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Satellite or cable service for local TV broadcasts?
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Ant
Feb 17, 2012, 3:19:45 PM2/17/12
to
Hello.
I don't know if this is the proper newsgroups to ask this. In a few
months, my family and I (three people) will be relocating/moving to
another house. We won't be able to get free over the air (OTA) due to a
small mountain/giant hill blocking transmitters for Los Angeles/L.A.
broadcasts. It is impossible to get a very high antenna (would require a
high rise building height with twenty floors -- 193 or more feet for the
local English stations in green color according to TVFool.com!). So that
means we will have to order cable or satellite TV for TV feeds. Since we
don't watch many movies and stuff (we just rent or stream), we will
still keep it simple and basic. Hopefully, cheap/low cost. Basically, we
want all local broadcast channels including foreign ones (asian like
Chinese).
We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner
Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99 per
month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is available
(no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).
TWC sales said for monthly payments as of Christmas break of 2011:
$24.50 (basic/local broadcast TV)
$52.99 (regular Internet package)
$10 DVR rental (heard cable DVRs suck? Or should we get our own
[however, I can't find one that doesn't require subscriptions like
DTVPal and ChannelMaster DVRs]
$49.99 for installation charge
Total = $84.79 per month for service (without $49.99 for installation
charge).
Bundled packages and a single bill would be nice too if it is cheap/not
much different, but if satellite TV service is a lot cheaper than we
will get it. However, it will suck if the whole cable goes out/down,
then no Internet and TV. :(
I read and heard that satellite TV services for TV stuff can be cheaper
and better quality. We will also need to get a new DVR (we still have
VCRs, but why?) to replace DTVPal DVR (only for OTA). There are several
satellite TV services like EchoStar, DishTV, DirecTV, etc. Which ones to
get? We have never owned satellite TV services before so this will be
new to us. Also, we still use old CRT TVs but we will get HDTV ones
later on when they break/die.
Thank you in advance. :)
--
"The tiny ant dares to enter the lion's ear." --Armenian
/\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
/ /\ /\ \ Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
| |o o| |
\ _ / If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
( ) If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.
I don't know if this is the proper newsgroups to ask this. In a few
months, my family and I (three people) will be relocating/moving to
another house. We won't be able to get free over the air (OTA) due to a
small mountain/giant hill blocking transmitters for Los Angeles/L.A.
broadcasts. It is impossible to get a very high antenna (would require a
high rise building height with twenty floors -- 193 or more feet for the
local English stations in green color according to TVFool.com!). So that
means we will have to order cable or satellite TV for TV feeds. Since we
don't watch many movies and stuff (we just rent or stream), we will
still keep it simple and basic. Hopefully, cheap/low cost. Basically, we
want all local broadcast channels including foreign ones (asian like
Chinese).
We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner
Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99 per
month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is available
(no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).
TWC sales said for monthly payments as of Christmas break of 2011:
$24.50 (basic/local broadcast TV)
$52.99 (regular Internet package)
$10 DVR rental (heard cable DVRs suck? Or should we get our own
[however, I can't find one that doesn't require subscriptions like
DTVPal and ChannelMaster DVRs]
$49.99 for installation charge
Total = $84.79 per month for service (without $49.99 for installation
charge).
Bundled packages and a single bill would be nice too if it is cheap/not
much different, but if satellite TV service is a lot cheaper than we
will get it. However, it will suck if the whole cable goes out/down,
then no Internet and TV. :(
I read and heard that satellite TV services for TV stuff can be cheaper
and better quality. We will also need to get a new DVR (we still have
VCRs, but why?) to replace DTVPal DVR (only for OTA). There are several
satellite TV services like EchoStar, DishTV, DirecTV, etc. Which ones to
get? We have never owned satellite TV services before so this will be
new to us. Also, we still use old CRT TVs but we will get HDTV ones
later on when they break/die.
Thank you in advance. :)
--
"The tiny ant dares to enter the lion's ear." --Armenian
/\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
/ /\ /\ \ Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
| |o o| |
\ _ / If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
( ) If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.
Patty Winter
Feb 17, 2012, 3:29:04 PM2/17/12
to
Cable companies can (and usually do) carry more local channels than
satellite systems do. They're both required to carry certain locals,
but AFAIK, Dish and DirecTV carry few (if any) of the subchannels,
and that's where many of the foreign-language broadcasts are. So
check the channel lineups for all the companies you're considering
before you make a choice, to make sure that you select one that
has the channels you want.
Patty
satellite systems do. They're both required to carry certain locals,
but AFAIK, Dish and DirecTV carry few (if any) of the subchannels,
and that's where many of the foreign-language broadcasts are. So
check the channel lineups for all the companies you're considering
before you make a choice, to make sure that you select one that
has the channels you want.
