TCP/IP for 8051 or Atmel AVR
CntDwn2000
Atmel AVR or similar processor. I need true TCP/IP running on the target and
would prefer not to use a hardware solution or software that requires a
gateway. Any suggestions?
TIA
Charley
Mark A. Odell
<20000628112557...@ng-fa1.aol.com>:
CMX.
--
- Mark
Replace email username with my first name if you need to email me.
Above all, try to be more like me - it makes me feel validated.
D. Cook
First off, do you need TCP/IP or will UDP suffice? UDP is FAR easier to
implement on a small device then TCP/IP.
I have implemented UDP on an XA, not too tough with a packet sniffer. I
would never even try on a true 8051, but of course, after being spoiled with
an AVR 103, I won't use an 8051 again if I can avoid it.
You might look at http://liquorice.sourceforge.net/
I have not played with it myself, but he is trying to do true TCP/IP I
believe.
Another good place to look is http://www.embeddedethernet.com/.
He claims to have AVR->Ethernet running. One note, it keeps claiming to be
TCP/IP. This has been the source of great confusing. My understanding
(after having looked at the PIC code) is that it is only UDP. There is a
BIG difference.
-- Devin
"CntDwn2000" <cntdw...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000628112557...@ng-fa1.aol.com...
Bill Giovino
See
http://Microcontroller.com/microcontrollers/news/D_cmx/ei010225cmx_micronet.htm
-Bill Giovino
http://Microcontroller.com
tri...@my-deja.com
> CMX makes probably the best TCP/IP stack for an 8051.
>
I've priced their solution... $5500 for MicroNET, add another $1500 for
a web server, and another $1000 if you want to support PPP.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
tom...@hotmail.com
free but at a pretty high cost. You might want to check out
http://www.rabbitsemiconductor.com . They have a kit for $199.00. I
haven't used it, but it is within a low cost range. I'm also looking
into Embedded Intenet devices. There is one site http://www.mycal.com
that uses a S7600 (formerly, iChip). This has the protocol for tcp/ip
within and attaches directly to the 8-bit microcontroller.
Hope this helps.
In article <395A4AF3...@nospam-microcontroller.com>,
Bill Giovino <edi...@nospam-microcontroller.com> wrote:
> CMX makes probably the best TCP/IP stack for an 8051.
>
> See
>
http://Microcontroller.com/microcontrollers/news/D_cmx/ei010225cmx_micro
net.htm
>
> -Bill Giovino
> http://Microcontroller.com
>
> CntDwn2000 wrote:
> >
> > I am working on a project in which the processor will be either an
8051 or
> > Atmel AVR or similar processor. I need true TCP/IP running on the
target and
> > would prefer not to use a hardware solution or software that
requires a
> > gateway. Any suggestions?
> >
> > TIA
> >
> > Charley
>
tri...@my-deja.com
> that uses a S7600 (formerly, iChip). This has the protocol for tcp/ip
> within and attaches directly to the 8-bit microcontroller.
I looked at this chip as well, but from their FAQ I see that it is
focused toward PPP, not Ethernet. I am currently waiting for a Rabbit
2000 TCP/IP Development Kit to arrive, we'll see how that performs.
Mark A. Odell
>
>> that uses a S7600 (formerly, iChip). This has the protocol for tcp/ip
>> within and attaches directly to the 8-bit microcontroller.
>
>I looked at this chip as well, but from their FAQ I see that it is
>focused toward PPP, not Ethernet. I am currently waiting for a Rabbit
>2000 TCP/IP Development Kit to arrive, we'll see how that performs.
http://www.rabbitsemiconductor.com/tcpip_devkit.html
Shows a 10BaseT setup, try this.
Jim Granville
>
> I am working on a project in which the processor will be either an 8051 or
> Atmel AVR or similar processor. I need true TCP/IP running on the target and
> would prefer not to use a hardware solution or software that requires a
> gateway. Any suggestions?
