AC2K Problems

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Lyle Fairfield

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Jan 20, 2001, 6:44:02 AM1/20/01
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I polish my little Personal Financial Transactions AC97 DB, having tried Quacken for
18 months and wanting to use something that is logical, efficient and smooth, instead.

I read a thread in here that makes me wonder about AC2K and say, "I'll have to test
that". I open my 97 DB in 2K and choose convert. In a few seconds the db opens. I try
every procedure; oops ... one in which I open a module in a backup copy of my db so
that I can run
.DoCmd.RunCommand acCmdCompileAndSaveAllModules
from an instance of access that has the db open, leaves the vbe window open. (Gee, I
think, so many others compile the code of external databases that this is a SERIOUS
problem.)
I change one line of code to clear that up.
Everything else works fine.

Oh well, size will be a big problem. so I compact everything a have a look at size:
Ac97 - 544 KB
AC2K - 464 KB.

hmmmmmm ... maybe speed ... so I wake up the keeper of the books and ask her to test
the two out; which one is faster? "You woke me up for that????" There no difference,
Dummy!"

So I can sure see why Ac2K is BIG trouble.

--
Lyle
http://www.cyriv.com/

peter walker

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Jan 20, 2001, 9:17:05 AM1/20/01
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Lyle, your being naughty again....
Stop trolling
:-)
--

peter walker

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"Lyle Fairfield" <lyle...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
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Lyle Fairfield

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Jan 20, 2001, 9:40:01 AM1/20/01
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You mean it's OK for others to whine about AC2K but not me?
... well that's ok, I never like whine anyway ... whimper is
way better.

"peter walker" <papw...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in
<cWga6.6387$65.3...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com>:

>Lyle, your being naughty again....
>Stop trolling
>:-)

--
Lyle
http://www.cyriv.com/

Steven R. Zuch

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Jan 20, 2001, 11:03:35 AM1/20/01
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Maybe the A2K reported problems become more apparant on bigger
databases. A program database of 544KB is not very large, and this is
assuming that the data is being stored in another database.

In addition, much of the problems relate to the development cycle.

My understanding is that for "small" databases, A2K is fine to develop
in.

Steven


On Sat, 20 Jan 2001 11:44:02 GMT, lyle...@yahoo.com (Lyle Fairfield)
wrote:

Lyle Fairfield

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Jan 20, 2001, 11:37:01 AM1/20/01
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Uh huh ...

Did you know that Bill sends special versions to his Canadian friends who live in or
east of Ontario with all the bugs removed?

st...@nospam.com (Steven R. Zuch) wrote in
<3a69b59...@news.westnet.com>:

>Maybe the A2K reported problems become more apparant on
>bigger databases. A program database of 544KB is not very
>large, and this is assuming that the data is being stored in
>another database.
>
>In addition, much of the problems relate to the development
>cycle.

--
Lyle
http://www.cyriv.com/

peter walker

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Jan 20, 2001, 12:01:15 PM1/20/01
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Its OK to whinge, whine, rant and whimper in this newsgroup, but crowing,
extolling and gloating are out<g>.
BTY are you preparing your Sunday morning whimsy for us yet?
:-)

--

peter walker

LZ129: - Don't paint your airship with rocket fuel.
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"Lyle Fairfield" <lyle...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

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Lyle Fairfield

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Jan 20, 2001, 12:25:04 PM1/20/01
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Sunday morning doesn't happen here for another 11 hours 36 minutes ... Geesh!!!! How
about a case-sensitive, whole word only (both optional) strtran (replace) function?

"peter walker" <papw...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in

<3kja6.6442$65.3...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com>:

>BTY are you preparing your Sunday morning whimsy for us yet?

