Paradox/Win 5.0 upgrade expensive?
Kevin L White
5.0 upgrade has been announced (sorta) at ~$179. Now, I haven't
actually gotten my notice yet so I don't know how much that comes with
(SQL drivers etc.) but doesn't that seem a little excessive? I mean,
we paid $139 for the original application and $9.95 for the upgrade to
4.5 (maybe more if you needed the SQL stuff). That seems to be
pushing it, making the upgrade more than I paid for the original
product. Aren't there supposed to be benefits for being a customer?
Just my thoughts...
Kevin
--
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"Where...the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes and weighs 30
tons, computers in the future may have 1,000 vacuum tubes and perhaps
weigh just 1-1/2 tons." Popular Mechanics, March 1949
Dave Yuhas
: Aren't there supposed to be benefits for being a customer?
Maybe Borland wants to stay in business...
--
Dave Yuhas
Pacifica, CA
da...@crl.com
RobtSNovak
Borland's official line on the upgrade price justification is that the
1.0-4.5 upgrade represented basically a maintenance release, while 5.0 is
a completely new product. The $179 upgrade isn't *too* bad compared to
the $495 list price, but it's still too high for many people.
Considering that Borland will not come out with 5.0 Runtime or the 5.0
Developer's tools for "several months", I think they are in for a surprise
when developers won't buy the upgrade until their tools are ready, and
consumers are reluctant to pay the upgrade price when many of the new
features are geared towards power users and developers (coaches and tutors
excluded).
Rob
James Michael Spring
In article <31s7vf$f...@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> klw...@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kevin L White) writes:
>Reading the messages flying by here, I am noticing that the PDox/Win
>5.0 upgrade has been announced (sorta) at ~$179. Now, I haven't
>actually gotten my notice yet so I don't know how much that comes with
>(SQL drivers etc.) but doesn't that seem a little excessive? I mean,
>we paid $139 for the original application and $9.95 for the upgrade to
From reading the various magazines that have had spots on 5.0, it sounds
like it is a MAJOR upgrade, where 4.5 was more like a bunch of fixes w/o
a whole lot of new stuff added on. Prior to P4W, Pdox Dos used to see
for around $300+ for a single user count, so the price isn't entirely
unreasonable. I'm sure you might beable to find a bit lower of a price
at software stores.
-Jim
--
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_Bob
Brad Wartman
>Reading the messages flying by here, I am noticing that the PDox/Win
>5.0 upgrade has been announced (sorta) at ~$179. Now, I haven't
>actually gotten my notice yet so I don't know how much that comes with
>(SQL drivers etc.) but doesn't that seem a little excessive? I mean,
>we paid $139 for the original application and $9.95 for the upgrade to
>4.5 (maybe more if you needed the SQL stuff). That seems to be
>pushing it, making the upgrade more than I paid for the original
>product. Aren't there supposed to be benefits for being a customer?
What's always held me back from using Pdox/Win is the lack of a runtime
version. Oh, it's been promised for a long, LONG time, but nothin's ever
come down the pike. With competing products like FoxPro and Access selling
for nearly 2/3 the price, it wrankled me to see the price Borland wants for
this "upgrade". But hey, you get a *free* copy of SideKick/Win along with
it (though I got my copy from Compuserve). I'm half tempted to call Borland
and ask what the price is sans Sidekick.
When they get a runtime version up & working, then I'll give 'em a call. I
hope it's soon; I sure do like their product.
--
bwar...@teleport.COM Almost live! from the City of Roses, Portland, OR
RobtSNovak
Wartman) writes:
>>>>What's always held me back from using Pdox/Win is the lack of a
runtime
version. Oh, it's been promised for a long, LONG time, but nothin's ever
come down the pike. With competing products like FoxPro and Access selling
for nearly 2/3 the price, it wrankled me to see the price Borland wants
for
this "upgrade". But hey, you get a *free* copy of SideKick/Win along with
it (though I got my copy from Compuserve). I'm half tempted to call
Borland
and ask what the price is sans Sidekick.<<<<
------------------------------------------
Brad,
PDOXWIN Runtime has been available for quite a while - it's $495.00.
Rob
Brad Wartman
>PDOXWIN Runtime has been available for quite a while - it's $495.00.
Are you sure you're not thinking of the DOS runtime? I''ve never heard any
mention of a runtime version for the Windows, though I had heard that
Borland would, for about the price you quoted, allow a developer to install
full copies of Pdox/Win until the runtime became available (after which time
the copies would have to be replaced with runtime versions).
It seems more than a little strange that I never received notice from
Borland about the runtime being available, nor have the Paradox develpers I
know & work with.
Peter Hyde
> Considering that Borland will not come out with 5.0 Runtime or the 5.0
> Developer's tools for "several months", I think they are in for a surprise
> when developers won't buy the upgrade until their tools are ready, and
> consumers are reluctant to pay the upgrade price when many of the new
> features are geared towards power users and developers (coaches and tutors
> excluded).
Although this is getting a little off-topic, I'd beg to differ with the
latter point. I have the developers tools, and can't see for the life of me
why I should wait for 5.0 versions of them. Perhaps I don't use 'em as much
as I should, or as much as others...
...but for this developer, the speed and extra features in the 5.0
interactive version will be enough to be going on with, to propel
development. Albeit I'd rather the upgrade price wasn't so stiff!
cheers,
peter
P.S. I notice another poster seemed to imply there was no runtime NOW for
the existing (pre-5.0) versions. I wonder where he got that idea?
