* WINDOWS 95 REALLY REALLY Dangerous ???!! *
Brian Rampersaud
HI!
Sorry, I know that this is unappropriate in this newsgroup, but I DO
monitor this one constantly, so here I go ..
Well, from what I have heard, MS WINDOWS 95 has a file called REG.INI or
something. When anyone logs into MSN (Microsoft Network), that file is
uploaded to them automatically!
The PROBLEM of course, is that this file contains ALL information about
yer computer, such as its hardware AND all the software that is on it!
This is just WRONG, no?
Obviously, to protect our "privacy," one can make a fake REG.INI file,
and as such, Microsoft could no longer sell this information (huh? Nahhh
.. Bill wouldn't do THAT, would he?) for million of $$. Hmmm ... ya
think some organization would buy this data if they knew all users had a
fake INI? Gee ... if this IS true, don't u think it would we wise that
ALL users were informed of this BEFORE they logged onto MSN?
(flame MS, not me please)
bRiAn
UNIVERSITY of TORONTO
computing disciplines facility
g4s...@cdf.utoronto.ca
Michael Schoebel
>Well, from what I have heard, MS WINDOWS 95 has a file called REG.INI or
>something. When anyone logs into MSN (Microsoft Network), that file is
>uploaded to them automatically!
Oh come on! Do you really believe anything that you read in InfoWorld?
This whole story is a lie!
Michael
Jeff Dickey
Please keep your slanderous flames to yourself. Thank you. Brian was
talking about a "feature" of Winblows 95 that has been known and talked
about for some time on other groups and mailing lists; attempting to
shout the guy down and insult his intelligence for quoting a widely
read industry rag, WITHOUT providing any information to counter his,
is just asking for a flamefest/mailbomb/legal action (multiple choice).
Do try to engage the cranial protoplasm before pounding on the keys.
Jeff
(speaking only for myself and the countless multitudes, NOT for Borland)
In article <3vjeqq$d...@ra.ins.de>, msch...@bochum.netsurf.de says...
Jeffrey S. Kirkham
Casey Hawthorne
>Well, from what I have heard, MS WINDOWS 95 has a file called REG.INI or
>something. When anyone logs into MSN (Microsoft Network), that file is
>uploaded to them automatically!
>The PROBLEM of course, is that this file contains ALL information about
>yer computer, such as its hardware AND all the software that is on it!
> bRiAn
First: The purpose is probably to discover how many copies of Office
are out there, exceeding the number of copies Microsoft actually made.
Second: To find out how many competitiors to Office exist out there.
But: The serach of your hard drive is not sent in if you don't
register by Microsoft News Network.
Casey
Bruce Satinover
g4s...@cdf.toronto.edu says...
>
>
>HI!
>
>Sorry, I know that this is unappropriate in this newsgroup, but I DO
>monitor this one constantly, so here I go ..
I don't know about the rest of the folks up here but thank goodness this
group is being monitored.
>Well, from what I have heard, MS WINDOWS 95 has a file called REG.INI or
>something. When anyone logs into MSN (Microsoft Network), that file is
>uploaded to them automatically!
True, there is a Registry file. When I logged on to MSN I wasn't subjected
to horrible violation of my rights. There are some procedures that BETA
TESTERS occasionally deal with, like bug reports, where it is -requested-
to have the registry downloaded with the report. It does help to find out
if certain programs are behaving badly, whether because of Win95 code
problems, or poor programming by application on your computer.
But of course, being so well informed, I'm sure you just slipped up on
this.
>The PROBLEM of course, is that this file contains ALL information about
>yer computer, such as its hardware AND all the software that is on it!
>
>This is just WRONG, no?
Not if you are trying to remidy a problem.
The question is, are they using your information and making a database of
it and selling it to people.
I don't think so. Bill G dosen't need any more legal suits in his life.
And a class action suit might actually cause Microsoft some grief.
I wonder what database he uses? Might it be the foul Access, or the evil
Visual FoxPro?
>Obviously, to protect our "privacy," one can make a fake REG.INI file,
>and as such, Microsoft could no longer sell this information (huh? Nahhh
>.. Bill wouldn't do THAT, would he?) for million of $$. Hmmm ... ya
>think some organization would buy this data if they knew all users had a
>fake INI? Gee ... if this IS true, don't u think it would we wise that
>ALL users were informed of this BEFORE they logged onto MSN?
