Catia Kernel scare or Pro Engineer salesman propoganda
DStuart539
After Explaining to a Pro E salesman why I was switching to Solidworks.
Had him suggesting to me that the future of Solidworks is in Question because
Catia was Pulling the use of there Kernel which solidworks was designed around.
It would be ashame to switch to a program that would have no future uopgrades.
Is this known to be of concern by anyone other than Pro E sales trash.
These are thing I know nothing about.
Is the sky falling?
Don
Brian Morgan
Don, do you suppose that Dassault would notify a PTC rep of their development
intentions, but not their customers? Why in the world would you believe a PTC
salesman who claims internal, confidential knowledge of a competitor?
Brian
Gary Strahinic
authored / supported / sold by Shape Data, a Unigraphics Solutions Company.
Dassault has nothing to do with it.
Did the PTC guy also tell you Solid Works was written in Cobol?
Kurt Pennington
Unigraphics, not Catia. Maybe what he meant to say, was that SW was going
to switch to a different kernal, in other words, to the same kernal Catia is
currently using?
Who knows?
DStuart539 wrote in message
<19990722133935...@ng-cg1.aol.com>...
bill mce
warning of a possible new infectious disease. It is possibly the first such
warring being connected to a CAD system. Apparently large numbers of CAD
systems administrators/executives are developing sore hip joints and
hemorrhoids. The preliminary epidemiological evidence compiled to date
suggests that a strong relationship exists between the afflicted CAD workers
and the CAD system Pro/E developed by Parametric Technologies Corp of
Waltham Mass. Apparently, the affliction manifests itself after several
visits by PTC Sales representatives. The center is quite sure the disease is
transmitted by airborne contact as few handshakes were reported. Another
interesting side effect is that many of the Company's employing the
afflicted individuals are experiencing very high CAD system expenditures,
reduced profitability and high employee turnover. It has also been reported
that the frequency of the incidences of the disease, now known as
cadproscrewinitis,has risen sharply since PTC announced that its license
revenue has dropped nearly $10 million over the same period last year.
Interestingly enough the researchers at CDC have determined that the
incidences may now start to grow much more rapidly. The researchers
dissected the financial statement of PTC and determined that $25 million of
reported revenue of $132 million was actually for a different software
system called Winchill. Thus, the drop in Pro/E license revenue was actually
closer to $35 million over the same period last year. This discovery has led
the researchers to issue an occupational health and safety warning to CAD
individuals at risk, namely those who currently own Pro/E licenses. It was
also noted by the researchers that if the current trends continue the
disease will be self extinguishing and should pose a much reduced
significant health risk in a few years. The CDC is also considering issuing
a similar health warning to the vast majority of unknowing investors who
have recently lost $2/share on PTC stock.
In related news, the New England Journal of Software Medicine reported today
the an emerging cure for cadproscewinitis is a program called SolidWorks.
The reported study indicated that quick and sudden cures for
cadproscrewinitis had been reported in the vast majority of cases where the
medicine has been applied. In addition it was also reported that large
increases in corporate productivity at the cure sites was also experienced
much lower CAD system expenditures, higher profitability and reduced
employee turnover. It was recommended by the researchers involved that the
study sample size be increased immediately due to the large benefits to
health and the economy.
Paul Salvador
Greg Jankowski
Greg Jankowski
DStuart539 <dstua...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19990722133935...@ng-cg1.aol.com...
Gary Morgan
This is really pathetic!
We've dealt with sales folks from both PTC and SW and never found
either of them to be anything but totally professional.
You should put your complaint in writing and send it to PTC. I'm sure
they don't condone that type of sales tactic.
Robert Berger
Pro Engineer user exhuasted by pro E support and Maintaince problems.
>After Explaining to a Pro E salesman why I was switching to Solidworks.
>Had him suggesting to me that the future of Solidworks is in Question because
>Catia was Pulling the use of there Kernel which solidworks was designed around.
>It would be ashame to switch to a program that would have no future uopgrades.
It is true that by Solidworks using Parasolid, Dassault Systemes is seriously contributing to the proliferation of Parasolid among the CAD/CAE and CAM markets. Creating a Parasolid "standard" is at the core of UG Solutions strategy to make Unigraphics the premier enterprise package.
The edge of interoperability with 3rd party packages gives Unigraphics an advantage over Dassault's enterprise package (and cash cow) Catia. Dassault is aware of this and cannot be happy about contributing to their competitor's success. The Pro/E guy was probably saying this as a scare tactic, but Dassault does have a long term business problem that needs to be resolved.
:-)
Robert Berger
Hans Nygaard
Simply disregard all the rest of their blabber.
Hans
DStuart539 wrote:
> Pro Engineer user exhuasted by pro E support and Maintaince problems.
> After Explaining to a Pro E salesman why I was switching to Solidworks.
