So long Clarion
Ilia
I’d like your feedback about the following subject. I have
completely moved from Clarion to VB. And I think VB is great language
(regardless its bugs which are in every language), but most important
thing is that VB is more human RAD than Clarion. VB is 100% hand code
lanuage with its great debugger , but here I’m not going to
discuss the positive aspects of VB. The purpose of this message is to
tell the reasons why I throw out Clarion. Clarion had a Poor IDE, no
ability to create ActiveX controls, ActiveX .DLLs and .EXEs. No user
controls. Poor support of SQL servers access. Bad help. Almost no
(poor) debugger (I can’t imagine in 21-st century the
programming language without debbager). Very complicated way to create
Add-ins like features. The necessity to declare in MAP every procedure
I added to my modules and long time recompilation after this. Poor
support of creation Internet (intanet) enable applications. Poor
database access ( no nested transactions, no batch updating, no
disconnected recordsets, no ability to open one .tps file with several
recordsets, necessity of file declaration in code and much more). Poor
classes (no propery let/get/set, no class generated events, no
collection). I wonder what you (Clarion users) think about this?
Rhys Daniell
(not to mention .Net) are just made for each other. May you have a
long and happy career, far away from us.
oris...@yahoo.com (Ilia) wrote in message news:<a338fddb.02051...@posting.google.com>...
Johan Welgemoed
> I’d like your feedback about the following subject. I have
> completely moved from Clarion to VB. And I think VB is great language
> (regardless its bugs which are in every language), but most important
> thing is that VB is more human RAD than Clarion.
<ROFL> I worked in VB for more than 2 years before coming to my senses
and switching back to Clarion. All I can say is best of luck <vbg>
You'll soon realize your mistake...
Bob R
applications in VB provide a great code base which I can later rewrite
in Clarion, providing great customer satisfaction.
LOL
On 19 May 2002 23:30:36 -0700, oris...@yahoo.com (Ilia) wrote:
SPAMbjarne.havnen@broadpark.no Bjarne Havnen
Clarion so much that you are qualified to judge it. Looks more to me like
the thoughts I get when trying Delphi,VB or any Visual Studio tool. I have
very little knowledge, and trying to accomplish the same task that I do in
Clarion takes about forever.
For your statements, I see that you have neither knowledge of Clarions
possibilites today in the standard templates, or upcoming enhancements. I
don't think you ever tried to make your own classes or derived the standard
classes (which I have been told is impossible in VB), made your own
templates, bought any 3rdparty tools,read the documentation or even
understood the basic browsetechnology. Please press F1 for details. That
works for me.
I will give you right in the following statements
> great debugger
Absolutely. I love the debug window, and syntax checking is most presise.
>Clarion had a Poor IDE
My customers don't see it, and except for the rather simple editor, I have
no problems whatsoever.
>no ability to create ActiveX controls, ActiveX .DLLs and .EXEs.
Acitve X is Microsoft technology. I could hammer a nail with an axe, but I
would be better of with the right tool. It is possible to create both
activex and Com, but it is a complete waste of time.
>Almost no > (poor) debugger (I can’t imagine in 21-st century the
> programming language without debbager).
Works good with exes, but a pain when working with multidlls.
>Poor support of creation Internet (intanet) enable applications.
Could have been better, and with the ASP templates they will be. However, I
delivered a standard responssystem in less than a day, at the same time I
delivered the desktop app.
Russell B. Eggen
Obviously we don't share your findings, but I wish you well.
--
Russ Eggen
See you at ETC!
http://etc.kcug.org/
"Ilia" <oris...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a338fddb.02051...@posting.google.com...
Ron Schofield
Ilia wrote:
> To all Clarion users.
> I’d like your feedback about the following subject.
Why would you want feedback when you said you already moved to VB?
> I have completely moved from Clarion to VB. And I think VB is great
> language
> (regardless its bugs which are in every language), but most important
> thing is that VB is more human RAD than Clarion.
Human RAD? I want my machine to do my RAD, not a human..
> VB is 100% hand code
> lanuage with its great debugger , but here I’m not going to
> discuss the positive aspects of VB.
You call 100% hand code a positive aspect?
