Fermenting for aroma: trenolin bouquet plus

[Wayne Bush]

I am focussing a little bit this year on trying to bring out/enhance the aroma of cider made primarily from eating apples.  I'm mindful of Andrew's notes in previous threads that yeast plays a major role in creating the aroma profiles--and I'm reading into that that the yeast can be more important than the fruit itself, perhaps with a few exceptions.  The manufacturer of a pectin enzyme, Trenolin Bouquet Plus, states:  " Due to the sugar tolerant ß-glycosidase activity, Trenolin® BouquetPLUS can be applied before alcoholic fermentation to release aroma precursors. Useful in all white wine varieties, Bouquet PLUS has the ability to release various terpenes and aromatic compounds from grapes."   Does anyone know whether this enzyme also benefit the aroma profile of cider?  Does anyone know if it actually works?  Thanks in advance!  Wayne

[Andrew Lea]

I’ve never used it myself, but it won’t liberate terpenes from glucose-bound forms in apple juice, because there aren’t any. So it won’t turn cider into a Riesling ;-)

There are however some interesting compounds in apples that are glycosidically bound. Amongst these are 2-phenyl ethanol which is rose-like / floral, and octane diols which can take part in post-fermentation reactions with acetaldehyde to give “cidery” dioxolanes.  So Bouquet Plus may have some useful attributes for cidermaking. I hope you try it!

Andrew

Wittenham Hill Cider Page

www.cider.org.uk

On 9 Nov 2022, at 14:30, Wayne Bush <butter...@hotmail.com> wrote:

I am focussing a little bit this year on trying to bring out/enhance the aroma of cider made primarily from eating apples.  I'm mindful of Andrew's notes in previous threads that yeast plays a major role in creating the aroma profiles--and I'm reading into that that the yeast can be more important than the fruit itself, perhaps with a few exceptions.  The manufacturer of a pectin enzyme, Trenolin Bouquet Plus, states:  " Due to the sugar tolerant ß-glycosidase activity, Trenolin® BouquetPLUS can be applied before alcoholic fermentation to release aroma precursors. Useful in all white wine varieties, Bouquet PLUS has the ability to release various terpenes and aromatic compounds from grapes."   Does anyone know whether this enzyme also benefit the aroma profile of cider?  Does anyone know if it actually works?  Thanks in advance!  Wayne

--
--
Visit our website: http://www.ciderworkshop.com
 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the "Cider Workshop" Google Group.
By joining the Cider Workshop, you agree to abide by our principles. Please see http://www.ciderworkshop.com/resources_principles.html
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Cider Workshop" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to cider-worksho...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web, visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/cider-workshop/dde1a166-a9d9-4d63-b702-1df981c20bc6n%40googlegroups.com.

[Wayne Bush]

Thank you Andrew!  I also just came across a study which--I think--says the same thing you have said but in language much harder to understand.  The study concludes, if I'm reading it correctly, that application of this enzyme to the apple pulp during a minimum eight hour maceration would have a beneficial impact on aroma.   Adopting that process would be a change for me for two reasons:  1.  I normally don't macerate the pulp for very long because I understand that doing so actually diminishes the amount of tannin in the resulting cider--and I'd like to retain as much tannin as possible in the cider since the total amount in dessert apples is limited.  2.  I normally apply pectin enzyme to the juice after pressing rather than to the pulp because it seems so much easier as a way to clarify the juice, although I understand applying the enzyme to the pulp itself could increase yield.  Have I understood correctly that I would be trading tannin for aroma if I tried this technique?  

Here is a link to the study :   The Impact of the Fermentation Strategy on the Flavour Formation of Ilzer Rose (Malus domestica Borkh.) Apple Wine - PMC (nih.gov).  And here is a quote from its conclusion:  

