Instead of writing getter and setter methods, could a g/setter template be used?

[Robert Hutchings]

Again, I am a n00b, but, if a class has 50+ data elements, could generic
Get/Set functions be defined?

[Jorgen Grahn]

On Tue, 2014-10-28, Robert Hutchings wrote:
> Again, I am a n00b, but, if a class has 50+ data elements, could generic
> Get/Set functions be defined?

Don't know, but it's probably better to use more types. E.g. three
members

double x;
double y;
double z;

could become one:

Coordinate location;

IME you can usually get rid of the problem that way.

/Jorgen

--
// Jorgen Grahn <grahn@ Oo o. . .
\X/ snipabacken.se> O o .

[Paavo Helde]

Robert Hutchings <rm.hut...@gmail.com> wrote in news:m2o6s0$qo2$1@dont-
email.me:

> Again, I am a n00b, but, if a class has 50+ data elements, could generic
> Get/Set functions be defined?

Even if this was possible, it would not be a good idea. If your class is a
huge bag of unrelated variables which can all be changed independently,
then there are no getters or setters needed, just make the member variables
public.

OTOH, if the variables have interdependencies, then a generic setter
function would not work properly either. And in this case it would be clear
that the class is overcrowded, managing 50 or more interdependecies is
clearly too much for a single class. The data portions belonging together
should be encapsulated into separate smaller classes as suggested by
Jorgen. These member objects could be then set/replaced in a single go.

hth
Paavo

[Robert Hutchings]

Yes, I see your point Paavo. I guess I was still thinking in C-sharp
concepts....yes, I know, C# is NOT c++ :)

[Robert Hutchings]

On 10/28/2014 10:57 AM, Jorgen Grahn wrote:
> On Tue, 2014-10-28, Robert Hutchings wrote:
>> Again, I am a n00b, but, if a class has 50+ data elements, could generic
>> Get/Set functions be defined?
>
> Don't know, but it's probably better to use more types. E.g. three
> members
>
> double x;
> double y;
> double z;
>
> could become one:
>
> Coordinate location;
>
> IME you can usually get rid of the problem that way.
>
> /Jorgen
>

Yes, I see your point Jorgen. :)

[Mr Flibble]

I think what you are trying to say can stated more succinctly as:
*member variables that do not contribute to the class invariant can be
made public*. IME most member variables do contribute to the class
invariant so should remain private.

/Flibble

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Tuesday, October 28, 2014 9:49:09 AM UTC-4, Robert Hutchings wrote:
> Again, I am a n00b, but, if a class has 50+ data elements, could generic
> Get/Set functions be defined?

Unless you have some specific reason you want to run them through an
accessor, such as interception, or parallel event processing upon use),
you can always make those members you wish to access public, and in
that way they are then endowed with a "type of generic Get/Set ability".
It's not the same as an accessor, but it gives you the same effect (the
ability to get and set directly).

-----
On a side-note unrelated to C++...

I like your idea. I have a non-C++ compiler I'm working on and I will
incorporate your idea using this syntax:

class
{
public:
// Custom definitions go here

// To indicate all other unspecified forms have generics:
accessors(Get_);
mutators(Set_);

// Optionally, to have only a few members setup, it will be like this:
accessors(Get_, ...comma-delimited list of member names);
mutators(Set_, ...comma-delimited list of member names);

private:
...
}

Here they would be accessed as myClass->Get_memberName(). To change their
accessors names, use memberAccessors(getMyData, setMyData) to then have
them accessed by myClass->getMyDatamemberName(), et cetera.

The variable naming portion would allow them to be defined separately
from those which have hard-coding, so they are visible that way in
code and lists of member functions. I could support a syntax like
"Get_#_auto" which translates to myClass->Get_memberName_auto() for
pre-names and post-names.

I like your suggestion.

Best regards,
Rick C. Hodgin

[Robert Hutchings]

Thanks! I just had a situation where my employer is using SQL tables to
"model" objects. So, for example, an Employee table has about 30 data
items. When moving this into a c++ class, you end up with 30 members.
What may be required is to break that down into subclasses or just
create more classes...

[Chris M. Thomasson]

>"Rick C. Hodgin" wrote in message
>news:d45c34f9-e9fd-4b39...@googlegroups.com...

>>On Tuesday, October 28, 2014 9:49:09 AM UTC-4, Robert Hutchings wrote:
>> Again, I am a n00b, but, if a class has 50+ data elements, could generic
>> Get/Set functions be defined?

[...]

> class
> {

What is the name of the class?

[Chris M. Thomasson]

> "Chris M. Thomasson" wrote in message
> news:m2ovfe$94q$1...@speranza.aioe.org...

Sorry if I missed something here Rick!

:^o

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Tuesday, October 28, 2014 4:49:05 PM UTC-4, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:

> >"Rick C. Hodgin" wrote:
> > class
> > {
>
> What is the name of the class?

:-)

The compiler would've caught that. I just typed it off the top of
my head. :-) RDC also has only public members, so the public/private
are superfluous as well.

This also reminded me, I have been considering allowing spaces in variable
names (to be encoded as ASCII-255 (not ASCII-32) in 8-bit source files.
So, the name above could've been one or more spaces ... but it wasn't. :-)

[Öö Tiib]

On Tuesday, 28 October 2014 23:00:11 UTC+2, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
>
> This also reminded me, I have been considering allowing spaces in variable
> names (to be encoded as ASCII-255 (not ASCII-32) in 8-bit source files.
> So, the name above could've been one or more spaces ... but it wasn't. :-)

"ASCII-255" is strange term. What you mean with it? ASCII is character
encoding scheme that encodes 128 characters into 7-bit binary integers.
None of 7 bit binary integers has value 255.

[red floyd]

I think he means that he'll code blanks in variable names as '\xff'

[Rick C. Hodgin]

People always tell me this whenever I mention upper ASCII characters.
It comes from the days of MS-DOS. The ASCII characters were the ones
present on video cards. They were a standard character set that
provided for certain graphical characters, symbols in other languages,
etc. Here's an image showing them:

http://www.jimprice.com/ascii-128-255.gif

The ASCII-255 character was the same bit pattern as ASCII-0 (NULL)
and ASCII-32 (space). But, it is a separate and distinct character
that today would probably be referred to as ampersand-nbsp;

[Martijn Lievaart]

On Tue, 28 Oct 2014 16:51:12 -0700, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:

> On Tuesday, October 28, 2014 7:04:23 PM UTC-4, Öö Tiib wrote:
>> On Tuesday, 28 October 2014 23:00:11 UTC+2, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
>> >
>> > This also reminded me, I have been considering allowing spaces in
>> > variable names (to be encoded as ASCII-255 (not ASCII-32) in 8-bit
>> > source files. So, the name above could've been one or more spaces ...
>> > but it wasn't. :-)
>>
>> "ASCII-255" is strange term. What you mean with it? ASCII is character
>> encoding scheme that encodes 128 characters into 7-bit binary integers.
>> None of 7 bit binary integers has value 255.
>
> People always tell me this whenever I mention upper ASCII characters. It
> comes from the days of MS-DOS. The ASCII characters were the ones
> present on video cards. They were a standard character set that

No, those aren't ASCII. The first 128 codes are ASCII. The upper 128 are
an extension defined by IBM. Aka IBM extended ASCII aka cp437 (http://
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_page_437)

M4

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Tuesday, October 28, 2014 8:16:02 PM UTC-4, Martijn Lievaart wrote:
> No, those aren't ASCII. The first 128 codes are ASCII. The upper 128 are
> an extension defined by IBM. Aka IBM extended ASCII aka cp437 (http://
> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_page_437)

My mistake.

