AT&T Universal Card is Not Two Cards in One
Matthew McGehrin
Another thought came to mind about the 'AT&T Universal Card': Just
think, if you use the 'card' to charge purchases, your 'phone number
with four-digit code', along with the 'ATT Credit card number' goes on
the same slip (since its one huge carbon) ... Reach Out and Touch
someone's life, since you have their credit card number, (their bank
since ATT uses only one bank), their phone number with a 'universal'
calling card ... not bad huh??
matt
Arpa / DDN : pro-graphics!matt_m...@nosc.mil
UUCP : crash!pro-graphics!matt_mcgehrin
Internet : matt_m...@pro-graphics.ctc.com
From : (908) 469-0049, Free Access, 24 hours a day
300/1200/2400 baud, 'Pro-Graphics'
Dave Levenson
In article <12...@accuvax.nwu.edu>, matt_m...@pro-graphics.cts.com
(Matthew McGehrin) writes:
> Another thought came to mind about the 'AT&T Universal Card': Just
> think, if you use the 'card' to charge purchases, your 'phone number
> with four-digit code', along with the 'ATT Credit card number' goes on
> the same slip (since its one huge carbon) ... Reach Out and Touch
> someone's life, since you have their credit card number, (their bank
> since ATT uses only one bank), their phone number with a 'universal'
> calling card ... not bad huh??
The PIN is not embossed, or even printed, on the AT&T universal card.
It is mailed in a separate envelope, a week or so after the card is
mailed, to the account holder.
Apparently, Matthew, somebody thought of that!
Dave Levenson Internet: da...@westmark.com
Westmark, Inc. UUCP: {uunet | rutgers | att}!westmark!dave
Warren, NJ, USA AT&T Mail: !westmark!dave
Voice: 908 647 0900 Fax: 908 647 6857
ethan miller
Two comments about the AT&T Universal Card:
First, there isn't enough room for two stripes on the back of the
card. There's got to be enough space to sign the card as well. Even
if there were room, what happens when someone comes up to a credit
card/phone card telephone in an airport and swipes the card the wrong
way? They'll be charged the credit card rates, not the AT&T phonecard
rates. It's easier just to type in the calling card number.
To the person afraid of calling card numbers on carbons, don't worry.
The front of the card has only the equivalent of the phone number
portion of the calling card number -- the four digit security code
isn't there. Incidentally, the number I have is an illegal phone
number, though the area code is valid. The exchange number starts
with a 0, however, so the number is (under the current system) a
disallowed phone number. Is there any system AT&T is using to assign
these "phony" calling card phone numbers?
ethan miller--cs grad student e...@sprite.berkeley.edu
#include <std/disclaimer.h> {...}!ucbvax!sprite!elm
Steve Lemke
matt_m...@pro-graphics.cts.com (Matthew McGehrin) writes:
>Another thought came to mind about the 'AT&T Universal Card': Just
>think, if you use the 'card' to charge purchases, your 'phone number
>with four-digit code', along with the 'ATT Credit card number' goes on
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>the same slip (since its one huge carbon) ... Reach Out and Touch
>someone's life, since you have their credit card number, (their bank
>since ATT uses only one bank), their phone number with a 'universal'
>calling card ... not bad huh??
Perhaps someone has already corrected you on this, but in case not:
My AT&T MasterCard contains a MasterCard number, and an AT&T Long
Distance Calling Card number, but the four digit PIN is _NOT_ there.
In addition, as has been previously discussed (I think), the AT&T LD #
is NOT my home phone number. It is a completely different ten-digit
number.
However, I _do_ agree with another poster who mentioned that if you
stick this card into a card reader, it looks like an ordinary
MasterCard. I found this out when I stuck it into a GTE Airphone
which was supposed to recognize AT&T Calling Cards. The bill for the
phone call came through on my AT&T Monthly statement, but it appeared
under the MasterCard section, rather than the long distance calling
section, meaning I did NOT get my 10% discount on the call. It was
instead treated like any other credit purchase. (On the other hand,
it therefore fell into the category of things that is NOT required to
be paid off every month, but instead could be rolled over. However,
the entire bill was so small that I paid the whole thing at once
anyway.)
