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Which editor for Perl hacking are you using

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John Bokma

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Dec 20, 2007, 11:52:26 PM12/20/07
to
Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).

I am currently using Textpad, but in the very near future I am moving to
GNU/Linux. I've some experience with using vi(m) for editing work, and
have printed both the emacs and vim manual, but not sure which one to
start reading first.

I've had a short peek at Komodo Edit, but considered the start up time way
too high. Ages ago I had a peek at Eclipse, but not sure if I am the IDE
kind of guy (I manage quite ok with a "perldoc" keymark in Firefox, and
perldoc on the cli most of the time).

--
John

http://johnbokma.com/mexit/2007/12/20/

RedGrittyBrick

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Dec 21, 2007, 4:31:31 AM12/21/07
to
John Bokma wrote:
> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
> using to write Perl,

vim

> and why (if you want to share).

a) It was the Unix editor I learned concurrent with learning Perl.
b) It's good.
c) It's available on most operating systems.
d) Inertia.

If I'd started with Emacs I imagine I'd still be using Emacs.

>
> I am currently using Textpad, but in the very near future I am moving to
> GNU/Linux. I've some experience with using vi(m) for editing work, and
> have printed both the emacs and vim manual, but not sure which one to
> start reading first.

If you've some experience with vim, I suggest you continue on that path.

>
> I've had a short peek at Komodo Edit, but considered the start up time way
> too high. Ages ago I had a peek at Eclipse, but not sure if I am the IDE
> kind of guy (I manage quite ok with a "perldoc" keymark in Firefox, and
> perldoc on the cli most of the time).
>

I use Eclipse for Java but I see no need to use an IDE for Perl. YMMV.

Josef Moellers

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Dec 21, 2007, 5:03:39 AM12/21/07
to
John Bokma wrote:
> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
> using to write Perl,

vim

> and why (if you want to share).

I started with ed, dispising full-screen-editors, then learned that vi
was like ed but full-screen (and it was able to solve a maze ;-), now
I'm using vim.

> I am currently using Textpad, but in the very near future I am moving to
> GNU/Linux. I've some experience with using vi(m) for editing work, and
> have printed both the emacs and vim manual, but not sure which one to
> start reading first.
>
> I've had a short peek at Komodo Edit, but considered the start up time way
> too high. Ages ago I had a peek at Eclipse, but not sure if I am the IDE
> kind of guy (I manage quite ok with a "perldoc" keymark in Firefox, and
> perldoc on the cli most of the time).

I sometimes wonder whether using an IDE would help. As the name implies
it's an *integrated* development environment, where you have the
documentation readily available and some help in getting the syntax
right. But I'm too much of a "toolbox" person to be using these big,
monolithic beasts. Maybe that will change.

Happy holidays,

Josef
--
These are my personal views and not those of Fujitsu Siemens Computers!
Josef Möllers (Pinguinpfleger bei FSC)
If failure had no penalty success would not be a prize (T. Pratchett)
Company Details: http://www.fujitsu-siemens.com/imprint.html

gamo

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Dec 21, 2007, 6:26:04 AM12/21/07
to
On Fri, 21 Dec 2007, John Bokma wrote:

> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
> using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).
>

JED is a wonderful editor. Especially in EDT mode.
If you try it and learn how to use the numeric keypad
to operate, you will be assimilated.

--
http://www.telecable.es/personales/gamo/
perl -E 'say 111_111_111**2;'

Pavel Lepin

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Dec 21, 2007, 6:47:31 AM12/21/07
to

John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> wrote in
<Xns9A0CE8B10A...@130.133.1.4>:
> Please no editor war...

I'll specifically mention then that there is an awful lot of
good editors and IDEs of all stripes out there, and I
imagine most of them would work well for writing in Perl.

> but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're using

> to write Perl...

gvim

> and why (if you want to share).

It does everything I need from a text editor, it does it
well, it's lightweight, powerful, ubiquitous, and good for
reducing repetitive strain injury due to it's non-reliance
on chords, and most features being invokable without moving
your hands away from the home row.

elisp sounds like a wonderful idea, but I'm too lazy to move
to a different editor when I have one that works so well
for me. Getting acquainted with vile is on my TODO-list,
though.

