[ADVOC] - Tag for Ruby Advocacy Related Topics
Ilias Lazaridis
or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
would increase the informative value and would allow easier filtering.
.
Bill Atkins
Happy?
Bill
On 4/19/05, Ilias Lazaridis <il...@lazaridis.com> wrote:
>
> may I ask the community to introduce a tag, e.g. "[ADVOC]" or "[ADVO]"
> or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
>
> would increase the informative value and would allow easier filtering.
>
> ..
>
> --
> http://lazaridis.com
>
>
--
Bill Atkins
Ilias Lazaridis
> Request granted. The community has officially introduced these tags.
>
> Happy?
very.
>
> Bill
>
> On 4/19/05, Ilias Lazaridis <il...@lazaridis.com> wrote:
>
>>may I ask the community to introduce a tag, e.g. "[ADVOC]" or "[ADVO]"
>>or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
>>
>>would increase the informative value and would allow easier filtering.
>>
>>..
>>
>>--
>>http://lazaridis.com
>>
>>
>
>
>
Nikolai Weibull
> may I ask the community to introduce a tag, e.g. "[ADVOC]" or "[ADVO]"
> or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
I thought we were using [ADV] for that, but perhaps it [ADV] actually
stood for advertisement or advice.
Seriously, though, how many of these threads do we get? Perhaps it
would be even better to break up ruby-talk into more mailing-lists,
instead of using a bunch of tags?,
nikolai
--
Nikolai Weibull: now available free of charge at http://bitwi.se/!
Born in Chicago, IL USA; currently residing in Gothenburg, Sweden.
main(){printf(&linux["\021%six\012\0"],(linux)["have"]+"fun"-97);}
Austin Ziegler
> or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
>
> would increase the informative value and would allow easier filtering.
You can ask.
Doesn't mean you'll get it.
Seriously, I don't see the value in such a tag, the way that [ANN]
does. I personally don't plan on using such a tag -- if I am
discussing my efforts toward advocating Ruby, I consider that general
interest.
-austin
--
Austin Ziegler * halos...@gmail.com
* Alternate: aus...@halostatue.ca
Ilias Lazaridis
> On 4/19/05, Ilias Lazaridis <il...@lazaridis.com> wrote:
>
>>may I ask the community to introduce a tag, e.g. "[ADVOC]" or "[ADVO]"
>>or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
>>
>>would increase the informative value and would allow easier filtering.
>
> You can ask.
>
> Doesn't mean you'll get it.
obvious
> Seriously, I don't see the value in such a tag, the way that [ANN]
> does. I personally don't plan on using such a tag -- if I am
> discussing my efforts toward advocating Ruby, I consider that general
> interest.
what you consider it is irrelevant.
what readers consider it is relevant.
that's what are tag's for: the reader to decides
> -austin
Austin Ziegler
You misspelled "author". Do get your terminology right -- but you have
a problem with that, don't you?
Martin Ankerl
>> does. I personally don't plan on using such a tag -- if I am
>> discussing my efforts toward advocating Ruby, I consider that general
>> interest.
> what you consider it is irrelevant.
What makes Austin's comment irrelevant? He certainly is a reader. You
have an opinion, he has an opinion. Although you do not share his
opinion, you most certainly have to respect it. You can request whatever
you want, nobody will care because you are not in the position to demand
anything from anyone. In fact, no one is: newsgroups are democracy, not
dictatorship. If you have a suggestion, as you can see it is discussed.
If people like it, it may be used; if not, you have to live with this.
martinus
Dmitry V. Sabanin
> may I ask the community to introduce a tag, e.g. "[ADVOC]" or
> "[ADVO]" or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
> would increase the informative value and would allow easier
> filtering.
>
> ..
--
sdmitry -=- Dmitry V. Sabanin
http://muravey.net
vruz
> or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
> would increase the informative value and would allow easier filtering.
there seems to be some consensus among a number of users of this maillist.
they believe you should tag your messages as [ILIAS].
that would increase the informative value and would allow easier filtering.
Nikolai Weibull
> Can we please introduce tag [TROLL]?
Yes. Lately it seems that the need for a [TROLL] tag has increased
exponentially with the number of posts originating in .gr and perhaps
a new tag “would increase the informative value and would allow for
easier filtering”,
Bill Atkins
Josef 'Jupp' Schugt
Ilias Lazaridis wrote:
> may I ask the community to introduce a tag, e.g. "[ADVOC]" or
> "[ADVO]" or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
Problem in all cases is that the initial 'ADV' may result in false UCE
alerts. What about the following?
[R-VOCACY]
This tag avoids the 'ADV' triptychon of the beast, sounds similar to
'advocacy', has the Ruby 'R' and is built in the same way as
ad-vocacy.