Steve Lemke, Engineering Quality Assurance, Radius Inc., San Jose
Reply to: le...@radius.com (Note: NEW domain-style address!!)
Ron Newman
From article <12...@accuvax.nwu.edu>, by matt_mcgehrin@pro-graphics
.cts.com (Matthew McGehrin):
[Moderator's Note: Matt's quote eliminated to save space. Read it in
prior messages if necessary. PAT]
An AT&T Universal card does NOT have a real phone number embossed on
it. Instead, it has a 10-digit made-up 'Calling Card number' that is
not a phone number and does NOT have the four-digit code at the end of
it. (My card has 508-096-xxxx which is unlikely to ever become a real
phone number.) The user of the AT&T Universal card must remember the
four-digit code him/herself.
Ron Newman
Dave Levenson
In article <12...@accuvax.nwu.edu>, plains!com50.c2s.mn.org!
ch...@uunet.uu.net (Chris Johnson) writes:
> In article <12...@accuvax.nwu.edu> mo...@sunne.east.sun.com (Monty
> Solomon - Temp Consultant) writes:
> >The fact: The AT&T Universal Card is simply a bankcard (VISA or
> >Mastercard) with an AT&T credit card number embossed onto it. The
> Well, that seems like an awfully easy thing to rectify with no new
> technology whatsoever: just put two magnetic stripes on the back of
> the card, one with the bankcard data and one with the phonecard data.
> Then in all those glossy brochures they send to holders of the
> Universal Card (like me), they need only instruct the users to insert
> the card one way to use the VISA/MC capabilities, and the other way to
> use the AT&T phone card capabilities.
The AT&T card-caller public phones around here are not like those
where you can insert the card two different ways. They have a slot
into which you insert the card, more like an ATM, except that it
doesn't have the capability that ATM's have of keeping the card once
you've inserted it.
The phones with the less expensive readers where the user sweeps the
card through a stationary reader on the phone might be able to use the
design proposed by Chris, but how many 'card-carrying members' of the
public would understand such instructions?
Dave Levenson Internet: da...@westmark.com
Westmark, Inc. UUCP: {uunet | rutgers | att}!westmark!dave
Warren, NJ, USA AT&T Mail: !westmark!dave
[The Man in the Mooney] Voice: 908 647 0900 Fax: 908 647 6857
ekr...@ulysses.att.com
>Another thought came to mind about the 'AT&T Universal Card': Just
>think, if you use the 'card' to charge purchases, your 'phone number
>with four-digit code', along with the 'ATT Credit card number' goes on
What do you mean by this?. The number on the Universal Card is not
your phone number and is missing the four-digit PIN. They would still
have to guess your PIN. How different is this from the current system
that uses your home phone number (which I can get from the phone book
or directory service)?
Eduardo Krell AT&T Bell Laboratories, Murray Hill, NJ
UUCP: {att,decvax,ucbvax}!ulysses!ekrell Internet: ekr...@ulysses.att.com
Jim Budler
In article <12...@accuvax.nwu.edu> matt_m...@pro-graphics.cts.com
(Matthew McGehrin) writes:
>Another thought came to mind about the 'AT&T Universal Card': Just
>think, if you use the 'card' to charge purchases, your 'phone number
>with four-digit code', along with the 'ATT Credit card number' goes on
>the same slip (since its one huge carbon)
Nope.
The calling card number bears no relation to my phone number, and the
PIN portion is not embossed on the card. It arrives by seperate post
after the card arrives. While a binary search of the 10,000
possibilities is not an impossibility, I would hope the security
system would invalidate any calling card number if sufficient probes
against it occured.
