Jon Harrop

101 views
Skip to first unread message

Tim Bradshaw

unread,
May 20, 2007, 4:58:52 PM5/20/07
to
Well, I've had enough. Although I'm enjoying bating him enormously, I
realise it's the kind of enjoyment one gets from heroin: fun for sure,
but eventually it eats your life. I find myself hitting refresh to see
what idiocy he's come up with this time. May be I'll check back in
another couple of years.

Rainer Joswig

unread,
May 20, 2007, 5:07:39 PM5/20/07
to
In article <f2qcqq$eh4$1$830f...@news.demon.co.uk>,
Tim Bradshaw <t...@tfeb.org> wrote:

He is a troll and spammer. Since he has no clue, his
postings are not even interesting. He doesn't contribute anything
useful to comp.lang.lisp. Best to ignore and killfile him.
Any discussion with him is just a waste of time...

--
http://lispm.dyndns.org

Message has been deleted

Dan Bensen

unread,
May 20, 2007, 7:30:13 PM5/20/07
to
Tim Bradshaw wrote:
> Well, I've had enough. Although I'm enjoying bating him enormously, I
> realise it's the kind of enjoyment one gets from heroin: fun for sure,
> but eventually it eats your life.

Maybe we should make him our mascot.
"Dr. Frog, the Fabulous Flying Amphibian"
Someone could make up some ascii art that tastefully
blends that impressive Hasselhoff shot with the Toad logo.

--
Dan
www.prairienet.org/~dsb/

Ken Tilton

unread,
May 20, 2007, 8:43:30 PM5/20/07
to

Well I fer one am LMAO as you try to get the monkey off your back.

The thing is that he is viral, wheedling himself into your cortex by
saying things just a hair off the plate, and by turning a deaf ear on
any taunts, the kind of thing to which most trolls make the mistake of
reacting, such that they then get sucked down a black hole of abuse that
no one cares to respond to except troll-seeking missiles like Naggum or
Tilton who just suck them deeper and deeper down the flytrap.

Harrop is immune to that, a true master, prevailing only because you all
are so earnest and decent. He cloaks himself in the protein signature
of plausible computerspeak and sails straight past your immune system.

The best part is, knowing this does not help. And this is why g*d
created killfiles. That drops your exposure to others quoting him. Still
a challenge. But it puts pressure on the Harrop species that grows
ineluctably until the species winks out (only to return, for as some
brilliant wag once observed, "Liars need good memories. Trolls need NG
readers with bad ones.").

The sad thing is that Harrop is smart enough to be contributing to
society, but instead is himself addicted to the hits he sees on his web
site because of his trolling. All I need do to see a hundred-fold jump
in traffic to my Algebra site is say "new demo pages start <here>".
Probably search engines feeding off NG posts, but Harrop does not know
that.

Here is the acid test: I forget who even is doing it, but only when
/that/ person can resist posting the "do not feed the trolls" banner can
we expect the harropodemic to ebb.

I do have some methadone here: replies to Harrop's technical stuff must
be funny, unaggressive, and Lisp-deprecating. Feed a cold, starve a Harrop.

hth, kenneth

ps. Trick #2: Counting a behavior changes it. I am not smart like you
guys. Can someone write the code to print daily/cumulative totals? The
columns should be: count contributed to Harrop thread, count direct
replies to Harrop, count direct replies by Harrop to them, and then a
weighted sucker-score, with (I think) each of those having increasing
weight (1-2-4?). (If Harrop responds directly to you, he has sensed a
fresh blood vein.) Problem. Harrop joins random threads. OK, those are
not harropthreads, so just count direct replies /to/ harrop (but weight
those 4).

Other ideas for the Harrop Index welcome. k


--
http://www.theoryyalgebra.com/

"Algebra is the metaphysics of arithmetic." - John Ray

"As long as algebra is taught in school,
there will be prayer in school." - Cokie Roberts

"Stand firm in your refusal to remain conscious during algebra."
- Fran Lebowitz

"I'm an algebra liar. I figure two good lies make a positive."
- Tim Allen

fireblade

unread,
May 21, 2007, 6:42:07 AM5/21/07
to
Even when dealing with proven trolls don't forgeth the rule saying
"Don't be vicious". I wanted to make Xah Lee and Jon Harrop look bad
but at the end I looked bad , at least in my own eyes.

