Any advice for using "Tree Pots" with new grafts?

[Joe_in_CT]

I'm curious to know if anyone has experience with tree pots. I may
need to use them for a few months ( possibly longer ) and I'm
wondering how long newly grafted apple trees could remain in the tall
pots.

http://www.stuewe.com/ has a large selection.

http://www.stuewe.com/products/minitreepots.php

The MT38 is a 3" wide X 8" tall pot ( 58 cu in ) which I would
consider along with 10" tall pots.

Does someone have experience with this sort of pot?

Joe

[greg l.]

Joe, in Australia we use these pots a lot, we call them "tubes", they
are mainly used for seedlings. The advantage is they train the roots
to grow downwards so they become drought hardy fairly soon after
planting out. They are not intended for the trees to stay in them for
very long. Personally for an orchard I think it is better to grow
trees in larger containers so they have a good root system when
planted, the main advantage of the tubes is low cost. I use plastic
grow bags which are about 10" wide and allow good root development.
Unfortunately they take a fair bit of potting mix to fill but I get
good results.

Greg

On Feb 2, 12:20 pm, Joe_in_CT <jstaf...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I'm curious to know if anyone has experience with tree pots. I may
> need to use them for a few months ( possibly longer ) and I'm
> wondering how long newly grafted apple trees could remain in the tall
> pots.
>

> http://www.stuewe.com/has a large selection.

[Dick Dunn]

On Wed, Feb 01, 2012 at 05:20:58PM -0800, Joe_in_CT wrote:
> I'm curious to know if anyone has experience with tree pots...
>..

> http://www.stuewe.com/products/minitreepots.php
>
> The MT38 is a 3" wide X 8" tall pot ( 58 cu in ) which I would
> consider along with 10" tall pots.
>
> Does someone have experience with this sort of pot?

Joe -
I bench graft in March, plant out in September or so.

I had a few tall/narrow pots, like the MT38 only larger. They were too
narrow for the rootstock--I'd have needed to wind it around and stuff
it into the pot, or trim it severely.

A standard 1-gal nursery container works well...tho pay some attention
to the actual size/capacity. Try to find the larger ones among the "trade
size 1", sometimes called a "full 1". The smaller ones are only 0.6-0.7
gallon.
--
Dick Dunn rc...@talisman.com Hygiene, Colorado USA

[Steve Bonney]

On 2/1/2012 8:20 PM, Joe_in_CT wrote:
Does someone have experience with this sort of pot? Joe

Joe,

Because my land is so wet in the spring, I pot up purchased trees and my
grafted rootstocks to grow all summer and then plant in the fall. I
purchased a case of TP414 (4" square by 14" deep) from Steuwe a few
years ago and they hold up well. The rootstocks do well in them all
summer, but I do check them a couple of times to see if the roots have
reached the bottom. G11 and B9 have not exceeded the depth of the pot. I
would like even taller pots for my rootstocks, like the Steuwe TP1124R
(11" diameter X 24" deep and hold 1 cu ft of soil), but they are $4.76
each in a case of 16. Yikes! And they are made in China.

For my purchased trees I use larger pots. I scrounged hundreds of pots
from a nursery a couple of years ago, but in order to get the depth I
need, they do take a lot of soil -- usually 10 gallons. 5 gallon pickle
buckets are about the right proportion for trees and I drill several
holes in the bottom for drainage. They are usually free or $1 each when
I do have to pay for them. And I believe that the white color keep the
soil from heating up too much during the summer.

Steve
Field and Forest Eco-Farm, Indiana, USA

--
Steve Bonney
Sustainable Earth
a 501(c)3 not-for-profit membership organization
to promote sustainable farming and food systems

[Dick Dunn]

Steve makes an important side point here:
On Wed, Feb 01, 2012 at 11:55:13PM -0500, Steve Bonney wrote:
...much snip...
> ...5 gallon pickle

> buckets are about the right proportion for trees and I drill several
> holes in the bottom for drainage. They are usually free or $1 each when
> I do have to pay for them. And I believe that the white color keep the
> soil from heating up too much during the summer.

Wherever I keep my new grafts in black plastic nursery pots, I do place
barrier(s) on the sunny side(s) of the pots to keep direct sun off them.
This is not an entirely theoretical precaution!

(The main bad thing happens if the pot dries out--then the roots get baked
on the sunny side. But with small pots, once they're outdoors, it's easy
to short them on water.)

[Joe_in_CT]

I may compromise and use the cp413ch pots which are 13.5" tall and
hold 0.7 gallons.

http://www.stuewe.com/products/treepots.php

I'll be using EMLA 106's

I thought that I could recuperate plastic crates to use as "trays" but
there would be the sun/heat issue. I might need to buy the correct
trays and paint them white...

Thanks for the replies.

Joe

[Joe_in_CT]

I learned that the "cp" pots are basically a very thin single-use
citrus pot so that won't be my choice.

[greg l.]

Joe, have you considered planter bags? They are very economical and
work quite well. The folds in the bottom of the bags stop the roots
from circling. This is an Australian supplier, you would need to find
somewhere in the USA.

http://www.botanyplastics.com.au/planter_bags.htm

Greg

[Joe_in_CT]

Hi Greg,

Space is non existent to minimal, and as of right now I'm not certain
where the nursery bed will be. I actually live in a four unit
condominium... so ordering 100 rootstocks requires a certain amount
of optimism : )

For now, I need to be able to transport my "orchard". I wish I could
use bags. I tallied up the list of plastic pots and trays and while
individually, everything is inexpensive it does get pricey.

Joe

[greg l.]

I don't know about apples but with grapes they put the new grafts in a
"callus" box, horizontal layered with damp sphagnum moss. That way the
graft can callus over before planting out. You would need a pretty
robust graft, but it saves a lot of room.

Greg

[Joe_in_CT]

"Callusing" was going to be the subject of my net thread.

I have a copy of Plant Propagation Principles and Practices ... but
it doesn't seem to provide as much info as I'm seeking. I'm not
finding much at all on callusing on the internet either.

Joe

[Chris Rylands]

Hi Joe, this may help, and for anyone who does not have this outstanding
book available:

Chapter 12, page 412, under the paragraph: Environmental Conditions During
and Following Grafting, where it discusses certain conditions must be met
for callus tissue to develop.

Plant Propagation: Principles and Practices (6th Edition):

1. In apple grafts, little or no callus is formed below 32 Deg F(0 Deg C) or
above 104 Deg F (40 Deg C).

2. At 90 Deg F (32 Deg C) and higher, callus production is retarded, and
cell damage increases.

3. For Bench Grafting, callusing may be allowed to proceed for several
months by storing the grafts at 45-50 Deg F (7-10 deg C).

4. For rapid callusing, the temperature can be raised 10 degrees, however at
the cost of potentially depleting needed carbohydrate reserves which will
limit field survival.

Chris Rylands

Joe

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[Joe_in_CT]

What is the typical "real world" process of callusing?

What type of tags do people like?
I have some of the aluminum tags that one presses the name in with a
ball point pen. Do they hold up as well?

[Charlotte Traynor]

Hi Joe,

We've just been looking into various tagging types for our new orchard. Have you found the aluminium tags easy to engrave?

We were very keen on metal tags as I think they'll last well, but I've also just come across a different variety of black plastic "scratch off" tags:

http://www.wellsandwinter.co.uk/product.asp?prodID=118&prodName=Scratch%20Off%20Black%20Plastic%202

which seems a very cheap alternative and the retailer claims is 'very permanent'. Anyone any experience with these or other permanent tags?

Charlotte

[Julian Back]

I have used these black plastic scratch off tags and they have lasted about 5 years so far without any problems.

Julian

[greg l.]

I have seen a commercial callus box for grapevines. Basically just a
coolroom with layers of grafted vines, laid down with damp sphagnum
moss to keep them moist. i don't know what temperature they kept. So
long as you keep the whole thing moist they should produce callus
fairly quick, but vine nurseries don't have to worry about the roots
because they strike the rootstock after grafting.

Greg

[Joe_in_CT]

I'm getting the impression that new benchgrafts don't require any
"special" care...

Is there any harm in keeping the benchgrafts warm and moist for seven
or eight days?

Does anyone do this?

I'm a little concerned about bacteria ...

[Joe_in_CT]

Bump...

[greg l.]

Joe, my only experience with callusing is a peek in a coolroom a few
years back,

I think if the scions get too warm they will start to shoot which
inhibits callusing. The right temp slows budburst but allows
callusing. My main concern with grafting is not to disturb the scion,
get the graft tightly wrapped and not allow it to dry out.
.

Greg