I hate Pro/E

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Heywood Jablome

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Mar 26, 1998, 3:00:00 AM3/26/98
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Oh Pro/E!!

How I hate you.

Let me count the ways.

$25,000 software... and it is so primitive in it's interface.

Why the hell do the dimensions jump all over the place?
Why do they jump on top of each other. Obviously the a$$hole$ at PTC
never use their own software.

Why the hell do the views in model mode jump all over the place? Why do
the views change position and scale when I use simplified reps??

Why doesn't it have a model tree in the drawing?

Why does the model tree disappear behind the active screen - EVEN
AFTER I'VE PLACED IT SO IT SHOULDN'T??!

Why doesn't the model tree come back the way I left it the last time??
(stupid..stupid..stupid..stupid..stupid..)

Why doesn't Pro/E allow me to minimize the window and do something else
while a big assembly is loading - like write a bitch letter about how
asinine the Pro/E interface is.

Why does that jackass message window keep popping on top when I don't
want it to?

Why can't I just turn off geometric tolerancing datums in the model
instead of going through this covulated archaic make layer and set the
datum in it process. What a bunch of #@@!%.

Pro/E often doesn't allow me to choose features, axis, planes even
though I'm using query select. The damned thing simply doesn't allow
the selection and it ain't operator error either - it's more Pro/E
crappy user interface.

What about those stupid red and yellow sides of datum planes? When I
choose one it should default to one side - not make me choose one every
time. 90% of the time I could use the default and save a few thousand
menu picks a month. You jerks have NEVER EVER tried to actually use your
own software have you?

Why are there 4 ways to finish a command sequence?
"done/return" "done return" "done" and "done accept" A simple "enter"
would suffice nicely. (pathetic brain dead Unix interface - that's why)

Why can't I plot a screen shot without having the simplified rep name
and the instance name show up on the plot?? Did it ever occur to you
jerks that my client might not appreciate seeing this.... and that I
might not appreciate having to create a separate drawing if I needed a
quick plot. (jackasses)

Why does the grid always come on in sketcher? I rarely use it and it is
truly annoying. Why can't I make a default so it doesn't come on?? Huh?

Somebody could probably come up with a more screwed up way of doing
assemblies, but I don't know how. Why the hell doesn't the part stay put
in the window until I finish constraining it. I have to chase it all
over the screen - or use the equally lame 2 window approach. (what
bullhockey this is)

Why does it take ...FOREVER... to turn a layer on or off if you happen
to have an assembly or assembly drawing open at the same time?? What
rocket science is involved in turning layers on or off? More crap ass
interface problems from sh**birds who don't care.

Why don't wildcards work with search paths to retrieve drawings, models
etc out of the current directory. (lame.. lame.. lame..)

And what pathetic excuses for scrollable windows to search through.
These are some dickhead unix programmer's idea of a windowing interface.

I must say that Pro/E is very slow when the assemblies get large. Why
does Pro/e have to regen every part practically every time I do
something. It is slow on simplified reps, slow on layer operations,
slow on selections, and it hightlights everything every time I make a
selection... why can't it just suppress everything if that is what I
tell it to do, I don't need it to highlight "all". (dumbheads)

Pro/E does things in such a serial (one at a time) manner, internally
and externally. That's why it is so slow with big assemblies and parts.
(bad programming from "don't give a shit" unix programmers)

Try working with simplified reps in large (like real world) assemblies.
See how SLOW this screwball wannabe window interface SOB really is (
and I have HOT hardware). See the model tree slowly repaint itself a
couple of times before you get to start work. Observe how SLOW the menu
picks are. And as an aside,.. see how many time the screen goes dead
for mapkeys forcing you to make menu picks.

Try re-ordering parts in a medium to large assembly. You will age while
waiting.

Why don't you f***heads stay in the unix world completely - leave the NT
world to sombody that gives a s**t and will use the tools.

Wait!.. there's more... but I'm tired of writing.

There are so many archaic, quirkey, time wasting, wierd, things going on
that I could write a book.

Those who say these things aren't true are nothing more than ignorant
shills for PTC.

I can tell you the answer to all of the above. The jerks at PTC have
never sat in front of their own dipshit interface and asked the
question " I am a designer and how best can I quickly do this thing I
need to do?" They don't give a sh**, they are making money.... for
now. Why...because..

...most of the Pro/E users are 8 to 5 drones working at big companies.
They get paid even if it takes all day to produce one bracket. They may
be engineers but they are still drones - otherwise PTC wouldn't be
making so much money off this 1970's looking/acting piece of crap.

