Clinton Hill Dog Run
http://groups.google.com/group/clintonhilldogrun?hl=enclintonh...@googlegroups.comToday's topics:
* Tish James Questions - 4 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/clintonhilldogrun/t/28965c590c9d3b8f?hl=en==============================================================================
TOPIC: Tish James Questions
http://groups.google.com/group/clintonhilldogrun/t/28965c590c9d3b8f?hl=en==============================================================================
== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jul 18 2009 9:37 pm
From: stephanie bergsma
pls see emails below
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: stephanie bergsma <
stephani...@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, Jul 19, 2009 at 12:32 AM
Subject: Fwd: Dog Run Followup Questions
To: clintonhilldogrun group <
nor...@googlegroups.com>
Hi All,
I have been working on the dog run project slowly but surely. The email
below is the latest communication with Leticia James. Please let me know
if
I am representing your opinion accurately of if you have other suggestions.
Please see her response and advise any comments you have. I read her
explanation and I still don't understand why a fenced in area cant co-exist
at Fort Greene Park. Do you?
I also spoke with her on the phone for about 20 minutes and she answered a
lot of our questions. For example: Many dog owners in the area have
suggested the empty lot on the north east corner of Myrtle and
Waverly<
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=-&sll=40693239,-73967894&cid=583950929553174159&li=lmd>near
Jive Turkey and Bank of America. Several people have advised that
this
has been vacant for 10 / 20 / 30 years. Turns out that the property has
been in legal limbo but is now finally
out and the property is sold to
become affordable housing.
Also she told me that community members have been attempting to get a fenced
dog run for 5 years now. She says they have not been able to find a spot.
She is 100% behind us if we can find a spot, we don't need to convince her
that a fenced dog run is desired or needed.
I am looking to squeak in with a small basic dog run and prove that our
community will use it a ton. We can work from there if what we get is not
enough or temporary. The other goal is that we have to be clear not to
change anything about Fort Greene's (unfenced) free run. This is not
negotiable. We cannot un-do what other community members have worked for.
Plus I love free run, it's just that we (Bruce Wayne and I) cant make it
except the weekends.
That's it for now. Remember to read below and send everyone your
feedback.
-Stephanie
General Coordinator
Clinton Hill Dog Run
http://groups.google.com/group/clintonhilldogrun?hl=en---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: stephanie bergsma
Date: Sat, Jul 18, 2009 at 11:18 PM
Subject: Dog Run Followup Questions
To:
lja...@council.nyc.govHi Tish,
Thank you for taking the time to speak with me on the phone a week ago.
Before I get started asking around about a dog run there is one point I am
still unclear on. What is the reason that, *at Fort Greene Park*, it must
be either off leash hours -or- a fenced in dog run? I know I asked you and
you tried to explain it to me, but I still do not understanding why we cant
have both in one
park?
The reason I had hoped to find or create a fenced in dog run is that Free
Run hours are not usable with a 9-6 work schedule. I wont be out after 9pm
with my small dog and I cant make the 2 mile round trip to the park and have
time for my pup to play before 9am weekdays (the other dogs are usually
there between 7:30/8am to 9am).
I do understand that in any location you will probably hear push back from
the community who is already using that space. The question becomes whether
that community is larger than the un-served dog run community in fort greene
and clinton hill. My argument is that there are many many parks for the
community to go to. If a dog run was to transform one corner of just one
park, the rest of the community would still have options for park use. As
it stands, anyone employed 9-6 (i hope there are still a lot of us left!)
cannot meet in a safe spot and
exercise our dogs.
*
Ideas for locations:*
*a)* Non Park spaces:I saw that there was a brainstorming meeting about what
to do with the stone paved open space on Lafayette between St. James and
Classon<
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=-&sll=40693239,-73967894&cid=583950929553174159&li=lmd>.
I know a dog run aspect was suggested there.
Also, I attended the brainstorming meeting under the BQE where I heard &
made the same suggestion. Do you think either of these could happen?
Do you think it would it be possible to be granted temporary stewardship of
an open space for a dog run? In that way we could just borrow the space and
see if the community will use it. Based on the community use we could see
if there was cause to secure a permanent
space. Maybe if the community
displays their desire to use either of those spaces in a temporary way, a
dog run would be drawn into the plans for the permanent redesign of that
space?
*b)* Would you direct me to the groups I should talk to about the already
fenced/gated grassy area in Underwood Park at Lafayette and
Washington<
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=-&sll=40693239,-73967894&cid=583950929553174159&li=lmd>?
This is a very dog run friendly set up with benches all around for easy
watching. We would not need any $ to change this into a dog run! (it does
not even need a double gate since it is already inside the park's gate.)
