my 29mm crown caps aren't tight

[Nat West]

I did a large batch (few hundred bottles) of pasteurized juice so far this year. Nearly all of them are in used 29mm champagne bottles (is "champers" the right UKanian word?), the rest in used 26mm champagne bottles. Last year I used plastic mushroom stoppers and bails, so this is new to me.

I am using a hand-capper, "Emily" I believe. It's red, primarily plastic. I have two screw-in bells for each mm size. 

The 26mm bottles of juice I have are great. A nice tight seal.

The 29mm bottles of juice I have are not great. With most bottles, I can spin the crown cap with my fingers, but the rubber/plastic ring on the underside of the lid is keeping them sealed from air. The juice inside is not "turning". Some lids I can even remove by prying very hard with my fingers. 

It also appears that, when applied, the 29mm lids aren't rounded over on the edge. The 26mm lids have some radius to the bent-over edge, but the 29mm lids are more squared-off.

Am I doing something wrong? Do I have a bad batch of lids? Do I need to get a different capper? I do not feel comfortable giving away any of the 29mm bottles of juice since it's so easy to dislodge the lids and break the seal.

I need to confidently solve this problem before bottling 2009's batch in a couple months. Any help appreciated.

-Nat West, Portland Oregon

[Dries Muylaert]

So, if I get it right, the 29 mm crown cap doesn't fit the 29 mm champus bottle? Are you sure? Ok, the prob is your Emily. Use a bigger model. fe 020.046.9 ore heavier at Brouwland, and make sure that the changeable cap anvil also is a 29 mm.

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[Nat West]

Thanks for the reply, Dries.

The 29mm cap fits much better than the 26mm cap, but that's the question that I'm asking - which piece of the system isn't quite right: the crown caps, the bell, the capper, or all of my (hundreds) of bottles. I *can* tell the difference between a 29mm bottle and one that is 26mm, so that's not my problem. And my Emily has two pieces of metal that grab the neck which flip around between 26 and 29, so I know that's not my problem either. I bought my caps from my reputable local brewshop, but they obviously don't do much 29mm business since I'm stateside.

-Nat West

[Dries Muylaert]

Crown caps I can't see, so I don't know. But that's standard production, so unlikely to be wrong. However, buy some  somewhere else and try with those. Bottles are also standard production. Same remarks. Also look at the shape of higher end of the neck and compare with a filled and crowned bottle you bought in the shop. If these possibilities are eliminated there is only one possibility left: the emily. I often was told that the lighter models do not perform well.

[Wilf]

Nat,
I use reclaimed champagne bottles from wherever I can get them.
There are a few observations that I would make which might help you
eliminate the aspects to your system that are working.

Not all bottles are created equal and it may be a number of things.

Some bottles especially the cheaper bottles that came with a mushroom
cap don’t always have a good lip so the seal isn’t brilliant.
Unfortunately its been trial and error as to whether the cap has
sealed. Visually I find it very difficult to see if the lip is good
or not.

Are you sure that you’re neck sizes are correct? Some of the US
bottles are slightly smaller (somebody told me they were 27.5mm but
can’t remember where I got that from) and I could never get a good
seal. I don’t bother keeping the US bottles now.

As Dries says, caps aren’t equal either so try another batch or
manufacturer, some seal better than others due to better manufacturing
tolerances.

It sound’s like you’ve got the same capper as I have and I’ve not had
a problem so far (3 years old)

Hope that helps

Wilf

[Nat West]

It does help, Wilf. I know I can "rule out" my capper. Some 29mm bottles do seal better than others. I'll organize a bunch of like bottles and run some tests. And buy some new caps. My bottles are all manner of beverage brand, country of origin, and previous-contents.

-Nat West