The Egg Barrel (Foudre) Ovum

[Guillaume Barrier]

Hello,

I already post here 2 weeks ago. I am still looking for all process regarding cider making and so improving my business plan. I just saw something unusual regarding the wooden barrels through internet and I would like to share you this because the thing that work for wine, work most of the time for cider as the process is not so far (stop me if I am wrong). 

I invite you to go on this http://www.taransaud.com/#/cuves-vinification-elevage to see the Egg Barrel that have some impact regarding the "wine" in this case, but someone know people using this kind of barrel or oval tank in terra cotta (making orange wine). 

If someone know something about this tank or process or fermentation, let me know. 

http://www.domaine-viret.com/images/article-vin-en-amphore-RVF-Novembre-2011.pdf?PHPSESSID=i08v5pe92ic4n0skot165ogel5 For people who can read french, some explanation regarding the Ovum and Terra Cotta Tanks.

Sincerely,

Guillaume

[HEW]

Similar to kvevri? A cidery in Virginia USA uses terra cotta kvevri -- a very ancient method, apparently: http://www.castlehillcider.com/our-cider/method/

[Guillaume Barrier]

I think yes, its this I guess. But my question was if this Ovum, a egg wooden barrel provide some improvement regarding the fermentation or its just because its fashion/design.

[Andrew Lea]

On 06/02/2014 21:21, Guillaume Barrier wrote:
> I think yes, its this I guess. But my question was if this Ovum, a egg
> wooden barrel provide some improvement regarding the fermentation or its
> just because its fashion/design.

There is a good old English saying "learn to walk before you learn to
run". Once you have some serious cidermaking experience, it may be worth
experimenting with 'eggs' (if you can afford them). But you need to
learn the basics over several seasons first, and to make all the
mistakes that beginners make. Then once you are confident you can make a
good product reliably, you can spread your wings.

I think you will find most of the winemakers using 'eggs' have a serious
track record in making wine conventionally before they start to 'branch
out'. I have seen 'eggs' in use in a winery in South Australia; the same
winery also plays recorded music to the maturing wines to enhance their
flavour. I was not able to do any comparative tasting, so I can't tell
you whether I think their enthusiasm was justified.

Even the proponents of 'eggs' I think admit that the flavour changes
which they believe take place are subtle. Many of the 'eggs' are made of
ceramic or concrete in the traditional 'amphora like' Georgian style and
it is not at all clear whether it is the shape or the material which
makes the difference. Wood, concrete and ceramic have very different
surface chemistries.

I'm afraid I think a lot of it is just 'fashion'. Wine makers
desperately need a USP to capture market share at the top end (> £25 per
bottle), and 'eggs' are just one way of doing it. In the UK, the cider
market is mostly volume and price driven and the price-insensitive
'quality' cider market is minuscule, so I don't see 'eggs' catching on
here somehow!

Just my six penn'orth of course ;-)

Andrew

--
near Oxford, UK
Wittenham Hill Cider Portal
www.cider.org.uk

[Yann F.]

I have used an egg-shaped vessel ~250 gallons, admittedly only a single fermentation this past harvest, for wine not cider, and not made by the company in question. So take what I say as anecdotal at best. Though, I did ferment two batches under the same conditions (one wine and one cider) in a cylindrical vessel of the same material alongside during that time. As well as another batch of the same wine as in the egg in a 500 gallon traditional SS cylinder. 

From what I gather, the main benefits of egg shaped fermentors are two fold; first, lees 'convection' during fermentation, and second, added micro-oxygenation during aging similar to a neutral barrel. Andrew is correct that this is more about material than shape anyways.

Bases on my observation, there was significantly more lees convection during the fermentation as compared to the cylindrical shape. Large bubbles of escaping CO2 would travel up the sides of the egg and bring considerably more lees into suspension as they moved up the tank. None of the batches were/have been in the tanks long enough to really comment on micro-oxygenation. Which, IMO is a a useful tool in making wine, but doesn't typically apply to cider-making.

After a sensory analysis, there was no significant taste difference between the egg and the cylindrical batch, though I do plan on more trials in the future.

[Guillaume Barrier]

Thank you Yann and Andrea, got all the answers that I needed!