[Scott Lurndal]

"Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c...@gmail.com> writes:
>On Tuesday, October 28, 2014 8:16:02 PM UTC-4, Martijn Lievaart wrote:
>> No, those aren't ASCII. The first 128 codes are ASCII. The upper 128 are
>> an extension defined by IBM. Aka IBM extended ASCII aka cp437 (http://
>> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_page_437)
>
>My mistake.
>

Why do you believe that allowing spaces in a variable name is a
good idea?

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Wednesday, October 29, 2014 9:44:07 AM UTC-4, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> Why do you believe that allowing spaces in a variable name is a
> good idea?

Because we are human beings and we read things in words.

The space I would allow is the NBSP character, but I would not make
it completely invisible by default (as the actual ASCII-32 space symbol
is). Instead, I would allow an editor setting to display a mark there,
some type of visible cue, or to leave it blank by user setting.

By default, I would put a visible cue in there so it's clear (after one
becomes accustomed to the cue) that the colorized portion is connected.
I may do this anyway as an always-on feature (regardless of whether or
not there is a marked symbol present) using a slightly colorized
background color, which is different enough from the normal background
color that the eye catches it, but not so different that it's overtly
intrusive). By experience, a color delta of about 10% seems to work
for these purposes. :-)

In terms of a symbol, I think actually the extended-ASCII character
249 or 250 would be very nice for this. It's a tiny 4-pixel (249)
or single-pixel (250) dot in the middle of the character bitmap.

You can see them on the IBM extended ASCII Code Page 437 Wikipedia
page on the bottom row, 5th from the right, directly to the left
of the square root symbol:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_page_437
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f8/Codepage-437.png

I use that symbol in my kernel debugger in lieu of leading zeros. The
character serves as a placeholder in that context, so that we only see
the digits of significance in the numbers, and not the white noise of
the many leading zeros, allowing us to quickly read the content without
intrusion, for the significant numbers are all we really care about
generally.

See the example here in this video (Use VLC http://www.videolan.org):

http://www.visual-freepro.org/videos/2014_02_13__exodus_debi_debugger.ogv

[Martijn Lievaart]

It isn't, but it is kind of fun, isn't it? :-)

M4

[Fred.Zwarts]

"Rick C. Hodgin" schreef in bericht
news:b685a94d-6592-43da...@googlegroups.com...

Isn´t it much more simple to use the underscore (_) for such a space? It
almost completely matches your description.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Wednesday, October 29, 2014 10:04:06 AM UTC-4, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
> By default, I would put a visible cue in there so it's clear (after one
> becomes accustomed to the cue) that the colorized portion is connected.

I just thought of what may be a better solution. I'll have to do some
experimenting. I may make it visible as a half-space character in the
GUI and center the variable around the extra pixel space that would
otherwise be occupied by the full number of pixels in the name with
spaces. That by itself would make it stand out somewhere as it would
insert extra space before and after the name.

I could then use an optional cue on both sides to indicate the form
without question, such as a type of mini (|cask|).

Something like this:

http://snag.gy/a8SpE.jpg

[Robert Wessel]

On Tue, 28 Oct 2014 16:51:12 -0700 (PDT), "Rick C. Hodgin"
<rick.c...@gmail.com> wrote:

What would motivate you to actually require the old IBM-PC OEM
codepage at this point in time? The world has largely moved to
Unicode for a reason.

And calling the old 0xff character "&nbsp;" is pretty deceiving as
well, everyone who sees that is going to thing the Unicode character
(which would be code point 0xa0, or in UTF-8: 0xc2, 0xa0).

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Wednesday, October 29, 2014 11:09:33 AM UTC-4, robert...@yahoo.com wrote:
> What would motivate you to actually require the old IBM-PC OEM
> codepage at this point in time? The world has largely moved to
> Unicode for a reason.

I wouldn't require it. I would introduce it into my GUI editor as a
special bitmap used for this purpose.

> And calling the old 0xff character "&nbsp;" is pretty deceiving as
> well, everyone who sees that is going to thing the Unicode character
> (which would be code point 0xa0, or in UTF-8: 0xc2, 0xa0).

Calling this character "NBSP" is not my own device. I took the
name after reading about it on this website:

http://www.theasciicode.com.ar/extended-ascii-code/non-breaking-space-no-break-space-ascii-code-255.html

I appreciate your direction though. In searching through
images.google.com just now for the extended ASCII chart, I didn't
find any other references to ASCII-255 being known by that name.
And it just so happened that the first one I found yesterday was
the link above which did call it that. :-) Murphy's Law.

[Scott Lurndal]

As a thought experiment, whose result would invariably be "don't do this",
perhaps.

Bad enough having them in filenames.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Wednesday, October 29, 2014 12:04:15 PM UTC-4, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> As a thought experiment, whose result would invariably be "don't do this",
> perhaps.
>
> Bad enough having them in filenames.

The problem with spaces in filenames is that they're spaces. Were they
ASCII-255 (or other) characters, it wouldn't be any kind of issue at all
... even in non-quoted form. It would merely require that we change our
parsing algorithms from searching for alphanumeric + N special symbols,
to now be looking for alphanumeric + (N+1) special symbols, using space
as the delineator.

I never understood why compiler (and even OS) designers, at least those
doing new work in the 1990s, didn't do this. It's so obvious and removes
the whole delineation issue. You'd just need to teach developers one
time to type something like Shift+Space if they want a space in a
variable name. And if they won't, then they can continue to type in
variable names as they've always done, with underscores or all squished
together.

As for GUI interfaces and input mechanisms, these could automatically fix
up what the input was without any "regular users" having to do any
Shift+Space combinations unless they are skilled / foward-thinking and
want to do so.

[Mr Flibble]

Totally ridiculous; there is nothing wrong with underscores.