> The purpose of this message is to tell the reasons why I throw out
> Clarion.
First of all, probably not fully learning about Clarion and it's power
features.
> Clarion had a Poor IDE, no
> ability to create ActiveX controls, ActiveX .DLLs and .EXEs.
I have never had a client care what I use. And in all the years that
ActiveX have been around, I have never used one. Never needed to. Clarion
gives me all the power I need to create the products that my customers
what/need.
> No user controls. Poor support of SQL servers access.
> Bad help.
The help is very clean, there could be more examples, but the Clarion
community fills in the rest and more.
> Almost no (poor) debugger (I can’t imagine in 21-st century the
> programming language without debbager).
Funny, never needed to use it. And the template language will remove 99%
of all the bugs that you will come across, you need a debugger in VB, not
Clarion.
> Very complicated way to create Add-ins like features.
If you mean the template language, then you mean powerful, not
complicated, unless you don't take the time to learn how to use the tools
that you are given.
> The necessity to declare in MAP every procedure I added to my modules
> and long time recompilation after this.
> Poor support of creation Internet (intanet) enable applications.
Using the template language, my Clarion apps have been internet enabled
since CW2.
> Poor database access ( no nested transactions, no batch updating, no
> disconnected recordsets, no ability to open one .tps file with several
> recordsets, necessity of file declaration in code and much more). Poor
> classes (no propery let/get/set, no class generated events, no
> collection).
How about the ability to easily switch file drivers easily and the ability
of the data dictionary to control the integrity of the data.
> I wonder what you (Clarion users) think about this?
What do you care? You have moved on. I wish you the best on you life with
VB. I will continue to be productive in my work with Clarion. Not only can
I use Clarion to write Clarion apps, but Perl, C, Lex, Yacc, etc.
A.A
> It's obvious you've no idea what Clarion is about. Best you stay with
> VB. Happy journeys my friend. What's sad about this is that it's
> people like you that give the product a bad rap... such a shame.
Illia
I think you did not understand clarion well. You can do almost all of
the things you written down. (As long as you are a good programmer not
a newbie). Basic and visual brother are good old languages. But pain
in the neck. If you like 100% hand code writing why not move to C++.
This is much better. And you do more thing than you do with every
other language.(except ASM) Clarion is not for code writing like
basic. Clarion is easy to use quick application generator which you
can do some hand code writing.
Russell B. Eggen
Clarion is a far more advanced language than even its users realize.
--
Russ Eggen
See you at ETC!
http://etc.kcug.org/
"A.A" <xma...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
DrEmmetLBrown
your so quick to condem and discard.
Clarion IS a crappy language.
It is a difficult language to use in other than a gerneral database.
I've been in this language since 1988 with Clarion 2.0
I've gone throught the changes, the errors the excessive abuse from
this fourm when asking for help and many times getting little more
than opinion or someones advertizments.
In todays computing environment we all need an edge. If it's an
ActiveX , a DLL a related table what ever if we are going to get the
client we need the edge.
Develping anything but a database in Clarion is a painfull venture.
this nonsense of brackets and braces and is the event registered and
ir the procedure reading the right event and blah blah VB has the
intigration of ActiveX hands down. Prototyping a DLL is a straight
forward issue. None of the map incluses and declair this calarion
value to equate to a VB or C++ value.
VB doen't have the familiar data file structures we have used and
loved. But am I shorting my potention sticking with a Topspeed data
structure for all these years when I could have learned MSSQL and
really have a future in computing?
The whole point of this thread is a Clarion user has had enough of the
BS it tales to be a Clarion programer. Hes tired of the comments and
feed back on every single issue raized in this fourm in the form of
asking for help.
I started a new project this morning using Leadtools AxiveX it NEVER
enterd my mind to use Clarion / Topspeed for this broject becase
afther hundreds of hours thinking I was the problem on the GPFs and
the Windows not open I finally realized it's not me.
2002. Windows XP, Windows 2000 Pro and Sever and We are still
programing in a 16 bit IDE. Numerous users have complained on C5.5
closing on trmination of run in XP and the best anyone has to offer is
turn off the Prefetch in the registery.
