than one
connection from your PC to *one* newsserver, for example to the FU
Berlin. They say in their FAQ that it is allowed to do this, but
only up to 4 parallel connections in one session. That's how you
can multiply the download speed from a newsserver, if it enables
multithreading. The other possibility of using several connections
is of course pulling articles parallel (= at the same time) from
different newsservers.
>> And another attempt to get this thread back on topic <g>:
> No, no - please! I've just corrected Subj. line!.. :-))
Yes, but you left the "Re" which disables the automatic function of
some newsreaders to delete the old subject when replying to your
article. ;-))
>> the new
>> Arachne v1.68 is out and can use a... wheelmouse... taaa-taaa! ;-)
> Great - how it's done? It uses its own mouse driver, I suppose? And
Right, like Stephan wrote...
> how about compatibility with various brands? My experience shows that
> wheels are highly proprietary things, and MS/Log./A4/Genius all
> implement different protocols for sending extra packets...
I hope this excerpt from CHANGES.TXT answers this:
Changes since release 1.65
--------------------------
Complete history can be found at http://browser.arachne.cz/download/history.txt
1.68 stable for DOS
----
Release date: 3th December 2000
Improvements: New "small icons" screen layout (use F5 to change layouts)
Wheel mouse support via patched CTMOUSE 1.8 beta 8 (you have
to load SYSTEM\DEVDRVRS\CTMOUSE.EXE instead of your mouse
driver, and only Microsoft Intellimouse protocol is supported
- works fine eg. with Genuus Netscroll+ mouse).
Implementation of HTTP/1.0 "Connection: keep-alive".
Faster image download (as result of main loop optimization).
Bug fixes: Installation process now doesn't overwrite existing
HOTLIST.HTM
Changes: Setup now runs in fullscreen mode to avoid user confusion.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
Outsider
>
You know, it is not a good idea (IMO) to over-publicize this server.
At least not if you are interested in using it. Every free newsgroup
server is at risk when too many people find out about it. The server
will simply get too many users and slow down to the point of being
useless, or become the target of spammers with the same result. Many
servers are shut down due to mis-use or over-use.
--
<!-- Outsider //-->
MS-DOS 6.22, Windows for Workgroups 3.11, Netscape Navigator 4.08
"I think we ought to raise the age at which juveniles can have a gun."
--G. W. Bush
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
> You know, it is not a good idea (IMO) to over-publicize this server.
> At least not if you are interested in using it. Every free newsgroup
> server is at risk when too many people find out about it. The server
> will simply get too many users and slow down to the point of being
> useless, or become the target of spammers with the same result. Many
> servers are shut down due to mis-use or over-use.
I don't see this danger for the server from the FU Berlin for several
reasons: First they have strict rules that avoid a mis-use or over-use,
and they really keep an eye on their registered users, if they stick
to these rules. One example is the use of anonymous pseudos instead
of real names: if the admins get to know that a registered user is
posting under a pseudo, he will be warned once and then thrown out,
if he continues to do that. The reason for this is obvious, because
that is one method spammers use.
Another example is the maximum of 100 postings per day which can be
exceeded if a user can give a really good reason why he has to post
more than 100 times a day. Furthermore they use software like
"Cleanfeed" that eliminates spam right away so that the users don't
even see it - or not much of it...
And I don't think that those few readers of this newsgroup will tear
that server down, even if they all would register at once. ;-) You
see, this newsserver works for many years now in this volunteer "open"
situation and cannot be compared with smaller, maybe illegal servers
that are established to spread out copyrighted software, for example.
By the way, there are no binary newsgroups on news.cis.dfn.de, and
that's one reason the traffic there is per se limited to only a
small percentage of the amount (in giga- or terrabytes) other servers
have to handle that are feeding those newsgroups. Furthermore most
of the alt.* hierarchy is not available for the same reason, but
certain newsgroups can be acquired if you write an email to them.