*c)* I do have a new location idea: Parham Playground on Clermont between
Willoughby and Dekalb<
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=-&sll=40693239,-73967894&cid=583950929553174159&li=lmd>.
There are 2 sections of this park I have never seen used (see photos
attached). These sections would lend well to be separate but adjacent small
dog and large dog fenced dog runs. In fact, they are already fenced, with
some gates, benches and trash cans. One section is on street level, on the
north east corner of the park which is currently "green space" i am guessing
(however - pls see photo, its not green because its too shady) making it
unused by the community. It is long and narrow and low fenced with a gate
already outside the park entrance. This would be ideal for small dogs. It
also already has chicken wire at ground level which prevents digging &
very
small dogs from slipping thru the bars & balls from rolling out through the
fence.
The other area is larger square with benches and partial paved perimeter.
It is the sunken area directly adjacent to the 1st area and is behind and
below the swings which are near the pool. This area would be ideal for
larger dogs. I think the two sections could easily be connected without
disturbing the flow of the park and without walking dogs thru kid's play
areas. There are other much larger seating areas in this park that would
not be disturbed.
There are a couple negatives to this location though; 1) it is directly
adjacent a school (which could be argued that this raises the risk of
children and dogs being harmed. However, there is a risk anywhere and with
the easy install of some small "chicken" wire we can easily keep children's
fingers from being nipped and dogs from being harmed by
swallowing school
supplies.) 2) it is a very segmented crowded park with different levels
(making it confusing at first how to enter different areas, some existing
gate entrances/exits may need to be closed off). It would take very very
small amount of $ to change this into a dog run (only 1 gate is needed).
Please let me know your thoughts. Thank you for your time.
Stephanie Bergsma**
-----------------------------------------(email response from Tish):
fromJames, Letitia <
LJa...@council.nyc.gov> sender-timeSent at 12:15 AM
(GMT-04:00). Current time there: 12:19 AM. ✆ tostephaniebergsma
dateSun, Jul 19, 2009 at 12:15 AM subjectRe: Dog Run Followup Questions
mailed-bycouncil.nyc.govhide details 12:15 AM (3 minutes ago)
Reply
[image: Follow up message]
Stephanie:
nice to hear from you . At a contentious community meeting a few
years ago sponsored by PUPS the dog owner association in the community, it
was decided that off leash hours were preferable to a dog run. Further, non
dog owners at the meeting recounted several dog bite stories in fort greene
park, and argued against not only extending off leash hours but a dog run,
as well. Fort greene park is very popular and every summer I have to balance
competing interests who all want to use the park. Working with parks dept we
have had to reduce the number of permits because residents complain about
all of the uses being allowed in the park and a plea for peace and
quiet. In regards to parham, I doubt DOE would agree to a dog run near
PS 20. I spearheaded the streetscape project for lafayette ave which is
almost complete. This plan reflects the ideas from residents of the
three
towers on lafayette ave. Most of the residents are seniors and are
requesting restoration of belgium blocks and trees. They have complained in
the past about irresponsible dog owners who walk their dogs on lafayette
ave. Therefore, I do not think it would work at that location. As I stated
in our earlier conversation, Underwood is patronized by several public,
private and church sponsored day care centers during the day and after
school programs. There would be MAJOR push back if a dog run were planned in
this playground. That leaves under the BQE. A dog run is being considered
at this site and at Commodore Barry Park as I stated in our earlier
conversation. I know you do not like the location of Commodore Barry park
and so I will push for the dog run under the BQE when DOT issues an RFP for
that site. I do not know the timing of this project but will inquire.
Please know that a dog run
in commodore barry park would happen sooner since
we are renovating that park. It is a very safe park with a lot of activities
and a pool. You should visit the park sometime soon and see for yourself.
Tish
== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Sun, Jul 19 2009 6:48 am
From: Matt Townsend
Personally I think the idea of a dog run under the BQE is an excellent idea. On the days and/or evenings when the rain is falling it would be nice to have a place to take your dog.
--- On Sun, 7/19/09, stephanie bergsma <
stephani...@gmail.com> wrote:
From: stephanie bergsma <
stephani...@gmail.com>
Subject: Tish James Questions
To:
clintonh...@googlegroups.comDate: Sunday, July 19, 2009, 12:37 AM
pls see emails below
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: stephanie bergsma <
stephani...@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, Jul 19, 2009 at 12:32 AM
Subject: Fwd: Dog Run Followup Questions
To: clintonhilldogrun group <
nor...@googlegroups.com>
Hi All,
I have been working on the dog run project slowly but surely. The email below is the latest communication with Leticia James. Please let me know if I am representing your opinion accurately of if you have other
suggestions. Please see her response and advise any comments you have. I read her explanation and I still don't understand why a fenced in area cant co-exist at Fort Greene Park. Do you?