--
...also, I submit that we all must honourably commit seppuku
right now rather than serve the Dark Side by producing the
HTML 5 spec.

Michele Dondi

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Dec 21, 2007, 7:24:57 AM12/21/07
to
On 21 Dec 2007 04:52:26 GMT, John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> wrote:

>Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're

jed

>using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).

I stumbled upon it. (Long story not worth, but I was searching for
emacs, go figure!)

It suits my needs.

(As someone else also wrote:) inertia.

It has Borland's IDE's like keybindings which I got used to many years
ago.


Michele
--
{$_=pack'B8'x25,unpack'A8'x32,$a^=sub{pop^pop}->(map substr
(($a||=join'',map--$|x$_,(unpack'w',unpack'u','G^<R<Y]*YB='
.'KYU;*EVH[.FHF2W+#"\Z*5TI/ER<Z`S(G.DZZ9OX0Z')=~/./g)x2,$_,
256),7,249);s/[^\w,]/ /g;$ \=/^J/?$/:"\r";print,redo}#JAPH,

Martijn Lievaart

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Dec 21, 2007, 7:56:05 AM12/21/07
to
On Fri, 21 Dec 2007 09:31:31 +0000, RedGrittyBrick wrote:

> John Bokma wrote:
>> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice
>> you're using to write Perl,
>
> vim

Emacs

>
>> and why (if you want to share).
>
> a) It was the Unix editor I learned concurrent with learning Perl.

Ditto.

> b) It's good.

Ditto.

> c) It's available on most operating systems.

It's available on all machines I use. Here Vi has an advantage and vim a
slight advantage.

> d) Inertia.

Ditto.

>
> If I'd started with Emacs I imagine I'd still be using Emacs.
>

I hated vi and I hated Emacs. But Emacs let me do what I wanted to do and
vi didn't. Nowadays, there is not much between vim and Emacs, but in
those days there was.

>> I am currently using Textpad, but in the very near future I am moving
>> to GNU/Linux. I've some experience with using vi(m) for editing work,
>> and have printed both the emacs and vim manual, but not sure which one
>> to start reading first.
>
> If you've some experience with vim, I suggest you continue on that path.

Learning Emacs is rewarding, but it's learning curve is even steeper than
vim.

>> I've had a short peek at Komodo Edit, but considered the start up time
>> way too high. Ages ago I had a peek at Eclipse, but not sure if I am
>> the IDE kind of guy (I manage quite ok with a "perldoc" keymark in
>> Firefox, and perldoc on the cli most of the time).

Like you I don't have use for an IDE, except as a language aware editor.
With the current crop of IDEs, maybe there is a good one you like. A good
modern IDE should be usuable out of the box, while both vim and Emacs
mean you have some learning and getting used to ahead.

HTH,
M4

Lars Eighner

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Dec 21, 2007, 8:01:06 AM12/21/07
to
In our last episode, <Xns9A0CE8B10A...@130.133.1.4>, the lovely
and talented John Bokma broadcast on comp.lang.perl.misc:

> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
> using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).

Joe. What's not to like? Color for just about any language you can think
of, "modeless" so it doesn't have the steep (yeah, I know, really shallow)
learning curve of vi, unlike emacs it is completely customizable so if you
want to avoid cramps in your left hand you can, powerful and easy macros.

--
Lars Eighner <http://larseighner.com/> use...@larseighner.com
Countdown: 396 days to go.

De Vliegende Hollander

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Dec 21, 2007, 8:18:04 AM12/21/07
to
The sentient life form John Bokma posted the following:

> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
> using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).

gvim/vim with Perl syntax highlighting.

Very powerful and it's available for many, many platforms, so that I can
always use it.

Joost Diepenmaat

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Dec 21, 2007, 9:10:47 AM12/21/07
to
John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> writes:

> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
> using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).

The last two years I've been using emacs exclusively (I've used it on
and off for much longer) and forced myself to really get to know
it. This takes time, but IMHO it's definitely worth it.

I'm also working on my Lisp knowledge, so having an editor that's
programmable* in Lisp is cool.