Patty
Ant
Feb 17, 2012, 3:30:00 PM2/17/12
to
On 2/17/2012 12:29 PM PT, Patty Winter typed:
Thanks. :)
--
"Left right left right we're army ants. We swarm we fight. We have no
home. We roam. We race. You're lucky if we miss your place." --Douglas
Florian (The Army Ants Poem)
--
"Left right left right we're army ants. We swarm we fight. We have no
home. We roam. We race. You're lucky if we miss your place." --Douglas
Florian (The Army Ants Poem)
Message has been deleted
Ant
Feb 17, 2012, 6:50:33 PM2/17/12
to
On 2/17/2012 1:12 PM PT, Bill M. typed:
>> TWC sales said for monthly payments as of Christmas break of 2011:
>> $24.50 (basic/local broadcast TV)
>> $52.99 (regular Internet package)
>> $10 DVR rental (heard cable DVRs suck? Or should we get our own
>> [however, I can't find one that doesn't require subscriptions like
>> DTVPal and ChannelMaster DVRs]
>> $49.99 for installation charge
>
> Instead of using their DVR, which might suck and will definitely have
> a monthly charge, I love my Silicondust HDHomerun network tuners.
> Equip them with CableCards and you can watch or record the encrypted
> channels, in addition to unencrypted locals. You'll need storage for
> the recordings and you'll need a front end like SageTV, BeyondTV,
> MythTV, Windows 7 Media Center, etc. Once set up, it works flawlessly,
> at least for me. Wife is technology-challenged and took to this setup
> like a duck to water. HDHR's (with CableCard support) are available
> with 3 or 6 tuners. Lose the CableCard support (and the ability to
> watch or record encrypted channels) and they have a unit available
> with just two tuners.
>
> <http://www.silicondust.com/products/hdhomerun/prime/>
>
> <http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&N=-1&isNodeId=1&Description=silicondust&x=0&y=0>
>
> Note that these tuners won't work with satellite TV, so if you choose
> Dish or Direct instead of TWC these tuners won't be an option.
That's great, but I don't want to use a computer. I just want a
dedicated hardware as the DVR.
--
"Even the sharpest ear cannot hear an ant singing." --Sudanese
>> TWC sales said for monthly payments as of Christmas break of 2011:
>> $24.50 (basic/local broadcast TV)
>> $52.99 (regular Internet package)
>> $10 DVR rental (heard cable DVRs suck? Or should we get our own
>> [however, I can't find one that doesn't require subscriptions like
>> DTVPal and ChannelMaster DVRs]
>> $49.99 for installation charge
>
> a monthly charge, I love my Silicondust HDHomerun network tuners.
> Equip them with CableCards and you can watch or record the encrypted
> channels, in addition to unencrypted locals. You'll need storage for
> the recordings and you'll need a front end like SageTV, BeyondTV,
> MythTV, Windows 7 Media Center, etc. Once set up, it works flawlessly,
> at least for me. Wife is technology-challenged and took to this setup
> like a duck to water. HDHR's (with CableCard support) are available
> with 3 or 6 tuners. Lose the CableCard support (and the ability to
> watch or record encrypted channels) and they have a unit available
> with just two tuners.
>
> <http://www.silicondust.com/products/hdhomerun/prime/>
>
> <http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&N=-1&isNodeId=1&Description=silicondust&x=0&y=0>
>
> Note that these tuners won't work with satellite TV, so if you choose
> Dish or Direct instead of TWC these tuners won't be an option.
That's great, but I don't want to use a computer. I just want a
dedicated hardware as the DVR.
--
"Even the sharpest ear cannot hear an ant singing." --Sudanese
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Justice Gustine
Feb 17, 2012, 8:02:42 PM2/17/12
to
On Fri, 17 Feb 2012 12:19:45 -0800, Ant <a...@zimage.comANT> wrote:
>
>We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner
>Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99 per
>month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is available
>(no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).
Is there a self install option in the home?
>
>We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner
>Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99 per
>month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is available
>(no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).
Do Best Buy stores offer modems for sale and any free startup offers?
I could say to get cable Internet for $53 and split the coax, run it
to the TV. See what comes in :) but more and more cable systems are
encrypting everything.
The Windows Media Center suggestion is really one to consider for a
DVR that does not have a monthly fee.
Ant
Feb 17, 2012, 8:35:33 PM2/17/12
to
On 2/17/2012 4:39 PM PT, D. Stussy typed:
> For Dish Network, adding one's local stations is only an additional
> $5/month beyond other programming. However, you'll only get the primary
> digital channel. The secondary OTA streams are not covered. However,
> depending on where you are, you might be able to receive them OTA
> nonetheless due to their signal strength -- or receive a similar feed from
> San Diego.
Interesting. TWC RR has a few unlisted foreign independent channels on
http://www.timewarnercable.com/socal/support/clu/clu.ashx compared to
OTA. I e-mailed them to ask them if they even carry them.
> In my opinion, you should be ready to go with your choice when you move in
> BUT first be able to survey what you can actually see OTA before actually
> ordering any service (unless you want more than just OTA plus basic). The
> minidishes are currently cheaper than cable TV.
How much cheaper? Hence trying to decide cable or satellite for
basic/local TV services.