Look at this site :
http://www.ibutton.com/TINI/index.html
They have a PCB with Ethernet and TCP/IP running on a TurboC51
( Dallas 80C390 Core ).
We have heard from some customers trialing this system, that it
looks promising.
- jg
--
======= 80x51 Tools & IP Specialists =========
= Want to work smarter than C ?
= http://www.DesignTools.co.nz/modbench.htm
= http://www.DesignTools.co.nz
chuc...@my-deja.com
cntdw...@aol.com (CntDwn2000) wrote:
> I am working on a project in which the processor will be either an 8051 or
> Atmel AVR or similar processor. I need true TCP/IP running on the target and
> would prefer not to use a hardware solution or software that requires a
> gateway. Any suggestions?
>
>
> Charley
CMX offers a TCP/IP stack called CMX-MicroNet that supports the 8051, Atmel
AVR, Infineon 80C16x, and Hitachi H8S or H8/300H. The Zilog
Z180 and Philips XA are also coming soon. It offers TCP, UDP, IP, PPP,
SLIP, HTTP Web Server, and more. Ethernet is also coming in the next few
weeks. Our website is: http://www.cmx.com.
Kind Regards,
Chuck Behrmann
chuc...@my-deja.com
cntdw...@aol.com (CntDwn2000) wrote:
> I am working on a project in which the processor will be either an 8051 or
> Atmel AVR or similar processor. I need true TCP/IP running on the target and
> would prefer not to use a hardware solution or software that requires a
> gateway. Any suggestions?
>
> TIA
>
> Charley
CMX offers a TCP/IP stack called CMX-MicroNet that supports the 8051, Atmel
AVR, Infineon 80C16x, and Hitachi H8S or H8/300H. The Zilog
Z180 and Philips XA are also coming soon. It offers TCP, UDP, IP, PPP,
SLIP, HTTP Web Server, and more. Ethernet is also coming in the next few
weeks. Our website is: http://www.cmx.com.
It is a more cost effective then buying chips that have TCP/IP built in to
them, such as the S7600 (formerly iChip), since that must be added to every
board of course and increases your hardware cost.
Also it is not tied to any one particular chip vendor, which makes it very
attractive versus chips like the rabbit semiconductor solution.
chuc...@my-deja.com
Atmel AVR, Infineon 80C16x, and Hitachi H8S or H8/300H. The Zilog
Z180 and Philips XA are also coming soon. It offers TCP, UDP, IP, PPP,
SLIP, HTTP Web Server, and more. Ethernet is also coming in the next
few weeks. Our website is: http://www.cmx.com.
It is more cost effective then buying chips that have TCP/IP built in to
them, such as the S7600 (formerly iChip), since that must be added to
every board of course and increases your hardware cost.
Also it is not tied to any one particular chip vendor, which makes it
very attractive versus chips like the rabbit semiconductor solution.
Regards,
Chuck Behrmann
In article <20000628112557...@ng-fa1.aol.com>,
cntdw...@aol.com (CntDwn2000) wrote:
> I am working on a project in which the processor will be either an
8051 or
> Atmel AVR or similar processor. I need true TCP/IP running on the
target and
> would prefer not to use a hardware solution or software that requires
a
> gateway. Any suggestions?
>
> TIA
>
> Charley
>
Mark A. Odell
>
>
>> CMX makes probably the best TCP/IP stack for an 8051.
>>
>
>I've priced their solution... $5500 for MicroNET, add another $1500 for
>a web server, and another $1000 if you want to support PPP.
>
>
>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>Before you buy.
What's your point? If you're going to sell a product and make money,
this goes into the NRE of the project. If this is too much for you expected
revenue. Don't do the project. If it is for a hobbie, then yes, this would be
pricey.
Rickman
>
> In article <20000628112557...@ng-fa1.aol.com>,
> cntdw...@aol.com (CntDwn2000) wrote:
> > I am working on a project in which the processor will be either an 8051 or
> > Atmel AVR or similar processor. I need true TCP/IP running on the target and
> > would prefer not to use a hardware solution or software that requires a
> > gateway. Any suggestions?