"In this study, we followed this practice by adding an oenological enzyme with pronounced β-glucosidase activity to the apple mash and following the development of volatile and potentially aroma active compounds in the juice over a period of eight hours. We were unable to confirm our initial assumption that this would lead to an increase in the floral, rose-like flavour in Ilzer Rose juice and wine, in a manner similar to the release of terpenoids from their glycosides as observed in aromatic grape varieties. The observed increase in terpene-concentrations upon enzymatic treatment was far too low for a significant impact of the overall aroma [19]. Nevertheless, the maceration of the apple mash with the addition of β-glucosidase led to a significant change in the volatilome of the Ilzer Rose apple juice. A total of 70 volatile compounds was identified in the juice (Table 1). The volatilome is dominated by alcohols, esters, short chain fatty acids and carbonyl compounds. The relative concentrations of the compounds given in Table 1 clearly show that maceration of the mash prior to pressing already impacts the composition significantly after two hours of maceration with a further increase in concentration for several compounds during longer maceration times. Strong increases could be observed for esters (8.5-fold increase in the total ester concentration within 8 h of maceration) and alcohols (threefold increase in total alcohol concentration after 8 h of maceration), whereas for carbonyls, free acids and terpenoids only small concentration changes were observed. The highest concentration increases were found for the C6 alcohols 1-hexanol, 3-hexenol (Z) and 2-hexenol (E), for the corresponding acetates and the hexyl esters hexyl hexanoate and hexyl 2-methylbutanoate. The observed increase in concentration is not, however, derived from their release from glycosides, but most probably from the lipoxygenase pathway upon cell disruption and contact with oxygen and the acidic catalysed formation of the corresponding esters in the mash. Having the odour properties of these compounds in mind (i.e., fresh green, grassy, leafy for the alcohols and green, fresh, fruity, apple- and pear-like for the mentioned esters), their concentration increase will impact the fruity character of the juice that is further processed. Consequently, the mash was macerated for eight hours to produce apple wines AW2 and AW4, to take advantage of these reactions."

[Andrew Lea]

Yes that is a very interesting paper, and is full of useful detail, especially to a flavour chemist. There’s far too much to discuss here, but I’ll just note in passing that the ciders they produced also seem to have undergone a spontaneous malolactic fermentation which would bring its own impact on flavour as well. (It’s also interesting to me that they identified octanediol but not the dioxolanes I mentioned, but they probably aren’t in the standard mass-spec libraries that many researchers use). 

To respond specifically to your points:

Based on the juice data, even a 2 hr pulp maceration with enzyme would be useful though 8 hr is clearly better. Re loss of tannins during maceration, don’t forget this only happens if the pulp is left to oxidise in shallow layers where air can penetrate. If you macerate in a tall vessel where air cannot reach the lower layers, browning and tannin loss occurs only in the top inch or two. So this should not be an issue and it’s not necessarily the disadvantageous trade-off you imagine. 

If I were you I certainly go ahead and have a go with the Trenolin Bouquet Plus and see what it does with your apples.

Andrew

——————————

Wittenham Hill Cider Page

www.cider.org.uk

On 9 Nov 2022, at 21:19, Wayne Bush <butter...@hotmail.com> wrote:

Thank you Andrew!  I also just came across a study which--I think--says the same thing you have said but in language much harder to understand.  The study concludes, if I'm reading it correctly, that application of this enzyme to the apple pulp during a minimum eight hour maceration would have a beneficial impact on aroma.   Adopting that process would be a change for me for two reasons:  1.  I normally don't macerate the pulp for very long because I understand that doing so actually diminishes the amount of tannin in the resulting cider--and I'd like to retain as much tannin as possible in the cider since the total amount in dessert apples is limited.  2.  I normally apply pectin enzyme to the juice after pressing rather than to the pulp because it seems so much easier as a way to clarify the juice, although I understand applying the enzyme to the pulp itself could increase yield.  Have I understood correctly that I would be trading tannin for aroma if I tried this technique?  

To view this discussion on the web, visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/cider-workshop/3e8a2b5b-f00d-4ce8-8244-97db7e5ce4fen%40googlegroups.com.

[Wayne Bush]

Thank you again Andrew--I will order the enzyme and give it a try on apples that I am going to press later this month.  I do use quite a tall cylindrical pulp bucket so that should work well for this.  I have one final question if I may:  What would be the best way to apply the enzyme to the pulp?  When I put it in the juice, I just stir dissolve it in a small amount of juice or water and stir it in the top of the tank.  To apply it to the pulp, I imagine that I should mix the enzyme in a larger quantity of water and possibly spray it onto the pulp as we grind the apples, making sure that I spray enough to achieve the dosing requirements on the bottle?  