> Had him suggesting to me that the future of Solidworks is in Question because
> Catia was Pulling the use of there Kernel which solidworks was designed around.
> It would be ashame to switch to a program that would have no future uopgrades.
>
Trevor D'Arcy-Evans
>have recently lost $2/share on PTC stock.
going to be some class action against PTC by disgruntled investors?
Kind regards
Trevor D'Arcy-Evans
trev...@DivingMagpie.com.au
http://www.DivingMagpie.com.au
- high quality addins for SolidWorks
Sporkman
1) The check's in the mail.
2) Of course, I'll respect you in the morning.
3) I'm from the Federal Government, and I'm here to help you. AND (last but not
least)
4) I'm a software salesman and __________ (anything you want to put in the blank).
Robert Heininger
>Did the PTC guy also tell you Solid Works was written in Cobol?
Real programmers write windows applications with debug. 8-O
Robert
Gary Strahinic
A: One's a scum-sucking bottom feeder; the other is a fish.
John Gehman
...hehehehe... Most folks today don't know about debug. And
assembler is for pansy bedwetters that can't count on all 16 fingers.
cheers,
--
John Gehman
SDRC Ford Program Office
Allen Park, MI 48101
Robert Heininger
==========================
=========================
hehe. . . .
John,
It's ironic your post is 16 lines long. It must of been a Freudian
slip. Kind of like your subconscious reminding you of the humble
beginnings or something. :-)
Robert Heininger
Lou Bruce
had decided to go with SolidWorks. It doesn't surprise me that A Slo-E
salesman would do this. The reps that I have dealt with were very agressive
and caustic. Anyway that was almost two years ago and I'm happy with my
decision. I'm eagerly awaiting the release of 99.
Lou
DStuart539 wrote in message
<19990722133935...@ng-cg1.aol.com>...
kellne...@my-deja.com
dstua...@aol.com (DStuart539) wrote:
...clip
>
> Is the sky falling?
> Don
>
Did the PTC rep mention that PTC has acquired a product that uses the
parasolid kernel same as SW, SE etc. or that the Chief Software Engineer
at SW came from PTC? I think not.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
Robert Berger
Pro/Desktop (DesignWave) no longer exclusively uses the Parasolid modeling
kernel. Many of the newer modeling routines are using PTC's Pro/E kernel.
I suspect as new version come out, you will see a further migration in this
direction. If Pro/Desktop has any future at all, it will be in the context
of being a scaleable solution for Pro/E.
:-)
Robert Berger
Johnathen Lieber
Robert Berger <rlber...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:379C4646...@earthlink.net...
fkelka
not to start a flame war, but
Johnathen Lieber wrote:
> Then it becomes another Pro/Jr - PT/Modeler - GONE :)
it is not gone, it is upgraded to Pro/ENGINEER Foundation,
Pro/Jr was targeted against the huge advertising compaign from AutoDESK, trying
to sell MDT.
Pro/Jr was a success, just stripping functionality of Pro/E, then selling in the
low end market.
times changes, low/middle CAD systems getting more functionality, so PT/MODELLER
was
upgraded to Pro/ENGINEER Foundation.
And still, Pro/ENGINEER Foundation is still more powerfull than MDT
mfg
Frank Kelka
Johnathen Lieber
Either way, you are still left with the original Pro/E package, Wether it is
Pro/Foundation or Pro/E.
Which leaves me with the question and quote: Question: What exactly would
the difference between Pro/Foundation and Pro/E? Modules?
Quote (by a recent pro/e to sw convert when asked my question): "The way I
look at pt/m, pro/f and pro/e is like the car market. A
Mercury/Lincoln/Ford is a Ford, made by ford and sold by Ford..... One just
looks better than the other...."
fkelka <fke...@ptc.com> wrote in message news:379C81C8...@ptc.com...
Ramon Busboom
CATIA. It's using the Parasolid kernal which I believe Unigraphics owns.
So how can CATIA pull there kernal?
DStuart539 <dstua...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19990722133935...@ng-cg1.aol.com...
> Pro Engineer user exhuasted by pro E support and Maintaince problems.
> After Explaining to a Pro E salesman why I was switching to Solidworks.
> Had him suggesting to me that the future of Solidworks is in Question
because
> Catia was Pulling the use of there Kernel which solidworks was designed
around.
> It would be ashame to switch to a program that would have no future
uopgrades.
>
>
> Is this known to be of concern by anyone other than Pro E sales trash.
> These are thing I know nothing about.
>
Robert Berger
The word is KERNEL not KERNAL...
:-)
Robert Berger
Jon Banquer
Okay !
