Clearing perry

[michael]

I know that this is a cider workshop but perry is closely related,and it is discussed here from time to time.In fact,I remember this topic coming up previously,and I have always suggested leaving it longer and it would clear naturally.All of my perries have cleared naturally,in the past but one I made September 2012,refuses to clear.It is a batch made from Teddington Green pear with an initial S.G of 1.060,which has fermented out to 1.002 some while ago.One strange thing is that I added a little completed perry from a small batch of Thorn pear to complete the filling of a 2 litre T.G.demijohn,and this has finally cleared with a coagulated white substance at the bottom-this enabled me to rack off a couple of litres to produce a sparklingly clear and excellent tasting perry.

However,I do not have any Thorn perry to carry out this procedure on my remaining two 5 litre demijohns of cloudy Teddington Green perry.

Can someone suggest the easiest and least invasive (in terms of changing the flavour) addition to clear the perry?

Michael

[Claude Jolicoeur]

This reminds me of something similar that happened to one of my 2011 ciders - it had obstinately refused to clear after over a year and trialing a few fining agents. So I decided to bottle it still hazy, and I kept a 3L demijohn of it in the refrigerator as cooking cider.

Some time after that, a friend comes at home and leaves a bottle of his cider. We drank it, but as we didn't finish the bottle, I simply poored the leftover of the bottle into the cooking cider demijohn in the fridg. And guess what, next morning the cider was perfectly cleared...
I contacted this friend to enquire what there was in his cider that could have provoked this clearing of my cider, but absolutely nothing special...

So the following days, I took out some of the bottles to do more thorough fining tests, as I thought that if something can clear it, I need to find what, as this could be useful to know in the future. I tested some of the bottles with bentonite, gelatin, kieselsol, chitosan, and combinations. I also tried pectinase overdose and PME. Some of the bottles did partly clear, but none as well as the cooking demijohn...

Morale of the story, there is something mysterious with the clearing of ciders and perries. We can't win everytime and we need to accept that there are things we don't understand there.

The only other thing I can tell you is that a perry I did in 2012 had some Thorn, Winnal's Longdon, Golden Spice and some eating pears. It was also reluctant to clear, but after a few fining tests, I was successful with the combination of 0.6 g/L of gelatin, followed next day by 3 ml/L of Bevasil. Now - there is no garantee whatsoever that this combination would work for yours...

P.S. Perry is a perfectly acceptable topic on this forum - see the home page on Google:

The Cider Workshop group discuss all aspects of growing, making and consuming cider (and Perry) from orchard to glass.

Claude

[Andrew Lea]

On 17/01/2014 04:45, Claude Jolicoeur wrote:
>
> also reluctant to clear, but after a few fining tests, I was successful
> with the combination of 0.6 g/L of gelatin, followed next day by 3 ml/L
> of Bevasil.

Bevasil is a colloidal silica sol (another trade name is Baykisol).
These are also known generically as 'kieselsols' in deference to their
original German origins. Fining is largely about 'charge
neutralisation'. The concept of such 2 part 'combination fining' is that
gelatin is positively charged and kielsol is negatively charged. When
dispersed in a beverage they act to form a flocculant gel by charge
neutralisation, entraining other charged (and non-charged) haze-forming
entities with them. That's how it works.

Gelatin / kieselsol is a good combination. As (arguably better) is
chitosan / kieselsol. Michael is in the UK so he can easily buy the 2
part finings by mail order.
http://www.homebrewcentre.co.uk/product.asp?pID=1654&cID=112 is chitosan
/ kieselsol and
http://www.homebrewcentre.co.uk/product.asp?pID=263&cID=112 is gelatin /
kieselsol.

I recently used chitosan / kieselsol on some intractable cider vinegar
which had not cleared after standing for years. It took a few weeks to
work but it's clear as a bell now.

Tests are important - don't commit to treating a complete batch without
small scale trials. And follow the instructions. As Claude says, you
need to add the two parts separately with a time interval between them.

Andrew


--
Wittenham Hill Cider Portal
www.cider.org.uk

[michael]

Thanks for the advice,Claude and Andrew.

Michael

[michael]

I have ordered 3 of the two part sachets (0.98p each,but postage £3.00) since the postage charge dominated the order.They describe this two part finings as containing chitosan and silicic acid,so hope it is the correct stuff.Each two part sachet is meant to treat up to 5 gallons,which suggests that this usage is at the limit of its effectiveness.I have 2 separate gallons to deal with,so I am thinking to use half of the quantity of each the sachets (1/2 0f 98p worth ) and see if it works on 1 of my gallons.The instructions suggest leaving one hour between the two additions-I think you suggested having a longer interval.Does this seem a sensible procedure?

Michael

P.S.If I have ordered too much,do these materials have a long shelf life to use in the future when I have some more cloudy(probably perry) liquid?

On Thursday, 16 January 2014 10:58:02 UTC, michael wrote: