Kegging from tank

[Alex]

I'd love to hear about people's small/medium scale kegging set-ups. 

I haven't given much consideration to kegging my cider yet and had just thought I'd bottle for a while. I carbonate in a pressurised tank using a carbonation stone. If I was to buy a kegging machine, I imagine I would fill the kegs from the tank with a filling machine, but don't know how pasteurisation would take place in this set-up. Given the difficulty of pasteurising a keg in a bath pasteuriser, I know a flash pasteuriser would be best for this type of thing. Would the pasteurisation happen before the cider goes into the tank for carbonation or would it happen to the carbonated cider on its way out of the tank before going into the kegs?

Does anybody know a European manufacturer of the sort of equipment that would be needed for this sort of set-up?

Best regards

Alex

 

[eaglewolfff]

Are we talking about cider here or apple juice? Why would anyone pasteurise cider?

[Claude Jolicoeur]

Le vendredi 14 octobre 2016 14:35:37 UTC-4, eaglewolfff a écrit :

Why would anyone pasteurise cider?

This is a good question...
In effect, many cider makers do pasteurise cider, in particular when there is some residual sugar. It is an insurance against bottle bursting and other problems that may occur after bottling (or kegging in the present case)
Unfortunately, it happens much too often that such ciders have a clearly identifiable aroma of cooked apples that is, in my opinion, quite objectionable.
In theory, a well done pasteurisation shouldn't produce such aroma... But I haven't yet tasted a pasteurised cider where I couldn't detect the pasteurisation.

Alex, since your are kegging, are you sure you need to pasteurise? Normally, kegged ciders would be drank quite rapidly, and the kegs would be kept in good conditions (away from heat). In my opinion, the risks are much lower to have problems with kegged cider...

Claude

[Richard Anderson]

Kegging requires a bit of equipment but for a small producer not a major expense and is dependent on the type of keg used to fill and pressurize. Keep in mind what equipment the pub uses to pour it. In addition you will need clean and sanitize your keg. As for pasteurization this is trickier, but most keg cider is consumed fairly quickly so that it is not an issue, however it will need to be kept cold at all times.

[Wes Cherry]

Assuming you have a brite tank, this is all you need to fill:

http://www.gwkent.com/proline-ii-keg-filler.html

Cleaning is another story.   Either get a local brewery to clean the kegs for you, or build/buy a keg cleaner ($2K to $10K+)

I cobbled together one that is somewhat similar to this except single head

http://www.gwkent.com/manual-keg-washer.html

it has been replaced with a four head cleaner I made that uses a steam pressure washer to clean and sanitize.   Steam can be very dangerous, so make sure you have adequate pressure release valves so you don’t blow yourself up.

Cider kegs are much easier to clean than beer kegs so steam only is fine.   Doing so with beer would bake on residue.

Or I also recommend Dolium Kegs.    The come pre pressurized and sanitized so all you need is the filler.   We use them for distal accounts were getting stainless kegs back is difficult.  Dolium 20L kegs are now available in the same aspect ratio as regular 1/6 bbl stainless kegs.   Accounts didn’t like the short squat 20L kegs Dolium used to have.  Dolium kegs cost about $20 each...

Filled kegs are kept at ~4 degC in an improvised cold room with a coolbot and off the shelf A/C unit.  It works really well.

https://www.storeitcold.com/

-Wes

[Alex]

Hi Claude,

I have found pasterurisation tends to give a more balanced, rounded flavour to my cider. I once tried somebody's cider before and after pasteurisation and definitely preferred the pasteurised one so that was me sold on the process since it seemed to not only have plenty of benefits, but in my opinion also gave a better flavour.. I now also give people my cider before and after pasteurisation and I have not had one person say they prefer it before.

Over-pasteursiation definitely gives too much of a heavy cooked apples taste, but personally I like, when pasteurisation has been done better, a small hint of cooked apple.

[Alex]

Thanks Wes and Richard, I think I'm going to do some trials with this over the space of the next year.

Much appreciated.

[Joe Heley]

Hi guys, im looking to get kegging soon. Wes, when you say the dolium tanks come pre pressurised , does this mean you just fill them up and away you go ? Ready to drink carbonated cider after being filled with still ?
Any advice greatly appreciated! Joe

[Wes Cherry]

They are just charged with co2 so when you counter-pressure fill out of a brite tank you don’t need to do any cleaning or pre-pressurization with co2.

You still need a means of carbonating the cider first.

You could put the Dolium in a fridge at as cold as possible and keep it under pressure for a week+ and carbonate that way. Pay attention to the max pressure rating of doly vessels.

It’s also possible to keg condition in a dolium, but add a known quantity of sugar for a desired co2 level. Still be sure to monitor pressure so it doesn’t explode. Using a pressure push or pump, you could even dosage and sulfite after the priming sugar has been exhausted.

Finally, you could put keeved/nitrogen depleted cider in a doly and have it finish there. You would need to monitor FSUs and be very careful with this technique. You could periodically vent excess co2 if necessary.

Doliums cost about $17-$20 in pallet quantities. I don’t think you can get single quantities except maybe as a sample from a supplier.

-'//es Cherry
Dragon's Head Cider
Vashon Island, Wa US
www.dragonsheadcider.com

> On Apr 25, 2018, at 6:01 AM, 'Joe Heley' via Cider Workshop <cider-w...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
> Hi guys, im looking to get kegging soon. Wes, when you say the dolium tanks come pre pressurised , does this mean you just fill them up and away you go ? Ready to drink carbonated cider after being filled with still ?
> Any advice greatly appreciated! Joe
>

> --
> --
> Visit our website: http://www.ciderworkshop.com
>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the "Cider Workshop" Google Group.
> By joining the Cider Workshop, you agree to abide by our principles. Please see http://www.ciderworkshop.com/resources_principles.html
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Cider Workshop" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to cider-worksho...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send an email to cider-w...@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.