After I checked what he has to offer came to the same conclusion.


>The sad thing is that Harrop is smart enough to be contributing to
>society, but instead is himself addicted to the hits he sees on his web
>site because of his trolling

That's why a give him a credit and a best free advice I had :
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.lisp/browse_thread/thread/68e2aa891dbbf1b4/d0cd2fcac6fd1c40#d0cd2fcac6fd1c40

If you don't like some troll post a warning sign and ignore him or
just ignore him. Life is to short to waste it on things that just make
you feel bad.

some statistics for comp.lang.lisp :

Top posters
This month
131 j...@ffconsultancy.com
82 jos...@lisp.de
69 p...@p-cos.net
51 pit...@nhplace.com
51 tfb+goo...@tfeb.org
51 randomg...@cyberspace.net
47 fireblade
45 raffaelcavall...@pas-d'espam-s'il-vous-plait-mac.com
44 Joe Marshall
37 p...@informatimago.com

I would give all mine 47 posts for a one really good one.

All time
4127 pit...@world.std.com
3769 ktil...@nyc.rr.com
2822 e...@naggum.no
2332 t...@cley.com
2065 costa...@web.de
2055 e...@naggum.net
1977 amor...@mclink.it
1863 p...@p-cos.net
1833 p...@informatimago.com
1778 marc...@cs.nyu.edu

http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.lisp/about

Ken Tilton

unread,
May 21, 2007, 8:36:10 AM5/21/07
to

fireblade wrote:
> Even when dealing with proven trolls don't forgeth the rule saying
> "Don't be vicious". I wanted to make Xah Lee and Jon Harrop look bad
> but at the end I looked bad , at least in my own eyes.
>
> After I checked what he has to offer came to the same conclusion.

Pull yourself together, man!

>
>>The sad thing is that Harrop is smart enough to be contributing to
>>society, but instead is himself addicted to the hits he sees on his web
>>site because of his trolling
>
>
> That's why a give him a credit and a best free advice I had :
> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.lisp/browse_thread/thread/68e2aa891dbbf1b4/d0cd2fcac6fd1c40#d0cd2fcac6fd1c40
>
> If you don't like some troll post a warning sign and ignore him or
> just ignore him. Life is to short to waste it on things that just make
> you feel bad.

It is the mouse that feels bad, not the cat playing with it.

>
> some statistics for comp.lang.lisp :
>
> Top posters
> This month
> 131 j...@ffconsultancy.com
> 82 jos...@lisp.de
> 69 p...@p-cos.net
> 51 pit...@nhplace.com
> 51 tfb+goo...@tfeb.org
> 51 randomg...@cyberspace.net
> 47 fireblade
> 45 raffaelcavall...@pas-d'espam-s'il-vous-plait-mac.com
> 44 Joe Marshall
> 37 p...@informatimago.com
>
> I would give all mine 47 posts for a one really good one.

I feel the same about George Bush's thoughts.

>
> All time
> 4127 pit...@world.std.com
> 3769 ktil...@nyc.rr.com

Now I see why Kent came out of retirement.

I feel like Barry Bonds chasing Babe Ruth.

Thank god they go by count and not redeeming social value.

I'll be here all week, don't forget your bartenders.

kt

Tim Bradshaw

unread,
May 21, 2007, 9:11:54 AM5/21/07
to
On May 21, 11:42 am, fireblade <slobodan.blaze...@gmail.com> wrote:

> If you don't like some troll post a warning sign and ignore him or
> just ignore him. Life is to short to waste it on things that just make
> you feel bad.

Ah, that's not the problem. The problem is that I *enjoy* bating
trolls, but I suspect it's good neither for me (I could be skiing) nor
cll (you could be discussing Lisp). Harrop is, I admit, a particularly
difficult specimen - normally their heads have come entirely off by
this stage - but that just adds to the challenge. Which must be
resisted, I think.

--tim

fireblade

unread,
May 21, 2007, 9:44:09 AM5/21/07
to

I coudn't agree more but Rainer is right we should rather do lisping
or something usefull.