> I'm in the shadow of the Santa Monica Mountains/Hollywood Hills from the
> transmitters on Mounts Wilson and Lukens, but I do receive about half of
> the OTA stations over the air. I also see San Diego more than 50% of the
> time (i.e. good weather) and sometimes can see Ensenada, BC, Mexico
> stations (about 15 days/year). The furthest I ever saw (before the digital
> conversion) was WCCV 54 in Arecibo, PR during troposphere ducting about 15
> years ago.
Not if there is a big hill/mountain blocking transmitters. Both
antennaweb and tvfools show yellow and red for them. Previous home
owners couldn't get OTA because of that. See:
http://i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d40330909db0c9f
http://i.imgur.com/KWz13.gif
:(
--
"She's got ants in her pants." --unknown
> $5/month beyond other programming. However, you'll only get the primary
> digital channel. The secondary OTA streams are not covered. However,
> depending on where you are, you might be able to receive them OTA
> nonetheless due to their signal strength -- or receive a similar feed from
> San Diego.
Interesting. TWC RR has a few unlisted foreign independent channels on
http://www.timewarnercable.com/socal/support/clu/clu.ashx compared to
OTA. I e-mailed them to ask them if they even carry them.
> In my opinion, you should be ready to go with your choice when you move in
> BUT first be able to survey what you can actually see OTA before actually
> ordering any service (unless you want more than just OTA plus basic). The
> minidishes are currently cheaper than cable TV.
How much cheaper? Hence trying to decide cable or satellite for
basic/local TV services.
> I'm in the shadow of the Santa Monica Mountains/Hollywood Hills from the
> transmitters on Mounts Wilson and Lukens, but I do receive about half of
> the OTA stations over the air. I also see San Diego more than 50% of the
> time (i.e. good weather) and sometimes can see Ensenada, BC, Mexico
> stations (about 15 days/year). The furthest I ever saw (before the digital
> conversion) was WCCV 54 in Arecibo, PR during troposphere ducting about 15
> years ago.
Not if there is a big hill/mountain blocking transmitters. Both
antennaweb and tvfools show yellow and red for them. Previous home
owners couldn't get OTA because of that. See:
http://i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d40330909db0c9f
http://i.imgur.com/KWz13.gif
:(
--
"She's got ants in her pants." --unknown
Ant
Feb 17, 2012, 8:39:49 PM2/17/12
to
On 2/17/2012 5:02 PM PT, Justice Gustine typed:
>> We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner
>> Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99 per
>> month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is available
>> (no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).
>
> Is there a self install option in the home?
> Do Best Buy stores offer modems for sale and any free startup offers?
Well, I already have TWC RR at the old home. I just need to transfer my
account to the new home.
> I could say to get cable Internet for $53 and split the coax, run it
> to the TV. See what comes in :) but more and more cable systems are
> encrypting everything.
Isn't that illegal?
> The Windows Media Center suggestion is really one to consider for a
> DVR that does not have a monthly fee.
I want to avoid using computers and just get a dedicated hardware.
--
"Look not to the windmill's turning while the ant still burrows." --unknown
>> We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner
>> Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99 per
>> month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is available
>> (no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).
>
> Is there a self install option in the home?
> Do Best Buy stores offer modems for sale and any free startup offers?
account to the new home.
> I could say to get cable Internet for $53 and split the coax, run it
> to the TV. See what comes in :) but more and more cable systems are
> encrypting everything.
> The Windows Media Center suggestion is really one to consider for a
> DVR that does not have a monthly fee.
--
"Look not to the windmill's turning while the ant still burrows." --unknown
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Ant
Feb 18, 2012, 11:55:06 AM2/18/12
to
On 2/17/2012 10:30 PM PT, Bill M. typed:
> On Fri, 17 Feb 2012 17:35:33 -0800, Ant<a...@zimage.comANT> wrote:
>
>> On 2/17/2012 4:39 PM PT, D. Stussy typed:
>>
> right? According to them, are you likely to receive all of the major
> networks, at least?
Um, no. None of them were green. To be green, the antennae would have to
be about twenty floor high. :(
>> Previous home owners couldn't get OTA because of that. See:
>> http://i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg
>> http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d40330909db0c9f
>> http://i.imgur.com/KWz13.gif
>>
>> :(
>
> Could be a lot worse. You could be in a location where you get nothing
> at all OTA.
>
> Lastly, in my experience, both tvfool and antennaweb are a bit
> pessimistic in their predictions. In my area, at least, I get more
> channels than they think I should.
Interesting, but I still want all the channels like I do at my old home
(80+ channels. Definitely, most of the English ones and a few asian
channels).
