Re: olcott

[olcott]

On 12/6/2020 10:39 AM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> On 2020-12-06, olcott <No...@NoWhere.com> wrote:
>> On 12/6/2020 5:19 AM, Mr Flibble wrote:
>>> If EVERYONE is saying you are wrong then which is more likely?
>>>
>>> 1) You are not wrong.
>>> 2) You are wrong.
>>>
>>> /Flibble
>>>
>>
>> Not everyone say that I am wrong, Kaz says that I am correct and no one
>> else bothers to carefully examine what I say.
>
> I say that you're correct in that the cases which defeat deciders are
> often trivial and can be analyzed to show that they either halt or do
> not halt.

Such as the following case provided below:

> What has not been shown that those cases can be somehow correctly
> analyzed *by the decision functions themselves* which they target and
> defeat.
>
This statement does not make sense to me within the context of the
reasoning that I carefully explain below:

Linz, Peter 1990. An Introduction to Formal Languages and Automata.
Lexington/Toronto: D. C. Heath and Company.

http://www.liarparadox.org/Peter_Linz_HP(Pages_315-320).pdf

Just in case your knowledge of software engineering is abysmal I will
give you this little hint whenever an execution trace includes a
function call to the same function from the same machine address without
any intervening conditional branch instructions in-between:

(trace lines 13-21 shown below) THIS IS INFINITE RECURSION !!!

Actual debug trace of H() deciding halting on H_Hat()

void H_Hat(u32 P)
{
u32 Input_Halts = H(P, P);
if (Input_Halts)
HERE: goto HERE;
else
HALT
}

int main()
{
H((u32)H_Hat, (u32)H_Hat);
HALT;
}

_H_Hat()
[000005e0](01) 55 push ebp
[000005e1](02) 8bec mov ebp,esp
[000005e3](01) 51 push ecx
[000005e4](03) 8b4508 mov eax,[ebp+08]
[000005e7](01) 50 push eax
[000005e8](03) 8b4d08 mov ecx,[ebp+08]
[000005eb](01) 51 push ecx
[000005ec](05) e87ffdffff call 00000370
[000005f1](03) 83c408 add esp,+08
[000005f4](03) 8945fc mov [ebp-04],eax
[000005f7](04) 837dfc00 cmp dword [ebp-04],+00
[000005fb](02) 7404 jz 00000601
[000005fd](02) ebfe jmp 000005fd
[000005ff](02) eb01 jmp 00000602
[00000601](01) f4 hlt
[00000602](02) 8be5 mov esp,ebp
[00000604](01) 5d pop ebp
[00000605](01) c3 ret

_main()
[00000610](01) 55 push ebp
[00000611](02) 8bec mov ebp,esp
[00000613](05) 68e0050000 push 000005e0
[00000618](05) 68e0050000 push 000005e0
[0000061d](05) e84efdffff call 00000370
[00000622](03) 83c408 add esp,+08
[00000625](01) f4 hlt
[00000626](01) 5d pop ebp
[00000627](01) c3 ret

Output_Debug_Trace() Trace_List.size(20)
[00000610](01) 55 push ebp
[00000611](02) 8bec mov ebp,esp
[00000613](05) 68e0050000 push 000005e0
[00000618](05) 68e0050000 push 000005e0
[0000061d](05) e84efdffff call 00000370
[000005e0](01) 55 push ebp
[000005e1](02) 8bec mov ebp,esp
[000005e3](01) 51 push ecx
[000005e4](03) 8b4508 mov eax,[ebp+08]
[000005e7](01) 50 push eax
[000005e8](03) 8b4d08 mov ecx,[ebp+08]
[000005eb](01) 51 push ecx
[000005ec](05) e87ffdffff call 00000370
[000005e0](01) 55 push ebp
[000005e1](02) 8bec mov ebp,esp
[000005e3](01) 51 push ecx
[000005e4](03) 8b4508 mov eax,[ebp+08]
[000005e7](01) 50 push eax
[000005e8](03) 8b4d08 mov ecx,[ebp+08]
[000005eb](01) 51 push ecx
[000005ec](05) e87ffdffff call 00000370
The PRIOR Instruction Specifies Infinite Recursion: Simulation Stopped:
Number of Instructions Executed(2777)

On 11/27/2020 9:02 PM, Ben Bacarisse wrote:
> A computation that would not halt if its simulation were not
> halted is indeed a non-halting computation.

On Saturday, November 28, 2020 at 2:00:28 PM UTC-8, olcott wrote:
> Every computation that would not halt if its simulation
> were not halted is by logical necessity a non-halting computation.

Because of the above (halt deciding) criterion measure conditionals that
are a part of the halt decider and not a part of the user code are
correctly excluded when determining the non-halting behavior of the user
code.


--
Copyright 2020 Pete Olcott

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre
minds." Einstein