Disillusioned
Karen H
In a message dated 97-02-25 22:38:17 EST, you write:
<< Curious, I am a new Magic Capper. Why are you disillusioned? >>
When I bought my Magic Link in April of 1995, I paid $550 for it. (Plus $70
for a battery and $100 for a 1 meg ram card and $100 for MXchange) This is
not an issue, I obviously thought it was worth that much and I know the
earlier folks paid $1000 for theirs. I also know that is the nature of the
industry, that what you buy today will be given away with an 8 gallon fill up
at Exxon next year.
I got my Link because I had seen Charlie F's link and fell in love with it.
There is another oldtimer who we don't hear from anymore. I wonder why.
Are there any of the old folks still around?
I used my Link for email mostly. I would have loved to use the Datebook, but
the fact that everything in the Datebook goes to the New Items package made
that impossible to deal with. Yes, I could have used Onno's tools to move
everything but that got to be a pain in the butt, and took up precious room
on my ram card. I did store some useful things in the notebook, and I
enjoyed Scrambler.
So that was the start of the disillusionment. I had to spend so much time
moving things around and doing manual clean ups that it was getting tedious
to use my Link for much of anything. But I was still excited, it was a cool
thing, and everyone who saw it wanted one. I used to post very enthusiastic
tips about how to avoid clean ups etc.
For a short time we had a user group exchanging stamps and that was exciting.
One of the Magic folks made me a brat smiley stamp animation that sticks out
its tongue. Magic Cap was still fun. There were newsletters and other fun
things to subscribe to.
Then the PIC2000 came out. A brief glimmer of hope that the bugs in Magic
Cap would be fixed. But no, there is no upgrade available. At that point I
started to feel like my Link was becoming an expensive paperweight. Some of
you may remember all of the discussion about this on the lists back then. Is
the Link a computer or a consumer product? It became clear that Sony saw it
as a consumer product, like a CD player, and just because there is a new
model out, it doesn't mean that consumers "deserve" some kind of credit or
upgrade. IMHO Sony could have done a lot for consumer loyalty by offering us
a trade in credit at least. That was the start of the sense that we all felt
abandoned.
Then PersonaLink died. All of a sudden, there was no way to exchange stamps
unless we were all on AOL. PrestoMail was out there, but unless you have a
nationwide ISP that doesn't do much good for getting mail on the road. I
never even installed the free PrestoLinks/PrestoMail that we all got. I
didn't bother to download the CujoChat IRC client either. I really didn't
want to change ISPs just for Magic Link. I continued to get my mail via AOL
on my Link.
It is clear that AOL is phasing out the SprintNet numbers and MagicLinks
cannot access the AOLNet numbers. So, soon I will not be able to use my Link
when I travel either. There is no one supporting the AOL MagicLink Client.
Obviously we are small potatoes to AOL, but I would have thought that
GeneralMagic or Sony could have done something to help us there. Even the
bugs in the AOL client will never be fixed.
Then the Pilot was announced. Inexpensive and one button sync with the PC.
A lot of people defected for that, but I hung on to Magic because I needed
the email capability. (I hear the new version of the Pilot will do email)
Now what I see on this list is a bunch of highschool kids who are finding
this to be a real neat toy. That is fine, that is what it is. I stopped
reading these lists regularly last November. I used to read them several
times a day, now I catch up every week or so. I no longer see people out
here using the Link as a business tool. I know I no longer use it that way.
I use the rolodex feature and that is about it now. It is just too tedious
to deal with the memory management and it takes too many hours a week. I
find that I have little yellow sticky notes (the real ones not the stamp)
stuck to the back of my Magic Link and that keeps the info at hand a lot
easier than putting it somewhere in the Link and filing it to a package etc
etc.
Much of the promised development for the Link never came to be. Remember
Market Square? vaporware. Fax receive capabilities? a dream. The
Financial App that was going to be a group effort? Died on the vine.
So now, I am stuck will 2 years of email stored on my PC in Magic Exchange
packages that I cannot even access without my Link because MagicCap for
windows cannot interpret them. Before I can sell my Link, I have to go
through each package and turn them all into text files somehow.