--
Lyle
http://www.cyriv.com/

peter walker

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Jan 20, 2001, 12:40:26 PM1/20/01
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f&r?...pox on that, Since you have 11 hours to ponder it, (do Canaks sleep?)
what about a decent fast sort routine for alphanumerics in a 1d array or
some such? I miss the old MatSort (array) routines from Wang basic and I
think I'm falling prey to the dark side using a virtual listview
(comctl32.ocx)
...or you could sit by the fire with feet up and sip coffee and read.
:-)
--

peter walker

LZ129: - Don't paint your airship with rocket fuel.
ICQ 85542363
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"Lyle Fairfield" <lyle...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

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Lyle Fairfield

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Jan 20, 2001, 1:49:39 PM1/20/01
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This is the best I can do in eleven minutes Peter ... change the field type to binary
if you want case-sensitive sorting:

Sub test()
Dim a As Variant
Dim z As Long
a = Array("UpsideDown", "5", "Peter", "7", "Alison")
aSort a
For z = LBound(a) To UBound(a)
Debug.Print a(z)
'5
'7
'Alison
'Peter
'UpsideDown
Next z
End Sub


Public Sub aSort(ByRef a As Variant)
Dim r As Recordset
Dim rs As Recordset
Dim z As Long
With DBEngine
On Error GoTo aSortErr
.BeginTrans
With .Workspaces(0)(0)
.Execute "CREATE TABLE AlphaNumericSort (fldElement TEXT (255));"
.Execute "CREATE INDEX AlphaSort ON AlphaNumericSort (fldElement);"
Set r = .OpenRecordset("AlphaNumericSort", dbOpenDynaset)
With r
For z = LBound(a) To UBound(a)
.AddNew
!fldelement = a(z)
.Update
Next z
.Sort = "fldElement"
Set rs = .OpenRecordset
End With
With rs
.MoveFirst
Do
a(.AbsolutePosition + LBound(a)) = !fldelement
.MoveNext
Loop Until .EOF
End With
End With
Set rs = Nothing
Set r = Nothing
End With

aSortExit:
DBEngine.Rollback
Exit Sub

aSortErr:
With Err
msgbox .Number & " " & .Description
End With
Resume aSortExit

End Sub

"peter walker" <papw...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in

<NUja6.6448$65.3...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com>:

peter walker

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Jan 20, 2001, 2:27:44 PM1/20/01
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OK.
I've totally given over to the darkside by drinking 'International Roast',
and just to show A2K has some utility, my Sunday morning whimsy is....

In **A2K** only...try this TOTALLY UNSUPPORTED AND UNDOCUMENTED don't try
this at home kids please.

Sub test()
Dim a(5) As String, i
a(0) = "peter"
a(1) = "walker"
a(2) = "Lyle"
a(3) = "fairfield"
a(4) = "2"
a(5) = "michka wont like this post"
WizHook.SortStringArray a()
For i = 0 To 5
Debug.Print a(i)
Next
End Sub
--

peter (i hate giving up secrets) walker

LZ129: - Don't paint your airship with rocket fuel.
ICQ 85542363
Compuserve 106244,2032
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"Lyle Fairfield" <lyle...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

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Lyle Fairfield

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Jan 20, 2001, 2:48:29 PM1/20/01
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Very nice ... I thought "Set Up" would be one of the array
elements though. How many of the hookers have you tried?

"peter walker" <papw...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in

<qtla6.6454$65.3...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com>:

--
Lyle
http://www.cyriv.com/

Steve Jorgensen

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Jan 20, 2001, 2:52:19 PM1/20/01
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Getting serious for a second, I think most of the complaints have to
do with the greater difficulty of working in the A2K development
environment, not in getting apps to run well (though there's the spell
checker issue you have to know about). I remember someone's advice to
do all development in A97, then convert to A2K for deployment.

On Sat, 20 Jan 2001 16:37:01 GMT, lyle...@yahoo.com (Lyle Fairfield)
wrote:

>Uh huh ...

Steven R. Zuch

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Jan 20, 2001, 3:09:17 PM1/20/01
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Yes, the Linux version :).