--
"After World War III, the ants will still be around." --unknown
> On Fri, 17 Feb 2012 17:35:33 -0800, Ant<a...@zimage.comANT> wrote:
>
>> On 2/17/2012 4:39 PM PT, D. Stussy typed:
>>
>>> I'm in the shadow of the Santa Monica Mountains/Hollywood Hills from the
>>> transmitters on Mounts Wilson and Lukens, but I do receive about half of
>>> the OTA stations over the air. I also see San Diego more than 50% of the
>>> time (i.e. good weather) and sometimes can see Ensenada, BC, Mexico
>>> stations (about 15 days/year). The furthest I ever saw (before the digital
>>> conversion) was WCCV 54 in Arecibo, PR during troposphere ducting about 15
>>> years ago.
>>
>> Not if there is a big hill/mountain blocking transmitters. Both
>> antennaweb and tvfools show yellow and red for them.
>
> But they seem to show good colors for a nice handful of stations,
>>> transmitters on Mounts Wilson and Lukens, but I do receive about half of
>>> the OTA stations over the air. I also see San Diego more than 50% of the
>>> time (i.e. good weather) and sometimes can see Ensenada, BC, Mexico
>>> stations (about 15 days/year). The furthest I ever saw (before the digital
>>> conversion) was WCCV 54 in Arecibo, PR during troposphere ducting about 15
>>> years ago.
>>
>> Not if there is a big hill/mountain blocking transmitters. Both
>> antennaweb and tvfools show yellow and red for them.
>
> right? According to them, are you likely to receive all of the major
> networks, at least?
Um, no. None of them were green. To be green, the antennae would have to
be about twenty floor high. :(
>> Previous home owners couldn't get OTA because of that. See:
>> http://i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg
>> http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d40330909db0c9f
>> http://i.imgur.com/KWz13.gif
>>
>> :(
>
> at all OTA.
>
> Lastly, in my experience, both tvfool and antennaweb are a bit
> pessimistic in their predictions. In my area, at least, I get more
> channels than they think I should.
Interesting, but I still want all the channels like I do at my old home
(80+ channels. Definitely, most of the English ones and a few asian
channels).
--
"After World War III, the ants will still be around." --unknown
Ant
Feb 18, 2012, 11:59:54 AM2/18/12
to
On 2/17/2012 11:39 PM PT, D. Stussy typed:
>> Not if there is a big hill/mountain blocking transmitters. Both
>> antennaweb and tvfools show yellow and red for them. Previous home
>> owners couldn't get OTA because of that. See:
>> http://i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg
>> http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d40330909db0c9f
>> http://i.imgur.com/KWz13.gif
>
> I've got 1200 feet of hill in my way of line of sight, and on your list, I
> can receive down to KCET, but not KCBS. However, I do have a 57 element
> rooftop antenna. KNBC or KTLA will probably be your weakest received major
> station without a rooftop antenna. You're about 18.5 miles away while I'm
> 25 miles distant from the main collection of transmitters. Good luck.
Right, but this antenna has to be twenty floors high to get all channels
(green status). FYI, the house is one floor and right next to the big
hill/small mountain's south side (no view of the mountains (e.g.,
Mount/Mt. Wilson) on the north). The antenna woulkd have to be over this
blockage. :(
--
"When you have seen one ant, one bird, one tree, you have not seen them
all." --Edward O. Wilson, 1992
>> Not if there is a big hill/mountain blocking transmitters. Both
>> antennaweb and tvfools show yellow and red for them. Previous home
>> owners couldn't get OTA because of that. See:
>> http://i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg
>> http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d40330909db0c9f
>> http://i.imgur.com/KWz13.gif
>
> can receive down to KCET, but not KCBS. However, I do have a 57 element
> rooftop antenna. KNBC or KTLA will probably be your weakest received major
> station without a rooftop antenna. You're about 18.5 miles away while I'm
> 25 miles distant from the main collection of transmitters. Good luck.
Right, but this antenna has to be twenty floors high to get all channels
(green status). FYI, the house is one floor and right next to the big
hill/small mountain's south side (no view of the mountains (e.g.,
Mount/Mt. Wilson) on the north). The antenna woulkd have to be over this
blockage. :(
--
"When you have seen one ant, one bird, one tree, you have not seen them
all." --Edward O. Wilson, 1992
Ant
Feb 18, 2012, 12:02:31 PM2/18/12
to
On 2/17/2012 9:21 PM PT, Bill M. typed:
>>> I could say to get cable Internet for $53 and split the coax, run it
>>> to the TV. See what comes in :) but more and more cable systems are
>>> encrypting everything.
>>
>> Isn't that illegal?
>
> No.
Interesting. I thought that would be a cable service thief.
> You'll most likely only get some of the local channels via clear QAM,
> so your TV(s) need to have a QAM tuner.
Hmm, how can I check if these old CRT TVs have them? I know my Sharp 20"
CRT TV, from 1996, has cable analog and antenna support with its coax
input (yep, only one port). I also have an old Toshiba VCR from dotcom days.
--
"Ah. Those club kids did eat those ants up like popcorn." --CSI: Miami
(Wannabe episode; #218)
>>> I could say to get cable Internet for $53 and split the coax, run it
>>> to the TV. See what comes in :) but more and more cable systems are
>>> encrypting everything.
>>
>> Isn't that illegal?