> >
> > TIA
> >
> > Charley
>
> AVR, Infineon 80C16x, and Hitachi H8S or H8/300H. The Zilog
> Z180 and Philips XA are also coming soon. It offers TCP, UDP, IP, PPP,
> SLIP, HTTP Web Server, and more. Ethernet is also coming in the next few
> weeks. Our website is: http://www.cmx.com.
>
>
> Chuck Behrmann
Maybe I am a little confused, but what do you mean when you say you have
TCP/IP, but Ethernet is "coming" soon. I thought that Ethernet was a
hardware medium and TCP/IP were layers on top. Are you saying that you
are bringing out hardware products?
--
Rick Collins
rick.c...@XYarius.com
Ignore the reply address. To email me use the above address with the XY
removed.
Arius - A Signal Processing Solutions Company
Specializing in DSP and FPGA design
Arius
4 King Ave
Frederick, MD 21701-3110
301-682-7772 Voice
301-682-7666 FAX
Internet URL http://www.arius.com
chuc...@my-deja.com
Hi Rick,
TCP/IP is not required to use Ethernet for a physical connection. There
are many other physical connections, such as point to point (serial
connection with/without modems), Wireless, etc. TCP, IP, UDP are all
protocols (defined with RFCs).
Rickman
That is all true, but what do you mean when you say you are coming out
with "Ethernet"? Are you making hardware or what???
chuc...@my-deja.com
Hi Rick,
Sorry I did not answer your question properly the first time. That will
teach me to answer something at 6:30 AM when drinking my first cup of
coffee.
Now for your answer. We are working with a number of target boards with
processors such as 8051, AVR, 16x, etc. that will have a Ethernet
chip (in most cases mounted on a daughter bd.) and we will be writing
the respective driver for that particular Ethernet chip and hardware
interface. In some cases we will be selling these boards and in others,
it will be a specific vendor that made the particular board.
Hope this helps.
Norman Rogers
includes a microprocessor board with ethernet interface, a C compiler and a
complete TCP/IP and Internet connectivity package with full source and royality
free.
Norm Rogers
Bill Giovino wrote:
> CMX makes probably the best TCP/IP stack for an 8051.
>
> See
> http://Microcontroller.com/microcontrollers/news/D_cmx/ei010225cmx_micronet.htm
>
> -Bill Giovino
> http://Microcontroller.com
Bill Giovino
useful for serving static pages, but it won't let you do anything at all
interactive (see
http://Microcontroller.com/Learn-Embedded/embedded_internet/browser_pages_forms.htm
for an important example). to really do anything useful in your embedded
internet application you need to support an HTTP POST. CMX, US Software,
ATI, and others support this (also uCos). Cheaper solutions like the
iChip and iPIC do not, which makes them little more than embedded
document delivery systems.
HTTP POST allows you to send data (like from a form) to a routine in
program memory (like a CGI), that can then affect the processor and
maybe control an external system.
In the cases of CMX and US Software you are paying for all of the
optimization that went into making a functional stack that fits in a
minimal of on-chip memory.
In a conversation I had with Rabbit Semiconductor I confirmed that they
do support an HTTP POST. Rabbit's stack has probably the best price per
feature than I've seen, but you can't compare it to CMX. For more on
Rabbit Semiconductor's stack see
http://Microcontroller.com/microcontrollers/news/ei_Rabbit/ei100616rab_tcpip.htm.
The CMX stack is made for an 8051 with very limited internal memory, so
it is an excellent compromise of features given the limited code
footprint. It is targeted for systems with a very small physical size.
Rabbit's stack is for use with the Rabbit processor that uses external
memory, so, you can easily add the memory you need to support the stack.
It is targeted for more higher-performance systems.
The best stack and toolsuite is the NETsilicon implementation. At
$9,000, it better be the best...