Then I'll have 1 bucket of extra crispy, 1 bucket of original receipt and
1 bucket of honey barbecue. Oh, one more thing....so I can get some actual
nutrition, give me the "SaladWorks" that Robert Heininger is always talking
about.
jon
Jon Banquer
Ops, change receipt to recipe.
jon
J.P.Seebo
Since you are using OE5, there is a neat tool on the Message menu called
"Cancel Message" just in case you make on of those little typo boo boo's.
Jeff
Jon Banquer <jbt...@mpinet.net> wrote in message
news:L%8n3.333$pg4....@typ11.nn.bcandid.com...
fkelka
> Which leaves me with the question and quote: Question: What exactly would
> the difference between Pro/Foundation and Pro/E? Modules?
At least, there is no Pro/Foundation.
There is only Pro/ENGINEER Package Foundation, which contains 15 modules.
> Quote (by a recent pro/e to sw convert when asked my question): "The way I
> look at pt/m, pro/f and pro/e is like the car market. A
And again there is no PT/Modeller (but there was one in the past), pro/f was
never a product.
> Mercury/Lincoln/Ford is a Ford, made by ford and sold by Ford..... One just
> looks better than the other...."
not a good example.
If you buy Pro/ENGINEER you have the kernel, all other modules are optional,
giving you additional functionality.
So the different modules are not other types of cars, all are the same car.
If you compare it to SW, like the gold logo partners, adding NC or FEM
functionality by buying an additional integrated product.
With Pro/E you buying an additional module, so the softwaremanufacturer is the
same, so you have
a better integration.
The advantage is, you can buy additional functinality without changing the car.
mfg
Frank Kelka
D. Short
either... just add-in the "module".
I see a huge benefits with the freedom to choose solutions from other vendors in
contrast to going with the "one stop shop" approach... One being simply the freedom
to choose, others being on the lines of competition breeds better solutions. There
are quite a few Gold Partner programs offering solutions from Analysis to CAM to
PDM... They're very nicely done too.
I believe PTC offers a few 3rd party integrated solutions, how well they're
actually integrated, I don't know.... Some companies tout "Integration" as just
another menu... That's not integration (imho).... that's adding a menu pick that
invokes a program.
SolidWorks also offers a few of their own in-house add-ins as well such as
PhotoWorks, FeatureWorks, and SolidWorks Piping.
fkelka wrote:
> Hello Johnaten,
>
> <snip>
>
> If you compare it to SW, like the gold logo partners, adding NC or FEM
> functionality by buying an additional integrated product.
> With Pro/E you buying an additional module, so the softwaremanufacturer is the
> same, so you have
> a better integration.
>
> The advantage is, you can buy additional functinality without changing the car.
>
> mfg
>
> Frank Kelka
--
David Short
__________________________________________________________________
admin@loopback $LOGIN@localhost $LOGNAME@localhost $USER@localhost
$USER@$HOST -h1024@localhost ro...@mailloop.com
Johnathen Lieber
a little more sense...
The only reason I mentioned Pro/Foundation is because that is the way PTC
was marketing it on their web page. As far as modules go. I like choice,
having been a ptc reseller from the days of Pro/Jr. I have a little
understanding of the whole module concept and again I like choice. And I'm
cheap, I like my CAM software, some of my customers like seeing their
product as a CAD file not a printed picture. Though pro has that on
advantage, photorendering included in its base package.
And I cannot stand getting a file from someone and seeing: This file
contains features that cannot be modified with your package, please contact
your sales representative. (not verbatim but you get the point).
Joe Dunne has done an good job with getting us several vendors per
application (add-on/third party/whatever) for us to choose from. Just like
when I go to the grocery store to buy an apple, I like choice.
Johnathen
PS: I'm going offline in this thread as I feel I am getting to personal and
it could easily turn into a flame ware which I'm sure both of us don't want.
Again, I like choices, and I like SW and you like Pro....
fkelka <fke...@ptc.com> wrote in message news:379D5624...@ptc.com...
> Hello Johnaten,
>
>
> > Which leaves me with the question and quote: Question: What exactly
would
> > the difference between Pro/Foundation and Pro/E? Modules?
>
> At least, there is no Pro/Foundation.
> There is only Pro/ENGINEER Package Foundation, which contains 15 modules.
>
> > Quote (by a recent pro/e to sw convert when asked my question): "The
way I
> > look at pt/m, pro/f and pro/e is like the car market. A
>
> And again there is no PT/Modeller (but there was one in the past), pro/f
was
> never a product.
>
> > Mercury/Lincoln/Ford is a Ford, made by ford and sold by Ford..... One
just
> > looks better than the other...."
>
> not a good example.
> If you buy Pro/ENGINEER you have the kernel, all other modules are
optional,
> giving you additional functionality.
> So the different modules are not other types of cars, all are the same
car.