I suggest you do something along these lines. Then as you mop up the crap
you'll be dealing with you'll have time to think up a whole new conspiricy
to spam usenet groups with, err...I mean monitor.
If you want to back up your assertions then please do so via e-mail. I
appologise to anyone who dosen't want to read through this idiocy. I'm a
beta tester of Win95. I'm not a big Microsoft fan but I don't have any
need to "expose" an evil agenda anymore than I need to advocate how swell
the new OS is. BTW, it works well and most of the other beta testers have
been impressed.
If MS were illegally recieving information from a persons system they
would be very depressed because there are alot of Delphi users on their
net. Delphi is a competitor to Visual Basic, and to some degree Visual
C++.
Most of the response is very positive and includes testimonials from
people *paid* by Microsoft and their network. I'm probably wasting my time
responding to this foolishness but it does matter to Delphi
users/developers.
Win95 is a reality, most people using win31 will switch to it, if not
immediatly within a year. It's not an issue of whether it's a better OS
than OS2/Warp, WindowsNT, UNIX- this is what a large segment of computer
users will work with.
>(flame MS, not me please)
I'm not going to flame MS (although I find it ironic that they are making
computer users do what IBM wanted to do with OS2, make people get more
powerful computers just to run an OS!) It's almost worth a flame.
As for you, well...you just don't beat up Bambi.
>
> bRiAn
Neil Davies
: Well, from what I have heard, MS WINDOWS 95 has a file called REG.INI or
: uploaded to them automatically!
: The PROBLEM of course, is that this file contains ALL information about
:
: This is just WRONG, no?
While I cannot comment as to the acuracy of this posting, I feel that if
this is true it would not be suprising, and maybe we should not be
suprised given the questionable nature of many of MS's behaviour.
If I found this was true and it had been done to me, my lawyer would be
my next port of call.
Are any of us suprised by such behaviour, given old Bill's total
dominance of the software market? Recently when I enquired into their
current upgrade policy, I found there had been significant increases in
the cost of crossgrading from competing products. I think this is just an
indication of what we can expect as the number of competitors in the
software market becomes ever more restricted.
Neil Davies
===========================================================================
br...@adelaide.dialix.oz.au or br...@cleese.apana.org.au or br...@adam.com.au
Compu$erve: 100035,2443
===========================================================================
Ian Piper
>If MS were illegally recieving information from a persons system
they
>would be very depressed because there are alot of Delphi users on
Isn't that part of the problem - that actually it has not been
established as illegal to gather this sort of information? If it has
I'd love to know.
I am continually fascinated by how little people seem to care about
the information which organisations can gather about them. I think
companies like Microsoft would be very interested in the idea of
gathering profiles of their users, simply as an aid to the targeting
of future services. Whether W95 is being used for this purpose or not,
it must be a consideration in the minds of companies like M$.
I am concerned about this simply because I have little faith in the
value of this sort of profiling. I get loads of junk mail every week,
much of which is targeted to me supposedly as a member of a particular
socio-economic group. Very little of this junk mail is of any value to
me, testimony to the lack of success of this targeting. And I have no
reason to think the quality of this targeting will improve when
detailed electronic information on me is being gathered.
The fact that corporations have such faith in profiling and targeting
when it clearly doesn't work worries me, because they are only going
to get it more wrong in future. What will happen when corporations are
running interactive services and other such stuff, monitoring my
shopping habits, which videos I download to view, which newspapers I
read (aka what my politics are) and so on? What assumptions will they
be making about me?
And the other worry is the potential misuse. What powers will our
governments have to get hold of this information? When I book my
holiday online, who is making a note of the fact that I'll be away
from my home in the first two weeks of June? When I register my
software online, is the registration program picking up credit card
and banking information from documents on my disk?
OK, all very scaremongering and hysterical, I know. But one has to
consider capabilities as the parents of intentions, and these
capabilities are very much here with us.
Sorry for the off-topic posting, but I feel quite strongly about this.
I'll be glad to continue with anyone interested via email.
Ian Piper
---
Mail address: i...@monty.demon.co.uk
Web Home page: http://metro.turnpike.net/M/monty/index.htm
Rune Moberg
jdi...@wpo.borland.com (Jeff Dickey) wrote:
> Please keep your slanderous flames to yourself. Thank you. Brian was
> talking about a "feature" of Winblows 95 that has been known and talked
> about for some time on other groups and mailing lists; attempting to
> shout the guy down and insult his intelligence for quoting a widely
> read industry rag, WITHOUT providing any information to counter his,
> is just asking for a flamefest/mailbomb/legal action (multiple choice).