Damien Kick

unread,
May 22, 2007, 1:52:37 AM5/22/07
to
Ken Tilton wrote:
> The best part is, knowing this does not help. And this is why g*d
> created killfiles. That drops your exposure to others quoting him. Still
> a challenge. But it puts pressure on the Harrop species that grows
> ineluctably until the species winks out (only to return, for as some
> brilliant wag once observed, "Liars need good memories. Trolls need NG
> readers with bad ones.").

Too bad that newsreader clients and their kill-files haven't been
getting as much attention as e-mail clients and their spam filters.

> ps. Trick #2: Counting a behavior changes it. I am not smart like you
> guys. Can someone write the code to print daily/cumulative totals? The
> columns should be: count contributed to Harrop thread, count direct
> replies to Harrop, count direct replies by Harrop to them, and then a
> weighted sucker-score, with (I think) each of those having increasing
> weight (1-2-4?). (If Harrop responds directly to you, he has sensed a
> fresh blood vein.) Problem. Harrop joins random threads. OK, those are
> not harropthreads, so just count direct replies /to/ harrop (but weight
> those 4).
>
> Other ideas for the Harrop Index welcome. k

I'd be willing to contribute money to an effort to implement a
newsreader with a Harrop-index kill-file filter. It would have to use
the concept of a Harrop-index to sort signal from noise. Extra points
would, of course, go to anyone implementing this Harrop-killer app in
OCaml or even F# itself. Super extra points if it escorted Harrop to
/dev/null faster than a competing lisp implementation. "I just blew
your mind" extra points if Harrop himself were to write it. Of course,
one would have to generalize it so that it would be useful for
*plonk*ing other trolls on the head, too.

<pause>

I suppose it would also be good to integrate something like this with
other chaff threshing techniques. Many-to-many communication networks
which include some kind of user ranking system come to mind. Of course,
this would probably be just another factor in calculating the Harrop-index.

Kenny, your a genius! Now just whip one up with Cells somehow. Or get
the Open Source Fairy to do it. Or maybe Tim Bradshaw can write a lisp
version in all the free time he gains from not wasting time on usenet.
Then, we bet Harrop that he can't write one of these here new fangled
things in OCaml and do a better job at it than this super awesome lisp
version. I'd do it in all the free time I have from flirting with
insomnia but I'm lazy and stupid, not like that clever Harrop. I bet he
could write one before any of our lisp ray tracers finished rendering a
simple gray scale image.

Ken Tilton

unread,
May 22, 2007, 10:58:45 AM5/22/07
to
Ah, here's the answer, straight from Jon, aka "we":

"We've been looking at data submitted by readers registering interest in
the F#.NET Journal: ... the next most popular language for people
wanting to learn F# is Lisp. We found that quite surprising, for one
because we didn't realise so many people knew Lisp. [PWUAHHHAAA! No, it
is too slow, no one knows Lisp.] These guys are probably yearning for
pattern matching, better performance, .NET interoperability [PWUAHHHAA]
and the elimination of run-time errors."

Yeah, I am sick to death of run-time errors. What an idiot.

But he does have his fans: "Some people ask me if "Jon Harrop" is an
alter-ego. I wish he was, since then I'd be a lot smarter than I am :-)
[Oh, get your nose out!] We (the F# and all the Microsoft .NET teams)
can make the language and the framework, but Jon is one of those many
[PWUAHHAHAHA] users who helps make it sparkle."

Microsoft likes Jon. 'Nuff said? And Jon makes it "sparkle"? The F# team
cannot? No, we just make the language, haven't a clue what to do with
it. It is tough having to write that stuff where your Mom might see it.

OK, so surprise-surprise, Jon is just trying to drum up business with a
lot of intellectual dishonesty, sad way to make a buck, lessee how he is
doing: raise your hand if Jon has you interested in F#. Fireblade, I
have you down already.

kt

Xah Lee

unread,
May 22, 2007, 1:53:49 PM5/22/07
to
Tech Geekers versus Spammers

Xah Lee, 2002-08

Recall that Spy vs Spy was a popular comic by Antonio Prohias that
appears in Mad magazine.

