Interest in CocoaSharp
Leauki
I don't see many people hanging out here. :-(
Anyone?
Chuck Esterbrook
I think many of us are interested but don't have the time and/or
expertise to push it forward. And it seems unlikely that Apple or
Novell will ever sponsor this work in a major way.
*But* AFAICT both Mono and Mac are growing in popularity. Hopefully
this bodes well for the future of CocoaSharp.
-Chuck
Roger Eisenecher
Hash: SHA1
Hi @all!
I'm subscribed to this list for a long time already. We tried to develop
and port some .net applications which runs fine with Linux and Windows
of course. We had no experience in development on the MAC platform. If
you want to start to use mono on the mac platform (with cocoa#) it is
very hard even to write a small hello world application due the lack of
any good documentation or tutorial.
So we think there are mainly two problems:
* You must know how to write objective-c applications (because of the
GUI designer and how the GUI interacts with your "objective-c" code
* You must investigate how to integrate and use the MAC OS X api from
your .net code
This lead to our final thought about this platform: We need more
documentation and tutorials from people which knows to write
applications in this environment.
just my 2 cents...
regards, rOger
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Chuck Esterbrook schrieb:
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Leauki
wrote:
>
> > Is there some interest in CocoaSharp in the community?
>
> > I don't see many people hanging out here. :-(
>
> > Anyone?
>
> I think many of us are interested but don't have the time and/or
> expertise to push it forward. And it seems unlikely that Apple or
> Novell will ever sponsor this work in a major way.
Novell are already doing what they can, what with native Winforms
support coming and everything. But Quartz Winforms still don't look
native.
> *But* AFAICT both Mono and Mac are growing in popularity. Hopefully
> this bodes well for the future of CocoaSharp.
podcasts). And they happen to be the only two platforms I am really
interested in (apart from POSIX/C).
Objective C is fine (although I find it difficult) but is so non-
portable, it's a disaster. Everything that ports between Windows and
Mac OS seems to be Carbon-based (REALbasic, WxWidgets etc.). And
Carbon just doesn't look as nice as Cocoa. Even QT is Carbon (plus I
don't know C++ and don't want to learn it).
If Apple don't release Yellow Box for Windows (and they won't),
CocoaSharp is the next best alternative, I think. You could develop in
Visual Studio, adhere to the model-view-controller pattern and then
port to Mac OS by replacing the GUI with a NIB file and the controller
with different glue code.
And macpack can apparently pack all the needed DLLs into the bundle.
Further advantages are that the same application can be ported to
Linux and UNIX (either Winforms or replace with GTK# and appropriate
glue) and will run on Mac OS even before the Cocoa GUI is done (via
X11 or Quartz Winforms).
It's theoretically fantastic. If only I wasn't too stupid/lazy to do
anything in the actual project...
I can donate though!
Leauki
>
> I'm subscribed to this list for a long time already. We tried to develop
> and port some .net applications which runs fine with Linux and Windows
> of course. We had no experience in development on the MAC platform. If
> you want to start to use mono on the mac platform (with cocoa#) it is
> very hard even to write a small hello world application due the lack of
> any good documentation or tutorial.
connect any controls to anything. I can just display a window titled
"Hello World".
> So we think there are mainly two problems:
> * You must know how to write objective-c applications (because of the
> GUI designer and how the GUI interacts with your "objective-c" code
> * You must investigate how to integrate and use the MAC OS X api from
> your .net code
I can do a "using Cocoa" but that only makes it possible to load and
display a NIB. For some reason "using Apple.AppKit" etc. don't work
and I think I need those frameworks to connect controls.
> This lead to our final thought about this platform: We need more
> documentation and tutorials from people which knows to write
> applications in this environment.
This is a good place to learn some Cocoa and about Interface Builder:
http://www.cocoacast.com/
As for the rest, I will experiment a bit over the next few days. I
have Windows Vista, Visual Studio Professional, Leopard, Parallels and
several Macs. What I don't have is much knowledge of Cocoa and
probably not even enough about C#.
Chuck Esterbrook
> On Dec 27, 1:56 am, "Chuck Esterbrook" <chuck.esterbr...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > On Dec 26, 2007 2:08 PM, Leauki <ajbr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Is there some interest in CocoaSharp in the community?
> >
> > > I don't see many people hanging out here. :-(
> >
> > > Anyone?
> >
> > I think many of us are interested but don't have the time and/or
> > expertise to push it forward. And it seems unlikely that Apple or
> > Novell will ever sponsor this work in a major way.