I'm not saying anything else is better, just that Pro/E sucks.

Come on SolidWorks, SolidEdge, whoever.. There are vast quantities of
money to be made for the company that finally figures out how to solve
our problems. BUT.... I won't pay more money for more halfbaked, half
done, buggy, half capable (or even 7/8 capable) software. A lot of
other people won't either. You gotta deliver the goods to get the
money.. all of the goods.. in good working order and damned user
friendly too. (and fast).

PS I would rather (and it is more cost effective) pay $20,000 for
quality software that did all that I need, in the way that I need, than
pay $2000 for software that only does 85% and/or doesn't work nicely.
AND.... I really hate paying $24000 plus for hard to use software that
still falls short. (and it crashes too damn often too)


sdd...@umslvma.umsl.edu

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Mar 27, 1998, 3:00:00 AM3/27/98
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In article <351A8703...@xyz.com>,

Heywood Jablome <_hey...@xyz.com> wrote:
>
> Oh Pro/E!!
>
> How I hate you.
>
> Let me count the ways.
>
> $25,000 software... and it is so primitive in it's interface.
>
> Why the hell do the dimensions jump all over the place?
> Why do they jump on top of each other. Obviously the a$$hole$ at PTC
> never use their own software.
>

What a beautiful rant!!! Norm McDonald, watch out!

-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading

Osgood

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Mar 27, 1998, 3:00:00 AM3/27/98
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<<Oh Pro/E!!

How I hate you................................>>

Heywood sounds plenty riled up.

I agree on a couple of points.

PTC never misses a chance to gouge their customers, and the interface is
pretty crude.

Problem is, that there is no real good alternative to Pro/E yet.

SolidWorks is coming on, but not there yet - I don't think.

Folks are saying that SolidWorks is good for 80% of their needs. I sure
wish somebody could (rationally) explain exactly what is missing. And
what if anything does SolidWorks have that Pro/E doesn't.

Joe Dunn... are you there?

O


David Hidding

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Mar 27, 1998, 3:00:00 AM3/27/98
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Osgood <xxx...@xxx.com> wrote in article <351BD281...@xxx.com>...
> <<Oh Pro/E!!
>

> How I hate you................................>>
>
> Heywood sounds plenty riled up.
>


By did this one make me laugh... Osgood gave them hell. On the other hand,
he also said that there's no point is switching unless the new software is
just as capable.

BTW, I just heard from PTC. They have reduced the base price of ProE to
$8,000 list. This is not PT-Toddler, but rather full base ProE. Of course,
how many modules do you have to purchsae to get it up to the level you
need? They just offered a toolmaker I know his entire package...ProE,
Assemblies, Detailing, Manufacturing (ProMold), and Plastic Flow Analysis
(MoldFlow Part Advisor) for $15,000. That's a hell of a deal.

I guess the mid-range guys are taking a big bite! <grin>

Joe Dunne

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Mar 28, 1998, 3:00:00 AM3/28/98
to

Osgood,

SW does not 80% difference in Pro/E. You said it not me.

SolidWorks offers MORE functionality, written with better code, much easier
to use. And it is a lot less expensive too.

When you get down to feature based modeling, parametric relationships,
associativity in the assy, stuff like that. SW superior.

Pro/E does offer extra modules that are not included in SW. Things
Pro/CADAM, or Pro/check.

SW has built in

assy
parts
detailing
family parts
user defeined features
welding
sheet metal
Reports
programming
much of PRo Surfacing


If you require some of the specialized surfacing commands in Pro/Surface
then it may still be a good choice. But considering SW has Multi trajectory
sweep, loft with tangency control, non planer draft and parting line
creation. I think only a few customers still require the extra stuff. And
not for long.

The more accurate comparison, is SW can do 100% of the job for 90% of all
the users out there. Pro/E has some extra, less used stuff that 10% may
still need.

SW does much more for these mainstream users such as drag handles, feature
pallet, drag and drop, feature manager, and more. 90% of the people are far
better off using SW than Pro/E.

So you really have to answer the question for yourself. Try it and put SW
through it's paces. You will be surprised that holds up better than Pro/E.

Joe Dunne
SolidWorks


Joe Dunne

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Mar 28, 1998, 3:00:00 AM3/28/98
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That is

There is not a 80% difference bettween Pro/E and SW.