I also spoke with her on the phone for about 20 minutes and she answered a lot of our questions. For example: Many dog owners in the area have suggested the empty lot on the north east corner of Myrtle and Waverly near Jive Turkey and Bank of America. Several people have advised that this has been vacant for 10 / 20 / 30 years. Turns out that the property has been in legal limbo but is now finally out and the property is sold to become affordable housing.
Also she told me that community members have been attempting to get a fenced dog run for 5 years now. She says they have not been able to find a spot. She is 100% behind us if we can find a spot, we don't need to convince her
that a fenced dog run is desired or needed.
I am looking to squeak in with a small basic dog run and prove that our community will use it a ton. We can work from there if what we get is not enough or temporary. The other goal is that we have to be clear not to change anything about Fort Greene's (unfenced) free run. This is not negotiable. We cannot un-do what other community members have worked for. Plus I love free run, it's just that we (Bruce Wayne and I) cant make it except the weekends.
That's it for now. Remember to read below and send everyone your feedback.
-Stephanie
General Coordinator
Clinton Hill Dog Run
http://groups.google.com/group/clintonhilldogrun?hl=en---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: stephanie bergsma
Date: Sat, Jul
18, 2009 at 11:18 PM
Subject: Dog Run Followup Questions
To:
lja...@council.nyc.govHi Tish,
Thank you for taking the time to speak with me on the phone a week ago. Before I get started asking around about a dog run there is one point I am still unclear on. What is the reason that, at Fort Greene Park, it must be either off leash hours -or- a fenced in dog run? I know I asked you and you tried to explain it to me, but I still do not understanding why we cant have both in one park?
The reason I had hoped to find or create a fenced in dog run is that Free Run hours are not usable with a 9-6 work schedule. I wont be out after 9pm with my small dog and I cant make the 2 mile round trip to the park and have time for my pup to play before 9am
weekdays (the other dogs are usually there between 7:30/8am to 9am).
I do understand that in any location you will probably hear push back
from the community who is already using that space. The question
becomes whether that community is larger than the un-served dog run
community in fort greene and clinton hill. My argument is that there
are many many parks for the community to go to. If a dog run was to
transform one corner of just one park, the rest of the community would
still have options for park use. As it stands, anyone employed 9-6 (i
hope there are still a lot of us left!) cannot meet in a safe spot and
exercise our dogs.
Ideas for locations:
a) Non Park spaces:I saw that there was a brainstorming meeting about what to do with the stone paved open space on Lafayette between St. James and Classon. I know a dog run aspect was suggested
there.
Also, I attended the brainstorming meeting under the BQE where I heard & made the same suggestion. Do you think either of these could happen?
Do you think it would it be possible to be granted temporary stewardship of an open space for a dog run? In that way we could just borrow the space and see if the community will use it. Based on the community use we could see if there was cause to secure a permanent space. Maybe if the community displays their desire to use either of those spaces in a temporary way, a dog run would be drawn into the plans for the permanent redesign of that space?
b) Would you direct me to the groups I should talk to about the already fenced/gated grassy area in Underwood Park at Lafayette and Washington? This is a very dog run friendly set up with benches all around for easy watching. We would not
need any $ to change this into a dog run! (it does not even need a double gate since it is already inside the park's gate.)
c) I do have a new location idea: Parham Playground on Clermont between Willoughby and Dekalb. There are 2 sections of this park I have never seen used (see photos attached). These sections would lend well to be separate but adjacent small dog and large dog fenced dog runs. In fact, they are already fenced, with some gates, benches and trash cans. One section is on street level, on the north east corner of the park which is currently "green space" i am guessing (however - pls see photo, its not green because its too shady) making it unused by the community. It is long and narrow and low fenced with a gate already outside the park entrance. This would be ideal for small dogs. It also already has chicken wire at ground level which prevents digging & very small dogs from
slipping thru the bars & balls from rolling out through the fence.
The other area is larger square with benches and partial paved perimeter. It is the sunken area directly adjacent to the 1st area and is behind and below the swings which are near the pool. This area would be ideal for larger dogs. I think the two sections could easily be connected without disturbing the flow of the park and without walking dogs thru kid's play areas. There are other much larger seating areas in this park that would not be disturbed.