/Flibble

[Geoff]

I would further add that there is absolutely no difference between
insertion of a shifted space or some other artificial spacing
construct and an underscore. You're still inserting some kind of
character into the variable name and it is exactly the same amount of
work.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Wednesday, October 29, 2014 2:05:38 PM UTC-4, Geoff wrote:
> ...You're still inserting some kind of

> character into the variable name and it is exactly the same amount of
> work.

The thing about adding the ability to use spaces into a language, and
therefore make it more human-friendly, instead of the old-school "why
use fuel injectors? Carbs work just fine!" underscore mentality, is
that when the ability to use spaces exists (here's the best part),
that if you don't like them, then you don't have to use them!! But,
if you do like them, there they are for your eyes.

I will add them to RDC and VXB/VXB++. Probably won't make a dent in
the world's fish population or ozone layer ... but they'll be there
so as to lead by example (or follow surely some other languages allow
spaces?? Surely??).

Here's some commentary:

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1805030/why-do-programming-languages-not-allow-spaces-in-identifiers

Everybody's commenting on "using spaces" in variable names. I'm not
suggesting to use spaces (ASCII-32), but rather another parseable
character. Surely someone has thought of this before. Surely?? I
mean it's clear as an empty character there in extended ASCII character
code 255. It looks just like a space even. :-)

[Mr Flibble]

On 29/10/2014 18:31, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 29, 2014 2:05:38 PM UTC-4, Geoff wrote:
>> ...You're still inserting some kind of
>> character into the variable name and it is exactly the same amount of
>> work.
>
> The thing about adding the ability to use spaces into a language, and
> therefore make it more human-friendly, instead of the old-school "why
> use fuel injectors? Carbs work just fine!" underscore mentality, is
> that when the ability to use spaces exists (here's the best part),
> that if you don't like them, then you don't have to use them!! But,
> if you do like them, there they are for your eyes.

All adding spaces to things that are meant to be atomic symbols will do
is make code more difficult to read; what if you are viewing the code in
something other than your fucktarded IDE?

>
> I will add them to RDC and VXB/VXB++. Probably won't make a dent in
> the world's fish population or ozone layer ... but they'll be there
> so as to lead by example (or follow surely some other languages allow
> spaces?? Surely??).
>
> Here's some commentary:
>
> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1805030/why-do-programming-languages-not-allow-spaces-in-identifiers
>
> Everybody's commenting on "using spaces" in variable names. I'm not
> suggesting to use spaces (ASCII-32), but rather another parseable
> character. Surely someone has thought of this before. Surely?? I
> mean it's clear as an empty character there in extended ASCII character
> code 255. It looks just like a space even. :-)

You are fucking demented mate; also just how is a user supposed to
insert character 0xFF quickly with their standard keyboard?

/Flibble

[Geoff]

On Wed, 29 Oct 2014 11:31:45 -0700 (PDT), "Rick C. Hodgin"
<rick.c...@gmail.com> wrote:

>I'm not suggesting to use spaces (ASCII-32), but rather another parseable
>character.

That other parseable character is an underscore, easily found, easily
typed, common to all keyboards, within the original ASCII character
set and in use for decades. Change for change sake is not good change.

If you are going to write a language that allows spaces in variable
names then you should make it a space - a real space - and not some
contrived off-the-wall half-assed thingy that can only be parsed by
some half-assed, unfinished and unspecified IDE that attempts to
emulate what has taken Microsoft *decades* to develop with dozens of
developers on the job.

For all your time and trouble you should drop your RDC compiler or
whatever you're calling it this week and write a compiler that accepts
natural SPOKEN language as input.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Wednesday, October 29, 2014 3:33:44 PM UTC-4, Geoff wrote:
> Change for change sake is not good change.

I agree. This isn't a change for change sake. I personally think
general use of underscores is hideous. Always have. They have
application where they're applicable, such as to divide things into
easily recognizable groups by a delineator, but that's it so far as
I'm concerned.

I've had in mind to introduce spaces into my compiler since I first
decided to begin writing one back in the early/mid-90s. I just
haven't gotten there yet. But soon (prayerfully, James 4:15).

> For all your time and trouble you should drop your RDC compiler or
> whatever you're calling it this week

My compiler has always been RDC since 2011. The confusion may stem
from me periodically mentioning VXB and VXB++. Those are two XBASE
definition languages written for Visual FreePro, Jr. and Visual
FreePro, respectively. VXB is a lesser version of VXB++ (in case
you couldn't put that together) to go along with Visual FreePro, Jr.
being a lesser version of Visual FreePro.

> and write a compiler that accepts natural SPOKEN language as input.

That's a different issue, of course.

[David Brown]

On 29/10/14 15:03, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 29, 2014 9:44:07 AM UTC-4, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>> Why do you believe that allowing spaces in a variable name is a
>> good idea?
>
> Because we are human beings and we read things in words.
>
> The space I would allow is the NBSP character, but I would not make
> it completely invisible by default (as the actual ASCII-32 space symbol
> is). Instead, I would allow an editor setting to display a mark there,
> some type of visible cue, or to leave it blank by user setting.
>
> By default, I would put a visible cue in there so it's clear (after one
> becomes accustomed to the cue) that the colorized portion is connected.
> I may do this anyway as an always-on feature (regardless of whether or
> not there is a marked symbol present) using a slightly colorized
> background color, which is different enough from the normal background
> color that the eye catches it, but not so different that it's overtly
> intrusive). By experience, a color delta of about 10% seems to work
> for these purposes. :-)
>

Programmers have been using a visible NBSP character in identifier names
for decades - it is the underscore_character. Why not just use that,
just like everyone else?

[Martijn Lievaart]

Agree.

> Bad enough having them in filenames.

Don't agree at all. Besides the obvious arguments, those are here to stay
so we'ld better accommodate them.

Now a CR and/or LF in a filename, that's obscene. (but possible, so
account for it).

M4

[Ben Bacarisse]

"Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c...@gmail.com> writes:

<snip>

> The thing about adding the ability to use spaces into a language, and
> therefore make it more human-friendly,

Just help the discussion along a bit, you are confusing two separate
things: the presentation with the name. They can be separated. Algol
68 permitted names to be written with spaces, but the spaces were not
part of the name. This is, of course, ordinary spaces, not some special
space-like character code. It meant that accidentally typing two spaces
instead of one did not make a different name.

<snip>
--
Ben.

[Drew Lawson]

In article <61dfd69d-8340-4662...@googlegroups.com>

"Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c...@gmail.com> writes:

>Everybody's commenting on "using spaces" in variable names. I'm not
>suggesting to use spaces (ASCII-32), but rather another parseable
>character. Surely someone has thought of this before. Surely?? I
>mean it's clear as an empty character there in extended ASCII character
>code 255. It looks just like a space even. :-)

Actually, with my normal dev setup, 0xFF looks like a question mark.
In my 2nd choice environment, it looks like \ff with highlighting.