Here's a few snap shots:
spy vs spy spy vs spy spy vs spy

The theme being two archenemic spies, colored one white and one black,
who better each other on schemes and technologies. One creates a voice-
recognition missile, then the other invents a voice-exchanging device.
The final frame of the comic would have the second spy shrieking with
mirth and a victory pose over the mishaps of the other. Turn to the
next installment and the winner & loser are reversed: We see one spy
excitedly plans a booby trap. When he enters the other spy's house to
install the bomb, he got blown up because the other spy has spied on
his scheme. Again the hilariously smug victory pose over the
misfortune of the other.

Their fight is endless. Over and over we read with glee over the silly
stratagems and incredible technologies they devices that befall on
themselves.

As i sit here and read the technology geeking morons fighting with
spammers.

2006
The Worsening of Email Spams

The tech geekers, due to utter ignorance of sociology and power-
struggling nature of males, have long been fighting with the spammer
in the very beginning, by tech battle. That is, the tech geekers
device technological ways to defeat spammers, while, the spammers, do
exactly the same: they use more technology to thwart the tech geeker's
ruse. (e.g. tech geekers have black lists, honey pots, web email-
harvesting traps, bayesian filtering et al, while the spammers have
email havesters, spam farm, forged header, et al.) Long story short,
in mid 1990s spam is just a annoyance that accounts perhaps 1% of
email traffic, but today it is 90% of email traffic, and i'm getting
tens of spams in my inbox per day, most of which are either entirely
image based or have lots of Joe-Bloke rube texts that are very
difficult to distinguish from a Joe-Bloke email. (in my spam mail box,
i actually receive literally thousands of spams per day, and since
about 2004, i started to lose real emails because of spam.
Newsgroup Noise

Now, let's consider newsgroups. Every tech geeker knows about
newsgroups. Now, newsgroups softwares have “kill file” feature from
the very early beginning. Newsgroups have been around for what, 20
years? With each generation of newsgroup clients, the kill-file
feature or otherwise various mark-up mark-down features get better and
better all the time. But has any of these features abated the so-
called “trolls” or “noise” in newsgroups? or, have they reduced or
eased the fights and hostilities in newsgroups? Frankly, the noises,
fights, troll-cryings only increased and in fact today you can not go
by passing a few days without hearing a troll cry or fight broke out.
What is wrong? Again, due to the tech geeker's total ignorance in
sociology, they perceived wrong problems, and their actions only
exacerbated the situation.

----
This post is archived at:
http://xahlee.org/UnixResource_dir/writ/tech_geekers_vs_spammers.html

Xah
x...@xahlee.org
http://xahlee.org/

Joe Marshall

unread,
May 22, 2007, 2:22:44 PM5/22/07
to
On May 22, 7:58 am, Ken Tilton <kennytil...@optonline.net> wrote:

> OK, so surprise-surprise, Jon is just trying to drum up business with a
> lot of intellectual dishonesty, sad way to make a buck, lessee how he is
> doing: raise your hand if Jon has you interested in F#.

I'm not sure this counts, but when Jon mentioned F# (the twenty-third
time, he mentioned it, that is), I remembered that I had downloaded it
and looked at it, but that I hadn't deleted it. Jon renewed my
interest in freeing up that disk space.

Ken Tilton

unread,
May 22, 2007, 2:28:02 PM5/22/07
to

Unfortunately we square the value before summing, so you count for two.

:)

kt

Joe Marshall

unread,
May 22, 2007, 2:40:39 PM5/22/07
to
On May 20, 5:43 pm, Ken Tilton <kennytil...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
> Other ideas for the Harrop Index welcome. k

Not worth the effort. He's got a limited shelf life and will soon be
bored and move on.

ilias - 3 months
The Peaceman - 2 months
gavino - 7 months

Hmmm. I can't remember the names of the other random trolls we've
had. I guess your fifteen minutes is pretty fleeting on this group.

Bob Felts

unread,
May 22, 2007, 2:48:37 PM5/22/07
to
Ken Tilton <kenny...@optonline.net> wrote:

> raise your hand if Jon has you interested in F#.

I went so far as to download a PowerPoint presentation on F# and looked
at the first couple of slides. I re-wrote their first example in Lisp.

But I still feel dirty.

