Linux vs Windows poll results released.

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Bojan Zdravkovic

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Nov 9, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/9/98
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There was a Linux vs Windows poll taken maybe a month ago. Althogh I was
glad to see the results, I was surprised that only 602 people did
actually take the poll. Anyhow, here's the URL so you can see for
yourself:

http://www.WebCMO.com/linux/linux.htm

Some interesting quotes:

"If there is one thing in this world that makes Bill Gates nervous, it
must be Linux."

"In Bill Gates' game, the size of a company is not the concern. The size
does not determine whether Microsoft can win the competition."

"The Open Linux spirit makes Linux undefeatable. Bill Gates can buy or
destroy a company, but he is unable to buy or destroy a spirit."

Best regards,

Bojan Zdravkovic
bzdr...@nt.com
bzdr...@nortel.ca

Stephen Edwards

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Nov 9, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/9/98
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Bojan Zdravkovic <boj...@ngfc.com> wrote:

: "The Open Linux spirit makes Linux undefeatable. Bill Gates can buy or


: destroy a company, but he is unable to buy or destroy a spirit."

Oh, how fugging pathetic. Next thing you know, people will be wearing
"L"s on gold chains around their necks, and praising Linus Torvald's
sacrifices and teachings. That's almost as bad as this one:

"I want Linux to become a part of my computing life..." -- some idiot in
EFnet #Linux.

The Linux community has reached a new level of idiocy. I miss the old
days, when those of us who used Linux, didn't give a crap what other
people used. Now the Linux community is full of "preachers" who've "come
to save our souls".

Pardon me, whilst I barf. Thank God, SuSE doesn't appeal to lusers.

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Christopher Browne

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Nov 10, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/10/98
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On 9 Nov 1998 21:33:51 GMT, Stephen Edwards <ja20...@primenet.com> wrote:
>Bojan Zdravkovic <boj...@ngfc.com> wrote:
>: "The Open Linux spirit makes Linux undefeatable. Bill Gates can buy or
>: destroy a company, but he is unable to buy or destroy a spirit."
>
>Oh, how fugging pathetic. Next thing you know, people will be wearing
>"L"s on gold chains around their necks, and praising Linus Torvald's
>sacrifices and teachings.

That's penguins on gold chains, thank you very much :-).

(Informix gave me a penguin at the ALS. That's the only stuffed penguin
I have.)

>That's almost as bad as this one:
>
>"I want Linux to become a part of my computing life..." -- some idiot in
>EFnet #Linux.
>
>The Linux community has reached a new level of idiocy. I miss the old
>days, when those of us who used Linux, didn't give a crap what other
>people used. Now the Linux community is full of "preachers" who've "come
>to save our souls".

If you look carefully at those that started the free software movement
(RMS in particular), you do see a quantity of what have to be regarded
as "prophets."

Right now, it is *cool* in the Linux community to be a prophet, bearing
the message of what needs to come forth to smite the evils of Redmond.

On the one hand, I thought that RMS spent far too much time at the ALS
putting on his "St. IGNUcious Halo." If he puts on and takes off the
halo too often, it starts to make it of less significance whether as
joke or as a serious matter. (Possibly in comparable fashion to "adult
entertainers" who put on and take off other sorts of garments on a
continual basis, but that would be serious digression...)

And there were assortedly some other "counter-cultural prophets"
(although is it really being "nonconformant" when everyone in the group
conforms to similar standards of "looking strange"?) as well as a
variety conforming to the UNIX approach of having long hair and beard.
And then the Californian business folk acting as "suited prophets" to
lead us into the land flowing with commercial viability...

In short, there was quite a show of "prophets," whether from IDG, the
FSF, Debian, Oracle, Corel, KDE, GNOME, or IDG.

Unfortunately, each of these groups of "prophets" are actively
evangelizing, and it unfortunately reads a whole lot like:

"Choose ye this day whom ye shall serve. Choose carefully, for the
other prophets may counsel deception!"

I think there is *some* degree of legitimacy to this. Free Software
came about as a significant force out of an intent for a better culture.
Which is to say that there is more to it than merely technology.

But hopefully the "honeymoon" will be over soon and the prophets will go
home and be quiet.