Guys (and Lady's) get a grip. recognise there IS a problem with
Clarion. We ARE a small familly of users who have setteled for the
easy way out. and we have programed ourselves into a corner.
Before any of you flame me for this I want you to go the the Sunday
Paper and gtather all the job openings for Clarion and VB programers.
Cancel each that you find out and then tell me what the Market place
wants.
Then next time any of you have a question on how something is done in
the languge check how many other souces are available to the clarion
programmer. This newsgroup is about it. Now go find VB or C++ or JAVA
or ASP source code and examples.
llia said he has had enough. Why aren't we finding out why and fixing
it rather than this typical "Well then good ridence" attatude which
has always prevailed in this fourm.
That's my opinion and I'm use you'll let me know I'm wrong.
Emmet
Ville Vahtera
"DrEmmetLBrown" <Emmet...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:4qkieu044is4dhrnb...@4ax.com...
> You know it's just so like you people here when someone has an opinion
> your so quick to condem and discard.
>
> Clarion IS a crappy language.
I suggest all you guys go and get a life! You all sound like a group of teenagers
growling and dripping adrenaline for a gal.
Regards,
Ville
****
A boat docked in a tiny Mexican village. An American tourist
complimented the Mexican fisherman on the quality of his fish and asked
how long it took him to catch them.
"Not very long," answered the Mexican.
"But then, why didn't you stay out longer and catch more?" asked the
American.
The Mexican explained that his small catch was sufficient to meet his
needs and those of his family.
The American asked, "But what do you do with the rest of your time?"
"I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, and take a siesta
with my wife. In the evenings, I go into the village to see my friends,
have a few drinks, play the guitar, and sing a few songs . . .I have a
full life."
The American interrupted, "I have an MBA from Harvard and I can help
you! You should start by fishing longer every day. You can then sell
the extra fish you catch. With the extra revenue, you can buy a bigger
boat. With the
extra money the larger boat will bring, you can buy a second one and a
third one and so on until you have an entire fleet of trawlers. Instead
of selling your fish to a middle man, you can negotiate directly with
the processing
plants and maybe even open your own plant. You can then leave this
little village and move to Mexico City, Los Angeles, or even New York
City! From there you can direct your huge enterprise."
"How long would that take?" asked the Mexican.
"Twenty, perhaps twenty-five years," replied the American.
"And after that?"
"Afterwards? That's when it gets really interesting," answered the
American, laughing. "When your business gets really big, you can start
selling stocks and make millions!"
"Millions? Really? And after that?"
"After that you'll be able to retire, live in a tiny village near the
coast, sleep late, play with your children, catch a few fish, take a
siesta, and spend your evenings drinking and enjoying your friends."
Russell B. Eggen
deal with facts. No one could legimately argue that Clarion is for
everyone. It is not. That does not make it a crappy language, it will not
be everyone's cup of tea. That is not a problem, no product could be.
Of all the programming languages one could use, all have shortcomings.
Depends on what you expect. If you expect real pointers, you will be
disappointed in Clarion. If you expect OOP, you will not use VB. If you
expect speed in delivering project, C++ is not the tool. If you expect
stability, C++, VB, Delphi and Clarion deliver the goods. Depends on the
design and the skill set of the programmer.
If I wish to use Clarion with full dot syntax and ease of use like VB, I
can. But I won't have to worry about the trade-off on performance that VB's
late-binding gives you. You have no choice. C++ gives you this control,
but a Clarion and VB project should deliver to the client faster.
Clarion is fully mature programming language. Does not mean that bad code
won't be produced. C++ is in the same boat.
For me, the 16-bit IDE argument is lost on me as it does not matter. None
of my clients see it, they could care less. As long as I give them stable,
fast code they are happy. That really is the bottom line.
There are more jobs for C++, Delphi and other languages than Clarion. That
is a fact. Does not mean there are no jobs for Clarion. There are. That
is also a fact. I've got a few projects that I am about to start
sub-contracting as I cannot keep up with client demands and I do like to
sleep <g>. These are all Clarion projects and there are bits of one that is
partially C++. That is because that is what the client needed. Since he is
quite happy at the moment, it does not matter what language is used.