I'd never willingly develop code in an editor that hides the
difference between two distinct characters.



--
Drew Lawson So risk all or don't risk anything
You can lose all the same

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Thursday, October 30, 2014 9:20:42 AM UTC-4, Drew Lawson wrote:
> "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c...@gmail.com> writes:
> >Everybody's commenting on "using spaces" in variable names. I'm not
> >suggesting to use spaces (ASCII-32), but rather another parseable
> >character. Surely someone has thought of this before. Surely?? I
> >mean it's clear as an empty character there in extended ASCII character
> >code 255. It looks just like a space even. :-)
>
> Actually, with my normal dev setup, 0xFF looks like a question mark.
> In my 2nd choice environment, it looks like \ff with highlighting.
>
> I'd never willingly develop code in an editor that hides the
> difference between two distinct characters.

I would not use the default font's character for this, but instead I
would display it as I have indicated, a half-space with some coloring
around it. You would only ever see it as a space in my editor because
I would graphically be manipulating what is displayed to show it that
way.

I'll get this coded soon (James 4:15) and demonstrate it to everybody.
Perhaps even tonight as I'm finally done with another project that's
consumed the last couple of weeks.

[Chris M. Thomasson]

> > "Rick C. Hodgin" wrote in message
> > news:ec50f5ea-a548-468f...@googlegroups.com...

> On Tuesday, October 28, 2014 4:49:05 PM UTC-4, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> > >"Rick C. Hodgin" wrote:
> > > class
> > > {
> >
> > What is the name of the class?

> :-)

> The compiler would've caught that. I just typed it off the top of
> my head. :-) RDC also has only public members, so the public/private
> are superfluous as well.

No problem.

:^)

[...]

[Rick C. Hodgin]

I was able to get the non-breaking-space ability added to my parser and
IDE tonight. It now allows me to have non-breaking-spaces added to every
variable name, function name, table field, etc., in an XBASE language.
The same will be introduced into RDC.

It uses Shift+spacebar to insert the nbsp character, which internally
is stored as ASCII-255 in the text file.

http://snag.gy/QjtXc.jpg

I will probably change the formatting somewhat. Right now I'm using a
1 point size smaller font size so the space looks normal with the
smaller text. I'll probably put it back up to normal size and go with
my original half-space idea. I'm also using only a fixed dark blue
background with a 15% opacity over white. I think it's still too "in
your face" and will work on the presentation.

[Robert Wessel]

And in the process you've broken every tool, other than yours, which
someone might want to use to look at or manipulate a source file.
Heck, you can't even display a page of source code on a web site
anymore without heroics.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

Robert...@yahoo.com wrote:
> Heck, you can't even display a page of source
> code on a web site anymore without heroics.

"Heroics." Hmmm. Interesting.

"Come and visit LibSF.org, where developers
code more like people, and our web server's
are heroic."

[Daniel]

On Friday, October 31, 2014 8:01:04 AM UTC-4, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:

> "Come and visit LibSF.org,

"There's a man I've met on an online forum. He is negative and hurtful in his
comments, ... he's being led by false spirits seeking to do harm ... I pray
that this man will humble himself before the Living God, believe, repent, and
be saved." - Rick C. Hodgin

I think he's talking about you, Mr Flibble.

Daniel

[Daniel]

On Friday, October 31, 2014 8:01:04 AM UTC-4, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:

> Robert...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > Heck, you can't even display a page of source
> > code on a web site anymore without heroics.
>

> "Come and visit LibSF.org, where developers
> code more like people, and our web server's
> are heroic."
>

Pride, Mr Hodgin, pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall.

[Scott Lurndal]

"Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c...@gmail.com> writes:
>On Thursday, October 30, 2014 9:20:42 AM UTC-4, Drew Lawson wrote:
>> "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c...@gmail.com> writes:
>> >Everybody's commenting on "using spaces" in variable names. I'm not
>> >suggesting to use spaces (ASCII-32), but rather another parseable
>> >character. Surely someone has thought of this before. Surely?? I
>> >mean it's clear as an empty character there in extended ASCII character
>> >code 255. It looks just like a space even. :-)
>>
>> Actually, with my normal dev setup, 0xFF looks like a question mark.
>> In my 2nd choice environment, it looks like \ff with highlighting.
>>
>> I'd never willingly develop code in an editor that hides the
>> difference between two distinct characters.
>
>I would not use the default font's character for this, but instead I

A language where one cannot use their favorite editor is pretty
close to useless.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

Agreed. Proverbs. One of the wisdom books.
http://biblehub.com/proverbs/16-18.htm

(1) I was being silly, attempting humor.
(2) God does not want us to be without pride, nor without a view of
ourselves. He just does not want it artificially inflated, as
with yeast, but only insomuch as is correct. A person can be
proud of their accomplishments, but they must recognize that the
reason they had any such accomplishment in the first place was
because God gave them the abilities and opportunities to do so.

Have you considered this verse?
http://biblehub.com/romans/12-3.htm

"For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is
among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to
think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every
man the measure of faith."

The man who focuses his life upon the Lord, for example, can take pride
in his work because it is a right work. The man who strives with great
effort to live a holy life can take pride in the fact that he is living
a holy life. But he must not become conceited or prideful in himself,
but in all ways acknowledge first the Lord.

What is wrong is the, "Hey, I'm all that and a bag of chips" attitude
about oneself. Jesus taught us to first remove the beam from our own
eye, and then we will see clearly to remove the speck from our brother's
eye, meaning it is okay to reach out to guide another, provided you are
first taking care of yourself.

Ours (Christians) is a communal effort. We are not practicing our
faith in isolation, but as part of a community, His community. We
remind each other continually of the things we should be doing, because
the enemy is real and is actively prowling around seeking whom he may
devour with temptation and culmination in sin.

I am proud of the work I've done with regards to LibSF. It has been
an ongoing, continuous battle against all other people, including my
own family. Everyone has told me to set it aside and conform to the
more conventional ways of the world. I have persisted through it all,
and when I look at myself in the mirror, apart from the standard degree
of self-examination where I always look at myself and think, "You
could've done more, Rick," I am pride, and even humbled at the fact
that I have been able to continue because there have been times it has
been so very very hard to proceed. Times I've even laid in bed crying
because of what I was having to endure as I moved forward for my Lord.
But, I persisted. And I have been very proud of that, because it is a
right thing to do that is not centered upon myself, but upon Him, and
devotion unto Him.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Friday, October 31, 2014 9:31:49 AM UTC-4, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> A language where one cannot use their favorite editor is pretty
> close to useless.

(1) No one is forced to use spaces. Use your favorite editor and
use only underscores or some type of case like camelCase.
However, if you want to use spaces, then it's now available (or
soon will be, James 4:15).

