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Kook Index

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David B. Held

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Apr 25, 2004, 1:55:44 AM4/25/04
to
Just for fun, I thought we could vote on "kook credibility" or
"kookability" of some of the more regular posters here.
Low means "not kook" and high means "very kook". Here's
a tenative list with my votes (in the order in which I happen
to remember the names):

David Longley: 6
Glen Sizemore: 3
Curt Welch: 3
patty: 1
Eray Ozkural: 1
Ken Collins: 8
Arthur T. Murray: 10
Lester Zick: 4
David Held: ? (go ahead and give me a 10 if you like ;)
Neil Rickert: 1.5 (for not buying into Fredkinism ;> )

These are just people whose posts I've actually read now
and then, which is why I don't include other posters that are
obviously prolific. Feel free to add names if you have an
opinion.

Dave

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qw6

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Apr 25, 2004, 3:21:26 AM4/25/04
to

Yet this NG is still the dullest I've seen. 0 less kooks in this NG
as I am leaving.

George Bush

JPL Verhey

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Apr 25, 2004, 6:26:38 AM4/25/04
to
Thank God you left me out ;)

My subjective, totally untestable and unjustified intensional scorelist,
based on posts that made most sense to me, sound sensible or provoked more
interest in a subject:

David Longleg: 4
Darth Sizemore: 8
Curt Welch: 6
patty: 2
Eray Ozkural: 2
Ken Collins: 5 (a pitty he doesn't have it-all on some website??)
Arthur T. Murray: dunno
Lester Zick: 1
David Held: 2
Neil Rickert: dunno
qw6: 1,5

"David B. Held" <dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> wrote in message
news:c6fjt7$r3d$1...@news.astound.net...

ken

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Apr 25, 2004, 8:40:22 AM4/25/04
to
"David B. Held" <dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> wrote in message
news:c6fjt7$r3d$1...@news.astound.net...
> Just for fun, I thought we could vote on "kook credibility" or
> "kookability" of some of the more regular posters here.
> Low means "not kook" and high means "very kook". Here's
> a tenative list with my votes (in the order in which I happen
> to remember the names):
>
> David Longley: 6
> Glen Sizemore: 3
> Curt Welch: 3
> patty: 1
> Eray Ozkural: 1
> Ken Collins: 8
> Arthur T. Murray: 10
> Lester Zick: 4
> David Held: ? (go ahead and give me a 10 if you like ;)
> Neil Rickert: 1.5 (for not buying into Fredkinism ;> )
>
> These are just people whose posts I've actually read now
> and then, which is why I don't include other posters that are
> obviously prolific. Feel free to add names if you have an
> opinion.

'sorry' -- no 'fish', here.

k. p. collins


John H.

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Apr 25, 2004, 9:35:48 AM4/25/04
to
Oh come on David, this is insulting, how come I'm not on the list? I am the
penultimate freak, just ask my friends. I take offence at not recording a
level on your kookometer. Unacceptable conduct on your part, you are now my
arch enemy, I shall hunt you down and machete you to death for excluding me
from such a prestigious list. Give me a rating or I'll hunt you down like a
wild dog.

John H.

"David B. Held" <dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> wrote in message
news:c6fjt7$r3d$1...@news.astound.net...

Neil W Rickert

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Apr 25, 2004, 10:31:50 AM4/25/04
to
"David B. Held" <dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> writes:

>Just for fun, I thought we could vote on "kook credibility" or
>"kookability" of some of the more regular posters here.
>Low means "not kook" and high means "very kook". Here's
>a tenative list with my votes (in the order in which I happen
>to remember the names):

>David Longley: 6
>Glen Sizemore: 3
>Curt Welch: 3
>patty: 1
>Eray Ozkural: 1
>Ken Collins: 8
>Arthur T. Murray: 10
>Lester Zick: 4
>David Held: ? (go ahead and give me a 10 if you like ;)
>Neil Rickert: 1.5 (for not buying into Fredkinism ;> )

Your score for Longley is way too low.

