Why is Earthlink Run by Idiots??
John Duncan
some unauthorized person logging on and using their mail services to send
SPAM. Thus, they have a VERY legitimate reason for doing this.
That said, some ISPs do allow a workaround, which may or may not work in
your case. SMTP (mail send) does not have a built in authorization
protocol, as does POP3 (mail receive). Thus there is no DIRECT way to
verify your identity, and that you are authorized, except by tracking IPs,
and only allowing IPs that are known to belong to that ISP to send mail.
The workaround that may work, depending on how it is implemented by the ISP,
is to receive mail first, before sending. If they have stateful session
monitoring (simply meaning that it remembers what happened before),
successfully receiving mail should allow you to then send mail from that IP,
until the timeout expires. This is how it was explained by the head mail
tech at my ISP (which does this), anyway.
As far as dial-up access, when you dial-up, you are then assigned a
recognized IP again, and can send and receive normally. There is a way to
manually establish routing, so some connections will use the DSL line, while
others will use the dial-up, but it is probably more trouble than it is
worth. If the receive first method doesn't work, simply receive and compose
before dialing, dial up and send what you need to, and disconnect. Many
mail (and news) clients offer the send later option, so you can compose
everything, and send all at once.
When you do decide to switch mail servers, consider getting a mail
forwarding service. These work like HotMail or something, but also allow
you to automatically forward your mail to another address. Some are free,
others are not. The idea is to get such a service, and use it for your mail
rather than your ISP address. Then you simply forward the mail to whatever
ISP address you happen to have at the time. The poster I originally got
this idea from said he has had several ISPs, but has kept the same address
the whole time, simply using forwarding to direct it to his real address,
and changing the forwarding instructions as necessary.
--
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------------------------------------------------------------
John Duncan
My computer is part of the worlds largest computer!
It cracked RC5-56 and DES (latest time < 24 hours, 01/19/99).
It is now working on RC5-64 and your computer can help too!
http://www.distributed.net
Now functioning as a computer LoJack, too!
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.html
------------------------------------------------------------
Stephen J. Daniel, <sda...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ns7VN2GzvTfaqh...@4ax.com...
> I'm a 3 year Earthlink customer. Bell Atlantic rolls out DSL in my
> home town. Earthlink can't even tell me when they will have DSL. I
> add Bell Atlantic DSL to my system but decide to keep Earthlink via my
> analog modem as well. I don't want to chage ISPs right now and Bell
> Atlantic does not give me local numbers to connect to them when I
> travel like Earthlink does.
>
> I configure my mail client (Netscape 4.6) to still use earthlink for
> both inbound and outbound mail. Everything works fine for 3 days. On
> the 4th day I can receive but can't send e-mail. Error message say
> "An Error occurred while sending mail. blah-blah-blah Relaying
> denied."
>
> Ok. Call Earthlink. Bottom line. This is a policy decision. Some
> dude named Garth who is a Supervisor of Customer Service tells me that
> they won't even explain it to me and I can't talk to anyone else.
> Implies that they don't care if I have a problem here and chose to
> close my account.
>
> I have an annoying work around. If I launch my old earthlink dial-up
> then as long as I'm connected via the analog modem I can send e-mail
> fine via earthlink. But this is an extra step, annoying and cuts me
> off from my DSL connection during this time.
>
> Bottom line. As soon as Bell Atlantic give me a way to access them via
> a local call anywhere in the country, I will tell Earthlink to kiss my
> DSL goodbye. And I won't be the only one.
>
>
>
Spamster
John Duncan wrote:
> That is pretty much standard practice. What the ISP is worried about is
> some unauthorized person logging on and using their mail services to send
> SPAM. Thus, they have a VERY legitimate reason for doing this.
>
This is not true, or at least not true in the case of my ISP. What they do is
block SMTP port 25 so that you cannot use an SMTP server to send mail except for
theirs. There is also some authentication that allows only subscribers to use
their SMTP server. So, while I could send loads of spam from my ISPs SMTP
server, I assume they'd nuke my account once they found out about it. What it
boils down to is that the ISP prevents you from using some other SMTP server to
send spam while connected to their system.
Eric
SMTP server to
send spam while connected to their system."
This is untrue. The mail system that relays the mail is responsible.
Stephen, why don't you just use Bell Atlantic's smtp server for your
outgoing mail? Incoming would be Earthlink and outgoing would be
Bell. In Netscape (or whatever) just put the earthlink as outgoing smtp and
people
will reply to the Earthlink 1. (it's probably smtp.bellatlantic.net or
something)
Here is the url:
http://home.bellatlantic.net/Root/Help/EML_netscape4_setpref.html
Good luck.
Spamster
could probably Telnet into another SMTP server, but it's too much bother.
But, you don't have to believe me.