Steven


On Sat, 20 Jan 2001 16:37:01 GMT, lyle...@yahoo.com (Lyle Fairfield)
wrote:

>Uh huh ...

peter walker

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Jan 20, 2001, 3:42:00 PM1/20/01
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LOL
Sorry, no it wasn't a set-up, I remembered the undocumented thing only
moments before you posted. In fact I nearly emailed you instead of posting
but since it showed a plus side to A2k....it was only after I posted it that
it occurred to me it may seem smart assy.
I also thought of just cranking up a temp table, in fact I used to, but its
so messy. I've been wondering about a virtual ADO recordset also??
The printer code I posted to my web site uses listview to sort the printers.
I have been worrying for several days about the dll hell people may
encounter and in reality, even WizHook stuff is not really distributable? (I
haven't decided yet), and is not available for A97, so the solution still
needs work. That is the ONLY reason I chose a sort as a suggestion.

...as far as the other hookers, some are useful, some will go bang 'cause I
still haven't hacked 'em into shape.
For instance, with this routine, is it **crucial** that the sub not be
passed "" or you forget a(0). It will go badly for you<g>
My notebook is on site so I haven't got the results of my A2K and VBA / VBE
skulduggery handy. If your interested let me know and I'll email or fax some
stuff over.

opps! the sun is up - back to the coffin.
Once again sorry, it honestly wasn't a set up.
--

peter walker

LZ129: - Don't paint your airship with rocket fuel.
ICQ 85542363
Compuserve 106244,2032
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"Lyle Fairfield" <lyle...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

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Lyle Fairfield

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Jan 20, 2001, 4:07:18 PM1/20/01
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Peter

I wasn't really serious about the setup thing ... I almost
never use emoticons ... people may interpret what I right as
they wish.

Ther should be no mess with the table I created with the aSort
procedure ... the table is, AFAICT, completely virtual (almost
whimsical); it is never saved and never appears in the
database window.

There is one minor advantage to using virtual recordsets for
sorting; the code could be modified quite easily to
accommodate multi-dimensional arrays. I've never checked their
speed, but if we created the table with modular scope and
simply used and trashed the recordset it should be resaonably
fast.


"peter walker" <papw...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in

<3zma6.6462$65.3...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com>:

>LOL
>Sorry, no it wasn't a set-up, I remembered the undocumented
>thing only moments before you posted.

>I also thought of just cranking


>up a temp table, in fact I used to, but its so messy.

--
Lyle
http://www.cyriv.com/

peter walker

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Jan 20, 2001, 4:41:15 PM1/20/01
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Yes, I must admit I **was** guilty of giving your solution only a cursory
glance and dismissing it as a typical 'sortwork' table of old. I revisited
it and noticed the rollback trick you mentioned a week or so ago. It is
probably the correct solution for access since the dao library is open
anyway.

--

peter walker

LZ129: - Don't paint your airship with rocket fuel.
ICQ 85542363
Compuserve 106244,2032
various things available from
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"Lyle Fairfield" <lyle...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

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Tony Toews

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Jan 20, 2001, 7:54:34 PM1/20/01
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lyle...@yahoo.com (Lyle Fairfield) wrote:

>Did you know that Bill sends special versions to his Canadian friends who live in or
>east of Ontario with all the bugs removed?

Gee, more evidence that Ontario, Quebec and the Maritimes are favoured. <smile>

Tony
----
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Please respond only in the newsgroups so that others can
read the entire thread of messages.
Microsoft Access Links, Hints, Tips & Accounting Systems at
http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm

E. Fridman

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Jan 20, 2001, 7:59:37 PM1/20/01
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Steven,

PMJI

>>> In addition, much of the problems relate to the development cycle.


Where can I find descriptions of these problems?

I am only starting with Access in general and use A2K for fairly simple
development.

