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What Data Do They Find On Android If One Doesn't Do Texting?
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Nomen Nescio
Dec 11, 2019, 5:49:48 PM12/11/19
to
The do find the numbers you have called and location, but what else is
there to find?
there to find?
Libor Striz
Dec 12, 2019, 12:33:31 AM12/12/19
to
Nomen Nescio <nob...@dizum.com> Wrote in message:r
"What data can they find in your computer if you do not do texting?”
As smartphones are computers that by chance are able to manage
phone calls.
Contacts, SMS MSG's, emails, communication history, Browsing
bookmarks and history, not secured passwords, used applications,
data used by these applications, stored data....
In an extreme case, anything what you do with the phone.
--
Poutnik ( the Wanderer )
> The do find the numbers you have called and location, but what else isthere to find?
The answer is similar as the answer to the question
"What data can they find in your computer if you do not do texting?”
As smartphones are computers that by chance are able to manage
phone calls.
Contacts, SMS MSG's, emails, communication history, Browsing
bookmarks and history, not secured passwords, used applications,
data used by these applications, stored data....
In an extreme case, anything what you do with the phone.
--
Poutnik ( the Wanderer )
Commander Kinsey
Dec 12, 2019, 2:34:30 PM12/12/19
to
Arlen Holder
Dec 12, 2019, 4:09:08 PM12/12/19
to
On Thu, 12 Dec 2019 19:34:28 -0000, Commander Kinsey wrote:
> The trouble is every app seems to want access to everything.
> I'm even warned about it usually when installing something.
> Why the hell does every app need access to my call data?
> Why have this segmenting secure system within Android
> if you have to say "yeah ok just do it anyway" to get the
> app to install?
Hi Commander Kinsey,
> The trouble is every app seems to want access to everything.
> I'm even warned about it usually when installing something.
> Why the hell does every app need access to my call data?
> Why have this segmenting secure system within Android
> if you have to say "yeah ok just do it anyway" to get the
> app to install?
Is _everything_ you say, Commander Kinsey, based on your wild imagination?
o Shouldn't you own an _adult_ belief system (which should based on facts)?
Regarding _every_ app needing access to your call data:
> Why the hell does every app need access to my call data?
I have to wonder why your belief system is almost completely imaginary.
o It's as if you're a young iOS user who can't comprehend simple facts.
FACTS:
On my new $100 Moto G7, I just went to
o Settings > Apps & notifications > (choose the app) > Permissions
Extremely few apps asked for permission to access my "call logs".
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/EvXtsP9radE/8UJDoJDRAAAJ>
Where are you getting your Android facts from, Commander Kinsey?
o Apple Marketing brochures?
> Why have this segmenting secure system within Android
> if you have to say "yeah ok just do it anyway" to get the
> app to install?
o <https://github.com/8enet/AppOpsX>
I don't need to be root to use it on my $100 Moto G7 for example.
o <https://f-droid.org/en/packages/com.zzzmode.appopsx/>
o <https://f-droid.org/repo/com.zzzmode.appopsx_125.apk>
AppOpsX has a checkbox for "Automatically turn off permissions = checked"
o "All permissions auto turn off after application is installed"
Or, you can set a "template" of checkboxes determining exactly which
specific permissions to turn off after each app is installed.
There are many front ends to the Android App Ops feature:
<https://play.google.com/store/search?q=%22app%20ops%22&c=apps>
But even so, you can manually set app permissions by app:
o Settings > Apps & notifications > {app} > Permissions > {allow or deny}
I don't mind you posting, but why bother posting imaginary belief systems?
o Why not save the rest of us our energy and you just post real facts?
FACTS:
It's what adults are supposed to do.
--
Those with imaginary belief systems simply make everything up from scratch.
Chris
Dec 13, 2019, 9:55:15 AM12/13/19
to
Nomen Nescio <nob...@dizum.com> wrote:
> The do find the numbers you have called and location, but what else is
> there to find?
Who is "they"?
> The do find the numbers you have called and location, but what else is
> there to find?
Mayayana
Dec 13, 2019, 10:04:32 AM12/13/19
to
"Libor Striz" <poutnik4R...@gmailCAPITALS.com.INVALID> wrote
| > The do find the numbers you have called and location, but what else
isthere to find?
|
| The answer is similar as the answer to the question
|
| "What data can they find in your computer if you do not do texting?"
|
In practice that's not really true. This article just today:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/thomasbrewster/2019/12/11/google-gives-feds-1500-leads-to-arsonist-smartphones-in-unprecedented-geofence-search/#1db3d97d27dc
I have lots of such articles, about Google spying in stores,
about stores using bluetooth to watch you look at things
on store shelves.... If you leave your phone turned on it's
a tracking collar with an unknown number of trackers. If
you go online with your phone you're probbably going through
Google's proxy. (I'm not certain about that, but I do see
that hostname in server logs from Android users.)
Last week I saw an article about how Google lied about
location tracking being turned off.... In some cases Google
might listen to audio. Android is a semi-kiosk system. I doubt
it can be cleaned up. And that's not even getting into spyware
app makers who sell personal data to advertisers as their
busness model.
None of that is possible on my computer. I control it. There's
no location data aside from IP. Police can't search it if they pull
me over. Bezos can't track it in his Whole Foods store. Google
can't follow me around. (I have numerous Google/Doubleclick
domains in my HOSTS file.)
| > The do find the numbers you have called and location, but what else
isthere to find?
|
| The answer is similar as the answer to the question
|
| "What data can they find in your computer if you do not do texting?"
|
https://www.forbes.com/sites/thomasbrewster/2019/12/11/google-gives-feds-1500-leads-to-arsonist-smartphones-in-unprecedented-geofence-search/#1db3d97d27dc
I have lots of such articles, about Google spying in stores,
about stores using bluetooth to watch you look at things
on store shelves.... If you leave your phone turned on it's
a tracking collar with an unknown number of trackers. If
you go online with your phone you're probbably going through
Google's proxy. (I'm not certain about that, but I do see
that hostname in server logs from Android users.)
Last week I saw an article about how Google lied about
location tracking being turned off.... In some cases Google
might listen to audio. Android is a semi-kiosk system. I doubt
it can be cleaned up. And that's not even getting into spyware
app makers who sell personal data to advertisers as their
busness model.
None of that is possible on my computer. I control it. There's
no location data aside from IP. Police can't search it if they pull
me over. Bezos can't track it in his Whole Foods store. Google
can't follow me around. (I have numerous Google/Doubleclick
domains in my HOSTS file.)
Libor Striz
Dec 13, 2019, 10:39:54 AM12/13/19
to
"Mayayana" <maya...@invalid.nospam> Wrote in message:
> In practice that's not really true. ...
There is no difference in principle, rather, how the HW and SW are
configured, and how it affects the data collection.
My original answer answered rather question
of direct physical or network access to the device.
> In practice that's not really true. ...
There is no difference in principle, rather, how the HW and SW are
configured, and how it affects the data collection.
My original answer answered rather question
of direct physical or network access to the device.
123456789
Dec 13, 2019, 10:51:33 AM12/13/19
to
Mayayana wrote:
> Google spying in stores,
> If you leave your phone turned on it's a tracking collar
> with an unknown number of trackers.
> over.
> Bezos can't track [my computer] it in his Whole Foods
paranoid posting here (often and voluminous - he knows who
he is).