(2) No one is forced to use RDC. People will use it because they
want to, and for no other reason. There are lots of other compilers
with all of their favorite stand-bys.

(3) A person could easily parse and type in the ASCII-255 character. In
Windows it's Alt+numpad 255. I'm sure it's possible in Linux too.

(4) If your editor is proprietary and you cannot get the source code
to go in and make an easy way to accept Shift+Spacebar, and alter
the display to in some way mark off the single variable with the
nbsp character ... then perhaps you should switch to an open source
editor? Just a thought...

(5) Hi. :-)

[David Brown]

He may be talking about many people, including me. I've been declared
to be someone Rick will not answer, though I actually am not sure why.
Given all the useful advice I have posted for him, it is very much his
loss, not mine.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Friday, October 31, 2014 9:44:12 AM UTC-4, David Brown wrote:
> He may be talking about many people, including me. I've been declared
> to be someone Rick will not answer, though I actually am not sure why.

I hereby reset my "someone Rick will not answer" list to be completely
empty. Everything starts anew! :-)

The people who have gone on that list, and others will go on it again I
have no doubts, have been demeaning and hurtful, purposefully negative
rather than honestly helpful, and as a pattern lasting for more than a
few posts.

There is a spirit which operates in this world. We cannot see him with
our eyes, just as we cannot see God, but he is there, just as He is there.

What we can see is the action in people because of the spiritual presence.
The devil and his demon imps stir up hate, violence, demeaning speech, in
people. He tempts them to lust, commit acts of sin, satiate self at the
expense of others, or of righteousness.

I cease speaking with people who are moved by that spirit because that
spirit is there for only one reason: to steal, kill, destroy, whatever it
can (ideas, hope, inspiration, everything). Such a spirit cannot be
reasoned with, talked to, it will only and always turn anything said into
a debate or argument, trying to twist things around into man's reasoning
rather than a solid faith upon/in God.

There is a real spiritual battle taking place in this world. It's why
there is so much hate and harm. And Jesus really is the ONLY way out
of that hate because He is the only one who has overcome all of it.
Because of His victory, those who put their faith in Him also stand in
victory because He gives to all who come to Him, without any exceptions,
provided you come to Him as He is, seeking from your inmost heart the
Truth. It is the only way He is found ... when you seek Him with all
your heart.

http://biblehub.com/jeremiah/29-13.htm
"13 And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with
all your heart."

People are unaware they are letting Satan and his demon imps work
through them because of the fallen sin nature and man's inability to
know the truth by himself. It is a supernatural act of God that any
man can be restored. But God looks into a person's true self and
knows if a man will hear the Truth, and if so He moves in that person's
life to change the course over time, so that they will be saved.

It is a true daily battle for every Christian. And also for every non-
Christian, but the non-Christian does not recognize there is a battle
taking place and is generally left alone because they're already where
Satan wants them (on the path to Hell). But for those who stand up and
speak unto God, and who speak of Jesus Christ and each of our need for
forgiveness by Him through His atoning sacrifice on the cross, that's
where the enemy's fire goes.

There's a great sermon about this by Steve Lawson. I would advise
everyone watch it and listen to what he's teaching. He's teaching
that there is an invisible war taking place all around us, that
things are happening in the spiritual realm which translate into
physical action down here upon this Earth in people, in even nations
rising up against nations. The powers that are at work are massive.
In Lawson's teaching he speaks about Job from the Bible who had
everything he possessed taken from him when God gave Satan permission
to lay his hand upon everything he had. And Satan did it because he
hates God. He hates you and me. All he is is hate.

Do you know there are only three times in scripture we actually hear
the voice of Satan recorded? Look at the overall theme here (para-
phrased):

(1) Garden of Eden, to Adam and Eve. "God's withholding His
blessing by keeping you from the fruit of the tree of the
knowledge of good and evil."

(2) In Heaven to God, regarding Job. "God, you're being too
good to Job. If you took away his stuff, he'll curse you
to your face."

(3) In the wilderness to Jesus during Jesus' 40-day fast.
"All of this has been given to me, and I can give it to
whomever I choose. If you will bow down and worship me,
I'll be better to you than God."

He tells Adam and Eve "God's being too good to you," then God, "You're
being too good to them," and then Jesus, "I'll be better to you than
God."

He is only and always setting everyone against everyone else because
he wants to be God and he hates the fact that he cannot be God because
there is only one God who is God. He is God the Father, God the Son,
and God the Holy Spirit ... the Almighty.

A description of Satan's goals:
http://biblehub.com/isaiah/14-13.htm
http://biblehub.com/isaiah/14-14.htm
http://biblehub.com/isaiah/14-15.htm

"13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I
will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the
mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north."

"14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the
most High."

"15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit."

That is the enemy we face. One who desires to rule the Heavens and
be God. And there is not one of us upon this Earth who can stand
against him, but only the Lord Jesus Christ, rightly called "Lord"
because of what He's done, and because of who He is.

Make no mistake about it ... we are all in this war. Some will wind
up on the losing side because they would not humble themselves.
Others will forgo self and submit themselves unto the Lord humbly,
and ask forgiveness, and be forgiveness, and shine like the stars
in Heaven forever.

Each man has a choice to make. And the enemy is working continually
in your life to stop you from making the right one. But all you have
to do is turn to Him in your heart, in the quiet recesses of your mind,
and ask Him to save you. Ask Him to come to you and lead you out of
captivity and He will do so. He hears your thoughts. He knows your
heart. He knows your truest intentions and aspirations. When you
humble yourself and come to Him, He will ALREADY have been working on
your life to save you, because He knows your thoughts afar off.

Come to Him, and ask forgiveness, and ask Him to save you, and you
too will be saved this very day. You'll be forever glad you did.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

The Invisible War, by Steve Lawson:
http://www.libsf.org/video/steve_lawson__the_invisible_war.mp4

You can also find it on YouTube by googling:
"YouTube Steve Lawson The Invisible War"

Here is the full video on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDVWvOQvlK8

[Mr Flibble]

On 31/10/2014 13:40, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
> On Friday, October 31, 2014 9:31:49 AM UTC-4, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>> A language where one cannot use their favorite editor is pretty
>> close to useless.
>
> (1) No one is forced to use spaces. Use your favorite editor and
> use only underscores or some type of case like camelCase.
> However, if you want to use spaces, then it's now available (or
> soon will be, James 4:15).

James was a cunt but not as much of a cunt as Jesus; or to put it
another way: stop fucking preaching in this technical newsgroup.

>
> (2) No one is forced to use RDC. People will use it because they
> want to, and for no other reason. There are lots of other compilers
> with all of their favorite stand-bys.

I suspect no one will use this "RDC" thing except you if this spaces
debacle is indicative of how you approach things

>
> (3) A person could easily parse and type in the ASCII-255 character. In
> Windows it's Alt+numpad 255. I'm sure it's possible in Linux too.