They are all excellent implementations, but for completely different
embedded internet applications.
-Bill Giovino
http://Microcontroller.com
tom...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> There is a cost to factor in...CMX is quite expensive. It is royalty
> free but at a pretty high cost. You might want to check out
> http://www.rabbitsemiconductor.com . They have a kit for $199.00. I
> haven't used it, but it is within a low cost range. I'm also looking
> into Embedded Intenet devices. There is one site http://www.mycal.com
> that uses a S7600 (formerly, iChip). This has the protocol for tcp/ip
> within and attaches directly to the 8-bit microcontroller.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> In article <395A4AF3...@nospam-microcontroller.com>,
> Bill Giovino <edi...@nospam-microcontroller.com> wrote:
> > CMX makes probably the best TCP/IP stack for an 8051.
> >
> > See
> >
> http://Microcontroller.com/microcontrollers/news/D_cmx/ei010225cmx_micro
> net.htm
> >
> > -Bill Giovino
> > http://Microcontroller.com
> >
> > CntDwn2000 wrote:
> > >
> > > I am working on a project in which the processor will be either an
> 8051 or
> > > Atmel AVR or similar processor. I need true TCP/IP running on the
> target and
> > > would prefer not to use a hardware solution or software that
> requires a
> > > gateway. Any suggestions?
> > >
> > > TIA
> > >
> > > Charley
> >
>
Kelly Hall
Hash: SHA1
"Bill Giovino" <edi...@nospam-microcontroller.com> wrote in message
news:39655AE7...@nospam-microcontroller.com...
> HTTP POST allows you to send data (like from a form) to a routine
> in program memory (like a CGI), that can then affect the processor
> and maybe control an external system.
Well, you can certainly write HTML forms that encode their data via
the URL and thus use the GET method. POST is preferred since there's
no chance that you'll overflow the URL buffer on small
implementations. But for forms where there's not much data going
upstream, either is fine. The last CGI library I used, you didn't
even have to know which one the form designer chose - your incoming
data went into a perl hash regardless.
> In a conversation I had with Rabbit Semiconductor I confirmed that
> they do support an HTTP POST. Rabbit's stack has probably the best
> price per feature than I've seen, but you can't compare it to CMX.
The Rabbit TCP/IP stack seems to be a Dynamic C port of Erick
Engelke's WatTCP stack. The APIs for the Rabbit stack and the
Engelke stacks appear the same. I haven't programmed the Rabbit
stack, but I've done a couple of projects with the Engelke code and
the Rabbit API looks identical. If you compare section 15 of
http://www.rabbitsemiconductor.com/TCPIP_ref/Introduction/TCPIP1.htm
with either the WatTCP programmer's manual (www.wattcp.com) or the
Engelke's eRTOS TCP/IP manual (www.ertos.com), you'll find the text
to be damn near identical.
Frankly, I'm impressed with ZWorld's TCP/IP support - they're
leveraging off of a mature and well-respected stack and are shipping
enough libraries to be very useful. I'm not sure what their pricing
is going to be on the non-dev-kit board, but I hope it'll be cheap
enough that I can use it for some small projects down the road.
If you want the same (or darn near) stack on x86, I recommend either
WatTCP or eRTOS.
Kelly
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: PGPfreeware 6.5.2 for non-commercial use <http://www.pgp.com>
iQA/AwUBOWav7eO3tORmHE48EQKb9gCfRd+HUUoV5iBBfVVQUtnV98IbXhgAmgM8
ZBMzuH5RE1ziuq5vjtlLKcOP
=b94d
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
tom...@hotmail.com
anyone that may be considering cost. I have also used CMX and find that
it is fine, but if you cannot afford the 5,000+ cost for the software,
then the Rabbit would be the best bet. The one thing that onw should
consider, is that the Rabbit 2000 TCP/IP Kit does not support PPP at
this time. I think that it will soon.
Hope this helps.