Perhaps a few further suggestions:
If you drive a modern car disconnect the electronics as it
likely knows where you are and stores and/or transmits it to
the home base. (Like OnStar.) And cover your license plate
to avoid those roadside (and police) automatic cameras.
Don't use a credit card. Don't use a bank. Demand to be paid
only in cash. Don't register your car. Don't have a home
ISP. Well...don't do anything that uses electricity these
days since it all rats you out somehow.
Oh, and wear a mask when out. Those security cameras are
everywhere and may have facial recognition. A tinfoil coat
and hat also can't hurt. But maybe just seeing a shrink
would be easier... ;)
> Google spying in stores,
> If you leave your phone turned on it's a tracking collar
> with an unknown number of trackers.
> Google might listen to audio.
> Android is a semi-kiosk system.
> Android is a semi-kiosk system.
> spyware app makers who sell personal data
> Police can't search it [my computer] if they pull me
> over.
> Bezos can't track [my computer] it in his Whole Foods
> store.
> Google can't follow me around. (I have numerous
> Google/Doubleclick domains in my HOSTS file.)
Whoa! I think you may be more paranoid than the other
> Google can't follow me around. (I have numerous
> Google/Doubleclick domains in my HOSTS file.)
paranoid posting here (often and voluminous - he knows who
he is).
Perhaps a few further suggestions:
If you drive a modern car disconnect the electronics as it
likely knows where you are and stores and/or transmits it to
the home base. (Like OnStar.) And cover your license plate
to avoid those roadside (and police) automatic cameras.
Don't use a credit card. Don't use a bank. Demand to be paid
only in cash. Don't register your car. Don't have a home
ISP. Well...don't do anything that uses electricity these
days since it all rats you out somehow.
Oh, and wear a mask when out. Those security cameras are
everywhere and may have facial recognition. A tinfoil coat
and hat also can't hurt. But maybe just seeing a shrink
would be easier... ;)
Mayayana
Dec 13, 2019, 5:28:15 PM12/13/19
to
"123456789" <12...@12345.com> wrote
| Whoa! I think you may be more paranoid than the other
| paranoid posting here
All I did was post facts. What are you posting? Taunts.
It's the first response of the lazy ostrich. Not curiosity
and wanting to get the facts. Just namecalling. Tinfol
hat wearer. Paranoiac. The Googlites must be glad
to see your kind. Lucky for them, the large majority
can't be bothered to think about anything if it's
inconvenient.
| Whoa! I think you may be more paranoid than the other
| paranoid posting here
It's the first response of the lazy ostrich. Not curiosity
and wanting to get the facts. Just namecalling. Tinfol
hat wearer. Paranoiac. The Googlites must be glad
to see your kind. Lucky for them, the large majority
can't be bothered to think about anything if it's
inconvenient.
123456789
Dec 13, 2019, 6:01:07 PM12/13/19
to
Mayayana wrote:
> 123456789 wrote
> Whoa! I think you may be more paranoid than the other
> paranoid posting here
> All I did was post facts.
Strange. That's what the other paranoid always says...
> What are you posting? Taunts.
No. More like (somewhat) humorous observations.
> The Googlites must be glad to see your kind.
Yep. I was assimilated long ago... ;)
> 123456789 wrote
> Whoa! I think you may be more paranoid than the other
> paranoid posting here
> All I did was post facts.
> What are you posting? Taunts.
> The Googlites must be glad to see your kind.
Mayayana
Dec 14, 2019, 9:12:54 AM12/14/19
to
"123456789" <12...@12345.com> wrote
| > All I did was post facts.
|
| Strange. That's what the other paranoid always says...
|
I don't mind your silly insults but people have a right
to know these things. If you don't care that's your
right. But that's not the point for you. You want
for no one to care, so that you won't have to know
about it... All that racket makes it hard to sleep.
A Google shill couldn't do a better job of making
the case that no one should care about their behavior....
Even if it means you're under constant surveillance
and even if it means corrupt elections. The article
I linked shows that Google keeps a record of your
physical location, probably for months, possibly for
years, from your Android phone. And gov't can ask
for that data. And if you disable location data in your
phone, that's probably not actually having any effect,
because Google lied to you.
If it were me I'd want to be told about such things.
And that's what Nomen Nescio was asking about.
| > All I did was post facts.
|
| Strange. That's what the other paranoid always says...
|
to know these things. If you don't care that's your
right. But that's not the point for you. You want
for no one to care, so that you won't have to know
about it... All that racket makes it hard to sleep.
A Google shill couldn't do a better job of making
the case that no one should care about their behavior....
Even if it means you're under constant surveillance
and even if it means corrupt elections. The article
I linked shows that Google keeps a record of your
physical location, probably for months, possibly for
years, from your Android phone. And gov't can ask
for that data. And if you disable location data in your
phone, that's probably not actually having any effect,
because Google lied to you.
If it were me I'd want to be told about such things.
And that's what Nomen Nescio was asking about.
123456789
Dec 14, 2019, 11:19:00 AM12/14/19
to
Mayayana wrote:
> 123456789 wrote:
Nor I yours.
> A Google shill...
See, you make silly insults too. You're a paranoid and I'm a
shill... ;)
> Even if it means you're under constant surveillance
Google isn't the only one watching by far.
> and even if it means corrupt elections.
Nothing I can do about that except not worry and
not vote.
> Google keeps a record of your physical location,
You can erase it, turn it off, or not opt in in the first
place. But I'm betting a paranoid wouldn't believe it and a
shill wouldn't care...
https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
> And gov't can ask for that data.
The government can get data from virtually every aspect of
your life. I assume you do your income taxes...
> if you disable location data in your phone, that's
> probably not actually having any effect, because Google
> lied to you.
Buy an iPhone instead? 8-O
> 123456789 wrote:
>> Mayayana wrote:
>> All I did was post facts.
> Strange. That's what the other paranoid always says...
> I don't mind your silly insults.
>> All I did was post facts.
> Strange. That's what the other paranoid always says...
Nor I yours.
> A Google shill...
See, you make silly insults too. You're a paranoid and I'm a
shill... ;)
> Even if it means you're under constant surveillance
> and even if it means corrupt elections.
not vote.
> Google keeps a record of your physical location,
place. But I'm betting a paranoid wouldn't believe it and a
shill wouldn't care...
https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
> And gov't can ask for that data.
your life. I assume you do your income taxes...
> if you disable location data in your phone, that's
> probably not actually having any effect, because Google
> lied to you.
Mayayana
Dec 14, 2019, 12:03:37 PM12/14/19
to
"123456789" <12...@12345.com> wrote
| > A Google shill...
|
| See, you make silly insults too. You're a paranoid and I'm a
| shill... ;)
|
I didn't call you a shill. I said a Google shill
couldn't do a better job of twisting facts. You're
doing the Google shill's job for them.
| > and even if it means corrupt elections.
|
| Nothing I can do about that except not worry and
| not vote.
|
Great logic. It's all corrupt so check out and
watch TV. :)
The millionaire Alstaire Mactaggert has almost single-
handedly pushed through privacy legislation in California.
That's all we need. Decent, enforced privacy laws.
Of course the tech companies are fighting it, but there's
hope. He got interested because he was at a party one
night, talking to a Google employee, and joked about
their spying, expecting the Googlite to joke back. Instead
the Googlite told him people would be stunned if they had
an inkling of what's going on. So, there are things you
can do. You can start by not denying it's going on or
mocking people who acknowledge it.
| > Google keeps a record of your physical location,
|
| You can erase it, turn it off, or not opt in in the first
| place. But I'm betting a paranoid wouldn't believe it and a
| shill wouldn't care...
|
| https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
|
First, you have to know about that. Most people don't.