Jon Harrop

unread,
May 22, 2007, 3:13:12 PM5/22/07
to
Joe Marshall wrote:
> Not worth the effort. He's got a limited shelf life and will soon be
> bored and move on.

http://groups.google.co.uk/group/comp.sys.acorn.programmer/msg/c72f55e7b4bf2390?hl=en&

--
Dr Jon D Harrop, Flying Frog Consultancy
The F#.NET Journal
http://www.ffconsultancy.com/products/fsharp_journal/?usenet

Ken Tilton

unread,
May 22, 2007, 3:33:52 PM5/22/07
to

You make three, and I might make four, but I think I looked at F# during
the excitement over MSatan deciding to support dynamic languages. Ah,
let's make it four, the poor sod has been working his tail off.

kt

Matthew Swank

unread,
May 22, 2007, 3:47:42 PM5/22/07
to
On Sun, 20 May 2007 20:43:30 -0400, Ken Tilton wrote:

>
>
> Tim Bradshaw wrote:
>> Well, I've had enough. Although I'm enjoying bating him enormously, I
>> realise it's the kind of enjoyment one gets from heroin: fun for sure,
>> but eventually it eats your life. I find myself hitting refresh to see
>> what idiocy he's come up with this time. May be I'll check back in
>> another couple of years.
>>
>
> Well I fer one am LMAO as you try to get the monkey off your back.
>

...


> Counting a behavior changes it. I am not smart like you
> guys. Can someone write the code to print daily/cumulative totals?

...


>
> Other ideas for the Harrop Index welcome. k

So is this a Meta-Troll?

Matt
--
"You do not really understand something unless you
can explain it to your grandmother." - Albert Einstein.

Ken Tilton

unread,
May 22, 2007, 4:24:54 PM5/22/07
to

Matthew Swank wrote:
> On Sun, 20 May 2007 20:43:30 -0400, Ken Tilton wrote:
>
>
>>
>>Tim Bradshaw wrote:
>>
>>>Well, I've had enough. Although I'm enjoying bating him enormously, I
>>>realise it's the kind of enjoyment one gets from heroin: fun for sure,
>>>but eventually it eats your life. I find myself hitting refresh to see
>>>what idiocy he's come up with this time. May be I'll check back in
>>>another couple of years.
>>>
>>
>>Well I fer one am LMAO as you try to get the monkey off your back.
>>
>
> ...
>
>>Counting a behavior changes it. I am not smart like you
>>guys. Can someone write the code to print daily/cumulative totals?
>
>
> ...
>
>>Other ideas for the Harrop Index welcome. k
>
>
> So is this a Meta-Troll?

Precisely. The topic becomes Jon Harrop's behavior, and these threads
will be vastly more entertaining than his mistakes about Lisp and the
earnest but tedious corrections the nice people have offered.

Now it is Kenny's turn. Not Ken, not Kenneth, neither Kenzo, Kzo, nor
Kxo. Kenny. Kenny and the Hounds. Kenny and the Hounds and the Savages.
We'll be opening for American Idol on tour. I digress.

The trick to eradicating harrosites, should the sugar trail over to
c.l.python not work, is not not to respond to him. That is like trying
not to think. Meditators use a mantra on which to concentrate, because
focusing on something is easier than not focusing at all, and as long as
I am focused on something void such as a mantra I am close enough to not
concentrating to begin the transition to a meditative state where
thought truly ceases.

The key is simply to push out the annoying harrop thread with an
entertaining harrop thread that has nothing to do with anything but him
being rude.

The best part is, knowing this will not save him. :)

kenny

Bob Felts

unread,
May 22, 2007, 4:45:14 PM5/22/07
to
Ken Tilton <kenny...@optonline.net> wrote:

> Meditators use a mantra on which to concentrate, because
> focusing on something is easier than not focusing at all, and as long as
> I am focused on something void such as a mantra I am close enough to not
> concentrating to begin the transition to a meditative state where
> thought truly ceases.

Eight, sir; seven, sir;
Six, sir; five, sir;
Four, sir; three, sir;
Two, sir; one!
Tenser, said the Tensor.
Tenser, said the Tensor.
Tension, apprehension,
And dissension have begun.

Raymond Wiker

unread,
May 22, 2007, 5:13:57 PM5/22/07
to
wr...@stablecross.com (Bob Felts) writes:

Demolished.

luc...@math.purdue.edu

unread,
May 22, 2007, 5:20:55 PM5/22/07
to
On May 21, 8:36 am, Ken Tilton <kennytil...@optonline.net> wrote:

> fireblade wrote:
> > some statistics for comp.lang.lisp :
>
> > Top posters
>
> > All time
> > 4127 pit...@world.std.com
> > 3769 ktil...@nyc.rr.com
>
> Now I see why Kent came out of retirement.
>
> I feel like Barry Bonds chasing Babe Ruth.

