Installing iOS 12 on my iPad forced an iTunes upgrade on my Mac

[Juan I. Cahis]

Dear friends:

I installed yesterday iOS 12 directly on my iPad Pro without any problem.
But today, when I connected it to my Mac in order to backup it, it forced
an iTunes upgrade.

The software of my Mac was fully up to date, previously to connect the iPad
to it, I updated all the apps installed in my Mac, including an update to
Safari released today.

My question is why the iTunes update was not included in the standard Mac
update? Is it because maybe is a “provisory update”, and Apple is not sure
to release it to all Mac users?

Any hint?

--
Enviado desde mi iPad usando NewsTap, Juan I. Cahis, Santiago de Chile.

[David Empson]

Juan I. Cahis <jicahis....@gmail.com> wrote:

> I installed yesterday iOS 12 directly on my iPad Pro without any problem.
> But today, when I connected it to my Mac in order to backup it, it forced
> an iTunes upgrade.

Every prior major iOS update has required an updated version of iTunes
to support the new iOS version.

With iOS 12 and Macs, this is being handled a little differently from
past versions. (See below for details.)

Windows users need to be running iTunes 12.9, which adds iOS 12 support,
but that iTunes version has not yet been released for the Mac.

> The software of my Mac was fully up to date, previously to connect the iPad
> to it, I updated all the apps installed in my Mac, including an update to
> Safari released today.

For Mac users wanting to use iTunes to manage iOS devices, iOS 12
requires:

1. OS X El Capitan 10.11.4 or any later version (including macOS Sierra,
High Sierra, Mojave and future versions).

2. Either iTunes 12.6.5 or iTunes 12.8, or a later version on either
branch.

iTunes 12.8 is the latest version (for the Mac), normally delivered via
Software Update (App Store). It runs on OS X Yosemite 10.10.5 through
macOS High Sierra 10.13.6, but Yosemite will not be able to access iOS
12 devices with iTunes 12. (All Macs that are running Yosemite can
upgrade at least to El Capitan.)

iTunes 12.6.5 is the latest version of the special branch that started
with iTunes 12.6.3, which retains support for managing apps and access
to the iOS App Store (which was removed from the mainstream version as
of iTunes 12.7).

Once a version on this branch is installed, Software Update (App Store)
stops offering you iTunes updates. Later versions of iTunes 12.6.x need
to be installed manually, and if you want to go back to the mainstream
version of iTunes you need to install that manually.

If you are already running iTunes 12.7 or later, downgrading to iTunes
12.6.x is somewhat tricky because it doesn't support the newer iTunes
library format used by later versions.

You can get the latest version of iTunes 12.6.x here:

https://support.apple.com/HT208079

Judging from its installer, iTunes 12.6.5 also runs on OS X Yosemite
10.10.5 through macOS High Sierra 10.13.6, but not on macOS Mojave.

I haven't tested whether iTunes 12.6.5 on Yosemite is able to support
iOS 12 devices.

3. If you are running iTunes 12.8 or later, you need an update for the
mobile device support in macOS.

When you first plug a device running iOS 12 into a Mac running OS X
10.11.4 or later and iTunes 12.8 or later, the computer prompts you to
install an update as described here:

https://support.apple.com/HT208831

The mobile device support was previously included as part of iTunes, and
a required iTunes update was released at the same time as the new iOS
version.

The old method is still being used for iTunes 12.6.5 and iTunes 12.9 for
Windows, but iTunes 12.8 for Mac has revised the structure.

> My question is why the iTunes update was not included in the standard Mac
> update? Is it because maybe is a "provisory update", and Apple is not sure
> to release it to all Mac users?
>
> Any hint?

I expect the reason for that change is that Apple wanted to decouple
major iTunes updates from iOS releases. By separating out the mobile
device support, the iTunes application no longer needs a featureless
update just to add support for a new iOS version. Due to the developer
and public beta period for iOS, the new method means Apple no longer
needs to do extra work to support a pre-release iOS version in the "old"
version of iTunes.