Second, there was an article recently explaining that
Google has lied about that. You also need to turn off
Web and App Activity:
https://www.wired.com/story/google-location-tracking-turn-off/
Is that enough? Why assume it is? Their entire business
is now based on spying on you as much as possible. And
they've lied repeatedly.
But turning off those two things is at least better than
nothing. Why let them track you just because they wrote
the software in your phone?
| > And gov't can ask for that data.
|
| The government can get data from virtually every aspect of
| your life. I assume you do your income taxes...
|
Yikes! My income tax forms require a record of my physical
location at each moment during the year? I had no idea. I only
filled out my income statistics. Which form is it where
you had to fill out details of all of your personal activity
for the year? Do I also have to tell them my bathroom
schedule, because I didn't record that. And unfortunately
I don't have an Android phone, so I can't ask Google for
a copy of their report. Maybe you're right.... Maybe I
need a tracking collar. :)
| > A Google shill...
|
| See, you make silly insults too. You're a paranoid and I'm a
| shill... ;)
|
couldn't do a better job of twisting facts. You're
doing the Google shill's job for them.
| > and even if it means corrupt elections.
|
| Nothing I can do about that except not worry and
| not vote.
|
watch TV. :)
The millionaire Alstaire Mactaggert has almost single-
handedly pushed through privacy legislation in California.
That's all we need. Decent, enforced privacy laws.
Of course the tech companies are fighting it, but there's
hope. He got interested because he was at a party one
night, talking to a Google employee, and joked about
their spying, expecting the Googlite to joke back. Instead
the Googlite told him people would be stunned if they had
an inkling of what's going on. So, there are things you
can do. You can start by not denying it's going on or
mocking people who acknowledge it.
| > Google keeps a record of your physical location,
|
| You can erase it, turn it off, or not opt in in the first
| place. But I'm betting a paranoid wouldn't believe it and a
| shill wouldn't care...
|
| https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
|
Second, there was an article recently explaining that
Google has lied about that. You also need to turn off
Web and App Activity:
https://www.wired.com/story/google-location-tracking-turn-off/
Is that enough? Why assume it is? Their entire business
is now based on spying on you as much as possible. And
they've lied repeatedly.
But turning off those two things is at least better than
nothing. Why let them track you just because they wrote
the software in your phone?
| > And gov't can ask for that data.
|
| The government can get data from virtually every aspect of
| your life. I assume you do your income taxes...
|
location at each moment during the year? I had no idea. I only
filled out my income statistics. Which form is it where
you had to fill out details of all of your personal activity
for the year? Do I also have to tell them my bathroom
schedule, because I didn't record that. And unfortunately
I don't have an Android phone, so I can't ask Google for
a copy of their report. Maybe you're right.... Maybe I
need a tracking collar. :)
Arlen Holder
Dec 14, 2019, 12:34:31 PM12/14/19
to
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 09:12:17 -0500, Mayayana wrote:
> And if you disable location data in your
> phone, that's probably not actually having any effect,
> because Google lied to you.
Adults are supposed to have belief systems _based_ on facts.
> And if you disable location data in your
> phone, that's probably not actually having any effect,
> because Google lied to you.
o It's children whose belief systems are imaginary
Mayayana is generally a smart guy as I know him well from the Windows
groups, but, Mayayana also has his head in the sand almost always, when it
comes to facts.
So while I appreciate Mayayana's expertise (particularly in photo editing),
Mayayana is very often dead wrong on what he says, as he is here now.
FACTS:
Google _did_ lie to us on Location data being saved even when turned off,
which they did from January to November 2017 (assuming that's what Mayayana
is speaking about), but Google _clearly_ said they stopped that practice
_long_ ago (by November 2017).
o Google admits it tracked user location data even when the setting was turned off
<https://www.theverge.com/2017/11/21/16684818/google-location-tracking-cell-tower-data-android-os-firebase-privacy>
Since Mayayana doesn't usually cite actual facts, we can't tell if Mayayana
was speaking about _this_ particularly breach of privacy rules; and it's
not likely Mayayana will respond since he seems to _always_ stick his head
in the sand whenever confronted with actual facts.
Hence, I simply state a few basic facts, one of them is that I strive to
turn off everything Google (as anyone knows about me but if you need a
cite, there are so many I can give you that will back that up that I won't
bother right now with a cite).
Given that I strive to turn off everything Google, if YOU (or Mayayana, but
he likely just had his head in the sand so he won't likely respond) know of
ANY FACTS that Google gathers location data when we don't even have a
Google account on our phone and our location data tracking is turned
off....
Then simply act like an adult (please) and provide well-cited facts.
o Otherwise, if you speak like Mayayana does, you're acting like a child.
Let's try to act like adults on this newsgroup & speak only facts please.
--
A key difference between adults & children is that adults comprehend facts.
123456789
Dec 14, 2019, 1:05:49 PM12/14/19
to
Mayayana wrote:
> 123456789 wrote
>> A Google shill...
> See, you make silly insults too. You're a paranoid and
> I'm a shill... ;)
> I didn't call you a shill. I said a Google shill
> couldn't do a better job of twisting facts. You're doing
> the Google shill's job for them.
Ok. I take it back. You're not a paranoid. You just post
like one... ;)
> It's all corrupt... so check out and watch TV. :)
Spoken LIKE a true paranoid. Notice I didn't call you one... ;)
> You can start by not denying it's going on or mocking
> people who acknowledge it.
Don't think I denied it. I just said (in so many words) that
Google's data was a teeny tiny part of the information
contained about me on various doctor and hospital and credit
card and government and stores and restaurants and (gasp)
Amazon (etc etc etc) servers.
Further I'm one of billions of Google accounts. I supposed I
should be honored if a Google human ever knows I'm alive.
> Is that enough? Why assume it is? Their entire business
> is now based on spying on you as much as possible.
Of course. And I find their services worth the cost. It
might be a philosophical difference but I have less of a
problem with data stored on a machine vs a physical human
perusing through it.
> And they've lied repeatedly.
Many companies (and governments) do. Nothing unusual about
Google.
> Why let them track you just because they wrote the
> software in your phone?
I find Google Maps very helpful on trips. It doesn't work
well with location turned off...
> Yikes! My income tax forms require a record of my
> physical location at each moment during the year?
You can turn off Google's location. Not so your income tax's
very personal and voluminous information...
> 123456789 wrote
>> A Google shill...
> See, you make silly insults too. You're a paranoid and
> I'm a shill... ;)
> I didn't call you a shill. I said a Google shill
> couldn't do a better job of twisting facts. You're doing
> the Google shill's job for them.
like one... ;)
> It's all corrupt... so check out and watch TV. :)
Spoken LIKE a true paranoid. Notice I didn't call you one... ;)
> You can start by not denying it's going on or mocking
> people who acknowledge it.
Google's data was a teeny tiny part of the information
contained about me on various doctor and hospital and credit
card and government and stores and restaurants and (gasp)
Amazon (etc etc etc) servers.
Further I'm one of billions of Google accounts. I supposed I
should be honored if a Google human ever knows I'm alive.
> Is that enough? Why assume it is? Their entire business
> is now based on spying on you as much as possible.
might be a philosophical difference but I have less of a
problem with data stored on a machine vs a physical human
perusing through it.