So while someone may wish to use a non-Clarion language, that is their
choice. Someone who is comfortable with something else, chances are small
they will have success with Clarion, despite its strengths.
I hope you did not take any of this as a flame. It is not meant to be. You
may be totally unhappy with Clarion. Matters little what caused the
dissatisfaction. If you mind is made up, it is made up.
You must also realize that placing a post in a Clarion newsgroup that
trashes the language without offering any code or steps to back up your
claims will invite flames in response. This is because you have not
presented or made your case. I would expect no less if I went to another
newsgroup and posted something similar to what you did. So you must be fair
about this.
I simply made a case in favor of Clarion and in about 48 hours there is to
be a good demonstration of the language. Areas where many would not expect
Clarion to go.
--
Russ Eggen
See you at ETC!
http://etc.kcug.org/
"DrEmmetLBrown" <Emmet...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4qkieu044is4dhrnb...@4ax.com...
Ron Schofield
DrEmmetLBrown wrote:
> You know it's just so like you people here when someone has an opinion
> your so quick to condem and discard.
>
My question is why someone would bother to post in the first place. There are
many of us people who make a very profitable living using Clarion. If someone
can't make it, then don't blame the tool. If I can use a saw and hammer to make
useful things and someone else only ends up with a useless mess and throbbing
fingers, don't blame the saw and hammer. The fact that there are many people
making their livelihoods on Clarion, means that it's not "crappy".
>
> Clarion IS a crappy language.
>
Each language is designed for certain things. Lisp is great for AI, Fortan is
great for Numerical analysis, C is great for low level programming. For Clarion
it's designed for business databases..
>
> It is a difficult language to use in other than a gerneral database.
>
> I've been in this language since 1988 with Clarion 2.0
>
Seems for something so crappy, you still use it..
>
> I've gone throught the changes, the errors the excessive abuse from
> this fourm when asking for help and many times getting little more
> than opinion or someones advertizments.
>
I have not seen any abuse aimed at anyone who wants to learn Clarion.
>
> In todays computing environment we all need an edge. If it's an
> ActiveX , a DLL a related table what ever if we are going to get the
> client we need the edge.
>
> Develping anything but a database in Clarion is a painfull venture.
> this nonsense of brackets and braces and is the event registered and
> ir the procedure reading the right event and blah blah VB has the
> intigration of ActiveX hands down. Prototyping a DLL is a straight
> forward issue. None of the map incluses and declair this calarion
> value to equate to a VB or C++ value.
>
Clarion is designed to be a database language. Would you use VB to write a
compiler? I don't use ActiveX, never needed to. And I haven't seen a DLL that I
couldn't prototype in Clarion. I took the time to learn how to use my tools. And
have been willing to help someone who is willing to take the time to learn.
>
> VB doen't have the familiar data file structures we have used and
> loved. But am I shorting my potention sticking with a Topspeed data
> structure for all these years when I could have learned MSSQL and
> really have a future in computing?
>
Good database theory applies to all databases, MSSQL and TopSpeed.
>
> The whole point of this thread is a Clarion user has had enough of the
> BS it tales to be a Clarion programer. Hes tired of the comments and
> feed back on every single issue raized in this fourm in the form of
> asking for help.
>
I question the point of the thread. If he tried to learn how to use Clarion,
there are many who would go out of the way to help him.
>
> I started a new project this morning using Leadtools AxiveX it NEVER
> enterd my mind to use Clarion / Topspeed for this broject becase
> afther hundreds of hours thinking I was the problem on the GPFs and
> the Windows not open I finally realized it's not me.
>
I have used Clarion in all forms and it's been very stable for me. Clarion has
not GPF'd on me in years now.
>
> 2002. Windows XP, Windows 2000 Pro and Sever and We are still
> programing in a 16 bit IDE. Numerous users have complained on C5.5
> closing on trmination of run in XP and the best anyone has to offer is
> turn off the Prefetch in the registery.
>
XP has problems. Why do you think that they are constantly releasing
compatibility patches. There has been three additional patches to help
applications to run. Some of the applications that needed an update to run are
Microsoft ones. So you tell me what the problem is, the long list of
applications or XP?