Hunting through the installers, I found that the mobile device updater
was added in iTunes 12.8. It is launched from here:

/System/Library/LaunchAgents/com.apple.mobiledeviceupdater.plist

The iTunes 12.8 installer will refuse to install on Mojave, so I expect
iTunes 12.9 for the Mac will be released at the same time as Mojave, and
will drop support for Yosemite but will run on El Capitan, Sierra and
High Sierra.

--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz

[Chris]

Juan I. Cahis <jicahis....@gmail.com> wrote:

> Dear friends:
Hello

> I installed yesterday iOS 12 directly on my iPad Pro without any problem.
> But today, when I connected it to my Mac in order to backup it, it forced
> an iTunes upgrade.

I installed iOS 12 on my iPad with iTunes and the iTunes upgrade was
made before the uploading of iOS 12.
[...]
> Any hint?
I suppose that it's to ensure compatibility between iTunes and iOS 12?

--
Veuillez multidupliquer le convertisseur
instable avant d'ajuster sciemment.

[Erilar]

Thanks for the warnings! I called Apple yesterday about “updates” and was
assured that I could leap to whatever version the current one might be,
because I have read the “improvements” for the last several, and not one
“updated” anything I own or could use. I do use iTunes, so I have even less
reason to install this thing! Until something I actually need and use
regularly requires it, I’ll just sit here in my Luddite oasis.

--
biblioholic medievalist via iPad

[nospam]

In article <1nvdxbx.pr6lcs1eymye4N%dem...@actrix.gen.nz>, David Empson

<dem...@actrix.gen.nz> wrote:

> You can get the latest version of iTunes 12.6.x here:
>
> https://support.apple.com/HT208079
>
> Judging from its installer, iTunes 12.6.5 also runs on OS X Yosemite
> 10.10.5 through macOS High Sierra 10.13.6, but not on macOS Mojave.

the 12.6.5 installer states it's for compatibility with ios 11, which i
assume is a typo.

[Savageduck]

On Sep 19, 2018, nospam wrote
(in article<190920181512092344%nos...@nospam.invalid>):

After I took delivery of my new iMac last week (9/11) I had several updates
as part of the set up, including an iTunes update to 12.8 making my current
version iTunes 12.8.0.150.

I updated my iDevices to iOS 12.0 (iPad Pro, iPhone 6s+, & iPhone 8+) and
this has not prompted any further update to iTunes on my iMac.

[nospam]

In article <0001HW.2152DBDF02...@news.giganews.com>,

Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:

> > > You can get the latest version of iTunes 12.6.x here:
> > >
> > > https://support.apple.com/HT208079
> > >
> > > Judging from its installer, iTunes 12.6.5 also runs on OS X Yosemite
> > > 10.10.5 through macOS High Sierra 10.13.6, but not on macOS Mojave.
> >
> > the 12.6.5 installer states it's for compatibility with ios 11, which i
> > assume is a typo.
>
> After I took delivery of my new iMac last week (9/11) I had several updates
> as part of the set up, including an iTunes update to 12.8 making my current
> version iTunes 12.8.0.150.
>
> I updated my iDevices to iOS 12.0 (iPad Pro, iPhone 6s+, & iPhone 8+) and
> this has not prompted any further update to iTunes on my iMac.

12.6.3-12.6.5 is a separate fork from the 12.7-12.9 and beyond.

[Savageduck]

On Sep 19, 2018, nospam wrote

(in article<190920181542563196%nos...@nospam.invalid>):

So I guess I took a different fork.

--
Regards,
Savageduck

[Juan I. Cahis]

Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:

Curiously, my MacBookPro didn’t update automatically iTunes, as it did it
for Safari. After syncing my iPad with iOS 12, my Mac updated iTunes to
version 12.8.0.150

[David Empson]

That is the same text it had for 12.6.3 and 12.6.4. Apple didn't bother
updating the description in the installer.

--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz

[David Empson]

Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:

It isn't iTunes itself which is updated: the application version is
12.8.0.150 before and after the mobile device support is updated.
(Updating mobile device support does require iTunes to quit if it is
running.)

iTunes 12.8 was released in July. iTunes 12.6.5 was built in late August
and its support article was updated on September 13, the day after the
launch event for the new iPhones and the release of the iOS 12 GM, so
that is probably when Apple released iTunes 12.6.5 (I didn't notice it
until this week).