> And they've lied repeatedly.
Google.
> Why let them track you just because they wrote the
> software in your phone?
well with location turned off...
> Yikes! My income tax forms require a record of my
> physical location at each moment during the year?
very personal and voluminous information...
nospam
Dec 14, 2019, 1:32:49 PM12/14/19
to
In article <qt34l6$fn1$1...@dont-email.me>, Mayayana
than knowing where you live, work and frequently shop.
> Do I also have to tell them my bathroom
> schedule, because I didn't record that.
they might not know exactly when you pee but they can tell if your
water consumption is unusual and indicative of a possible crime.
<https://5newsonline.com/2016/02/23/bentonville-pd-says-man-strangled-dr
owned-former-georgia-officer/>
Detectives determined the extra water usage between 1 and 3 a.m.
was consistent with the patio being sprayed down, the affidavit
states. They also determined that much water usage had never
occurred at the residence since October 2013, according to the
affidavit.
> And unfortunately
> I don't have an Android phone, so I can't ask Google for
> a copy of their report.
your location can be determined by where/when you use various internet
services (email, ecommerce, etc.), using credit/debit cards, flying,
taking a train or public transit, alpr, surveillance cameras, any time
you provide a name to a vendor (home depot delivery, doctor's office,
etc.) and more.
> Maybe you're right.... Maybe I
> need a tracking collar. :)
or another type of collar.
<maya...@invalid.nospam> wrote:
> | > And gov't can ask for that data.
> |
> | The government can get data from virtually every aspect of
> | your life. I assume you do your income taxes...
> |
>
> Yikes! My income tax forms require a record of my physical
> location at each moment during the year? I had no idea. I only
> filled out my income statistics. Which form is it where
> you had to fill out details of all of your personal activity
> for the year?
they know your entire financial picture, which is a *lot* more invasive
> | > And gov't can ask for that data.
> |
> | The government can get data from virtually every aspect of
> | your life. I assume you do your income taxes...
> |
>
> Yikes! My income tax forms require a record of my physical
> location at each moment during the year? I had no idea. I only
> filled out my income statistics. Which form is it where
> you had to fill out details of all of your personal activity
> for the year?
than knowing where you live, work and frequently shop.
> Do I also have to tell them my bathroom
> schedule, because I didn't record that.
water consumption is unusual and indicative of a possible crime.
<https://5newsonline.com/2016/02/23/bentonville-pd-says-man-strangled-dr
owned-former-georgia-officer/>
Detectives determined the extra water usage between 1 and 3 a.m.
was consistent with the patio being sprayed down, the affidavit
states. They also determined that much water usage had never
occurred at the residence since October 2013, according to the
affidavit.
> And unfortunately
> I don't have an Android phone, so I can't ask Google for
> a copy of their report.
services (email, ecommerce, etc.), using credit/debit cards, flying,
taking a train or public transit, alpr, surveillance cameras, any time
you provide a name to a vendor (home depot delivery, doctor's office,
etc.) and more.
> Maybe you're right.... Maybe I
> need a tracking collar. :)
Arlen Holder
Dec 14, 2019, 2:57:57 PM12/14/19
to
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 13:32:46 -0500, nospam wrote:
> your location can be determined by where/when you use various internet
> services (email, ecommerce, etc.), using credit/debit cards, flying,
> taking a train or public transit, alpr, surveillance cameras, any time
> you provide a name to a vendor (home depot delivery, doctor's office,
> etc.) and more.
While nospam is correct in that data protection is a chain of links, I
> your location can be determined by where/when you use various internet
> services (email, ecommerce, etc.), using credit/debit cards, flying,
> taking a train or public transit, alpr, surveillance cameras, any time
> you provide a name to a vendor (home depot delivery, doctor's office,
> etc.) and more.
believe a knowledgeable adult can ameliorate some of those links by
intelligent setup of the smartphone.
For example, why on earth do you need a "Google Account" on Android?
o I can't think of a single reason; can you?
HINT: You can do _everything_ you need to do, WITHOUT a Google Account
(as far as I can tell).
Prove me wrong if anyone believes otherwise, as I _love_ facts.
Q: What FUNCTIONALITY can't you do on Android WITHOUT a Google Account
(i.e., without a Google Account directly associated with the OS.)
NOTE: You can still have a 'google account' for this question; you just
don't have to set it up as "the" Google Account for that Android phone
(sort of like how iOS users still have a Google Account for the apps).
--
Privacy/security & data protection are a long chain of factual links.
Arlen Holder
Dec 14, 2019, 2:57:58 PM12/14/19
to
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 16:39:49 +0100 (GMT+01:00), Libor Striz wrote:
> My original answer answered rather question
> of direct physical or network access to the device.
Poutnik is generally astute and well informed of the facts.
> My original answer answered rather question
> of direct physical or network access to the device.
1. Privacy/security of data is a long "chain" of links
2. To have privacy/security is to have ALL those links be strong
3. There is no consumer compute device that has that feature.
It just does not exist.
o Marketing easily sways the gullible imaginary privacy/security exists.
As Poutnik accurately notes, in general, any consumer smartphone (whether
Android, or the highly touted imaginary privacy of iOS) acts like a
computer in very many ways with respect to "data" being available to be
spied upon.
Even worse in some ways, is the smartphone (although the PC is worse in
other ways, due partially to sheer size of disks & abilities to communicate
via keyboard for example).
The smartphone has some relatively unique spy'able features such as the
cellphone _and_ the IP address, whereas with PCs, a cellular signal is
"usually" not part of the package.
Likewise, the granular control "appears" to be greater for a PC than for a
smartphone, where Lord knows, I _try_ to keep my cellphone private even as
I know it's impossible for _any_ consumer cellphone to be private or
secure:
o What is the factual truth about PRIVACY differences or similarities between the Android & iOS mobile phone ecosystems?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/FCKRA_3i9CY/Bm40liKdEQAJ>
Children who desperately want to believe in imaginary privacy/security will
not be able to read the huge number of adult facts in that thread alone.
--
Anyone who thinks a cellphone is private/secure, holds imaginary beliefs.
Frank Slootweg
Dec 14, 2019, 3:12:49 PM12/14/19
to
123456789 <12...@12345.com> wrote:
> Mayayana wrote:
[...]
What the ('Manage your Location History') document says is
"When Location History is off New location information is no longer
saved to your Location History."
It's not saved to *your* Location History. It does *not* say it is not
*recorded* (in some (other) place).
And about "erase":
"You can manage and delete your Location History information"
Note *your* Location History information, i.e. *in your account*. What
about location information *about* you kept elsewhere?
What? "Google wouldn't lie!" No they probably won't *lie*, but they
are known to not tell the truth.
Remember 'X-No-Archive: yes'?
Another example of Google not-telling-the-truth (in the same
document):
"Location History is a Google Account-level setting that saves where you
go with every mobile device where:
* You're signed in to your Google Account,
* You have turned on Location History, and
* The device has Location Reporting turned on."
So if I don't turn Location Reporting on, I have nothing to worry, do
I, right?
Wrong! If Location Reporting is off, turning on GPS will turn on
Location Reporting. I.e. *I* didn't turn it on, *Google* did. And to add
insult to injury, turning GPS back off will *not* turn off Location
Reporting.
So turning Location Reporting off is an exercise in futility, because
as you turn on GPS, Location Reporting is on ever after.