Charles Sprickman
: I configure my mail client (Netscape 4.6) to still use earthlink for
: both inbound and outbound mail. Everything works fine for 3 days. On
: the 4th day I can receive but can't send e-mail. Error message say
: "An Error occurred while sending mail. blah-blah-blah Relaying
: denied."
This is standard procedure. If they didn't do this, anyone could simply
relay spam through them. Most ISP do this. Our rule is "use the smtp
server of the provider you buy your connection from to send outgoing
mail". It's a good FAQ entry. There are some additional tricks we have
to implement "roaming relay" for mobile users, but I doubt it would scale
well for someone as large as EL.
It can be a pain, but as long as support can explain it, it's a good
policy, and it cuts down on spam.
Charles
--
=-----------------= =
| Charles Sprickman Internet Channel |
| INCH System Administration Team (212)243-5200 |
| sp...@inch.com acc...@inch.com |
= =----------------=
mem...@yahoo.com
<sda...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>I'm a 3 year Earthlink customer. Bell Atlantic rolls out DSL in my
>home town. Earthlink can't even tell me when they will have DSL. I
>add Bell Atlantic DSL to my system but decide to keep Earthlink via my
>analog modem as well. I don't want to chage ISPs right now and Bell
>Atlantic does not give me local numbers to connect to them when I
>travel like Earthlink does.
>
>I configure my mail client (Netscape 4.6) to still use earthlink for
>both inbound and outbound mail. Everything works fine for 3 days. On
>the 4th day I can receive but can't send e-mail. Error message say
>"An Error occurred while sending mail. blah-blah-blah Relaying
>denied."
Exactly. Most responsible ISPs do not allow "outsiders"
to send mail via smtp. Why don't you just set up your
netscape to send via BA and receive via EL? I know that
the preferences has different slots for POP-rec and
SMTP-send. Just leave your "reply-to" set to your EL
address and all will be well.
Ken
Netcom at work using Outlook express. I cannot use Netcom's smtp server,
because I am not connected to Netcom. I use my Company's smtp server to send
mail out. Netcom could not have any control in this situation, and niether
could Earthlink, because you are not connected to them. Im sure Earthlink
supports pop3 and you would not have to be connected to them at all. Once
your mail has poped down your connection with them is terminated.
My $0.2 worth.
Ken.
Spamster wrote in message <37D5E903...@ftc.gov>...
Tim Smith
>I configure my mail client (Netscape 4.6) to still use earthlink for
>both inbound and outbound mail. Everything works fine for 3 days. On
>the 4th day I can receive but can't send e-mail. Error message say
>"An Error occurred while sending mail. blah-blah-blah Relaying
>denied."
Use Bell Atlantic's SMTP server for your outgoing mail when you are connected
via your DSL. Use Earthlink's SMTP server when you are connected via your
modem to Earthlink.
--Tim Smith
Miguel Cruz
>> That is pretty much standard practice. What the ISP is worried about is
>> some unauthorized person logging on and using their mail services to send
>> SPAM. Thus, they have a VERY legitimate reason for doing this.
>
> This is not true, or at least not true in the case of my ISP. What they do
> is block SMTP port 25 so that you cannot use an SMTP server to send mail
> except for theirs.
That solves a different problem. It does not prevent their SMTP servers from
being abused by spammers - it just prevents their customers from abusing
other ISP's SMTP servers.
Unless every ISP does it - and they don't, far from it - it's only solving
half of the problem.
miguel
--
Hit The Road! Photos and tales from around the world: http://travel.u.nu
Jason O'Rourke
>This is standard procedure. If they didn't do this, anyone could simply
>relay spam through them. Most ISP do this. Our rule is "use the smtp
>server of the provider you buy your connection from to send outgoing
>mail". It's a good FAQ entry. There are some additional tricks we have
>to implement "roaming relay" for mobile users, but I doubt it would scale
>well for someone as large as EL.
Oh, come on. Even Best/Verio here offered the ability to relay from fixed
IPs due to the number of customers using pacbell dsl but best's shell
account for mail and such (Verio's dsl is quite expensive).
If you have dynamic IPs on your dsl, you're SOL, but they ought to be
willing to accommodate their customers who do have a fixed address.
--
Jason O'Rourke j...@best.com www.jor.com
'96 BMW r850R
last dive: September 4th, Melissa's Reef, Roatan. 85F! 70mins at 57ft max.
Kroagnon
Stephen J. Daniel, <sda...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ns7VN2GzvTfaqh...@4ax.com...
> I'm a 3 year Earthlink customer. Bell Atlantic rolls out DSL in my
> home town. Earthlink can't even tell me when they will have DSL. I
> add Bell Atlantic DSL to my system but decide to keep Earthlink via my
> analog modem as well. I don't want to chage ISPs right now and Bell
> Atlantic does not give me local numbers to connect to them when I
> travel like Earthlink does.