>
Interesting. I thought that would be a cable service thief.
> You'll most likely only get some of the local channels via clear QAM,
> so your TV(s) need to have a QAM tuner.
Hmm, how can I check if these old CRT TVs have them? I know my Sharp 20"
CRT TV, from 1996, has cable analog and antenna support with its coax
input (yep, only one port). I also have an old Toshiba VCR from dotcom days.
--
"Ah. Those club kids did eat those ants up like popcorn." --CSI: Miami
(Wannabe episode; #218)
Ant
Feb 18, 2012, 12:21:30 PM2/18/12
to
On 2/17/2012 11:39 PM PT, D. Stussy typed:
>>>> I don't know if this is the proper newsgroups to ask this. In a few
>>>> months, my family and I (three people) will be relocating/moving to
>>>> another house. We won't be able to get free over the air (OTA) due to
> a
>>>> small mountain/giant hill blocking transmitters for Los Angeles/L.A.
>>>> broadcasts. It is impossible to get a very high antenna (would require
> a
>>>> high rise building height with twenty floors -- 193 or more feet for
> the
>>>> local English stations in green color according to TVFool.com!). So
> that
>>>> means we will have to order cable or satellite TV for TV feeds. Since
> we
>>>> don't watch many movies and stuff (we just rent or stream), we will
>>>> still keep it simple and basic. Hopefully, cheap/low cost. Basically,
> we
>>>> want all local broadcast channels including foreign ones (asian like
>>>> Chinese).
>>>>
>>>> We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner
>>>> Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99
> per
>>>> month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is
> available
>>>> (no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).
...
this house need to get the local broadcast English channels on an one
floor house? Obviously, the antennae need to be returnable if these
tests fail. http://i.imgur.com/LTao8.jpg for the aerial shot of the
rooftop (note that it has a satellite dish already from previous owners).
--
"I killed an ant, now all my relatives are afraid of me." --unknown
>>>> I don't know if this is the proper newsgroups to ask this. In a few
>>>> months, my family and I (three people) will be relocating/moving to
>>>> another house. We won't be able to get free over the air (OTA) due to
> a
>>>> small mountain/giant hill blocking transmitters for Los Angeles/L.A.
>>>> broadcasts. It is impossible to get a very high antenna (would require
> a
>>>> high rise building height with twenty floors -- 193 or more feet for
> the
>>>> local English stations in green color according to TVFool.com!). So
> that
>>>> means we will have to order cable or satellite TV for TV feeds. Since
> we
>>>> don't watch many movies and stuff (we just rent or stream), we will
>>>> still keep it simple and basic. Hopefully, cheap/low cost. Basically,
> we
>>>> want all local broadcast channels including foreign ones (asian like
>>>> Chinese).
>>>>
>>>> We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner
>>>> Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99
> per
>>>> month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is
> available
>>>> (no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).
>>> In my opinion, you should be ready to go with your choice when you move
> in
>>> BUT first be able to survey what you can actually see OTA before
> actually
>>> ordering any service (unless you want more than just OTA plus basic).
> The
>>> minidishes are currently cheaper than cable TV.
>>
>> How much cheaper? Hence trying to decide cable or satellite for
>> basic/local TV services.
>
> You'll have to visit the web sites and compare.
> in
>>> BUT first be able to survey what you can actually see OTA before
> actually
>>> ordering any service (unless you want more than just OTA plus basic).
> The
>>> minidishes are currently cheaper than cable TV.
>>
>> How much cheaper? Hence trying to decide cable or satellite for
>> basic/local TV services.
>
>
>>> I'm in the shadow of the Santa Monica Mountains/Hollywood Hills from
> the
>>> transmitters on Mounts Wilson and Lukens, but I do receive about half
> of
>>> the OTA stations over the air. I also see San Diego more than 50% of
> the
>>> time (i.e. good weather) and sometimes can see Ensenada, BC, Mexico
>>> stations (about 15 days/year). The furthest I ever saw (before the
> digital
>>> conversion) was WCCV 54 in Arecibo, PR during troposphere ducting about
> 15
>>> years ago.
>>
>> Not if there is a big hill/mountain blocking transmitters. Both
>> antennaweb and tvfools show yellow and red for them. Previous home
>> owners couldn't get OTA because of that. See:
>> http://i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg
>> http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d40330909db0c9f
>> http://i.imgur.com/KWz13.gif
>
>>> I'm in the shadow of the Santa Monica Mountains/Hollywood Hills from
> the
>>> transmitters on Mounts Wilson and Lukens, but I do receive about half
> of
>>> the OTA stations over the air. I also see San Diego more than 50% of
> the
>>> time (i.e. good weather) and sometimes can see Ensenada, BC, Mexico
>>> stations (about 15 days/year). The furthest I ever saw (before the
> digital
>>> conversion) was WCCV 54 in Arecibo, PR during troposphere ducting about
> 15
>>> years ago.