I didn't run any iOS 12 betas prior to the GM, but I expect the iOS 12
mobile device support would have been needed by developers and public
beta testers during the beta period, and might have been available to
the public at some point prior to September 13.

If you installed iTunes 12.8 after Apple had released the iOS 12 mobile
device support to the public, iTunes may have installed the updated
version of the mobile device support as part of the iTunes installation.

Those (like me) who installed iTunes 12.8 earlier and hadn't plugged in
anything running iOS 12 betas got prompted to update the mobile device
support when iTunes 12.8 first saw a device running iOS 12.

--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz

[Arlen H. Holder]

On Thu, 20 Sep 2018 12:03:02 +1200, David Empson wrote:

> I didn't run any iOS 12 betas prior to the GM, but I expect the iOS 12
> mobile device support would have been needed by developers and public
> beta testers during the beta period, and might have been available to
> the public at some point prior to September 13.

David,
Do you know if this "mobile device support" change will adversely affect
Linux users who habitually connect using the open source libimobiledevice
drivers?

We had a world-wide problem with Apple unilaterally changing things in iOS
7.0.0 to iOS 7.0.1, which instantly broke all Linux connectivity for a few
weeks or months (until the open source libimobile device drivers adjusted
to Apple's unilateral changes).

Do you foresee that happening again with this new iOS 12 "mobile device
support"?

[Lewis]

In message <1391046456.559014603.025559...@news-central.giganews.com> Juan I Cahis <jicahis....@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear friends:

> I installed yesterday iOS 12 directly on my iPad Pro without any problem.
> But today, when I connected it to my Mac in order to backup it, it forced
> an iTunes upgrade.

Yes?

> The software of my Mac was fully up to date,

Obviously iTunes was not.

> previously to connect the iPad to it, I updated all the apps installed
> in my Mac, including an update to Safari released today.

And?

> My question is why the iTunes update was not included in the standard Mac
> update? Is it because maybe is a “provisory update”, and Apple is not sure
> to release it to all Mac users?

No, it's because the update is for iOS 12, and updates get pushed out
slowly unless someone needs it right now. Once you connected an iOS 12
device, you needed the update.

You could have also gone directly to the iTunes page and downloaded the
current version, usually a few days before it will show up in the
regular update channel.


--
MS Word still hasn't caught up -- it has more bells and whistles, but not as
many pistons and cylinders. -- Steve Hayes

[David Empson]

Lewis <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> In message <1391046456.559014603.025559.jicahis.SINBASURA-gmail.com@news-

> central.giganews.com> Juan I Cahis <jicahis....@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Dear friends:
>
> > I installed yesterday iOS 12 directly on my iPad Pro without any problem.
> > But today, when I connected it to my Mac in order to backup it, it forced
> > an iTunes upgrade.
>
> Yes?
>
> > The software of my Mac was fully up to date,
>
> Obviously iTunes was not.
>
> > previously to connect the iPad to it, I updated all the apps installed
> > in my Mac, including an update to Safari released today.
>
> And?
>
> > My question is why the iTunes update was not included in the standard Mac
> > update? Is it because maybe is a "provisory update", and Apple is not sure
> > to release it to all Mac users?
>
> No, it's because the update is for iOS 12, and updates get pushed out
> slowly unless someone needs it right now. Once you connected an iOS 12
> device, you needed the update.
>
> You could have also gone directly to the iTunes page and downloaded the
> current version, usually a few days before it will show up in the
> regular update channel.

As I noted in an earlier post this is not an iTunes application update:
iTunes 12.8 from July is still the current version for the Mac (probably
until 12.9 is released next week alongside Mojave).

As of iTunes 12.8, Apple has split off distribution of the mobile device
support which now has an on-demand updater that checks if an update is
needed when you plug in an iOS device. The update was triggered when a
device running iOS 12 was first plugged into the Mac.

It is not distributed through App Store or the standard Software Update
mechanism so doesn't show up in the normal software update lists.

--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz

[nospam]

In article <1nvhctw.lmg6881k089fvN%dem...@actrix.gen.nz>, David Empson

<dem...@actrix.gen.nz> wrote:

> As of iTunes 12.8, Apple has split off distribution of the mobile device
> support which now has an on-demand updater that checks if an update is
> needed when you plug in an iOS device. The update was triggered when a
> device running iOS 12 was first plugged into the Mac.

what about the 12.6.5 fork?

i'm assuming no...