>
> both inbound and outbound mail. Everything works fine for 3 days. On
> the 4th day I can receive but can't send e-mail. Error message say
> "An Error occurred while sending mail. blah-blah-blah Relaying
> denied."
>
> dude named Garth who is a Supervisor of Customer Service tells me that
> they won't even explain it to me and I can't talk to anyone else.
> Implies that they don't care if I have a problem here and chose to
> close my account.
>
> I have an annoying work around. If I launch my old earthlink dial-up
> then as long as I'm connected via the analog modem I can send e-mail
> fine via earthlink. But this is an extra step, annoying and cuts me
> off from my DSL connection during this time.
It is unreasonable for you to ask that Earthlink allow you to do that
because SMTP usually doesn't require authorization, so that would be opening
up the door for ANYbody, on ANY ISP to abuse their outgoing mail servers.
However, there's a much simpler way around this problem... just change
Earthlink's outgoing mail server (SMTP) to Bell Atlantic's while keeping all
the other Earthlink settings (POP3, reply-to E-mail address, etc) the same.
Chewbacca Wookie
The concept is that they are trying to make sure that only "validated" Earthlink customers use their SMTP server (outgoing mail). Due to spammers, people are able to mask their identities and send mail through other provider's servers, so that their own service does not have a record - and of course, there's little an ISP can do about it, other than prevent relaying.
I find this a nuisance as well. I have a DSL connection and even though I use my own mail servers, my small ISP also prevents relaying. When DSL goes down and I must dial onto Earthlink, I can't send mail without having to switch settings... which is annoying. But hey, I wrote a program off the web to solve my temporary mail-sending problems :)
So another thing you can try is use a hotmail account, mail.com, or some similar service. There are many web-based e-mail services out there if you truly need to use your mail servers on more than one connection...
However about them not explaining it to you, THAT IS IDIOCY AND IRRESPONSIBLE TECH SUPPORT... I think they should have the knowledge (if not they have serious problems) and the obligation to explain the problem to you and possible workarounds because after all, you are a paying customer...
In my experience, Earthlink Tech Support hasn't been helpful at all on the occasions I've really needed to get ahold of them. They always think it's your problem... Yeah... They tell me to reinstall all my network protocols and switch around 15 different network settings, before it was then determined... "Oh... we might have a problem..."
Sorry to hear that their nonsense tech support practices have affected more people than me....
"Stephen J. Daniel," wrote:
I'm a 3 year Earthlink customer. Bell Atlantic rolls out DSL in my
home town. Earthlink can't even tell me when they will have DSL. I
add Bell Atlantic DSL to my system but decide to keep Earthlink via my
analog modem as well. I don't want to chage ISPs right now and Bell
Atlantic does not give me local numbers to connect to them when I
travel like Earthlink does.
I configure my mail client (Netscape 4.6) to still use earthlink for
both inbound and outbound mail. Everything works fine for 3 days. On
the 4th day I can receive but can't send e-mail. Error message say
"An Error occurred while sending mail. blah-blah-blah Relaying
denied."
Ok. Call Earthlink. Bottom line. This is a policy decision. Some
dude named Garth who is a Supervisor of Customer Service tells me that
they won't even explain it to me and I can't talk to anyone else.
Implies that they don't care if I have a problem here and chose to
close my account.
I have an annoying work around. If I launch my old earthlink dial-up
then as long as I'm connected via the analog modem I can send e-mail
fine via earthlink. But this is an extra step, annoying and cuts me
off from my DSL connection during this time.
Bottom line. As soon as Bell Atlantic give me a way to access them via
fido...@businessweekmail.com
>I'm a 3 year Earthlink customer. Bell Atlantic rolls out DSL in my
>home town. Earthlink can't even tell me when they will have DSL. I
>add Bell Atlantic DSL to my system but decide to keep Earthlink via my
>analog modem as well. I don't want to chage ISPs right now and Bell
>Atlantic does not give me local numbers to connect to them when I
>travel like Earthlink does.
>
>I configure my mail client (Netscape 4.6) to still use earthlink for
>both inbound and outbound mail. Everything works fine for 3 days. On
>the 4th day I can receive but can't send e-mail. Error message say
>"An Error occurred while sending mail. blah-blah-blah Relaying
>denied."
As others have pointed out, this is fairly standard practice. In
fact, any ISP which has a halfway decent spam policy will enforce things
exactly the same way.
The workaround, as "Eric" <ad...@t10.net> suggested in another post,
is to change the outbound mail server in Netscape to be BellAtlantic's SMTP
server.
Basically, what it boils down to, is that you can check e-mail from
any connection to the Internet that you wish. But when you send e-mail, you
must connect to the mail server of the ISP that you use to connect to the
Internet.
You say you spoke with customer service, did you try technical
support? The technical support team at EarthLink should have known to suggest
the above solution. The customer service reps at EarthLink are there to help
with billing problems, not technical issues.