> Do try to engage the cranial protoplasm before pounding on the keys.
What if the rumour simply isn't true?
It's not true. End of story.
Check REG.INI or whatever yourself.
=\
*=- R.Moberg, author of CD-Player Pro! ftp.cica.indiana.edu:
=/ /win3/sounds/cdppro45.zip
Robert Small
>g4s...@cdf.toronto.edu (Brian Rampersaud) wrote:
>>Well, from what I have heard, MS WINDOWS 95 has a file called REG.INI or
>>something. When anyone logs into MSN (Microsoft Network), that file is
>>uploaded to them automatically!
>>The PROBLEM of course, is that this file contains ALL information about
>>yer computer, such as its hardware AND all the software that is on it!
>> bRiAn
[snip]
>But: The serach of your hard drive is not sent in if you don't
>register by Microsoft News Network.
>Casey
The August 95 copy of Microsoft Communique (the Oz edition) contains a
piece about this.
It claims that "the scan does not upload the user's CONFIG.SYS or
AUTOEXEC.BAT file". "It captures only yhr information that appears on
the user's registration screen"
Look in \windows\reginfo.txt to see what is being sent
==
Bob Small
Rune Moberg
> Most of the response is very positive and includes testimonials from
> people *paid* by Microsoft and their network. I'm probably wasting my time
> responding to this foolishness but it does matter to Delphi
> users/developers.
I did a search for "delphi" in the recent July edition of MSDN (MS Developers
Network), and it turned up a recent article in MSJ (MS Journal) about Delphi.
The author was quite happy with Delphi, didn't praise it as much as I would've
but stuck to the point and even presented an useful example involving a
listbox which I found to be interesting (basically using a font enumeration
function to fill up the listbox directly).
Now, I wonder whether or not MSDN will accept articles involving more
Delphi source code...? hmm... MSDN claim to be compiler unbiased!
Ironically, a couple of weeks ago I made a "VB code beautifier". A small
util that skimped through VB code and indented it correctly. I did of course
implement it in Delphi... :-)
Joe Feenin
>In article <3vjqv4$i...@druid.borland.com>,
>jdi...@wpo.borland.com (Jeff Dickey) wrote:
>> Please keep your slanderous flames to yourself. Thank you. Brian was
>> talking about a "feature" of Winblows 95 that has been known and talked
>> about for some time on other groups and mailing lists; attempting to
>> shout the guy down and insult his intelligence for quoting a widely
>> read industry rag, WITHOUT providing any information to counter his,
>> is just asking for a flamefest/mailbomb/legal action (multiple choice).
>> Do try to engage the cranial protoplasm before pounding on the keys.
>What if the rumour simply isn't true?
>It's not true. End of story.
>Check REG.INI or whatever yourself.
>=\
> *=- R.Moberg, author of CD-Player Pro! ftp.cica.indiana.edu:
>=/ /win3/sounds/cdppro45.zip
Microsoft has stated and as anyone who has used 95 knows that
A: the electronic registration does not send any info you don't allow.
B: It only send system information and the names of software you have
not serial numbers etc.
C: It is for technical support and marketing not catching someone with
an illegal copy of word.
D: If you aren't pirating software why would you even care.
E: Since it isn't true why waste the bandwidth, it is not unlike any
other electronic software registration, it does not gather any
information you wouldn't check on a post card, it is NOT MANDATORY,
and to gather information and transmit it without your permission or
knowledge would be illegal. I have used it and all it does is gather
basic system info and send it if you say OK, you can also say NO.
This person is right it is wrong, Microsoft has publicly stated it is
not true, and since it isn't true and therefore nothing to back up the
fact that it is true then why would one need to justify saying it
wasn't. I will it was in the third to last microsoft WinNews press
release available on their ftp and web sites. I will point out that
OS/2 has a similar thing except OS/2's software does give them the
ability to look inside you computer and fix it via remote, and do
whatever else they want but noone complains about that. Peculiar huh?
Incidently OS/2's is for tech support too sorry guys in this case Big
Brother really IS NOT watching you.
Don Beusee
>
> HI!
>
> Sorry, I know that this is unappropriate in this newsgroup, but I DO
> monitor this one constantly, so here I go ..