I suggest that you take a look at their website and read through the
FAQs and rules and then decide, if they will be shut down soon. Maybe
you'll come to the conclusion that Denmark isn't so far away from
Berlin, too... But you would have to change your address and user
name first, of course. ;-) One last remark: like any academical
institution on this planet, they also need many users to legitimate
their existence, if politicians try to save up some money again.
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
Outsider
Interesting. I hope you are right about this servers longevity.
I already subscribe, but not for this group.
Artur Yelchishchev
(Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen) wrote:
-snip-
> the Russians seem to love the Fidonet, even if it is gated to
>the usenet. ;-)
Yes - it's still widely popular in exUSSR.
>By the way, Forte Agent probably can sort a long
>group list alphabetically, right? Then it's easier to take a look at
>the neighbour hierarchies and newsgroups.
This is default mode, but I don't think it's really convenient. There
is a special freeware add-on called "Agent Group Order" by
jon...@netcom.com (ftp://ftp.netcom.com/pub/jo/jonzonk/agent/ago)
that gives you total control over groups sorting. For example, I keep
all groups related to Win3.x together, and other groups are also
sorted "thematically", not alphabetically.
>>> And another attempt to get this thread back on topic <g>:
>> No, no - please! I've just corrected Subj. line!.. :-))
>
>Yes, but you left the "Re" which disables the automatic function of
>some newsreaders to delete the old subject when replying to your
>article. ;-))
I can guess, what namely newsreader! :-)
[wheelmouse in Arachne]
> and only Microsoft Intellimouse protocol is supported
> - works fine eg. with Genuus Netscroll+ mouse).
Hmm... My attempts to use Microsoft Intellimouse in conjunction with
Genius Netscroll driver were unsuccessful - the wheel doesn't work.
IMHO, this means they're incompatible, at least in wheel signals
handling...
Cheers,
Artur
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
>> By the way, Forte Agent probably can sort a long
>> group list alphabetically, right? Then it's easier to take a look at
>> the neighbour hierarchies and newsgroups.
> This is default mode, but I don't think it's really convenient. There
> is a special freeware add-on called "Agent Group Order" by
> jon...@netcom.com (ftp://ftp.netcom.com/pub/jo/jonzonk/agent/ago)
> that gives you total control over groups sorting. For example, I keep
> all groups related to Win3.x together, and other groups are also
> sorted "thematically", not alphabetically.
Not bad, either... ;-)
By the way, I just saw a lot of ee.* newsgroups on the list of the
FU Berlin - did you notice them too?
>>>> And another attempt to get this thread back on topic <g>:
>>> No, no - please! I've just corrected Subj. line!.. :-))
>> Yes, but you left the "Re" which disables the automatic function of
>> some newsreaders to delete the old subject when replying to your
>> article. ;-))
> I can guess, what namely newsreader! :-)
Almost any reader can do this, except for Agent. ;-)
> [wheelmouse in Arachne]
>> and only Microsoft Intellimouse protocol is supported
>> - works fine eg. with Genuus Netscroll+ mouse).
> Hmm... My attempts to use Microsoft Intellimouse in conjunction with
> Genius Netscroll driver were unsuccessful - the wheel doesn't work.
> IMHO, this means they're incompatible, at least in wheel signals
> handling...
And did you try out this patched CTMOUSE.DRV from the new Arachne?
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
--
Artur Yelchishchev
(Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen) wrote:
>By the way, I just saw a lot of ee.* newsgroups on the list of the
>FU Berlin - did you notice them too?
Sure - and even subscribed to the part of them!
>>>>> And another attempt to get this thread back on topic <g>:
>>>> No, no - please! I've just corrected Subj. line!.. :-))
>>> Yes, but you left the "Re" which disables the automatic function of
>>> some newsreaders to delete the old subject when replying to your
>>> article. ;-))
>> I can guess, what namely newsreader! :-)
>
>Almost any reader can do this, except for Agent. ;-)
Score 1:1 :-)
>And did you try out this patched CTMOUSE.DRV from the new Arachne?
Not yet, but I'm planning to do it.
WBR,
Artur
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
>> And did you try out this patched CTMOUSE.DRV from the new Arachne?
> Not yet, but I'm planning to do it.