>>
>> Not if there is a big hill/mountain blocking transmitters. Both
>> antennaweb and tvfools show yellow and red for them. Previous home
>> owners couldn't get OTA because of that. See:
>> http://i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg
>> http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d40330909db0c9f
>> http://i.imgur.com/KWz13.gif
>
> I've got 1200 feet of hill in my way of line of sight, and on your list, I
> can receive down to KCET, but not KCBS. However, I do have a 57 element
> rooftop antenna. KNBC or KTLA will probably be your weakest received major
> station without a rooftop antenna. You're about 18.5 miles away while I'm
> 25 miles distant from the main collection of transmitters. Good luck.
Just for kicks, what type of roof top/outdoor antenna (57 element?) does
> can receive down to KCET, but not KCBS. However, I do have a 57 element
> rooftop antenna. KNBC or KTLA will probably be your weakest received major
> station without a rooftop antenna. You're about 18.5 miles away while I'm
> 25 miles distant from the main collection of transmitters. Good luck.
this house need to get the local broadcast English channels on an one
floor house? Obviously, the antennae need to be returnable if these
tests fail. http://i.imgur.com/LTao8.jpg for the aerial shot of the
rooftop (note that it has a satellite dish already from previous owners).
--
"I killed an ant, now all my relatives are afraid of me." --unknown
Patty Winter
Feb 18, 2012, 12:53:52 PM2/18/12
to
In article <L--dnRbyEew7RKLS...@earthlink.com>,
Ant <a...@zimage.comANT> wrote:
>On 2/17/2012 9:21 PM PT, Bill M. typed:
>
>On 2/17/2012 9:21 PM PT, Bill M. typed:
>
>> You'll most likely only get some of the local channels via clear QAM,
>> so your TV(s) need to have a QAM tuner.
>
>Hmm, how can I check if these old CRT TVs have them?
They don't. QAM tuners are in digital TVs. (Although as Bill noted,
>> so your TV(s) need to have a QAM tuner.
>
>Hmm, how can I check if these old CRT TVs have them?
not in all of them.)
Given the information you've posted (repeatedly) in these groups and
others, it's obvious that your new home will not get OTA without an
impractically tall antenna, so just bite the bullet and do what we've
all suggested: figure out which international channels you really want,
check the channel lineups for the cable and satellite companies that
are available at that location, and subscribe to the service that will
give you those channels. If you're lucky and the channels you want are
available from more than one provider, then you can compare prices on
their websites and take the cheaper/cheapest one.
Patty
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Ant
Feb 18, 2012, 1:07:16 PM2/18/12
to
On 2/18/2012 10:03 AM PT, Bill M. typed:
>> Um, no. None of them were green. To be green, the antennae would have to
>> be about twenty floor high. :(
>
> Not sure why you're holding out for green. Blue and violet are easily
> watchable in most cases. Worst case, you may need an antenna in the
> attic or on the roof rather than a little 8" loop inside the house.
>
> Do you own the hill, by chance? Put the antenna up on the hill where
> it has a clear line of site, add a signal amp, then run coax down the
> hill to the house. Split it to the various TV's, as needed. I don't
> know how far that is so I can't say if it's practical.
Nope, probably neighbors' on the other side. :(
--
"We are anthill men upon an anthill world." --Ray Bradbury
>> Um, no. None of them were green. To be green, the antennae would have to
>> be about twenty floor high. :(
>
> watchable in most cases. Worst case, you may need an antenna in the
> attic or on the roof rather than a little 8" loop inside the house.
>
> Do you own the hill, by chance? Put the antenna up on the hill where
> it has a clear line of site, add a signal amp, then run coax down the
> hill to the house. Split it to the various TV's, as needed. I don't
> know how far that is so I can't say if it's practical.
Nope, probably neighbors' on the other side. :(
--
"We are anthill men upon an anthill world." --Ray Bradbury
Ant
Feb 18, 2012, 1:08:29 PM2/18/12
to
On 2/18/2012 9:54 AM PT, Bill M. typed:
>>>>> I could say to get cable Internet for $53 and split the coax, run it
>>>>> to the TV. See what comes in :) but more and more cable systems are
>>>>> encrypting everything.
>>>>
Ah. I assume those simple/cheap OTA DTV tuner boxes don't as well.
>>>>> I could say to get cable Internet for $53 and split the coax, run it
>>>>> to the TV. See what comes in :) but more and more cable systems are
>>>>> encrypting everything.
>>>>
>>> You'll most likely only get some of the local channels via clear QAM,
>>> so your TV(s) need to have a QAM tuner.
>>
>> Hmm, how can I check if these old CRT TVs have them? I know my Sharp 20"
>> CRT TV, from 1996, has cable analog and antenna support with its coax
>> input (yep, only one port). I also have an old Toshiba VCR from dotcom days.
>
> Your old TV's and VCR's don't have QAM tuners, but new HD TV's do.
>>> so your TV(s) need to have a QAM tuner.
>>
>> Hmm, how can I check if these old CRT TVs have them? I know my Sharp 20"
>> CRT TV, from 1996, has cable analog and antenna support with its coax
>> input (yep, only one port). I also have an old Toshiba VCR from dotcom days.