>
> something. When anyone logs into MSN (Microsoft Network), that file is
> uploaded to them automatically!
>
> The PROBLEM of course, is that this file contains ALL information about
> yer computer, such as its hardware AND all the software that is on it!
>
>
> and as such, Microsoft could no longer sell this information (huh? Nahhh
> .. Bill wouldn't do THAT, would he?) for million of $$. Hmmm ... ya
> think some organization would buy this data if they knew all users had a
> fake INI? Gee ... if this IS true, don't u think it would we wise that
> ALL users were informed of this BEFORE they logged onto MSN?
>
>
>
>
MS is not "automatically" sending your registration file unless you authorize
it, right? Do you have proof it is sending the file without your authorization?
Isn't it asking you first?
Regards,
Don.
David Egan
>Michael,
>Please keep your slanderous flames to yourself. Thank you. Brian was
>talking about a "feature" of Winblows 95 that has been known and talked
>about for some time on other groups and mailing lists; attempting to
>shout the guy down and insult his intelligence for quoting a widely
>read industry rag, WITHOUT providing any information to counter his,
>is just asking for a flamefest/mailbomb/legal action (multiple choice).
>Do try to engage the cranial protoplasm before pounding on the keys.
>Jeff
>(speaking only for myself and the countless multitudes, NOT for Borland)
>In article <3vjeqq$d...@ra.ins.de>, msch...@bochum.netsurf.de says...
>>
>>g4s...@cdf.toronto.edu (Brian Rampersaud) wrote:
>>
>>>Well, from what I have heard, MS WINDOWS 95 has a file called REG.INI
>or
>>>something. When anyone logs into MSN (Microsoft Network), that file is
>>>uploaded to them automatically!
>>
>>Oh come on! Do you really believe anything that you read in InfoWorld?
>>This whole story is a lie!
>>
>>Michael
>>
>>
Sounds like most of us just really don't know. Folks just jump into
the mess without actually knowing what is going on regarding this
feature.
Last I read (note: I know nothing because I've not seen Windoz95)
This "uploading of your machine configuration" is not as ominous as it
sounds. Yes I would not want someone doing this, taking my system
specifics and sucking them off without asking.
Follow-on articles mentioned that it is clearly marked on the screen
as to whether to allow this.
That's my input (again, just another ignorant stirring up the pot...!)
And yes, Infoworld is not to always be taken seriously.
Edward Rettig
tools palette the menu would begin disappearing and reapperaing,
apparently stuck in a loop. It crashed. The same thing happened to me
in Delphi on one particular application - either when I loaded it, or
when I tried to resize ANY component.
Is this a bug or user error? Has this happened to anyone else? Is
there a fix, or upgrade, to it? Can anyone offer any help?
Thanks.
PS This hasn't happened in other projects, just this one, and the Image
Editor (I recommend, strongly, the Resource Workshop!).
David Prothero
>authorize it, right? Do you have proof it is sending the file
without >your authorization?
>
>Isn't it asking you first?
I'm on MSN and was never asked about this, so if it did send my
SYSTEM.DAT file, then it did so without my permission.
-David Prothero
-International Technology Group
-Salem, Oregon
Don Beusee
> >MS is not "automatically" sending your registration file unless you
> >authorize it, right? Do you have proof it is sending the file
> without >your authorization?
> >
> >Isn't it asking you first?
>
> I'm on MSN and was never asked about this, so if it did send my
> SYSTEM.DAT file, then it did so without my permission.
My question is, what makes you think it did send the file? If I were you, I
would not believe everything I read in a magazine. Microsoft already answered
the claims made by those magazine articles as false and that you are prompted
if you want to send the files or not.
I don't think you would be prompted when you connect to MSN, but when you
install. But I don't have win95, so I cannot say one way or the other yet.
MS is not dumb. They know people would send their lawers after them and thats
the last thing they want/need.
If you are so worried, don't connect to MSN.
Regards,
Don.
jre...@rt66.com
> A: the electronic registration does not send any info you don't allow.
>
> B: It only send system information and the names of software you have
> not serial numbers etc.
>
> C: It is for technical support and marketing not catching someone with
> an illegal copy of word.
I know what it's for, and it's not Tech Support. I for one, will never log on to that network. It's for marketing research. They want to
know what everybody has running on their system, so they will know what marketing decisions to make, what companies to go after,
what's in demand and what to charge.