Charles Sprickman
: Charles Sprickman <sp...@shell.inch.com> wrote:
:>This is standard procedure. If they didn't do this, anyone could simply
:>relay spam through them. Most ISP do this. Our rule is "use the smtp
:>server of the provider you buy your connection from to send outgoing
:>mail". It's a good FAQ entry. There are some additional tricks we have
:>to implement "roaming relay" for mobile users, but I doubt it would scale
:>well for someone as large as EL.
: Oh, come on. Even Best/Verio here offered the ability to relay from fixed
: IPs due to the number of customers using pacbell dsl but best's shell
: account for mail and such (Verio's dsl is quite expensive).
We might do that, but I don't see Earthlink doing it. They are too large.
Small profit margin=narrow range of services.
Charles
: If you have dynamic IPs on your dsl, you're SOL, but they ought to be
: willing to accommodate their customers who do have a fixed address.
: --
: Jason O'Rourke j...@best.com www.jor.com
: '96 BMW r850R
: last dive: September 4th, Melissa's Reef, Roatan. 85F! 70mins at 57ft max.
--
Jim Fick
news:ns7VN2GzvTfaqh...@4ax.com...
> I'm a 3 year Earthlink customer. Bell Atlantic rolls out DSL in my
> home town. Earthlink can't even tell me when they will have DSL. I
> add Bell Atlantic DSL to my system but decide to keep Earthlink via my
> analog modem as well. I don't want to chage ISPs right now and Bell
> Atlantic does not give me local numbers to connect to them when I
> travel like Earthlink does.
>
> I configure my mail client (Netscape 4.6) to still use earthlink for
> both inbound and outbound mail. Everything works fine for 3 days. On
> the 4th day I can receive but can't send e-mail. Error message say
> "An Error occurred while sending mail. blah-blah-blah Relaying
> denied."
>
> dude named Garth who is a Supervisor of Customer Service tells me that
> they won't even explain it to me and I can't talk to anyone else.
> Implies that they don't care if I have a problem here and chose to
> close my account.
Sorry, you're in left field on this issue. Try having a spammer relay
250,000 spams thru your system over the weekend and see how you approach
allowing relaying.
Simple solution: switch your SMTP server to the Bell Atlantic server.
Problem solved.
Jim
Jim Fick
news:%wtB3.30866$Jl.4...@news6.giganews.com...
> In article <37D5DDB9...@ftc.gov>, Spamster <u...@ftc.gov> wrote:
> >> That is pretty much standard practice. What the ISP is worried about
is
> >> some unauthorized person logging on and using their mail services to
send
> >> SPAM. Thus, they have a VERY legitimate reason for doing this.
> >
> > This is not true, or at least not true in the case of my ISP. What they
do
> > is block SMTP port 25 so that you cannot use an SMTP server to send mail
> > except for theirs.
>
> That solves a different problem. It does not prevent their SMTP servers
from
> being abused by spammers - it just prevents their customers from abusing
> other ISP's SMTP servers.
>
> Unless every ISP does it - and they don't, far from it - it's only solving
> half of the problem.
At least it cuts down on the problem a little. Also, you can join some
anti-spam efforts whereby you register your dialup IP ranges, and all other
ISPs who participate refuse to accept mail from subscriber IPs directly (as
opposed from the ISPs legitimate mail server). Cause spammers frequently
run their own smtp servers off a dialup connection. This cuts down on spam
a lot also.
Jim
Richard A. Hecker
"Stephen J. Daniel," wrote:
> I'm a 3 year Earthlink customer. Bell Atlantic rolls out DSL in my
>
...<snip>...
>
> Bottom line. As soon as Bell Atlantic give me a way to access them via
> a local call anywhere in the country, I will tell Earthlink to kiss my
> DSL goodbye. And I won't be the only one.
In this day-and-age where ISPs base their decisions on "churn rate" it is
a disgrace that Earthlink does not see the value of multi-year customers.
I forget how many I had, but as your last sentence points out this will
cost
them. I like "anywhere" access but at least the small ISPs still treat me
like a person as opposed to an account ;-)
Richard
Richard A. Hecker
>
> When you do decide to switch mail servers, consider getting a mail
> forwarding service. These work like HotMail or something, but also allow
You also might want to consider if it would bother you to share your email
with a total stranger ;-).
Richard
Richard A. Hecker
BD wrote:
>
...<snip>...
> PS. It's just common-courtesy to include the persons' name when quoting
> 'em....
>
> Richard A. Hecker <richard...@dfrc.nasa.gov> wrote in message
> news:37D94D44...@dfrc.nasa.gov...
> >
> > You also might want to consider if it would bother you to share your email
> > with a total stranger ;-).
For those in the audience who are humor-impaired, I hope this message will
seem courteous ;-)