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ESR on the Anti-Linux Microsoft Campaigns (Halloween Documents)

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Roy Schestowitz

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Aug 25, 2008, 11:34:08 AM8/25/08
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"Expect Microsoft to ally even more closely with the RIAA and MPAA in making
yet another try at hardware-based DRM restrictions — and legislation making
them mandatory. The rationale will be to stop piracy and spam, but the real
goal will be customer control and a lockout of all unauthorized software. Two
previous attempts at this have failed, but the logic of Microsoft's situation
is such that they must keep trying.

"I also expect a serious effort, backed by several billion dollars in bribe
money (oops, excuse me, campaign contributions), to get open-source software
outlawed on some kind of theory that it aids terrorists. We can only defeat
that by making sure that national governments become so attached to
open-source code that their military men and bureaucrats will short-stop the
bribed legislators, rather than let their vital infrastructure be outlawed."

http://www.catb.org/~esr/halloween/halloween11.html

Lots more there. It's prophetic
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7

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Aug 25, 2008, 11:30:44 AM8/25/08
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Roy Schestowitz wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> "Expect Microsoft to ally even more closely with the RIAA and MPAA in

> making yet another try at hardware-based DRM restrictions ? and


> legislation making them mandatory. The rationale will be to stop piracy
> and spam, but the real goal will be customer control and a lockout of all
> unauthorized software. Two previous attempts at this have failed, but the
> logic of Microsoft's situation is such that they must keep trying.
>
> "I also expect a serious effort, backed by several billion dollars in
> bribe money (oops, excuse me, campaign contributions), to get open-source
> software outlawed on some kind of theory that it aids terrorists. We can
> only defeat that by making sure that national governments become so
> attached to open-source code that their military men and bureaucrats will
> short-stop the bribed legislators, rather than let their vital
> infrastructure be outlawed."
>
> http://www.catb.org/~esr/halloween/halloween11.html
>
> Lots more there. It's prophetic


Eliminating micoshaft is the best way to stop all this crap.
Very sound business practices to get rid of the WINDUMMY osen and replace
it with free software below:
Original article by Rex Ballard.


"
Here are some tactics I've been hearing about from different companies
who are trying to prevent another "forced upgrade" to Vista at the
cost of jobs, poor earnings reports, and loss of productivity.

Executive Management Approval
Employees who want Vista or Office 2007 have to get approval from
their supervisor, who has to get approval from his supervisor, and so
on up the chain almost to the CEO or COO.  If a lower level manager
approves, and doesn't get prior approval from his management, a
substantial charge is assessed to his budget, sufficient to clearly
and negatively affect his bonuses.  In effect, any Vista or Office
2007 he personally approves, comes out of his bonus.

The point is that most lower level workers are not willing to go
through the hassles of writting a justification sufficient to merit
the approval of a high level executive, and mid-level managers aren't
going to eliminate their chances of promotion or bonuses by bucking
upper management.


Self Funded Personal Platforms

The company will provide the PC and Windows 2000, XP, or Linux, but if
the employee feels that he has to have Vista or Office 2007, they have
to purchase it through the corporate procurement system, and the cost
of the software will be deducted from their bunuses or raises.

Linux bonuses
Company offers bonuses, or adds to annual bonuses based on the
employee's ability to use Linux, with higher bonuses for Linux in
Native mode, slightly less for Virtual Mode, because they have taken
the time to self-train and take responsibility for their own desktop
or laptop environment.

Annual surcharges.
Rather than just giving every employee a copy of Windows and Office,
the employees department gets charged for the licenses and support
they are using.  For example, a call to the help desk for XP issues
would be over $300 per call.  A support call for Linux might be as
little as $30 per call.  In addition, administrative fees and support
fees for just having XP or Linux are similarly proportionally priced.

Full Time Reportinng
Time spent dealing with Windows XP or Office issues, ranging from back-
up and restore to reinstallation of software or Windows, has to be
reported separately on a time sheet.  If this time is from the 40 hour
work week, it's treated similar to "sick time".  If it's done in
ADDITION to the standard 40 hour week, it is considered volunteer
effort, but this gives companies a much better picture of how much
time is spent dealing with Microsoft related issues, and makes a
better case for switching to Linux.

Extra time spent installing and learning to use Linux ad Open Office
are treated like training, since these are new skills that the company
wants to encourage.  Since this training time indicates a willingness
to follow corporate guidelines,   Therefore this is a positive when
considering bonuses, raises, and promotions.


Client Provided software
More consulting firms are now expecting the client to pay for special
software.  If the client is using Vista and/or Office 2007 and won't
share documents in a legacy friendly way, the consultant has to
purchase the software through corporate procurement, and expense it to
the client along with travel and other expenses (at full corporate
price).  This is because too many clients have been "giving" pirated
copies of Vista and Office 2007 to consultants, and the corporate
licenses ONLY apply to permanent employees of the corporation.  The
consulting company is liable to Microsoft for the pirated licenses and
could even face a $10,000 per copy fine for the copyright violation.
In some countries, the penalties for stealing are quite severe,
including the loss of body parts.