>
Ah. I assume those simple/cheap OTA DTV tuner boxes don't as well.
--
"Look not to the windmill's turning while the ant still burrows." --unknown
"Look not to the windmill's turning while the ant still burrows." --unknown
Ant
Feb 18, 2012, 1:09:48 PM2/18/12
to
On 2/18/2012 9:53 AM PT, Patty Winter typed:
>>> You'll most likely only get some of the local channels via clear QAM,
>>> so your TV(s) need to have a QAM tuner.
>>
>> Hmm, how can I check if these old CRT TVs have them?
>
> They don't. QAM tuners are in digital TVs. (Although as Bill noted,
> not in all of them.)
>
> Given the information you've posted (repeatedly) in these groups and
> others, it's obvious that your new home will not get OTA without an
> impractically tall antenna, so just bite the bullet and do what we've
> all suggested: figure out which international channels you really want,
> check the channel lineups for the cable and satellite companies that
> are available at that location, and subscribe to the service that will
> give you those channels. If you're lucky and the channels you want are
> available from more than one provider, then you can compare prices on
> their websites and take the cheaper/cheapest one.
OK and thanks. So, OTA is definitely out.
>>> You'll most likely only get some of the local channels via clear QAM,
>>> so your TV(s) need to have a QAM tuner.
>>
>> Hmm, how can I check if these old CRT TVs have them?
>
> They don't. QAM tuners are in digital TVs. (Although as Bill noted,
> not in all of them.)
>
> Given the information you've posted (repeatedly) in these groups and
> others, it's obvious that your new home will not get OTA without an
> impractically tall antenna, so just bite the bullet and do what we've
> all suggested: figure out which international channels you really want,
> check the channel lineups for the cable and satellite companies that
> are available at that location, and subscribe to the service that will
> give you those channels. If you're lucky and the channels you want are
> available from more than one provider, then you can compare prices on
> their websites and take the cheaper/cheapest one.
--
"After World War III, the ants will still be around." --unknown
"After World War III, the ants will still be around." --unknown
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Ant
Feb 18, 2012, 2:25:14 PM2/18/12
to
On 2/18/2012 11:09 AM PT, Bill M. typed:
>>>>> You'll most likely only get some of the local channels via clear QAM,
>>>>> so your TV(s) need to have a QAM tuner.
>>>>
>>>> Hmm, how can I check if these old CRT TVs have them? I know my Sharp 20"
>>>> CRT TV, from 1996, has cable analog and antenna support with its coax
>>>> input (yep, only one port). I also have an old Toshiba VCR from dotcom days.
>>>
>>> Your old TV's and VCR's don't have QAM tuners, but new HD TV's do.
>>
>> Ah. I assume those simple/cheap OTA DTV tuner boxes don't as well.
>
> Nope, those are ATSC tuners, not QAM. Both are digital, but
> incompatible with each other. Many/most new TV's can handle both.
Thanks again. :)
--
"Ants never sleep." --Ralph Waldo Emerson, poet
>>>>> You'll most likely only get some of the local channels via clear QAM,
>>>>> so your TV(s) need to have a QAM tuner.
>>>>
>>>> Hmm, how can I check if these old CRT TVs have them? I know my Sharp 20"
>>>> CRT TV, from 1996, has cable analog and antenna support with its coax
>>>> input (yep, only one port). I also have an old Toshiba VCR from dotcom days.
>>>
>>> Your old TV's and VCR's don't have QAM tuners, but new HD TV's do.
>>
>> Ah. I assume those simple/cheap OTA DTV tuner boxes don't as well.
>
> incompatible with each other. Many/most new TV's can handle both.
Thanks again. :)
--
"Ants never sleep." --Ralph Waldo Emerson, poet
Alan Justice
Jul 19, 2012, 1:25:09 PM7/19/12
to
I currently have Charter cable. I miss a lot of shows because of a poor or
nonexistent signal. They used to credit my account for the problems, but
not anymore. I've had to go to a public high speed internet so I can watch
the misssed ones online.
So I'm looking into satellite. I called DirecTV and they would not tell me
which channels they carry. They would only telll me if I guessed each one.
They would not send a list. So I hung up.
I talked to Dish and it was so much easier. So last week I called Dish to
sign up and it turned out they lie in their ads: The Hopper, their DVR, is
not free. They try to double talk to make me think it is. So I asked for
the supervisor who also confirmed their lie. So I hung up. (I went down to
a local telephone office which offers Dish, and they said, "yes, they lie.")
I found a web site that showed all channels for each tier for the 2
satellites. I called back DirecTV to ask their prices and they refused to
tell me. I had to give them my credit card number so they could do a credit
check first. So I hung up.
Apparently their are no good options to do business with an honest and
professional company.
--
Alan Justice
http://home.earthlink.net/~wildlifepaparazzi/
"Ant" <a...@zimage.comANT> wrote in message
news:AqCdnU9HloT6K6PS...@earthlink.com...