Yeah, twice as many keystrokes as underscore and four times as many as
multiple underscores.

>
> (4) If your editor is proprietary and you cannot get the source code
> to go in and make an easy way to accept Shift+Spacebar, and alter
> the display to in some way mark off the single variable with the
> nbsp character ... then perhaps you should switch to an open source
> editor? Just a thought...

Yeah switch to an open source editor just so they can type spaces that
aren't spaces in things that shouldn't have spaces.

/Flibble

[Mr Flibble]

Mate, just fuck off.

/Flibble

[Rick C. Hodgin]

Mr Flibble wrote:
> [snip]

Mr Flibble, I love you. Jesus loves you more.

As He brings you to my remembrance, I will keep you in my prayers.
Take care my friend. I will be here if you would like to contact
me. And remember, there are none so far away from the Lord that
His tremendous Love cannot reach, should they have even the smallest
inkling of desire from within to seek Him. He is able to save to
the uttermost.

May He guide you from within, Mr Flibble, forever to His Kingdom
in the glories of Heaven.

[Robert Wessel]

On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 06:40:25 -0700 (PDT), "Rick C. Hodgin"
<rick.c...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Friday, October 31, 2014 9:31:49 AM UTC-4, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>> A language where one cannot use their favorite editor is pretty
>> close to useless.
>
>(1) No one is forced to use spaces. Use your favorite editor and
> use only underscores or some type of case like camelCase.
> However, if you want to use spaces, then it's now available (or
> soon will be, James 4:15).

While *I* might avoid the embedded pseudo-spaces, but if I have to
look at source code that someone else has written, all my tools are
trashed.

>(2) No one is forced to use RDC. People will use it because they
> want to, and for no other reason. There are lots of other compilers
> with all of their favorite stand-bys.

Whatever your goals are, setting up extra roadblocks to the use of
your language seems like a bad idea. Especially when they accomplish
so little. What, again, is so horrible about underscores?

The last is a rhetorical question, I've seen you prior
justification(s), which I find wholly unsatisfying, so unless you have
a new one, let's leave it at you really don't like underscores for
some unfathomable (to me) reason.

In any event programming languages are not the same as human
languages, and meet different goals. Trying to make a language more
like English leads you down the road of Cobol. Which, despite a
rather convoluted and complex syntax, and a huge effort to actually be
English-like, pretty much failed utterly at that goal.

>(3) A person could easily parse and type in the ASCII-255 character. In
> Windows it's Alt+numpad 255. I'm sure it's possible in Linux too.

When you do that, by default, you end up with an 0xa0 in your file. Or
it may depend on which version of notepad you're running. It also
doesn't display well.

I expect that in a lot of cases you're going to end up with either a
0xc2 0xa0 or a 0xc3 0xaf in your file, which will probably break
*your* tools.

>(4) If your editor is proprietary and you cannot get the source code
> to go in and make an easy way to accept Shift+Spacebar, and alter
> the display to in some way mark off the single variable with the
> nbsp character ... then perhaps you should switch to an open source
> editor? Just a thought...

It's not just editors, there are a lot of tools which won't deal with
this well, especially once you add the PC/OEM code page vs. Unicode
distinction to the mix.

[David Brown]

On 31/10/14 15:15, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
> On Friday, October 31, 2014 9:44:12 AM UTC-4, David Brown wrote:
>> He may be talking about many people, including me. I've been declared
>> to be someone Rick will not answer, though I actually am not sure why.
>
> I hereby reset my "someone Rick will not answer" list to be completely
> empty. Everything starts anew! :-)
>
> The people who have gone on that list, and others will go on it again I
> have no doubts, have been demeaning and hurtful, purposefully negative
> rather than honestly helpful, and as a pattern lasting for more than a
> few posts.

I call a spade a spade. If I see you have an idea I think is good, I
will say so. If you have an idea that I think can be improved, I will
give suggestions. And if I see an idea that I think is utterly stupid,
I will call it utterly stupid. If you find that "demeaning", then I
suggest you think through some of your ideas a little better - and
listen to the responses and advice given. My aim in the technical
comments I post is to be helpful - if I have been cruel, it is to be kind.

(In case it is still not entirely clear, I think many of your ideas are
good or at least interesting, and while they may not make sense for C
they would be fine for your own language. But a few of them, such as
your weird spaces idea, are /really/ bad, and it would be disrespectful
to you if people let them pass without trying to persuade you to drop them.)

Note also that I am condemning the "sin", not the "sinner".


Regarding your religious posts and comments, it's been made abundantly
clear that they are not welcome here. Nobody - Christians, atheists,
agnostics, pastafarians, or whatever - appreciates them. Nobody thinks
they are of any benefit or help. Even the other Christians in this
group understand that the way you write is going to chase people away
rather than persuade people to consider Christianity. In your own
terms, /you/ are doing Satan's work.

Unlike many here, I am quite happy with the occasional religious thread,
just as I am quite happy with the occasional political or other
off-topic thread. But it should be kept in a separate thread. There is
a time and a place for such discussions - I am sure you know the
Biblical quotation about there being a time for all things. And when
there /is/ a religious discussion, you will get on far better by keeping
to the point and the issues at hand, rather than continuously re-cycling
the same theories about a "war". If you like, try /fighting/ the "war"
by being a positive influence in your posts, rather than just moaning
about it.

Again, if you find this hurtful then I am sorry for you - but I write
this to be helpful to /you/.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Friday, October 31, 2014 12:05:30 PM UTC-4, David Brown wrote:
> Regarding your religious posts and comments, it's been made abundantly
> clear that they are not welcome here.

The Lord will not ask me on the final day if I was popular, or if I
made converts, but only if I obeyed Him. Have you ever read Matthew
28:18+? And John 13:34 (or printf("John \015:\042\n"); // If you prefer)?
There, I used octal. :-)

http://biblehub.com/matthew/28-18.htm // All authority, so I tell you:
http://biblehub.com/matthew/28-19.htm // Go, teach, even baptize
http://biblehub.com/matthew/28-20.htm // Teach them to obey me
http://biblehub.com/matthew/28-21.htm // I am with you always

http://biblehub.com/john/13-34.htm // Love one another
// "as I have loved you"

[Richard Damon]

On 10/29/14, 11:31 AM, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
>
> Everybody's commenting on "using spaces" in variable names. I'm not
> suggesting to use spaces (ASCII-32), but rather another parseable
> character. Surely someone has thought of this before. Surely?? I
> mean it's clear as an empty character there in extended ASCII character
> code 255. It looks just like a space even. :-)
>

> Best regards,
> Rick C. Hodgin
>

One comment about use '255' as the value of your 'space' character, is
that seems to be implying that your language has, in effect, defined
what 'code page' you system needs to be in. In effect, this limits what
human languages are expressible in the file, including comments and
strings.