The Immortal

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Mar 30, 1998, 3:00:00 AM3/30/98
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hey joe... is solidworks written in c++ or a hybrid...? i'd love ti
hear you say that it is written in assembly code... that would make me
truly happy...

kra...@execpc.com

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Apr 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM4/6/98
to

Osgood wrote:
>
> <<Oh Pro/E!!
>
> How I hate you................................>>
>
> Heywood sounds plenty riled up.
>
> I agree on a couple of points.
>
> PTC never misses a chance to gouge their customers, and the interface is
> pretty crude.
>
> Problem is, that there is no real good alternative to Pro/E yet.
>
> SolidWorks is coming on, but not there yet - I don't think.
>
> Folks are saying that SolidWorks is good for 80% of their needs. I sure
> wish somebody could (rationally) explain exactly what is missing. And
> what if anything does SolidWorks have that Pro/E doesn't.
>
> Joe Dunn... are you there?
>
> O
Have you ever tried I-DEAS??? SDRC's Artisan seems strong compared to
SW. What do you think?

Bernard

Mirlizon

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Apr 8, 1998, 3:00:00 AM4/8/98
to

I-deas is an expensive high-end system. Users tend to be large companies or
companies supporting these companies.

Keith Macfadgen

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Apr 8, 1998, 3:00:00 AM4/8/98
to

kra...@execpc.com wrote:

> Have you ever tried I-DEAS??? SDRC's Artisan seems strong compared to
> SW. What do you think?

I am currently trapped on I-Deas. It sucks big time. It's full of bugs
and it even has a built in virus! The company does a poor job of
supporting their software. Working in assemblies bites the big one.

Do yourself a big favor and stick with Solidworks.

--
Keith MacFadgen
Kinetrix, Inc. - A Teradyne Company http://www.kinetrix.com
33 Constitution Drive
Bedford, NH 03110
Phone# (603)471-1338
E-mail keith.m...@kmx.teradyne.com

Keith Macfadgen

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Apr 9, 1998, 3:00:00 AM4/9/98
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Keith Macfadgen wrote:
>
> kra...@execpc.com wrote:
>
> > Have you ever tried I-DEAS??? SDRC's Artisan seems strong compared to
> > SW. What do you think?
>
> I am currently trapped on I-Deas. It sucks big time. It's full of bugs
> and it even has a built in virus! The company does a poor job of
> supporting their software. Working in assemblies bites the big one.
>
> Do yourself a big favor and stick with Solidworks.


>Keith,
>
>Your wording is a bit strong. Sorry to hear you are "trapped". My
>experience has been extremely good with I-DEAS. Sometimes it gets like
>religeon or favorite car brands. I'm looking to understand the
>"theological" differences.
>
>I-DEAS has the capabilities of SW in assembly, plus other features w
>which
>permit different types of assembly management. What in particular has
>bitten you, that makes SW better? Or did you mean to say SW assemblies
>has bitten you?

Yes, I meant trapped. We have complete 2 projects on Master Series.
These progects have been a nightmare because of all the shortcomings
in I-deas. The SDRC people are religious toward the I-Deas product but
to compare CAD packages like car brands is a poor way to compare
products that have totally different phlosophies.

Here are some of the major drawbacks to I-Deas:

Bugs and viruses run rampant in the spagetti code. It often takes SDRC
years to deal with major bugs. There are some bugs that have been
know for well over 5 years but they continue to offer workarounds as
good modeling practice. If you don't believe me on this just go
to the ICCON archive mailing lists and see all the complaints and
frutrations with this sloppy product.

Assemblies are cumbersome to work with because I-Deas sucks when it
comes to constraining. In fact, constraining is so bad that SDRC
suggests that you don't even use constraints unless you really need
to.

The icon panel is confusing and loaded with hidden commands that can
cripple a new user.

The software crashes all the time. I'm talking at least once a day.
What makes matters worse is that it's virtually impossible to trace
the reason for the crashes (most of the time).

The tools they provide for troubleshooting are next to useless.

They don't even have a good solution for detailing. I hear how wonder-
ful thier drafting package is but you can't even create broken views
or jog leader lines. The worse part is that drafting is done in a
seperate CAD package that has a totally different icon panel with
totally different commands. Not to mention how accociativity between
drafting and the solid ar suspect most of the time.

Modifying features in I-Deas can be (and usually is) a task that is
left for the experienced user. Most of the time it's easier to delete
you work and start over. In fact, that is the solution designed into
I-Deas for many things (constriants for instance).

Sorry I have to stop raving and get to work. I can't wait for the
company to start the next project. Which by the way we are going to
do on a package other than SDRC I-Deas Master Series so that we can
get our work done quickly and correctly.