Kenny, Kenny, did you read the statistics correctly? Did you notice

2822 e...@naggum.no
2055 e...@naggum.net

??? You and Kent are just two guys competing for second!

Brad

PS: Bonds is chasing Hank Aaron.

Rob St. Amant

unread,
May 22, 2007, 5:38:14 PM5/22/07
to
luc...@math.purdue.edu writes:

PPS: If Ken's programming productivity is due to steroids, I'd like to
know who his supplier is.

Ken Tilton

unread,
May 22, 2007, 6:36:36 PM5/22/07
to

Brad, precision is the enemy of humor!

And I have not been at nyc.rr.com in a year!

That's OK, no way I oculd hold off Harrop anyway. :(

>
> Brad
>
> PS: Bonds is chasing Hank Aaron.
>

Doh!

kt

Matthew Swank

unread,
May 22, 2007, 7:34:37 PM5/22/07
to
On Tue, 22 May 2007 05:52:37 +0000, Damien Kick wrote:

> I'd be willing to contribute money to an effort to implement a
> newsreader with a Harrop-index kill-file filter. It would have to use
> the concept of a Harrop-index to sort signal from noise.

Has anyone tried running his posts through a RID analysis:
http://lemonodor.com/archives/001511.html?

Ken Tilton

unread,
May 22, 2007, 8:35:04 PM5/22/07
to

Matthew Swank wrote:
> On Tue, 22 May 2007 05:52:37 +0000, Damien Kick wrote:
>
>
>>I'd be willing to contribute money to an effort to implement a
>>newsreader with a Harrop-index kill-file filter. It would have to use
>>the concept of a Harrop-index to sort signal from noise.
>
>
> Has anyone tried running his posts through a RID analysis:
> http://lemonodor.com/archives/001511.html?

Sign those bad boys up!

kenny

fireblade

unread,
May 23, 2007, 10:48:16 AM5/23/07
to
On May 22, 4:58 pm, Ken Tilton <kennytil...@optonline.net> wrote:
> Ah, here's the answer, straight from Jon, aka "we":

[snipped]


> Fireblade, I have you down already.
>
> kt

I don't understand above . For me Jon Harop is interesthing troll that
knows programming with OCaml ,but beside that he's a miserable
little soul. That's too bad considering that he has a potential to
make something interesthing or certainly make more money than trolling
in usenet.

As for myself ,i thought of checking on f# but I'll skip it beacuse
i'm busy with below thingies:
1. Learning to use FreeBSD -it's already installed on my desktop and i
have a book with great sense of humor: Absolute BSD-The Ultimate
Guide to FreeBSD from Michael Lucas
2. Started with Data mining (in lisp as my hobby project ), in the
beginning i'm going to implement WEKA http://www.cs.waikato.ac.nz/ml/weka/
in lisp.
and finally
3 I get a green for a real commercial project for my employer done in
lisp, it's not big as I expected, nor very interesthing but any
foothold for lisp is good.

cheers
bobi

Ken Tilton

unread,
May 24, 2007, 5:08:17 AM5/24/07
to

fireblade wrote:
> On May 22, 4:58 pm, Ken Tilton <kennytil...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>>Ah, here's the answer, straight from Jon, aka "we":
>
>
> [snipped]
>
>>Fireblade, I have you down already.
>>
>>kt
>
>

> I don't understand above . For me Jon Harop is ...

Gone.

They brought up the house lights and everyone left. The movie is over,
don't forget your belongings.

hth, kenny

Giorgos Keramidas

unread,
Jun 4, 2007, 12:09:30 AM6/4/07
to
On 23 May 2007 07:48:16 -0700, fireblade <slobodan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On May 22, 4:58 pm, Ken Tilton <kennytil...@optonline.net> wrote:
>> Ah, here's the answer, straight from Jon, aka "we":
>>
>> Fireblade, I have you down already.
>
> I thought of checking on f# but I'll skip it because I'm busy with

> below thingies:
>
> 1. Learning to use FreeBSD -it's already installed on my desktop and i
> have a book with great sense of humor: Absolute BSD-The Ultimate Guide
> to FreeBSD from Michael Lucas

Nice! Good choice of an intro book too. Michael's writing style is
truly marvellous.