If you want to try emacs for perl hacking, make sure you use cperl-mode
instead of perl-mode. Other cool things I've found useful:

additional minor modes - the following work with many major modes, not
just perl:

compile-mode: run your perl code from emacs and jump to errors / warnings.

imenu-mode: adds a pulldown menu with package/function declarations in
the current file. Very simple but useful if you want a short file
overview/navigation and haven't got to grips with all the keyboard
commands.

outline-mode: takes the idea of imenu-mode but lets you fold/move
packages and functions around. Very useful when you've got a large file
and you want to have an overview of the file's structure / group related
functions together / move to some other part of the file. The default
keyboard commands are too complex, though. You really want to set them up
differently.

cedet: makes emacs look more like an IDE: adds buffers with speedbar /
file browser / package inspection etc. Also does some auto-completion
though that seems to be tuned more for static languages like C++ / Java.

All of these you can find from EmacsWiki:

http://www.emacswiki.org/
http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/PerlLanguage

Just recently I've been looking at Sepia, which IMO could become the
best thing that's happend to perl/emacs in years: real autocompletion,
live inspection etc. Based on the Lisp/Slime interactive development style.

http://search.cpan.org/dist/Sepia/


* This is a huge understatement. Gnu/X Emacsen really aren't
programmable editors. They're environments for running/building
interactive applications that involve text editing.

Joost.

Lawrence Statton

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Dec 21, 2007, 10:27:51 AM12/21/07
to
John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> writes:

> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
> using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).

Emacs w/ psvn, cperl, tramp and MMM (for mason/html). Mostly because
I've used emacs for darn-near-everything since 1987.

--
Lawrence Statton - lawre...@abaluon.abaom s/aba/c/g
Computer software consists of only two components: ones and
zeros, in roughly equal proportions. All that is required is to
place them into the correct order.

Petr Vileta

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Dec 21, 2007, 10:09:09 AM12/21/07
to
John Bokma wrote:
> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice
> you're using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).
>
> I've had a short peek at Komodo Edit, but considered the start up
> time way too high. Ages ago I had a peek at Eclipse, but not sure if
> I am the IDE kind of guy (I manage quite ok with a "perldoc" keymark
> in Firefox, and perldoc on the cli most of the time).
I'm using Komodo on Win and Linux because this is a more then and editor only.
I use Komodo debugger for debug my Perl and PHP scripts and I'm happy ;-)
--
Petr Vileta, Czech republic
(My server rejects all messages from Yahoo and Hotmail. Send me your
mail from another non-spammer site please.)

Please reply to <petr AT practisoft DOT cz>

John M. Gamble

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Dec 21, 2007, 12:54:59 PM12/21/07
to
In article <fkg321$ags$1...@nntp.fujitsu-siemens.com>,

Josef Moellers <josef.m...@fujitsu-siemens.com> wrote:
>John Bokma wrote:
>> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
>> using to write Perl,
>
>vim
>

vim and jedit.

>> and why (if you want to share).
>
>I started with ed, dispising full-screen-editors, then learned that vi

Huh, me too (an ed variant but same principle).

>was like ed but full-screen (and it was able to solve a maze ;-), now

(*) Maze?

>I'm using vim.
>

--
-john

February 28 1997: Last day libraries could order catalogue cards
from the Library of Congress.

Jürgen Exner

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Dec 21, 2007, 1:02:41 PM12/21/07
to
On 21 Dec 2007 04:52:26 GMT, John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> wrote:

>Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
>using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).

emacs with CPerl mode.

When I started I could never figure out how to convince vi to do what I
wanted it to do, so I switches to the most powerful editor of the time.
Not to mention that for emacs you can write your own extensions to do
whatever you can imagine.

And now 2 decades later I am still happy with it.

jue

Keith Keller

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Dec 21, 2007, 1:25:49 PM12/21/07
to
On 2007-12-21, John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> wrote:
> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
> using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).

I use both vi/vim and nedit, mainly because I use vi/vim and nedit for
my other editing tasks. (I picked vi because, at the time, it was
smaller and more likely to be available on a small and/or embedded
system (like a rescue floppy (!)) than emacs.)

> I am currently using Textpad, but in the very near future I am moving to
> GNU/Linux. I've some experience with using vi(m) for editing work, and
> have printed both the emacs and vim manual, but not sure which one to
> start reading first.