And, as said before, Google tracks your location even if (GPS,) Wi-Fi
and Bluetooth are switched off, i.e. Google silently switches on Wi-Fi
or/and Bluetooth to continue tracking.
Proof? My Location History! :-(
> The government can get data from virtually every aspect of
> your life. I assume you do your income taxes...
But very little of my location (history), movements, etc..
Did you realize that Google even extrapolates your Location History
from data it did *not* get from you?
I have examples of our travels in outback areas in Australia where
most of the time there *is* no mobile coverage, no Wi-Fi and no
Bluetooth, but Google still figured out how we got from A to B by
'connecting the dots', even some weird but correct connecting. Both
amazing and rather 'terrifying'.
Bottom line: Google Location History can contain some very private
information, which, when in the wrong hands, can have serious
consequences. (IMO) "in the wrong hands' includes Google itself and many
of Google's 'partners'.
That doesn't mean we really have a choice, other than not to use *any*
Google products and services. :-(
> Mayayana wrote:
[...]
> > Google keeps a record of your physical location,
>
> You can erase it, turn it off, or not opt in in the first
> place. But I'm betting a paranoid wouldn't believe it and a
> shill wouldn't care...
>
> https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
>
> > And gov't can ask for that data.
Who says you can erase it or turn it off?
>
> You can erase it, turn it off, or not opt in in the first
> place. But I'm betting a paranoid wouldn't believe it and a
> shill wouldn't care...
>
> https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
>
> > And gov't can ask for that data.
What the ('Manage your Location History') document says is
"When Location History is off New location information is no longer
saved to your Location History."
It's not saved to *your* Location History. It does *not* say it is not
*recorded* (in some (other) place).
And about "erase":
"You can manage and delete your Location History information"
Note *your* Location History information, i.e. *in your account*. What
about location information *about* you kept elsewhere?
What? "Google wouldn't lie!" No they probably won't *lie*, but they
are known to not tell the truth.
Remember 'X-No-Archive: yes'?
Another example of Google not-telling-the-truth (in the same
document):
"Location History is a Google Account-level setting that saves where you
go with every mobile device where:
* You're signed in to your Google Account,
* You have turned on Location History, and
* The device has Location Reporting turned on."
So if I don't turn Location Reporting on, I have nothing to worry, do
I, right?
Wrong! If Location Reporting is off, turning on GPS will turn on
Location Reporting. I.e. *I* didn't turn it on, *Google* did. And to add
insult to injury, turning GPS back off will *not* turn off Location
Reporting.
So turning Location Reporting off is an exercise in futility, because
as you turn on GPS, Location Reporting is on ever after.
And, as said before, Google tracks your location even if (GPS,) Wi-Fi
and Bluetooth are switched off, i.e. Google silently switches on Wi-Fi
or/and Bluetooth to continue tracking.
Proof? My Location History! :-(
> The government can get data from virtually every aspect of
> your life. I assume you do your income taxes...
Did you realize that Google even extrapolates your Location History
from data it did *not* get from you?
I have examples of our travels in outback areas in Australia where
most of the time there *is* no mobile coverage, no Wi-Fi and no
Bluetooth, but Google still figured out how we got from A to B by
'connecting the dots', even some weird but correct connecting. Both
amazing and rather 'terrifying'.
Bottom line: Google Location History can contain some very private
information, which, when in the wrong hands, can have serious
consequences. (IMO) "in the wrong hands' includes Google itself and many
of Google's 'partners'.
That doesn't mean we really have a choice, other than not to use *any*
Google products and services. :-(
nospam
Dec 14, 2019, 3:29:20 PM12/14/19
to
In article <qt3es4$j1v$1...@news.mixmin.net>, Arlen Holder
> I believe a knowledgeable adult can ameliorate some of those links by
> intelligent setup of the smartphone.
even the most knowledgable people will not be able to outsmart or
outrun countless data mining companies, who collect, aggregate and
resell all sorts of data and there's very little anyone can do.
> For example, why on earth do you need a "Google Account" on Android?
> o I can't think of a single reason; can you?
sure can, and you've even been told what some of them are by many
different people.
> HINT: You can do _everything_ you need to do, WITHOUT a Google Account
> (as far as I can tell).
*you* personally might, but only because you don't use the devices to
their fullest potential.
> Prove me wrong if anyone believes otherwise, as I _love_ facts.
no, you actually don't, since any time they're offered you go into rant
mode.
<arlen.geo...@is.invalid> wrote:
>
> > your location can be determined by where/when you use various internet
> > services (email, ecommerce, etc.), using credit/debit cards, flying,
> > taking a train or public transit, alpr, surveillance cameras, any time
> > you provide a name to a vendor (home depot delivery, doctor's office,
> > etc.) and more.
>
> While nospam is correct in that data protection is a chain of links,
i wasn't talking about data protection.
>
> > your location can be determined by where/when you use various internet
> > services (email, ecommerce, etc.), using credit/debit cards, flying,
> > taking a train or public transit, alpr, surveillance cameras, any time
> > you provide a name to a vendor (home depot delivery, doctor's office,
> > etc.) and more.
>
> While nospam is correct in that data protection is a chain of links,
> I believe a knowledgeable adult can ameliorate some of those links by
> intelligent setup of the smartphone.
outrun countless data mining companies, who collect, aggregate and
resell all sorts of data and there's very little anyone can do.
> For example, why on earth do you need a "Google Account" on Android?
> o I can't think of a single reason; can you?
different people.
> HINT: You can do _everything_ you need to do, WITHOUT a Google Account
> (as far as I can tell).
their fullest potential.
> Prove me wrong if anyone believes otherwise, as I _love_ facts.
mode.
123456789
Dec 14, 2019, 4:48:25 PM12/14/19
to
Frank Slootweg wrote:
> 123456789 wrote:
>> You can erase it [Google history], turn it off, or not
> Who says you can erase it or turn it off?
Google does (above link):
"You can turn off Location History for your account at any
time."
"You can choose to delete all of your history..."
> It does *not* say it is not *recorded* (in some (other)
> place).
It doesn't say a lot of things. It doesn't say a copy of
your history is being forwarded to the CIA either... 8-O
> Google wouldn't lie!" No they probably won't *lie*, but
> they are known to not tell the truth.
Google is not unique among large corporations in this property.
> turning Location Reporting off is an exercise in
> futility, because as you turn on GPS, Location Reporting
> is on ever after.
Your phone company records where you go too... 8-O
> Google Location History can contain some very private
> information, which, when in the wrong hands, can have
> serious consequences.
You'll Just have to stay away from those kinds of places... ;)
> That doesn't mean we really have a choice, other than not
> to use *any* Google products and services. :-(
That's the choice I would make if I was paranoid of Google
products...
> 123456789 wrote:
>> You can erase it [Google history], turn it off, or not
>> opt in in the first place.
>> https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
> Who says you can erase it or turn it off?
"You can turn off Location History for your account at any
time."
"You can choose to delete all of your history..."
> It does *not* say it is not *recorded* (in some (other)
> place).
your history is being forwarded to the CIA either... 8-O
> Google wouldn't lie!" No they probably won't *lie*, but
> they are known to not tell the truth.
> turning Location Reporting off is an exercise in
> futility, because as you turn on GPS, Location Reporting
> is on ever after.
> Google Location History can contain some very private
> information, which, when in the wrong hands, can have
> serious consequences.
> That doesn't mean we really have a choice, other than not
> to use *any* Google products and services. :-(
products...