[David Empson]

No, 12.6.5 is built using the old method with the mobile device support
bundled into the iTunes installer and no separate updater, so you would
still need to manually install a newer version of iTunes 12.6.x to get
newer mobile device support. (I also noted that the installer will
reject Mojave, so this branch might be dead ending at High Sierra unless
Apple does another update to iTunes 12.6.6 next week.)

I haven't confirmed whether it was iTunes 12.6.4 or 12.6.5 which updated
the mobile device support for compatiblity with iOS 12 but I know that
iTunes 12.6.5 works while 12.6.3 does not.

The mobile device updater first appeared in the installer for the Mac
version of iTunes 12.8. It is not in the iTunes 12.7.5 installer either.

It appears the new method is being used on the Mac only, because Apple
already released iTunes 12.9 for Windows, which says it is required for
iOS 12 compatibility.

--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz

[dmi...@gmail.com]

Dear David,

your response is the most concise answer I could find to about he topic at hand. Good information here. Thanks for that!

> I haven't tested whether iTunes 12.6.5 on Yosemite is able to support
> iOS 12 devices.

just wanted to pop in and see if there is any new information on the above, as it would appear that iTunes 12.8 cannot communicate with iOS 12 devices on Yosemite.

I have an iMac early 2008, iphone 6 running 10.10, which I was considering to update, and would like to avoid updating to 10.11 if i can.

best regards,
Dan

[nospam]

In article <50b5d33a-1ec4-4a7c...@googlegroups.com>,

<dmi...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> > I haven't tested whether iTunes 12.6.5 on Yosemite is able to support
> > iOS 12 devices.
>
> just wanted to pop in and see if there is any new information on the above,
> as it would appear that iTunes 12.8 cannot communicate with iOS 12 devices on
> Yosemite.
>
> I have an iMac early 2008, iphone 6 running 10.10, which I was considering to
> update, and would like to avoid updating to 10.11 if i can.

why?

[Lewis]

Considering it started by praising David B, I'm going with "because
sockpupet".

(which is why I didn't other responding to the post)


--
I CANNOT ABSOLVE SINS Bart chalkboard Ep. AABF14

[David Empson]

Lewis <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> In message <200120191211231668%nos...@nospam.invalid> nospam <nospam@nospam.

> invalid> wrote:
> > In article <50b5d33a-1ec4-4a7c...@googlegroups.com>,
> > <dmi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > I haven't tested whether iTunes 12.6.5 on Yosemite is able to support
> >> > iOS 12 devices.
> >>
> >> just wanted to pop in and see if there is any new information on the
> >> above, as it would appear that iTunes 12.8 cannot communicate with iOS
> >> 12 devices on Yosemite.
> >>
> >> I have an iMac early 2008, iphone 6 running 10.10, which I was
> >> considering to update, and would like to avoid updating to 10.11 if i
> >> can.
>
> > why?
>
> Considering it started by praising David B, I'm going with "because
> sockpupet".

Not David B. The first (unattributed) quote above is a sentence from a
post of mine, 4 months ago. Look for Message-ID
<1nvdxbx.pr6lcs1eymye4N%dem...@actrix.gen.nz>.


To answer the question from dmi...@gmail.com re new information:

1. Tested: iTunes 12.6.5 on Yosemite won't allow communication with iOS
12. It also complains that El Capitan is required.

2. Now that macOS Mojave 10.14 have been released, we know that iTunes
12.9 is supplied as part of Mojave and is not being released for earlier
macOS versions.

3. iTunes 12.6.5 won't install on Mojave so if you want to run an iTunes
which continues to have access to App Store, you need a Mac (or VM)
which is running High Sierra or earlier, so you can run iTunes 12.6.5.

4. There was briefly an iTunes 12.8.1 update (presumably bug fixes) for
High Sierra and earlier, but it got pulled shortly after release because
it mistakenly allowed installation on Yosemite but didn't work there. I
haven't seen it (or a later revision) reappear.