We -- the FreeBSD team -- have an extensive and growing online set of
helpful documentation articles and books too. There's also a thriving
community of people replying user-questions and helping people as they
find their way around FreeBSD, at the comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc
newsgroup and the `freebsd-questions' mailing list.

[Followup-To set to c.u.b.f.m]

Have fun, welcome to BSD, and all that :-)

Rainer Joswig

unread,
Jun 8, 2007, 10:46:09 AM6/8/07
to
In article <f2qcqq$eh4$1$830f...@news.demon.co.uk>,
Tim Bradshaw <t...@tfeb.org> wrote:

> Well, I've had enough. Although I'm enjoying bating him enormously, I
> realise it's the kind of enjoyment one gets from heroin: fun for sure,
> but eventually it eats your life. I find myself hitting refresh to see
> what idiocy he's come up with this time. May be I'll check back in
> another couple of years.


Jon Harrop (aka 'we') advertises in comp.sys.mac.advocacy :

http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.mac.advocacy/browse_frm/thread/a10d3b9daa38ee52/e4f162cf4eb4442f#e4f162cf4eb4442f

;-)


He even did the Google trends trick again.

--
http://lispm.dyndns.org

Joe Marshall

unread,
Jun 8, 2007, 2:08:03 PM6/8/07
to
On Jun 8, 7:46 am, Rainer Joswig <jos...@lisp.de> wrote:

>
> Jon Harrop (aka 'we') advertises in comp.sys.mac.advocacy :
>

> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.mac.advocacy/browse_frm/threa...


>
> ;-)
>
> He even did the Google trends trick again.

Looks like he found some friends, too.

Tim Bradshaw

unread,
Jun 8, 2007, 4:28:00 PM6/8/07
to
On Jun 8, 3:46 pm, Rainer Joswig <jos...@lisp.de> wrote:

> Jon Harrop (aka 'we') advertises in comp.sys.mac.advocacy :

I think he's probably stalking me, and has found out I have a mac.

Rainer Joswig

unread,
Jun 8, 2007, 4:39:37 PM6/8/07
to
In article <1181334480....@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>,
Tim Bradshaw <tfb+g...@tfeb.org> wrote:

You have a Mac? Got just lately? ;-)

--
http://lispm.dyndns.org

Tim Bradshaw

unread,
Jun 9, 2007, 7:15:30 AM6/9/07
to
On Jun 8, 9:39 pm, Rainer Joswig <jos...@lisp.de> wrote:

>
> You have a Mac? Got just lately? ;-)

Over a year ago. But it all makes sense because I'm probably about to
buy another, since I need a laptop. He's obviously trying to get
involved in some way. He's really a tragic character.

Joseph Coffey

unread,
Jun 29, 2007, 10:24:32 AM6/29/07
to

F# is not a dynamic language.

On May 22, 12:33 pm, Ken Tilton <kennytil...@optonline.net> wrote:
> Bob Felts wrote:

> > Ken Tilton <kennytil...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
> >>raise your hand if Jon has you interested in F#.
>
> > I went so far as to download a PowerPoint presentation on F# and looked
> > at the first couple of slides. I re-wrote their first example in Lisp.
>
> > But I still feel dirty.
>
> You make three, and I might make four, but I think I looked at F# during
> the excitement over MSatan deciding to support dynamic languages. Ah,
> let's make it four, the poor sod has been working his tail off.
>
> kt
>

> --http://www.theoryyalgebra.com/

Jon Harrop

unread,
Jun 29, 2007, 1:11:10 PM6/29/07
to
Joseph Coffey wrote:
> F# is not a dynamic language.

F# supports reflection and run-time typing.

--
Dr Jon D Harrop, Flying Frog Consultancy

The OCaml Journal
http://www.ffconsultancy.com/products/ocaml_journal/?usenet

Pascal Costanza

unread,
Jun 29, 2007, 4:22:41 PM6/29/07
to
Jon Harrop wrote:
> Joseph Coffey wrote:
>> F# is not a dynamic language.
>
> F# supports reflection [...]