Automated License and software audits

Most corporations now have the ability to get a comprehensive list of
who has what software, and many are on the lookout for pirated copies
of Vista or Office 2007.  If it's not on the inventory as a purchased
license, then it's pirated.  Many companies are also asking violators
to come to the data center or customer support depot and have their
laptops re-imaged.  Some corporate desktops can automatically be re-
imaged if pirated software is detected.

There are also some new viruses out that are causing full indexes of
the entire file-system to be generated, and sending the index to some
unknown location on a "trickle" basis.  If your laptop is suddenly
runnig very SLOWLY, this might be why.

Another virus is looking for file-sharing software such as bit-
torrent, if it's found, the virus deletes all mp3 files.  It only
impacts Win2K, XP and Vista users.

Seems like a lot of corporate and hacker forces are starting to make
Windows users really "suffer" for their addiction to Windows.  And
attempts to install Vista are pretty much the road to an
"Intervention".

"

So start with LiveCDs me thinks....

http://www.livecdlist.com
http://www.distrowatch.com

amicus_curious

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Aug 25, 2008, 12:31:18 PM8/25/08
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"7" <website_...@www.enemygadgets.com> wrote in message
news:EeAsk.47874$E41....@text.news.virginmedia.com...
> Roy Schestowitz wrote:
>
This out of date tripe must be an embarassment to the Linux lovers. Here we
have ESR pontificating some 4 years ago about what was going to happen and
nothing at all occurred, showing his complete lack of credibility in the
forcasting department. Why would you bring it up again? You look like a
stupid idiot.

Hadron

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Aug 25, 2008, 12:33:27 PM8/25/08
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"amicus_curious" <AC...@sti.net> writes:

He is a stupid idiot. Notice how all the other "advocates" now have him
killfiled?

bbgruff

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Aug 25, 2008, 1:10:43 PM8/25/08
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amicus_curious wrote:

Funny what you find when you look back 4 years, isn't it?

Try this:-
--------------------------------------
Yeah, sure!
Sure they have a better browser and the only reason that 96% of the world
doesn't use it is that they are too lazy to download it and give it a try!
LOL!!!

The real reason is that it is not any better and for most users it is a
lot worse than anything else that they are using. People do not see it as
worth bending over to pick up off the floor for free. Like a penny laying
under the table on the floor across the aisle!

Some better product. Baloney.
Posted by: amicus_curious Posted on: 06/10/04
-----------------------------------------
http://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-3513-0.html?forumID=1&threadID=3703&messageID=77006&start=-9927

Linonut

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Aug 25, 2008, 1:28:18 PM8/25/08
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* bbgruff peremptorily fired off this memo:

> amicus_curious wrote:
>
>> This out of date tripe must be an embarassment to the Linux lovers. Here we
>> have ESR pontificating some 4 years ago about what was going to happen and
>> nothing at all occurred, showing his complete lack of credibility in the
>> forcasting department. Why would you bring it up again? You look like a
>> stupid idiot.
>
> Funny what you find when you look back 4 years, isn't it?
>
> Try this:-
> --------------------------------------
> Yeah, sure!
> Sure they have a better browser and the only reason that 96% of the world
> doesn't use it is that they are too lazy to download it and give it a try!
> LOL!!!
>
> The real reason is that it is not any better and for most users it is a
> lot worse than anything else that they are using. People do not see it as
> worth bending over to pick up off the floor for free. Like a penny laying
> under the table on the floor across the aisle!
>
> Some better product. Baloney.
> Posted by: amicus_curious Posted on: 06/10/04
> -----------------------------------------
> http://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-3513-0.html?forumID=1&threadID=3703&messageID=77006&start=-9927

LOL!!!

--
Men are always ready to respect anything that bores them.
-- Marilyn Monroe

Moshe Goldfarb.

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Aug 25, 2008, 1:31:31 PM8/25/08
to
On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 18:10:43 +0100, bbgruff wrote:

> amicus_curious wrote:
>
>>
>> "7" <website_...@www.enemygadgets.com> wrote in message
>> news:EeAsk.47874$E41....@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>>> Roy Schestowitz wrote:
>>>
>> This out of date tripe must be an embarassment to the Linux lovers. Here we
>> have ESR pontificating some 4 years ago about what was going to happen and
>> nothing at all occurred, showing his complete lack of credibility in the
>> forcasting department. Why would you bring it up again? You look like a
>> stupid idiot.
>
> Funny what you find when you look back 4 years, isn't it?

Yep.

You can see Linux's desktop market share at just about the same point it is
today.
Less than 1 percent by most stats.

--
Moshe Goldfarb
Collector of soaps from around the globe.
Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

Peter Köhlmann

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Aug 25, 2008, 1:41:29 PM8/25/08
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Hadron stuttered incoherently:

Another fine "true linux advocacy post" from the
"true linux advocate", "kernel hacker", "emacs user", "swapfile expert", "X
specialist", "CUPS guru", "USB-disk server admin", "defragger
professional", "newsreader magician", "hardware maven", "time
coordinator", "email sage" and "OSS culling committee chairman" Hadron
Quark, aka Hans Schneider, aka Richard, aka Damian O'Leary


Notice how you "interpret" in Snot Glasser technique?
That is, your "conclusion" is not backed by *any* facts
--
Experience is what causes a person to make new mistakes instead of
old ones.