There are a couple negatives to this location though; 1) it is directly adjacent a school (which could be argued that this raises the risk of children and dogs being harmed. However, there is a risk anywhere and with the easy install of some small "chicken" wire we can easily keep children's fingers from being nipped and dogs from being harmed by swallowing school
supplies.) 2) it is a very segmented crowded park with different levels (making it confusing at first how to enter different areas, some existing gate entrances/exits may need to be closed off). It would take very very small amount of $ to change this into a dog run (only 1 gate is needed).
Please let me know your thoughts. Thank you for your time.
Stephanie Bergsma
-----------------------------------------(email response from Tish):
fromJames, Letitia <
LJa...@council.nyc.gov>
sender-timeSent at 12:15 AM (GMT-04:00). Current time there: 12:19 AM. ✆
tostephaniebergsma
dateSun, Jul 19, 2009 at 12:15 AM
subjectRe: Dog Run Followup Questions
mailed-bycouncil.nyc.govhide details 12:15 AM (3 minutes ago)
Reply
Stephanie: nice to hear from you . At a contentious
community meeting a few years ago sponsored by PUPS the dog owner
association in the community, it was decided that off leash hours were
preferable to a dog run. Further, non dog owners at the meeting
recounted several dog bite stories in fort greene park, and argued
against not only extending off leash hours but a dog run, as well. Fort
greene park is very popular and every summer I have to balance
competing interests who all want to use the park. Working with parks
dept we have had to reduce the number of permits because residents
complain about all of the uses being allowed in the park and a plea for
peace and quiet. In regards to parham, I doubt DOE would agree to a
dog run near PS 20. I spearheaded the streetscape project for
lafayette ave which is
almost complete. This plan reflects the ideas
from residents of the three towers on lafayette ave. Most of the
residents are seniors and are requesting restoration of belgium blocks
and trees. They have complained in the past about irresponsible dog
owners who walk their dogs on lafayette ave. Therefore, I do not think
it would work at that location. As I stated in our earlier
conversation, Underwood is patronized by several public, private and
church sponsored day care centers during the day and after school
programs. There would be MAJOR push back if a dog run were planned in
this playground. That leaves under the BQE. A dog run is being
considered at this site and at Commodore Barry Park as I stated in our
earlier conversation. I know you do not like the location of Commodore
Barry park and so I will push for the dog run under the BQE when DOT
issues an RFP for that site. I do not know the
timing of this project
but will inquire. Please know that a dog run in commodore barry park
would happen sooner since we are renovating that park. It is a very
safe park with a lot of activities and a pool. You should visit the
park sometime soon and see for yourself. Tish
== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Sun, Jul 19 2009 7:05 am
From: Mayumi Shimose Poe
Under the BQE sounds great.
But just wondering what's wrong with Commodore Barry park? It actually
is a really nice, somewhat underutilized park ... and if they are
already leaning towards allowing a dog park there, I say GO for it.
Cheers,
Mayumi
On Sun, Jul 19, 2009 at 9:48 AM, Matt Townsend<
stok...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Personally
I think the idea of a dog run under the BQE is an excellent idea.
> On the days and/or evenings when the rain is falling it would be nice to
> have a place to take your dog.
>
> --- On Sun, 7/19/09, stephanie bergsma <
stephani...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> From: stephanie bergsma <
stephani...@gmail.com>
> Subject: Tish James Questions
> To:
clintonh...@googlegroups.com> Date: Sunday, July 19, 2009, 12:37 AM
>
> pls see emails below
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: stephanie bergsma
<
stephani...@gmail.com>
> Date: Sun, Jul 19, 2009 at 12:32 AM
> Subject: Fwd: Dog Run Followup Questions
> To: clintonhilldogrun group <
nor...@googlegroups.com>
>
>
> Hi All,
> I have been working on the dog run project slowly but surely. The email
> below is the latest communication with Leticia James. Please let me know if
> I am representing your opinion accurately of if you have other suggestions.
> Please see her response and advise any comments you have. I read her
> explanation and I still don't understand why a fenced in area cant co-exist
> at Fort Greene Park. Do you?
>
> I also spoke with her on the
phone for about 20 minutes and she answered a
> lot of our questions. For example: Many dog owners in the area have
> suggested the empty lot on the north east corner of Myrtle and Waverly near
> Jive Turkey and Bank of America. Several people have advised that this has
> been vacant for 10 / 20 / 30 years. Turns out that the property has been in
> legal limbo but is now finally out and the property is sold to become
> affordable housing.
>
> Also she told me that community members have been attempting to get a fenced
> dog run for 5 years now. She says they have not been able to find a spot.
> She is 100% behind us if we can find a spot, we don't need to convince her
> that a fenced dog run is desired or needed.