Well, just from the vi/emacs standpoint, it's pretty much a religious
war (or inertial). You might as well flip a coin. For other editors, I
imagine just trying each of them for an hour or a day will be more
instructive than advice from random usenet posters. ;-)

--keith

--
kkeller...@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us
(try just my userid to email me)
AOLSFAQ=http://www.therockgarden.ca/aolsfaq.txt
see X- headers for PGP signature information

Thrill5

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Dec 21, 2007, 2:10:36 PM12/21/07
to

"John Bokma" <jo...@castleamber.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9A0CE8B10A...@130.133.1.4...

> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
> using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).
>
> I am currently using Textpad, but in the very near future I am moving to
> GNU/Linux. I've some experience with using vi(m) for editing work, and
> have printed both the emacs and vim manual, but not sure which one to
> start reading first.
>
ActiveState Visual Perl for Visual Studio 2003

It's a shame ActiveState choose to discontinue this product instead of
putting into the public domain, since it doesn't work with later versions of
Visual Studio. Built-in debugging support (using all the debugging features
of VS, such as breakpoints, watches, etc). The editor has bracket matching,
auto-indenting, highlighting code that issues compiler warnings and errors
as you type, and a raft of other features. I'm pretty sure that Komodo has
all of the same features so even though it might take some time to learn all
of the features, you will gain that time back many times over because you
can code faster by finding errors as you write. I never have to go back and
fix and compiler errors or warnings, because I never have any! It even
understands compiler directives (such as "use warnings" and "no
warnings('uninitialized').
Visual Perl does not have (or I've never used it) any integrated help system
for Perl. I keep my "Programming Perl" reference handy in those cases.

l v

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Dec 21, 2007, 3:29:58 PM12/21/07
to

Perl Builder by Solutionsoft.

--

Len

TonyV

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Dec 21, 2007, 4:24:00 PM12/21/07
to
On Dec 20, 11:52 pm, John Bokma <j...@castleamber.com> wrote:
> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice you're
> using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).

I do almost all of my development on Windows, so I use Notepad++.
It's got a good featureset, its free, and handles lots of languages
and file formats. I used to use PSPad for the same reasons, but I
like Notepad++'s customization abilities a little better. PSPad has
an excellent built-in FTP client, but I've started using a copy of
NetDrive to handle mounting FTP connections as filesystems. Much
easier!

I'm rather fickle, though. I might be using something totally
different tomorrow.

Bob Walton

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Dec 21, 2007, 6:43:06 PM12/21/07
to
John Bokma wrote:
...
VIM, because using a mouse kills my wrist, and with VIM I can do
everything from the keyboard.
--
Bob Walton

Randal L. Schwartz

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Dec 21, 2007, 8:02:13 PM12/21/07
to John Bokma
>>>>> "John" == John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> writes:

John> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice
John> you're using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).

That's like saying "Please - no platform wars, but which is better,
XBOX 360, PS/3, or Wii?". Can't be done. :)

--
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
<mer...@stonehenge.com> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl training!

Joost Diepenmaat

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Dec 21, 2007, 8:35:58 PM12/21/07
to
mer...@stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) writes:

>>>>>> "John" == John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> writes:
>
> John> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of choice
> John> you're using to write Perl, and why (if you want to share).
>
> That's like saying "Please - no platform wars, but which is better,
> XBOX 360, PS/3, or Wii?". Can't be done. :)

I think the replies so far have been very polite and informative. In any
case the most objective answer is always "try them all and see what you
like best". From what I've seen here the reply has been to put forth a
good case for why people use what they use, without resorting to flaming
the other opintions, which is probably the best kind of reply you can expect.

Cheers,
Joost.

John Bokma

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Dec 21, 2007, 8:37:15 PM12/21/07
to
mer...@stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) wrote:

>>>>>> "John" == John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> writes:
>
> John> Please no editor war, but I am curious, what's the editor of
> choice John> you're using to write Perl, and why (if you want to
> share).
>
> That's like saying "Please - no platform wars, but which is better,
> XBOX 360, PS/3, or Wii?". Can't be done. :)

So far it still goes very good.