7

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Aug 25, 2008, 2:02:26 PM8/25/08
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bbgruff wrote:

BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAA!!!!!!
Thats cracked me up totally!!!!!!!!!

> -----------------------------------------
> http:/
talkback.zdnet.com/5208-3513-0.html?forumID=1&threadID=3703&messageID=77006&start=-9927

JEDIDIAH

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Aug 25, 2008, 1:31:16 PM8/25/08
to
On 2008-08-25, amicus_curious <AC...@sti.net> wrote:
>
> "7" <website_...@www.enemygadgets.com> wrote in message
> news:EeAsk.47874$E41....@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>> Roy Schestowitz wrote:
>>
> This out of date tripe must be an embarassment to the Linux lovers. Here we
> have ESR pontificating some 4 years ago about what was going to happen and

We all got over being embarassed about ESR a LONG time ago...

Compared to St. Ignucious, he really isn't all that anyways.

> nothing at all occurred, showing his complete lack of credibility in the
> forcasting department. Why would you bring it up again? You look like a
> stupid idiot.
>


--

The social cost of suing/prosecuting individuals |||
for non-commercial copyright infringement far outweighs / | \
the social value of copyright to begin with.

Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
----------------------------------------------------------
http://www.usenet.com

bbgruff

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Aug 25, 2008, 2:10:45 PM8/25/08
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Linonut wrote:

> LOL!!!

Yep - it's a bit of a givaway, isn't it?:-)

Roy Schestowitz

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Aug 25, 2008, 3:42:37 PM8/25/08
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____/ 7 on Monday 25 August 2008 18:02 : \____

Yuk. Bill Weisbgerber is a repellent character just as he was 4 years ago.
Probably a very lonely one, too...

- --
~~ Best of wishes

Roy S. Schestowitz | WARNING: /dev/null running out of space
http://Schestowitz.com | Open Prospects | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
Tasks: 146 total, 1 running, 145 sleeping, 0 stopped, 0 zombie
http://iuron.com - knowledge engine, not a search engine


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Roy Schestowitz

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Aug 25, 2008, 3:43:14 PM8/25/08
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____/ bbgruff on Monday 25 August 2008 18:10 : \____

> Linonut wrote:
>
>> LOL!!!
>
> Yep - it's a bit of a givaway, isn't it?:-)

How old was he 4 years ago. Like 5?

- --
~~ Best of wishes

Roy S. Schestowitz | WARNING: /dev/null running out of space
http://Schestowitz.com | Open Prospects | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
Tasks: 146 total, 1 running, 145 sleeping, 0 stopped, 0 zombie
http://iuron.com - knowledge engine, not a search engine

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Ezekiel

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Aug 25, 2008, 3:11:44 PM8/25/08
to

"Roy Schestowitz" <newsg...@schestowitz.com> wrote in message
news:2121301.o...@schestowitz.com...

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> ____/ bbgruff on Monday 25 August 2008 18:10 : \____
>
>> Linonut wrote:
>>
>>> LOL!!!
>>
>> Yep - it's a bit of a givaway, isn't it?:-)
>
> How old was he 4 years ago. Like 5?

Says the child named Roy Schestowitz who has never had a job, never paid his
own bills and who lives in a dorm room while his mommy and daddy pay for his
way through life.


** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

Moshe Goldfarb.

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Aug 25, 2008, 3:17:42 PM8/25/08
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Schestowitz is obviously a leech.

If he ever makes it into the workforce, he will change his tune.

7

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Aug 25, 2008, 3:34:23 PM8/25/08
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Micoshaft asstroturfing fraudster pounding the sock Ezekiel
wrote on behalf of Half Wits from Micoshaft Department of Marketing:


You utter fscked up twat!!
Keep your personal attacks to yourself!
You should talk to the man in the mirror when you write your personal
attacks instead of spilling it out on to the real world on behalf
of asstroturfing purposes for Micoshaft corporation.
Got that asshole?


Ezekiel

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Aug 25, 2008, 3:44:47 PM8/25/08
to

"7" <website_...@www.enemygadgets.com> wrote in message
news:3PDsk.47959$E41....@text.news.virginmedia.com...

It's not a personal attack if it's true.

And it is true. Roy Schestowitz is an unemployed loser. Kind of like you.

amicus_curious

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Aug 25, 2008, 4:02:00 PM8/25/08
to

"bbgruff" <bbg...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:6hg7cfF...@mid.individual.net...

>
> Funny what you find when you look back 4 years, isn't it?
>
Perhaps, but you don't see me dredging it up to embarass my position either.
Whereas, you silly geese tolerate Shestowitz and his magpies doing the very
thing.

Moshe Goldfarb.

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Aug 25, 2008, 4:07:48 PM8/25/08
to

Schestowitz has them all dancing on the end of a rope, like marionettes.
I have to give him credit in that he has managed to dupe quite a few people
in COLA.

Roy Schestowitz

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Aug 25, 2008, 5:05:28 PM8/25/08
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____/ 7 on Monday 25 August 2008 19:34 : \____

Personal attacks in a technical forum are a verification of the truth of the
stories. It means that there's no way to dismiss the message.

They can libel me all they want. I don't see it and I don't let it distract.
Times are too good for GNU/Linux, so getting people's eyes off the ball or
intimidating them is the best Microsoft and its minions can do.

- --
~~ Best of wishes

Google: organising the world's information. Government: reorgnaising
the world's information (censorship) in its favour


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Linonut

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Aug 25, 2008, 4:30:32 PM8/25/08
to
* Moshe Goldfarb. peremptorily fired off this memo:

> On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 18:10:43 +0100, bbgruff wrote:
>
> You can see Linux's desktop market share at just about the same point it is
> today.
> Less than 1 percent by most stats.

But but... you used to say it was 0.24%, now you say it is 1%. So it
has increased 4 times on the desktop!

On the serious side, though, one has to suspect that Microsoft's and
Sun's subsidizing of SCO had some deleterious effect on Linux uptake,
at least by business.

And yet....

--
A small town that cannot support one lawyer can always support two.

Linonut

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Aug 25, 2008, 4:31:37 PM8/25/08
to
* amicus_curious peremptorily fired off this memo:

Cry us a river.

--
QOTD:
"Unlucky? If I bought a pumpkin farm, they'd cancel Halloween."

Linonut

unread,
Aug 25, 2008, 4:32:37 PM8/25/08
to
* Moshe Goldfarb. peremptorily fired off this memo:

> On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 16:02:00 -0400, amicus_curious wrote:
>
>> "bbgruff" <bbg...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>> news:6hg7cfF...@mid.individual.net...
>>>
>>> Funny what you find when you look back 4 years, isn't it?
>>>
>> Perhaps, but you don't see me dredging it up to embarass my position either.
>> Whereas, you silly geese tolerate Shestowitz and his magpies doing the very
>> thing.
>
> Schestowitz has them all dancing on the end of a rope, like marionettes.
> I have to give him credit in that he has managed to dupe quite a few people
> in COLA.

I'll bet you've duped far more people in your Usenet peregrinations.
<grin>

--
When there are two conflicting versions of the story, the wise course
is to believe the one in which people appear at their worst.
-- H. Allen Smith, "Let the Crabgrass Grow"

Moshe Goldfarb.

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Aug 25, 2008, 4:53:26 PM8/25/08
to
On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 16:32:37 -0400, Linonut wrote:

> * Moshe Goldfarb. peremptorily fired off this memo:
>
>> On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 16:02:00 -0400, amicus_curious wrote:
>>
>>> "bbgruff" <bbg...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>>> news:6hg7cfF...@mid.individual.net...
>>>>
>>>> Funny what you find when you look back 4 years, isn't it?
>>>>
>>> Perhaps, but you don't see me dredging it up to embarass my position either.
>>> Whereas, you silly geese tolerate Shestowitz and his magpies doing the very
>>> thing.
>>
>> Schestowitz has them all dancing on the end of a rope, like marionettes.
>> I have to give him credit in that he has managed to dupe quite a few people
>> in COLA.
>
> I'll bet you've duped far more people in your Usenet peregrinations.
> <grin>

I call em' as I see em'.

Tim Smith

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Aug 25, 2008, 5:06:12 PM8/25/08
to
In article <1923972.U...@schestowitz.com>,

Roy Schestowitz <newsg...@schestowitz.com> wrote:
> Personal attacks in a technical forum are a verification of the truth of the
> stories. It means that there's no way to dismiss the message.

So, according to you, we can conclude that when you make personal
attacks on Miguel de Icaza, Rick Jelliffe, Jesper Lund Stocholm, and
many others, it is because you recognize the truth of their arguments
and have no way to refute them?

--
--Tim Smith

Hadron

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Aug 25, 2008, 5:19:19 PM8/25/08
to
Roy Schestowitz <newsg...@schestowitz.com> writes:

> ____/ 7 on Monday 25 August 2008 19:34 : \____
>
>> Micoshaft asstroturfing fraudster pounding the sock Ezekiel
>> wrote on behalf of Half Wits from Micoshaft Department of Marketing:
>>
>>
>>>
>>> "Roy Schestowitz" <newsg...@schestowitz.com> wrote in message
>>> news:2121301.o...@schestowitz.com...
>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>>
>>>> ____/ bbgruff on Monday 25 August 2008 18:10 : \____
>>>>
>>>>> Linonut wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> LOL!!!
>>>>>
>>>>> Yep - it's a bit of a givaway, isn't it?:-)
>>>>
>>>> How old was he 4 years ago. Like 5?
>>>
>>> Says the child named Roy Schestowitz who has never had a job, never paid
>>> his own bills and who lives in a dorm room while his mommy and daddy pay
>>> for his way through life.
>>
>>
>> You utter fscked up twat!!
>> Keep your personal attacks to yourself!
>> You should talk to the man in the mirror when you write your personal
>> attacks instead of spilling it out on to the real world on behalf
>> of asstroturfing purposes for Micoshaft corporation.
>> Got that asshole?
>
> Personal attacks in a technical forum are a verification of the truth of the
> stories. It means that there's no way to dismiss the message.

Like when you killfile people and threaten to have them castrated? You
need help and guidance you silly little boy. You are not exempt from
your own criticisms your fool.

>
> They can libel me all they want. I don't see it and I don't let it
> distract.

Head in the sand.

> Times are too good for GNU/Linux, so getting people's eyes off the ball or
> intimidating them is the best Microsoft and its minions can do.

I am a 100% Linux user give or take and I think you're a bloody
idiot. You lie and twist at every turn in order to pimp your revenue
generating, virus infected web site. You should be ashamed of yourself.


Moshe Goldfarb.

unread,
Aug 25, 2008, 5:22:45 PM8/25/08
to

I always thought that was a given?

Notice how whenever Schestowitz is confronted with facts, or by people who
are more knowledgeable about a particular subject than he is, the usual
method he employs is to attack, discredit and then run from the thread.

7

unread,
Aug 25, 2008, 5:35:24 PM8/25/08
to


You utter fcked up twat!!!

A personal attack is still a personal attack if the material is true or
false. Your ISP AUP does not allow you to conduct personal attacks.
The COLA charter does not allow you to conduct personal attacks.
Your lawer will not allow you to conduct your personal attacks.
If you believe you are in the right, post your full name, address
and work details here, and we will see what becomes of you
and your employer.


Moshe Goldfarb.

unread,
Aug 25, 2008, 5:49:15 PM8/25/08
to

Schestowitz is in need of some serious psychological help.
He has run off the rails from what I can tell.


>>
>> They can libel me all they want. I don't see it and I don't let it
>> distract.
>
> Head in the sand.

Close....

http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/2268/headupass3qu.jpg


>> Times are too good for GNU/Linux, so getting people's eyes off the ball or
>> intimidating them is the best Microsoft and its minions can do.
>
> I am a 100% Linux user give or take and I think you're a bloody
> idiot. You lie and twist at every turn in order to pimp your revenue
> generating, virus infected web site. You should be ashamed of yourself.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, someday Roy Schestowitz is going
to wake up and come to his senses and he is going to realize that he has
squandered a good portion of what most people consider the best part of
their life.
IOW college age, give or take.

He will realize that other people have been using him as a patsy and all
that he thinks he has accomplished when taken in the scheme of things, will
just be nothing more than a fart in the wind.


It will happen, sooner or later.

William Poaster

unread,
Aug 25, 2008, 6:04:35 PM8/25/08
to
On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 16:31:37 -0400, Linonut wrote:

> * amicus_curious peremptorily fired off this memo:
>
>> "bbgruff" <bbg...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>> news:6hg7cfF...@mid.individual.net...
>>>
>>> Funny what you find when you look back 4 years, isn't it?
>>>
>> Perhaps, but you don't see me dredging it up to embarass my position
>> either. Whereas, you silly geese tolerate Shestowitz and his magpies
>> doing the very thing.
>
> Cry us a river.

Ah, Bill Weisgerber, still doing his shill service for M$.


--
ɐ ɯoɹɟ ʇuǝs sɐʍ ǝƃɐssǝɯ sıɥʇ
pǝǝʇuɐɹɐnƃ sı ɥɔıɥʍ ɹǝʇndɯoɔ
˙snɹıʌ ǝzopuıʍ $ɯ ǝɥʇ ɟo ǝǝɹɟ %00⇂
-- sɯǝʇsʎs xnuıl/nuƃ --

Linonut

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Aug 25, 2008, 9:55:33 PM8/25/08
to
* Moshe Goldfarb. peremptorily fired off this memo:

> On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 14:06:12 -0700, Tim Smith wrote:
>
>> In article <1923972.U...@schestowitz.com>,
>> Roy Schestowitz <newsg...@schestowitz.com> wrote:
>>> Personal attacks in a technical forum are a verification of the truth of the
>>> stories. It means that there's no way to dismiss the message.
>>
>> So, according to you, we can conclude that when you make personal
>> attacks on Miguel de Icaza, Rick Jelliffe, Jesper Lund Stocholm, and
>> many others, it is because you recognize the truth of their arguments
>> and have no way to refute them?
>
> I always thought that was a given?
>
> Notice how whenever Schestowitz is confronted with facts, or by people who
> are more knowledgeable about a particular subject than he is, the usual
> method he employs is to attack, discredit and then run from the thread.

I've never seen Roy make a personal attack on someone.

Discredit, maybe.

I don't buy Roy's implication that "personal attacks" ==> "the attackee
speaks truth", though it can happen that way.

--
I think it's a little fantastic to try to form a picture in people's
minds of the Debian archive administration team huddled over their
terminals, their faces lit only by a CRT with a little root shell
prompt and the command
"/project/org/ftp.debian.org/cabal/s3kr1t/nuke-non-free.pl" all keyed
in and ready to go, their fingers poised over the enter key, a sweat of
lustful anticipated beading on their upper lips."
-- Branden Robinson in
<20031104211...@deadbeast.net> discussing
his draft Social Contract amendment

Linonut

unread,
Aug 25, 2008, 9:58:49 PM8/25/08
to
* Moshe Goldfarb. peremptorily fired off this memo:

> On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 23:19:19 +0200, Hadron wrote:
>
>> Like when you killfile people and threaten to have them castrated? You
>> need help and guidance you silly little boy. You are not exempt from
>> your own criticisms your fool.
>
> Schestowitz is in need of some serious psychological help.
> He has run off the rails from what I can tell.
>>

>> I am a 100% Linux user give or take and I think you're a bloody
>> idiot. You lie and twist at every turn in order to pimp your revenue
>> generating, virus infected web site. You should be ashamed of yourself.
>
> I've said it before and I'll say it again, someday Roy Schestowitz is going
> to wake up and come to his senses and he is going to realize that he has
> squandered a good portion of what most people consider the best part of
> their life.
> IOW college age, give or take.
>
> He will realize that other people have been using him as a patsy and all
> that he thinks he has accomplished when taken in the scheme of things, will
> just be nothing more than a fart in the wind.
>
> It will happen, sooner or later.

You guys are even more "off the rails" than Roy, in my opinion <grin>.

He sure gets on your nerves, doesn't he!

--
Q: What's the big deal about rm, I have been deleting stuff for years? And
never lost anything.. oops!
A: ...
-- From the Frequently Unasked Questions

Moshe Goldfarb.

unread,
Aug 25, 2008, 10:14:16 PM8/25/08
to
On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 21:55:33 -0400, Linonut wrote:

> * Moshe Goldfarb. peremptorily fired off this memo:
>
>> On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 14:06:12 -0700, Tim Smith wrote:
>>
>>> In article <1923972.U...@schestowitz.com>,
>>> Roy Schestowitz <newsg...@schestowitz.com> wrote:
>>>> Personal attacks in a technical forum are a verification of the truth of the
>>>> stories. It means that there's no way to dismiss the message.
>>>
>>> So, according to you, we can conclude that when you make personal
>>> attacks on Miguel de Icaza, Rick Jelliffe, Jesper Lund Stocholm, and
>>> many others, it is because you recognize the truth of their arguments
>>> and have no way to refute them?
>>
>> I always thought that was a given?
>>
>> Notice how whenever Schestowitz is confronted with facts, or by people who
>> are more knowledgeable about a particular subject than he is, the usual
>> method he employs is to attack, discredit and then run from the thread.
>
> I've never seen Roy make a personal attack on someone.
>
> Discredit, maybe.

I didn't say "personal attack" I said "attack".


> I don't buy Roy's implication that "personal attacks" ==> "the attackee
> speaks truth", though it can happen that way.

Schestowitz is just trying to justify his tactic of running from hot topics
where he makes statements he can't back up.

Moshe Goldfarb.

unread,
Aug 25, 2008, 10:20:38 PM8/25/08
to
On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 21:58:49 -0400, Linonut wrote:

> * Moshe Goldfarb. peremptorily fired off this memo:
>
>> On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 23:19:19 +0200, Hadron wrote:
>>
>>> Like when you killfile people and threaten to have them castrated? You
>>> need help and guidance you silly little boy. You are not exempt from
>>> your own criticisms your fool.
>>
>> Schestowitz is in need of some serious psychological help.
>> He has run off the rails from what I can tell.
>>>
>>> I am a 100% Linux user give or take and I think you're a bloody
>>> idiot. You lie and twist at every turn in order to pimp your revenue
>>> generating, virus infected web site. You should be ashamed of yourself.
>>
>> I've said it before and I'll say it again, someday Roy Schestowitz is going
>> to wake up and come to his senses and he is going to realize that he has
>> squandered a good portion of what most people consider the best part of
>> their life.
>> IOW college age, give or take.
>>
>> He will realize that other people have been using him as a patsy and all
>> that he thinks he has accomplished when taken in the scheme of things, will
>> just be nothing more than a fart in the wind.
>>
>> It will happen, sooner or later.
>
> You guys are even more "off the rails" than Roy, in my opinion <grin>.

Nope...
The difference between Roy Schestowitz and most of the other people in this
group, [Homer} excepted, is that we don't give a hoot what gets said here,
who said it, how accurate or inaccurate it is nor who it helps or harms.

While we do point out these things, in the grand scheme of things it
doesn't matter at all to us.

Schestowitz on the other hand, has a vested interest in this operation,
amongst others, which is why he is so vigilant about his posting and why
his quantity is sky high.

It's so obvious to anyone who takes the time to look at this group and Roy
Schestowitz in particular, with an open, unbiased mind.


> He sure gets on your nerves, doesn't he!

Are you kidding?
I have him scored way down.

He is ruining *your* group, not mine.
In fact there is some talk on ICQ that Schestowitz might actually be a
Microsoft plant who is reverse trolling to make Linux and Linux advocates
look bad.