[Andrew Lea]

Dosage details are on their data sheet https://erbsloeh.com/fileadmin/user_upload/pdf/Wine/technical_data_sheet/GB/trenolin_bouquet_plus-technical_data_sheet-english-erbsloeh.pdf

Yes spraying onto the pulp to get it evenly distributed is always a good plan for this sort of addition.

Andrew

Wittenham Hill Cider Page

www.cider.org.uk

On 10 Nov 2022, at 17:49, Wayne Bush <butter...@hotmail.com> wrote:

Thank you again Andrew--I will order the enzyme and give it a try on apples that I am going to press later this month.  I do use quite a tall cylindrical pulp bucket so that should work well for this.  I have one final question if I may:  What would be the best way to apply the enzyme to the pulp?  When I put it in the juice, I just stir dissolve it in a small amount of juice or water and stir it in the top of the tank.  To apply it to the pulp, I imagine that I should mix the enzyme in a larger quantity of water and possibly spray it onto the pulp as we grind the apples, making sure that I spray enough to achieve the dosing requirements on the bottle?  

To view this discussion on the web, visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/cider-workshop/50239d28-e00a-4927-9702-432c625bcae9n%40googlegroups.com.

[Wayne Bush]

Thanks again Andrew--I will give the enzyme a trial and report back here on the results.  Cheers, Wayne

[Beth Byebierggaard]

Wayne you may be interested in a yeast that I used last year for the first time -- Fermentis SafCider AS-2. It has given noticeably (and nicely) different results in aroma and mouthfeel. I've pitched it again this year so now waiting.

Beth

[Beth Byebierggaard]

Andrew, a question about aromatics: occasionally I have had a cider that has a slight petrol/diesel smell and my very first attempts to make cider had this. Where does this come from and what can be done about it?

Thanks,

Beth

On Wednesday, November 9, 2022 at 4:13:51 PM UTC+1 Andrew Lea wrote:

[LL]

Sounds like what you can get in a Riesling wine:

https://wordonthegrapevine.co.uk/petrol-in-riesling/

Best

Love

[Andrew Lea]

I never heard any reports that the compound 1,1,6-Trimethyl-1,2-dihydronaphthalene, which is responsible for the petrol aroma in some white wines (especially aged Riesling), is present in ciders. However, it is believed to originate from carotenoid breakdown in the fruit skin in strong sunlight. It is also varietally determined. Can I ask which country you are in, and which variety of apples give this problem for you?

I wonder are you familiar with all the known off-flavours that can be present in cider such as the sulphidic and aldehydic taints, and the family of ethyl phenols? Some of the latter can be a bit “pharmaceutical” or “band-aid” in character. Might these be what you are picking up?

Andrew

Wittenham Hill Cider Page

www.cider.org.uk

On 16 Nov 2022, at 22:09, Beth Byebierggaard <ciderdis...@gmail.com> wrote:



To view this discussion on the web, visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/cider-workshop/8bed207d-e030-4b94-bd41-f80e24c539a8n%40googlegroups.com.

[Miguel A. Pereda]

It is a proven fact that if your cider is fermenting close to a place that is being tarred or near a place where there are petrol effluents, it can pick up aromas of these products, but these are exogenous causes and bad practices.

Miguel A. Pereda

[Beth Byebierggaard]

I'm familiar with some off-flavors but not chemically what type they are. If by sulphidic you mean the sulfur/rotten egg smell, then that is one I know. Aldehydic and ethyl phenols (tannins?) I don't know by name. I would not characterize it as pharmaceutical.

I am in the Netherlands and the apples were goudreinet/boskoop (primarily a cooking apple).

It's not been kept near petrol fumes.

Beth

[Wayne Bush]

Beth, thank you for the yeast suggestion--I will check it out.   Meanwhile I have set up an experiment with the trenolin enzyme--identical apples and cultured yeast in three tanks--one with my regular pectin enzyme, one with trenolin bouquet plus added to the juice, and a third with the trenolin added to the pulp and then macerated for four hours before pressing.  The temperatures here are a bit lower than recommended which may adversely impact the results across the board--nothing I can do about that--but I'll share what I learn 

here.  Cheers, Wayne