And of course I want to know, which editor you are using ;-)

--
John

Arachnids near Coyolillo - part 1
http://johnbokma.com/mexit/2006/05/04/arachnids-coyolillo-1.html

Keith Keller

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Dec 22, 2007, 12:53:47 AM12/22/07
to
On 2007-12-22, Randal L. Schwartz <mer...@stonehenge.com> wrote:
>
> That's like saying "Please - no platform wars, but which is better,
> XBOX 360, PS/3, or Wii?". Can't be done. :)

I prefer the PS/2. The Model 80 was pretty nice. ;-)

Josef Moellers

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Dec 22, 2007, 3:27:30 AM12/22/07
to
John M. Gamble wrote:
> In article <fkg321$ags$1...@nntp.fujitsu-siemens.com>,
> Josef Moellers <josef.m...@fujitsu-siemens.com> wrote:

>> was like ed but full-screen (and it was able to solve a maze ;-), now
>
> (*) Maze?

'that a question?

There was an ingenious script using :map and yank buffers that was able
to traverse a randomly generated map.

--
Mails please to josef dot moellers
and I'm on gmx dot de.

david...@gmail.com

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Dec 22, 2007, 4:21:38 AM12/22/07
to
On Dec 20, 8:52 pm, John Bokma <j...@castleamber.com> wrote:
> Pwhat's the editor of choice you're using to write Perl

For many years it was Nedit. Sometimes Jedit when I didn't have a
proper X-server available. Lately it's Komodo.

> and why (if you want to share).

My main computer at work is a Window$ boxen, but I maintain programs
on AIX servers. So I need something that works seamlessly over ssh,
and I personally dislike VI/VIM, and I was intimidated by EMACS (egad
- I'd rather learn LaTeX). Nedit is the only graphical editor that
runs worth a fig over an ssh connection (Kate is nice, but SLOW SLOW
SLOW over a remote connection). Nedit has the best syntax
highlighting for Perl I have ever seen.

Jedit (with the SSH plugin) works OK, but syntax highlighting and
performance (it's Java) leave much to be desired.

Lately I use Komodo. Why? Somebody else (my employer) pays the
bill. If Komodo were free, I bet most of the people in this group
would be using it! Nothing else comes even close. Right now I've got
22 Perl programs on nine different servers open in a Komodo window.
It talks to cvs or svn, and has integrated Perl debugging (on the
remote host), and a boatload of other great stuff. It works
seamlessly through ssh tunnels. If my computer crashes (as Window$
tends to do) then I loose nothing.

--
David Filmer (http://DavidFilmer.com)

rahed

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Dec 22, 2007, 8:30:53 AM12/22/07
to
John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> writes:
> And of course I want to know, which editor you are using ;-)

I'd say emacs if his agent is gnus.

--
Radek

Randal L. Schwartz

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Dec 22, 2007, 11:56:04 AM12/22/07
to
>>>>> "rahed" == rahed <rah...@gmail.com> writes:

rahed> John Bokma <jo...@castleamber.com> writes:
>> And of course I want to know, which editor you are using ;-)

rahed> I'd say emacs if his agent is gnus.

Indeed. Once a month or so, I type "screen emacs" on my server,
and ssh into it from day to day and do *all* of my work, even firing
up mail and shell windows inside this single instance of emacs.

People who complain about the Emacs startup time are not using Emacs
properly. :) *What* startup time? It'd be like complaining about
the Firefox startup time every time you wanted to go to a *different*
web page. :)

RedGrittyBrick

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Dec 23, 2007, 9:44:19 AM12/23/07
to
Keith Keller wrote:
> On 2007-12-22, Randal L. Schwartz <mer...@stonehenge.com> wrote:
>> That's like saying "Please - no platform wars, but which is better,
>> XBOX 360, PS/3, or Wii?". Can't be done. :)
>
> I prefer the PS/2. The Model 80 was pretty nice. ;-)

Hmm,
http://members.chello.at/theodor.lauppert/games/ascii.htm

Michele Dondi

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Dec 23, 2007, 10:48:04 AM12/23/07
to
On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 02:35:58 +0100, Joost Diepenmaat <jo...@zeekat.nl>
wrote:

>> That's like saying "Please - no platform wars, but which is better,
>> XBOX 360, PS/3, or Wii?". Can't be done. :)
>
>I think the replies so far have been very polite and informative. In any

Ok: my editor is better than yours. Yours sucks. An impolite and
uninformative answer, eventually! :)

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