[Those that think that all this pseudo-religious fervor is completely
inappropriate in a "marketplace" should note that Apple and Microsoft
both have been known to advertise for positions entitled "Evangelists."
I find this appalling, personally...]

--
Where do you *not* want to go today? "Confutatis maledictis, flammis
acribus addictis" (<http://www.hex.net/~cbbrowne/msprobs.html>
cbbr...@ntlug.org- <http://www.ntlug.org/~cbbrowne/lsf.html>

Linus Torvalds

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Nov 10, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/10/98
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In article <727n3v$r7j$2...@nnrp03.primenet.com>,

Stephen Edwards <ja20...@primenet.com> wrote:
>
>Oh, how fugging pathetic. Next thing you know, people will be wearing
>"L"s on gold chains around their necks, and praising Linus Torvald's
>sacrifices and teachings.

What the h*ll? They don't already?

Grumble.

Linus

Con Tiki

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Nov 10, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/10/98
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I believe your sig file says this:

> Please send all flames, trolls, and complaints to /dev/toilet.
>

Well your Troll blocked the toilet, Sir.
---------

Stephen Edwards wrote:

> Bojan Zdravkovic <boj...@ngfc.com> wrote:
>
> : "The Open Linux spirit makes Linux undefeatable. Bill Gates can buy or
> : destroy a company, but he is unable to buy or destroy a spirit."
>

> Oh, how [*******] pathetic. Next thing you know, people will be wearing


> "L"s on gold chains around their necks, and praising Linus Torvald's

> sacrifices and teachings. That's almost as bad as this one:


>
> "I want Linux to become a part of my computing life..." -- some idiot in
> EFnet #Linux.
>
> The Linux community has reached a new level of idiocy. I miss the old

> days, when those of us who used Linux, didn't give a [****] what other


> people used. Now the Linux community is full of "preachers" who've "come
> to save our souls".
>

> Pardon me, whilst I [***]. Thank God, SuSE doesn't appeal to [*****].


>
> [] Footnote server is currently down...
> --
> .-----.
> |[_] :| Stephen S. Edwards II | http://www.primenet.com/~rakmount
> | = :| Support the shareware authors... register your software!
> | | Please send all flames, trolls, and complaints to /dev/toilet.

> |_..._| [*****]: I have a problem. ADMIN: Keep talking... I'm reloading.

--
"Monkey see, Monkey do."
"OUCH~OUCH~OUCH" >>>>> C/T<<<<
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Stephen Edwards

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Nov 10, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/10/98
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Christopher Browne <cbbr...@hex.net> wrote:

: On 9 Nov 1998 21:33:51 GMT, Stephen Edwards <ja20...@primenet.com> wrote:
: >Bojan Zdravkovic <boj...@ngfc.com> wrote:
: >: "The Open Linux spirit makes Linux undefeatable. Bill Gates can buy or
: >: destroy a company, but he is unable to buy or destroy a spirit."
: >
: >Oh, how fugging pathetic. Next thing you know, people will be wearing

: >"L"s on gold chains around their necks, and praising Linus Torvald's
: >sacrifices and teachings.

: That's penguins on gold chains, thank you very much :-).

Hmmm... if we turn the penguin upside-down, will Linux boxen everywhere
crash? :)

: (Informix gave me a penguin at the ALS. That's the only stuffed penguin
: I have.)

Well, now that IS cool. A mascot is a fantastic way to "spread the word".
Look at BSD and Chuck.

: >That's almost as bad as this one:


: >
: >"I want Linux to become a part of my computing life..." -- some idiot in
: >EFnet #Linux.
: >
: >The Linux community has reached a new level of idiocy. I miss the old

: >days, when those of us who used Linux, didn't give a crap what other


: >people used. Now the Linux community is full of "preachers" who've "come
: >to save our souls".

: If you look carefully at those that started the free software movement


: (RMS in particular), you do see a quantity of what have to be regarded
: as "prophets."

I suppose it's merely perception then. Myself, I see a group of
enthusiastic, generous, highly intelligent software engineers who are in
it for the thrill, and not the money. But I see no logic in turning the
Freeware/OpenSource movement into some sort of religion... after all,
these silly little devices are just that... _devices_. To me, someone who
says "I am incredibly excited about Linux, and what it can do", is an
enthusiast... someone who states "Linux will reveal much about the
Microsoft conspiracy, and it shall release unprecedented punishment on
those who stand in its way... so it is written, so it shall be done", is
an idiot.