>
> I am looking to squeak in with a small basic dog run and prove that our
> community will use it a ton. We can work from there
if what we get is not
> enough or temporary. The other goal is that we have to be clear not to
> change anything about Fort Greene's (unfenced) free run. This is not
> negotiable. We cannot un-do what other community members have worked for.
> Plus I love free run, it's just that we (Bruce Wayne and I) cant make it
> except the weekends.
>
> That's it for now. Remember to read below and send everyone your feedback.
> -Stephanie
> General Coordinator
> Clinton Hill Dog Run
>
http://groups.google.com/group/clintonhilldogrun?hl=en>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: stephanie bergsma
> Date: Sat, Jul 18, 2009 at 11:18 PM
> Subject: Dog Run Followup Questions
> To:
lja...@council.nyc.gov>
>
> Hi Tish,
> Thank you for taking the time to speak with me on the phone a week ago.
> Before I get started asking around about a dog run there is one point I am
> still unclear on. What is the reason that, at Fort Greene Park, it must be
> either off leash hours -or- a fenced in dog run? I know I asked you and you
> tried to explain it to me, but I still do not understanding why we cant have
> both in one park?
>
> The reason I had hoped to find or create a fenced in dog run is that Free
> Run hours are not usable with a 9-6 work schedule. I wont be out after 9pm
> with my small dog and I cant make the 2 mile round trip to the park and have
> time for my pup to play before 9am weekdays (the other dogs are
usually
> there between 7:30/8am to 9am).
> I do understand that in any location you will probably hear push back from
> the community who is already using that space. The question becomes whether
> that community is larger than the un-served dog run community in fort greene
> and clinton hill. My argument is that there are many many parks for the
> community to go to. If a dog run was to transform one corner of just one
> park, the rest of the community would still have options for park use. As
> it stands, anyone employed 9-6 (i hope there are still a lot of us left!)
> cannot meet in a safe spot and exercise our dogs.
>
> Ideas for locations:
> a) Non Park spaces:I saw that there was a brainstorming meeting about what
> to do with the stone paved open space on Lafayette between St. James and
> Classon. I know a dog run aspect was
suggested there.
>
> Also, I attended the brainstorming meeting under the BQE where I heard &
> made the same suggestion. Do you think either of these could happen?
>
> Do you think it would it be possible to be granted temporary stewardship of
> an open space for a dog run? In that way we could just borrow the space and
> see if the community will use it. Based on the community use we could see
> if there was cause to secure a permanent space. Maybe if the community
> displays their desire to use either of those spaces in a temporary way, a
> dog run would be drawn into the plans for the permanent redesign of that
> space?
>
> b) Would you direct me to the groups I should talk to about the already
> fenced/gated grassy area in Underwood Park at Lafayette and Washington?
> This is a very dog run friendly set up with benches all
around for easy
> watching. We would not need any $ to change this into a dog run! (it does
> not even need a double gate since it is already inside the park's gate.)
>
> c) I do have a new location idea: Parham Playground on Clermont between
> Willoughby and Dekalb. There are 2 sections of this park I have never seen
> used (see photos attached). These sections would lend well to be separate
> but adjacent small dog and large dog fenced dog runs. In fact, they are
> already fenced, with some gates, benches and trash cans. One section is on
> street level, on the north east corner of the park which is currently "green
> space" i am guessing (however - pls see photo, its not green because its too
> shady) making it unused by the community. It is long and narrow and low
> fenced with a gate already outside the park entrance. This would be
ideal
> for small dogs. It also already has chicken wire at ground level which
> prevents digging & very small dogs from slipping thru the bars & balls from
> rolling out through the fence.
>
> The other area is larger square with benches and partial paved perimeter.
> It is the sunken area directly adjacent to the 1st area and is behind and
> below the swings which are near the pool. This area would be ideal for
> larger dogs. I think the two sections could easily be connected without
> disturbing the flow of the park and without walking dogs thru kid's play
> areas. There are other much larger seating areas in this park that would
> not be disturbed.
>
> There are a couple negatives to this location though; 1) it is directly
> adjacent a school (which could be argued that this raises the risk of
> children and dogs being
harmed. However, there is a risk anywhere and with
> the easy install of some small "chicken" wire we can easily keep children's
> fingers from being nipped and dogs from being harmed by swallowing school
> supplies.) 2) it is a very segmented crowded park with different levels
> (making it confusing at first how to enter different areas, some existing
> gate entrances/exits may need to be closed off). It would take very very
> small amount of $ to change this into a dog run (only 1 gate is needed).
>
> Please let me know your thoughts. Thank you for your time.