Your score for Arthur is too high. At least he is able to laugh at
himself now and then. Sizemore's score should be higher than that of
Zick. Hmm, Ken's score should also be higher than Zick's.

ken

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Apr 25, 2004, 12:00:51 PM4/25/04
to
"Neil W Rickert" <ricke...@cs.niu.edu> wrote in message
news:c6gi4m$h6b$1...@usenet.cso.niu.edu...

It's 'hilarious' - my 'score' is higher than Zick's :-]

Give me "1000".

It'll make no difference with respect to what I
post, nor with respect to the fact that there's
been only one forced-correction to anything
that I've posted, and that only because I act-
ually wasn't discussing what was corrected.

So, if I'm a "kook", then what does such
absence of correction say about everyone
else? :-])

ken


Lester Zick

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Apr 25, 2004, 12:52:43 PM4/25/04
to
On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 00:55:44 -0500, "David B. Held"
<dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> in comp.ai.philosophy wrote:

>Just for fun, I thought we could vote on "kook credibility" or
>"kookability" of some of the more regular posters here.
>Low means "not kook" and high means "very kook". Here's
>a tenative list with my votes (in the order in which I happen
>to remember the names):
>
>David Longley: 6
>Glen Sizemore: 3
>Curt Welch: 3
>patty: 1
>Eray Ozkural: 1
>Ken Collins: 8
>Arthur T. Murray: 10
>Lester Zick: 4
>David Held: ? (go ahead and give me a 10 if you like ;)
>Neil Rickert: 1.5 (for not buying into Fredkinism ;> )
>
>These are just people whose posts I've actually read now
>and then, which is why I don't include other posters that are
>obviously prolific. Feel free to add names if you have an
>opinion.
>

Ah. The one true universal antikook pronounces judgment. The problem
is that we're all kooks. Some of us have just made greater progress
remediating the kookiness.

Regards - Lester

Lester Zick

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Apr 25, 2004, 12:52:44 PM4/25/04
to
On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 12:26:38 +0200, "JPL Verhey"
<p...@nospamwhatsoever.nu> in comp.ai.philosophy wrote:

> Thank God you left me out ;)
>
>My subjective, totally untestable and unjustified intensional scorelist,
>based on posts that made most sense to me, sound sensible or provoked more
>interest in a subject:
>
> David Longleg: 4
> Darth Sizemore: 8
> Curt Welch: 6
> patty: 2
> Eray Ozkural: 2
> Ken Collins: 5 (a pitty he doesn't have it-all on some website??)
> Arthur T. Murray: dunno
> Lester Zick: 1
> David Held: 2
> Neil Rickert: dunno
> qw6: 1,5

Certainly makes sense to me.


Regards - Lester

Lester Zick

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Apr 25, 2004, 12:52:44 PM4/25/04
to
On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 23:35:48 +1000, "John H." <johnh@faraway.> in
comp.ai.philosophy wrote:

>Oh come on David, this is insulting, how come I'm not on the list? I am the
>penultimate freak, just ask my friends. I take offence at not recording a
>level on your kookometer. Unacceptable conduct on your part, you are now my
>arch enemy, I shall hunt you down and machete you to death for excluding me
>from such a prestigious list. Give me a rating or I'll hunt you down like a
>wild dog.
>
>
>
>John H.

I wondered the same. You probably just need more at bats.


Regards - Lester

Curt Welch

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Apr 25, 2004, 5:30:26 PM4/25/04
to
"David B. Held" <dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> wrote:
> Just for fun, I thought we could vote on "kook credibility" or
> "kookability" of some of the more regular posters here.
> Low means "not kook" and high means "very kook". Here's
> a tenative list with my votes (in the order in which I happen
> to remember the names):
>
> David Longley: 6
> Glen Sizemore: 3
> Curt Welch: 3

I'd give this idiot at least a 5!

--
Curt Welch http://CurtWelch.Com/
cu...@kcwc.com Webmaster for http://NewsReader.Com/

David B. Held

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Apr 26, 2004, 4:46:10 AM4/26/04
to
"JPL Verhey" <p...@nospamwhatsoever.nu> wrote in message
news:408b9243$0$41759$5fc...@dreader2.news.tiscali.nl...
> [...]