Eugene
============================
In article <3a69b59...@news.westnet.com>,

--
===========================================


Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/

David W. Fenton

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Jan 20, 2001, 8:48:10 PM1/20/01
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st...@nospam.com (Steven R. Zuch) wrote in
<3a69b59...@news.westnet.com>:

>My understanding is that for "small" databases, A2K is fine to
>develop in.

It's fine for deployment

I'd never develop in it, unless there were features required that
A97 does not include.

--
David W. Fenton http://www.bway.net/~dfenton
dfenton at bway dot net http://www.bway.net/~dfassoc

David W. Fenton

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Jan 20, 2001, 8:49:05 PM1/20/01
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nos...@nospam.nospam (Steve Jorgensen) wrote in
<3a69ecd5....@ca.news.verio.net>:

>I remember someone's advice to
>do all development in A97, then convert to A2K for deployment.

This advice goes back to MichKa, who recommended it to me after my
initial bad brush with A2K.

Lyle Fairfield

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Jan 20, 2001, 8:50:47 PM1/20/01
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HORATIO
Where, my lord?

HAMLET
In my mind's eye, Horatio.

E. Fridman <pm...@my-deja.com> wrote in
<94dc9n$efe$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>:

>Steven,
>
>PMJI
>
>>>> In addition, much of the problems relate to the
>>>> development cycle.
>
>
>Where can I find descriptions of these problems?
>
>I am only starting with Access in general and use A2K for
>fairly simple development.

--
Lyle
http://www.cyriv.com/

Lyle Fairfield

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Jan 20, 2001, 9:09:27 PM1/20/01
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We have me and you have Ralph and Stockwell and Deborah. Any
more evidence is overkill.

Tony Toews <tto...@telusplanet.net> wrote in
<h63k6tgfglhhnp007...@4ax.com>:

>lyle...@yahoo.com (Lyle Fairfield) wrote:
>
>>Did you know that Bill sends special versions to his
>>Canadian friends who live in or east of Ontario with all the
>>bugs removed?
>
>Gee, more evidence that Ontario, Quebec and the Maritimes are
>favoured. <smile>
>
>Tony

--
Lyle
http://www.cyriv.com/

Tony Toews

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Jan 20, 2001, 9:49:30 PM1/20/01
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lyle...@yahoo.com (Lyle Fairfield) wrote:

>We have me and you have Ralph and Stockwell and Deborah. Any
>more evidence is overkill.

Gotta agree with your sentiments on Ralph and Stockwell. However Deborah is a family
friend of a cousin of mine. Back when she was a school teacher in a village 200 km
NE of Edmonton. Sorry but she's a good person.

OTOH more than one term in politics will corrupt almost everybody. No matter how
well intentioned.

michael (michka) kaplan

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Jan 20, 2001, 11:51:04 PM1/20/01
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The big problem with WizHook is that most of it does not work when you call
it.

--
MichKa

a new book on internationalization in VB at
http://www.i18nWithVB.com/

"Lyle Fairfield" <lyle...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

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michael (michka) kaplan

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Jan 20, 2001, 11:51:39 PM1/20/01
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Why would I give a crap? WizHook is not dangerous.... its just that most of

it does not work when you call it.

--
MichKa

a new book on internationalization in VB at
http://www.i18nWithVB.com/

"peter walker" <papw...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
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michael (michka) kaplan

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Jan 20, 2001, 11:53:04 PM1/20/01
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Well, if you look at the original article I wrote, most of the complaints
have to do with the development environment. The rest had to do with new
features that were not finished.