I guess the short version is that MagicCap and MagicLink were too far ahead
of their time. They got the products out to us in an unfinished buggy format
and we the consumers unwittingly did the beta testing for them. And we got
no thanks, we got left behind in the dust. Now that is all philosophical
speculation on my part. The hard reality is that MagicLink is too tedious to
have any real use for me, because of the poor memory management internally
and because of the existing bugs in 1.0f. Once upon a time I felt it was
worth that effort, but my perception now is that the companies involved just
don't care and the excitement has worn off. Most of the neat tricks with the
Link use up too much memory.
So, that is my history with Magic Link. If you look around at the archives
of this list and see who used to post here you will probably see ads for
their Links as they have pretty much all left.
The MagicLink PIC1000 is well worth the $99 that y'all have been paying for
it lately. I am glad that I was a part of this, someday I can say "gee
remember that MagicLink I used to have, look at how far technology has come
now". But then, I say that about my RadioShack Scientific Calculator from
1980 now.
Rosemary sounds exciting, I attended the demo at the last BAMCUG meeting
(virtually, and it was very cool to do that. I am so easily seduced by
technology.). But I am skeptical. I suspect some of the old bugs will still
be there and a host of new ones. And I am just not keen to go down this path
again. If the Rosemary devices are affordable and can access AOL neatly, I
may consider it. But you can bet that if I have to do a lot of moving data
around just to avoid clean ups, then I will return it to wherever I bought
it. I guess my biggest concern is a lack of upgrade path, even for bug
fixes, and I am don't have a warm and fuzzy feeling that upgrades and fixes
will be available.
I'll keep following these lists, sporadically, so lets hear some comments.
Who has had similar experiences? Who disagrees?
KarenH
http://users.aol.com/mindfire/mindfire.html (where I used to have a
MagicLink page, you can still see it at
http://users.aol.com/mindfire/magiccap.html if you want to see my old
enthusiasm and all the fun things there used to be for the Link)
Tom Yates
Karen H (Mind...@AOL.COM) wrote:
: In a message dated 97-02-25 22:38:17 EST, you write:
:
: << Curious, I am a new Magic Capper. Why are you disillusioned? >>
[disillusionment deleted]
:
: I'll keep following these lists, sporadically, so lets hear some comments.
: Who has had similar experiences? Who disagrees?
i disagree. i find the device indispensable, it's used many times a day,
every day, and it's pulled my bum out of some tight corners.
i don't know how i can explain the difference. my best guess is that i
don't buy stuff that isn't fully formed - i explicitly don't allow myself
to buy things because they look neat and would do exactly what i wanted if
only a couple things were fixed.
i didn't buy the newton for that reason. i didn't buy the ML1000, or the
envoy, both of which i had on test, for that reason. they were nearly
there, but not quite. the 2000 came along, and everything i needed was
either there, or immediately available. including the development
environment. so i got it, added on what i needed to add, and used it, and
used it, and used it. i have added on a few things since, like a nice case
and presto!mail, but everything i actually bought it to do was there on
minute one.
this may have nothing to do with it, either. it's my best guess, is all.
--
Tom Yates - Unix Chap - The Mathworks, Inc. - +1 (508) 647 7561
MAG#65061 DoD#0135 AMA#461546
1024/CFDFDE39 0C E7 46 60 BB 96 87 05 04 BD FB F8 BB 20 C1 8C
please note the address "madh...@pobox.com" should be valid in perpetuity
Marc H Murray
Wow. I didn't realize there was that little support for the Magic Link. I
suppose time will tell. It will likely go the way of the Commodore, Atari
ST and someday Macintosh. I guess with Windows CE out, that will probably
be the "hot" thing. Gates always wins. Oh well, I'll enjoy my 2000 for a
while and sell it if it becomes too much of a hassle. However, I suppose
surfing the net and checking my e-=mail (I have Presto!links/Mail) will
keep me going for a while, until ISDN becomes the standard. I can just
look at it as a small Internet box. It's ashame really. As a long time
Windows user, I gotta say, Magic Cap, without a doubt, is one of the
coolest operating systems I have ever seen.