> My subjective, totally untestable and unjustified intensional
> scorelist, based on posts that made most sense to me, sound
> sensible or provoked more interest in a subject:

Hey, we only want exacting logically-derived scientific
judgements here. There's no room for waffling or fudging on
this list!

> David Longleg: 4
> Darth Sizemore: 8
> Curt Welch: 6
> patty: 2
> Eray Ozkural: 2
> Ken Collins: 5 (a pitty he doesn't have it-all on some website??)
> Arthur T. Murray: dunno
> Lester Zick: 1
> David Held: 2
> Neil Rickert: dunno
> qw6: 1,5

Hahaha! qw6 isn't a kook, he's a troll. That's why I added him
to my killfile (well, OE doesn't exactly have a "killfile", but close
enuf). Anyway, the fact that you give Lester Zick a 1 tells me
that either A) your score must match Lester's, or B) you *are*
Lester! Anyway, Curt is flaky, but I wouldn't say he's gone into
full-blown kookdom yet. He's just a bit over-enthusiastic. At
least he can still laugh at himself. The way Longley takes himself
so seriously, on the other hand, demands a higher score, if you
ask me.

My guess is that you give Glen a high score because you lock
horns with him a lot. But I don't think that justifies a high kook
score. I disagree with Rickert on a lot of stuff, but I wouldn't
call him a kook. Since I gave Lester a 4, that implies I should
give you a 4 as well, but your posts don't seem that far out in
left field. I'd have to give you a 2, probably.

Dave

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David B. Held

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Apr 26, 2004, 4:40:15 AM4/26/04
to
"John H." <johnh@faraway.> wrote in message
news:408b...@dnews.tpgi.com.au...

> Oh come on David, this is insulting, how come I'm not on the list?
> [...]

I haven't read many of your posts. My kookmeter registered
"insufficient sample". Anyway, you should join the fun and
cast your votes. Maybe an average of everyone's votes will
say something interesting about the group.

Dave

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David B. Held

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Apr 26, 2004, 4:53:25 AM4/26/04
to
"Neil W Rickert" <ricke...@cs.niu.edu> wrote in message
news:c6gi4m$h6b$1...@usenet.cso.niu.edu...
> [...]

> >David Longley: 6
> >Glen Sizemore: 3
> >Curt Welch: 3
> >patty: 1
> >Eray Ozkural: 1
> >Ken Collins: 8
> >Arthur T. Murray: 10
> >Lester Zick: 4
> >David Held: ? (go ahead and give me a 10 if you like ;)
> >Neil Rickert: 1.5 (for not buying into Fredkinism ;> )
>
> Your score for Longley is way too low.

I think Longley is more of a parrot than a kook, but that might
be splitting hairs.

> Your score for Arthur is too high. At least he is able to laugh
> at himself now and then.

Yet at other times, he can be very bombastic, and in an oh-so-
serious way. That bumps up the kook-o-meter by my
calibration. And if what the Mentifex-expose site says is true,
I believe Arthur is the only one who has paid to have a kook
book published. That's one-up on Longley, even! I mean, have
you *seen* the ASCII art? Have you *seen* how convinced he
is that those are drawings of *real practical value*? Arthur is
a nutcase through and through.

> Sizemore's score should be higher than that of Zick.

Perhaps you can explain Lester's "differential mathematics"
to me. It certainly doesn't look anything like differential equations
from calculus. I especially want to know how the "distance
between 'apple' and 'orange'" is a number. Whenever people
invent their own math, and do so very poorly, I have to bump
their kook score. Something so fundamental usually builds
a rotten foundation for bigger ideas. That's also why Ken
gets a high score (though for other reasons besides).

> Hmm, Ken's score should also be higher than Zick's.

And on my scale, it is. Not only does Ken have a non-
mainstream view of math (which has not been shown to
be useful or even consistent), he also has some flaky
ideas about physics. And his bizarre posting style and
emotional outbursts indicate a fair amount of kookocity
to me.