>
> Stephanie Bergsma
> -----------------------------------------(email response from Tish):
> fromJames, Letitia <
LJa...@council.nyc.gov>
> sender-timeSent at 12:15 AM (GMT-04:00).
Current time there: 12:19 AM. ✆
> tostephaniebergsma
> dateSun, Jul 19, 2009 at 12:15 AM
> subjectRe: Dog Run Followup Questions
>
mailed-bycouncil.nyc.gov> hide details 12:15 AM (3 minutes ago)
> Reply
> Stephanie: nice to hear from you . At a contentious community meeting a few
> years ago sponsored by PUPS the dog owner association in the community, it
> was decided that off leash hours were preferable to a dog run. Further, non
> dog owners at the meeting recounted several dog bite stories in fort greene
> park, and argued against not only extending off leash hours but a dog run,
> as well. Fort greene park is very popular and every summer I have to balance
> competing interests who all want to use the park. Working with parks dept we
> have had to reduce the number of permits because residents complain about
> all of the uses being allowed in the park
and a plea for peace and
> quiet. In regards to parham, I doubt DOE would agree to a dog run near
> PS 20. I spearheaded the streetscape project for lafayette ave which is
> almost complete. This plan reflects the ideas from residents of the three
> towers on lafayette ave. Most of the residents are seniors and are
> requesting restoration of belgium blocks and trees. They have complained in
> the past about irresponsible dog owners who walk their dogs on lafayette
> ave. Therefore, I do not think it would work at that location. As I stated
> in our earlier conversation, Underwood is patronized by several public,
> private and church sponsored day care centers during the day and after
> school programs. There would be MAJOR push back if a dog run were planned in
> this playground. That leaves under the BQE. A dog run is being
considered
> at this site and at Commodore Barry Park as I stated in our earlier
> conversation. I know you do not like the location of Commodore Barry park
> and so I will push for the dog run under the BQE when DOT issues an RFP for
> that site. I do not know the timing of this project but will inquire.
> Please know that a dog run in commodore barry park would happen sooner since
> we are renovating that park. It is a very safe park with a lot of activities
> and a pool. You should visit the park sometime soon and see for yourself.
> Tish
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >
>
--
May in the Bay is now Live from Brooklyn. Check me out at
http://www.mayumishimosepoe.com.
To keep myself humble, I remember that the great William Faulkner once
remarked to an editor: "I know
you mean well, but so do I."
“How vain it is to sit down to write when you have not stood up to
live.” –David Henry Thoreau
“You are lucky to be one of those people who wishes to build sand
castles with words . . . This is what separates artists from ordinary
people: the belief, deep in our hearts, that if we build our castles
well enough, somehow the ocean won’t wash them away. I think this is a
wonderful kind of person to be.” –Anne Lamott (Bird by Bird, p. 231).
== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Sun, Jul 19 2009 7:51 am
From: Amy Hecht
I am one of the original founders of PUPS, and I was at the contentious
meeting Tush described. We were, at the time, trying to /extend/
off-leash hours during the lesser-used months of November through March,
as they do in Prospect Park. This opened up a monstrous can of worms
whereby some in the community wanted off- leash
abolished in FGP
altogether. While we were able to fight back and secure the current
hours (indeed, it is now official NYC law) we recognized just how
tenuous off-leash time is. This why PUPS does not support a dog run in
FGP, because those who oppose dogs off-leash would quickly rally to end
it if there was a dog run to use. And they'd have a point. Additionally,
you mention you don't use the park during off-leash but surely you are
aware of the amount of dogs who do. There is NO SPACE in FGP that would
be both large enough for all these dogs and that the community as a
whole would be willing to give up to a dog run.
Sounds like under the BQE is the best hope, or Commodore Barry Park
(what is your objection to that space?)
There is also a HUGE empty lot bordered by Clermont and Vanderbilt, Park
and Flushing. Half of it would already make a large dog run, and it's
already fenced, although
there is no shade. My husband approached Tish
about it some time ago and she said it was slated for housing, but these
plans don't always go through. Might be worth it to inquire.
Also proposed has been Cuyler Gore park. There are three separate grassy
areas that border the park. (People already use it as an unofficial dog
run from time to time.) It would need some additional fencing. I'm sure
you will get push back from the community there but you will at any
space you propose. My husband and I also tried to get a dog run
established in Murray Hill, Manhattan, years ago. Same story: the
community acknowledged the need for a run, but the battle always remains
where? We ended up moving to Brooklyn, and it got dropped. So I know
it's not easy. Good luck!
Amy
Mayumi Shimose Poe wrote:
> Under the BQE sounds great.