It would seem much better to adopt the Unicode encoding for your
character set. You might still allow some way to define that a given
file is written in a extended ASCII 8 bit character set (and defining
WHICH extended 8 bit character set it is in).

If you do this, then the value of the non-break-space character is
U+00A0 (how it will appear in the file depends on what encoding you
choose (UTF-8 may be the best, which would give you 0xC2, 0xA0 as a
multi-byte character).

[Drew Lawson]

In article <228d9393-add0-4911...@googlegroups.com>

"Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c...@gmail.com> writes:

>28:18+? And John 13:34 (or printf("John \015:\042\n"); // If you prefer)?

That prints:
:"hn

(And this from someone claiming to know when character substitutions make sense.)

--
Drew Lawson | Pass the tea and sympathy
| for he good old days are dead
| Let's raise a toast to those
| who best survived the life they led

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Friday, October 31, 2014 3:11:14 PM UTC-4, Drew Lawson wrote:
> In article <228d9393-add0-4911...@googlegroups.com>
> "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c...@gmail.com> writes:
>
> >28:18+? And John 13:34 (or printf("John \015:\042\n"); // If you prefer)?
>
> That prints:
> :"hn
>
> (And this from someone claiming to know when character substitutions
> make sense.)

:-)

Best regards
Rick C. Hodgin

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Friday, October 31, 2014 3:04:48 PM UTC-4, Richard Damon wrote:
> One comment about use '255' as the value of your 'space' character, is
> that seems to be implying that your language has, in effect, defined
> what 'code page' you system needs to be in. In effect, this limits what
> human languages are expressible in the file, including comments and
> strings.

I suppose so. It is my first offering. And I am doing this alone.
They tell authors to write what they know. I suppose it works for
developers as well.

> It would seem much better to adopt the Unicode encoding for your
> character set. You might still allow some way to define that a given
> file is written in a extended ASCII 8 bit character set (and defining
> WHICH extended 8 bit character set it is in).
>
> If you do this, then the value of the non-break-space character is
> U+00A0 (how it will appear in the file depends on what encoding you
> choose (UTF-8 may be the best, which would give you 0xC2, 0xA0 as a
> multi-byte character).

Are you ready to come on board and help me code this UNICODE support?

[Richard Damon]

On 10/31/14, 3:11 PM, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
> On Friday, October 31, 2014 3:04:48 PM UTC-4, Richard Damon wrote:
>> One comment about use '255' as the value of your 'space' character, is
>> that seems to be implying that your language has, in effect, defined
>> what 'code page' you system needs to be in. In effect, this limits what
>> human languages are expressible in the file, including comments and
>> strings.
>
> I suppose so. It is my first offering. And I am doing this alone.
> They tell authors to write what they know. I suppose it works for
> developers as well.
>

I suggest you think about Luke 14:28. Yes, a developer should develop
with what they know, and aim the extent of their development to what
they are comfortable with. It is one thing to develop a tool for your
own use, one can be a bit more haphazard in this. When one one puts
forth to the world that one is trying to make an improvement on an
existing environment, one needs to be sure that one really has the
chance to achieve this. (It takes much more than just good intentions).

>> It would seem much better to adopt the Unicode encoding for your
>> character set. You might still allow some way to define that a given
>> file is written in a extended ASCII 8 bit character set (and defining
>> WHICH extended 8 bit character set it is in).
>>
>> If you do this, then the value of the non-break-space character is
>> U+00A0 (how it will appear in the file depends on what encoding you
>> choose (UTF-8 may be the best, which would give you 0xC2, 0xA0 as a
>> multi-byte character).
>
> Are you ready to come on board and help me code this UNICODE support?
>
> Best regards,
> Rick C. Hodgin
>

If I had more interest in this project, it might be a possibility. I
personally don't see a value in the changes I have heard you wanting to
make to the C language.

I also am a bit put off by some of your behavior. I think you should
consider 1 Peter 2:20, and compare your behavior to whom you claim to
follow, and to who exhibited that behavior to. I don't see him getting
into the sort of arguments you seem to get into. Consider Luke 18:9 and
think you you act more like.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Saturday, November 1, 2014 12:34:55 AM UTC-4, Richard Damon wrote:
> [snip]

When I was a younger Christian I used to wonder why these verses
were in scripture. They seemed so out of place for a Christian,
and a Holy God of Love:

http://biblehub.com/revelation/6-10.htm
http://biblehub.com/revelation/20-15.htm

I do not wonder any more. God has shown me the necessity of what
He has done, and is doing. And I am so very thankful for who He is.
I am thankful that He is called Faithful and True, and it is in Him
I pin all my hopes. The plans He has for my life are His plans, and
because He is who He is, I am able to rest confidently there, in
that place, secure in the knowledge that He really is in control,
and that all of our Earthly struggles are but for a season.

I wish you well, Richard.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Saturday, November 1, 2014 1:44:21 AM UTC-4, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
> On Saturday, November 1, 2014 12:34:55 AM UTC-4, Richard Damon wrote:
> > [snip]
>
> When I was a younger Christian I used to wonder why these verses
> were in scripture. They seemed so out of place for a Christian,
> and a Holy God of Love:
>
> http://biblehub.com/revelation/6-10.htm
> http://biblehub.com/revelation/20-15.htm
>
> I do not wonder any more. God has shown me the necessity of what
> He has done, and is doing.

To be clear about what I mean here, it is a reference to putting
away sin and all falseness forever, that those who are in Heaven
may dwell with Him forever apart from such things as evil and
falseness, in only the goodness He has prepared for His dwelling.

There's a line in the movie, The Encounter, when "Nick" asks "Jesus"
if He commanded that the Canaanites be killed, to which He replies,
"I commanded they kill the Canaanites." "Including women and children?"
"Including women and children." "Today we have a word for that:
genocide. Is that any way for a God of Love to behave?"

"Jesus" goes on to explain, "I am Love. But I am also Holy. And
that's not just for my benefit, but for yours as well. Nick, I
don't want you to wallow in sin and regret, but to prosper in the
plans I've made for you..."

http://biblehub.com/proverbs/3-6.htm
"6 In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths."

Continually. Prayerfully. And prayerfully again.

[Daniel]

On Saturday, November 1, 2014 1:56:35 AM UTC-4, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
>
> To be clear about what I mean here, it is a reference to putting

> away sin and all falseness forever.