Dave

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David Longley

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Apr 26, 2004, 6:56:51 AM4/26/04
to
In article <c6ii8a$fj2$1...@news.astound.net>, David B. Held
<dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> writes
Here we see you up to your "redneck" ignorant political games again. Do
you travel much? Note how concerned you are to make alliances....

If you like this kind of "activity", you should look up "Personal
Construct Theory" (originally by George Kelly, first created remarkably
close to when "Two Dogmas of Empiricism" was published back in 1951).
They even got round to using computers! I'm not sure how popular it
still is, but they used to get clients to generate a whole load of
bi-polar constructs and elements and then subject this Repertory Grid to
multi-dimensional scaling, principal components analysis etc to show how
one made sense of the world! Much loved by organisations intrigued by
what their employees think.

But note - all it basically tells one is how one is disposed to verbally
behave, and in your case - there's no need for PCA* etc - it's obvious.
You're just showing is what an arrogant and ignorant you are prepared to
be. Don't kid yourself that having an education in some areas in any way
protects you from behaving that way elsewhere!


* As I've said elsewhere, use of this sort of statistical technology in
mentalistic contexts of propositional attitude (other than de dicto) is
highly dubious to the point of being pseudo-science.
--
David Longley

David Longley

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Apr 26, 2004, 8:22:08 AM4/26/04
to
In article <c6iht7$fin$1...@news.astound.net>, David B. Held
<dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> writes

>"John H." <johnh@faraway.> wrote in message
>news:408b...@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
>> Oh come on David, this is insulting, how come I'm not on the list?
>> [...]
>
>I haven't read many of your posts. My kookmeter registered
>"insufficient sample". Anyway, you should join the fun and
>cast your votes. Maybe an average of everyone's votes will
>say something interesting about the group.
>
>Dave

No, it will just tell you something about their current verbal
dispositions. But that is what some of us have been saying needs to
change as part of a more general repertoire that needs change.

Looks like your metering is far too limited a practice by the way.

--
David Longley

Neil W Rickert

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Apr 26, 2004, 8:43:07 AM4/26/04
to
"David B. Held" <dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> writes:
>"Neil W Rickert" <ricke...@cs.niu.edu> wrote in message
>news:c6gi4m$h6b$1...@usenet.cso.niu.edu...

>> Sizemore's score should be higher than that of Zick.

>Perhaps you can explain Lester's "differential mathematics"
>to me.

Lester cannot explain that himself. I have tried several times to
draw out an explanation.

But you are right. I withdraw my disagreement on the relative
position of Zick and Sizemore.

David Longley

unread,
Apr 26, 2004, 9:32:48 AM4/26/04
to
In article <c6j04r$fir$1...@usenet.cso.niu.edu>, Neil W Rickert
<ricke...@cs.niu.edu> writes

You won't get matters any clearer playing politics Rickert. You've tried
that before and all you got was a bad dose of hysteria! What you really
need to do is look into why you've stopped learning.

Maybe you should have a chat with Minsky on that score - he's interested
in the same question apparently (albeit perhaps more widely). You
clearly don't listen to what I have to say, or any other teachers aka
"dogmatists" (on the planet Rickertia).
--
David Longley

Arthur T. Murray

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Apr 26, 2004, 12:01:09 PM4/26/04
to
"David B. Held" wrote on Mon, 26 Apr 2004:
>
>> Your score for Arthur is too high. At least he is able to laugh
>> at himself now and then.
>
> Yet at other times, he can be very bombastic,
> and in an oh-so-serious way.
http://dev.null.org/psychoceramics/archives/1998.05/msg00018.html
http://www.nanomagazine.com/i.php?id=01_10_24
http://www.sl4.org/archive/0205/3829.html
http://doi.acm.org/10.1145/307824.307853

> That bumps up the kook-o-meter by my calibration.
> And if what the Mentifex-expose site says is true,
> I believe Arthur is the only one who has paid to have
> a kook book published. That's one-up on Longley, even!