Here are README.TXT and PROTOCOL.TXT from Arachne's subdirectory
containing the mousedriver and other text files:
======================================================================
This is very experimental, unofficial build of CTMOUSE 1.8 beta 8 by
Arachne Labs.
It returns Microsoft Intellimouse compatible (eg. Genius Netscoll+) wheel
status in BH (high byte of BX register) when serivce AX=0x03 of INT 0x33
is called, which should be compatible with most existing DOS library
functions returning mouse buttons status, available for most programming
languages. BH values 0xf to 0xa indicate movement in one direction, values
0x1 to 0x7 indicate movent in oposite direction. Event queuing and service
AX=0x11 support are not yet implemented, and will be probably included in
official CTMOUSE 1.9 release, as promised by CTMOUSE development team.
You have to replace your mouse driver in AUTOEXEC.BAT by CTMOUSE driver.
It should be able to autodetect mouse type on any serial port.
Please contact net...@arachne.cz for further information about this CTMOUSE
patch.
======================================================================
Mouse reset:
------------
1: Set UART to 'broken line' state (set bit 6 of the LCR)
2: Clear the bits 0-1 of the MCR (clear RTS and DTR), wait a while
3: Reverse the bits again (set RTS and DTR)
Mouse detection (identification bytes before optional PNP data):
----------------------------------------------------------------
Microsoft mice send 'M' after dropping and raising RTS.
Logitech mice send 'M3' after dropping and raising RTS.
Microsoft Intellimouse/Wheel mice send 'MZ@',0,0,0 after
dropping and raising RTS.
===========================================================================
Microsoft mode: 1200 bps, 7 data bits, 1 stop bit, no parity
1st byte 2nd byte 3rd byte
+---------------+ +---------------+ +---------------+
|0|1|L|R|Y|Y|X|X| |0|0|X|X|X|X|X|X| |0|0|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|
+---------------+ +---------------+ +---------------+
| | \ / \ / \----+----/ \----+----/
| | | | | |
| | +---|-------------|---------+ |
| | +-----+ | | |
| | / \ /----+----\ / \ /----+----\
| | +---------------+ +---------------+
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
Left Button -+ | +---------------+ +---------------+
Right Button ---+ X increment Y increment
(1 if pressed)
The X and Y increment values are in 2's compliment signed char format.
===========================================================================
Microsoft IntelliMouse: 1200 bps, 7 data bits, 1 stop bit, no parity
1st byte 2nd byte 3rd byte 4th byte
+---------------+ +---------------+ +---------------+ +---------------+
|0|1|L|R|Y|Y|X|X| |0|0|X|X|X|X|X|X| |0|0|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y| |0|0|0|M|0|0|0|0|
+---------------+ +---------------+ +---------------+ +---------------+
| | \ / \ / \----+----/ \----+----/ | \--+--/
| | | | | | | |
| | +---|-------------|---------+ | Middle -+ |
| | +-----+ | | | Button |
| | / \ /----+----\ / \ /----+----\ |
| | +---------------+ +---------------+ |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Wheel
Left Button -+ | +---------------+ +---------------+ Movement
Right Button ---+ X increment Y increment
(1 if pressed)
The X and Y increment values are in 2's compliment signed char format.