None of the above changes anything with respect to iOS 12 support: you
cannot use any version of iTunes on a Mac running OS X Yosemite
(10.10.x) or earlier to manage or connect to devices running iOS 12. The
Mac must be running El Capitan or later (specifically OS X 10.11.4 or
later).

If you want to update your iPhone 6 to iOS 12 (or use any new model
which already comes with iOS 12), and you want to use iTunes with your
iPhone, you will need to update your Mac to El Capitan. If you stick
with Yosemite, iTunes won't be able to access the device running iOS 12,
but online sync mechanisms (e.g. iCloud) will work (to the limits of
features supported by both the iOS and macOS versions).

Even upgrading to El Capitan will only help you for a few more months.
Assuming Apple sticks to pattern, then come September, the bar will be
raised again and iOS 13 support in iTunes will require a Mac running
macOS 10.12 Sierra or later. I expect the iPhone 6 will be able to
upgrade to iOS 13.

Your 2008 iMac cannot run Sierra. Therefore if you need to keep using
iTunes to manage devices running the latest iOS version, you should be
planning to get a newer Mac. Getting one sooner rather than later would
avoid the need to upgrade your 2008 iMac to El Capitan, because the
newer Mac can run a newer macOS while you keep using legacy software in
Yosemite on your 2008 iMac.

--
David Empson
dem...@actrix.gen.nz

[Lewis]

In message <1o1s4xl.xd7u4m7pqnbfN%dem...@actrix.gen.nz> David Empson <dem...@actrix.gen.nz> wrote:
> Lewis <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

>> In message <200120191211231668%nos...@nospam.invalid> nospam <nospam@nospam.
>> invalid> wrote:
>> > In article <50b5d33a-1ec4-4a7c...@googlegroups.com>,
>> > <dmi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> > I haven't tested whether iTunes 12.6.5 on Yosemite is able to support
>> >> > iOS 12 devices.
>> >>
>> >> just wanted to pop in and see if there is any new information on the
>> >> above, as it would appear that iTunes 12.8 cannot communicate with iOS
>> >> 12 devices on Yosemite.
>> >>
>> >> I have an iMac early 2008, iphone 6 running 10.10, which I was
>> >> considering to update, and would like to avoid updating to 10.11 if i
>> >> can.
>>
>> > why?
>>
>> Considering it started by praising David B, I'm going with "because
>> sockpupet".

> Not David B. The first (unattributed) quote above is a sentence from a
> post of mine,

Ah, sorry about that.

> None of the above changes anything with respect to iOS 12 support: you
> cannot use any version of iTunes on a Mac running OS X Yosemite
> (10.10.x) or earlier to manage or connect to devices running iOS 12. The
> Mac must be running El Capitan or later (specifically OS X 10.11.4 or
> later).

That answers that.

> Your 2008 iMac cannot run Sierra. Therefore if you need to keep using
> iTunes to manage devices running the latest iOS version, you should be
> planning to get a newer Mac. Getting one sooner rather than later would
> avoid the need to upgrade your 2008 iMac to El Capitan, because the
> newer Mac can run a newer macOS while you keep using legacy software in
> Yosemite on your 2008 iMac.

My friends with the new mac mini are very happy, and nearly all of them
have the base model. My only issue with it is the 128GB SSD which seems
absurdly small, especially with how MacOS loves to but everything on
the boot drive (itunes, photos, icloud, etc).

I'd be nice if their icloud drive options allowed specifying and external
drive, but I know why that would be hard.

--
Just give us a kiss to celebrate here, today.

[Ant]

Lewis <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> My friends with the new mac mini are very happy, and nearly all of them
> have the base model. My only issue with it is the 128GB SSD which seems
> absurdly small, especially with how MacOS loves to but everything on
> the boot drive (itunes, photos, icloud, etc).

I really wished Apple would increase their base models' default storage
sizes to much bigger sizes.

--
Quote of the Week: "I remember being fascinated by ants and wasps and
other bugs when I was a kid. I'd set out a Coke can and stand back 20
feet and use my telescope to watch wasps land on it." --Paul McEuen
Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly.
/\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://aqfl.net & http://antfarm.home.dhs.org /
/ /\ /\ \ http://antfarm.ma.cx. Please nuke ANT if replying by e-mail.
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