Greg Satz
>In a message dated 97-02-25 22:38:17 EST, Karen H wrote:
>I used my Link for email mostly. I would have loved to use the Datebook, but
>the fact that everything in the Datebook goes to the New Items package made
>that impossible to deal with. Yes, I could have used Onno's tools to move
>everything but that got to be a pain in the butt, and took up precious room
>on my ram card. I did store some useful things in the notebook, and I
>enjoyed Scrambler.
Memory issue have always been the bane of Magic Cap. It was very
disappointing to everyone when Magic Cap 1.5 arrived with some bug fixes
but none of the memory usability issues resolved. 1.5 is better but still
far too time consuming.
It was never clear to me that the GM development team actually used their
Magic Cap devices for their daily email or appointments. That is the only
way I can explain such poor performance getting out the door and never
being resolved.
>Then the PIC2000 came out. A brief glimmer of hope that the bugs in Magic
>Cap would be fixed. But no, there is no upgrade available. At that point I
>started to feel like my Link was becoming an expensive paperweight. Some of
>you may remember all of the discussion about this on the lists back then. Is
>the Link a computer or a consumer product? It became clear that Sony saw it
>as a consumer product, like a CD player, and just because there is a new
>model out, it doesn't mean that consumers "deserve" some kind of credit or
>upgrade. IMHO Sony could have done a lot for consumer loyalty by offering us
>a trade in credit at least. That was the start of the sense that we all felt
>abandoned.
Others have commented quite nicely how GM and Sony really screwed up the
marketing of these devices. Consumers never did quite get it but computers
folks loved it. Computer folks expected upgrades. Sony wasn't interested in
dealing with the disconnect. It is all moot now since Sony is no longer
doing Magic Links. It is a dead product. So is the Envoy from Motorola.
We are all in a technological cul de sac, in my opinion.
>Then PersonaLink died. All of a sudden, there was no way to exchange stamps
>unless we were all on AOL. PrestoMail was out there, but unless you have a
>nationwide ISP that doesn't do much good for getting mail on the road. I
>never even installed the free PrestoLinks/PrestoMail that we all got. I
>didn't bother to download the CujoChat IRC client either. I really didn't
>want to change ISPs just for Magic Link. I continued to get my mail via AOL
>on my Link.
While personalink was nice it never had a chance. Somehow GM ignored the
internet for too long. Instead of doing nice internet tools from the
beginning they invested large amount of resources into a proprietary mail
system. GM can't be blamed singularly since AT&T made the same misjudgement
and lead GM on with large investments.
GM hasn't been able to capitalize on the technology behind personalink,
Telescript, for unknown reasons. This is a real shame.
>It is clear that AOL is phasing out the SprintNet numbers and MagicLinks
>cannot access the AOLNet numbers. So, soon I will not be able to use my Link
>when I travel either. There is no one supporting the AOL MagicLink Client.
> Obviously we are small potatoes to AOL, but I would have thought that
>GeneralMagic or Sony could have done something to help us there. Even the
>bugs in the AOL client will never be fixed.
The whole AOL support effort in the communicator was a nightmare. I never
relied on it since it regularly lost email messages. Then AOL Magic Cap
support atrophied to the point of text-only unreliable email with dwindling
access phone numbers. They are clearly trying to tell the Magic Cap
customers to find another service provider.
This brings me to one of the largest criticisms I have about Magic Cap and
General Magic. There is no such thing as customer support for the
communicator. The very idea of fixing a bug in the communicator just wasn't
important. Magic Cap has support for runtime updating of code. That is how
the 1.0f patch works. But it takes up precious resources in main memory and
is easily lost when you pull the batteries (which happens often if you use
your device heavily). The fact that the slow appointment book, AOL
unreliable mail handling and other very blatent and egregious bugs never
got resolved is very unfortunate. I just can't understand delivering a new
piece of software without expecting to resolve customer quality issues. I
believe this why GM is shrinking instead of growing.