===========================================================================
Logitech MouseMan mode: 1200 bps, 7 data bits, 1 stop bit, no parity
3 bytes (left or right button is pressed):
------------------------------------------
1st byte 2nd byte 3rd byte
+---------------+ +---------------+ +---------------+
|0|1|L|R|Y|Y|X|X| |0|0|X|X|X|X|X|X| |0|0|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|
+---------------+ +---------------+ +---------------+
| | \ / \ / \----+----/ \----+----/
| | | | | |
| | +---|-------------|---------+ |
| | +-----+ | | |
| | / \ /----+----\ / \ /----+----\
| | +---------------+ +---------------+
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
Left Button -+ | +---------------+ +---------------+
Right Button ---+ X increment Y increment
(1 if pressed)
The extra byte (when middle button is pressed):
-----------------------------------------------
4th byte
+---------------+
|0|0|M|0|0|0|0|0|
+---------------+
|
Middle button
===========================================================================
Mouse Systems mode: 1200 bps, 8 data bits, 1 stop bit, no parity
1st byte 2nd byte 3rd byte
+---------------+ +---------------+ +---------------+
|1|0|0|0|0|L|M|R| |X|X|X|X|X|X|X|X| |Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|
+---------------+ +---------------+ +---------------+
| | | \------+------/ \------+------/
| | | | |
| | | Xa increment Ya increment
| | |
| | | 4th byte 5th byte
| | | +---------------+ +---------------+
Left Button --+ | | |X|X|X|X|X|X|X|X| |Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|Y|
Middle Button ----+ | +---------------+ +---------------+
Right Button ------+ \------+------/ \------+------/
(0 if pressed) | |
Xb increment Yb increment
Note: Mouse Systems mouse sends two independent bytes for each direction
in each packet.
Xa/Ya - movement of the mouse since last packet (+ right/up)
Xb/Yb - movement of the mouse since Xa/Ya
======================================================================
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
Artur Yelchishchev
(Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen) wrote:
>Here are README.TXT and PROTOCOL.TXT from Arachne's subdirectory
>containing the mousedriver and other text files:
Thanks - it's very handy information! I'll add it to my hardware
descriptions archive.
As I see, Arachne is worth dounloading at least for good documentation
files!
Artur
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
>> Here are README.TXT and PROTOCOL.TXT from Arachne's subdirectory
>> containing the mousedriver and other text files:
> Thanks - it's very handy information! I'll add it to my hardware
> descriptions archive.
> As I see, Arachne is worth dounloading at least for good
> documentation files!
And it's only one MB... ;-)
ZZee ya, Hans-Juergen
--
Hans-Juergen Bardenhagen
## Ursprung : appr...@rcn.com
## Ersteller: hjbard...@compuserve.de
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Hi Jay,
> on 14.12.00 you wrote:
>> By the way, Forte Agent probably can sort a long
>> group list alphabetically, right?
> I _think_ [Free] Agent does this by default; but it may just be that
> every NNTP server I've ever used with it spits out the group list in
> alpha order. However, either way, an add-on called Agent Group Order
> will let you do most anything you want with the Group List.
Yes, Artur already told me so.
>>> I'm not sure what you're referring to under "several connections" -
>>> AFAIK it's standard feature in any WINSOCK, isn't it? At least,
>> Well, as far as I know it wasn't possible with the older ones from
>> MS and Trumpet, but I might be wrong.
> This limitation was applicable to at least _some_ (2.x, I _think_;
> but it might go back to 1.x) versions of Trumpet; but "MS" is harder
> to call... IIRC, they didn't actually make/release a dialer under
> their own name until the Win95 "Plus Pack"; and even then it was a
> re-packaged/stolen version of ShivaPPP (which is the dialer that is
> packaged with some versions of MSIE 3.x for Win-16). Shiva was also
I know, because I use MSIE 3.03 besides Arachne. But they didn't
steal it, because you can read this info within the setup/properties
screens of the dialer.
> packaged with the NTS (Network TeleSystems) Winsock and called the
> "Netscape Personal Edition Dialer", and bundled with Netscape
> Navigator 2.x/3.x packages distributed by ISPs. I can state with
I did not know that, for I never used Netscape because of its size.
With a 420 MB HDD, you have to keep an eye on the free space
constantly...
> certainty that at least _that_ incarnation of Shiva/NTS _does_
> support multiple server connections (including to the same server); I
> suspect the (current) MS-bundled version also does, but I'm not
> absolutely sure of this.
Even the one that MSIE 3.03 uses (from 1997) is capable of this,
because I can open up several windows = connections in Opera 3.62
with that dialer. So it might be possible to use it with a ported
version of Hamster, like Stephan wrote. By the way, Hamster is
written in Delphi, as someone told me yesterday...
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By the way, did you send this as an email on purpose? Perhaps the
others would have liked to comment on your statements in the newsgroup.
ZZee ya, Hans-Jürgen