Arlen Holder
Dec 14, 2019, 4:59:48 PM12/14/19
to
On 14 Dec 2019 20:12:47 GMT, Frank Slootweg wrote:
>>> And gov't can ask for that data.
>
> Who says you can erase it or turn it off?
>
> What the ('Manage your Location History') document says is
>
> "When Location History is off New location information is no longer
> saved to your Location History."
While I don't disagree with Frank Slootweg's point that you can likely only
>>> And gov't can ask for that data.
>
> Who says you can erase it or turn it off?
>
> What the ('Manage your Location History') document says is
>
> "When Location History is off New location information is no longer
> saved to your Location History."
"pause" your Google Account location history when you set up a Google
account on your Android phone, I ask a _different_ (related) question.
*Why do you need to set up the phone's OS to a Google account?*
o *Why not set up the Android phone to _no_ account whatsoever?*
What do you lose?
o I posit you lose nothing.
a. You can still get Google Mail (e.g., using any MUA other than GMail)
b. You can still use Google Maps (you just can no longer save offline maps)
c. You can still scrape Google Play (e.g., Aurora downloads APKs just fine)
etc.
I love facts - where I don't know of ANY reason you _need_ to set the
Android phone up with a Google Account in the Android OS.
Do you?
--
Most people haven't thought of any other way of doing things than the way
that the big marketing companies fed them to believe is the "only" way.
Arlen Holder
Dec 14, 2019, 4:59:49 PM12/14/19
to
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 15:29:19 -0500, nospam wrote:
> i wasn't talking about data protection.
What is this thread about, if it's not about data protection?
> i wasn't talking about data protection.
> even the most knowledgable people will not be able to outsmart or
> outrun countless data mining companies, who collect, aggregate and
> resell all sorts of data and there's very little anyone can do.
>
>> For example, why on earth do you need a "Google Account" on Android?
>> o I can't think of a single reason; can you?
> sure can, and you've even been told what some of them are by many
> different people.
o Just stop it.
You clearly own an imaginary belief system that you can _never_ back up.
When have you provided this answer, nospam.
o Name just once
You _never_ can point to an actual cite, nospam, since you make this up.
o Your credibility is no better than the result of a dumb coin toss, nospam
Stop playing your silly childish games, nospam
o I understand why your childish games work well for you on Apple ngs
But here, where we are adults - your silly games are easily proven so.
Name just once where you've provided this answer you "say" you did.
o Name just one.
>
>> HINT: You can do _everything_ you need to do, WITHOUT a Google Account
>> (as far as I can tell).
>
> *you* personally might, but only because you don't use the devices to
> their fullest potential.
o I realize these childish games work great for you on Apple newsgroups
Making up bullshit works GREAT for you on Apple newsgroups, I agree.
o But here, we're adults - where you haven't provided a single fact.
Name just one functionality I don't have on Android that requires me to
literally set the phone's OS to a Google account - that I don't have -
without setting the phone's OS to a Google account.
o Name just one
HINT: Your bullshit works on Apple newsgroups - but not here nospam.
(Your credibility is worse than the result of a dumb coin toss, nospam.)
--
It's sad but the posters who frequent Apple newsgroups tend to think that
they can get away with bullshitting simply because they're used to a bar so
low that it works for them on those Apple newsgroups; but not here.
Arlen Holder
Dec 14, 2019, 5:13:52 PM12/14/19
to
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 21:59:48 -0000 (UTC), Arlen Holder wrote:
> *Why do you need to set up the phone's OS to a Google account?*
> o *Why not set up the Android phone to _no_ account whatsoever?*
>
> What do you lose?
> o I posit you lose nothing.
Note that you can a lot WITHOUT setting up the OS with a Google Account:>
> *Why do you need to set up the phone's OS to a Google account?*
> o *Why not set up the Android phone to _no_ account whatsoever?*
>
> What do you lose?
> o I posit you lose nothing.
a. You can still get Google Mail (e.g., using any MUA other than GMail)
b. You can still use Google Maps (e.g., you can navigate & view traffic)
c. You can still scrape Google Play (e.g., Aurora downloads APKs just fine)
d. You can still scrape YouTube (e.g., NewPipe is YouTube on steroids).
e. You can still maintain a calendar (e.g., using CadDAV servers)
f. You can still backup & restore (e.g., using any of many backup apps)
etc.
Since you can easily use a "Google Account" on Android (or iOS for that
matter), without setting up the phone OS to that Google Account, I've asked
the question separately in its own thread just now over here:
o Why would anyone NEED to set up the Android OS to a Google Account?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/0O0GLU0bFmw>
--
One problem with people, in general, is they never think outside the box
that the (rather clever) marketing organizations have fed them to believe.
Mayayana
Dec 14, 2019, 5:34:16 PM12/14/19
to
"Frank Slootweg" <th...@ddress.is.invalid> wrote
| That doesn't mean we really have a choice, other than not to use *any*
| Google products and services. :-(
You do have a choice to leave your phone turned off.
Probably most people wouldn't do that. I have a Tracphone
and just don't turn it on unless I need to make a call
or expect a call. The battery lasts for months. But people
using maps, Uber, restaurant reviews, and "all that jazz"
have no real choice under current law. Though I expect
it's more civilized where you are.
I also have a lot of stuff in my HOSTS file. Google has
been remarkably successful at achieiving almost 100% online
tracking by offering freebies. Fonts, jquery, maps, analytics
-- plus ads -- mean that Google tracks nearly every webpage
loaded. This is my block list for Google. I enable only google.com.
(The asterisks are wildcards that work with Acrylic DNS proxy.)
127.0.0.1 *.googlesyndication.com
127.0.0.1 *.googleadservices.com
127.0.0.1 *.googlecommerce.com
127.0.0.1 *.scorecardresearch.com
127.0.0.1 *.1e100.com
127.0.0.1 *.1e100.net
127.0.0.1 *.doubleclick.net
127.0.0.1 *.doubleclick.com
127.0.0.1 *.googletagservices.com
127.0.0.1 *.googletagmanager.com
127.0.0.1 *.google-analytics.com
127.0.0.1 fonts.googleapis.com
127.0.0.1 *.2mdn.net
127.0.0.1 googleadapis.l.google.com
127.0.0.1 *.gstatic.com
127.0.0.1 plusone.google.com
127.0.0.1 cse.google.com
127.0.0.1 www.google.com/cse
127.0.0.1 www.youtube-nocookie.com
127.0.0.1 *.appspot.com
| That doesn't mean we really have a choice, other than not to use *any*
| Google products and services. :-(
Probably most people wouldn't do that. I have a Tracphone
and just don't turn it on unless I need to make a call
or expect a call. The battery lasts for months. But people
using maps, Uber, restaurant reviews, and "all that jazz"
have no real choice under current law. Though I expect
it's more civilized where you are.
I also have a lot of stuff in my HOSTS file. Google has
been remarkably successful at achieiving almost 100% online
tracking by offering freebies. Fonts, jquery, maps, analytics
-- plus ads -- mean that Google tracks nearly every webpage
loaded. This is my block list for Google. I enable only google.com.
(The asterisks are wildcards that work with Acrylic DNS proxy.)