...probably not.


Pascal

--
My website: http://p-cos.net
Common Lisp Document Repository: http://cdr.eurolisp.org
Closer to MOP & ContextL: http://common-lisp.net/project/closer/

Jon Harrop

unread,
Jun 30, 2007, 8:10:35 PM6/30/07
to
Pascal Costanza wrote:
> Jon Harrop wrote:
>> Joseph Coffey wrote:
>>> F# is not a dynamic language.
>>
>> F# supports reflection [...]
>
> ...probably not.

?

Daniel Barlow

unread,
Jun 30, 2007, 8:45:44 PM6/30/07
to
Jon Harrop wrote:
> Pascal Costanza wrote:
>> Jon Harrop wrote:
>>> Joseph Coffey wrote:
>>>> F# is not a dynamic language.
>>> F# supports reflection [...]
>> ...probably not.
>
> ?
>

If you accept the notion that "languages shape the way we think", this
follows trivially from the observation that F#'s users appear to have no
reflective or introspective capability at all ...


-dan

Ken Tilton

unread,
Jun 30, 2007, 11:08:27 PM6/30/07
to

Yes, Jon's reflective moments involve funhouse mirrors that make him
look clever, not pathetic. Perhaps it is time we c.l.l savages stop
toying with him. Garret should remain our preferred chew toy. Harrop has
descended now into the same behavior pattern that once got him beat up
in the school yard, trading bruises for the sad satisfaction of simply
annoying others, and it is too sad to see. All he has left is his desire
to irritate, and now even that does not work because it is so obvious.
Sure, dolts like Larry Clapp will do their best to feed him, but Harrop
will soon weary of the monotonous diet as even the dumbest c.l.l
denizens come up to speed. This is a time for compassion, not attack dog
training.

hth,kt

Larry Clapp

unread,
Jul 1, 2007, 12:10:42 AM7/1/07
to
On 2007-07-01, Ken Tilton <kenny...@optonline.net> wrote:
> Sure, dolts like Larry Clapp will do their best to feed him, but
> Harrop will soon weary of the monotonous diet as even the dumbest
> c.l.l denizens come up to speed.

Color me up to speed. :)

ctnd

unread,
Jul 1, 2007, 2:40:44 AM7/1/07
to
On May 21, 12:30 am, Dan Bensen <randomg...@cyberspace.net> wrote:

> Tim Bradshaw wrote:
> > Well, I've had enough. Although I'm enjoying bating him enormously, I
> > realise it's the kind of enjoyment one gets from heroin: fun for sure,
> > but eventually it eats your life.
>
> Maybe we should make him our mascot.
> "Dr. Frog, the Fabulous Flying Amphibian"
> Someone could make up some ascii art that tastefully
> blends that impressive Hasselhoff shot with the Toad logo.
>
> --
> Danwww.prairienet.org/~dsb/


//`'''```,
o // LISP `.,
,....OOo. .c;.',,,.'``.,,.`
.' ____.,'.//
/ _____ \___/.'
| / || \\---\|
|| || \\ ||
co co co co


It's the suave lisp toad. :)

Thomas F. Burdick

unread,
Jul 1, 2007, 6:11:35 AM7/1/07
to
On Jul 1, 5:08 am, Ken Tilton <kennytil...@optonline.net> wrote:
> Yes, Jon's reflective moments involve funhouse mirrors that make him
> look clever, not pathetic. Perhaps it is time we c.l.l savages stop
> toying with him. Garret should remain our preferred chew toy. Harrop has
> descended now into the same behavior pattern that once got him beat up
> in the school yard, trading bruises for the sad satisfaction of simply
> annoying others, and it is too sad to see. All he has left is his desire
> to irritate, and now even that does not work because it is so obvious.

I think of him more as the borderline case on the subway. The problem
is that one source of noise can easily be ignored; indeed meaningful
conversations among a group of people on the subway often involve
doing just that. Alas, we're not all urbanites here, and I think
we're seeing a case of the suburban folks not realizing that these
borderline types are the worst, and should be ignored at all cost.
True crazies can be interesting from time to time, but the merely
severely maladjusted almost never.

Reply all
Reply to author
Forward
0 new messages