With any credit card the issuing bank information is contained within
the credit card number. So what? It isn't the bank where I have any of
my other accounts. This statement is true both of the AT&T Universal
card I hold, and of the Visa card I acquired from the same bank at
which I *do* have my checking and savings account. This is because
although my bank accepted my Visa application, the card itself was
issued by a regional clearing house.
Jim Budler ji...@silvlis.com +1.408.991.6115
Silvar-Lisco, Inc. 703 E. Evelyn Ave. Sunnyvale, Ca. 94086
J...@mis.arizona.edu
In article <12...@accuvax.nwu.edu>, lotus!rne...@uunet.uu.net (Ron
Newman) writes...
>An AT&T Universal card does NOT have a real phone number embossed on
>it.
Not only that, it CANNOT have a real phone number on it. When I
applied for the card, I asked if I could have my home phone number on
it (since my interest in memorizing yet another ten digit number waned
years ago), and was told "yes." After getting the card, I called in
(as instructed) to change my "calling card code," and found that I
could not. The excuse was lame: how will we be able to tell your
calls apart (duh, how do you tell them apart NOW, jerkos?), but I was
firmly assured in useless doublespeak that what I wanted was not
possible. And while I kept the card, my few days of joy at the wonder
of not having to memorize another calling card number ended RATHER
abruptly.
Also: someone asked about getting card encoders/decoders. They're
easy to get; one source for us (here at Arizona) is the company we buy
our mag-stripe door openers from, Elko in Chicago somewhere. They're
expensive, about $1000, but if you want one...
Joel M Snyder, The Mosaic Group, 627 E Speedway, 85705 Phone: 602.626.8680
(University of Arizona, Dep't of MIS, Eller Graduate School of Management)
BITNET: jms@arizmis Internet: j...@mis.arizona.edu SPAN: 47541::uamis::jms
Peter da Silva
> if you use the 'card' to charge purchases, your 'phone number
> with four-digit code', along with the 'ATT Credit card number' goes on
> the same slip...
I don't know about you, but my AT&T card doesn't have a phone number
on it. And they couldn't put two mag stripes (to address another
message) because there's imprinting where the second stripe would have
to go on all credit cards (bad design decision, I'd say).
Peter da Silva
+1 713 274 5180
pe...@ferranti.com
dpl...@coherent.com
In article <12...@accuvax.nwu.edu> Matt McGehrin writes:
> Another thought came to mind about the 'AT&T Universal Card': Just
> think, if you use the 'card' to charge purchases, your 'phone number
> with four-digit code', along with the 'ATT Credit card number' goes on
> the same slip (since its one huge carbon) ... Reach Out and Touch
> someone's life, since you have their credit card number, (their bank
> since ATT uses only one bank), their phone number with a 'universal'
> calling card ... not bad huh??
Nope. They aren't stupid enough to do it that way.
The four-digit PIN is not included on the card. It'd better not be...
the same PIN is used both for the phonecard authorization, and as the
auto-teller-machine PIN which enables you to get a cash advance
against your card. There's no way AT&T would put it on the card ...
if they did, they'd almost certainly end up being held liable for any
cash withdrawls made via a card that was reported stolen.
They send you the PIN under separate cover, and warn you not to write
it down on the card or keep it in your wallet.
Nor is your [home or business] phone number included on the card. The
phonecard number is a made-up number which isn't in the correct format
for a real phone number (mine starts out 507 00x, and there are no 00x
phone exchanges to the best of my knowledge). I understand that this
is done deliberately, to ensure that AT&T is the only carrier which
will honor the number (this is a feature, not a bug).
In these respects, the Universal Card is slightly more secure than,
say, a Pacific Bell or MCI calling card, both of which have the real
phone number _and_ the PIN embossed on the card. For the benefit of
those with short memories, I suppose.