127.0.0.1 *.googlesyndication.com
127.0.0.1 *.googleadservices.com
127.0.0.1 *.googlecommerce.com
127.0.0.1 *.scorecardresearch.com
127.0.0.1 *.1e100.com
127.0.0.1 *.1e100.net
127.0.0.1 *.doubleclick.net
127.0.0.1 *.doubleclick.com
127.0.0.1 *.googletagservices.com
127.0.0.1 *.googletagmanager.com
127.0.0.1 *.google-analytics.com
127.0.0.1 fonts.googleapis.com
127.0.0.1 *.2mdn.net
127.0.0.1 googleadapis.l.google.com
127.0.0.1 *.gstatic.com
127.0.0.1 plusone.google.com
127.0.0.1 cse.google.com
127.0.0.1 www.google.com/cse
127.0.0.1 www.youtube-nocookie.com
127.0.0.1 *.appspot.com
nospam
Dec 14, 2019, 6:43:05 PM12/14/19
to
In article <qt3m0k$19k$2...@news.mixmin.net>, Arlen Holder
> > even the most knowledgable people will not be able to outsmart or
> > outrun countless data mining companies, who collect, aggregate and
> > resell all sorts of data and there's very little anyone can do.
>
> I think they can, but I agree they have to be _intelligent_ about it.
they can't.
> >> For example, why on earth do you need a "Google Account" on Android?
> >> o I can't think of a single reason; can you?
> > sure can, and you've even been told what some of them are by many
> > different people.
>
> Stop playing this childishly silly game, nospam.
> o Just stop it.
>
> You clearly own an imaginary belief system that you can _never_ back up.
>
> When have you provided this answer, nospam.
> o Name just once
>
> You _never_ can point to an actual cite, nospam, since you make this up.
> o Your credibility is no better than the result of a dumb coin toss, nospam
>
> Stop playing your silly childish games, nospam
> o I understand why your childish games work well for you on Apple ngs
>
> But here, where we are adults - your silly games are easily proven so.
>
> Name just once where you've provided this answer you "say" you did.
> o Name just one.
as predicted, you went into rant mode, thereby confirming what i said.
> >> HINT: You can do _everything_ you need to do, WITHOUT a Google Account
> >> (as far as I can tell).
> >
> > *you* personally might, but only because you don't use the devices to
> > their fullest potential.
>
> Again, nospam, stop with the silly childish games, please.
> o I realize these childish games work great for you on Apple newsgroups
>
> Making up bullshit works GREAT for you on Apple newsgroups, I agree.
> o But here, we're adults - where you haven't provided a single fact.
>
> Name just one functionality I don't have on Android that requires me to
> literally set the phone's OS to a Google account - that I don't have -
> without setting the phone's OS to a Google account.
> o Name just one
>
> HINT: Your bullshit works on Apple newsgroups - but not here nospam.
> (Your credibility is worse than the result of a dumb coin toss, nospam.)
and continuing to remain in rant mode, further confirming it.
<arlen.geo...@is.invalid> wrote:
>
> > i wasn't talking about data protection.
>
> What is this thread about, if it's not about data protection?
data mining.
>
> > i wasn't talking about data protection.
>
> What is this thread about, if it's not about data protection?
> > even the most knowledgable people will not be able to outsmart or
> > outrun countless data mining companies, who collect, aggregate and
> > resell all sorts of data and there's very little anyone can do.
>
> I think they can, but I agree they have to be _intelligent_ about it.
> >> For example, why on earth do you need a "Google Account" on Android?
> >> o I can't think of a single reason; can you?
> > sure can, and you've even been told what some of them are by many
> > different people.
>
> Stop playing this childishly silly game, nospam.
> o Just stop it.
>
> You clearly own an imaginary belief system that you can _never_ back up.
>
> When have you provided this answer, nospam.
> o Name just once
>
> You _never_ can point to an actual cite, nospam, since you make this up.
> o Your credibility is no better than the result of a dumb coin toss, nospam
>
> Stop playing your silly childish games, nospam
> o I understand why your childish games work well for you on Apple ngs
>
> But here, where we are adults - your silly games are easily proven so.
>
> Name just once where you've provided this answer you "say" you did.
> o Name just one.
> >> HINT: You can do _everything_ you need to do, WITHOUT a Google Account
> >> (as far as I can tell).
> >
> > *you* personally might, but only because you don't use the devices to
> > their fullest potential.
>
> Again, nospam, stop with the silly childish games, please.
> o I realize these childish games work great for you on Apple newsgroups
>
> Making up bullshit works GREAT for you on Apple newsgroups, I agree.
> o But here, we're adults - where you haven't provided a single fact.
>
> Name just one functionality I don't have on Android that requires me to
> literally set the phone's OS to a Google account - that I don't have -
> without setting the phone's OS to a Google account.
> o Name just one
>
> HINT: Your bullshit works on Apple newsgroups - but not here nospam.
> (Your credibility is worse than the result of a dumb coin toss, nospam.)
Arlen Holder
Dec 14, 2019, 8:27:20 PM12/14/19
to
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 18:43:04 -0500, nospam wrote:
> as predicted, you went into rant mode, thereby confirming what i said.
Grow up.
> as predicted, you went into rant mode, thereby confirming what i said.
As always, you act like a child nospam.
Your inability to back up your claims works fine on Apple newsgroups.
But here, your credibility is worse than the result of a dumb coin toss.
Joerg Lorenz
Dec 15, 2019, 4:08:14 AM12/15/19
to
Am 14.12.19 um 21:12 schrieb Frank Slootweg:
And BTW: Capable criminals and terrorists don't use Android devices and
in particular Google Services.
> 123456789 <12...@12345.com> wrote:
>> Mayayana wrote:
> [...]
>>> Google keeps a record of your physical location,
>>
>> You can erase it, turn it off, or not opt in in the first
>> place. But I'm betting a paranoid wouldn't believe it and a
>> shill wouldn't care...
>>
>> https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
>>
>>> And gov't can ask for that data.
>
> Who says you can erase it or turn it off?
>
> What the ('Manage your Location History') document says is
>
> "When Location History is off New location information is no longer
> saved to your Location History."
>
> It's not saved to *your* Location History. It does *not* say it is not
> *recorded* (in some (other) place).
>
> And about "erase":
>
> "You can manage and delete your Location History information"
>
> Note *your* Location History information, i.e. *in your account*. What
> about location information *about* you kept elsewhere?
>
Again: Everything from you is wrong and a very simple conspiracy theory.
>> Mayayana wrote:
> [...]
>>> Google keeps a record of your physical location,
>>
>> You can erase it, turn it off, or not opt in in the first
>> place. But I'm betting a paranoid wouldn't believe it and a
>> shill wouldn't care...
>>
>> https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
>>
>>> And gov't can ask for that data.
>
> Who says you can erase it or turn it off?
>
> What the ('Manage your Location History') document says is
>
> "When Location History is off New location information is no longer
> saved to your Location History."
>
> It's not saved to *your* Location History. It does *not* say it is not
> *recorded* (in some (other) place).
>
> And about "erase":
>
> "You can manage and delete your Location History information"
>
> Note *your* Location History information, i.e. *in your account*. What
> about location information *about* you kept elsewhere?
>
And BTW: Capable criminals and terrorists don't use Android devices and
in particular Google Services.
Frank Slootweg
Dec 15, 2019, 7:04:18 AM12/15/19
to
123456789 <12...@12345.com> wrote:
> Frank Slootweg wrote:
> > 123456789 wrote:
>
> >> You can erase it [Google history], turn it off, or not
> >> opt in in the first place.
>
> >> https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
>
> > Who says you can erase it or turn it off?
>
> Google does (above link):
>
> "You can turn off Location History for your account at any
> time."