I believe that is wrong, and I'm also pretty sure it's an illegal advantage they need to get prosecuted and/or sued for. As a programmer, I
don't want them to know what's on my system and I don't want them to have an unfair advantage over me in marketing. Also, as this
network is intended for users besides programmers, think about the ones scared to say no! Bill Gates knows that the average home
user would be scared to say 'No.' He's only giving them that option because he thinks it might avoid him getting nailed for unfair
business practices. Nevertheless, these business practices are unfair and wrong, in my opinion. He has no right. If the information is
needed for Tech Support, why doesn't MS sell a program that compiles that information for future use? Because nobody would buy it.
It's been tried and died so many times by smaller companies that MS knows it's not needed.
I know what it's for.
John Reynolds
Jason Costomiris
: I'm on MSN and was never asked about this, so if it did send my
It does NOT ask when you are using MSN. It asks during Online
registration. AND, it isn't system.dat, that's the registry. If you
want to see what it was going to send, look at reginfo.txt.
--
Jason Costomiris | "...You'll sweat grease."
jco...@netaxs.com |
My employers like me, but not enough | --overheard outside the new
to let me speak for them. | restaurant, "Everything Pork."
Brian Key
>Sorry, I know that this is unappropriate in this newsgroup, but I DO
>monitor this one constantly, so here I go ..
>Well, from what I have heard, MS WINDOWS 95 has a file called REG.INI or
>something. When anyone logs into MSN (Microsoft Network), that file is
>uploaded to them automatically!
>The PROBLEM of course, is that this file contains ALL information about
>yer computer, such as its hardware AND all the software that is on it!
>This is just WRONG, no?
Yes it is wrong - I mean that the whole situation you describe is
wrong because it isn't true. This nonsense has long been denied by
MS, investigated by others and found to be untrue. It's trivial to
monitor what goes to/from your modem, and what does go to/from your
modem is only what the on-screen stuff says - ie. basic registration
stuff. What idiot would attempt to do otherwise?
>(flame MS, not me please)
No, I suspect you'll get flamed...
>
> bRiAn
Brian (who also knows what his shift key is for...)
--
br...@fantasia.demon.co.uk
Brian Key
Jason Costomiris
:[text with some of the worst line breaks I've ever seen!]
: I believe that is wrong, and I'm also pretty sure it's an illegal advantage they need to get prosecuted and/or sued for. As a programmer, I
: don't want them to know what's on my system and I don't want them to have an unfair advantage over me in marketing. Also, as this
: network is intended for users besides programmers, think about the ones scared to say no! Bill Gates knows that the average home
: user would be scared to say 'No.' He's only giving them that option because he thinks it might avoid him getting nailed for unfair
: business practices. Nevertheless, these business practices are unfair and wrong, in my opinion. He has no right. If the information is
: needed for Tech Support, why doesn't MS sell a program that compiles that information for future use? Because nobody would buy it.
: It's been tried and died so many times by smaller companies that MS knows it's not needed.
Nobody says you have to upload the info. How can you get busted for not
uploading this file? Can an investigation be launched for not sending it
in? Go ahead, try to investigate me. I pay for software...
: I know what it's for.
John, remember, just because you are paranoid does not mean they are not
watching you.
And remember kids, "Paranoia is its own reward!"
--
Jason Costomiris | Finger for PGP 2.6.2 Public Key
jco...@netaxs.com | "...You'll sweat grease."
>
> uploading this file? Can an investigation be launched for not sending it
> in? Go ahead, try to investigate me. I pay for software...
>
> : I know what it's for.
>
> John, remember, just because you are paranoid does not mean they are not
> watching you.
It's funny that we defend big corporations while we treat the average person like shit.
It's even more funny that if I was doing what MS was doing ...
I'd be in deep shit!
Galen Raben
: It's funny that we defend big corporations while we treat the average person like shit.
: It's even more funny that if I was doing what MS was doing ...
: I'd be in deep shit!
Just what exactly IS it that MS is doing wrong? Frankly all I see is a big
corporation just doing what we are all trying to do (make a profit).
Just because they have a great marketing dept and are making money means
that they HAVE to be guilty of something?
MS is NOT retrieving your system info unless you tell Windows 95
that it is okay - this is YOUR choice. What's so illegal about that?
This thread should've died long ago. It's already been made clear
several times system info is not being transferred without permission.
MS is not that stupid, otherwise IBM would've owned the market long ago.
- Galen -
gal...@hpgrla.gr.hp.com