>
> That is too bad really. Apple seem to be firmly in the Java camp and
> Novell are already doing what they can, what with native Winforms
> support coming and everything. But Quartz Winforms still don't look
> native.
True, but I applaud Novell for making this giant step forward. It's
nice to be able to develop a Winforms app and run it on Windows, Mac
and Linux. And it's great to drop the X11 requirement on the Mac.
> > *But* AFAICT both Mono and Mac are growing in popularity. Hopefully
> > this bodes well for the future of CocoaSharp.
>
> .NET and Cocoa are the most hippest platforms (as measured in
> podcasts). And they happen to be the only two platforms I am really
> interested in (apart from POSIX/C).
You said it!
> Objective C is fine (although I find it difficult) but is so non-
> portable, it's a disaster. Everything that ports between Windows and
> Mac OS seems to be Carbon-based (REALbasic, WxWidgets etc.). And
> Carbon just doesn't look as nice as Cocoa. Even QT is Carbon (plus I
> don't know C++ and don't want to learn it).
I used to crank Objective-C for a living. It's a fine language, but
now far behind the times compared to C# and other modern offerings.
> If Apple don't release Yellow Box for Windows (and they won't),
> CocoaSharp is the next best alternative, I think. You could develop in
> Visual Studio, adhere to the model-view-controller pattern and then
> port to Mac OS by replacing the GUI with a NIB file and the controller
> with different glue code.
Agreed. With a good structure, you could swap out the GUI for your application.
-Chuck
Leauki
wrote:
> > That is too bad really. Apple seem to be firmly in the Java camp and
> > Novell are already doing what they can, what with native Winforms
> > support coming and everything. But Quartz Winforms still don't look
> > native.
>
> True, but I applaud Novell for making this giant step forward. It's
> nice to be able to develop a Winforms app and run it on Windows, Mac
> and Linux. And it's great to drop the X11 requirement on the Mac.
I registered a bug re clipboard-related crashes.
https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=348590
It is resolved, but I didn't compile the new version of Mono to verify
it.
Either way, that is Carbon. :-(
Carbon gets all the portability what with REALbasic and QT supporting
Carbon but not Cocoa.
> > > *But* AFAICT both Mono and Mac are growing in popularity. Hopefully
> > > this bodes well for the future of CocoaSharp.
>
> > .NET and Cocoa are the most hippest platforms (as measured in
> > podcasts). And they happen to be the only two platforms I am really
> > interested in (apart from POSIX/C).
>
> You said it!
> > Objective C is fine (although I find it difficult) but is so non-
> > portable, it's a disaster. Everything that ports between Windows and
> > Mac OS seems to be Carbon-based (REALbasic, WxWidgets etc.). And
> > Carbon just doesn't look as nice as Cocoa. Even QT is Carbon (plus I
> > don't know C++ and don't want to learn it).
>
> I used to crank Objective-C for a living. It's a fine language, but
> now far behind the times compared to C# and other modern offerings.
Java suffers from: there is no easy alternative for small
applications. .NET has Visual Basic, Java and Cocoa have only the C#-
equivalent, not the BASIC-equivalent.
> > If Apple don't release Yellow Box for Windows (and they won't),
> > CocoaSharp is the next best alternative, I think. You could develop in
> > Visual Studio, adhere to the model-view-controller pattern and then
> > port to Mac OS by replacing the GUI with a NIB file and the controller
> > with different glue code.
>
> Agreed. With a good structure, you could swap out the GUI for your application.
GUI and Visual Studio for the code. I find Xcode also a bit behind
when it comes to code sense. It seems to offer every keyword rather
than what is appropriate for the context.
mandel
I have been trying to get involve in the development of cocoa#, I have
experience with c# and objective-c and I have the time, well i need to
be able to run c# on mac natively, currently I want to port the
addressook libs to work with c# and I don't mind to start developing
more code... the only problem I have is that I have found no info what
so ever of how to get involved and what is the current situation, if
anyone knows how a could get involved let me know, I need to know ASAP
since I'm going to do it any way and I do not want to "fork" the
project.
let me know,
Manuel
Leauki
I emailed you, Chuck, and Dave.
Manuel de la Pena
I'm more than happy to start working and give it 2-3 hours a day, but
I need a place to start and some info of the project, I'm happy to
start looking at the code and start doing some documentation before I
start coding (If there is something the project needs is some
documentation). If any person involved in the project can give me a
hand would me awesome news.
let me know,
Manuel
Leauki
And on a side note: if anybody finds out how to get the using
statements to work, please tell us.