>Then the Pilot was announced. Inexpensive and one button sync with the PC.
> A lot of people defected for that, but I hung on to Magic because I needed
>the email capability. (I hear the new version of the Pilot will do email)
I understand there is software available for the Pilot that does email
right now.
>I guess the short version is that MagicCap and MagicLink were too far ahead
>of their time. They got the products out to us in an unfinished buggy format
>and we the consumers unwittingly did the beta testing for them. And we got
>no thanks, we got left behind in the dust. Now that is all philosophical
>speculation on my part. The hard reality is that MagicLink is too tedious to
>have any real use for me, because of the poor memory management internally
>and because of the existing bugs in 1.0f. Once upon a time I felt it was
>worth that effort, but my perception now is that the companies involved just
>don't care and the excitement has worn off. Most of the neat tricks with the
>Link use up too much memory.
GM will be a part of technology history along with EO/GO. By the way AT&T
also had a hand in EO's demise as well.
>So, that is my history with Magic Link. If you look around at the archives
>of this list and see who used to post here you will probably see ads for
>their Links as they have pretty much all left.
This is very sad but very true. Lots of folks have come through this list
and are no longer here.
>Rosemary sounds exciting, I attended the demo at the last BAMCUG meeting
>(virtually, and it was very cool to do that. I am so easily seduced by
>technology.). But I am skeptical. I suspect some of the old bugs will still
>be there and a host of new ones. And I am just not keen to go down this path
>again. If the Rosemary devices are affordable and can access AOL neatly, I
>may consider it. But you can bet that if I have to do a lot of moving data
>around just to avoid clean ups, then I will return it to wherever I bought
>it. I guess my biggest concern is a lack of upgrade path, even for bug
>fixes, and I am don't have a warm and fuzzy feeling that upgrades and fixes
>will be available.
Rosemary is a pipe dream as far as I can tell. At the last developers
conference GM showed working prototypes that were really cool. However they
had absolutely no plan on how to deliver the device. Their time frames were
vague and their confidence seemed strained. Most of the GM people who were
at the conference in December have either quit or been let go. Markman is
trying to take the company on a different course. All the company press
announcements are strangely devoid of information about Magic Cap.
In some respects this disillusioned email thread seems more like a eulogy
then anything else.
Greg Satz
Mark Nomady
I have to disagree with everyone out there who is "disillusioned." =20
I paid $800 for one of the first ML2000's, and had a ML1000 before that. =
Where else are you gonna get a handheld that lets you send email from =
your cell phone, that reads your handwriting, and lets you download html =
if you're patient, at current prices?
Nowhere.
Sure, we were abandoned by Sony, GM, and AT&T. But I've had more than a =
year of use out of my ml, and unless I drop it I think slip/pop (ie =
PrestoStuff) will be a standard at least for several more years and will =
allow my continued use of the Internet. It will be at least a year =
before the WinCE machines even come close....
It's not a good laptop. It's not a great pda. It is what it is. And =
still very cool.
mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Satz [SMTP:sa...@SPRYNET.COM]
Sent: Thursday, February 27, 1997 12:21 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list MAGICDST
Subject: Re: Disillusioned
>In a message dated 97-02-25 22:38:17 EST, Karen H wrote:
>I used my Link for email mostly. I would have loved to use the =
Datebook, but
>the fact that everything in the Datebook goes to the New Items package =
made
>that impossible to deal with. Yes, I could have used Onno's tools to =
move
>everything but that got to be a pain in the butt, and took up precious =
room
>on my ram card. I did store some useful things in the notebook, and I
>enjoyed Scrambler.
Memory issue have always been the bane of Magic Cap. It was very
disappointing to everyone when Magic Cap 1.5 arrived with some bug fixes
but none of the memory usability issues resolved. 1.5 is better but =
still
far too time consuming.
It was never clear to me that the GM development team actually used =
their
Magic Cap devices for their daily email or appointments. That is the =
only
way I can explain such poor performance getting out the door and never
being resolved.