>
> Guys (and Lady's) get a grip. recognise there IS a problem with
> Clarion. We ARE a small familly of users who have setteled for the
> easy way out. and we have programed ourselves into a corner.
>
I haven't programmed my way into a corner. I use Clarion as a key part of my
wide range of tools. Use it for what it was designed.
>
> Before any of you flame me for this I want you to go the the Sunday
> Paper and gtather all the job openings for Clarion and VB programers.
> Cancel each that you find out and then tell me what the Market place
> wants.
>
That mean's nothing. I have too much work and have to turn down work that I
could do in Clarion.
>
> Then next time any of you have a question on how something is done in
> the languge check how many other souces are available to the clarion
> programmer. This newsgroup is about it. Now go find VB or C++ or JAVA
> or ASP source code and examples.
>
This newsgroup? How about the dozens of newsgroups on news.softvelocity.com.
There are many, many resources for Clarion. If you think that this public
newsgroup is it, that may be your problem. There are so many FAQ, source code
examples, how to's for Clarion that I have a problem figuring out which ones to
use. I would love to see a consolidation of some of the resources.
>
> llia said he has had enough. Why aren't we finding out why and fixing
> it rather than this typical "Well then good ridence" attatude which
> has always prevailed in this fourm.
>
His message stated that he had already moved completely to VB. His message also
showed that he was not willing to take the time to learn how to use Clarion to
it's capabilities. I am constantly being surpassed on what is capable with
Clarion. So far there is little that I haven't been able to do and do well.
>
> That's my opinion and I'm use you'll let me know I'm wrong.
>
Yup..
>
> Emmet
>
Dennis E. Evans
"DrEmmetLBrown" <Emmet...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> It is a difficult language to use in other than a gerneral database.
Yep. But since that is what it was designed for I guess that makes sense,
while I personally dislike the term 'general purpose language' because it is
to general, but Clarion is not really all that general purpose.
> I've gone throught the changes, the errors the excessive abuse from
> this fourm when asking for help and many times getting little more
> than opinion or someones advertizments.
The opinion is all right. If I know an exact answer I will post it or
close. But lets be real I am not going to spend several hours solving a
problem for someone else for free, unless the problem is interesting or I
have already solved it. The bit about advertisements simply frosts my
ass but I doubt if they will go away.
> I started a new project this morning using Leadtools AxiveX it NEVER
> enterd my mind to use Clarion / Topspeed for this broject becase
> afther hundreds of hours thinking I was the problem on the GPFs and
> the Windows not open I finally realized it's not me.
Clarion is not suited for all projects, I can not think of a single
language that is. Use what tool best fits the job.
Dennis
Kobus
it. Some of them in a few hours. In VB you will take days to hand code it.
Clarion is build for me and I will stay with it even if I don't have the
newest version on the market. The customers is satisfied what I give them
and it is working hundred percent, so who's worried about you? One more
thing run a spell check because you cannot spell very good and therefore you
struggle with Clarion.
KL
"DrEmmetLBrown" <Emmet...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4qkieu044is4dhrnb...@4ax.com...
DBlackTip
should use for the package they sell. Their most consistent argument is this -
there are so many more vb programmers than clarion programmers around when you
need programming done. My answer has been and will always be - There needs to
be more vb programmers when it takes so much longer to get anything meaningful
done.
Don Schwirtlich
Clarion since 1988
C5.5ee, C5ee, C4, C2003, CFD2.1 VB6
Ralf
(i will maybe move to Delphi)- but don't tell us that VB is better
than Clarion.
I have seen VB too- and i am happy that i am not forced to work with
this
great tool...
I really can't imagine a project where i would use VB.
If you don't have enough other problems- good luck.
Go and post this message in the NG's of other languages and replace
Clarion with the name of this language.
I guess you don't find much people who share your feelings about VB...
... and if, you have found a language you shouldn't use.
rgds
Ralf
oris...@yahoo.com (Ilia) wrote in message news:<a338fddb.02051...@posting.google.com>...
Miroslav Benak
Don't even bother to respond to such provocation.
Some like it, some don't, so what? I use Clarion for about 10 years,
and I don't need to elaborate why. That's it.