Dave Platt VOICE: (415) 493-8805
UUCP: ...!{ames,apple,uunet}!coherent!dplatt DOMAIN: dpl...@coherent.com
INTERNET: coherent!dpl...@ames.arpa, ...@uunet.uu.net
USNAIL: Coherent Thought Inc. 3350 West Bayshore #205 Palo Alto CA 94303
C. Harald Koch
In article <12...@accuvax.nwu.edu> mo...@sunne.east.sun.com (Monty
Solomon - Temp Consultant) writes:
> Well, that seems like an awfully easy thing to rectify with no new
> technology whatsoever: just put two magnetic stripes on the back of
> the card, one with the bankcard data and one with the phonecard data.
There is an ANSI standard describing the magnetic stripe on the back
of the card. I dont have it in front of me, but from what I remember:
The stripe contains four tracks. The first three are the same, while
the fourth is a larger, 'high-density' track. The third track is used
by financial institutions for encoding Visa and Mastercard, bank
cards, etc, and there is an ANSI standard describing this track
separately.
It seems to me, therefore, that the easiest solution (and the one that
should have been used in the first place) is to put the Calling Card
information on one of the other tracks. Then there is no ambiguity;
the card is both optically and magnetically a credit card and a phone
card.
But of course, they never asked me... :-)
C. Harald Koch VE3TLA Alias Research, Inc., Toronto ON Canada
chk%al...@csri.utoronto.ca c...@gpu.utcs.toronto.edu c...@chk.mef.org
Robert E Stampfli
> (On the other hand, it therefore fell into the category of things
> that is NOT required to be paid off every month, but instead could
> be rolled over. However, the entire bill was so small that I paid
> the whole thing at once anyway.)
Does anyone know a reason why I can't use one of those "checks" I got
with the card to pay off the phone bill or minimum balance?
Rob Stampfli / att.com!stampfli (uucp@work) / kd8wk@w8cqk (packet radio)
614-864-9377 / osu-cis.cis.ohio-state.edu!kd8wk!res (uucp@home)
[Moderator's Note: Using 'one of those checks you got with the card'
would of course merely roll the balance, not pay it off ... and I
think if you read the fine print you will see they do not accept those
"checks" to pay their own bill. Try sending them one in the remittance
envelope and see what happens. You will probably get a snotty letter
back and have your account sent to Collections.
Steve Schallehn
c...@alias.uucp (C. Harald Koch) writes:
>There is an ANSI standard describing the magnetic stripe on the back
>of the card. I dont have it in front of me, but from what I remember:
Where would I be able easily find such ANSI standards? I am more
curious than anything.
Steve Schallehn
Kansas State University
U543...@ucsvc.ucs.unimelb.edu.au
In article <12...@accuvax.nwu.edu>, radius!le...@apple.com (Steve
Lemke) writes:
> My AT&T MasterCard contains a MasterCard number, and an AT&T Long
> Distance Calling Card number, but the four digit PIN is _NOT_ there.
> In addition, as has been previously discussed (I think), the AT&T LD #
> is NOT my home phone number. It is a completely different ten-digit
> number.
To avoid obtaining *more* long numbers, would it not be possible to
register one's Mastercard 16 digit number with AT&T or whoever, and
let them send you a special AT&T PIN for using that card with AT&T.
Only one number on the card; only one stripe necessary. If AT&T 1were
co-ordinated with the bank, you could even have just one PIN.
Danny
[Moderator's Note: This of course is the technique used by MCI, in
effect making any existing VISA/MC into an extension of the MCI
calling card. AT&T was different though -- they definitly wanted to
expand out of the phone business and into the credit card business,
which is why they chose to issue their own plastic. PAT]
Andy Rabagliati
In article <12...@accuvax.nwu.edu> U543...@ucsvc.ucs.unimelb.edu.au
writes:
>would it not be possible to
>register one's Mastercard 16 digit number with AT&T or whoever, and
>let them send you a special AT&T PIN for using that card with AT&T.
When I asked for my PIN, I asked for 1XXX, and it was refused. I
asked why - I was told that if it starts with a 1 it looks like the
start of 1-NPA-NXX-XXXX.
So I couldn't make it the same as my bank PIN.
Cheers, Andy. EMAIL: rabag...@isnet.inmos.COM