You meant to say "cook book", right? AI4U = "AI Cook Book".
http://isbn.nu/0595654371 -- hardbound AI4U textbook sources;
http://isbn.nu/0595259227 -- paperback AI4U textbook sources;
http://robots.net/person/AI4U/ -- personal info about author.

> I mean, have you *seen* the ASCII art? Have you *seen* how
> convinced he is that those are drawings of *real practical value*?
> Arthur is a nutcase through and through.

What if your ostensible "kook" is a messenger from the future bringing
http://freshmeat.net/projects/ai - solution to artificial intelligence?

What if the following Cognitive Architecture is the Seed AI you need?

Artificial Life of the Immortal Robot Mind (Main Alife Mind Loop)
--- Security
--- --- HCI (Human-Computer Interaction)
--- --- Rejuvenate (for cyborg immortality)
--- --- psiDecay
--- --- Ego
--- Sensorium
--- --- Audition
--- --- --- Listen
--- --- --- --- audSTM (auditory Short Term Memory)
--- --- --- --- --- audRecog (auditory Recognition)
--- --- --- oldConcept
--- --- --- --- Parser
--- --- --- --- --- Instantiate
--- --- --- --- Activate
--- --- --- --- --- spreadAct (spreading Activation)
--- --- --- newConcept (machine learning)
--- --- --- --- enVocab (English Vocabulary)
--- --- --- --- Parser
--- --- --- --- --- Instantiate
--- Emotion
--- --- Cognitive Component
--- --- --- Physiological Component
--- Think
--- --- Activate
--- --- --- spreadAct (spreading Activation)
--- --- English
--- --- --- Ask
--- --- --- --- wtAuxSDo (whatDoSubjectsDo?)
--- --- --- --- --- Speech
--- --- --- --- --- --- Reentry
--- --- --- negSVO
--- --- --- --- auxVerb
--- --- --- --- --- Speech
--- --- --- --- --- --- Reentry
--- --- --- SVO (Subject+Verb+Object)
--- --- --- --- nounPhrase
--- --- --- --- --- Reify
--- --- --- --- --- Speech
--- --- --- --- --- --- Reentry
--- --- --- --- --- Activate
--- --- --- --- --- --- spreadAct
--- --- --- --- verbPhrase
--- --- --- --- --- Reify
--- --- --- --- --- Speech
--- --- --- --- --- --- Reentry
--- --- --- --- --- nounPhrase
--- --- --- --- Conjoin
--- --- --- --- --- Speech
--- --- --- --- --- --- Reentry
--- Volition
--- Motorium

AT Murray
--
2004 America and 1944 Nazi Germany as seen from the future:
Bush=Hitler Cheney=Bormann Rumsfeld=Goring Ashcroft=Himmler
Paul Bremer = Hans Frank; Ahmed Chelabi = Vidkun Quisling;
Fallujah=Guernica Halliburton=Krupp Guantanamo=Auschwitz

ken

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Apr 26, 2004, 11:29:59 AM4/26/04
to
"David B. Held" <dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> wrote in message
news:c6iilt$fk9$1...@news.astound.net...

> "Neil W Rickert" <ricke...@cs.niu.edu> wrote in message
> news:c6gi4m$h6b$1...@usenet.cso.niu.edu...
> > [...]
> > > [...]
> [...]

> > Hmm, Ken's score should also be higher than Zick's.
>
> And on my scale, it is. Not only does Ken have a non-
> mainstream view of math (which has not been shown to
> be useful or even consistent), he also has some flaky
> ideas about physics. And his bizarre posting style and
> emotional outbursts indicate a fair amount of kookocity
> to me.

No fish here.

k. p. collins


Neil W Rickert

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Apr 26, 2004, 12:19:43 PM4/26/04
to
uj...@victoria.tc.ca (Arthur T. Murray) writes:

>What if your ostensible "kook" is a messenger from the future bringing
>http://freshmeat.net/projects/ai - solution to artificial intelligence?

He isn't.

>What if the following Cognitive Architecture is the Seed AI you need?

It isn't.