Best regards,
Miroslav Benak
*** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ***
*** Miroslav Benak
*** mbe...@open.hr
*** Clarion Paranoid Home
*** www.open.hr/~mbenak
*** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ***
Ville Vahtera
"Miroslav Benak" <mbe...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:hQDqPEmglGKMKu...@4ax.com...
> Dear Clarioners!
>
> Don't even bother to respond to such provocation.
> Some like it, some don't, so what? I use Clarion for about 10 years,
> and I don't need to elaborate why. That's it.
>
> Best regards,
>
Miroslav,
You said it! There's absolutely _no_ need to speak up for clarion, your
clarion applications will do that for you!!!
Regards,
Ville
K.C Chin
... solving my debt of 300k. Clarion (CPD+CFD 180k, C5 120k++ C55
400k++)
... making more $$$. Clarion
... getting more projects. Clarion
... having 14 projects(programs). Clarion
... getting my project done in the shortest time. Clarion
... getting a new project, next month, for a courier company (have 70+
of branches). Clarion
... less debugging. Clarion
... getting more help from newsgroup. Clarion
... doing less works. Clarion
... doing more time with family. Clarion
... developing many programs for (lost count) customers. Clarion
... less supports of what whatever I program. Clarion
... my customer demands more and pay more. Clarion
... I gave other programming language a try. Still Clarion
... CLARION. It is not a mono sound. It is a 3D surround stereo sound.
Cheers to all who are leaving the Clarion's world.
KC Chin
SOHO Programmer. Clarion since 198??
Mark Sulsters
As a ten year+ user of Clarion I also think it is a great tool with the edge
being the templates end the possibility of changing them to your liking.
Thers's one point I do agree with, and that's the 16-bit one.
It's not that I don't like the IDE, but I didn't like it when I move to my
new P4 2ghz and my applications compiled MUCH SLOWER than my "old" P3 1ghz.
That is, compiing goes faster, it's the generating that takes longer.
I know that this is not due only to Clarion. Through postings on
softvelocity newsgroup (thank you) I learned (too late) that P4 is slower
with 16-bits programs, XP has to be tuned on many points, etc.
Also I'm talking about a legacy App and that generates more code and thus
takes longer.
But would I have had this most irritating of problems if the IDE would have
been 32-bits.
Will I know with C6?
But I wont leave Clarion! Too great a tool and too many great things still
to come.
Mark.
Kelvin Chua
are people who died on the bed each day...
But.... that will not prevent people from using condoms to avoid
pregnancy... and neither will it prevent anyone from sleeping on the bed...
Kelvin Chua
SINGAPORE
Hector Pabon
I spent 21 years hancoding programs using basic. I took me six months to
understand Clarion and I'm doing pretty good business with it. :-)
Also, get excellent support from this great Clarion community.
Good look with the NET stuff.
Hector Pabon
Charles Edmonds
news:3cef...@news.softvelocity.com...
You know Kevin, I like that (in a strange sort of early AM kind of way
<VBG>).
My personal feeling every time some whiner posts his "so long to Clarion"
message is:
"Thank You"
By this one simple step that person has assured me that I'll never need to
fear them if we meet face-to-face across the "let's bid for the new
programming contract" table...
Don't get me wrong, Clarion is not perfect (and I know since I've been using
it since Personal Developer 1.0), and it is not the tool for EVERY job
(although the things I've done with low level devices or places that I could
have used C/C++ might surprise most folks <g>),
BUT...
I make my living shoveling data (ala razzle-dazzle), not writing device
drivers.
In that arena, I have never found ANY product that even comes close to
Clarion.
Compiled programs are lightning fast, feature rich and EASY to build
(especially if one has the good sense to invest in high quality 3rd party
products and not be a martyr by "reinventing the wheel" every time). You
can bet that the best kept secret in our company is Clarion and just how
easy it is to build or change products!
Most customers never realize that in the time it takes us to prototype a
program - we're done!
Seeing someone abandon the platform over something silly (such as still
having a 16 bit IDE) is like saying:
"Damn, the plastic gas cap on this Ferrari is so annoying that I'm just
going to have to get that new Volkswagon that I saw advertised the other
day"...