> Hello.
> --
> "The tiny ant dares to enter the lion's ear." --Armenian
nonexistent signal. They used to credit my account for the problems, but
not anymore. I've had to go to a public high speed internet so I can watch
the misssed ones online.
So I'm looking into satellite. I called DirecTV and they would not tell me
which channels they carry. They would only telll me if I guessed each one.
They would not send a list. So I hung up.
I talked to Dish and it was so much easier. So last week I called Dish to
sign up and it turned out they lie in their ads: The Hopper, their DVR, is
not free. They try to double talk to make me think it is. So I asked for
the supervisor who also confirmed their lie. So I hung up. (I went down to
a local telephone office which offers Dish, and they said, "yes, they lie.")
I found a web site that showed all channels for each tier for the 2
satellites. I called back DirecTV to ask their prices and they refused to
tell me. I had to give them my credit card number so they could do a credit
check first. So I hung up.
Apparently their are no good options to do business with an honest and
professional company.
--
Alan Justice
http://home.earthlink.net/~wildlifepaparazzi/
"Ant" <a...@zimage.comANT> wrote in message
news:AqCdnU9HloT6K6PS...@earthlink.com...
> Hello.
>
> I don't know if this is the proper newsgroups to ask this. In a few
> months, my family and I (three people) will be relocating/moving to
> another house. We won't be able to get free over the air (OTA) due to a
> small mountain/giant hill blocking transmitters for Los Angeles/L.A.
> broadcasts. It is impossible to get a very high antenna (would require a
> high rise building height with twenty floors -- 193 or more feet for the
> local English stations in green color according to TVFool.com!). So that
> means we will have to order cable or satellite TV for TV feeds. Since we
> don't watch many movies and stuff (we just rent or stream), we will
> still keep it simple and basic. Hopefully, cheap/low cost. Basically, we
> want all local broadcast channels including foreign ones (asian like
> Chinese).
>
> We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner
> Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99 per
> month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is available
> (no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).
>
> I don't know if this is the proper newsgroups to ask this. In a few
> months, my family and I (three people) will be relocating/moving to
> another house. We won't be able to get free over the air (OTA) due to a
> small mountain/giant hill blocking transmitters for Los Angeles/L.A.
> broadcasts. It is impossible to get a very high antenna (would require a
> high rise building height with twenty floors -- 193 or more feet for the
> local English stations in green color according to TVFool.com!). So that
> means we will have to order cable or satellite TV for TV feeds. Since we
> don't watch many movies and stuff (we just rent or stream), we will
> still keep it simple and basic. Hopefully, cheap/low cost. Basically, we
> want all local broadcast channels including foreign ones (asian like
> Chinese).
>
> We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner
> Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99 per
> month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is available
> (no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).
>
> TWC sales said for monthly payments as of Christmas break of 2011:
> $24.50 (basic/local broadcast TV)
> $52.99 (regular Internet package)
> $10 DVR rental (heard cable DVRs suck? Or should we get our own
> [however, I can't find one that doesn't require subscriptions like
> DTVPal and ChannelMaster DVRs]
> $49.99 for installation charge
>
> Total = $84.79 per month for service (without $49.99 for installation
> charge).
>
> Bundled packages and a single bill would be nice too if it is cheap/not
> much different, but if satellite TV service is a lot cheaper than we
> will get it. However, it will suck if the whole cable goes out/down,
> then no Internet and TV. :(
>
> I read and heard that satellite TV services for TV stuff can be cheaper
> and better quality. We will also need to get a new DVR (we still have
> VCRs, but why?) to replace DTVPal DVR (only for OTA). There are several
> satellite TV services like EchoStar, DishTV, DirecTV, etc. Which ones to
> get? We have never owned satellite TV services before so this will be
> new to us. Also, we still use old CRT TVs but we will get HDTV ones
> later on when they break/die.
>
> Thank you in advance. :)
> $24.50 (basic/local broadcast TV)
> $52.99 (regular Internet package)
> $10 DVR rental (heard cable DVRs suck? Or should we get our own
> [however, I can't find one that doesn't require subscriptions like
> DTVPal and ChannelMaster DVRs]
> $49.99 for installation charge
>
> Total = $84.79 per month for service (without $49.99 for installation
> charge).
>
> Bundled packages and a single bill would be nice too if it is cheap/not
> much different, but if satellite TV service is a lot cheaper than we
> will get it. However, it will suck if the whole cable goes out/down,
> then no Internet and TV. :(
>
> I read and heard that satellite TV services for TV stuff can be cheaper
> and better quality. We will also need to get a new DVR (we still have
> VCRs, but why?) to replace DTVPal DVR (only for OTA). There are several
> satellite TV services like EchoStar, DishTV, DirecTV, etc. Which ones to
> get? We have never owned satellite TV services before so this will be
> new to us. Also, we still use old CRT TVs but we will get HDTV ones
> later on when they break/die.
>
> --
> "The tiny ant dares to enter the lion's ear." --Armenian
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