David B. Held

unread,
Apr 26, 2004, 1:30:05 PM4/26/04
to
"Arthur T. Murray" <uj...@victoria.tc.ca> wrote in message
news:408d...@news.victoria.tc.ca...
> [...]

> > That bumps up the kook-o-meter by my calibration.
> > And if what the Mentifex-expose site says is true,
> > I believe Arthur is the only one who has paid to have
> > a kook book published. That's one-up on Longley, even!
>
> You meant to say "cook book", right? AI4U = "AI Cook Book".
> [...]

LOL!!! Yeah, they're right. At least you can have a laugh
now and then. You're still a nutcase, though.

David B. Held

unread,
Apr 26, 2004, 1:27:01 PM4/26/04
to
"David Longley" <Da...@longley.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:mUuCqMOw...@longley.demon.co.uk...
> [...]

> No, it will just tell you something about their current verbal
> dispositions. But that is what some of us have been saying
> needs to change as part of a more general repertoire that
> needs change.
>
> Looks like your metering is far too limited a practice by the way.

Do you know what the word "laugh" means? Are you familiar
with that funny sound other humans make sometimes when
you say something? The one that sounds kinda like chimps
and monkeys? That sound means: "Don't take it so seriously",
and I seriously hope most people are making that sound when
they read this thread.

David Longley

unread,
Apr 26, 2004, 1:51:53 PM4/26/04
to
In article <c6jgot$kdq$1...@news.astound.net>, David B. Held
<dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> writes

>"David Longley" <Da...@longley.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:mUuCqMOw...@longley.demon.co.uk...
>> [...]
>> No, it will just tell you something about their current verbal
>> dispositions. But that is what some of us have been saying
>> needs to change as part of a more general repertoire that
>> needs change.
>>
>> Looks like your metering is far too limited a practice by the way.
>
>Do you know what the word "laugh" means? Are you familiar
>with that funny sound other humans make sometimes when
>you say something? The one that sounds kinda like chimps
>and monkeys? That sound means: "Don't take it so seriously",
>and I seriously hope most people are making that sound when
>they read this thread.
>
>Dave
>
>

I'm trying to imagine you as a baboon - - - - - - yep.............. got
it.

I'm not sure your encouraging me to think of you that way is in your
long term best interests though. Still, if you think it will help in the
short term, I'll do my best.
--
David Longley

Eray Ozkural exa

unread,
Apr 26, 2004, 3:51:45 PM4/26/04
to
"David B. Held" <dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> wrote in message news:<c6fjt7$r3d$1...@news.astound.net>...

> Just for fun, I thought we could vote on "kook credibility" or
> "kookability" of some of the more regular posters here.
> Low means "not kook" and high means "very kook". Here's
> a tenative list with my votes (in the order in which I happen
> to remember the names):
>
> David Longley: 6
> Glen Sizemore: 3
> Curt Welch: 3
> patty: 1
> Eray Ozkural: 1
> Ken Collins: 8
> Arthur T. Murray: 10
> Lester Zick: 4
> David Held: ? (go ahead and give me a 10 if you like ;)
> Neil Rickert: 1.5 (for not buying into Fredkinism ;> )
>
> These are just people whose posts I've actually read now
> and then, which is why I don't include other posters that are
> obviously prolific. Feel free to add names if you have an
> opinion.

While this post may look fun, it does not seem to serve much
purpose... Was your intention to warn Arthur and David, who would
easily qualify as kooks, or did you just mean to offend every frequent
poster?

For the less serious minded, what about all the people who are not on
the list, or not even on this group? Where would they wind up on your
scoring system, I wonder. There are many famous people with eccentric
ideas such as Roger Penrose, Jack Sarfatti, David Chalmers, Hacker,
and so forth...

--
Eray

David B. Held

unread,
Apr 26, 2004, 3:32:43 PM4/26/04
to
"David Longley" <Da...@longley.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:ZZcdJcV5...@longley.demon.co.uk...
> [...]

> I'm not sure your encouraging me to think of you that way is in
> your long term best interests though. Still, if you think it will help
> in the short term, I'll do my best.