>
> But just
wondering what's wrong with Commodore Barry park? It actually
> is a really nice, somewhat underutilized park ... and if they are
> already leaning towards allowing a dog park there, I say GO for it.
>
> Cheers,
> Mayumi
>
> On Sun, Jul 19, 2009 at 9:48 AM, Matt Townsend<
stok...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Personally I think the idea of a dog run under the BQE is an excellent idea.
>> On the days and/or evenings when the rain is falling it would be nice to
>> have a place to take your dog.
>>
>> --- On Sun, 7/19/09, stephanie bergsma <
stephani...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> From: stephanie bergsma
<
stephani...@gmail.com>
>> Subject: Tish James Questions
>> To:
clintonh...@googlegroups.com>> Date: Sunday, July 19, 2009, 12:37 AM
>>
>> pls see emails below
>>
>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>> From: stephanie bergsma <
stephani...@gmail.com>
>> Date: Sun, Jul 19, 2009 at 12:32 AM
>> Subject: Fwd: Dog Run Followup Questions
>> To: clintonhilldogrun group <
nor...@googlegroups.com>
>>
>>
>> Hi All,
>> I have been working on the dog run project slowly but surely. The email
>> below is the latest communication with Leticia James. Please let me know if
>> I am representing your opinion accurately of if you have other suggestions.
>> Please see her response and advise any comments you have. I read her
>> explanation and I still don't understand why a fenced in area cant co-exist
>> at Fort Greene Park. Do you?
>>
>> I also spoke with her on the phone for about 20 minutes and she answered a
>> lot of our questions. For example: Many dog owners in the area have
>> suggested the empty lot on the north east corner of Myrtle and Waverly near
>> Jive Turkey and Bank of America. Several people have advised that this has
>> been
vacant for 10 / 20 / 30 years. Turns out that the property has been in
>> legal limbo but is now finally out and the property is sold to become
>> affordable housing.
>>
>> Also she told me that community members have been attempting to get a fenced
>> dog run for 5 years now. She says they have not been able to find a spot.
>> She is 100% behind us if we can find a spot, we don't need to convince her
>> that a fenced dog run is desired or needed.
>>
>> I am looking to squeak in with a small basic dog run and prove that our
>> community will use it a ton. We can work from there if what we get is not
>> enough or temporary. The other goal is that we have to be clear not to
>> change anything about Fort Greene's (unfenced) free run. This is not
>> negotiable. We cannot un-do what other community members
have worked for.
>> Plus I love free run, it's just that we (Bruce Wayne and I) cant make it
>> except the weekends.
>>
>> That's it for now. Remember to read below and send everyone your feedback.
>> -Stephanie
>> General Coordinator
>> Clinton Hill Dog Run
>>
http://groups.google.com/group/clintonhilldogrun?hl=en>>
>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>> From: stephanie bergsma
>> Date: Sat, Jul 18, 2009 at 11:18 PM
>> Subject: Dog Run Followup Questions
>> To:
lja...@council.nyc.gov>>
>>
>> Hi Tish,
>> Thank you for taking the time to speak with me on the phone a week
ago.
>> Before I get started asking around about a dog run there is one point I am
>> still unclear on. What is the reason that, at Fort Greene Park, it must be
>> either off leash hours -or- a fenced in dog run? I know I asked you and you
>> tried to explain it to me, but I still do not understanding why we cant have
>> both in one park?
>>
>> The reason I had hoped to find or create a fenced in dog run is that Free
>> Run hours are not usable with a 9-6 work schedule. I wont be out after 9pm
>> with my small dog and I cant make the 2 mile round trip to the park and have
>> time for my pup to play before 9am weekdays (the other dogs are usually
>> there between 7:30/8am to 9am).
>> I do understand that in any location you will probably hear push back from
>> the community who is already using that space. The
question becomes whether
>> that community is larger than the un-served dog run community in fort greene
>> and clinton hill. My argument is that there are many many parks for the
>> community to go to. If a dog run was to transform one corner of just one
>> park, the rest of the community would still have options for park use. As
>> it stands, anyone employed 9-6 (i hope there are still a lot of us left!)
>> cannot meet in a safe spot and exercise our dogs.
>>
>> Ideas for locations:
>> a) Non Park spaces:I saw that there was a brainstorming meeting about what
>> to do with the stone paved open space on Lafayette between St. James and
>> Classon. I know a dog run aspect was suggested there.
>>
>> Also, I attended the brainstorming meeting under the BQE where I heard &
>> made the same
suggestion. Do you think either of these could happen?
