Helvetica + Small Caps?
Marc Goldhagen
is there a Helvetica-like sans serif font with "real" small caps?
So far I've found only "Chalet Book" from HouseIndustries, which is
quite nice, but the caps are too large for my taste.
Any other alternatives?
TIA,
Marc
Armadillo
>
> So far I've found only "Chalet Book" from HouseIndustries, which is
> quite nice, but the caps are too large for my taste.
Meta (www.fontfont.com) has nice set of small caps.
Sans serif small caps is often considered as typografic error by purists (like me) but in some cases it looks very good.
With a large family which include normal and semibold versions sometimes semibold can be used in smaller size by matching the stem widths. Also spacing must be somewhat looser. With programs that have character styles (with keyborad shortcuts) this is very easy to do. However, in many typface families semibold is a bit too heavy for this purpose. Anyway whatever you do don't use 'engineer's small caps' it looks bad enough with serif typefaces but with sans serif it really look hideous.
Jukka
Marc Goldhagen
> Meta (www.fontfont.com) has nice set of small caps.
Yes, I know.
There are several other modern "humanist" sans serif fonts with decent
small caps. But they are all way too far off from Helvetica.
I really need a font that resembles Helvetica close enough so that a lay
person will not notice the difference, but the font needs to have
genuine small caps.
>
> Sans serif small caps is often considered as typografic error by
> purists (like me) but in some cases it looks very good.
Ah. Yes.
The purist approach.
I need only one typeface in my whole life:
Akzidenz Grotesk.
All you ever need to solve any kind of typographic problem.
;)
But somehow, sometimes things are bit more complicated.
>
> With a large family which include normal and semibold versions
> sometimes semibold can be used in smaller size by matching the
> stem widths. Also spacing must be somewhat looser. With programs
> that have character styles (with keyborad shortcuts) this is very
> easy to do. However, in many typface families semibold is a bit
> too heavy for this purpose. Anyway whatever you do don't use
> 'engineer's small caps' it looks bad enough with serif typefaces
> but with sans serif it really look hideous.
Yes, I know about those "tricks" too.
In case of Helvetica you could even get away with the Regular for the
caps and the Medium for the small caps. But I don't like that solution
too much, either.
So:
Is there really no other Helvetica lookalike with REAL small caps than
Chalet?
Yours,
Marc
Armadillo
> person will not notice the difference, but the font needs to have
> genuine small caps.
I don't see the point using another typeface if Helvetica is required. There is enough typographic means to make a good design without using small caps.
In design 'lay person will not notice' attitude really is a deadly sin. Lay person will usully notice if something is wrong although the person doesn't have a clue what it is. I make a lot of book design and I think that my neglect will make the authors work worse. I often compare design with cooking. Food can taste really bad even without knowing how it is made.
Jukka
Marc Goldhagen
> I don't see the point using another typeface if Helvetica is required.
Helvetica is not exactly required. They use ist because they have been
using it all the time and they are not willing to switch to something
entireley different.
> There is enough typographic means to make a good design without using small caps.
As if I didn't know that.
The point is, the client wants small caps and there is no way to talk
them out of it.
>
> In design 'lay person will not notice' attitude really is a deadly sin. Lay person
> will usully notice if something is wrong although the person doesn't have a clue
> what it is.
Exactly.
They don't know much about design, but they notice that the artificial
small caps don't look right. So ...
I make a lot of book design and I think that my neglect will make the
> authors work worse. I often compare design with cooking. Food can taste really bad
> even without knowing how it is made.
>
... there we are:
The client really spends a lot of money for their printed matter with
steel engraving, embossing, finest paper ... so I think, given the rigid
restrictions regarding the design they make, they should at least get
the best typographic quality possible.
Armadillo
> The point is, the client wants small caps and there is no way to talk
> them out of it.
OK, I see now.
> The client really spends a lot of money for their printed matter with
> steel engraving, embossing, finest paper ... so I think, given the rigid
> restrictions regarding the design they make, they should at least get
> the best typographic quality possible.
Linotype and other foundries make custom fonts. Maybe your customer is willing to order Helvetica small caps. ;-)
http://www.linotype.com/2049-16438/customfonts.html
http://www.linotype.com/2049-16450/corporatetype.html
Jukka
Armadillo
> small caps don't look right. So ...
Just fiddled with FontLab and in fact you can make Helvetica Small Caps quite easily.
Interpolate between regular and bold, scale capitals to x-height, slightly extend horizontally, manually make optical corections as necessary, replace lower case characters with new caps, rename the font and save. The right settings reguire some trial and error as well as a bit of calculation. The result is much better than 'engineer's caps' and probably better than using a lookalike.
Character widths will be scaled along with outlines but kerning must be done manually. Kerning between small caps should work if scaled caps values are used but kerning between caps and small caps should be done manually (or removed).
It depends on the license if this is allowed but in general fonts can be edited for own use. Meaning that the new font can't be sold or given to someone who doesn't have Helvetica license already.
Some time I was asked to make modifications to Meta font. According to FontFont it can be done as as long as the user of the new font has licensed copy of the original font and they will get copy of the modified font file.
Jukka
tobias benjamin koehler
> Interpolate between regular and bold, scale capitals to x-height, slightly extend horizontally, manually make optical corections as necessary, replace lower case characters with new caps, rename the font and save. The right settings reguire some trial and error as well as a bit of calculation. The result is much better than 'engineer's caps' and probably better than using a lookalike.
If you use Helvetica Medium, which is between regular and bold, you
wouldn't even have to interpolate ....