==============================================================================
Peter Hyde, South Pacific Information Services Ltd
Christchurch, New Zealand -- last time I looked outside
<<< Please use c.d.paradox for ALL relevant messages! >>>
Mike_Robertson
>From: bwar...@teleport.com (Brad Wartman)
>Subject: Re: Paradox/Win 5.0 upgrade expensive?
>Date: 5 Aug 1994 19:54:03 -0700
I've been using the Runtime Version for at least 5 Months now - time you "gave
'em a call" :-)
Mike Robertson | DISCLAIMER: These are *my* thoughts & are
robe...@ccen.unp.ac.za | thus not necessarily those of the Computer
| Services Div. at the University of Natal
RobtSNovak
(Peter Hyde) writes:
>>>>Although this is getting a little off-topic, I'd beg to differ with
the
latter point. I have the developers tools, and can't see for the life of
me
why I should wait for 5.0 versions of them. Perhaps I don't use 'em as
much
as I should, or as much as others...
...but for this developer, the speed and extra features in the 5.0
interactive version will be enough to be going on with, to propel
development. Albeit I'd rather the upgrade price wasn't so stiff!<<<<
--------------------------------------------
Peter,
That's good to hear - I don't have the developer's tools due to budget
reasons but always thought they would speed my work substantially.
Perhaps this is true, but I should investigate their usefulness. I will
start a new post on that very subject.
Regards,
Rob
RobtSNovak
Wartman) writes:
>>PDOXWIN Runtime has been available for quite a while - it's $495.00.
>Are you sure you're not thinking of the DOS runtime? I''ve never heard
any
mention of a runtime version for the Windows, though I had heard that
Borland would, for about the price you quoted, allow a developer to
install
full copies of Pdox/Win until the runtime became available (after which
time
the copies would have to be replaced with runtime versions).
It seems more than a little strange that I never received notice from
Borland about the runtime being available, nor have the Paradox develpers
I
know & work with.<
----------------------------------------------------
Brad,
Really, it's there. For Windows, for the last six months or so.
1-800-331-0877.
Good luck,
Rob
David E. Scheim
operations that can be performed locally on data in a supported server such
as Microsoft SQL Server? I would assume that this would imply that
applications can be developed directly against data in a server. In
contrast, the old Paradox SQL link was quite primitive and allowed only
transfer from server to local tables. Also, what limitations will be
imposed by the lack of immediate availability of developer tools for PDX Win
5.0? I would appreciate any comments on either of these points.
Thanks, David Scheim
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Paul Mowatt
So it is available somewhere out there.
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Brad Wartman
>P.S. I notice another poster seemed to imply there was no runtime NOW for
>the existing (pre-5.0) versions. I wonder where he got that idea?
Attribute it only to my own ignorance ;-). I haven't had to any work in
Pdox/Win for 6 months or so; I guess I just missed the news about it being
available. I do have several friends working in it, though, and they'll be
happy to know it's available now.
Peter Hyde
>
> It seems more than a little strange that I never received notice from
> Borland about the runtime being available, nor have the Paradox develpers I
> know & work with.
Well, don't take our word for it... go ask Borland!
cheers,
peter
P.S. There's a lot of rumourware out there. The PDW Runtime ain't one of
'em.
Robert Clemenzi
408/461-9000 about a free upgrade (plus shipping - $10). They will want
your receipt, a check for $10, and a written request for the grace
period upgrade.
Robert Clemenzi
Northern Virginia
James D. Lee - (602) 621-2748
>408/461-9000 about a free upgrade (plus shipping - $10). They will want
>your receipt, a check for $10, and a written request for the grace
>period upgrade.
Egghead has Pdox 4.5 for Windows available for around $120. Someone could
purchase a copy now and save around $50 by taking advantage of the free
upgrade. Something to consider.
============================================================================
James D. Lee
Sr. Research Associate
University of Arizona The ninety and nine are with dreams content
Department of MIS But the hope of the world made new,
Phone: (602) 621-2748 Is the hundredth man who is grimly bent
FAX: (602) 621-2641 On making those dreams come true.
jl...@bpa.arizona.edu anonymous
============================================================================
Jim
Randy BORL
b) Paradox 5.0 forms that are undelivered (.fsls) will run under both
Paradox 4.5 and 5.0. However, if you use new 5.0 features the 4.5
compiler will of course bark at you about them.
c) The new debugger alone makes it worthwhile to do the development in 5.0
even if you are going to just recompile it in 4.5 and deliver it for use
with 4.5 or 4.5 runtime.
Randy
Randy BORL
other
operations that can be performed locally on data in a supported server
such
as Microsoft SQL Server? >>
If the driver supports it, sure. Borland SQL Link for Windows is in
reality IDAPI drivers just like dBase and Paradox drivers are IDAPI
drivers. They work as if they were native types. You can scroll, edit,
etc. Of course, the speed at which you can do this often depends upon
what kind of navigational support is available in that particular server.
>> In contrast, the old Paradox SQL link was quite primitive and allowed
only
transfer from server to local tables. >>
No such limitations in the Windows version.
>> Also, what limitations will be imposed by the lack of immediate
availability of developer tools for PDX Win 5.0? I would appreciate any
comments on either of these points.
To what are you referring here?
Btw, I just created a Paradox 1-M form in Paradox 5.0 for Windows using
the new Forms expert against the Access 2.0 NWIND sample database through
the MS ODBC Access driver. Twas a piece of cake. I was able to launch
both products and update the records in one and see the changes reflected
in the other....no coding, no gimmicks. Was great! Navigation was also
pretty quick, considering that it was going through ODBC rather than
through MS's own Jet engine.
Randy
Paradox R&D
Borland