>Then the PIC2000 came out. A brief glimmer of hope that the bugs in =
Magic
>Cap would be fixed. But no, there is no upgrade available. At that =
point I
>started to feel like my Link was becoming an expensive paperweight. =
Some of
>you may remember all of the discussion about this on the lists back =
then. Is
>the Link a computer or a consumer product? It became clear that Sony =
saw it
>as a consumer product, like a CD player, and just because there is a =
new
>model out, it doesn't mean that consumers "deserve" some kind of credit =
or
>upgrade. IMHO Sony could have done a lot for consumer loyalty by =
offering us
>a trade in credit at least. That was the start of the sense that we =
all felt
>abandoned.
Others have commented quite nicely how GM and Sony really screwed up the
marketing of these devices. Consumers never did quite get it but =
computers
folks loved it. Computer folks expected upgrades. Sony wasn't interested =
in
dealing with the disconnect. It is all moot now since Sony is no longer
doing Magic Links. It is a dead product. So is the Envoy from Motorola.
We are all in a technological cul de sac, in my opinion.
>Then PersonaLink died. All of a sudden, there was no way to exchange =
stamps
>unless we were all on AOL. PrestoMail was out there, but unless you =
have a
>nationwide ISP that doesn't do much good for getting mail on the road. =
I
>never even installed the free PrestoLinks/PrestoMail that we all got. =
I
>didn't bother to download the CujoChat IRC client either. I really =
didn't
>want to change ISPs just for Magic Link. I continued to get my mail =
via AOL
>on my Link.
While personalink was nice it never had a chance. Somehow GM ignored the
internet for too long. Instead of doing nice internet tools from the
beginning they invested large amount of resources into a proprietary =
mail
system. GM can't be blamed singularly since AT&T made the same =
misjudgement
and lead GM on with large investments.
GM hasn't been able to capitalize on the technology behind personalink,
Telescript, for unknown reasons. This is a real shame.
>It is clear that AOL is phasing out the SprintNet numbers and =
. And we got
>no thanks, we got left behind in the dust. Now that is all =
philosophical
>speculation on my part. The hard reality is that MagicLink is too =
tedious to
>have any real use for me, because of the poor memory management =
internally
>and because of the existing bugs in 1.0f. Once upon a time I felt it =
was
>worth that effort, but my perception now is that the companies involved =
just
>don't care and the excitement has worn off. Most of the neat tricks =
with the
>Link use up too much memory.
GM will be a part of technology history along with EO/GO. By the way =
AT&T
also had a hand in EO's demise as well.
>So, that is my history with Magic Link. If you look around at the =
archives
>of this list and see who used to post here you will probably see ads =
for
>their Links as they have pretty much all left.
This is very sad but very true. Lots of folks have come through this =
list
and are no longer here.
>Rosemary sounds exciting, I attended the demo at the last BAMCUG =
meeting
>(virtually, and it was very cool to do that. I am so easily seduced by
>technology.). But I am skeptical. I suspect some of the old bugs will =
still
>be there and a host of new ones. And I am just not keen to go down =
this path
>again. If the Rosemary devices are affordable and can access AOL =
neatly, I
>may consider it. But you can bet that if I have to do a lot of moving =
data
>around just to avoid clean ups, then I will return it to wherever I =
bought
>it. I guess my biggest concern is a lack of upgrade path, even for bug
>fixes, and I am don't have a warm and fuzzy feeling that upgrades and =
fixes
>will be available.
Rosemary is a pipe dream as far as I can tell. At the last developers
conference GM showed working prototypes that were really cool. However =
they
had absolutely no plan on how to deliver the device. Their time frames =
were
vague and their confidence seemed strained. Most of the GM people who =
were
at the conference in December have either quit or been let go. Markman =
is
trying to take the company on a different course. All the company press
announcements are strangely devoid of information about Magic Cap.
In some respects this disillusioned email thread seems more like a =
eulogy
then anything else.