>>
>> Do you think it would it be possible to be granted temporary stewardship of
>> an open space for a dog run? In that way we could just borrow the space and
>> see if the community will use it. Based on the community use we could see
>> if there was cause to secure a permanent space. Maybe if the community
>> displays their desire to use either of those spaces in a temporary way, a
>> dog run would be drawn into the plans for the permanent redesign of that
>> space?
>>
>> b) Would you direct me to the groups I should talk to about the already
>> fenced/gated grassy area in Underwood Park at Lafayette and Washington?
>> This is a very dog run friendly set up with benches all around for easy
>> watching. We would not need any $ to change this into a dog run!
(it does
>> not even need a double gate since it is already inside the park's gate.)
>>
>> c) I do have a new location idea: Parham Playground on Clermont between
>> Willoughby and Dekalb. There are 2 sections of this park I have never seen
>> used (see photos attached). These sections would lend well to be separate
>> but adjacent small dog and large dog fenced dog runs. In fact, they are
>> already fenced, with some gates, benches and trash cans. One section is on
>> street level, on the north east corner of the park which is currently "green
>> space" i am guessing (however - pls see photo, its not green because its too
>> shady) making it unused by the community. It is long and narrow and low
>> fenced with a gate already outside the park entrance. This would be ideal
>> for small dogs. It also already has
chicken wire at ground level which
>> prevents digging & very small dogs from slipping thru the bars & balls from
>> rolling out through the fence.
>>
>> The other area is larger square with benches and partial paved perimeter.
>> It is the sunken area directly adjacent to the 1st area and is behind and
>> below the swings which are near the pool. This area would be ideal for
>> larger dogs. I think the two sections could easily be connected without
>> disturbing the flow of the park and without walking dogs thru kid's play
>> areas. There are other much larger seating areas in this park that would
>> not be disturbed.
>>
>> There are a couple negatives to this location though; 1) it is directly
>> adjacent a school (which could be argued that this raises the risk of
>> children and dogs being
harmed. However, there is a risk anywhere and with
>> the easy install of some small "chicken" wire we can easily keep children's
>> fingers from being nipped and dogs from being harmed by swallowing school
>> supplies.) 2) it is a very segmented crowded park with different levels
>> (making it confusing at first how to enter different areas, some existing
>> gate entrances/exits may need to be closed off). It would take very very
>> small amount of $ to change this into a dog run (only 1 gate is needed).
>>
>> Please let me know your thoughts. Thank you for your time.
>>
>> Stephanie Bergsma
>> -----------------------------------------(email response from Tish):
>> fromJames, Letitia <
LJa...@council.nyc.gov>
>> sender-timeSent at 12:15 AM (GMT-04:00). Current time there: 12:19 AM. ?
>> tostephaniebergsma
>> dateSun, Jul 19, 2009 at 12:15 AM
>> subjectRe: Dog Run Followup Questions
>>
mailed-bycouncil.nyc.gov>> hide details 12:15 AM (3 minutes ago)
>> Reply
>> Stephanie: nice to hear from you . At a contentious community meeting a few
>> years ago sponsored by PUPS the dog owner association in the community, it
>> was decided that off leash hours were preferable to a dog run. Further, non
>> dog owners at the meeting recounted several dog bite stories in fort greene
>> park, and argued against not only extending off leash hours but a dog run,
>> as well. Fort greene park is very popular and every summer I have to balance
>> competing interests who all want to use the park. Working
with parks dept we
>> have had to reduce the number of permits because residents complain about
>> all of the uses being allowed in the park and a plea for peace and
>> quiet. In regards to parham, I doubt DOE would agree to a dog run near
>> PS 20. I spearheaded the streetscape project for lafayette ave which is
>> almost complete. This plan reflects the ideas from residents of the three
>> towers on lafayette ave. Most of the residents are seniors and are
>> requesting restoration of belgium blocks and trees. They have complained in
>> the past about irresponsible dog owners who walk their dogs on lafayette
>> ave. Therefore, I do not think it would work at that location. As I stated
>> in our earlier conversation, Underwood is patronized by several public,
>> private and church sponsored day care
centers during the day and after
>> school programs. There would be MAJOR push back if a dog run were planned in
>> this playground. That leaves under the BQE. A dog run is being considered
>> at this site and at Commodore Barry Park as I stated in our earlier
>> conversation. I know you do not like the location of Commodore Barry park
>> and so I will push for the dog run under the BQE when DOT issues an RFP for
>> that site. I do not know the timing of this project but will inquire.
>> Please know that a dog run in commodore barry park would happen sooner since
>> we are renovating that park. It is a very safe park with a lot of activities
>> and a pool. You should visit the park sometime soon and see for yourself.
>> Tish
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
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