--
MichKa

a new book on internationalization in VB at
http://www.i18nWithVB.com/

"Steve Jorgensen" <nos...@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
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peter walker

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Jan 21, 2001, 12:57:06 AM1/21/01
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Sorry...no offence intended, just playing the clown. I recall very clearly
another thread with Lyle and undocumented stuff<g>. and I admit, it was a
*little* troll to get your thoughts on the WizHook<g>

--

peter walker

LZ129: - Don't paint your airship with rocket fuel.
ICQ 85542363
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"michael (michka) kaplan" <forme...@nospam.trigeminal.spamfree.com> wrote
in message news:t6kqmo9...@corp.supernews.com...

michael (michka) kaplan

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Jan 21, 2001, 2:36:43 PM1/21/01
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Well, I was not too offended. And my fear is never of the undocumented (I
think the sample code and add-ins on my site prove that!).

Like I said, the biggest problem with WizHook functions is that they will
not work, mostly, for reasons that are not entirely clear to people outside
Microsoft. :-(

--
MichKa

a new book on internationalization in VB at
http://www.i18nWithVB.com/

"peter walker" <papw...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message

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Allen Browne

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Jan 21, 2001, 9:59:08 PM1/21/01
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Lyle, my first conversion to A2k was similar to yours: quite
troublefree. I then spent 3 months (spare time) exploring A2k's
new features, testing stuff, timing stuff, getting frustrated
with stuff, and sincerely trying to adapt to the new stuff
before giving up on it.

It will be interesting to see how you feel about it as a design
environment after you've used it for a while. For example:

- Change a line of code in a small module in a large project.
Grab a coffee while you check the line wih a Compile.

- Try to figure out which of two versions of an mdb project is
the more recent. Since it saves *everything* each time, there's
a serious loss of versioning functionality here, not to mention
the loss of shared updating.

- Time how long it takes to open an A2k mdb compared to A97.

- Turn on the new Name AutoCorrect feature in your imported
database, and start renaming some fields. See how it works
and do some performance measuring.

- Try the new Record level locking, and do some perf. measuring
on that.

- Try keeping both versions on the computer, and alternating
between them: tests the patience of Job.

A2k can work, and esp. with the stuff that was also in A97, but
why frustrate yourself and slow yourself down for no real gain?


Lyle Fairfield wrote:
>
> I polish my little Personal Financial Transactions AC97 DB, having tried Quacken for
> 18 months and wanting to use something that is logical, efficient and smooth, instead.
>
> I read a thread in here that makes me wonder about AC2K and say, "I'll have to test
> that". I open my 97 DB in 2K and choose convert. In a few seconds the db opens. I try
> every procedure; oops ... one in which I open a module in a backup copy of my db so
> that I can run
> .DoCmd.RunCommand acCmdCompileAndSaveAllModules
> from an instance of access that has the db open, leaves the vbe window open. (Gee, I
> think, so many others compile the code of external databases that this is a SERIOUS
> problem.)
> I change one line of code to clear that up.
> Everything else works fine.
>
> Oh well, size will be a big problem. so I compact everything a have a look at size:
> Ac97 - 544 KB
> AC2K - 464 KB.
>
> hmmmmmm ... maybe speed ... so I wake up the keeper of the books and ask her to test
> the two out; which one is faster? "You woke me up for that????" There no difference,
> Dummy!"
>
> So I can sure see why Ac2K is BIG trouble.

--
Perth, Western Australia
Tips for MS Access users at:
http://odyssey.apana.org.au/~abrowne

peter walker

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Jan 22, 2001, 2:04:11 AM1/22/01
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I was whinging hatefully to Lyle about A2k nearly 18months ago starting with
the CPP edition. It caused months of anguish and despair. It was only when I
moved to a clean Win2000 and A2k sp1 install on a brand new high end HP
Vectra mean machine that the problems stopped. Compile time on my major app
(an ADP w/- 48k lines / 140 objects) was a maybe 10 seconds.
Prior to that form / module corruption with memory faults was the major
headache. Strangely I have had zero problems for the past 4 months.
I can't explain it. But it's still like a surly but obedient dog. I don't
trust it.
--

peter walker

LZ129: - Don't paint your airship with rocket fuel.
ICQ 85542363
Compuserve 106244,2032
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