Greg Satz
=00
H.R. Laser
Mark Nomady (trus...@USA.NET) wrote:
: I have to disagree with everyone out there who is "disillusioned." =20
: I paid $800 for one of the first ML2000's, and had a ML1000 before that. =
: Where else are you gonna get a handheld that lets you send email from =
: your cell phone, that reads your handwriting, and lets you download html =
: if you're patient, at current prices?
: Nowhere.
Newton, that's where. :)
Harv
*Portal AmigaZone has moved to CalWeb - signup is FREE!
*Call 1-800-509-9322 (24 hrs.), say "Amiga Zone sent me."
*Visit http://www.amigazone.com for more info.
Dave Coker
I went from a MP100 to a Sony ML and an Envoy; very cool tech but I
got real tired real fast of watching the spinning hat. Now I've got
an MP130 and my Sony ML is in the corner, gathering dust.
Nice box - no support and no SW. General Magic is dead within 2YR -
just look at their stock price recently. Marc Porat is genuinely
a well meaning dude, but they talk about Steven Jobs' "reality
distortion field"....
H.R. Laser (hrl...@netcom.com) wrote:
: Mark Nomady (trus...@USA.NET) wrote:
: : I have to disagree with everyone out there who is "disillusioned." =20
: : I paid $800 for one of the first ML2000's, and had a ML1000 before that. =
: : Where else are you gonna get a handheld that lets you send email from =
: : your cell phone, that reads your handwriting, and lets you download html =
: : if you're patient, at current prices?
: : Nowhere.
: Newton, that's where. :)
:
Manuel Veloso
In article <970226105323...@emout03.mail.aol.com>, Karen H <Mind...@AOL.COM> wrote:
> So, that is my history with Magic Link. If you look around at the archives
> of this list and see who used to post here you will probably see ads for
> their Links as they have pretty much all left.
> The MagicLink PIC1000 is well worth the $99 that y'all have been paying for
> it lately. I am glad that I was a part of this, someday I can say "gee
> remember that MagicLink I used to have, look at how far technology has come
> now". But then, I say that about my RadioShack Scientific Calculator from
> I'll keep following these lists, sporadically, so lets hear some comments.
> Who has had similar experiences? Who disagrees?
Funny that I happened to check out the newsgroup today...yesterday, a friend wanted to borrow the old PIC-2k because her laptop flamed out and she needed mobile email. Amusingly enough, it wouldn't turn on because instant-on ate the batteries :| (sigh)
(it did work after it was plugged in)
Reading this really brought me back, and it's given me a small fit of melancholia as well (gee, thanks). I have this almost overwhelming urge to say, "back in the old days", and spew forth about them olden times. Oh well....
Anyhow, a random lyric keeps coming to mind when thinking back on MagicCap:
"when I was a young man
I needed good luck
but I'm a little bit older now
and I know my stuff"
Beats the hell out of me <g>
-----------------------------------------
Manny Veloso Digital Plumber
-----------------------------------------
KP KP
> In article <970226105323...@emout03.mail.aol.com>, Karen H <Mind...@AOL.COM> wrote:
> > of this list and see who used to post here you will probably see ads for
> > their Links as they have pretty much all left.
>
> > The MagicLink PIC1000 is well worth the $99 that y'all have been paying for
> > it lately. I am glad that I was a part of this, someday I can say "gee
> > remember that MagicLink I used to have, look at how far technology has come
> > now". But then, I say that about my RadioShack Scientific Calculator from
> > Who has had similar experiences? Who disagrees?
> (it did work after it was plugged in)
> Reading this really brought me back, and it's given me a small fit of melancholia as well (gee, thanks). I have this almost overwhelming urge to say, "back in the old days", and spew forth about them olden times. Oh well....
> Anyhow, a random lyric keeps coming to mind when thinking back on MagicCap:
> "when I was a young man
> I needed good luck
> but I'm a little bit older now
> and I know my stuff"
> Beats the hell out of me <g>
> -----------------------------------------
> Manny Veloso Digital Plumber
> -----------------------------------------