>
fkelka
> The only reason I mentioned Pro/Foundation is because that is the way PTC
> was marketing it on their web page. As far as modules go. I like choice,
> having been a ptc reseller from the days of Pro/Jr. I have a little
> understanding of the whole module concept and again I like choice. And I'm
> cheap, I like my CAM software, some of my customers like seeing their
> product as a CAD file not a printed picture. Though pro has that on
> advantage, photorendering included in its base package.
>
> And I cannot stand getting a file from someone and seeing: This file
> contains features that cannot be modified with your package, please contact
> your sales representative. (not verbatim but you get the point).
BUT, you can read the file, make the drawing and so on.
please explain me, what happen in SW, if i had a gold logo partner CAM
applikation,
design the tools patch and the whole CAM stuff and forward these
file to a differnt company:
first question: the company has no CAM tools, only SW native, could they change
the CAM stuff?
second questions: the company has a different gold logo partner CAM application,
could they change the CAM stuff?
waiting for the answers.............
mfg
Frank Kelka
J.P.Seebo
as hot without the chemical taste. Have you tried the "Insanity Salsa" or
his "Insanity Seafood" sauce?
Jeff
Robert Heininger <mong...@iinc.com> wrote in message
news:37a16589...@news.iinc.com...
> It's not KERNEL or KERNAL. . it's COLONEL!
>
> Toss the Saladworks (pun intended), and get me a 2 dozen wings / hot /
> with a bowl of Dave's Insanity Sauce on the side for dippin'. Nuthin'
> like good 'ol hometown cuisine. :-)
>
> Robert Heininger
2good...@my-deja.com
I'm sure you have something to say that is informative, but I can't
understand one word your saying. It must be a PTC thing?
"...please explain me, what happen in SW, if i had a gold logo partner
CAM applikation,
design the tools patch and the whole CAM stuff and forward these file
to a differnt company:
first question: the company has no CAM tools, only SW native, could
they change the CAM stuff?
second questions: the company has a different gold logo partner CAM
application, could they change the CAM stuff?
waiting for the answers.............
mfg
Frank Kelka"
2good2btrue
Dennis
instead of animals:
a) it avoids problems with PETA and otheer animal rights groups
b) there are some things a rat just won't do.
Dennis
Gary Strahinic <gstr...@ugsolutions.com> wrote in message
news:37989D1B...@ugsolutions.com...
Stan Ogdan
Hans Nygaard <ha...@not.inova-as.dk> wrote in message
news:37981574...@not.inova-as.dk...
> The only valid information you can get from a Pro/E salesperson is a
pricequote.
> Simply disregard all the rest of their blabber.
>
> Hans
>
> DStuart539 wrote:
>
David Lowe
Dassault did buy Solidworks for $350 million at a time when it had only sold
$50 worth of software.
The main developers of Solidworks have moved over to Dassault on the Catia 5
project team.
The rumours are that Dassault will sell Solidworks or float it.
Either way the purchase was a vehicle for Catia 5, nothing else.
Solidworks is only sold through resellers who get 30% to 40% margin.
SW costs $4,000 approx
SW makes $2,500 per seat sold
SW sell 10,000 seats per year = $25 million per year new software revenue.
They pay Unigraphics for the Parasolid kernel.
SW only uses 3rd party add on modules
SW use the Unigraphics Solidedge kernel - Parasolid
Make your own conclusions.
Personally I would only consider the major systems UG, Catia, Pro/E and
SDRC.
Stan Ogdan <og...@associate-it.zzn.com> wrote in message
news:kuCv3.7731$dr6.1...@news1.rdc2.on.home.com...
Robert Berger
David,
You are bit off in your facts...
Unigraphics own the Parasolid Kernel not Dassault (Catia)
Dassault did buy Solidworks for $350 million at a time when it had only sold
$50 worth of software.
The main developers of Solidworks have moved over to Dassault on the Catia 5
project team.
The rumours are that Dassault will sell Solidworks or float it.
Either way the purchase was a vehicle for Catia 5, nothing else.Solidworks is only sold through resellers who get 30% to 40% margin.
SW costs $4,000 approx
SW makes $2,500 per seat sold
SW sell 10,000 seats per year = $25 million per year new software revenue.
They pay Unigraphics for the Parasolid kernel.
SW only uses 3rd party add on modules
SW use the Unigraphics Solidedge kernel - Parasolid
Make your own conclusions.Personally I would only consider the major systems UG, Catia, Pro/E and
SDRC.
For the Past two years Solidworks has been selling at a rate of approximately 16,000 seats per year. Resellers usually take 40% to 45% of the gross sale. You also have not considered the service contract revenues, which are substantial. Last year, Solidworks revenue was over $50,000,000. Recommending Solidworks or any of the enterprise systems that you site really depends on the needs of the company. For many comapnies, Solidworks is an excellent decision (See Joe...and you didn't think that I had it in me!).
:-)
Robert Berger