If thinking of me as a baboon makes you laugh, then go for it!
I have nothing to lose. You have no power over me, so nothing
you do affects my "long term best interests". However, laughing
will almost certainly be good for you.

patty

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Apr 26, 2004, 4:02:31 PM4/26/04
to

I think a more interesting list could be constructed by ordering people
according to who they respond to and who responds to them. Of course
that might be a bit too extensional for this crowd. But in any case, i
am happy to have made the list :)

patty

David B. Held

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Apr 26, 2004, 4:02:51 PM4/26/04
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"Eray Ozkural exa" <er...@bilkent.edu.tr> wrote in message
news:fa69ae35.04042...@posting.google.com...
> [...]

> While this post may look fun, it does not seem to serve much
> purpose...

Well, if you didn't have fun thinking about it, then it failed.

> Was your intention to warn Arthur and David, who would
> easily qualify as kooks, or did you just mean to offend every
> frequent poster?

Why should I warn Arthur and David? Warn them of what?
Offending posters? Well, if they don't realize that they have
non-mainstream ideas, I don't see how they would realize
they ought to be offended. And I didn't even name every
frequent poster. Just the ones where I've read more than
1 or 2 posts.

> For the less serious minded, what about all the people who
> are not on the list, or not even on this group? Where would
> they wind up on your scoring system, I wonder.

That's my point. It's not *my* scoring system. I think it would
be more fun if everyone gave their own scores. In fact, it's
obvious that some people I think are kooks, others think are
normal, and vice versa. That's the type of information that I
was trying to uncover.

> There are many famous people with eccentric ideas such
> as Roger Penrose, Jack Sarfatti, David Chalmers, Hacker,
> and so forth...

Yes, they should all be added to the list. I would rank these
three, at least:

Roger Penrose: 5 (I read both his popular books on AI, and he
isn't so much a kook as someone desperately hanging onto
an idea)

Frank Tipler: 9 (I read The Physics of Immortality, and this guy
has gone well off the deep end)

David Chalmers: 3 (he isn't a kook, just a philosopher; if
Chalmers is a kook, then so are all philosophers)

David B. Held

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Apr 26, 2004, 4:05:15 PM4/26/04
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"David Longley" <Da...@longley.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:SkuPmcIz...@longley.demon.co.uk...
> [...]

> Here we see you up to your "redneck" ignorant political games
> again. Do you travel much?

I leave the house, which would probably constitute "travel" in your
world.

> Note how concerned you are to make alliances....

> [...]

LOL!!! I criticise anyone and everyone I disagree with. The idea
that I come here for political intrigue is hilarious! You're almost
as paranoid as Ken!

In case you haven't figured it out, I've exhausted my patience with
your nonsense, so I'm just going to stick with "fun" replies to you.

Michael Olea

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Apr 26, 2004, 4:24:42 PM4/26/04
to
in article rVdjc.42857$aQ6.2568771@attbi_s51, patty at
pat...@SPAMicyberspace.net wrote on 4/26/04 1:02 PM:

Are you kidding? Eray loves graph theory, cluster analysis, and kernel
methods. He's probably already worked out a c.a.p. diffusion kernel -
support group cluster vectors...

> But in any case, i
> am happy to have made the list :)

Did it reveal anything interesting?

>
> patty

Lester Zick

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Apr 26, 2004, 4:59:24 PM4/26/04
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On 26 Apr 2004 12:51:45 -0700, er...@bilkent.edu.tr (Eray Ozkural
exa) in comp.ai.philosophy wrote:

Oh well, I expect a little comic relief is welcome. Innovators always
start off as kooks. Unfortunately kooks don't consider themselves as
such. Which probably defines the subject to begin with and why nobody
agrees. There must be some theory of kookery that applies.

Regards - Lester

Acme Diagnostics

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Apr 26, 2004, 5:09:24 PM4/26/04
to

"David B. Held" <dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> wrote:
>"Eray Ozkural exa" <er...@bilkent.edu.tr> wrote in message
>news:fa69ae35.04042...@posting.google.com...
>> [...]
>> While this post may look fun, it does not seem to serve much
>> purpose...
>
>Well, if you didn't have fun thinking about it, then it failed.