Josef 'Jupp' Schugt
--
Rome. Some hundred clerics have been arrested after repeatedly
polluting the air of the Italian capital.
Neil Stevens
> Seriously, I don't see the value in such a tag, the way that [ANN]
> does. I personally don't plan on using such a tag -- if I am
> discussing my efforts toward advocating Ruby, I consider that general
> interest.
Some of us just get annoyed at the people who clog us this list with stuff
that has nothing to do with using ruby, or making ruby more useful.
I don't see the value in hyperventilating at every media mention of ruby,
or in various language competitions, or in any other advocacy discussion.
Just keep on using ruby, or making ruby easier to use, and you've done all
you can do.
--
Neil Stevens - ne...@hakubi.us
'A republic, if you can keep it.' -- Benjamin Franklin
Ryan Davis
Likewise, there is another group that believes that nobody should
respond to Ilias at all. It worked for the lispers. I guess this is
another area where the lisp community proves to be years ahead of
everyone else. It only took them from Aug 2002 to Oct 2002 to ignore
him out of the group.
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?q=group:comp.lang.lisp+author:Ilias
--
I know that you believe you understand what you think I said but,
I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.
James Britt
>
> Likewise, there is another group that believes that nobody should
> respond to Ilias at all.
Thank you.
James
Ilias Lazaridis
> At Tue, 19 Apr 2005 14:09:34 +0900, Ilias Lazaridis wrote:
>
>> may I ask the community to introduce a tag, e.g. "[ADVOC]" or
>> "[ADVO]" or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
>
> Problem in all cases is that the initial 'ADV' may result in false
> UCE alerts.
I understand.
the would detect "ADVERTISMENT".
> What about the following?
>
> [R-VOCACY]
>
> This tag avoids the 'ADV' triptychon of the beast, sounds similar to
> 'advocacy', has the Ruby 'R' and is built in the same way as
> ad-vocacy.
I understand you thought, but it's not selfexplaining.
-
possibly [MEDIA] or [NEWS] is more adequate - normally someone mentions
something from somewhere.
> Josef 'Jupp' Schugt
.
Ilias Lazaridis
someone should tell those 'superstars' that my messages are all tagged with:
sender = il...@lazaridis.com
.
Ilias Lazaridis
> On Tue, 19 Apr 2005 22:20:33 +0900, Austin Ziegler wrote:
>
>>Seriously, I don't see the value in such a tag, the way that [ANN]
>>does. I personally don't plan on using such a tag -- if I am
>>discussing my efforts toward advocating Ruby, I consider that general
>>interest.
>
> Some of us just get annoyed at the people who clog us this list with stuff
> that has nothing to do with using ruby, or making ruby more useful.
I understand your frustration.
> I don't see the value in hyperventilating at every media mention of ruby,
> or in various language competitions, or in any other advocacy discussion.
but other people see the value in this.
you should tolerate this.
-
you wrote "media mention of ruby"
media...
> Just keep on using ruby, or making ruby easier to use, and you've done all
> you can do.
that's why tag's are for.
to allow people to post (even off-topic "[OT]").
and to allow people to filter.
-
comp.lang.ruby.media = comp.lang.ruby - subject: [MEDIA] ...
-
I like the '[MEDIA]' tag.
.
Ryan Davis
Yes, but some of us 'superstars' would like to filter out everyone who
responds to you as well. It would increase informative value (by
improving the signal to noise ratio) and allow for easier filtering.
Ilias Lazaridis
> On Apr 19, 2005, at 6:14 PM, Ilias Lazaridis wrote:
>> vruz wrote:
>>
>>>> may I ask the community to introduce a tag, e.g. "[ADVOC]" or "[ADVO]"
>>>> or "[ADVOCACY]" for ruby advocacy related threads?
>>>> would increase the informative value and would allow easier filtering.
>>>
>>> there seems to be some consensus among a number of users of this
>>> maillist.
>>> they believe you should tag your messages as [ILIAS].
>>> that would increase the informative value and would allow easier
>>> filtering.
>>
>> someone should tell those 'superstars' that my messages are all tagged
>> with:
>> sender = il...@lazaridis.com
>
> Yes, but some of us 'superstars' would like to filter out everyone who
> responds to you as well. It would increase informative value (by
> improving the signal to noise ratio) and allow for easier filtering.
if (sender==ilias@laz..) do (thread.ignore)
.
Ilias Lazaridis
>>> Seriously, I don't see the value in such a tag, the way that [ANN]
>>> does. I personally don't plan on using such a tag -- if I am
>>> discussing my efforts toward advocating Ruby, I consider that general
>>> interest.
>>
>> what you consider it is irrelevant.