>
> "You can choose to delete all of your history..."
>
> > It does *not* say it is not *recorded* (in some (other)
> > place).
>
> It doesn't say a lot of things. It doesn't say a copy of
> your history is being forwarded to the CIA either... 8-O
You conveniently snipped my "Remember 'X-No-Archive: yes'?" comment.
> Frank Slootweg wrote:
> > 123456789 wrote:
>
> >> You can erase it [Google history], turn it off, or not
> >> opt in in the first place.
>
> >> https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3118687?hl=en
>
> > Who says you can erase it or turn it off?
>
> Google does (above link):
>
> "You can turn off Location History for your account at any
> time."
>
> "You can choose to delete all of your history..."
>
> > It does *not* say it is not *recorded* (in some (other)
> > place).
>
> It doesn't say a lot of things. It doesn't say a copy of
> your history is being forwarded to the CIA either... 8-O
> > Google wouldn't lie!" No they probably won't *lie*, but
> > they are known to not tell the truth.
>
> Google is not unique among large corporations in this property.
>
> > turning Location Reporting off is an exercise in
> > futility, because as you turn on GPS, Location Reporting
> > is on ever after.
>
> Your phone company records where you go too... 8-O
data is much less relevant/dangerous/<whatever>.
> > Google Location History can contain some very private
> > information, which, when in the wrong hands, can have
> > serious consequences.
>
> You'll Just have to stay away from those kinds of places... ;)
(unwilling?) to realize that there are places which are nobodies
business - especially not some 'companies' -, which can and will hurt
you when they fall in the wrong hands, which are *not* "those kinds" and
which can *not* be avoided.
> > That doesn't mean we really have a choice, other than not
> > to use *any* Google products and services. :-(
>
> That's the choice I would make if I was paranoid of Google
> products...
Google account, have Location History turned on and implicitly shows I
have an Android phone.
So, I'm not paranoid, but I'm also not so stupid/gullible/<whatever>
as to belittle the potential dangers of the (location and time) data
which Google keeps.
Note the 'time' part. Location and the time you spent there, is an
additional source of information, which can lead to some 'interesting'
new information about you.
123456789
Dec 15, 2019, 10:43:38 AM12/15/19
to
Frank Slootweg wrote:
> 123456789 wrote:
> You conveniently snipped my "Remember 'X-No-Archive:
> yes'?" comment.
I snip most everything that I don't comment on unless it is
> 123456789 wrote:
> You conveniently snipped my "Remember 'X-No-Archive:
> yes'?" comment.
needed (IMO) for context in a further comment. And yes it is
for the convenience of the reader. It certainly would be
easier for me to leave miles of repeated text for others to
weed through but I have a kind heart and take pity on them
and wish they would do the same for me.
>> Your phone company records where you go
> Not anywhere as precise as Google does.
So you would rather be robbed for $10 than for $20. Makes
sense... ;)
BTW Cops use cell phone location records to ELIMINATE
suspects. So that nasty "feature" may actually save your
butt someday...
> there are places which are nobodies business - especially
> not some 'companies' -, which can and will hurt you when
> they fall in the wrong hands, which are *not* "those
> kinds" and which can *not* be avoided.
governments) have that risk so why worry only about Google?
> Note the 'time' part. Location and the time you spent
> there, is an additional source of information, which can
> lead to some 'interesting' new information about you.
does. But I refuse to give up the convenience to paranoia. I
just refuse to worry about it period. If something happens I'll
deal with it. YMMV...
Mayayana
Dec 15, 2019, 11:09:20 AM12/15/19
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"123456789" <12...@12345.com> wrote
| I just refuse to worry about it period.
Methinks the easygoing consumer doth protest too much. :)
| I just refuse to worry about it period.
123456789
Dec 15, 2019, 11:18:37 AM12/15/19
to
Mayayana wrote:
> 123456789 wrote
>>I just refuse to worry about it period.
> Methinks the easygoing consumer doth protest too much. :)
Tis the wayeth of Usenet... ;)
> 123456789 wrote
>>I just refuse to worry about it period.
> Methinks the easygoing consumer doth protest too much. :)
Frank Slootweg
Dec 15, 2019, 1:58:21 PM12/15/19
to
123456789 <12...@12345.com> wrote:
> Frank Slootweg wrote:
> > 123456789 wrote:
>
> > You conveniently snipped my "Remember 'X-No-Archive:
> > yes'?" comment.
>
> I snip most everything that I don't comment on unless it is
> needed (IMO) for context in a further comment. And yes it is
> for the convenience of the reader. It certainly would be
> easier for me to leave miles of repeated text for others to
> weed through but I have a kind heart and take pity on them
> and wish they would do the same for me.
Of course snipping irrelevant material is a good thing, but snipping
> Frank Slootweg wrote:
> > 123456789 wrote:
>
> > You conveniently snipped my "Remember 'X-No-Archive:
> > yes'?" comment.
>
> I snip most everything that I don't comment on unless it is
> needed (IMO) for context in a further comment. And yes it is
> for the convenience of the reader. It certainly would be
> easier for me to leave miles of repeated text for others to
> weed through but I have a kind heart and take pity on them
> and wish they would do the same for me.
relevant material, is changing or even misrepresenting the context, even
if you do not comment on said material perse, Another example below.
> >> Your phone company records where you go
>
> > Not anywhere as precise as Google does.
>
> So you would rather be robbed for $10 than for $20. Makes
> sense... ;)
point.
I wrote:
" Not anywhere as precise as Google does. Without the precision, the
So the point is, using your 'analogy', (effectively) not being robbed
versus being robbed.
> BTW Cops use cell phone location records to ELIMINATE
> suspects. So that nasty "feature" may actually save your
> butt someday...
disadvantages. By no means I want to deny the advantages, I'm only
saying not to belittle the disadvantages.
> > there are places which are nobodies business - especially
> > not some 'companies' -, which can and will hurt you when
> > they fall in the wrong hands, which are *not* "those
> > kinds" and which can *not* be avoided.
>
> Agreed. But my point is that ALL the companies (and
> governments) have that risk so why worry only about Google?
different/additional sources of data. Some of these companies may have a
more detailed picture of a *part* of your life, but Google (and
Facebook, etc..) have a more complete *general* picture of you. So
comparing Google to your run-of-the-mill other company is apples to
oranges.
[...]
Thanks for sharing your views, however gullible they are :-) (Sorry,
I *had* to put that in! I'm only human, despite what Google might
think.)
(AFAIC,) EOD, but feel free to continue.
123456789
Dec 15, 2019, 5:33:13 PM12/15/19
to
Frank Slootweg wrote:
> Because those other companies do not have all this
> multitude of different/additional sources of data. Some
> of these companies may have a more detailed picture of a
> *part* of your life, but Google (and Facebook, etc..)
> have a more complete *general* picture of you. So
> comparing Google to your run-of-the-mill other company is
> apples to oranges.
I think I am in much more danger from the human employees at
> Because those other companies do not have all this
> multitude of different/additional sources of data. Some
> of these companies may have a more detailed picture of a
> *part* of your life, but Google (and Facebook, etc..)
> have a more complete *general* picture of you. So
> comparing Google to your run-of-the-mill other company is
> apples to oranges.
my local doctors office who have complete access to all my
medical records with which one could easily commit identity
theft than from Google to who I am just a bunch of bits in a
bunch of monster servers and among billions of other accounts.
> Thanks for sharing your views, however gullible they are
> :-)
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