Vincent Ming Lieu

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Apr 9, 1998, 3:00:00 AM4/9/98
to

Our company is evaluating Artisan and I was assigned to test it on my
workstation. After working with Artisan for a while, I discovered that it is
not as user friendly as SolidWorks. Simple tasks such as creating work
planes, history tree operation, protrusion and cut operation, copying and
mirroring features, and editing sketches are so difficult to do as compare
to SolidWorks. It does not even have weldment features in the assembly like
SolidWorks. Another scary thing about Artisan is its model file system. It
uses one single design file called Model File to store a whole assembly
including its components and drawings, which is very inefficient if you have
a large assembly (300-1000 parts). You can not cross-reference
sub-assemblies and components between Model Files. This will force you to
put everything in one file in order to have a full associatively between
your models. Despite all the shortcomings I have discovered, it does have
some cool things. Its sketcher is really cool. It intelligently tracks your
design intention as you sketch. It will also display geometric relationship
symbols on the sketch that labels all the current constraints. Artisan has a
mechanism analysis module included in the base package that allows you to do
some assembly study and analysis without paying extra for a separate package
like Working Model for SolidWorks. I think SDRC needs to revamp Artisan’s
GUI before it can complete with SolidWorks. I welcome any comments on this.

Best regards,

VML

Keith Macfadgen wrote in message <352CC0...@kmx.teradyne.com>...

Kris Oxley

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May 2, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/2/98
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Solid Edge is easier to use than both Pro/E and Solid Works. This has been
proven time and time again.

Take a look at it.

http://www.solid-edge.com

________________________________________________________________________
The Immortal wrote in message <351f457e...@news2.cts.com>...

Joe Dunne

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May 3, 1998, 3:00:00 AM5/3/98
to

Kris,

You sell SolidEdge. Thus this is your biased opinion. I on the other hand
have found quite the opposite. Of course this is my biased opinion.

Facts are that both products are very easy to use. And that SW has far more
functionality.

Sincerely,

Joe Dunne
SolidWorks


Kris Oxley wrote in message
<247713217C802A9B.6B5A71DA...@library-proxy.airnews.ne
t>...

ecea...@gmail.com

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Mar 27, 2014, 3:51:10 PM3/27/14
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Nothing compares to the functionality and performance on NX. The Superman of CAD packages

gir...@gmail.com

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Feb 3, 2016, 6:11:01 PM2/3/16
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I'm experienced in Catia V4 & V5, Inventor, Solidworks, Pro-E Wildfire and Creo. Hell, I've even good at the native modeling programs within CFD & FEA solvers like CD-Adapco's Star-CCM+ and Ansys. I can easily say that Pro-E is BY FAR the worst out of the bunch. All of the others, it takes me roughly 30 minutes to remember the individual quirks and pick it back up. Coincidentally, that is the same amount of time it takes Pro-E to p*ss me off to the point I'm ready to put my fist through the monitor.

Next job interview, my first question will be do you use Lotus Notes? (ya, can you believe it's still around? The company I'm at stills tries to use it. I feel like I'm in the 90's every time I get an email, and that I should run over and check for faxes.)

The second will be do you use Pro-E?
If either answer is a yes, the interview is over.

dieorf...@gmail.com

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May 5, 2016, 1:50:12 PM5/5/16
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PTC Creo is a s/w 20 years out of date and past its prime. What CAD package grinds an engineer to the point of frustration that you want to drop kick your laptop/ desk top out the office window.
What CAD still has legacy UNIX written in the code.
What CAD package takes 6 months to master the basic command structure, will causing a 75% drop in productivity for a company.
What CAD package requires monster clicks to do simple things, 3 mouse click for a dimensioning?

PTC Creo 3.0 is a CAD s/w someone pulled out of a 1990's time capsule

aberl...@gmail.com

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Feb 10, 2017, 6:57:58 PM2/10/17
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Spot on!!! i hate creo so so much

David Lee

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Feb 12, 2017, 1:44:22 PM2/12/17
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universal...@gmail.com

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Feb 19, 2018, 2:23:33 PM2/19/18
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On Thursday, May 5, 2016 at 1:50:12 PM UTC-4, dieorf...@gmail.com wrote:
I think its hilarious that the first post on this is from '98 and most of the things the OP points out are still a problem...

Solidworks has come such a long way, I'm so proud of them.
Meanwhile... Pro/E Creo is just as bad as ever...
It really is as if the people at PTC NEVER use their own software!
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