>
> There's a line in the movie, The Encounter, when "Nick" asks "Jesus"
> if He commanded that the Canaanites be killed, to which He replies,
> "I commanded they kill the Canaanites." "Including women and children?"
> "Including women and children." "Today we have a word for that:
> genocide. Is that any way for a God of Love to behave?"
>

Those are "Old Testament" values, where obedience to a god becomes the motivating factor for killing and enslaving the "others", a modern day example of Old Testament values in Iraq and Syria is isis. It's not a good thing, and thankfully the modern world has moved on, but there are still flickers in the ashes, even in the west the gods are not entirely dead. But they not as powerful as they used to be.

Daniel

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Saturday, November 1, 2014 6:34:49 AM UTC-4, Daniel wrote:
> On Saturday, November 1, 2014 1:56:35 AM UTC-4, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
> >
> > To be clear about what I mean here, it is a reference to putting
> > away sin and all falseness forever.
> >
> > There's a line in the movie, The Encounter, when "Nick" asks "Jesus"
> > if He commanded that the Canaanites be killed, to which He replies,
> > "I commanded they kill the Canaanites." "Including women and children?"
> > "Including women and children." "Today we have a word for that:
> > genocide. Is that any way for a God of Love to behave?"
>

> Those are "Old Testament" values, where obedience to a god...
> thankfully the modern world has moved on, but...
>
> Daniel

God has demonstrated His resolve as a witness to us. He, in the Old
Testament, had entire peoples killed. In the days of Noah He destroyed
the entire Earth except for eight people. Will He really throw people
into Hell forever? Yes. In no uncertain terms yes.

It is not His desire that any should perish in Hell, but rather that
all would repent and be saved. He came here to make the way for that
to happen, and He succeeded. Men and women like me speak about Jesus
because, as our Lord desires, we also want people to be saved. It's
not for other reasons.

Eternity is heading at every one of us. Everybody dies. What happens
after we die goes on forever. The warnings that I, and others like me,
give are given for that purpose -- so that people will not enter in to
that most horrible place.

[red floyd]

On 10/31/2014 8:35 AM, Robert Wessel wrote:
> On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 06:40:25 -0700 (PDT), "Rick C. Hodgin"

>

>> (2) No one is forced to use RDC. People will use it because they
>> want to, and for no other reason. There are lots of other compilers
>> with all of their favorite stand-bys.
>
>
> Whatever your goals are, setting up extra roadblocks to the use of
> your language seems like a bad idea. Especially when they accomplish
> so little. What, again, is so horrible about underscores?

Will his language also put biblical references into the output? Even
if I'm not a member of ANY Christian denomination?

[Rick C. Hodgin]

On Saturday, November 1, 2014 12:39:50 PM UTC-4, red floyd wrote:
> Will his language also put biblical references into the output? Even
> if I'm not a member of ANY Christian denomination?

My license model (public domain, accountable to God):
http://www.libsf.org/licenses/

A sample splash screen from my IDE (the cross of love):
http://www.visual-freepro.org/images/vjr_054.png

I am explicitly a Christian offering this product unto the Lord, and
unto men. I am not doing it for other reasons. As such, I convey
that through my product.

[woodb...@gmail.com]

I think it's helpful to be candid about your approach.
There's a "General Background" section in the D&E book.
I'm glad to know something about what he believed/believes.

I'd use a biblical reference if I think it helps to
explain my understanding of something.

Brian
Ebenezer Enterprises - "A false witness will perish,
but the man who listens to the truth will speak forever."
Proverbs 21:28

http://webEbenezer.net

[Mr Flibble]

Best regards? You are not showing the majority of this technical
newsgroup "best regards" by continuing with your Christian preaching.
Nobody cares about your evil, fucktarded, non-existent god.

/Flibble

[Mr Flibble]

On 01/11/2014 18:19, woodb...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday, November 1, 2014 11:39:50 AM UTC-5, red floyd wrote:
>> On 10/31/2014 8:35 AM, Robert Wessel wrote:
>>>
>>> Whatever your goals are, setting up extra roadblocks to the use of
>>> your language seems like a bad idea. Especially when they accomplish
>>> so little. What, again, is so horrible about underscores?
>>
>> Will his language also put biblical references into the output?
>
> I think it's helpful to be candid about your approach.
> There's a "General Background" section in the D&E book.
> I'm glad to know something about what he believed/believes.
>
> I'd use a biblical reference if I think it helps to
> explain my understanding of something.

That limits your audience to people who know the bible inside-out or
carry a bible around with them; neither applies to me as I know the god
of the bible does not exist and hence also know the value of the bible
and its verses.

/Flibble

[woodb...@gmail.com]

On Saturday, November 1, 2014 1:26:47 PM UTC-5, Mr Flibble wrote:
>
> Best regards?

Please don't swear here.

[Rick C. Hodgin]

> Nobody cares about your evil....non-existent god.

You are not fighting me, Mr Flibble. You are free to insult me, harm
me, demean me. But there is One whom you are fighting in all of this,
and you will have no victory over Him, but only utter defeat.

http://biblehub.com/isaiah/5-20.htm

Jesus came to teach men the way, the truth path, and to warn men about
what is coming for those who will not receive it.

I pray you will hear Him, Mr Flibble, and receive the truth.

[woodb...@gmail.com]

On Saturday, November 1, 2014 1:29:20 PM UTC-5, Mr Flibble wrote:
>
> That limits your audience to people who know the bible inside-out or
> carry a bible around with them; neither applies to me as I know the god
> of the bible does not exist and hence also know the value of the bible
> and its verses.
>

They can use

http://Biblegateway.com

or other sites to look it up. They could also
email me or call me.

Brian
Ebenezer Enterprises
http://webEbenezer.net

[woodb...@gmail.com]

On Saturday, November 1, 2014 1:36:23 PM UTC-5, woodb...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday, November 1, 2014 1:29:20 PM UTC-5, Mr Flibble wrote:
> >
> > That limits your audience to people who know the bible inside-out or
> > carry a bible around with them; neither applies to me as I know the god
> > of the bible does not exist and hence also know the value of the bible
> > and its verses.
> >
>
> They can use
>
> http://Biblegateway.com
>

Should be

https://Biblegateway.com

[Chris Vine]

On Sat, 1 Nov 2014 09:55:20 -0700 (PDT)

"Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I am explicitly a Christian offering this product unto the Lord, and
> unto men. I am not doing it for other reasons. As such, I convey
> that through my product.

At least this part of your post is semi-on-topic, since it does relate
to some code you are developing with C++ (I think). If so, we should be
grateful for that at least.

However, "unto" has been archaic in English for many centuries now.
"To" is a perfectly good modern substitute. Presumably your usage stems
from an obsession with the King James translation of the bible into
English. Even at the time of the translation, the word was at least
formal, if not already archaic then. (There are much better translations
available now of course.)

On an English language news group, amongst whose users there are many
posters who do not have English as their first language, you might
convey your thoughts better about your project if you were to use
language that people have spoken in the last few centuries (outside any
of the weird American religious sects that you may belong to).

Chris