It *is* fun and entertaining! If you ever want to see a productive
work-group disintegrate fast, just have each member rate
the other members, then publish the results. But of course
a good lawyer would argue that "productive" is a fact not in
evidence. But then who listens to lawyers.

Larry

David Longley

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Apr 26, 2004, 5:07:03 PM4/26/04
to
In article <c6jq1j$n8r$1...@news.astound.net>, David B. Held
<dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> writes

>"David Longley" <Da...@longley.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:SkuPmcIz...@longley.demon.co.uk...
>> [...]
>> Here we see you up to your "redneck" ignorant political games
>> again. Do you travel much?
>
>I leave the house, which would probably constitute "travel" in your
>world.
>
>> Note how concerned you are to make alliances....
>> [...]
>
>LOL!!! I criticise anyone and everyone I disagree with. The idea
>that I come here for political intrigue is hilarious! You're almost
>as paranoid as Ken!

No - you're just naively unaware of how you're behaving. They're
operants you know. In terms you understand, you want social approval.

>
>In case you haven't figured it out, I've exhausted my patience with
>your nonsense, so I'm just going to stick with "fun" replies to you.
>

No - you've just exhausted your rather shallow repertoire of verbal
behaviours in this area. I see you're busy doing some homework
elsewhere, but you're cramming and it isn't working. You're now having
to resort to even more primitive mentalistic rhetoric as a defence.

You should seriously consider giving up and just do some reading as
advised.


--
David Longley

John H.

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Apr 26, 2004, 9:47:08 PM4/26/04
to

"David B. Held" <dh...@codelogicconsulting.com> wrote in message
news:c6jo4j$mic$1...@news.astound.net...

> "David Longley" <Da...@longley.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:ZZcdJcV5...@longley.demon.co.uk...
> > [...]
> > I'm not sure your encouraging me to think of you that way is in
> > your long term best interests though. Still, if you think it will help
> > in the short term, I'll do my best.
>
> If thinking of me as a baboon makes you laugh, then go for it!
> I have nothing to lose.

You may learn something though:

Darwin's M Book:


"Origin of man now proved. - Metaphysics must flourish. - He who understands
baboon will do more towards metaphysics than Locke."


qw6

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Apr 27, 2004, 12:42:22 AM4/27/04
to
> 2004 America and 1944 Nazi Germany as seen from the future:
> Bush=Hitler Cheney=Bormann Rumsfeld=Goring Ashcroft=Himmler
> Paul Bremer = Hans Frank; Ahmed Chelabi = Vidkun Quisling;
> Fallujah=Guernica Halliburton=Krupp Guantanamo=Auschwitz

New world order is Bush's perestroyka. Forced freedom is like a
machine. Bush is a machine.

qw6

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Apr 27, 2004, 12:54:57 AM4/27/04
to
"David B. Held" wrote:
>
> "JPL Verhey" <p...@nospamwhatsoever.nu> wrote in message
> news:408b9243$0$41759$5fc...@dreader2.news.tiscali.nl...
> > [...]
> > My subjective, totally untestable and unjustified intensional
> > scorelist, based on posts that made most sense to me, sound
> > sensible or provoked more interest in a subject:
>
> Hey, we only want exacting logically-derived scientific
> judgements here. There's no room for waffling or fudging on
> this list!
>
> > David Longleg: 4
> > Darth Sizemore: 8
> > Curt Welch: 6
> > patty: 2
> > Eray Ozkural: 2
> > Ken Collins: 5 (a pitty he doesn't have it-all on some website??)
> > Arthur T. Murray: dunno
> > Lester Zick: 1
> > David Held: 2
> > Neil Rickert: dunno
> > qw6: 1,5
>
> Hahaha! qw6 isn't a kook, he's a troll.

I am a machine animal.

qw6

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Apr 27, 2004, 2:43:57 AM4/27/04