ROFL
Charles Edmonds
D De Villiers
And welcome those thats new (like me !!) with open harms !! ;-)
Kind Regards,
Lennie De Villiers
SYSTEMS DEVELOPER & SOFTWARE CONSULTANT
Tel: +27 82 4455949 Fax: +27 82 131 4455949
Email: ddevi...@lando.co.za
Web Address: http://www.lando.co.za/Lennie
My CV: http://www.lando.co.za/Lennie/CV.htm
Steven Spierenburg
Cheers,
Steven
"D De Villiers" <ddevi...@lando.co.za> wrote in message
news:acqaqe$vn$5...@ctb-nnrp1.saix.net...
Ole-Morten Heien
> basic. Clarion is easy to use quick application generator which you
> can do some hand code writing.
The IDE is ONLY a 'parser' that scans the applicatrion file and creates
sourcecode. I hav many applications based on ONLY source
I think i remember some words from an very 'old' book written by Bruse
Barrington. The book's name was i think) Clarion User Guide for Clarion 2.0
:-) The old DOS days
Well. The words was something like this:
'I have used many developing tools like Basic, Pasca, C etc. I wanted to
creat a new programming language and took the best from Basic, Pascal and C
and called it Clarion'
This sentence may not be absolutly correct by words, but you get the
picture.
--
Ole-Morten Heien
Langaard Software
www.langaard.no
o-mh...@langaard.no
ICQ#: 72785878
"A.A" <xma...@hotmail.com> skrev i melding
news:bf26c51.02052...@posting.google.com...
James Cooke
http://www.clarionfoundry.com/General/General_Marketing/whyclarion.htm
--
--
Kind regards,
James Cooke
http://www.clarionfoundry.com - a free technical reference for the Clarion
community
http://63.99.156.24/
=========================================
"Ilia" <oris...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a338fddb.02051...@posting.google.com...
John Farmer
ABC OOP approach, but for sure, the Legacy syntax and the file structures
make complete sense to me. Of course, my background was Pascal in school
and COBOL by profession for 11 years. Clarion syntax just feels right, at
least to me.
John Farmer :o)
Philip Prohm
John Farmer <johnf...@qos-inc.com> wrote in message
news:3d00...@news.softvelocity.com...
Horses for courses, I say
Every language ever invented has its pros and cons. Even C has cons :)
Question is, do the pros help in a particular arena and do the cons not get
in the way? There are things I don't like about clarion but for the most
part it does its job pretty well. It is far from crappy. You could do a lot
worse
imhooc
Philip
shwetabe...@gmail.com
Joe Tan
pi...@wlship.com
> To all Clarion users.
> I’d like your feedback about the following subject. I have
> completely moved from Clarion to VB. And I think VB is great language
> (regardless its bugs which are in every language), but most important
> thing is that VB is more human RAD than Clarion. VB is 100% hand code
> lanuage with its great debugger , but here I’m not going to
> discuss the positive aspects of VB. The purpose of this message is to
> tell the reasons why I throw out Clarion. Clarion had a Poor IDE, no
> ability to create ActiveX controls, ActiveX .DLLs and .EXEs. No user
> controls. Poor support of SQL servers access. Bad help. Almost no
> (poor) debugger (I can’t imagine in 21-st century the
> programming language without debbager). Very complicated way to create
> Add-ins like features. The necessity to declare in MAP every procedure
> I added to my modules and long time recompilation after this. Poor
> support of creation Internet (intanet) enable applications. Poor
> database access ( no nested transactions, no batch updating, no
> disconnected recordsets, no ability to open one .tps file with several
> recordsets, necessity of file declaration in code and much more). Poor
> classes (no propery let/get/set, no class generated events, no
> collection). I wonder what you (Clarion users) think about this?
I still have VB installed on my Windows 10 machine.
It is surprising what you can do with it still in 2020 - as a front end to latest version on sql server for instance - it is still a breeze).
+++
If you like visual basic syntax but think it is dated (yes it is 25 years now)
, why dont you try Xojo (xojo.com). The syntax is like vb, it is multi platform,
it is free for development only (without making exe files) and to purchase is cheap. The price runs from usd 99 to a few hundred dollars.