: Right now, it is *cool* in the Linux community to be a prophet, bearing


: the message of what needs to come forth to smite the evils of Redmond.

I remember those days. I remember when Windows and Macintosh users would
come into the newsgroup, and begin spouting off about how freeware would
fail, and that Linux was a "pipe-dream". And yes, those people were
idiots, but not because of the OS they were using... they were just born
that way, *smirk* and I certainly don't remember getting mushy, goosey,
and evangelical about it.

But seriously, as it has been stated by many before me, I think this
raving lunacy about "the coming of Linux" should stop. If anything, it's
going to make us look like a bunch of paranoid schizophrenics (holy moley,
did I spell that right?). Microsoft tends to retain a certian level of
dignity in the eyes of the general public, despite their rather
less-than-ethical business practices, by simply not saying too much.

: And there were assortedly some other "counter-cultural prophets"


: (although is it really being "nonconformant" when everyone in the group
: conforms to similar standards of "looking strange"?) as well as a
: variety conforming to the UNIX approach of having long hair and beard.
: And then the Californian business folk acting as "suited prophets" to
: lead us into the land flowing with commercial viability...

: In short, there was quite a show of "prophets," whether from IDG, the
: FSF, Debian, Oracle, Corel, KDE, GNOME, or IDG.

: Unfortunately, each of these groups of "prophets" are actively
: evangelizing, and it unfortunately reads a whole lot like:

: "Choose ye this day whom ye shall serve. Choose carefully, for the
: other prophets may counsel deception!"

So what it comes down to is, I really hate people telling me what I
_SHOULD_ be doing, when I _KNOW_ what I want to do... and frankly, I don't
think that I'm much different from most well informed people.
Zealous Linux/UNIX users tend blindly assume that just because someone
uses Windows, or a Macintosh, that they are stupid, evil people, and that
they should be discounted as idiots.

But there are plenty of people like myself, who are well informed
about operating systems, how they work, and what they are most useful for,
who use *gasp* Windows in parallel with Linux. John Wiltshire is one of
the most clueful presences I've ever come across on USENET... what does he
use?... WindowsNT primarly, last I heard. One of the gentlemen that I
moderate the EFNet #Linux IRC channel with uses Macintoshes primarily,
despite his being a Linux enthusiast, and he knows his stuff believe me.

: I think there is *some* degree of legitimacy to this. Free Software


: came about as a significant force out of an intent for a better culture.
: Which is to say that there is more to it than merely technology.

Oh I agree 100% here. I think that there is a sort of "brotherhood" in
the freeware community, and it's quite a thing to see. And yes, it is
special, I think. But it's not something that I'll sing about in church.

: But hopefully the "honeymoon" will be over soon and the prophets will go
: home and be quiet.

Lets hope... PHBs in suits praising "the Linux movement" makes me feel
rather ill, somehow.

: [Those that think that all this pseudo-religious fervor is completely


: inappropriate in a "marketplace" should note that Apple and Microsoft
: both have been known to advertise for positions entitled "Evangelists."
: I find this appalling, personally...]

As do I. I gained a new respect for Steve Jobs after watching him in
"Triumph of the Nerds", as he seemed to have a much calmer, rational
approach to his opinions. However, I was reminded of his rabid tendencies
when they showed several clips of his product launches and demos... he
seemed rather arrogant, and smug, which I _DON'T_ like at all. Many of
today's Linux users seem to have a similar attitude, and it's highly
annoying. What makes me ROTFLMAO is when people who use OS/2 spout off
about "Microsoft World Domination"... guess they are too young to remember
the earlier glory days of Big Blue(tm), when Microsoft was the "underdog".
:)

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Stephen Edwards

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Nov 10, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/10/98
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Linus Torvalds <torv...@transmeta.com> wrote:
: In article <727n3v$r7j$2...@nnrp03.primenet.com>,

: Stephen Edwards <ja20...@primenet.com> wrote:
: >
: >Oh, how fugging pathetic. Next thing you know, people will be wearing
: >"L"s on gold chains around their necks, and praising Linus Torvald's
: >sacrifices and teachings.

: What the h*ll? They don't already?

: Grumble.

I have a rather unsettling premoniton of a couple of PHBs wearing white
shirts, and black pants ringing my doorbell at 6:30 in the morning on a
Saturday, while toting a Yggdrasil manual under their arms, and saying:

"Good morning, brother... Do you beleive in UNIX?"

You're scaring me, Linus.

Stephen Edwards

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Nov 10, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/10/98
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Con-tiki <con-ti...@geocities.com> wrote:
: I believe your sig file says this:

: > Please send all flames, trolls, and complaints to /dev/toilet.
: >
: Well your Troll blocked the toilet, Sir.

Troll?... That wasn't a troll.

--
"Monkey see, Monkey do."
"OUCH~OUCH~OUCH" >>>>> C/T<<<<
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Now _THAT'S_ a troll. Hello pot, I'm the kettle.

je...@dementia.mishnet

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Nov 10, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/10/98
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On 10 Nov 1998 05:56:51 GMT, Linus Torvalds <torv...@transmeta.com> wrote:
>In article <727n3v$r7j$2...@nnrp03.primenet.com>,
>Stephen Edwards <ja20...@primenet.com> wrote:
>>
>>Oh, how fugging pathetic. Next thing you know, people will be wearing
>>"L"s on gold chains around their necks, and praising Linus Torvald's
>>sacrifices and teachings.
>
>What the h*ll? They don't already?
>
>Grumble.

The wife seems to think that Tux is an approximate
portrait of you, so in a certain sense I guess some
of us already are...

Anyone get their tshirts from that South African's
contest yet?

>
> Linus

Did you get my invite?

The Star Trek experience is really cool the first time...

--
Unix had startmenus and tasbars before Microsoft |||
even had a decent memory manager for DOS. / | \

In search of sane PPP docs? Try http://penguin.lvcm.com

Con Tiki

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Nov 11, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/11/98
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Stephen Edwards wrote:

> Con-tiki <con-ti...@geocities.com> wrote:
> : I believe your sig file says this:
>
> : > Please send all flames, trolls, and complaints to /dev/toilet.
> : >
> : Well your Troll blocked the toilet, Sir.
>
> Troll?... That wasn't a troll.

Oh well. It came across as a troll to me. Maybe I am overzealous in my
definition of a troll...

> --
> "Monkey see, Monkey do."
> "OUCH~OUCH~OUCH" >>>>> C/T<<<<
> mailto:con-ti...@geocities.com
> See: http://www.linuxhelp.org + http://www.mozilla.org
> <script language="JavaScript">
> if (window.navigator.appName == "Microsoft Internet Explorer") {
> location.href = "http://msbc.simplenet.com/ierror"; }
> </script>
> --
>
> Now _THAT'S_ a troll.

My signature file is a troll !!?

> Hello pot, I'm the kettle.

What does that mean?

> [] Footnote server is currently down...
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> .-----.
> |[_] :| Stephen S. Edwards II | http://www.primenet.com/~rakmount
> | = :| Support the shareware authors... register your software!
> | | Please send all flames, trolls, and complaints to /dev/toilet.

> |_..._| [*****]: I have a problem. ADMIN: Keep talking... I'm reloading.

thx

Michael

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Nov 11, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/11/98
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Christopher Browne wrote:
>
> That's penguins on gold chains, thank you very much :-).
>

Hey, thats a good idea...

I wonder how much I could make those for. Any buyers? *rubs hands together
greedily*

{:-)

Xerophyte

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Nov 11, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/11/98
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Stephen Edwards wrote:
>
> Bojan Zdravkovic <boj...@ngfc.com> wrote:
>
> : "The Open Linux spirit makes Linux undefeatable. Bill Gates can buy or
> : destroy a company, but he is unable to buy or destroy a spirit."
>

> Oh, how fugging pathetic. Next thing you know, people will be wearing
> "L"s on gold chains around their necks, and praising Linus Torvald's

> sacrifices and teachings. That's almost as bad as this one:

Why "fugging" not? Plenty o' people wear "M" on justabout every part of
their bodies and praise the concept of "kill or be killed unless you're
too large, then it's okay" while NOT looking at the real facts. If
corporations had to face the same laws as humans, Microsoft would get
the electric chair, and Bill Gates would be on trial for countless
number of WAR CRIMES he has committed.

> "I want Linux to become a part of my computing life..." -- some idiot in
> EFnet #Linux.
>
> The Linux community has reached a new level of idiocy. I miss the old
> days, when those of us who used Linux, didn't give a crap what other
> people used. Now the Linux community is full of "preachers" who've "come
> to save our souls".

The person who said "I want Linux to become part of my computing
life..." is an idiot. That does not mean every Linux user is. Stop the
prejudice, por favor. And maybe their preachings are justified,
perhaps?

> Pardon me, whilst I barf. Thank God, SuSE doesn't appeal to lusers.

Shall I get and hold the little bag for you?

That's why I have System Commander to boot between "Winbloat NT 4.0" and
SuSE Linux 5.3 Commercial edition. :-)

Toon Moene

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Nov 11, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/11/98
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Stephen Edwards <ja20...@primenet.com> wrote:

> I have a rather unsettling premoniton of a couple of PHBs wearing white
> shirts, and black pants ringing my doorbell at 6:30 in the morning on a
> Saturday, while toting a Yggdrasil manual under their arms, and saying:

> "Good morning, brother... Do you beleive in UNIX?"

Why ?

Linux will just be shoved down your throat^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H sold to you
preinstalled with Intel hardware.

Now try to beat *that* monopoly.

--
Toon Moene (mailto:to...@moene.indiv.nluug.nl)
Saturnushof 14, 3738 XG Maartensdijk, The Netherlands
Phone: +31 346 214290; Fax: +31 346 214286
g77 Support: mailto:for...@gnu.org; egcs: mailto:egcs...@cygnus.com

Mark Woodward

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Nov 11, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/11/98
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Really think about it, if you were trying to start a religion, would you want people like us for followers? No way, get idiots they'll believe what you want them to, and you won't even have to prove it.

We'll just wear the penguin because it is cute.
 

Linus Torvalds wrote:

In article <727n3v$r7j$2...@nnrp03.primenet.com>,
Stephen Edwards  <ja20...@primenet.com> wrote:
>

>Oh, how fugging pathetic.  Next thing you know, people will be wearing
>"L"s on gold chains around their necks, and praising Linus Torvald's
>sacrifices and teachings.

What the h*ll? They don't already?

Grumble.

                Linus

-- 
Mohawk Software
Expert Solutions Now! Windows 95, Windows NT, UNIX, 
Linux. Applications, drivers, support. 
Visit the Mohawk Software website: www.mohawksoft.com
 

FoulDragon

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Nov 12, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/12/98
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>> Oh, how fugging pathetic. Next thing you know, people will be wearing
>> "L"s on gold chains around their necks, and praising Linus Torvald's
>> sacrifices and teachings. That's almost as bad as this one:

Too late on the latter... although the former is still in the staging phase.


--
Marada Coeurfuege Shra'drakaii Dra'torrinah(Clan Nightwings)
members.xoom.com/marada Colony name not needed in address.
'Security and freedom negate one another, yet we must secure our freedom.'

Jim & Bob Nixon

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Nov 13, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/13/98
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Bojan Zdravkovic <boj...@ngfc.com> wrote:

>There was a Linux vs Windows poll taken maybe a month ago. Althogh I was
>glad to see the results, I was surprised that only 602 people did
>actually take the poll. Anyhow, here's the URL so you can see for
>yourself:

All 602 were linux advocates, because most MS users never heard
of linux. Please wake up and smell the coffee.


Bob Nixon
big...@home.com
ezr...@primenet.com
das...@aztec.asu.edu

Bart

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Nov 14, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/14/98
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A poll of 602 people don't mean squat. Try some sampling, and get some
real results.

Bojan Zdravkovic wrote:
>
> There was a Linux vs Windows poll taken maybe a month ago. Althogh I was
> glad to see the results, I was surprised that only 602 people did
> actually take the poll. Anyhow, here's the URL so you can see for
> yourself:
>

> http://www.WebCMO.com/linux/linux.htm
>
> Some interesting quotes:
>
> "If there is one thing in this world that makes Bill Gates nervous, it
> must be Linux."
>
> "In Bill Gates' game, the size of a company is not the concern. The size
> does not determine whether Microsoft can win the competition."
>

> "The Open Linux spirit makes Linux undefeatable. Bill Gates can buy or
> destroy a company, but he is unable to buy or destroy a spirit."
>

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