Whatever he is up to you can bet it is 100 percent self serving.

Tim Smith

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 1:36:47 PM8/26/08
to
In article <AmJsk.16226$XB4....@bignews9.bellsouth.net>,

Linonut <lin...@bollsouth.nut> wrote:
>
> You guys are even more "off the rails" than Roy, in my opinion <grin>.

It's hard to get more off the rails than this:

Thereąs a good document about Microsoftąs call for łJihad˛. Itąs
referring to merciless marketing.

I showed this to Marc Fleury and believe it or not, he didnąt buy
it. He made a deal with Microsoft in the past. He has an XBox.

OMG! Marc Fleury has an XBox! Microsoft got to him!

It's also pretty off the rails to claim that all of these organizations
are pro-MS shills:

New York Times
Motley Fool
Time
CNN

You want a really far off the rails example? Consider this article on
the battle between Adobe and Microsoft over interactive web technologies:

<http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/feedarticle/7746031>

A fairly straightforward article. Roy sees it as an MS advertisement,
and so investigates the author, and finds this:

<http://www.journalisted.com/daisuke-wakabayashi>

and is making a big deal of the fact that it lists that author as having
written more about MS than anything else. He completely overlooks the
fact that the author only had two prior stories. One was about the
Yahoo/Google ad deal that was made during the Microsoft/Google takeover
attempt, and the other was about the Halo 3 launch.

So, a tech journalists writes two articles that have something to do
with Microsoft, and that's enough in Roy's eyes to make him suspect?

--
--Tim Smith

Moshe Goldfarb.

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 1:51:02 PM8/26/08
to

Now add in all the other crap Schestowitz is up to and tell me again how he
is not being paid for this full time *evangelist* position.

Geoff M. Fitton

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 1:55:11 PM8/26/08
to
On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 16:31:37 -0400, Linonut wrote:

> * amicus_curious peremptorily fired off this memo:
>
>> "bbgruff" <bbg...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>> news:6hg7cfF...@mid.individual.net...
>>>
>>> Funny what you find when you look back 4 years, isn't it?
>>>
>> Perhaps, but you don't see me dredging it up to embarass my position
>> either. Whereas, you silly geese tolerate Shestowitz and his magpies
>> doing the very thing.
>
> Cry us a river.

Ah, Bill Weisgerber, still doing his shill service for M$.


--
? ?o?? ?u?s s?? ???ss?? si??
p???u???n? si ??i?? ???nd?o?
?sn?i? ?zopui? $? ??? ?o ???? %00?
-- s???s?s xnuil/nu? --


Tim Smith

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 2:41:04 PM8/26/08
to
In article <wjJsk.16223$XB4....@bignews9.bellsouth.net>,

Linonut <lin...@bollsouth.nut> wrote:
> >> So, according to you, we can conclude that when you make personal
> >> attacks on Miguel de Icaza, Rick Jelliffe, Jesper Lund Stocholm, and
> >> many others, it is because you recognize the truth of their arguments
> >> and have no way to refute them?
> >
> > I always thought that was a given?
> >
> > Notice how whenever Schestowitz is confronted with facts, or by people who
> > are more knowledgeable about a particular subject than he is, the usual
> > method he employs is to attack, discredit and then run from the thread.
>
> I've never seen Roy make a personal attack on someone.
>
> Discredit, maybe.

You don't consider accusing people of accepting bribes for their
technical opinions to be a personal attack?

That could only be considering discrediting, rather than a personal
attack, if he had actual evidence. And no, the fact that their
technical opinions disagree with him is not evidence.

--
--Tim Smith

Moshe Goldfarb.

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 2:52:37 PM8/26/08
to

Evidence is not a word in Schestowitz's vocabulary.

His goal in life is to seed Google and other search engines with
sensational subject lines hoping that people won't bother to check his
sources.

Linonut

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 2:54:21 PM8/26/08
to
* Tim Smith peremptorily fired off this memo:

How do I know you're not completely misrepresenting Roy's positions
here?

--
You know the great thing about TV? If something important happens
anywhere at all in the world, no matter what time of the day or night,
you can always change the channel.
-- Jim Ignatowski

Linonut

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 2:54:50 PM8/26/08
to
* Moshe Goldfarb. peremptorily fired off this memo:

> On Tue, 26 Aug 2008 10:36:47 -0700, Tim Smith wrote:
>
> Now add in all the other crap Schestowitz is up to and tell me again how he
> is not being paid for this full time *evangelist* position.

Ask Roy, not me.

--
Life is a series of rude awakenings.
-- R. V. Winkle

Moshe Goldfarb.

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 2:57:26 PM8/26/08
to
On Tue, 26 Aug 2008 14:54:50 -0400, Linonut wrote:

> * Moshe Goldfarb. peremptorily fired off this memo:
>
>> On Tue, 26 Aug 2008 10:36:47 -0700, Tim Smith wrote:
>>
>> Now add in all the other crap Schestowitz is up to and tell me again how he
>> is not being paid for this full time *evangelist* position.
>
> Ask Roy, not me.