>
> What makes Austin's comment irrelevant? He certainly is a reader. You
please keep the coherence of my writings, if you want me to take your
writings serious.
.
Ilias Lazaridis
> On 4/19/05, Ilias Lazaridis <il...@lazaridis.com> wrote:
>
>>what you consider it is irrelevant.
>>
>>what readers consider it is relevant.
>>
>>that's what are tag's for: the reader to decides
>
> You misspelled "author". Do get your terminology right -- but you have
> a problem with that, don't you?
I have a problem with masses of non-categorized topics, which makes
filtering difficult.
that's why I opened this thread, to make this suggestion.
> -austin
.
Bill Atkins
On 4/19/05, Ilias Lazaridis <il...@lazaridis.com> wrote:
>
> ..
>
> --
> http://lazaridis.com
>
>
--
Bill Atkins
Thomas Kirchner
> please keep the coherence of my writings, if you want me to take your
> writings serious.
I can't resist anymore. Keeping the coherence of your writings would
involve deliberately obscuring everything we write. Seriously, please add
an [ILIAS] tag to all your mail. Plonking you isn't enough, your entire
threads are useless...
Francis Hwang
I have to say that I have no idea what the big fuss is about. If you
find Ilias irritating, just ignore what he says. How hard is that?
That's what I do, and it's no trouble at all.
Ruby's getting bigger every year, and it's attracting all sorts of
people with all sorts of personalities. Some of them make arguments
differently than we're used to. Some of them ask questions differently
than we're used to. Some of them even like Java.
So how are we going to respond to the new diversity? By figuring out
how to accommodate newcomers or by yelling at them 'til they conform to
our own personal style?
Are we looking for converts, or heretics?
I mean, I can't help but thinking that a bunch of people are wasting
too much energy on bitching about other people, and too little energy
on learning how to use a ML/newsgroup client with decent threading
support.
And far, far too little energy writing more code.
Francis Hwang
http://fhwang.net/
Thomas Kirchner
> So how are we going to respond to the new diversity? By figuring out
> how to accommodate newcomers or by yelling at them 'til they conform to
> our own personal style?
I'm not trying to force anyone into any style. I love ruby, I love the
community here; I think it's the most helpful and positive force we could
have for such a nice language, and it helps to promote itself. Newbies
are great, I was one, and they constantly bring new life (and projects)
into our community.
The problem is that Ilias reduces everyone's motive and efficiency,
while giving nothing back. He claims he's doing "evaluations", which
if done constructively could help. However, he doesn't listen to
anything anyone says, no matter how much more experienced they are,
and often goes into completely unrelated rants that are too rude even
for an [OT] marker. I try to be sensitive about his... how shall I put
it... failure to grasp the English language, as I know many posters
aren't native speakers. I've had to deal with him in several
newsgroups - I have a feeling you haven't had the pleasure :)
> I mean, I can't help but thinking that a bunch of people are wasting
> too much energy on bitching about other people, and too little energy
> on learning how to use a ML/newsgroup client with decent threading
> support.
You're right, there's a lot of bitching, and I wish it could be avoided.
Ilias is just prolific. I'm sure more people would simply ignore the
threads if it were easy to do so - and if you can provide a mutt macro
that can somehow delete his threads and all replies without some sort of
[ilias] tag, I'd love it.
> And far, far too little energy writing more code.
I write plenty of code, contribute to many open-source projects, and don't
think this has anything to do with mailing list courtesy.
Francis Hwang
> The problem is that Ilias reduces everyone's motive and efficiency,
> while giving nothing back. He claims he's doing "evaluations", which
> if done constructively could help. However, he doesn't listen to
> anything anyone says, no matter how much more experienced they are,
> and often goes into completely unrelated rants that are too rude even
> for an [OT] marker. I try to be sensitive about his... how shall I put
> it... failure to grasp the English language, as I know many posters
> aren't native speakers. I've had to deal with him in several
> newsgroups - I have a feeling you haven't had the pleasure :)
No, I haven't even had the pleasure of dealing with him in this
newsgroup. Because I don't read his posts.
>> I mean, I can't help but thinking that a bunch of people are wasting
>> too much energy on bitching about other people, and too little energy
>> on learning how to use a ML/newsgroup client with decent threading
>> support.
>
> You're right, there's a lot of bitching, and I wish it could be
> avoided.
> Ilias is just prolific. I'm sure more people would simply ignore the
> threads if it were easy to do so - and if you can provide a mutt macro
> that can somehow delete his threads and all replies without some sort
> of
> [ilias] tag, I'd love it.
Doesn't mutt support message threading? Isn't it fairly easy to see
which threads are started by Ilias, and ignore them?
Nobody is forcing you to read every message sent out on ruby-talk.
Francis Hwang
http://fhwang.net/