I don't have to because I already know the answer.

Linonut

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 2:57:32 PM8/26/08
to
* Tim Smith peremptorily fired off this memo:

> In article <wjJsk.16223$XB4....@bignews9.bellsouth.net>,
> Linonut <lin...@bollsouth.nut> wrote:
>> > I always thought that was a given?
>> >
>> > Notice how whenever Schestowitz is confronted with facts, or by people who
>> > are more knowledgeable about a particular subject than he is, the usual
>> > method he employs is to attack, discredit and then run from the thread.
>>
>> I've never seen Roy make a personal attack on someone.
>>
>> Discredit, maybe.
>
> You don't consider accusing people of accepting bribes for their
> technical opinions to be a personal attack?

Who knows? If you have a quote, I'd be happy to give my opinion. But
I'm not sure I can trust your characterizations here, or that you're
providing all the necessary context to understand it.

Based on what I've seen, Roy is a gentle puppy dog compared to some of
his "opposition".

> That could only be considering discrediting, rather than a personal
> attack, if he had actual evidence. And no, the fact that their
> technical opinions disagree with him is not evidence.

Sounds like what you (or is it Erik) try to imply about Rob Sutor and
others.

--
One good reason why computers can do more work than people is that they
never have to stop and answer the phone.

chrisv

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 4:02:35 PM8/26/08
to
Linonut wrote:

> mentally-ill troll wrote:
>>
>> Now add in all the other crap Schestowitz is up to and tell me again how he
>> is not being paid for this full time *evangelist* position.
>
>Ask Roy, not me.

These trolls do have a habit of asking the wrong person. Timmy asked
me to explain "exactly" why something that Roy (supposedly) did was
Linux advocacy. When I deflected the loaded, biased question by
making the point that Timmy wasn't advocating Linux, Timmy claimed
that I was "running away from" his loaded question about Roy's
behavior, as if I'm obligated to defend Roy.

Roy Schestowitz

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 5:03:51 PM8/26/08
to
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

____/ Linonut on Tuesday 26 August 2008 18:54 : \____

> * Tim Smith peremptorily fired off this memo:
>
>> In article <AmJsk.16226$XB4....@bignews9.bellsouth.net>,
>> Linonut <lin...@bollsouth.nut> wrote:
>>>
>>> You guys are even more "off the rails" than Roy, in my opinion <grin>.
>>
>> It's hard to get more off the rails than this:
>>

>> There¹s a good document about Microsoft¹s call for ³Jihad². It¹s
>> referring to merciless marketing.
>>
>> I showed this to Marc Fleury and believe it or not, he didn¹t buy


>> it. He made a deal with Microsoft in the past. He has an XBox.
>>
>> OMG! Marc Fleury has an XBox! Microsoft got to him!
>>
>> It's also pretty off the rails to claim that all of these organizations
>> are pro-MS shills:
>>
>> New York Times
>> Motley Fool
>> Time
>> CNN
>>
>> You want a really far off the rails example? Consider this article on
>> the battle between Adobe and Microsoft over interactive web technologies:
>>
>> <http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/feedarticle/7746031>
>>
>> A fairly straightforward article. Roy sees it as an MS advertisement,
>> and so investigates the author, and finds this:
>>
>> <http://www.journalisted.com/daisuke-wakabayashi>
>>
>> and is making a big deal of the fact that it lists that author as having
>> written more about MS than anything else. He completely overlooks the
>> fact that the author only had two prior stories. One was about the
>> Yahoo/Google ad deal that was made during the Microsoft/Google takeover
>> attempt, and the other was about the Halo 3 launch.
>>
>> So, a tech journalists writes two articles that have something to do
>> with Microsoft, and that's enough in Roy's eyes to make him suspect?
>
> How do I know you're not completely misrepresenting Roy's positions
> here?

*LMAO*

Timmy is now stalking in IRC channels too. Who pays him to spend all that time
chasing tails?

- --
"There's a lot of Linux out there -- much more than Microsoft generally signals
publicly -- and their customers are using it..." --Paul DeGroot, a Directions
On Microsoft analyst.


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Moshe Goldfarb.

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Aug 26, 2008, 4:18:51 PM8/26/08
to
On Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:03:51 +0000, Roy Schestowitz wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> ____/ Linonut on Tuesday 26 August 2008 18:54 : \____
>
>> * Tim Smith peremptorily fired off this memo:
>>
>>> In article <AmJsk.16226$XB4....@bignews9.bellsouth.net>,
>>> Linonut <lin...@bollsouth.nut> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> You guys are even more "off the rails" than Roy, in my opinion <grin>.
>>>
>>> It's hard to get more off the rails than this:
>>>

>>> Thereąs a good document about Microsoftąs call for łJihad˛. Itąs

>>> referring to merciless marketing.
>>>
>>> I showed this to Marc Fleury and believe it or not, he didnąt buy

Things getting a bit warm for you Schestowitz?
They should be.........

Tim Smith

unread,
Aug 26, 2008, 9:01:00 PM8/26/08